Another KBR Rape Claim Brings Scrutiny

What do women think is going to happen to them when they put themselves in a situation such as Iraq? You are putting yourself in harms way, you ARE in a war zone with MEN. That being said it does not justify raping someone. But I do not agree with women being in the military. Maybe in a perfect world that would be a great idea, but not in the world we live in.

Ah the old “blame the victim” ploy. Very nice. Glad to see it didn’t take long for that to happen.

khristina, I think that’s a ridiculous comment. the idea that men can’t help themselves. I think that’s wrong and we should have a higher standard of behavior. Of course, this also lends credence to one of the stronger arguments against having private military contractors, is that they aren’t as accountable when crimes like this occur.

These women aren’t in the military. They are civilians. The military is supposed to protect civilians, not harm them.
This is just bigotry and racism run rampant under people who call themselves Christians but are just false prophets and descendants of Cain who have no respect for themselves, for others, nor for God.

ho hum… another day, another 3 republican/corporate scandal

khristina, those women were NOT in the military. Regardless, I don’t see how being a female in Iraq is “put[ting] themselves in a situation”. Women get raped right here in the U.S. But at least here there is hope for a justice system. Should we just shut ourselves in our houses, wear burkas and chastity belts, and generally be paranoid? The fact is that a U.S. company, taking U.S. tax money, is covering up a heinous crime. They are accountable to U.S. laws, regardless of where they are.

Well, its too bad for her… but is much worse the cover and the protections these peoeple get and being so hard to prosecute there… imagine, if they can rap her and get immunity; what other kind of kinky biznez could be done from people with that position over there. And remember: US Bush pretened to be the saviors in Iraq, but it more seems is an invation from vary points of view.

khristina: as a woman you have no idea how your comment angered me! men need to learn SELF CONTROL!! your comment is just like the ideals that are pushed onto women in other countries–why are women forced by men to cover their bodies with sheets? cover themselves with full hijabs? Because the men think that if they see a woman skin, they might not be able to contorl their urges. Give me a break!
Stop blaming women when you cant keep your pants on!!

I agree that it is unacceptable. KBR should be nailed to the wall. Men should be ashamed. I also, unfortunately, have to agree that it is guaranteed to happen in an environment like Iraq. In the military I hated the attitudes and pressures surrounding women everyday. there aren’t enough words to describe how inappropriate it is. People are not good, and in a masculine fueled, war environment, men are going to find a way to hurt women. Not blaming the victim, just know it’s the worst kind of environment and would not advise any woman I care about to go there.

I don’t understand why allegations of rape must be referred to “arbitration.” instead of being tried in court.

I don’t know who “khristina” is, but its argument sounds more like self-serving justification by KBR than a reasoned opinion by any woman. I would expect that MANY more of these cases will crawl out from under the woodwork once Congress shows that it is serious about digging out the facts and dealing out some justice. Some people – like this current “administration” – just seem to believe that a war zone means a “no-rules” zone where anyone having “authority” can do what he wants without consequences. The whole war is an example of that thinking, as are all of GW’s infamous “signing statements” and other lawless trash. Congress needs to take the admin apart from the bottom up – starting with chief Dick.

…but they won’t let gay men or lesbians serve in the military. WHAT A COUNTRY.

Wow. I think a previous poster had it right. I guess us women should never go to sports events either. Or sports bars for that matter. I guess, just because we have hoo hoos (sorry – had to Disney that up) we deserve to get raped in any manly situation. I’m sorry but this attitude towards women needs to stop. In a round about way you placing all the blame on women and deflecting it from men. A person has a job to do whether they are male or female, and they have to do that job. I don’t give a crap if it takes them to Iraq or the moon for that matter. The last thing on earth you should have to worry about is rape from your co-workers/people you know. The only advice I can give the ladies is learn self defense. Gouge the eyes, punch the throat, knee the groin. Since, obviously, no more rape cases should be accepted, then you have to protect yourself. It would be a nice change. Men charging women for bodily damage, humiliation, suffering, etc…

war is immoral so let’s not act surprised when amoral individuals who make the CHOICE to go to a war for the money.
and let’s not act surprised when some of them are criminals.
and it’s not a ballgame.

Now, now, Eagle Man-
No need to insult- we all know the President does not need any help to look bad- give him some credit please, he can do that all by himself.

Ok, let’s use this case to set a standard for these types of cases. Let’s get Congress involved and USE these horrible crimes as an excuse to hold MAJOR hearings about how these contractors get immunity where they work. Lets use this to enrage the American people, to create such a deafening public out cry, that our leaders in Congress will fall all over themselves to support it. These people need to be subject to the rule of law, and this is how we get the political capital to bring them under that law.

Looks like you all missed the point — which is that there is no recourse to criminal justice against civilian contractors in Iraq. These cases are similar to the one involving Blackwater shooting at Iraqi civilians in that square in Baghdad. At that time it came out that the civilian contractors are not subject to Iraqi criminal law, U.S. criminal law, or U.S. military justice.
This would seem to be the only situation (besides perhaps diplomats) where an American can commit a felony against an American with impunity from any criminal justice system.
That is the situation. It’s not about rape, it’s about unpunishable felonies. Consider whether that seems like a good idea.

Garrigus- You’re right, actually; but it is still about rape.
It is about legal and ethical vacuum in which these contractors exist, with unlimited power and no accountability. And the complicity of the US government in their crimes. Anyone trained in sexual assault intervention will tell you that rape is an act of power, domination, and entitlement. And usually,statistically speaking, there is no accountability.
It is hard to imagine an situation more suited to this specific kind of violence. A woman is raped in the U.S. every 3 minutes. But rape is also a specific weapon of war. If these men were raping American women who theoretically could eventually access help, god only knows what they did to Iraqi women. Men’s violence against women is real. It’s absolutely epidemic. Let’s not ignore it. No matter in what context it occurs.

With a stroke of his pen President Bush could exempt the crime of rape against Americans from the immunity that contractors in Iraq enjoy.
Clear message: if you are loyal to President Bush, you can rape American girls he will protect you.
That is an ugly thing to say, but if you think it’s not accurate tell me why President Bush will not allow these crimes to be prosecuted.

Unfortunately there is nothing “new” about any of these allegations…it’s just a continuation of military behavior by a bunch of hyped-up mercenaries, most of whom are ex-military, where sexual assault reports are given little more investigation than a wink and a nod. The defense industry as well as the military may pretend to have taken serious steps to protect women, but I can tell you from my own personal experiences in the Army that the only person who suffers when sexual assaults are reported are the victims unless she is smart enough to outsmart the great military/industrial machine or finds a sympathetic and experienced care giver, which clearly these women have NOT. I do not regret having served my country, but I do wish the only blood, sweat and tears involved had been directly related to my duties.

AH HAHAHAHA – LJ you might win on humor on that one. Um, what’s with the “boys will be boys” by our Khristina? I might expect that from some guy, but not a fellow female. That does nothing but promote that whole Burka mentality they have going in the Middle East. I suppose I expect my fellow females not to promote that type of garbage. Bottom line – rape is rape. Don’t care where or what’s going on. UNacceptable. And I’d like to include that just because some idiots like the Duke gal have pulled some horrible stunts it does not mean that from now on every other female is lying. I’m beginning to think we have not heard the last of this. I find myself wondering if some lawless “ye haw” mentality might not have been going down over there since they can’t be held accountable. I mean, we know they’re ripping off the taxpayer unlike ever before – why not consider that this could be something as well?

All I can say is that I worked as a contractor in the middle east for a number of years; after a while, females I normally wouldn’t have looked at twice started looking very attractive. That was in a non-war, fairly normal day-to-day work environment, albeit with only one female in our entire department. It seems to me that we often overlook the fact that we males and females are essentially animals. Whether we accept that as an excuse for bad behavior depends on our sympathies toward the victims of our lapses in civility.

Okay fine — for the sake of argument, let’s accept that women who sign a contract to work in a war zone have a higner probability of being raped.
How does this excuse her employer from NOT supporting her if she is raped, or from destroying evidence and otherwise obstructing justice? THAT is what should be the topic here.

Sounds like the employment laywers who wrote those contracts are intent on promotiing a culture where “obstruction of justice” is the norm. Same thing here at the University of Michigan — the employment lawyers and more in the Office of General Counsel need to experience a comuppance. Their decision behavior based on their ability to write contracts like that make University faculty /employees think they can get away with anything. Feels like a codified dictatorship. Isn’t that why we went to war in Iraq. To fight the axis of evil. It seems we ought to do a little house cleaning here in the United States –

As a Marine Vietnam veteran I am appalled that the “official” agency of my country who claims to pursue issues of human rights and criticizes other countries for their treatment of women throughout the world can even begin to participate in a cover up such as they have. Many heads should roll over this beginning at the management level of the State Department and continuing to Haliburton and KBR.

It a sad state of affairs when citizens of the most powerful country in the world who are trying to help in the war effort are forced to bringing civil cases for rape because their own government created a legal black hole that allows criminals to escape jurisdiction. When our government creates a situation where overseas civilian contractors cannot be charged under U.S., military, or Iraqi law, the criminals are going to commit crimes and get away with it.

Why would murder’s care about rape.

Historically after a battle men had the spoils of war. Absent that in Iraq these women in Iraq are there as the substitute – to keep our fine fighting men happy and as a reward for jobs well done and no other reason – why are they so upset – didn’t the guy say thanks, come back for more, or leave a big enough tip.

And a pursed lip and furtive glance smile emanated from the fabulous KINDASLEAZY Rice and the State Dept. who absolves them of any crime.

KBR is a Cheney corporation and therefore inherently evil. It should be RICOed and dismantled as soon as possible. KBR is a prime example of Chimpy’s privatization of everything and how Chimpy is wrecking America. These KBR jerks obviously have NO moral values whatsoever. I bet they’re all conservative Christians too.

JBL55 – Thanks. I like to think I AM a decent person. And, to clarify, I never raped anyone no matter how sexually deprived I may have felt. I will accept that rape is often a power-play but I believe the environment “over there” changes the playing field somewhat. I never heard of any rapes, but by the same token, I never heard about any male-male rapes; which you DO hear about in prisons here. It could happen there, but it just doesn’t seem to. I truly believe “over there” it’s a uniquely testosterone-heavy environment and not really a good place for single women. Where I lived and worked we didn’t have a rape problem, but extra-marital affairs were rampant. Perhaps it’s more accurate to describe the situation as one where people revert somewhat to their more animal-sexual natures where new-comers are apt to become prey of sex-starved veterans (many of whom, as someone previously noted, are military vets who would be EXTREMELY disinclined to resort to homosexuality to satisfy their “needs”).

Benjalamelami you are way off base. The monsters who invaded Iraq have forced laws upon Iraq in the war zone so that no prosecution can take place. Only an arbiter or a civl suit is available. How convienient they lost the rape kit.
What the heck have we become?
Check out SOFA agreements and see how they screw other countries also. Then youmight find out why some people might not like us.

Why said:
“The real problem is that anyone, male or female, can anonymously accuse someone of rape”
No, the real problem isn’t accusations of rape. The REAL problem is RAPE. OR don’t you believe that it really happens?
I think that’s what’s at the bottom of asinine posts – especially since the accusers AREN’T anonymous. Even if a name is kept out of the newspapers, it’s known to the court, to the defendant, and to law enforcement and all the supporting agencies. It’s not some kind of unfair legal shield, just a shred of privacy for someone who has just had their safety and dignity ripped from them.
Or is that too compassionate for you?

What obscene apologists! I simply can’t believe the ignorance of some posters on this topic–starting with the very first post. So men with “raging testoterone” are exempt from the laws and from basic civilized human behavior? Give me a break! If your environment can dictate your behavior to that extent, you don’t have much internal character and probably should be locked up somewhere to protect society. Khristina–Your assertion is ridiculous. Do you really believe these women brought this on themselves because they should have been able to predict that hired private contractors would break into their living quarters, hold them hostage in storage units, brutally assault them, threaten them if they told anyone, collude with the ARMY to destroy evidence and deny them access to proper healthcare and legal services? Was it in the job description? Is that why they should have “expected” it? If it was so obvious to you, than what is the responsibility of KBR hiring people? Shouldn’t they have been able to predict this then, as well? If so, why did they put vulnerable individuals in harms way? We are all responsible for our behavior–having male hormones doesn’t let you off the hook. If this is truly just “business as usual” when groups of men get together, heaven help us all.

Picky inferred that homosexual rapes don’t occur in the military because military men are simply ‘disinclined’ to homosexuality. I’m not sure what branch of the military you served in, but sexual assault on another soldier exacts very severe punishment from the military. It is the severe and certain punishment that deters such behavior. But in the case of military contractors, there is no threat of certain and severe punishment. Behavior is mitigated by our belief systems. If men think they can rape and get away with it, rape will happen. If they believe severe punishment will likely result of their actions, men will find some other outlet for their raging hormones.

Wait a minute…what about the women in Iraq? These men are in Iraq, supposedly protecting and carrying up responsibilities towards democracy…so following this whoever Khristina is arguments, Iraqui women better get out of Iraq and not put themselves in this situation…this person has absolutedly no understanding of the implication of her statement…obviously either not well thought thru or just…well, pretty ignorant.

WHY: Like poor old Kobe Bryant, the rich basketball player who intimidated the woman he raped until she was forced to drop the criminal suit against him? Use your head for something besides a hat rack!

If you read about this case, it was clearly a well thought out, premeditated and likely oft-repeated “initiation” of new females at KBR in Iraq. She was offered a “special welcome drink” (meaning drugged) after which she lost consciousness, only later realizing from the massive evidence of repeated trauma “by more than one man” as the examiner assessed the next day when the rape kit was done and STUPIDLY handed over to KBR. Her thighs were badly bruised, she was torn and bleeding…I wouldn’t be at all surprised if these sickos have the whole thing recorded somewhere with the victims in neat alphabetical order…or maybe they just have them organized by date. But as usual, wink wink, nod nod, blame the victim and carry on with business as usual. Don’t these men have mothers or sisters? I know they have no conscience.

What is wrong with some of you people. The army doctors turned over the evidence they had procured from the victim who sought medical attention to the company officials and they hid the evidence. That is what is wrong with this whole case. Whether or not the she was raped is not the issue. You can not destoyed or hide evidence in a criminal investigation. Men in positions of power cover up for each other all the time. This women subjected herself to a rape exam, why would anyone want to do that unless some truth was behind her claims. The evidence should have been turned over to the legal authorities and the justice system should have been able to do its job, not some company officials. The problem is not women in a war zone, the problem is men constantly overstepping their bounds and acting like idiots. And as much as they pay civilians contractors all these reports of women selling it is a big joke most make between 6000-20000 a month. All those involved should have done the right thing and followed the laws that are put into place for these types of situations.

When I was in Bagram, Afghanistan for 2 years there were sexual liaisons happening everywhere. Contractor women walked around the base wearing see-through blouses and skin tight jeans that had the word juicy printed on the seat. You could sit outside your quarters and watch men sneaking in and out of the ladies buildings all during the night. A friend of mine rounded the corner of a building on his way to the latrine at 3:00 AM and came upon a couple having sex in the alley walk way between buildings.It was known around the camp that KBR security would overlook their buddies and co-workers sneaking into the ladies quarters but would enforce the rules on others. There were KBR security officials involved in sexual relationships with multiple women in the camp. My friends and I didn’t dare engage in any of this kind of activity for fear of losing our jobs.Eight women lived in each building without locks on the doors or on each of their individual sleeping spaces separated only by blankets and sheets hung to create privacy. When a man entered a ladies living quarters at night for sex he was free to approach and possibly rape any one of them. They were all at serious risk. Who knows how many were held down with mouths covered and raped? They didn’t want to lose their jobs or get caught up in a major scandal not to mention being unprotected from their rapist until they could get out of the country. Then they would face having to pay back taxes because they didn’t stay out of the US for 330 days. Thank God that the women are more secure today with locks on their doors.The men who raped women over there are simply rapists. Under the right conditions they will abuse women no matter where they are.

And private contractors are even worse.
Why are we babbling about God Bless our Troops, they are mindless killing raping machines. It’s what they do.

So why not leave all that war-stuff solely up to women? They can drive tanks over pets, bomb houses, schools, restaurants, market-places and hospitals and shoot children with anti-tanks guns just as well. And who knows it might even have a positive effect in that with the women overseas the “US homeland” as opposed to the many, many “US-not-the-homelands” would much sooner go up in smoke, creating a strong imperative to end wars after a year or so. Thereby not spoiling the mood to start many more.

Almost every post here is from people who have absolutely no clue how anything works overseas because they’ve never experienced anything past sitting in their comfy houses watching the news and clicking their tongues and blaming Bush and KBR for everything bad that happens in Iraq. KBR employees are now held accountable under the UCMJ, the same standards for military personnel. (The same cannot be said for Blackwater as far as I know but I could be wrong) That change was made over a year ago but it may not have been in effect at the time these incidents allegedly occurred. There are KBR employees in jail in the U.S. as we speak for selling over $800,000 in fuel at Bagram and pocketing the money and there are KBR employees in jail in Dubai for trafficking in drugs and soliciting prostitution so we can stop with the comments about how protected and immune contractors are from prosecution. These stories however are not nearly as beneficial to a liberal slanted media as a rape “cover-up” which sheds the worst possible light on the war effort and the many men and women who voluntarily support it.
Another thing that can stop is the comments about how much money contractors make compared to soldiers. Here’s a news flash, brainiacs: If there were enough soldiers to do all these jobs contractors wouldn’t be in Iraq in the first place and if you offered a civilian $20,000 a year to dodge mortars and IED’s and carry no weapon how many people do you think would sign up? That’s exactly why the army can’t get close to any recruiting goals they set. The more contractors you have cleaning toilets and cooking meals, the more soldiers you have doing what they do best. Anybody who knows anything about KBR knows that 90% of their workforce is prior military (myself included), so anything you say about them directly reflects the armed forces you revere so much. The two entities are almost one and the same. The scumbags who raped that girl should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law but everyone can stop licking their chops expecting KBR to be drug through the court system over this because the contract every employee voluntarily signs makes sure that won’t happen.

Jamie is a sweet girl that was simply trying to get ahead financially. This is about a few really bad people out of thousands of dedicated American military and civilian currently in Iraq. This was a violent crime commited by Americans on an American in the Green Zone. The government and the contractors didn’t handle this properly the first time but we hope they will give this the attention it requires now.

Yup. . .warmongering aint easy that’s for sure.

This is the mentality that the Arab world has, Example: The Saudi woman that was gang raped by men that took them hostage, punished by lashes and put in prison for being the victim, their rationale? its the woman’s fault for being around some guy that wasnt her husband. (btw, that guy didnt get prison and he was also raped by the criminals) – why isnt he at fault for being around a woman that wasnt his wife?
More unequal treatment to women.
The world needs to stop persecuting women for men’s crimes.

First of all the comment about females in the army and in war. I resent that very much. I have served my country for the past 8 1/2 years and love every bit of it. While people are saying we are putting our selves in harms way I say that I am making a living for my family and protecting my country. No woman deserves to be raped no matter what the situation. And if you keep reading the story they are not suing first they were trying to press charges but nothing has happened in the past 2 years. Hell I would sue by now too.

khristina is nuts! plain and simple! A woman has the SAME rights as a man, to go where she chooses, to be with whom she chooses..these clowns at KBR are the typical arrogant,cowardly males that think because they are overseas, and in a war zone, they can do what they want, when they want, to whomever they want, because they know the company has their collective backs…I bet you if you dug a little deeper, you would find a HELL of a lot more incidents either equal to or worse than that has been taking place for as long as people have been over in Iraq…

Let me just say this…those guys are lucky that woman was not a part of my family..i can say this without any hesitation..i would have gone to that country, located those men,castrated them right there and dared the sorry pot belly ceo to stand up and say tht these men are not guilty of a crime.you would not have to bring them back here for a trial….justice would have been served..what a bunch of losers we have running that outfit.i bet if it was their mother or sister,some congressman who is getting paid off would be investigaing now huh?………..

I don’t know what the hell is wrong with everyone! This whole forum makes men sound like dogs in heat who can not control themselves and if this is the case then all men are predators when it comes to being deprived of sex. Why can’t men leave women alone to do their jobs. I plan on going over to Iraq or Afghanistan and I swear if ANY MAN even looks at me the wrong way…HE will be on the news and brought back in a coffin! If men are such a threat over there to women, maybe female contractors should carry a weapon in situations like these.

If you’re the wife at home and you found he messed around on you over there, report it. These slits in uniforms deserve to be outed. Frequently you’ll hear that “what happens in Iraq, stays in Iraq.” Tell that to my gyn who just tested me for STDs for a husband who messed around with a Red Cross worker. The witch emailed him at home after his return. if you’re the wife, call every number on his cell phone records and tell them to get tested. The Red Cross allows the reporting of unethical behaviour of their employees on their website. The dimwits both used their official email addresses (WITH SECURITY CLEARANCES IN EFFECT) AND an ongoing IG investigation. If you find the other party to an affair has any license, report their sorriness to their professional organizations. Raise hell through the FRG until the crap gets stopped. The spouse cheated on has options. Quit thinking you have to protect the US effort or your cheater’s career. If you’re a female contractor going over there, know your boundaries before you go. Don’t strut your stuff. Wrong place if you don’t want to be known as a Desert Diamond. Keep your contacts with home tight and honest. Men and women should not be living or serving together. Period. Put them in separate units so that the bonds that are formed are appropriate and not threatening to the sanctity of the family unit back home.

Rape is not about sex it’s about power and control, Khristina. These power hungry men were getting off on dominating another human being, women being physically weaker than them and thus an easier target. They’re sadists.
It has little to do with being cooped up and horny in a war zone.