Clinton Will Fight As Long As It Takes

Very Good Story. Before you Obamanites start whining and crying, I am sure if your guy was a little behind and won Florida and Michigan, you would be very supportive of his efforts to stay in the race and keep fighting. A lesser candidate than Mrs. Clinton just might throw in the towel. I want my next President to be a fighter and a scrapper, and I see that in Hillary Clinton

If she cost the dems the election in nov because of stubbornness, i may never forgive her.

Jordan,
You can not change the rules for either. Florida and Michigan do not and should not count for either.
This entire florida/michigan mess should have been figured out beofre hand. HRC did not pursue it because she honestly tyhought that she would not neeed them for the nom, dont forget that. Now that she is in a fight she now again flips to serve her needs. It has nothing to do with being a fighter. FAir is fair and we are talking litigation if she trys to force the delegates in. If that happens we are looking another 4-8 years of a REpub

Sorry Ron, it is not Democratic to take away the votes of almost 2 million Florida votes and the votes in Michigan no matter who they voted for. The Democrats have no right to punish voters in their owe party because the Republicans moved up the primary. That is nonsense. This alone will destroy the Democratic Party and open the doors for another 4 years of the Republicans. Hillary had nothing to do with it.
Do you think Florida and Michigan will come out in force for any Democratic candidate, if their votes don’t count? McCain wins by a landslide in those states.

If anyone costs the Dems the race it will be Obama. He was advised in the beginning by the party that he was not ready, not experienced enough. His ego got in the way of what was best for the party and the country.

IT’S OBAMA’S FAULT; HE CHOSE TO TAKE HIS NAME OFF THE MICHIGAN BALLOT AND CLINTON OBVIOUSLY WON FLORIDA AS WELL. IT WAS NOT WISE FOR OBAMA TO REMOVE HIS NAME IN THE MICHIGAN BALLOT. AS A MAN, IT IS FAIR THAT HE SHOULD ACCEPT THE CONSEQUENCES OF HIS POOR DECISION. REMEMBER, HE VOTED PRESENT MORE THAN A 100 TIMES, INSTEAD OF TAKING ACCOUNTABILITY FOR HIS ACTION BY VOTING EITHER YES OR NO!

It’s always fair to change the rules when you are losing!

And had they let Flordia stand who would of had the mo then

I’ll give you that Jordan. Clinton won’t give up early.
But I think you’re seeing that my guess might just be right, about the drama being played out between the DNC and the Clinton campaign, and this message wasn’t meant for us as much as it was for the DNC.
This makes the obstacles even higher for Clinton, who is trying to catch up in pledged delegates as well as overcome whatever the Democratic leadership might do next.

Paul: Your guess could be very accurate, but Mr. Obama’s supporters always try to blame Hillary directly for the mess the DNC created. If they don’t decide on all these tangibles real fast, the party will implode at the convention right before America’s eyes. It will be a sad time in our history, and forget about Obama and Clinton. The Republicans will steal the election, once the Democratic party is weakened and fractured beyond repair.

Um, the party leadership in FL and Mich knew, when they went ahead with their voting that it was not going to count. Te candidates agreed to it. Haven’t we had enough of changing the rules so that they suit us? If Hills gets her way I am done with the democratic party. They get to vote in the general. The local voters need to remove the current party officials and install new ones.

REMEMBER DADE COUNTY FLORIDA in 2000
What have we learned? Nothing!!!!
If there had been a re-vote in Florida Al Gore might be president today and there might not be am Iraq war.
WHAT’S THE PROBLEM WITH A RE-VOTE?
If something is broken, then fix it, I don’t think any of the voters would complain. They ttok the time out once to have theit voices heard and they would do it again.
Either certify the existing vote in Florida and Michigan or hold new contests. It’s not that hard, if the Democrats want what right and what’s fair. Any disenfrachised votes is simply UNAMERICAN and wrong.

Paul She might net 5-10 delegates.
Hawaii has only 20, so they will probably split.. And Wisconsin has 74, will still be split about 50/50
Hillary is about 136 pledged delegated behind, not counting supers. She is hoping to make up ground by winning Ohio, Texas, and PA by good margins, plus she should win Puerto Rico and Rhode Island, and be competitive in Kentucky and Indiana.
So in essence, there is a lot more campaigning left to do.

OK Louis, I will give you that argument, they all agreed. Fine. My vote doesn’t count.
Of course, did they come to us in this state and ask us permission to negate our votes? No. They did not.
But still those were the rules.
So explain, why did Obama violate the campaign rules in Florida and run 112 comcast cable, Broward County Hollywood Pembroke Pines, Ft. Lauderdale, Sunrise, Oakland Park, Plantation, Boca Raton – - and on and on, 112 ads? I saw daily ads for 2 weeks on CNN (ch. 28, comcast cable, Broward).
How do you explain is right to run those ads in clear violation? Clinton did go to Florida afterwards, at a hotel right down the road from me, but that was AFTER THE ELECTION WAS OVER.
She did get our votes in a HUGE landslide that didn’t count.
But Obama absolutely, without hesitation, without being able to slough it off, violated the rules and ran those ads. Period.
That is not fair. That is cheating. That is dishonesty. You cannot excuse that, even if the votes do not count, and never do count.
Michigan is another story. All the names were not on the ballot and I don’t see anyway they can count them. It is not fair to the folks whose names were missing. Period.
I would love Hillary to win the nomination but I cannot agree that Michigan was a clear choice for her, though the uncomitted totals still lost by 15% which is not a close election.
Florida on the other hand had a cheater, running ads anyway, and he still got destroyed in the head to head matchup.

Senator Clinton and Senator Obama new the rules about Florida and Michigan. Let’s stick to the rules, Florida and Michigan should not count!!

As a resident of Michigan let me tell you that it IS NOT in Obama’s best interest to have a re-election. He has angered the voters (almost into a frenzy) with his comments on how we don’t count. Let him come back – he’ll learn the meaning of a count!!

The Florida primary was moved up by the Republican governor and the largely Republican legislature. They are responsible for moving both primaries.
Progressive DJ Randi Rhoades is one of the few in the media to explain it.
Theie is a legtimate argument for Obama to get the uncommitted in Michigan because no one else is left to use them, and Hillary get hers.
Hillary won Florida by 52% and those voters deserve to be counted.

The DNC allowed the Republican Party control the Democratic primaries since the Michigan Supreme Court and the Florida Legislature, both Republican, approved the date of both primaries.
While the Republicans punished FL and MI cutting their delegates in half, the DNC went to the extreme measure of eliminating all delegates.
With the DNC counting all the MI and FL delegates, Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama would have similar number of pledged delegates close to 1130 (excluding Super delegates).
The GOP is laughing all the way engineering in part the fight which is alienating Democratic Party voters to the benefit of John McCain in the general election.

Can you imagine the elderly standing around in hot rooms in the summer in Florda to do a caucus?
The middle class is taking vacations with kids and don’t need the headache of a caucus.
Obama, and I do like him but in 8 years after Hillary has done the hard work of cleaning up the country, needs to not talk out of both sides of his mouth.
What do Ted Kennedy and John Kerry do with their votes? AFter all, Hillary won their state.

Oh God,can you imagine if Sinclair had worked on a Clinton while doing drugs!!! ‘
OMG the world would have stopped turning by now, and she would have been forced out, true story or not.
And if we are going to pretend to be honest here, you have to admit that much.
But you know, it isn’t true, yet, if ever. So I guess they do not want to splash it all over. I just can’t help but think they wouldn’t be able to resist if it was Clinton. It would somehow, ‘accidentally’ made CNN and FOX and MSNBC and ABC and CBS and PBS and BBC. I mean Obama is a master at hiding inaccuracies, even if by mistake.

You can clearly see now that Clinton’s camp is beginning to exploit a variety of her dirty, ruthless, and shameless tricks. Ickes is a good example of that” he voted for stripping of the delegates of Florida and Michigan, and now he ate up his words big time. So does Hillary Clinton!!!!!!!! That’s why we really need change and hope. That’s also you see the ugly sides of Clintons. I think everything she does now will backfire big time for her eventual and fateful defeat.

What is it you Hillary voters don’t understand ? These were the rules, Hillary knew that all along. You can’t take the votes when she knew they weren’t going to count. Not only that someone from the election board form Florida said that Obamas ads were legal. Don’t you people read ? You listen to, to many people that spread lies. Wake up and read about your candidate, not rip on their opponent. Some of the people that voted absentee, said they would have changed their votes to Obama if they would have known what Hillary was pulling.

We all realize the race for the Democratic nomination is VERY close. Sen. Obama has a bit more than a 100 delegate lead before the Feb. 19 Primaries and he leads in overall Democratic votes cast. The race could get even closer.
Sen. Clinton, in political terms, has “no choice” except to go negative. She is behind and neither candidate can get to the required delegate count to win before the convention. And, she has already begun to go negative in her speeches and commercials. We can expect Sen. Clinton and her surrogates to do what Pres. Clinton did in SC, only more forcefully.
As with all modern American political races, their goal will be to destroy Sen. Obama and his family. It is reasonable to expect some version of “Swiftboat II” done on Sen. Obama.
Should these things occur, I think we can say the Democratic Party handed the “election they couldn’t lose” to the Republican Party.

So if Hillary had run ads, there would be no outcry that that was why the beast won, that she cheated and ran ads in a state that was to have no Democratic ads.
I accept your point. I would ask your opinion on what the general perception would be, not knowing about what you have said, what would the general public’s opinion be, if Hillary had run ads, and then boasted about winning?
They would be on her like flies on a dead corpse. But there just seems to be an unending litany of excuses afforded Obama that do no apply to anyone else. And it just seems disingenous and a bit unfair, when regarded from a distance.
His ads helped the voters learn about him, as he claimed that they did not know him, and that is why she got so many votes.
Well they had 2 weeks to see unending ads about the Hope and The Dream and The Future. But he still got trounced.
But our votes don’t count. :( Sucks, really. Oh well.

If it’s MCCAIN vs. Clinton-then MCcain wins becuse of the anti hillary vote.
If it’s MCCain vs. Obama….Obama winds because of the young voter.
anymore questions!

Obama is clearly still an addict. While his drug problems “appear” to be behind him he still has the addiction to cigarettes that he cannot control. Once an addict always an addict.

Wow!!
I never knew there were so many people with their heads in the sand.

Sammy is far as I’m concerned the youth vote is nothing but a bunch of uniformed people who are voting for Obama because it’s just a fad. The media created this plain and simple. The youth vote has been irrelevant for the last five elections

REALITY CHECK — for all the partisan bickering going on here, let’s face it — there is virtually no difference between these two candidates on any of the issues. They differ on some of the minutae of their health programs, but whatever each of them submits is going to be revised by Congress anyway, basically making their differences meaningless. We Democrats are lucky — either of thse guys would make a GREAT President. The Repubs are the ones with candidates all over the map, we aren’t.
All of the screaming and grandstanding in this campaign over essentially nothing it getting to be ridiculous and may hurt our party. C’mon, not having your specific choice of these two get the nomination isn’t the end of America as we know it.

Yes, Janice we are sick of the lies from the Obama camp, and everyone knows a “revolt” trumps a “movement”…lol

Democrats must unite!
All this division is playing into the hands of Karl Rove…no, he didn’t resign from the White House to write books. He slithered back into private life to do what he did for GW. WIN THE WHITE HOUSE. If he could win it for GW, all the easier for McCain. First, you divide the Democrats. Second, get them to nominate the weakest for the slaughter. Please, don’t let this happen. The Republicans want Obama to win. The Rove machine will have the time of its life defining Obama their way. Obama will go into defensive mode and will never get his message out (if he has one). Talk of change WILL NOT get him elected in November! If we unite as a Democratic Party and work together, we could control the White House for the next 16 years. Hillary Clinton – President, Barack Obama – Vice President, John Edwards – Attorney General (even better Supreme Court Judge), Bill Richardson – Secretary of State or Ambassador at large (we need someone to clean up this mess in the Middle East that’s been created by the White House Neocon’s). In eight years Barack will have the experience to be President.
We stand at the crossroads…will we look to the future of America and the future of our party, or do we play into the hands of the Rove machine. You better believe it’s cranking in the background and when it starts spewing forth all its disinformation, half truths, and outright lies we better have the strongest candidate to face it head on.

Jack, I refuse to join a cult so guess I would donate to McCain. Glad that won’t be necessary in the end.

You don’t get it, democratrus. To most, the Rove machine = the Clinton machine. Same tactics, different party. Our call is above party.

Time to rally around Sen Obama. Clinton supporters, it’s time to do what’s best for the party. She can only get the nominaiton by tearing the party in two at this point. You could cost us the election in nov. IT”S TIME.

Great news. Hillary is on message while her opponent has never gotten on message. Ad nauseum, he repeats the word, “change”, over and over again. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. His “one word” simplistic message has failed at this point, and he is frightened to debate. Is this someone we want as the party’s nominee? A resounding NO. Send him back to the Senate to gain the necessary experience and try to build a record of accomplishment as Hillary has done.

How many of you who are demanding that Hillary release her tax records have ACTUALLY READ Obama’s? I thought so! Do any of you have a problem with the organizations he gave to as charitable contributions? The great uniter! Yah right.

My god!! It appears that all the Clinton ditto-heads are out in full force today. As an Obama supporter I will vote for Hillary if she wins the nomination despite the fact that the majority of you guys will be the sorest of losers if Obama prevails. For crissakes folks save your vitriol and rancorous remarks for the general election. These caustic statements about Obama (and vice versa)may be the source of much regret later when president-elect McCain prevails over a fractured Democratic party. A president Hillary or Barack is light-years better than this potential nightmare scenario. So folks, lets keep the discourse clean, substantive and on the high ground. Go Dems ’08!!!!

An organization that does not allow the members to question the leader is a cult.

The DNC can’t just turn around and count MI and FL as if nothing happened.
Thousands and thousands of voters stayed home and didn’t vote because they were told their vote didn’t count.
No one got the chance to talk to a candidate or ask any questions because campaigning was not allowed.
In Michigan, most of the candidates weren’t even on the ballot.
I’m not saying it’s Hillary’s or Obama’s fault, but the DNC can’t go and change their mind now. The voters of those states will be disillusioned no matter what, and nothing can fix it at this point.
What a mess!

JEFF– Bottom line, he release his.Why not HILLIARY? What she hiding?

Here is the bottom line from the Obama Campaign:
- We give a zilch about democracy and peoples will as longs we win
- We will use any rovian technique to gain the white house, including racial bating
- We will go to any length, if necessary, to destroy the democratic party to secure the nomination
- What we do in our financial dealings etc is non of your business in the democratic party, and thereafter it represents a right wing attack to our privacy! So keep at bay, and of course the pardons are always handy!
- And out motto is fight! Fight till you divide and rule!
Sorry RO, I borrowed your post. It could go both ways you see… Mr. Obama will need to pardon Mr. Rezko as his first official act as President.

How about while you’re answering ready999′s question, Jeff, also answer why she won’t release the fundraising docs for the Clinton Library?

Yes, thanks. But the cut and paste squads come out in full force for both candidates. I think the Kenya thing is a non-issue at this point. We need to be more worried about the Repubs stealing the election once Hillary and Barack destroy each other. Sad truth is they both have giant ego’s and will not play nice until it’s too late.

considering Senator Clinton’s long history of advocacy for women and children, Americans and New Yorkers, I would have to say her workaholic dedication to others far outshines her ego…..I can’t say the same thing about obama…..

So, if Hillary loses the election she wants to have it awarded to her. Many of the posters on this site want to award it to her if she loses. I guess the non thinking less educated followers of hers will blindly follow her even if it means destroying democracy in the democratic party.
Hanging chads? Hillary wants to leave the democratic primary voters hanging.

I don’t think the Florida or Michigan votes should count. If the they want their voices heard then hold another primary. I’m sure many dems didn’t go to the polls for either candidate since they knew their votes wouldn’t award any delgates, I know I wouldn’t have voted if the same thing happened in my state.

Isn’t it interesting that the number of independabt voters in the US is almost equal to the combined numbers of Democrats and Republicans. That should tell you something about the politics today. Politicians make the laws and rules and change them to suit themselves. Is it any wonder our youth and anyone with any kind of intelligence wants something different and a change to every day politics?
The old politics are worn and shabby, it’s time for a change.

2009 Where Are You?
Obama asked permission from the Democratic Committee to run national ads, knowing that there was no way to prevent national ads from appearing in Florida. The National Democratic Committee authorized him to do so. If you have a beef, take it up with the committee and not Obama.
It is entirely possible that Clinton may have won Florida in a fair fight in which all the candidates campaigned. In fact, name recognition and fondness for Bill carried her name forward. I have read other blogs in which many, many, many Florida Democrats simply didn’t go to the election sites because they didn’t think their votes were going to count. They believed what the National committee told them. If you only have a percentage of the folks voting and then insist on counting them, you are still disenfranchising a large group of people.
Hillary and her campaign need to focus on winning delegates from available states. The National Committee needs to come up with some sort of method by which voters in Michigan and Florida can vote NOW and have that vote counted.
It would be the worst sort of dirty tricks and sink the Clinton campaign if they continue to insist–and get their way–to seat these delegates.

I think were awake and Mccain and and all the boys are crazy if they think will give up and let them have an easy target GO HILLARY and ps there are enough on each side to do our party in. if you think all the people {whitemale} in Iowa will vote Obama think again they start there so they can control the whole thing you know 50 years of republicans thing they hate Clinton because he messed them up

Jordan you talk about democrats finding common ground, how about who ever wins the most pledged delegates wins! Simple, fair, and representative of people!
And the clinton camp should not push/camp/legitamize for super delegates to overrule the will of the people! Agree to that, and we have common ground!

MESSAGE TO THE POOR AND BLUE COLLARS WORKERS OF THE STATES YET TO VOTE. Demand HILLIARY release of tax returns.If she really care about you she would release and show you she hiding nothing.Instead we all are going to be surprise with the results. The wealth and dirty business will appear.And she supposed to be for the common man.I dont think so!

common ground: a Clinton/obama ticket that is 100% guaranteed to win in November, and is 100% guaranteed to keep the White House in Democratic hands, thus greatly benefitting America, for at least the next 16 years…

Jasoninpa, I would have to say oops is much better than authorizing a war due to lack of judgement! And this shows another thing, that if Obama made a mistake he is ready to admit and rectify it, as opposed to hillary not even admitting her mistake – a la Bush!

last time i checked, obama’s votes regarding iraq were strikingly similar to those of Senator Clinton

I agree with Jordan, I want my next president to be a ‘fighter and a scrapper’….and more specifically, I want my next president to be an elderly woman, who holds boxing gloves over head at campaign rallies, in some kind of faux attempt at machismo.

Chris, yes we should look forward to the future, but we should at the same time not repeat the mistakes of the past! hint hint nook nook!
Also Obama’s votes were similar to Clintons, to support the troops after the fact that the invasion he DID NOT SUPPORT, was allowed through via puppet politians like hillary!

Hey CHRIS—THATS IT. THE PAST WAS SCARY,THE FUTURE FRIGHTING!!!!!!!

last time i checked, obama’s votes regarding iraq were strikingly similar to those of Senator Clinton
The only vote that got us into this mess was the Iraq War Resolution which Hillary not only voted for but spoke out in support of the day of the vote on the senate floor. That was where she said we should “put our trust in Bush”. Look it up.
Also, there’s a problem with her vote proclaiming Iran’s military a “terrorist organization”, which made Bush smile from ear to ear.

Clinton can talk tough all she wants, but Obama will win the nomination. And he will sweep into office in a landslide taking MANY Democrats into office with him. We might even get 60 in the Senate, without Leiberman.
McCain can’t beat Obama. It’s the war, stupid.

What I’m anticipating is another nasty court fight ahead…

Hillary should just drop out now. The last thing our country needs is a polarizing figure such as her running for the highest office in the land. The Clintons had their day. Make room for the new!!!

Clinton agreed that Florida and Mich. would not count. Now that she is losing, she reversed herself. She is so sleazy! She switched her position just like she has done with just about every issue. Counting those votes is like having a jury decide a case without the attorneys presenting their theories of the evidence. It violates the right to be heard by Obama. Hillary only won because of her name recognition -if voters got to see Obama they would have changed their minds just like they have accross the rest of the country. Hillary is shameless in her lack of principles; hence, for example, she stayed married to her known slut of a husband for her own political gain. If Clinton or her followers are so concerned about the voters in those two states, why not have a do-over after allowing each side to make their case. Hillary does not want that. Why? She knows she will either lose or do much worse than she did if it were actually a “fair fight.” There is no other reason for her to not agree to a “do-over.” THis proves she is a cheater who will stop at nothing to win. God help us if we get this manipulative phoney and her sleazy husband back in the white house. THey will soil it nearly as bad as Bush has.

I am so tired of the justification and manipulation of both Clintons. I can no longer believe anything either of them bring to the table. Fighting for your position is one thing. Lying, smearing and triangulating is disgusting. The GOP must be thrilled at all the material for ads the Clintons are providing. It is time to be better, brighter and smarter.

No wonder Ickes and the Clinton camp want to change the rules. Its in their nature to change the rules midstream to give them what they want. If this was Obama trying to change the rules I would be as critical.
The Clintons are masters of finding loopholes and bending the rules to suit their needs. Just like when her husband said that he did not have SEXUAL RELATIONS with that woman…directly to the American people. I guess oral stimulation and watching a live masterbation scene is not sex….
The fight the Clintons will wage will be the classic behind the doors deal making, promising nights in the Lincoln bedroom, Camp David, Air Force one, etc. Whatever it takes. Principles be damned.
America deserves better and YES WE CAN!

CelticOdyssey, It’s not that simple. Republicans win regardless of which one get the nomination. I think Clinton would do better but I don’t think she would win.

Clinton Campaign: Forget Democracy/Government by the people. Its BY THE Super-delegates/Party-leaders.
Hey, isn’t that the main difference between COMMUNISM and DEMOCRACY for electing head of the state? WOW, that’s a real CHANGE for the country by the Clintons.
I see lot of communist sounding people rooting for Clinton here.

So as long as she gives the impression that she will not disclose herself fully, people will distrust her. If I were her opponent, I would capitalize on the fact that she is not forthcoming with lots of stuff…

The Clintons are the most divisive people to have ever been in US politics. They would just as soon flush the Democratic party and the American people like they did so many women and workers. Shame on people picking a vendetta over the American people.

barefootboy,
In my opinion, if Clinton wins the nomination, she and her husband will run a dirty campaign, and we’ll lose anyway. McCain is a nice guy, but I don’t want him as president. And Obama is so energizing, he will win independents and Republicans alike. Hillary can’t do that.

Actually, Debbie Dingle, wife of John Dingle, thought it was a bang up idea to move the Michigan primary and worked with the Reps in Michigan to move the date. The Reps were all for it, everyone kept saying it was going to bring all this money into the state. Of course, they were given plenty of warning that it wasn’t going to happen that way. Did they listen? Nooo.. The Michigan Dem party consists of a bunch of idiots. I already have stopped contributing to them.
The delegates from Florida and Michigan should not be seated. I want my vote to count, but I want the rules to be followed too. A re-vote would be fine, even if it’s a caucus, but just saying whoever voted should count when many did not bother to vote at all because we were told it would not count is very unfair. It’s no different than when Republicans have been caught sending misleading information to Dem voters to get them to go to the wrong polling location or go on the wrong date. It’s wrong.
It’s a spoiled election in Michigan and Florida and should be redone or tossed out. As far as the guy that said people are furious at Obama for saying the rules should be honored.. you’re wrong in your assertions. I’m sure there are some Clinton supporters who are madder than hell that they haven’t been allowed to steal the delegates. But many of us are more interested in a fair, clean election. We are concerned that those who have been inspired to get involved for the first time or have re-engaged in the political process after being discouraged for so long, will just stay home on election day if things are seen to be ugly, dirty, unfair, politics as usual.
Of course, the other people that might be madder than heck at Obama are the idiot dems running the Michigan party who are trying to redirect the anger of the rest of us stupid mooks who let them run the party here. Yeah it’s that OBAMA guy that caused all this problem.. NOT. Debbie Dingle. Those of you angry about the MI primary fiasco need to email and call her office till they disconnect the phones and shut off their computers.
January 10th is just way too early to go out and vote. We didn’t know anything about the candidates then. We were too focused on the holidays to think about politics. I am most concerned that we get the primaries moved back to a more reasonable date for future elections.
But for now, do over or don’t count us.

Hillary was the “presumptive nominee” from the beginning: money, legacy, and the party machine. That an “upstart” decided to challenge her is remarkable, and it is a credit to what remains of democracy in America that Obama has succeeded in upending her hopes. I am an east coast, educated,somewhat elderly and affluent white woman who became disillusioned with HRC many speeches ago. Sorry. The party needs to comply with the will of its members, or else it is an arm of ideologues.
-Carolyn

So Obama is a smoker. Let’s hear that health plan again.

While reading the blogs I was horrified to see the word “Oprah”. People of Wisconsin hear me loud and clear – don’t make Obama bring OPRAH back out. PLEASE PLEASE do the right thing!

Go girl!!!!Go! Go! Go! Nobody has ever done this before!

Let us take it to Denver, This is the best thing for Obama, it gives him time to campaign nationally, aggressively and get one on one with voters. This is the spring board he is using and Nov will be a cake walk.

YOU CLINTON SUPPORTS KEEP REFUSING TO ADDRESS TWO POINTS:
1. Why won’t Hillary release her taxes? (and why do you think she should not when Barack did)?
2. Why did Ickes reverse himself on MI and FL when he initially voted to discard any vote there (and why would you support such duplicitous behavior)?
Your continual refusal to address both of these questions in this forum indicate that you either have no answer to these or are ashamed/embarrased by this behavior.
If you don’t respond, we can only assume you have no response.

I think the DNC is making a dangerous assumption. There actually has been some real CHANGE in all of this. Firstly, I don’t think the DNC has the ultimate authority, over states rights, to exclude Florida and Michigan from being counted at the convention. Secondly, this is not the time, place or election to allow super delegates to overturn the will of the Democratic voters. The dynamics of this particular election already have many of the ingredients to become a tender box by convention time, an overriding by super delegates is just the kind of spark to start a conflagration that would split the Democratic Party for years to come. The People’s vote should count above all else.

If Hillary has nothing to hide from relasing her taxes, why doesn’t she? The burden of proof is on all candidates running for office to disclose this information to the public. You call yourself Democrats, you should be ashamed of yourselves, supporting such undemocratic principles as refusing to release taxes… this is something Bush would do and the fact that you still support her is unbelievable.

Clinton supports that claim Obama is creating some sort of cult, you sicken me.
Enough with this messianic garbage about pulling the wool over the collective consiousness of America’s young and impressionable….
You think the vast majority of the nation’s largest newspapers’ editorial boards were so naiveley duped? What you forget (or conviniently ignore) is that these boards didn’t make their decisions listening to speeches, they do so based on hours-long phone conferences or in-person meetings with the candidates. They quiz the candidates in excruciating detail on the issues and proposed solutions. Time and again they conclude that Obama has the most nuanced and practical views and perspectives.
You probably think they are pandering to their readers’ support for Barack. You’d be wrong. The vast majority of California’s major papers endorsed Obama, yet he lost there by 10 points.
You will have no response to this, just as you refuse to respond to no taxes released and flip-flop on MI and FL.
Pathetic.

2009 Where Are You — let’s get some facts down here, shall we?
1. She visited the state numerous times for fundraisers. So did Obama. This did not violate any agreement as far as the DNC was concerned.
2. What ads ran in Florida was bundled with national advertising and there were FCC rules that made that difficult to circumvent. This also did not violate DNC rules and was in fact sanctioned by a superdelegate after Clinton complained.
3. She declared a victory in Florida when it mattered not. No delegates were awarded so she made herself look silly counting a straw vote.
4. She pandered to her supporters three days before the primary, cleverly announcing she would “seat the delegates”. This language was deliberately ambiguous to make it sound like the votes were suddenly going to count again. It sent her supporters flocking to the polls and rang the phone off the hook at both the state and national office. Those who called learned that nothing had changed and this was simply more Clinton manipulation.
5. The DNC has already ruled (and a federal judge backed it up) that the delegates “will be seated at the discretion of the nominee” so that means the nominee is ALREADY selected. Duh! For the record, Obama also pledged to seat the delegates should he be the nomimee — back on Sept 07. Hillary went further and implied she can reverse the DNC decision. When she turns up unable to make the votes count for all those people she sent rushing to the polls, she’ll shrug her shoulders and say, “I tried” and smile coyly. Meanwhile she got the guaranteed win on a straw vote she wanted just after the stinging loss in SC. Can it get any more desperate than that? My guess is that cost her some in Super Tuesday for how terrible it is to be capitalizing on Floridian pain.
6. Senator Nelson tried filing a lawsuit to stop the penalty and it was dismissed by a federal judge. The day after Hillary announced she is seating delegates, he endorsed her.
7. When you call the state office, they say they are still pushing to have the delegates seating. They are in bed with Hillary, apparently. It has been my experience that Florida Dems are exceptionally lame. There is a petition circulating protesting using this lopsided primary (and it is lopsided) and demanding a redo with full campaigning.
8. A class action law suit stands waiting in the wings on behalf of all those who did not vote and were told explicitly by the DNC votes will not count to be filed if Hillary is stupid enough to pull more crapola.
Now more of you know more of the story.

JIM
IS THAT THE BEST YOU’VE GOT???
“Of all the important issues at stake I don’t understand why someone would focus on whether or not a candidate released their tax records. In the scheme of things it seems really trivial especially because most of you don’t know how to read them.”
First of all your comment is insulting. Second of all, you still refuse to address the question – why won’t she release them? If she doesn’t have ANYTHING to hide, why not release them?
YOU CAN’T ANSWER THIS QUESTION because you know deep down that there is NO reason she shouldn’t release them. You talk about blind followers? You are the worst blind followers because you can’t even take an objective look at this duplicitous behavior.
You talk about disenfranchisement in MI and FL? Are you kidding? What about the millions of voters whose voices WERE NOT HEARD because they were told there votes wouldn’t mean anything? Are you kidding me? If you truly believed in having all votes counted and voices heard, you would support do-over primaries. But you don’t. What a surprise. You people make me sick.

By the Clinton folks’ strained logic, George Bush is the most qualified candidate for president. After all, he does have eight more years of “experience” in the office than either Hillary or Barack. Obviously, experience is one thing. Success is something else entirely. Given Hillary’s “successes” with her national health care efforts under Clinton I, and her judgement of Bush when she had to decide to vote on authorizing him to invade Iraq, I would say that we might do better with someone with a different track record.

Hillary and her supporters are doing a heck of a job swift boating Obama, just too bad it’s backfiring.
If she would just stick to the issues, and tell America what they want hear instead of whining about Obama’s lead, she might have a chance.

She ahs to say she will fight till the convention… because as we have already seen some super delegates are defecting and I am sure that the money boys are getting a bit reluctant to part with any more donations… She’s desperately trying to hold it together till March 4th when she hopes she will still be leading in TX and OH

I wonder how much Hillary is paying her supporters to smear Obama here.
5 Million?
Pathetic!

corstr.
She is under no obligation to show her tax returns to anyone. How can you be sure there is something suspicious in there, or like Obama, you must be clairvoyant.
Sounds like you are just trying to pick a fight.
Do you think a do over would matter? Mrs. Clinton would still destroy him in Florida by a huge margin. He is not too popular in Florida right now, and she would still win by a good margin in Michigan. If the DNC pays for 2 new primaries I am all for it.
Mr. OBama is a lot of things, but playing fair and square is certainly not one of them. I just took a good look in the mirror and I like what I see, and I sleep very well at night , Thank you for asking.

edjamgra wrote: “So many of you keep talking about Clintons experience. What experience? She’s a first term Senator just like Obama.
Being a Governors spouse and a Preisents spouse does not give you the experience of being a Governor or a President.”
She was the first to start Universal Health Care back in 1902 while Mr. Obama might be walking on street looking for job.

Jordan,
I understand your frustration but no, I’m not telling you or anyone else to sit down and shut up. I am providing you with facts and hope that you will direct your anger in the appropriate direction. What I’m saying is that the democratic party is an organization and as such has the right to set up it’s rules as it wishes. What I would suggest if you are unhappy with how things work is to get more involved with the party of your choice and try to get your voice heard to help solve the problem before the next election.
What is not fair is demanding that your vote count as it was cast despite the unfairness to other voters within your state who understood that there was no contest. The best analogy I’ve heard is it’s like being officially notified that the football game was called due to weather and then hearing later that the home team was declared the winner because they were there and you weren’t.

Here’s two senarios:
1. Hillary wins the primaries. Obama respectfuly endorses her for the presidency.
2. Obama wins the primaries. Hillary and Bill make it their mission to swift boat Obama till election day in November with the help of their dear friend Rupert Murdoch.
You read it here first!

March 5 this will not even matter. The results will be close in OH but Obama will win TX and RI. Clinton will be pressured by her donors to bow out gracefully. Her superdelegates whose districts supported Obama will join the Obama side.

Gosh corst:
You are awfully confident and very sure Mr. Obama will win the nomination. I don’t have a crystal ball, and I will always be a Hillary supporter. You can’t change that. I respect you, but you’re a little over the top with all of your superiority based statements. I will just let the next 3 months go by and see how things play out. I am pretty sure Hillary has nothing to hide, but you need to ask her your question directly. I can’t answer what I don’t know.

Ickes unfortunately is ill-serving Clinton with these kind of statements. Republicans are crossing over to vote in the Democratic primaries for Obama by the tens of thousands – even Time magazine reported on the G.O.P. organizing campaign in the red states. It’s almost insurmountable at this point. Texas and Wisconsin are open primaries, which means you don’t even have to change your voter registration in order to cross parties and try to knock Clinton out of the race. She cannot beat the Rove strategy – which includes this newcomer Obama dropping out of the sky into the race with $100 million – without the superdelegates. Howard Dean and the DNC have already deprived her of her Michigan and Florida wins. I’ve never seen such a stacked deck in politics, and the Clinton campaign should be calling attention to it.

what kind of doofus actually believes that Senator Clinton does not care about the caucus states? oh yeah…the ignorant kind

We should vote for her because of her leadership? Negativity and changing the rules is considered leadership?
Pretty sad when people will scrape the bottom of the barrel to find positives for Hillary.

senator obama, as nice as he is, would be DESTROYED in a national election against republicans for the White House…..not by the mccain campaign, but by those like swiftboatvvets and other anti-Americans who only care about keeping the White House in republican hands……even her most hateful opponents agree that Senator Clinton can withstand and even thrive under such attacks and pressure…

Every body and their mom hates Hillary, and if by chance she wins or someone helps her steal the primary, she will lose against McCain, guaranteed. That’s what the GOP want!
Hopefully she’s not in on it, but judging by her rage, it doesn’t look good. Maybe that’s why she’s attacking Obama, to get people to hate her even more than they do now, while Diebold elects her.

DITTO!
Geonm

Good out Jordan – “vicious posts”. Take the “high road”. Easier to do that than answer my question I imagine.
But I will agree with your very good point that the infighting will hurt our party. Would I bring myself to vote for Hillary over McCain? It will depend on how she conducts herself from here on out. If after losting WI and HI and then squeeks out narrow wins in Ohio and Texas but is still behind by around 150 pledged delegates (which there is not way she could overcome in the remaing contests), if after this she still brings a fight using MI or FL or with the superdelegates, goodbye to the Democratic party. And goodbye to my voting at all, and many many other Democrats.
If the above scenario played out, I imagine that you and the rest of the Clinton supporters here would support her withdrawing? I sure hope so, because if the tables were turned the pressure on Barack to drop out would be huge.

I believe that the Democratic Party was wrong to punish Florida and Michigan by denying their votes. What kind of democracy is that? Mistakes have been made by both parties over the years in seating delegates or denying delegates their seats. That is wrong, and it is clear that the voters of Michigan and Florida cast their votes anyway at the time for voting specified by others. The voters have spoken, and they should be counted. One person, one vote is the way we should be counted.
Geonm

why are some obama supporters so ready to concede the election to mccain if their man doesn’t get the nomination? is it that they care more for their candidate than for the best interests of America?

For those of you who don’t live in MI and love to trash our primary, you need to get a few things straight. The only names on the ballot were Hillary, Dodd (who had already dropped out), Kucinich, Gravel and Uncommitted. There was no Obama, Edwards, Biden or Richardson on the ballot. You had a choice between 2 actual people Hillary and Kucinich. You were not able to write in a candidate’s name (the ballot would be thrown out) and if you didn’t want to vote for Hillary you voted Uncommitted. This message was not broadcasted across the state for everyone to hear so most people went in and just voted for the name they recognized on the ballot.
Mind you there are plenty of people to blame, Mark Brewer, Carl Levin and Sander Levin were the ones who pushed for the early primary. You also have Howard Dean from the DNC who in the end made the call to nullify the election. As a voter I am ###### at each and everyone of them for the mess we are in.
I don’t fault MI and FL for their early primaries, its time we break the stranglehold that Iowa and New Hampshire have on our decision making. I am just mad that more states didn’t follow. If California had done so, I don’t think we would have having this converstaion. If the democratic party is about change, how about changing how everyone picks a nominee.
Not sure if you have noticed, MI has been in its own one state recession for years and the federal govt has turned their backs on us. We are sinking here and all we wanted was the Democratic party to acknowledge us. Was it handled poorly, yes and heads should roll but on both sides. I have no respect for Howard Dean anymore and believe he needs to resign from the DNC. Same goes for Mark Brewer the head of the Michigan Democratic Party.

Hillary is so desperate, Ikes, her advisor, who voted to strip Florida and Michigan of their right to have their votes counted, now wants to count their votes.
If that’s not pathetic, then I don’t know what is.
Still think she’s a Saint?

Senator Clinton has the intelligence, the resources, the preparation, the international contacts, the credibility, the qualifications, the initiative, the drive and the experience to do what needs to be done for the best interests of our children, our troops, our economy, our conflict with terrorism, our international allies, our shared problems, our educational problems, our health care system, our environment, our future and that of our children. This is why she is the best choice for President.

The Clintons are really shameless, The Right Wing has been on the money about them all along. Obama represents change and is the best from this country, not her. If she gets her way she will cost us the election, shame on her greediness.

New Deal, are you kidding?
If you are for all the voters’ voices being heard in FL and MI, then you would no doubt support do-over primaries. But you won’t support this, and I’ll tell you why: you know that do-overs will result in lower pledged delegate counts if Barack and Hillary both campaign for real in those states.
Don’t preach about Democratic values. Those votes were not “Democratic” and you know it. I’m not going to sit here and say throw out the will of FL and MI, as some other close-minded Barack supporters might insist. But at least meet me half way on do-overs. If you won’t your position is as politically-motivated and shameful as those Barack supports who say ignore FL and MI completely.
But I doubt you’ll agree to that, and I’m curious as to what you reasoning will be for not having do-overs where everyone’s voices would be heard… wait, I can hear it now… “it will cost too much”, or.. “they had their chance”… better come up with something better than that.

For those of you who are content to listen to the Republican spinners for the last two decades, read for youself to see what Hillary has done to help others. Her life story is full of hope and optimism for children, families, human rights, education, incomes for middle and lower income families, and the development of trust and cooperation with other countries. We need her intelligence, her vision, her work ethic, and her preparedness to lead this country now. George Bush still has not learned how to lead after more than seven years! The job requires more than on the job training. It requires Experience relevant to the job.
Geonm

I attended our local Democratic caucus and watched the young people, who had never been this involved in politics in their lives, expressing their preferences for candidates. I was heartened by their sincere and optimistic enthusiasm for a democratic process. I’m appalled that Hillary Clinton would demean the caucus process, and in doing so, the participation of these young Democrats in one of the most important decisions of their lives. That sounds a lot like those politicians who thrive on our cynicism and disinterest in politics and our government.

Independent, FreedomEnemies.com is a rightwing site, and you’re saying Republicans want Obama to get the nod?
Are you crazy?
They want Hillary to win the primaries because she’ll lose against McCain, guaranteed.

Florida was a big deal in 2000. I guarantee you they will vote republican if the DNC do not seat there delegates. I know this state and the way the people think and hear it each day. I think that whoever carries Florida wins the election. I think Clinton and Obama are close in the people’s choice, but it is a republican sate in most cases. Tee them off and it will stay that way. A few weeks ago I felt the democrats had a chance, but the Florida people are riled up about what the DNC did. I have been told Michigan people are also, but I don’t know about them.

Well costr I do know more than you Judging by your statements you come across as an uniformed idiot. Bill Clinton was not race baiting plain and simple. That’s something the media concocted so their little darling would win.

Okay, so let’s recap the answers from all these well-informed Clinton supporters:
1. On releasing taxes: “I can’t answer a question I have no answer to..” (that’s a good one)
2. On Ickes flip-flopping on MI and FL – NOT A SINGLE RESPONSE (But then again, how COULD anyone defend such pathetic politicaly trickery)
3. On why not have Do-over primaries in FL and MI – NOTHING!!
4. On how DARE Hillary and her campaign belittle the voters and states that did not vote for her, saying they are meaningless in the general.
Think, people. Think about WHY you are blindly following Hillary when you see this type of behavior that is so Rovian it is frightening.
Yes, I’d love to see a woman president. In fact, as I’ve said, I was a BIG supporter of Hillary’s before all this win-at-all-costs behavior, Bill showing his true colors, Hillary crying opportunistically. But call a rat a rat folks. Don’t be sheep.

So, if you give Clinton Florida, she gains 42 delegates, and Obama is still ahead by 95 pledged delegates.
Clinton would have to take 52% of the remaining delegates, of all of the 1105, to break even in pledged delegates.
This is highly unlikely (think Oregon and North Carolina) given the current forecast.
She’ll lose in pledged delegates, even with Florida counting. She’ll try to win with superdelegates overriding the votes from the election.
Obama will be ahead in pledged delegates, and the superdelegates will know better than to try and take the election away from him. He polls better nationally, he has brought new people into the party, and the super delegates will not want to be responsible for over-turning the voting public.
Let’s see how the rest of the primaries/caucuses turn out, but the likely scenario, by the math, is that Hillary has lost.

If the Democratic “superdelegates” vote against the will of the people, welcome John McCain for president. After all the Democratic talk of the unrepresentativeness of Bush, it would be beyond a joke.

Geez I really don’t know why people are even discussing this the democrats have already lost, it makes no difference who they chose or who they seat. If Clinton wins the nomination the Obama supporters will vote Mc Cain, and likewise if Obama is chosen and FL not seated the Clinton supporters will vote McCain….so stop all the discussing and get ready to welcome President Mc Cain 2008.

Get a grip people.Judging from the hysteria in most of these posts,I would say that you people are new voters.You obviously do not have a clue as to the rules of the game.Cooler heads will prevail.All is not lost.And if your candidate loses you can vote again in 2012.Senator Clinton is NOT going to just step aside so your cult leader can rule this country.She IS tough and smart and she is not afraid of hard work.Of course you know nothing about actual WORK.From the sound of you,you have pretty much always had your way.This is the real world.Nobody gets everything they want.Egobama lost in Florida and Michigan.Both are high delegate states.The Democratic National Committe wil settle this.They are well aware of what is at stake.You will get nowhere with all this whining and empty threats.As for Senator Clinton”s Tax returns that is none of your business.That is just an excuse for you to critize her.What good would it do you to read them??You would then just look for something else to whine about.There are at least sixteen more states to vote yet.If you people dont chill out you will not last that long.Hillary will prevail.

That site does not cite credible sources
if it was that credible don’t you think Hillary would be using it? at least she is smart enough to recognize fase info when she sees it

Today, I watched briefly Obama and Clinton campaigning. The audience behind Obama holding “change” signs are all very young and most with a blank and vacant look on their faces. The audience behind Clinton are older, with intielligent and thoughtful faces. Just look at the audiences behind these two, I know who I should choose.

I do believe Senator Clinton will achieve the nomination for the democratic party but she’s going to have to fight. Senator Clinton is a fighter and if she comes out punching on next Thursday debates so be it! You people better wake up we. Iran, Korea, Russia and Syria hate our very being. Iran held hostages remember in the Carter adminstration, Korea ignored our warning to install a nuclear program, Russia supplies arms to country that can’t wait to blow us up, Syria god forbiid is such a terriorist nation, it’s unbelievable! Obama is to wet behind the ears to try and control these countries, they will never sit and talk with him, McCain is just to old. Senator Clinton got the power, the know how, she walks the walk, and talks the talk. Put her in the ring and these countries are going to come under some sort of agreements at the bargaining table.They smear her on the cable news and newspaper, but when push comes to shove it’s going to be Senator Clinton. You know everybody knows her dirt but Senator Obama is good at hiding his and it’s going to be revealed all in good time. Michigan needs to hold there elections again and put Senator Obama on the ballot and then she’ll be the winner free and clear. Florida will be reinstated with there votes and she won there as well. You have to have all states at the convention, it’s the law.

Independent, kinda sad you changed your name to JAMES/FLORIDA to swiftboat Obama with that BS rightwing website.
No sources are referenced, so how can anyone believe it’s true.
Hillary is on the attack, and if that infomation about Obama was true, why isn’t she bringing it up? Answer: Because it’s fake!
Hope this comment didn’t hurt your pocket. Oh, forgot, Hillary already gave you all 5 million dollars.
Lucky you!

On collage campuses the young kids are giving each other high fives saying man I totally voted for Obama, this is what is going on kids that have no idea of the issues that are facing this country, first time voters that thinks its cool to show their friends they support Obama. Fun and games this is what this election has gotten down to, face book and yahoo where the teens hang out is the discussion board where from their post you can see they have no idea what is going on, they are just going with the flow. This election is the biggest joke, you have pictures of Obama as a black Jesus, sneakers with “yes we can” on the side of them, its like one big non stop party. This is how Obama is winning riding on the young backs of this nation, using them with catchy slangs and phrases to get into the WH. I feel sorry for these young people that are caught up in this wave because in the end they are the ones that will suffer the most when he cant deliver anything for them.

The young who are going supporting Obama evidently do not know and do not remember the prosperous period from 1992 to 2000 during the Clinton presidency. Youth’s lack of memory and experiences is easy to be exploited with empty inspirational words. Just remember how much Billy Grahm has achieveed in American politics and economy? He can insspire better than Obama can.
Any one who can remember the time froom 92-2000 cannot be mislead by all the empty promises. One Clinton has proved he could deliver. I rather stick with the one who has far greater chance to deliver than the one who has so far only delivered high rhetorics and ultimate fiip-floping in all the important issues. “A bird in hand is better than two birds in the bush”

Senator Barrack Obama is a total hypocrite. One the one hand, he states that, in respect to the Super Delegates, they should “vote the will of the people” and not think on their own accord. One the other hand, if he actually followed that line of thinking, then Senator Ted Kennedy, would have to cast his Super Delegate vote toward Senator Hillary Clinton. In the final analysis; the Super Delegates have EVERY INALIENABLE RIGHT to vote their own conscience. Further evidence that makes me simply not trust Senator Barrack Obama. My vote stays with Senator Hillary Clinton. She would be the best President of the United States.

I’m curious myself. Where did Obama suddenly come from with this great organization and lots of money? Seems unlikely for someone who is a senator for two years and has little national exposure.

Whoa: Obviously you’re free to do what you want. The mantra from the press is that Obama “Is not to be touched.” It’s easy to “stay ABOVE the fray” when you don’t have to worry about negative media. Everything has been skewed about Clinton. It’s evident by the headlines. “Clinton amps up attacks” verses “Obama challenges Clinton.” A subtle change but sends the reader the message that Clinton is bad and Obama is good.

I’m surprised more people haven’t pointed out the fallacy of Hillary being “Ready on Day One.” Her campaign is hemhorraging money, and she’s lost what were insurmountable leads to someone she–and her supporters–claim is an empty suit. If she can’t beat an empty suit, how will she beat a war hero?

Change is coming and that’s a good thing.Obama has not taken lobbiest money and I personally appauld him for that.

So far, I think Obama has been given a “special immunity” pass by the media. Three things we do know about him that particularly stick in my throat:
1. According to the NY Times, his claim that he stood up against nuclear power industry (Exelon) in Illinois is not true. Exelon execs have been big contributors to Obama’s campaigns.
2. According to the Chicago Tribune, Obama’s so-called sympathy in his speeches for laid-off Maytag workers in his state is not evidenced in any actions that he could have taken. He has received big contributions from Maytag directors.
3. According to an AP story, he made a statement in Idaho in support of the 2nd amendment, but in later statements, he said just the opposite.

You’re right. I forgot Obama would get it right from day one. This after admitting his taking money from Rezko was a “boneheaded mistake.” I wish I knew I’d never make a mistake. Life would be so much easier.

Hillary is so much like DeLay, anyone supporting her is really out of their mind.
God help The Party of Jefferson…

Look the most qualified individuals from the democratic side are not even in the race. Biden, Richardson, Dodd, Kucinich each have more legislative experience than both Obama and Clinton combined so the arguement that experience matters in this race is irrelevent.
This race is based upon ideas and personality and since the ideas from the two candidates are very much the same it really about personality. For those of you who do not like Obama it is probably one of two things you do not like him because he would rather resolve conflict by building concensus and not be confrontational or it is because he has a multicultural background and you are afraid of the “change” that would bring to America. If you agree with the latter I have pity for your soul. For those that do not like Hillary it is probably because she is a part of the old guard and what that represents, and for those that say she is not part of the old guard you are lying to yourself the woman is 60 years old, or it is because she is confrontational in how she handles things because she is a woman and alot of men and women do not like that. Look the bottom line is both are going to fight for each and everyone of you, even if you do not like them, everyday in a job where the current president did not do such a good job. One of these individuals will be your democratic nominee and to not like one or the other, despite the fact their policies are practically the same, but their view on how to achieve those policies is different, is incredibly stupid. This is not a football game people this the race for the White House so do not get so personal that you can not see the goal.

nht:
excellent post: thank you for providing the smoking gun!
Also, I was in Miami at the time leading up to the Florida Primaries, and Obama ads were showing regularly on CNN: how does that square with him not “campaigning or advertising”? I don’t get it…

Costr you keep saying the list goes on about the Clinton’s shady deals. List them and I can guarantee you that everyone them has been proven false. There is no evidences on any inside trader deals with them. Whitewater was proven false all they got was a B J out of that. 90 million in tax payer money looking into these lame allegations. By the way I want my money back from you right-wingers for spending my tax dollars on that sht. Your crap gets old. Hillary has already said she would release her taxes. So get over it

Obama wants to change the rules by saying superdelegants shouldn’t vote their conscience.
Those rules have been in effect for decades.
Obama wants to change the rules on superdelegates. It’s crybabying. Waa, waa why won’t they vote for me!
It’s simply politics as usual. Hillary does it. Obama does it.
Newsbeak!! They’re politicians!
The difference is that Obama is a weak politician. Hillary is a fighter. I’ve not seen ANY evidence of Obama ever standing up to the special interests. He backed down when confronted by cheny over oil. He said “it was the best we could do”. Duhh! when you’re not gonna fight it, darn right it’s the best you’re gonna do. Maybe if you showed some backbone you could’ve done better.

Hillary likes to say that she is ready on day one?speaking as one of senator clinton’s constituents, she has been useless. She has had nearly 8 years to help the upstate ny with the problems caused by Bill when he approved the closeing of griffis airforce base (better known as the site of woodstock99) which sent the local economy into a tailspin. Then Hillary became senator, and rather than fighting for aid or something to fix a bad situation, she goes AWOL from upstate ny… votes for the Iraq war and more recently to approve force against Iran. How can she say she is ready to lead this country when she hasn’t led in her *home* district. She only came to New York to use us as a stepping stone to get the Clintons back in power. She is only in this for the power and that is something all Americans should be very wary of.

CLINTONS ARE TRUE PATRIOTS, SPECIALLY HILLARY. SHE WILL FIGHT TO THE END FOR THE SAKE OF HER BELOVED COUNTRY AND PEOPLE NO MATTER HOW THEY HAVE WRONGED HER. SHE IS A GREAT PATRIOT AND TRUE LADY.

You know what drives me crazy about the Obama supporters – when they say they changed their votes cause thier kids asked them to.
Jeeze! We’re now letting 13 year olds choose the President of the US. This is NOT a popularity contest folks!! This is NOT the prom king or queen we’re talking about, folks!!

Amen Phil!

Bob Weaver, how about providing a link to a news source. Kinda hard to believe a rightwing blog that looks like crap.
Is that the best you righties can do? LOL!
OBAMA 08!

I am disgusted with his statement “nails coming out” or “feeling down”. This is disturbing that he would say such a thing about a strong smart leader like Hillary Clinton, and all other women. She is speaking honestly about issues of a person running for President for gods sake. But the Obama way is disable in an attack rather than answer to the issue. Would he say that about a man? This is someone running for President? AMAZING he has got this far. This is sexist and many times I have heard reference to age. Very disrespectful to insult a person for gender or age. I wonder what he thinks about race? Unity? Is it only Young men who he is uniting and everyone eles just stand out? This is disrespectful to the human population, and a very wrong choice for President. I am very offended. Why has he got this “o” for a flag? He reads words that someone else has written, no wonder if this is what he would say is he speaks whats on his mind. Afraid of a debate, because he will have to think on his feet again. And now we know what is running through his head when put on the spot. So rude and not qualified to represent America to the world. There are other leaders in other Countries that are women and some older men are leaders of other Countries. And he wants the old people out of the Government. This is a blanket insult to many, many people. Other leaders will take offence of this sexist attitude, and the are smart enough to see it no mater how old they are.

Rules are one thing. The sanction quite another. The DNC “Rules Committee” opted to strip Michigan and Florida of their entire delegations, when written recommendations are to allow 50% of the states delegates to vote. So, stop talking about the rules and talk about how the Rules Committee had to power trip and wipe out two entire delegations.

I fear that an Obama-McCain contest will
guarantee a victory for McCain.
Why?
Reality will set in as the day aproaches.
The contest will be seen as a black against white contest.
Not only a black president in white America but a Black First Lady.
Those who nominated Obama would regret too late their mistake.
A Clinton-McCain contest will guarantee
a sure victory for the Clinton.

Good Story… I am sick of Obama declaring himself the winner. Hillary is ahead in the polls in a lot of upcoming states. She has the passion, drive and experience unlike Obama who just talks about change with no record of backing it up. I am also sick of the media’s obsession with the candidate of their choosing; Obama. Give Hillary a change.

Obama will find himself whipped, cut up, and slashed by today’s adoring media if he gets the nomination. He’ll become the liberal, the inexperienced candidate, and the Rezko compatriot against McCain who will be described as moderate, experienced, and honest. It will be a blood bath. The press jumps one way and then another…that’s the way they are.

Easy question: Name 20 people of significance who have endorsed Obama.
Difficult question: Name 3 for Hillary

If blacks could vote for a black candidate, why couldn’t whites vote for one of their own??? A democratic election is meant to elect a competent and qualified candidate regardless of their gender/age/race. I’m bewildered that America could tolerate having a black president over a woman Commander in Chief. In the majority of American families, women usually have the final say in decision making. I would NEVER cast my vote for someone who belittles and degrades women. I am a health care professional, well-educated, upper-middle class young man and guess who I voted for. I despise empty slogans which filled arenas/stadiums similar to a rock concert atmosphere. Could we intelligently examine the facts and leave our personal feelings about the candidates behind when we cast our votes??? Hope + change = a gigantic delusion. God bless USA!!!

New Deal, you’ve ranting and ranting, swiftboating Obama with no credible proof. No links. Nada!
And you expect people to take you seriously?
Show me how Hillary came to her conclusion that 15 million people would be without health care. And not just that she said this, providing no proof.
I want a LINK to an independent source about this info, and not one that just quotes her.
Good luck!

That’s Clintonese for she’s about to throw in the towel.

krifos:
Among those I personally admire who have endorsed Hillary are:
Maya Angelou, one of this century’s greatest poets and a living icon of strength through adversity;
Erica Jong, whose brilliant piece in the Washington Post, said what millions of us have only thought;
Gloria Steinem, considered by many as the greatest front-runner for womens’ rights;
Bobby Kennedy Jr; Cesar Chavez Jr – sons of American fighters for human rights;
Bill Clinton, former President of the USA;
Sally Field; Barbra Streisand; The New York Times… I could go on and on — but in the end no big names can equal the power of the people who vote.

Karen, anybody can pounce on Obama or Hillary. And I’m not saying you’re swiftboating him, but I would like to know what Obama said to make you feel the way you do about him, and not just quotes from Hillary.
Anybody can say rehetoic, cheap, no sense, boogie man, ect…
What did he say that has you all riled up? I’m sure news sources reported this, so please do a search through Google to back up any claims you have with credible evidence.
Remember, you feel strongly about this. Right?

Ron,
This may amaze you but — I am not on this thread to convince you or provide you with anything. You, my friend, are a lost cause, unable to think for yourself and favoring the “splatter-gun” approach.
Keep up the character assassinations, Ron – as Ovid wrote in about 9 AD, “Judge a leader by the followers”; you’re doing a splendid job for yours…

dave,
Based on your data I make a motion that we end this thread. I hate to repeat myself but, IT’S OVER!!!!!!!

Anyone know more about the 80-odd precincts in New York (a few in Harlem) where Obama got zero votes, according to an article in today’s New York Times?

I’m sure the Clinton’s would be so concerned about FL. and Mich. if they had closed the deal on Super Tuesday.
It was Mr. Ickes who voted for the idea not to count those delegates. I hope you try and count those delegates and steal this election. This will be one democrat that will try everything to keep the power obsesed Clinton’s out of the White House.

Do the people who cite sponsored bills as success realize that all one has to do to “sponsor a bill” in the Senate is to sign off on it? That seems an awful lot like riding someone else’s coat tails and claiming you actually did something.

After reading many of the blogs on this topic and trying to get a perspective on where people stand the only conclusion I can come up with is “corstr” you need to get a life.
Dude, it’s not healthy to be fighting with all these people! Really, get a date or something.

Dave, what was your point in wasting our time with that list of nothing productive from O’Bama? So he supposedly did what you listed. Please be more specific. Did any of it pass into law? Or was O’Bama just adding his name to do nothing legislation?
And Ben, like a little kid running around with nothing to add. Sucking up to anything that might shed a better light on a third world conidate. Shame on you.

Just as the Clinton camp wants to disregard Democratic Party rules regarding the seating of Fl and Michigan delegates, the Clinton camp wants to ignore the more fundamental rules embedded in our Constitution, the 22nd Amendment.
Isn’t Hillary Clinton’s candidacy unconstitution because it violates the 22nd amendment prohibition on the election of a person to a third term in office. Hillary’s election will effectively give Bill Clinton a third term by allowing him to serve behind the scenes as a Co-President. Once again he will be running the halls of the White House. Doesn’t this candidacy violate the spirit and intent as well as the express language of the 22nd Amendment passed in 1951.
Of the more than 150 million American women eligible and competent to be President only two people, Hillary Clinton and Laura Bush run afoul of the 22nd Amendment to our Constitution by effectively giving their husbands a third term if elected. Rosalyn Carter and Nancy Reagan could be candidates because their husbands either have only served one term or have died and therefore there would be no Constitutional 22nd Amendment questions. The Supreme Court does not take up hypothetical cases. If elected, the Supreme Court may weigh in and rule that Hillary’s candidacy and election violates the 22nd Amendment. Hillary’s pick for vice-President would then assume the Presidency if her election is declared unconstitutional.
Just as there is no “separate educational facilities are inherently unequal” language in the Constitution, the Supreme Court interpreted the intent and spirit of the Equal Proection Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment of the Constition to find a violation of rights of young black public shcool students in Brown vs. Topeka School Board of Education. Although there is no express language in the 22nd Amendment, similarly, the Supreme Court will likely find that the 22nd Amendment prohibits surrogate candidacies of spouses as violating the intent and spirit of the 22nd Amendment prohibition against more than two terms for any person.
The father of our country, George Washington set a precedent of only two terms and rejected pleas that he run for a third term because he felt that three terms for any President would signal a return to monarchy which this country had fought a long bloody Revolutionary War to forever eliminate. It probably never entered George Washington’s mind to have Martha Washington run as a surrogate. George Washington could have served five terms hands down after guiding our armies to victory against the British. George Washington’s precedent was embodied in the 22nd Amendment and renders Hillary Clinton’s candidacy unconstitutional.

The Clinton team is all about winning at any cost. Do they have any ethics at all? Here’s the telling quote:
“But now Ickes, as a member of Clinton’s team, wants to change the rules.”
That’s right, Team Clinton can’t win honorably so there are willing to cheat to win.
There’s a pattern here. The furious spinning and near-lying about her vote for the war: “I didn’t think it was a bill to authorize the war.” Please. As Obama pointed out, the bill had a title in big bold letters “A Bill to Authorize War in Iraq.”
Sorry, Hillary, I can’t trust you in the White House for four years. You have a problem with the truth and following the rules.

so, when ickes wasn’t working for clinton, he took a principled stand that FL and MI shouldn’t count. now that he’s working for clinton, his principles have changed?
and as for “disenfranchising” voters by not counting FL and MI, what about all the people who were effectively disenfranchised because they chose not to vote in MI and FL because they were told their votes wouldn’t count in the first place?
the clinton sleaze machine just gets worse and worse.

It is so interesting to see how many of you are so “cynical” of both candidates. The faults you see in these individuals are the same faults you yourselves surely have. The difference between us and those that chose to serve is that they must be ridiculed by “you”. I am sure many of you have visions of how this country could be managed but you would rather sit here and degrade each of these individuals to some level beneath you so you can feel some sort of personal satisaction. I am sure each one of these candidates has done more for the public good than any of you individually. Clinton for the rights of children and women. Barack for those less fortunate on the S. Side of Chicago. You guys are funny. These people deserve more respect from you than this. Oh and if you have done more than either one of them I think you should seriously consider public office.

Once again, we see Hillary and Bill, the Manipulators-in-Chief. They play us and play us for all we’re worth. If she is elected (and he “re-elected”), they will continue to play us and play us and play us.

Obama would you like some cheese with that whine? The job of the super-delegates are to break a tie if there is no winner based on deligates. You Obama nuts are just a bunch of cry babies.

Everybody talk about the youth vote.I am 50 years and my life is almost over. Yes the youth have a voice and their future is most important down the road. It time for them to start to take responsibility for where their future is going. We oldies will be long gone and they will inherit all the old ideas that have not work in are lifetime. Yes its time for a change for the betterment of this country. The youth have a voice and should use it 100%. Us oldies have a voice and so do they and they should exercise their rights.

How sad. The Dems are splitting up and will LOSE in November.
Get it together, people — or it’s 4 more years of Republican Rule.
Think: The nominee who can beat McCain must be able to get Independent and Swing voters.
Hillary carries too much baggage to do so, fair or not.
Obama has cross-over appeal that will get those NECESSARY Independent and Swing votes. He can beat Obama — and Rove knows it.
Watch out, Dems. You’re on a slippery slope. (Divide and conquer is what the Republicans are doing to us.)
Use your head and think November. Think General Electorate.
Vote Obama — unless you want to see McCain in the White House.

it appears that some people are very NAIVE’…..we don’t need another john kerry who will wilt under the pressure of neo-conservative interest groups like swiftboatvets……WE KNOW HILLARY CLINTON CAN WITHSTAND AND THRIVE UNDER PRESSURE AND NATIONAL ATTACKS…….therefore, if we truly want a Democrat in the White House fighting for Americans as soon as possible, Senator Hillary Clinton is our only choice…

I am sure if your guy was a little behind and won Florida and Michigan, you would be very supportive of his efforts to stay in the race and keep fighting
Certainly. But I would not be supportive of efforts to change rules everybody had already agreed upon.
Nice straw-man, though.

ONLY SENATOR CLINTON can restore America’s international credibility as soon as possible….ONLY SENATOR CLINTON can bring about the international coalition necessary to fight terrorism and help us control the iraq situation, therefore helping to relieve the heavy and dangerous burdens our troops face every day…..ONLY SENATOR CLINTON has the experience and initiative to begin the necessary work and plans needed to help restore our economy and our health care coverage as soon as possible…..

everyone knows that Senator Clinton will embarrass mccain in every debate they have……we reasonable and sane people don’t have the same confidence in senator obama’s abilities….

stacycj……you talk as if independents don’t care about which candidate will do the best as President…..one debate with john mccain and Senator Clinton will have every voter who cares about our troops, our children and the future of America supporting her

people are typically smart when it comes to what is best for their children, including the babies, the toddlers, the teens and those in uniform…..I have yet to hear any reasonable explanation why Senator Clinton would not be the best President for our children……BECAUSE THERE IS NONE…..maybe if you spent more time explaining why your candidate is better than distorting and lying about his opponent, he might have a better chance…

stacycj, If obama beats McCain,it will sell a lot of xxx cds. LOLOLOLO

Chris,
Where are your facts?
Look, if you read my post, you’d see that I said I think both would do fine, but I think Obama will do better. Why? Because as someone who has roots in Kenya, was raised in part in Indonesia, studied at Harvard, is a Senator from Illinois, and has mid-western roots as well, he is viewed as someone who naturally understands people from other cultures. (Something the BUSHIES DO NOT). He already is trusted abroad.
I also said I think Hillary would do fine, too.
BUT SHE CANNOT WIN IN NOVEMBER. She carries too much baggage to get the Independent and Swing voters.
The Republicans are lol that our party is splitting. This is exactly what they’ve drooled over. That and Hillary as the nominee, because McCain can beat her.
I guess you’re okay with a McCain White House? Well, I’m not.
I’m a 45 year old woman who admires Hillary. She spoke at my commencement. But I admire Obama just as much and I feel it’s crucial the Dems take back the White House in November.
Obama has the broad appeal to get the Swing and Indie voters in the General Election, and only he can beat McCain.
That is the most important thing to me.

Senator Clinton will (politely) embarrass mccain in every debate and win in November; Senator Clinton will restore and repair America’s international credibility IMMEDIATELY; Senator Clinton will work as soon as possible to use such international cooperation for the benefit of our troops; Senator Clinton has the experience and credibility to help EVERY American get affordable health care; Senator Clinton has the VAST experience to help children and women in America; therefore, Senator Hillary Clinton is our BEST CHOICE FOR PRESIDENT

gh123:
He opted out of the Wisconsin debate because he saw it as free advertising for Hillary — and she didn’t at the time have as much $$ for advertising. It’s a campaign tactic. Personally, I think he should have debated her only because she’s getting so much free publicity out of this anyway. But whatever.
There have been 18 debates and there are 2 more scheduled over the next couple of weeks. Another one is not necessary. He’s not chicken.
And Obama is ready day 1 as well. But Hillary cannot get the Independent and Swing voters in November to beat McCain. If HIllary’s the nominee, will you too buy me lunch when McCain is president? I think Chris is…
BTW — you don’t need to scream!!!!! in your posts. I can read.
Don’t let the Republicans split the Dem party (Which they’re now doing). Vote to win in November. Vote Obama.

I will vote for who ever the democratic nominee is. All other dems need to do the same, if they dont want to blw it for the american people for 4 more years. Dont let yourselves get too worked up over these primaries. Either Dem canidate is light years better than Macain/Bush fear/war mongering to benefit the elite rich and the brainwashed! Keep your heads Dems!

If by some tragedy Hillary gets in there, we won’t see any results. Don’t you realize how much she is hated. Hated, whether rational or not, is an understatement for Clinton. How can anyone think the other side of the aisle will let anything like health care or a new energy policy go through? You might as well be asking for a civil war.

Sure jump off a bridge cause everyone else dose. Responsible people think. Vote Hillary !!! Or regret.

Obama trails or is tied with Hillary in head to head matchups with McCain in 3 significant swing states: OH, PA, FL.
A democrat can’t win without winning 2 of those 3.
The general election is a state by state race, so national polls are irrelevant. Hillary might lose a popular vote campaigns, but she wins the democratic states and the swing states, meaning she gets more electoral college delegates than either Obama or McCain.

I just watched both Obama and Hillary in Wisconsin. I am really shocked to find Obama to be such a poor speaker compared to Hillary. Hillary caught my attention all the way with every word. Her great ideas were presented with superb language and filled with heartfelt emotion. She gave so many moving examples of ordinary people’s need for change and solutions which she has already fulfilled and achieved for some. She was too humble to mention that part of her plan to solve the subprime crisis is being adopted by Bush and the banks. She calls for freezing the foreclosures for 3 months and now it is proposed to freeze for one month. Wow, even the Republicans have to steal her idea. But she did not mentions this in her speech.
After her Obama spoke and I was expecting a real good one since I have heard his thundering reputation for so long. I was really surprised to find him speak so unfluently with frequent pauses and hestitations. Hillary did not say anything negative about Obama and emphasized on Democratic unity while Obama levelled quite a few indirect attacks on Hillary. I was bored more than half way through while I hoped Hillary’s never ended. How false reputation can become such truism! Obama a good speaker? Then Hillary is an Excellent one.

I second the comment that a Hillary/Obama ticket is the only sure way to win in November. Hillary has the experience, the smarts, the fighting spirit and the trust of most of the democratic faithful and many others around the country. Obama can bring in many new voters. Everyone would be happy with this winning ticket; and Obama can run for President in 8 years giving us time to really get our country back on track. If this scenario doesn’t happen, McCain will win in November. Together they can unite the country. Right now, if Obama wins the nomination, he will end of dividing the country big time.

Hello shocked, are you kidding? We all watched both Hillary’s and Obama’s speech. She just put everyone in my family to sleep. Trust me, I heard snoring in our family room when that lady was going on and on without a clue. She was trying to become a speaker, and as usual, she Failed miserably. Try as you may, a donkey cannot become a horse. And a crow will never be a cuckoo. On the other hand, when Obama spoke, everyone just felt moved.

Obama does not need Hillary to be her running mate. He is clean. Why bring a dirty baggage and give ammunition to the Repubicans. Hillary is the biggest liability to the democratic party. She should stop running and accept the verdict that the public is beating her in all the states consecutively by a huge margin.

If you do the electoral math, why would anyone think Obama has a chance? Here’s why:
1) If he opposes seating Fl and MI, they will not vote for him. He will lose Florida for sure
2) OH and PA will also likely go for McCain.
3) Obama may take Virginia and Colorado, but those are the only red states that he flips.
What other red state can Obama win, and specifically why?

Hi Mandy, you are right every word about Hillary. Watch out, some Clintonites are out to destroy Obama supporters for just telling the truth about Hillary. She really wants to control everyone and the verdict of the people. She is a sore loser.

A real senator can debate his / her positions. Obama hasn’t & can’t. Obama runs a nice pep rally. He’d make a good cheerleader. Rah Rah Rah !!! For a Real President Vote For Hillary, with Real Solutions. She can explain & defend her solutions. It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to see that. Bush can’t explain anything important either, like Obama. He Likes his one liners too. Takes no Brains.

Staci,
How does Obama win FL, OH, PA vs. McCain? I don’t see how he does and that certainly trumps any negatives that Hillary has. BTW, in swing states Hillary polls better now than both Obama and McCain, uh-oh. And that’s without any attack ads against Obama yet.

A solution for the Florida and Michigan delegates: Divide each of the states total delegate number in half and give both Clinton and Obama an even amount. It would basically be a wash but this allows each of the states delegates to get seated at the convention and no voters disenfranchised. It is currently an absurd situation that will effect the party to some degree unless a balanced result is worked out. Any comments on this?

Ric,
No way Florida and Mich get sat as 50/50. What is the point of voting then? Either they get sat as they voted, or they won’t get sat at all.
Up in the air is:
a) do superdelegates from those states count normally or not
b) what kind of penalty is there on pledged delegates?

Johnson,
As it stands now, the super delegates, like the pledged delegates, will not be seated from MI and FL.
But, as I said earlier, I think they will be seated, but HRC still loses because he ends up with more pledged delegates. I suspect that Obama will end up with at least 80% of the super delegates.

Obama ran campaign ads in Florida. Hillary went down for a private fundraising which was allowable-then went down after to thank the voters for coming out. Obama willingly took his name off the Michigan ballot when he could have let it stay. The Republican controlled legislature moved the primary and the DNC was stupid enough to fall into the trap and take away all the votes while the RNC only took half of their delegates away. But then we have the genius Howard Dean as head of the DNC.
People, we are talking about the disenfranchisment of 3 million voters!!
THE VOTERS HAD NO SAY IN THIS MESS AND THEY VOTED ANYWAY!! their votes should count as they stand, Obama getting the uncommitted,since he CHOSE to remove his name from the ballot.
Obama is a fine orator, but keeps avoiding substance and debates where his lack of knowledge is glaring against Sen Clinton. He is unvetted because the media has given him a total pass, while spinning EVERYTHING Clinton does as either racist or dirty politics, but he’s gotten more than his fair share of earmarks like everyone else,cozied up to the corporations as much as everyone else,has his secrets like everyone else,i.e: his home he paid cost for and the extra land he acquired for next to nothing from Rezco, then blithly referred to it as “boneheaded”. I’m sick unto wretched death of his slick speeches and lack of substance and his arrogance. And what funds paid for the rally at Brice stadium in Columbia,SC? He or Oprah?
The University of South Carolina doesn’t just give the facility away for rallys of that sort out of the goodness of their heart! And he sure as hell didn’t have to pay for all the free major network coverage of the entire rally! Anyone getting my point on the media pass and “freebies”?
My idea of what the next president’s ability should be? One who knows the workings of the inner circle,knows how to get down and dirty if necessary and knows when to reach out when necessary. One who has been blamed for everything under the sun,but never had any charges brought against them. One whose private life embarrassments and sorrows have been thrown out in the street for everyone to see, and chose to keep her family together and keep her head up. one who has been tough enough to take all the vitriol and castigation that has been thrown at her and just keep on truckin. And one who can sit down at a poker table with Putin or Amidinijhad and stare in their eyes and run the table. You don’t HAVE to LIKE her! This isn’t a beauty contest! We live in perilous times and I want to know that who I vote for is smart enough and tough enough and,yes, devious enough to get us our respect back in this world and will not back down and just say “Can’t we all just get along?”
I want Hillary, and yes, the expert mind that her husband brings to the table as the dinner table advisor.
Ann from Lugoff SC

Jeff,
Obama’s blue states are all locks for the democratic party. Plus they are pretty small (none in top 10 states except for IL, which is also a lock for democrats).
Obama’s swing states are VA and CO, all of the rest go Democratic for sure (MO almost went for Hillary and she didn’t have the guaranteed vote from the “inner cities”.
Clinton’s current blue state win (and likely wins in TX, OH, PA) show that she owns all of the top 8 states except for IL.
HRC’s swing states are pretty much democratic locks with either candidate too.
So the key here is:
1) Can Obama win the big states?
2) Can Obama win the swing states of OH, PA, FL given his current possitions on seating delegates and his trailing both McCain and HRC in polls for those states.
3) Can Obama win MI given his delegate seating views and the likelihood that Romney is the GOP VP. Not likely.

People are in denial of all the bad things the Clintons have done to America.
I’ve been doing my homework and here’s what I discovered.
Legislative Experience
Obama: Illinois Senate: 1997-2004; U.S. Senate: 2004-2007 = 10 years
Hillary: has only been in the U.S. Senate since 2001 = 6 years
Scandals
Obama: One misguided relationship in Chicago.
Hillary (and Bill since he is running too): Travelgate, Filegate, Pardongate, Troopergate, Whitewater, Cattle Futures, Ponzi schemer Norman Hsu, Chinese dishwashers Gennifer Flowers, Zoë Baird, Paula Jones, Monica Lewinsky, Impeachment, dictator in Kazakhstan to name a few.
And we don’t know what is hidden in the Presidential papers that Clinton won’t allow released.
And now her campaigned dissed the American voters, saying the states won by Obama are insignificant? American voters are insignificant?
pretty sad and ugly she is and arrogant.
That’s what you want for president?

Johnson,
(I was delayed by a phone call)
My initial response was the same as Hillary’s, “The votes won’t count”, as she agreed with the DNC’s decision to strip the delegates. All the voters understood this as well when they went in to vote. Now that I see it may very well jeopardize the Dems from winning Fla. & Mich. in the general, I feel my suggestion is an even compromise. Other option is they don’t count and we risk losing those states in the general.
The Super’s can vote the way they want to as if it were a legitimate tie. As for a penalty for the pledged delegates, I’d waive any penalty and realize it was a bad decision to penalize those states in the first place. The DNC’s initial arguement was their concern for the earlier states being overlooked, but it sure didn’t play out well for Rudy.
What do you think should happen and what consequence might occur?

I’m an Irishman living in China – but the US election is so important to the whole world.
I was convinced Hillary Clinton would be the next President of the United States the day she and Bill vacated the White House for George W. and I haven’t changed my mind, despite the arrival of Sen. Obama on the scene.
If by some freak chance Obama did win the nomination, there is no way on earth he could win the election.
The sure fire winning ticket is Hillary with Barrack Obama as running mate. If they do a good job – and I think they will – Obama will deserve a clear run for nomination when HRC steps down.

If Obama gets the nomination, what will cost the Dems the election is Obama.
Just because you win 20M votes in a Kansas Caucus, don’t believe for one moment that state will be foor you in a general election when 70% of their voters vote Republican.
Don’t think for one moment the Republican machine will be cowed by the vicious under the table tactics the media has let you get away with so far in this primary season.
Don’t think for one moment after seeing this vicious campaign that Democrats and independents who have supported others will automatically support Obama.

“”last time i checked, obama’s votes regarding iraq were strikingly similar to those of Senator Clinton”"
Oh, don’t let the facts get in your way…for Obama didn’t vote to authorize the war and in fact made a speech against it. How can you claim that that is strikingly similar?
But this story is interesting. Does Hillary actually believe that she can win by super-delegates and get away with it? She may get the nomination (after a flight like in 1968 – and count me in) but she would never win the presidency. Hillary might do that though so she could get another chance in 4 years. With her it is all about her. We need hope in the country not boxing gloves.

I totally agree,Obama is the best canidate for the job we need for this country. We need someone like Obama, intelligent, credibilty, honesty, and understanding. A man who love everyone. He reaches out and touch america hear, men , women, and young adults. Make this world a better place. I see Obama as a great man. My insincts and vision say Obama,

just to correct you, Senator Clinton is the ONLY candidate who will give America INSTANTANEOUS international credibility due in no small part to her husband’s Administration, and she will work to re-establish international coalitions in order to reduce the workload and risks on the American soldier and simultaneously help their families at home…..the difference between two camps is that you may believe your candidate can do a decent job, but WE KNOW THAT SENATOR HILLARY CLINTON WILL DO A GREAT JOB AS PRESIDENT!…..and our loved ones who face risks everyday, both here and abroad, can ill afford to choose a leader, a Commander-in-Chief, who would not do the best job…..and that pretty much describes everyone who is not Senator Clinton

and Senator Clinton NEVER gives up: fail on getting Universal Health Care? oh well, I guess I’ll have to make sure that 6 million uninsured children get health insurance then……

Obama’s big ego will cost democratic party’s core voters. He is not uniting the party, but split it along racial line. I can hardly believe that some black superdelegates are switching. Where is your independent judgment? IS that how you vote in Congress? Representation also requires your understanding of issues and backgrounds. Hillary is a fighter.Support her in fighting for middle class. Obama is not a doer. All slogans only.

HILLARY IS LOSING. PERIOD.
ANY SLEAZY ATTEMPT TO STEAL THE NOMINATION WILL TEAR UP THE DEM PARTY AND THROW AWAY ANY CHANCE OF WINNING IN THE GENERAL.

Either Obama or Hillary is going to have to take one for the team and “let” the other have the nomination. Otherwise, there is no winner.
Obama won’t have the delegates to win and neither will Hillary. Both will claim a majoriy, HRC because of FL and MI, and Obama will claim they don’t count (despite 2.6 mil votes in those 2 states).
So who will cave? If +30 pledged delegates makes a difference, that is also a travesty as most of those will come form unrepresentative caucus states.
Why are caucuses bad? 1 delegate in a caucus corresponds to 1-2k votes. 1 delegate in a primary is worth 5-11k votes. Say what you want about strategy but clearly a caucus delegates is worth 5-10 times less than a primary delegate, in terms of true democratic votes. So hardly a mandate winning with an extra 40-50 caucus delegates.
Also, no way Obama carries GA or LA.

John D,
Any other source corroborates Obama “paying” super delegates?

John D -
If you read further in the article, it states that “for her Senate re-election, Hillary Clinton received a $4,200 contribution from Obama”
Unfortunately, this is how politicians support each other. They campaign for each other and support each other financially. Some politicians are better fund-raisers than others. And this is one way of, ostensibly, helping their political party. They spread the wealth for either altruistic or selfish motives depending on how cynical you are. And yes, Republicans do the same.
However, this is another reason why Democrats need to remove super delegates from the nomination equation.

PA and OH ain’t goin’ blue for Obama, that’s my point. His base would normally vote democratic. The anti-Obama vote is HIGH in PA and OH, which is why he is so low in the polls after so much good press for him.

Jeff,
Actually I think both would win as well. I do think Hillary is less of a risk, both in winning and in getting results.
Here is how I sum up what we would get from each:
Obama – tries to hit home runs with idealistic policies. If he succeeds, he is the better choice, but chance of failure is equally high.
HRC – tries to hit singles and get incremental improvement to reach the same goals as Obama. Probably won’t reach 100% of goals, but will achieve more incremental results.
I am sure we will get some good, incremental results with HRC, I am not sure of that with Obama’s ideals.

Would I be correct in assuming that if Hillary Clinton has one more pledged delegates than Barack Obama on June 4th (even though neither of them may have enough to win the nomination on their own) that Sen Obama will step aside because he wants the nomination decided by pledged delegates not super delegates??????

IMO Many HRC and BHO won’t vote for the other candidate if they get the nomination. I think Democrat independants will go for whoever wins the nomination by and large. Republicans will support McCain as they are already getting used to him being the nominee and he’s already trying to appease most. I don’t think the democrat supporters “will get over it in time”. No matter how much they hate Bush, Iraq etc this nomination because of its closeness is too personal for many of them. I also think the nomination of Hillary because of Bill will inspire the GOP and the nomination of Barack because of his strong Liberalisim will also inspire the GOP.
True independants with no bias to party will really be the red herring who decides this. I don’t think this is a done deal for the democrats as much as I may want it.

As I sit and read some of these posts, there comes to mind a few facts. First, it is comical to see these Democrats as well as the Democrat party, and their supporters fighting. It just typifies the Political Party. Second, I can see why they say Democrats are for the poor and uneducated. Some people on these boards are really inept. It amazes me how some people are just so lazy and unwilling to take care of themselves to have a better life and love nothing more than to blame someone else for their own shortcomings. Personally, I believe the Government has gotten too big. Politicians realized along time ago that they could just promise more and more to the weak to get a vote. It’s become a never ending perpetual cycle. Sit back….think to yourself for just a minute…….with all this calamity and infighting and boo-hooing in your party, have you ever really thought of what a politician is?
Poli = Many
Tic= Bloodsuckers
So the politics of our society are full of many bloodsuckers.
Oh well, happy voting there Democrats.

Sadly, this will not get the headlines as the media is out to fix Hillary and determined to coronate Obama the king. Now that all Obamotics have been hypnotized, mesmerized and conditioned into believing that he is pure and above politics, everything he says is gospel true. People are hungry for a different administration after 7 years of mismanagement and deceit that they are vulnerable to such repeated oratory and shallow rhetoric. They drink in like water to the brain that washes away any logical reasoning. When asked to state one solid Obama accomplishment, few if anyone of them can answer. They are stumped by the question and the best they can give is the rhetoric that has been fed to them, “Oh he is refreshing, he brings change and hope. Yes we can, Yes we can….”

Obama knows the media has built a wall of protection around him – he is untouchable and has been swaggering with confidence. They had said publicly that there is no way Hillary can catch up with his number of elected delegates. Bet they are already measuring curtains for the White House.

Isn’t it very telling as to the honesty and integrity of Hillary’s campaign that her campaign advisor Harold Ickes ‘while acting as a member of the Democratic NatIronically, last summer Ickes — as a sitting member of the Democratic National Committee Rules and Bylaws Commission — voted to strip those states of their delegates when the states moved up their primaries to dates before February 5. Those moves were seen as a threat to the traditional first states Iowa and New Hampshire and were therefore punished by the party.’ Now he has completely changed his tune and wants the votes to count. Is there anyone Hillary has employed that is honest? How can he honestly say it would be fair to count the votes when supporters of Edwards and Obama wouldn’t have come out to vote, knowing their names were not on the ballot? This is the type of person we can expect Hillary to hire for her administration… just like Ickes they will leave their morals behind if it means getting what she wants. Icky.

This should have all been taken care of before the election process started!
Oh, wait, it was. That was before Clinton realized she needed the votes.
Same old Clinton…silly me.

@Clinton supporters: I love how spinning the situation to one’s advantage makes Clinton “scrappy” and “a fighter”, while Obama is “a whiner”. No wait, I hate it.
Look, I think most Obama voters want our country to be more united, and that goes for the Democratic party too. If HRC wins this thing fair and square, she’ll be vastly preferable to any Republican. But if she tries to steal the election, watch out.

It is laughable when the Obama supporters viz. the liberals say they want the country to be more united. So they are going to unite with Rush Limbaugh and end the war? The liberal democrats in the house, including Obama himself, continue to vote for funding the war. Why don’t they give us some examples how they are going to unite the country and get things done for the middle class at the same time?

Democratic Party going insane! Yes. Hillary is hated by 50% of Americans. Women will turn out for her but she would lose badly for this additional reason. If she gets the DNC to cheat for her, Obama has 9 million votes already in the primary and most will not vote for her under any circumstances because they know she cheated Obama. Run Hillary and lose badly.

The DNC don’t want to give Hillary the delegate count for FL and MI because she would surpass Obama and that’s what they don’t want to happen. It appears that the DNC want Obama to be the next president but McCain will wipe him out. If Obama wins the nomination the Clinton supporters will definately turn to McCain to make sure Obama does not win. Good for them. We don’t need an experienced, lack of knowledge, lack of capabilities, lack of foreign policy in the white house. Who would be helping him Kennedy and Kerry? At least Hillary is well experienced at politics for years and we don’t need a disaster in America.

I agree, not counting the votes, amounts to communism. But then again, the democratic party established super delegates because they didn’t trust the voters in the beginning to make the right decision. Super delegates, dictating to the states when they can hold primaries ……. the whole thing smacks of communism, or could it just be a few power hungry individuals trying to control things. I really hate to see another Republican president, but this party is asking for that, just as hard as they can, of course thats always been the problem with the democratic party……shooting themselves in the foot.

Hillary has won 11 States and Obama has won 23! The American people have Spoken Obama for President!

I read comments PRAISING Clinton for “fighting”?
FIGHTING WHAT?? Republicans? NO!
The WILL of the VOTERS, THAT’S WHAT!
I am sickened!

Obama is a candidate of the rich Hollywood liberals. They know if Obama is a nominee he cannot win the general election and then they can retain their tax cuts. If lower income people in this country want some one in the WH who will look after their interest do not be sawyed by the media and Hollywood candidate.

Oh yeah, Hillary is such a wonderful leader. She knew when she made her vote in Oct 2002 that it was bogus. Scott Ritter and the other weapons inspectors were on every TV show telling people there were no WMDs. On top of that, the NIE at the time (which she claims she didn’t have time to read) said that Iraq had no WMDs.
I spend a year over there. And to think that Iraq the land of mud huts was ever a threat to us: unbelievably rediculous.
Hillary when asked about last fall said she would not answer any more questions on it, saying “If you don’t like my stand on my vote on Iraq, there are others to vote for.” Thanks Hillary for letting me off the hook.
Then there are those here who say that Obama is a spoiler. Oh please. He is the hope that we have that we can start this country again and get our dignity back.
I just don’t get why people would want the devisiveness of Hillary in the Whitehouse. She’s the one who took out the boxing gloves last week. That was another rediculous move – what apparently to show people she would bring the party down if she didn’t get the popular vote for the nomination.

“Attention America”, Florida, and Michigan Delegates has allready been settled! Dont let Hillary pull a old slick willy and try and reverse this discission that even she voted on! This would be the most dirty kind of Poltics she has ever done and should wake us up to see, we dont need her as a President!

Good idea! If Clinton STEALS the nomination, Obama should run INDEPENDANT with Bloomberg as his VP….
THAT’LL DO IT!

Of course Michigan and Florida should count! The Democratic Party should have never taken the delegates away. These are American citizens with the same rights as the rest of the states in this country. Shame on the Party!

Pat, the Florida vote will count in November. Florida will be the state that puts McCain in office. History repeats again.

Ickes is in denial or delusional or simply doing what he is paid to do. His scenario for “victory” is hard to believe and frought with many drop dead points. She would have to roll a bunch of 7′s in row to win this thing. Not likely.

It great to see the HRC campaign obsessed with this stupid MI,FL issue. Meanwhle Barack Obama is focusing on winning in WI, HI, TX and OH, etc. I suspect MI and FL won’t matter as Obama continues to rack up wins and delegates.

Well at least we have McCain, who is a real American, a hero and believes in doing the correct thing. He will be elected regardless of who the democrats nominate. The republicans have out smarted the democrats again.

To allow Hillary to reverse a Discission that even she voted on, would be like election rigging!

Wake Up America its becomming clear to see Hillary doesnt care about the people all she wants is to become President!

Hillary or Obama will be bought and paid for by the (mostly rich white male) superdelegates who support them and give them the Presidency. Paybacks will be expected — demanded. White male elites will again dictate White House policy. Does this bother anyone but me? What about change? What about a so-called “new” Washington? I am sitting this vote out.

Clinton, along with the other nominees, supported the DNC decision to strip Michigan and Florida of there delegates for holding an early primary. Now that she is behind, she wants these two “wins” to count. I’m afraid we are going to split the party and disenfranchise a whole generation of voters that will feel like backroom arm twisting decided the nominee. I think you can ensure McCain will win if Clinton wins the nomination by superdelegates and Michigan/Florida delegates. I believe many Obama supporters would not vote for her in that instance. However, if she were to win fair and square, I would vote for her.

I am so sick of people bashing Hillary. It shows you the ignorance of this country and the reason why we have to have delegates to decide the presidency. She is a good woman trying to make a difference in this country that she has served for so long. Obama may be a good man but he is green and he likes to use hipe to get his message across. We don’t need hipe or “hope” to solve the big problems that this country is faced with. We need practicle experienced solutions. We need a person that can get these problems solved and knows the ropes in the White House. We need a person that can clean up the mess that the GOP has made in the White House. We need a person and she happens to be a woman to clean up the mess that was made in the White House. Don’t listen to the hipe, listen to experience. Have we learned nothing from the past seven horrible years?

If for some reason if Hillary Won the Democrat Nomination, for one there would have to be some kinda of scam behind it, and two, Obama could run as a Independent and beat both Hillary and McCain in the Race!

No Change for Dems: I don’t understand your logic.
How is Obama who is not taking money from lobbyist going to owned by “Rich white men”? Hillary on the other hand is the ultimate insider and taking money from the lobby – in her words, “Lobbyist are people too.” Yes, they are but she gives them a huge vote multiplier. I’ve had enough of that.
We need someone knew with new ideas and a new way of doing things. Take off the boxing gloves and influence with words. I am tired of getting sent to wars for no purpose.
Even Colin Powell is backing Obama’s foriegn policy.

woman that cry are woman that are sincere. but
man that don;t want to be question as we all know
what has happen in the last seven years. take us down
a road that get us killed. emotions are ok to have but
not knowing what the hell you would when you seat
in that chair in the white house makes a great deal.
lets remember woman are also part of this great
american country so lets not make them feel cheap.

The law must be respected.So MICHIGAN and FLORIDA can not be counted under any circumstances. We are a nation of rule of law. I am sorry for the Clintons supporters.

Do your research. I’ve read several articles from various media (not all right wing) listing the “contributions” Obama (and HIllary) are paying to Superdelegates whose support they will likely need to win. These people are going to want paybacks, special favors and so forth. How is that change from what we have already?

To Reverse delegates in Michigan and Florida, to be able to count there vote, would be nothing short of Election Rigging! Hillary’s Tactics Know No Bounds!

The bad idea of Superdelegates had at least the justification that ib case of a stalemate of 3 or more candidates, somebody had to take a decision.
But in no case that if a candidate has alsready more than 50% of the pledged candidate, the supercandidates shall be
allowed to reverse such decision !!
And much less that help the minority candidate to seat fraudulantly delegates
as here in the case of Florida and Michigan
HILLARY HAS NOW CONFESSED THAT HER INTENT IS TO DO PRECISELY THAT, WHICH
IF SHE SUCCEEDS WILL AT THE BEST INDUCE
THE LOSS OF THE GENERAL ELECTION, AT
THE WORST SPLIT THE PARTY BY OBAMA DECLARING HIMSELF AN INDEPENENT CANDIDATE.
OR DO THE CLINTONS THINK THAT THE YOUNG PPEOPLE AND THE AFRO AMERICANS OBAMA BROUGHT IN, AS WELL AS MANY OTHER, WILL IN NOVEMBER VOTE FOR HILLARY ??
TOM

I shifted my support from Obama to Hillary since I began to notice the unfairly relentless negative attacks on Her by news/media. MSNBC practically looks like Obama’s campaign headquarter and CNN is not very far from it. Despite their on-going campaign on behalf of Obama, Hillary has shown real competitiveness and leadership as a female presidential candidate in this country that no other woman has ever done so. As we hear daily, women being raped, totured, killed, left to be uneducated, unemployed, and beated by men merciless from Darfur, middleast, Asia, to North America, a true political leader like Hillary has the ability to empower as well as be a great role model for them around the globe. Go Hillary! There are plenty of Americans still behind you in this country.

I shifted my support from Obama to Hillary since I began to notice the unfairly relentless negative attacks on Her by news/media. MSNBC practically looks like Obama’s campaign headquarter and CNN is not very far from it. Despite their on-going campaign on behalf of Obama, Hillary has shown real competitiveness and leadership as a female presidential candidate in this country that no other woman has ever done so. As we hear daily, women being raped, totured, killed, left to be uneducated, unemployed, and beated by men merciless from Darfur, middleast, Asia, to North America, a true political leader like Hillary has the ability to empower as well as be a great role model for them around the globe. Go Hillary! There are plenty of Americans still behind you in this country.

To all those saying how does so and so win this without winning [insert name of states here]? The 2008 election will be won by the person who is perceived to be the least like George W Bush. If Clinton wins a contested nomination, McCain will win in November. If Obama or Clinton wins the nomination in a way that is perceived to be fair and above board then you will see a Democrat inaugurated on the 20th Jan 2009. Thats the deal right now.

what a great thing for the democratic party, to have the family that has carried the party banner for the last 15 years resort to racist politicking and reliance upon rich white elitists and uncle toms like julian bond to trash and deny the first serious african american candidate a shot at the whitehouse.
all the clinton supporters should be very proud of themselves.
who is running her campaign anyways, trent lott and the ghost of strom thurmond?

Will the curse be broken if we all become one Nation under God?

Wow, so Obama is switching from inspiring rhetoric to attacking another candidate instead of highlighting his own plans and “dreams” for the country…………………….
Sounds like the same old politics of Washington. Attack. Attack. Something Obama has clearly said he is not about. ………………………..
With front-runner status comes more scrutiny. With Obama leading by a mere 25 delegates and losing in polls in Ohio, Texas and Pennsylvania; large states that are essential for Democrats to win in order to take back the White House, his rhetoric and plans have fallen apart. He has sent mailers that are lies about Clinton’s NAFTA position to thousands of households in Ohio. Attempts to mislead in order to distort a position to gain votes. That is more similar to George W Bush’s tactic to enter war. Mislead with facts in order to gain support…………………………………..
I have yet to hear any question addressed to Obama about an earmark to his wife’s employer for $5 million dollars. An unncessary tax payer expense since the same hospital that employee Michelle Obama made an annual profit of $100 million dollars. Since when does the new politics of “change” involve financial favors for a candidates wife? Since that same favor resulted in a raise to Michelle Obama’s annual salary too?……………………………….
Just seeing and hearing “the same old politics of Washington”. The more Obama speaks out against others his own failings are further exposed. Shame Shame.

In the upcoming Democratic presidential primary, Wisconsin voters are blessed with two candidates who are smart, energetic and forward-looking. Nonetheless, the state’s residents have to decide who will be the most qualified starting on the first day in the Oval Office. My choice is Hillary Clinton.
I have had the good fortune to observe Clinton’s career while living in New York. Up close, she is an unusually tough and savvy as well as charming political figure. While not as visible as Mayor Rudy Giuliani on 9/11, she showed great mastery in the difficult days after the attacks in helping to bring about the physical and emotional recovery of New York City and gaining federal assistance for ground zero workers exposed to toxic air.
As important, in her eight years in the Senate, she has compiled a strong liberal voting record in the tradition of Wisconsin’s great Sens. Bob La Follette and Gaylord Nelson. While she has known defeats (e.g., health care in 1994), she has turned her reversals into legislative prowess on Capitol Hill.
Her work on the Armed Services Committee and her fact-finding visits overseas belie the notion that she has limited foreign policy experience. Her vote for the congressional resolution on Iraq in 2002 was a vote for continued weapons inspection and diplomacy and in opposition to pre-emptive war, as she clearly stated in her Senate floor speech. Today she is trying to prevent the establishment of permanent U.S. bases in Iraq by requiring prior congressional approval for any such outposts.
Of extraordinary importance, she has taken the lead on the most important economic crisis to face our country in decades. She was among the first of the Democratic contenders to propose a bold economic recovery program designed to rescue the nation from recession. Over a month ago, Clinton advocated for $70 billion in emergency spending and a backup of a $40 billion tax rebate should economic conditions worsen. Hers is a direct attempt to help the most threatened people in America — namely, lower-income families facing foreclosures of their mortgages, those in need of home heating aid, and people who require extended jobless benefits.
Her opponent, Sen. Barack Obama, belatedly came out with his own plan, which seemingly lifts most of his ideas straight out of Clinton’s proposal.
On a more specific level, Clinton’s recommendations on helping Americans caught in the subprime mortgage mess are far-reaching. She has called for a moratorium on foreclosures, a freezing of interest rates, the use of federal subsidies to help homeowners keep up with payments and restructure loans, and augmented regulation of the financial industry.
Obama has come up with an alternative plan, which, by contrast, does none of these things but tinkers around the edges. He backs a bill against mortgage fraud, supports an average $500 tax credit for homeowners, and endorses additional funding for a limited class of homeowners. His is a tepid response to an enormous tragedy.
In many ways, Clinton is to the left of Obama. She has outlined a program of universal health insurance — meaning that every person in America would be covered. By contrast, his plan is more restrictive and would leave millions of people uncovered.
Lastly, Clinton is a fighter for change. Obama, on the other hand, is a self-described conciliator. What Democrats want today, however, is a battler, not a mediator. They have suffered enough from the vicious blows of President Bush and the Republicans. What the party needs is a nominee who will take the contest directly to the opposition. Come the fall showdown, a candidacy of “friendly persuasion” is going to be Swift-boated into oblivion.

Clintons are openly admitting that they would do ANYTHING to win even cheat and destroy the democratic party if the have to. I wonder about the people that support her. No wonder exit polls show that her base support comes from high school drop-outs. Get a clue people. Hillary has no chance. It’s either Mcain of Obama. Fortunately, there arent enough dumb people in this country for Clinton to win the presidency.

Another example of how Clintons would do and say anything to win. The fact that there are people out there that can’t see through this is sad.

On NPR last Friday, a black congress man admitted that they are being threatened of their political career if they support Hillary. I can understand their dilema exercising their conscience since their being in office is largely due to the black votes. Can you imagine though if this practice of intimidation is being waged by the Clinton camp against Obama? There will be an outcry in the entire world; blacks will be outraged and will brand this as racism.
Not one media outlet has even tried to look into this allegation. It’s against the Clintons, so it does not matter to them.
If we end up electing the wrong person in November, we will all bear the consequences. And that will be a real SHAME.

Add this to Hillary’s list of accomplishments: uniter of the GOP and divider of the DNC. Gotta love it!

If you think that Republicans will vote for Obama in November, then I know you must be new to politics.
I have followed politics in this Country for 33 years and I think I know what I am talking about.
You can take this to the bank, no matter who the Democrats nominates, Republicans will be united against him or her. At least Hillary has been in the trenches and knows what to expect.
I am just trying to save you (Obama supporters) from the sure grief you are likely to get when the Republicans start hurling anything including the kitchen tables against him. It’s going to happen, and there is nothing you and I can do about it because the Republicans control the media.

Come on guys, Obama is the biggest flim-flam ARTIST east of the Pecos. This guy is not qualified to run a small corporation, not to mention the U. S. government. His resume could be printed on a postage stamp. SNAKE OIL SALESMAN, OBAMA!

Hillary and Bill for President…please wake me up from this nightmare…how anyone who cares anything about truth, honor, dignity or respect vote for these two for co-president(make no mistake, that’s what we are talking about here} amazes me. For those of you who blame President Bush for the woes of today…if your beloved Clinton hadn’t been asleep at the switch as President when it comes to our national security, this President and the rest of us wouldn’t be dealing with it today. Thank God we have a President who realizes the threat to our nation and is willing to do what is necessary to protect our citizens.
Furthermore…it really doesn’t matter which Democrat wins the nomination…they are all socialist…which means higher taxes, taking money from the productive people of our society and giving to the non-productive people who are trapped forever on the Democrats welfare train to nowhere…and involving government in every aspect of our lives…if this is what you want for our country…vote Democrat..or move to France! I just hope the majority of the voters arent that stupid…
But of course, there are, sadly, quite a few morons out there that truly are weak and uneducated. That is the base of the Democratic voters. That’s what the DNC bank on to get your votes.
Democrats and their supporters are weak, uneducated, under-educated, lazy, socialist appeasers who always want to take from those of us that have attained a level of achievement to enjoy a six figure income and give to those who can’t or won’t take care of themselves. Trust me, the excuses are never-ending. Matter of fact, all you need is an excuse, there will be a Democrat to show up to solve all your little problems, all at the expense of those of us that take care of ourselves.
It’s truly comical watching the endless bickering between these two wannabe candidates. As usual though, us common Americans are left with another election cycle of picking the lesser of two evils between a republican or democrat.
Wonder how long it will take before Hilarious (Hillary) sheds another tear…….

Clinton supporters you need to wake up and smell the coffee. The Clintons fed you all with mostly lies and fabrications of the truth. Who played the race card and for what purpose I ask you? Who was almost impeached for actions and lies to the American people? If you have been paying attention since IOWA you know Hilary has mimicked everything Obama has said that she believes has brought him support. If you listen to her last few pitches on CNN. Every day she sound more and more like Obama, what does that tell you. Can we believe what she says as we believed her husband when he was our president? Hilary states her plan for Insurance coverage is better than Obama’s. Is it better to force folks to purchase insurance that they can not afford and garnish their wages if they do not purchase. Or is it better to get insurance companies to make their insurance affordable for everyone as Obama will do. Hilary has continuously told us all she has over 35 years experience, yet the only actual political experience she has is in the senate less than seven years. Hilary says she is ready on day one. Was she ready when she voted for the IRAC war? The only one who has demonstrated the ability to be ready on day one is Obama. Hilary is “now” saying she can find common ground and move the country forward. If you really know Hilary she has not demonstrated the capacity to move folks together. If anything she will move us a part. I hate to see what she does for our country if she wakes up on a bad day. Then there is Bill I pity the Vice President if it is not Bill. What about the staff will there be many more scandals that leak out from Bills activity. I would like to think we are smarter than the Clintons give us credit for. It will be a fight and the Clintons will stoop to who knows what to get back in the White House they have already shown us what they are capable of.

Hillary and Bill for President…please wake me up from this nightmare…how anyone who cares anything about truth, honor, dignity or respect vote for these two for co-president(make no mistake, that’s what we are talking about here} amazes me. For those of you who blame President Bush for the woes of today…if your beloved Clinton hadn’t been asleep at the switch as President when it comes to our national security, this President and the rest of us wouldn’t be dealing with it today. Thank God we have a President who realizes the threat to our nation and is willing to do what is necessary to protect our citizens.
Furthermore…it really doesn’t matter which Democrat wins the nomination…they are all socialist…which means higher taxes, taking money from the productive people of our society and giving to the non-productive people who are trapped forever on the Democrats welfare train to nowhere…and involving government in every aspect of our lives…if this is what you want for our country…vote Democrat..or move to France! I just hope the majority of the voters arent that stupid…
But of course, there are, sadly, quite a few morons out there that truly are weak and uneducated. That is the base of the Democratic voters. That’s what the DNC bank on to get your votes.
Democrats and their supporters are weak, uneducated, under-educated, lazy, socialist appeasers who always want to take from those of us that have attained a level of achievement to enjoy a six figure income and give to those who can’t or won’t take care of themselves. Trust me, the excuses are never-ending. Matter of fact, all you need is an excuse, there will be a Democrat to show up to solve all your little problems, all at the expense of those of us that take care of ourselves.
It’s truly comical watching the endless bickering between these two wannabe candidates. As usual though, us common Americans are left with another election cycle of picking the lesser of two evils between a republican or democrat.
Wonder how long it will take before Hilarious (Hillary) sheds another tear…….

Mr. Obama has the best chance? Do you know how many skeletons are there in his closet waiting to be exposed?

No. Its OBAMA supporters who need to wake up and smell the coffee. We Clinton supporters are so disgusted at the biased media and empty suit rhetoric of obama that we have FAR more in common with liberal Mc Cain than we do Obama. You will NEVER get our vote, NEVER win the white house. Clinton will hang on tooth and nail , if anyting to make SURE Obama doesnt win the election .
Looks good on the aarogant empty suit.

Vet_Sk: Hillary was not the one who started the war and you know who did it!As far as Obama being against the war from the beginning, may be he is but so as Hillary. Your argument is over authorization for war which she voted for it and we do not know where Obama’s vote would go since he was not in senate at that period of time. If I recalled correctly, he has given conflicting answer as to how he would have voted for that particular resolution if he was actually in the US senate during that time. As far as use and abuse of women around the world, it has always been there no matter who starts the war. Wish you good luck on your support to Mr. Obama.

tom: Take a deep breath. Do you really want to be in Iraq for another 100 years?? That’s what John McCain has said.

Those comments saying that people voted in Florida and didn’t care that it wouldn’t count are idiots. My group of friends (a group of well-educated voters) knew that our votes wouldn’t matter in Florida based on the DNCs prior decisions and so didn’t waste our time showing up. How can you call that a fair vote that she won? I’m livid that first they tell us it won’t matter, then in my opinion a large group of un-educated fools go and cast a vote (no surprise that Hillary won), then they tell us that Hillary is fighting to make it count. Florida, just like Michigan CAN NOT SEAT those delegates as the elections were meaningless. Voters who had an understanding of the process stayed home! We need to re-do it or not count it.

Hillary could not have the nomination sewed up yet because Obama won too many nickel and dime states so that put it off. She is 49 delegates behind him which is not a lot of delegates and after she wins those three big states she will surpass him and go on to win the nomination. He really wanted to win California and New York but too bad. Blacks will vote for their own that’s natural but the whites are wishy washy and should stick for their own. I am voting for Hillary and if she loses the nomination I will vote for McCain. I like my own too.

Obama has only been a US Senator for three years and has missed 40% of his votes. So he’s really only been a senator for a little over one and one half years.
He is not qualified to be President no matter how you try to spin it. He should stay in the Senate and learn about the issues and the legislative process and run again.

any sports fans out there? think of it this way. it’s early in the third quarter and obama is ahead, so he wants the game to end now. of course, he didn’t want it to stop at an earlier point when hillary was ahead. and if she gets ahead again, he won’t want it to stop. he just thinks it should stop when he’s up. the game has four quarters, which everyone knows in advance, but he thinks he shouldn’t have to play all of them. bull!!!

I am glad that hillary is fighting on there are a lot of voters who have not been heard and deserve a voice, and for you obama folks it is a good thing as well, Obama needs to know how these people feel, everyone only gets one shot to be the nominee and if he does not have the support to make it, then he would not want to waste his.

Obama needs to stop flip flopping around. When it comes to Florida and Michigan he claims the rules are the rules. When it comes to super delegates the rules state clearly that super delegates are not bound by the votes of their citizens, yet Obama now wants to throw out the rules and say they should follow the will of the people. What will Obamas whinning be like when he narrowly wins the delegate count but fails to reach 2025 needed, but she kills him in the popular vote. Super Delegates are there to help insure a winner gets the nomination. Obama can’t win in the blue states. He only wins in Red State Caucuses which should not carry the weight that states like CA, MA, NY, and NH. She beat him by almost 500,000 votes in CA almost double the number of total Democratic caucuces goers in IW, of which Obama got 37% to support him. His campaign is smoke and mirrors and he knows that the super delegates will see right through it!

A strange fact was identified in the possible inaccuracy of polls when two candidates are still competing for the nomination. People in most instances are emotionally connected to their candidate.Therefore results aren’t clear cut. They are still in this moment and so find it difficult to relate to another moment. It was further stated that as both candidates have very clear supporter bases it is hard to ascertain how many would truly bother to vote at all if their preferred candidate was not the nominee.

For the pedantic amongst us. The discussion as stated was based on “all Americans wwho have voted” The difference lies between 80,000 and 700,00 depending on who your source is and if the voters in Florida and Michigan are included in the overall tally. Still no one has the difference at 1 million or more from what I saw.
Here is one example:
Obama 9,373,334 50%
Clinton 8,674,779 46%
Others 726,095 4%
With Florida
Total Vote %
Obama 9,942,375 49%
Clinton 9,531,987 46%
Others 984,236 4%
With Florida and Michigan
Total Vote %
Obama 9,942,375 47%
Clinton 9,860,138 47%
Others 1,249,922 6%
The point still being that with all voters be considered as they all get to vote in November this is a very close race and many factors will be considered if it takes the convention to resolve it.

Hillary and Bill for President…please wake me up from this nightmare…how anyone who cares anything about truth, honor, dignity or respect vote for these two for co-president(make no mistake, that’s what we are talking about here} amazes me. For those of you who blame President Bush for the woes of today…if your beloved Clinton hadn’t been asleep at the switch as President when it comes to our national security, this President and the rest of us wouldn’t be dealing with it today. Thank God we have a President who realizes the threat to our nation and is willing to do what is necessary to protect our citizens.
Furthermore…it really doesn’t matter which Democrat wins the nomination…they are all socialist…which means higher taxes, taking money from the productive people of our society and giving to the non-productive people who are trapped forever on the Democrats welfare train to nowhere…and involving government in every aspect of our lives…if this is what you want for our country…vote Democrat..or move to France! I just hope the majority of the voters arent that stupid…
But of course, there are, sadly, quite a few morons out there that truly are weak and uneducated. That is the base of the Democratic voters. That’s what the DNC bank on to get your votes.
Democrats and their supporters are weak, uneducated, under-educated, lazy, socialist appeasers who always want to take from those of us that have attained a level of achievement to enjoy a six figure income and give to those who can’t or won’t take care of themselves. Trust me, the excuses are never-ending. Matter of fact, all you need is an excuse, there will be a Democrat to show up to solve all your little problems, all at the expense of those of us that take care of ourselves.
It’s truly comical watching the endless bickering between these two wannabe candidates. As usual though, us common Americans are left with another election cycle of picking the lesser of two evils between a republican or democrat.
Wonder how long it will take before Hillary sheds another tear…….

ERIN just because Hillary was 1st lady does not qualify her for a presidents job either. No one is qualified to be a president until they have done the job.
Hillary and her husband ransacked this country while they where in the white house and even down to taking furniture from the white house. Disgusting is Bill Clinton. The worlds biggest confirmed and caught on tape liar. You Dems just can’t look at the bad of these people. Ask Hillary how much she was paid to look into health care reform? She did not do it for free!!

It’s clear that people who want to elect a Democrat in November support Hillary. And, yes, if Obama gets the nomination, sensible Democrats will support him too. Contrast that with Michelle Obama, who said she would have to give thought to whether she would vote for Hillary in November. That’s horrible. So if the Obamas don’t get their way, they’d just as soon see another Republican in the White House. Nice one.

Jim Rod,
Dems are clueless. They’ve always advocated more socialistic programs for teh poor and undeserving, which always comes off of the backs of us that support ourselves. Case in point is the recent tax rebate for this so called stimulus package. Bush wanted it black and white, a clear cut rebate for taxpayers….ie…people who actually worked and paid in their taxes, but the Dems couldn’t resist getting their digs in the poor, and wanted money for heating subsidies, my god, they never stop. But that is their m.o., they want to keep the poor people poor, so they can make new promises, to keep getting their votes. It’s like a never-ending water funnel going down the drain. Any wonder why poor and uneducated go for Hillary-ous, while the well to do and educated go for Obama? Not all Dems are completely dumb, but I’ve never met too many smart ones.
I’ve worked hard my whole working career, and have attained a level of achievement to where I can now enjoy a six figure income, yet the Dems try to make me feel guilty? Not happening. I served my country honorably, went to school, was poor, and worked my way up. A novel concept the Dems will never see I guess.

So if the Obama campaign says that the superdelegates are obligated to vote the will of the people in their states, does this mean that Ted Kennedy and John Kerry will have to switch to Clinton?
Also, regarding Florida, Bracak Obama spent more money than Hillary advertising on cable that reached the Florida voters, so he had the advantage but lost. The primary vote should stand as is and the delegates distributed accordingly.

There would have to be a complete mutiny within the super delegates for Clinton to step aside anytime soon. Or she would have to lose Ohio and Texas by 10 points or more.
neither of these 2 things are going to happen.
Obama wants his HYPED nomination, he can have it, at the cost of the election in November.