TR: Why the difference?
SK: There are about twice the emissions, per unit of useful energy, from coal as from gasoline.
TR: But isn't it still worth reducing gas consumption for the United States to reduce dependence on unstable or even hostile countries for oil?
SK: Security of supply is much more important than carbon emissions, in my opinion, in transport.
TR: What's the best way to reduce gas consumption?
SK: Raising the price of driving is the simplest way to induce conservation and efficiency. Look at how much response we saw when the price of gasoline went up to $4.50 a gallon. We've seen it work over the last year. But raising gas prices is very difficult politically to do. In fact, you see the candidates going in the opposite direction.
The prices for gas and for carbon need to be high enough to make some difference, so that means there will be some pain. And it needs to be stable enough so that people can make long-term investments for deploying alternative technologies.
TR: When we look at oil companies, there's a lot of entrenched positions and not much movement. That seems to be a basic institutional problem.
SK: I can only talk about one company that I know well. I've found the folks at BP eager to listen, to learn, to engage in discussions, and to try to do the best job that they can in balancing the short-term operations of the company against these longer-term things. After all, they have a business to run; they have shareholders to report to. They have a responsibility to produce [a certain percentage] of the world's oil every day, which the world needs. So it's a balancing act.
One of the things I have learned, which was surprising but makes sense in retrospect, is that companies are wonderful optimizers of their situation. If the government sets the playing rules appropriately, they will respond strongly and rapidly. So it is a question of getting the right policies in place, as well as a push from within the company.
TR: So the markets aren't going to solve these problems?