Bill Clinton Says No Re-Vote in MI and FL is a Deliberate Attempt to Disenfranchise Voters

I agree with Bill this is just stupid we all know that no one will ever believe this is right how unfair have we gone crazy?

Good for you president clinton. Its true he slants this for his wife, but what he is saying is TRUE. Its also a fact that both Hillary and Obama agreed the vote shoulndt count, but neither thought they would need the vote to put them over the top.
Hanging them out to dry -yet NEEDING SUPERDELEGATES to decide the thing – is just plain stupid.
If Howard Dean knew that the race would be this close, and the SUPER DELEGATES would have to decide it, then he would never have taken all the delegates away. He probably would have gone for a 1/2 thing like the republicans.
The fact is OBAMA is not so secretly trying to BLOCK the revote. This is totally uncool, and Mc Cain will hit Obama over the head with it in the general election.
Obama is unelectable folks. Dont make the mistake of RAMMING him down our throats because he won caucus’s and red states he cant win in the general election

I bet Brett Farve would sure like to re-do that last interception he threw. YOU DO NOT CHANGE RULES AT HALFTIME. Why don’t people understand this? Many people didn’t even vote in FL & MI because they knew it wouldn’t count and the candidates did not campaign there so you can’t count those votes. I don’t understand why Hillary left her name on the ballot in MI. Obama 2008!!

I only have one question to the American public
WHO WANTS A PRESIDENT THAT WILL NOT SALUTE THE AMERICAN FLAG AND WHY HAS THIS NOT BEEN MADE BY ALL CANIDATES IN THIS POLITICAL MESS?
I had thought Obama was the right person for the job until I read and saw this. NO MORE.

Bill Clinton is 100% correct this time. The voting situation in Florida and Michigan SHOULD be unconstitutional. The public is being excluded from the election process; this doesn’t sound like the same America in which I was born. Florida and Michigan are worried about the “cost”. How about the “cost” to our way of life? The entire nominating process needs an overhaul, with every state holding a BINDING primary election on the same date, along with abolishing the conventions. Caucuses should be outlawed completely.

Folks, I wonder why everyone thinks Mccain will win in Nov. He’s the oldest candidate ever (out of touch with most folks), and he’s got only one thing to run on-Iraq, and that’s going bad. Dems, finish this fight for the nomination quickly and let’s take the Mccains on.

I don’t buy the disenfranchized argument with FL & MI. If I was from one of these states I would not vote for McCain because some idiots from my state elected to move the primary up, which everyone knew was against the rules. I would not vote for McCain and continue this terrible war indefinitely, just because I want to get back at the DNC….. Let’s give FL & MI votes more credit than that. Obama 2008!

Against the “rules”? WHOSE rules?! Since when do party officials in their “smoke-filled rooms” behind closed doors have the right to decide for whom we can vote? This is “Boss Tweed” politics, which went out of style in the 1930′s. We need OPEN elections, or our system is no better than Russia’s, where voters have a choice of one candidate. If you don’t call it “disenfranchised”, what DO you call it?!

I feel that the people who voted in MI and FL should have their votes counted. The heck with a re do.
Obama be DAMNED just like his Minister says. Obama is not for a ONE America he is only for a BLACK America

Not only did Howard Dean pull a brain #### on taking ALL the delegates away, he needs to get RID of these stupid caucus’s. Primaries mirror a general election. They should have 50 primaries to select the nominee. Caucus’s disenfranchise too many elderly and others who cant come within the couple of hours specified.

tomdavie, you’re right, but that’s only part of the story. In our state (and a few others), they have a CLOSED caucus! These things are attended ONLY by party bosses and the public is not permitted to participate even if they CAN get there! Caucuses are completely WRONG for America!

Every time they show Obama’s church with those crazy hateful people jumping up and down, tapping the Rev. on the shoulder while he speaks (what’s up with that?) and clapping and hollering, America gets a good look at what kind of shenanigans would be going on in the sacred White House.
Uh, no thanks.

pt, I completely agree with you about the Electoral College. The last President who tried to abolish it was Richard Nixon, and he was “tarred and feathered” for a meaningless escapade which accomplished nothing and hurt no one. Caucuses are just as exclusive as the Electoral College when it comes to disregarding the will of the voters, and the conventions are even worse. We need BINDING primaries in EVERY state. This way, everyone’s vote counts!

If not for these video tapes of Rev. Wright, he would be the one holding the Bible for the swearing in ceremony of Barack. Can you just imagine this America hater in that sacred ceremony?? He shouldn’t be allowed within 100 yards of the White House.

Split the delegates down the middle, 50-50, and then seat ‘em all at the convention in August. There’s no other way now. Accept it, and let’s get on with CRUSHING John W. McBush — our REAL enemy, and a prospective THIRD BUSH TERM for certain.

Clinton is the one who won’t agree to split them. Obama has already agreed! LOL It’s Hillary spin time to say it’s Obama. She will only agree to FRANCHISE them IF and ONLY IF it benefits her LOL

Hillary did not win those election because they were not elections…say it one more time and perhaps it will sink in…Hillary did not win those elections. They rules were broken and now it stands. Deal with it.

COUNT THE VOTES IN FL AND MI!
WHY HAS IT BECOME SO DIFFICULT IN THIS COUNTRY TO SIMPLY:
COUNT ALL VOTES!!

Republicans like myself are just sitting back and enjoying the two democrat contenders sloshing around in the mud. This is the most fun we’ve had since the day after the 2004 election when the Kerry supporters were bawling after Bush won yet again.

Jackt51-What does it take for hard left wingers such as yourself to somehow understand no campaign can simply GIVE FL and MI to the republicans even BEFORE the general begins. But if you insist, then perhaps you can explain how you see any democrat winning the White House including Obama and especially because folks down FL see him as the problem. Considering that 28-36% of Fl democrats say they will vote republican if their votes are not counted. Plenty to put the republicans over the top there.

why is this sooo difficult?? why do we need to fight for this basic democratic right?? what is going on??
COUNT THE VOTES IN FL AND MI!
WHY HAS IT BECOME SO DIFFICULT IN THIS COUNTRY TO SIMPLY:
COUNT ALL VOTES!!

If Obama needed these two states you can rest assured Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson would be in the streets demanding that every vote be counted and that every vote count! He would be making all kinds of speeches about how the people of Florida and Michigan were being disinfranchised. But since it may benefit Hillary they are silent and even working behind the scenes to prevent a revote!
I don’t care what party rules say no party can have as its core that people who voted will not have their votes counted, it is fundamentally undemocratic. I see that the party rules allow for all the superdelegates to vote for whom ever they want yet Obama says that they must follow the will of the voters. So when it comes to counting votes he says rules are rules but when to comes to superdelegates he says that the rules should be broken!

this is NOT about Obama or about Clinton!
what is the matter with you?
IT’S ABOUT COUNTING ALL VOTES IN AN ELECTION!!!
COUNT THE VOTES IN FL AND MI!
WHY HAS IT BECOME SO DIFFICULT IN THIS COUNTRY TO SIMPLY:
COUNT ALL VOTES!!

Carl-Talk about the good old days, Carl. You know, when ONLY republicans did this sort of thing as we all claimed at the time. Nope! Thanks to the republicans we leaned how to disenfranchise voters ourselves. BUT we’ll even go one better than the republicans, we’ll disenfranchise TWO state to prove we are better at this game than the republicans ever dreamed.

here’s a news flash. Hillary made a speech on a future housing plan today in Philadelphia; what’s so strange is that it is so similar to the memo Obama sent out March 2007 to Federal Reserve Chairman and Treasury Secretary. Hillary has a lot of gall and what she banks on is the American people not reading…

JJ: It is Obama’s problem because he did not agree to the recount. He dragged his feet!

I’m from Florida and I was told the primary votes wouldn’t count. I don’t feel disenfranchised but right about now I do feel a little used. If my vote wasn’t a concern when pledges were signed, why is it so important now? I would respect the Clintons more if they would just say they looking for a way to win the nomination because that’s the truth. This fake concern for our rights just makes me angry.

Why didn’t we have this discussion when the rules were first introduced ? Oh Yeah, we did and all of the candidates agreed that they wouldn’t count. Now the Clintons have changed their mind because it is convenient for them and they are dredging up the specter of voter disenfranchisement to blackmail the democratic party into changing the rules? They truly don’t care about the party, they only care about themselves, and they don’t care about those voters… Hillary is a hypocrite.

if Clinton were OK with not counting Fl and MI than that would have been fine. But CLINTON is running and SHE wants ALL VOTES to be counted!!
why do YOU think YOU have the right to take that away from HER??
this is NOT Obama’s problem and it is NOT Clinton’s problem.
IT IS OUR PROBLEM!!
without the votes we are NOTHING!!
COUNT THE VOTES IN FL AND MI!
WHY HAS IT BECOME SO DIFFICULT IN THIS COUNTRY TO SIMPLY:
COUNT ALL VOTES!!

I have been a Michigan native all of my life and I am amazed that Obama is taking the heat on Michigan/Florida revote issue. The MICHIGAN DEMOCRATIC PARTY, THE LEADERS OF WHICH ARE ALL IN THE CLINTON CAMP, HAVE PLAYED DIRTY POOL FROM THE GET GO! I am a retired teacher who spent every day trying to teach 3rd and 4th graders that we need to take responsibility for our actions, that it isn’t okay to believe that rules don’t apply..especially when those rules were decided democratically by the DNC. In fact, Harold ICKES, one of Hillary’s head advisors, is on the RULES COMMITTEE. He helped formulate the rule stripping states who went ahead of delegates and now, of course, he’s calling foul. Give me a break. Michiganders : OF COURSE WE ALL WANT TO HAVE OUR VOTES COUNT…but don’t misplace the blame for the fact that we were all denied. Jennifer Granholm, Carl Levin, Debbie Dingel, Debbie Stabenow, who have had my support for years, MADE THE DECISION TO BREAK THE RULES, they are responsible for this debacle…not the candidates!

DL-How do I know? Obama! He stood on that stage and he said I can no more distance myself and all that garbage. Then he threw grandma under the bus and kept Wright. Good enough for me.

Rainy-Simple. Wright them off. Clear win for the republicans. Case closed.

The Florida & Michigan “situation” is one that FL & MI legislators (wrongly) decided on (WITHOUT the consent of their consituents, I might add!). It had absolutley NOTHING to do with either HRC or BO and cannot be resolved by either campaign.
It is a far more complicated situation than Bill Clinton would suggest. A re-do necessarily “disenfranchises” all voters (Independent, Dem & Rep) who “used” their vote in the MI Republican primary simply because they knew their vote would not count in the Democratic primary. These voters would not be allowed to cast a vote in a re-do primary. This is just one of the problems.
If Bill Clinton wants to talk ‘disenfranchisment’ and ‘un-american and that this situation ‘is in opposition to our democratic principles’, then he ought to figure out how HRC will legitimately argue that the word “Uncommitted” on MI primary ballot should be reinterpreted as representing the candidate: Barack Obama.
If MI delegates were seated in accordance with the (unsanctioned)January primary (which is HRC’s argument), it would represent a fundamental disrespect of democratic principles, voter’s rights and the rule of law.

Why are these FL and MI people angry with their own State’s elected officials as they are the people who decided to change the rule and move the primary date up to vote early. It was NOT the fault of the DNC. It was their own “elected officials”. If they want to do something to correct this, they should not vote again for the people they elected/chose in the first place. THIS IS NOT A FAULT OF THE DNC. THESE STATES KNEW THE RULES AS LAID OUT BY THE DNC CHARTER AND BYLAWS, BUT DECIDED TO CHANGE THE RULES KNOWING FULL WELL THE CONSEQUENCES! They have only their elected officials to blame!

Why didn’t the VOTERS in Michigan and Florida scream at the time??? They had a right to protest, complain, whatever it took to ensure that their votes would be counted. Why all the hoopla now, because the Clintons want to change the rules in the middle of the game? No one is disenfranchising anyone – and if she felt so strongly about them being “disenfranchisied” why didn’t she fight for this back in the fall when she agreed to it. This is hypocrisy at its best…very sad indeed.

SPLIT THE DELEGATES RIGHT DOWN THE MIDDLE SO THEY CAN BE SEATED AT THE CONVENTION, HOWEVER CLINTON DOES NOT LIKE/WANT THAT. NO – NOTHING SHORT OF ALL DELEGATES FOR HER WILL DO. RATHER THAN HAVE THE DELEGATES SEATED, SHE WOULD THROW THE DEM PARTY UNDER THE BUS ALONG WITH AMERICA – WE THE PEOPLE! I HAVE NEVER SEEN A MORE SELFISH INDIVIDUAL IN MY ENTIRE 65 YEARS OF LIFE!!

Lisa Bradford-You are NOT the people. You are merely ONE person, like me.

The next time the Democrats decide to disallow a state’s delegates, they should also deduct the value of these delegates from the number of delegates required to win the nomination. The fact is this – the Democratic party is split between Obama and Clinton. FL and MI votes will NOT solve that split. If the people of FL and MI are now mad, they can throw out their state Democratic officials who caused this mess in the first place. But don’t come back now and say their votes should count…

COUNT ALL DEMOCRATIC VOTES – Please tell me how Obama is blocking this? Point me to a web page.. something.
Obama is not blocking a revote.
FL and MI have decided that they do not want to PAY for a revote.
Do you understand that?

If it comes down to the superdelgates deciding, which it will I would rather have Fl and MI decide it.

Re: Michigan and Florida: What if John Edwards had won in Michigan and/or Florida? Or even placed second? How would that have changed things? You just can’t rewind the clock here and call it fair because it can never be fair to everyone. Nancy Pelosi said weeks ago that Michigan and Florida can never be allowed to alter the results of the rest of the voting.

It’s called the LAW, people. Michigan and Florida elected to try to outdo other states by holding their primaries early, so they got penalized… period. If everyone’s wondering why the whole process got started so early, you can blame it on those states, thank you very much.

Okay, first, I am a Michigan resident. I don’t have an ax to grind because I was (and am) a John Edwards supporter. Those biases being stated, there is no consitutional right of an individual to vote for nominees of any political party. It happens to be the way most states decide on their delegates to the major party national conventions– but it doesn’t have to be that way. Delegates are chosen in the way that suits the various state parties. The state parties agree to the national parties’ rules. What happened was simply a matter of two state parties (Michigan and Florida), after having agreed to the rules laid down by the national parties, deciding that the rules weren’t fair and changing them on their own. The same rules were agreed to by the candidates– all the candiates- and now one of the candidates wants to change the rules that the candidates camp has deemed “unfair.” I’m sorry but everyone needs to grow up. The rules, which everyone agreed to exist. Either play by them or leave the game.

The possibility of Senator Clinton deciding to break from the Democratic Party is quite realistic, given the circumstances that are emerging.
The DNC has failed its party members miserably. The caucus system of selecting delegates was skewed. Florida and Michigan voters have been disenfranchised. Superdelegates may pick the presidential nominee. Backroom endorsements are being issued as an attempt to control the party.
If Senator Clinton were to simply follow the successful, independent campaign tactics of Joe Lieberman, she could very well be the first president not beholding to party politics.
At the very least, a Hillary Clinton independent candidacy would ensure that Barack Hussein Obama and his radical, liberal policies never infect the White House.
God BLESS America!

Why has it become so difficult to count all votes?
Because Michigan and Florida broke the rules. What is it that you don’t understand about the word rules?
And please leave your go to Africa comment out of this discussion, it has no place here, try David Duke’s house.

One more time:
The Florida Republicans moved the primary date up resulting in the DNC refusing to accept the primary vote.
The Florida Democrats that voted did not have a say in when their primary was held.
By rule, the Democratic convention cannot be considered legitimate unless delegates from ALL states are seated.
Broken rules?
You be the judge.

The primaries in FL and MI were illegal. Illegal votes don’t count. Either do a legitimate re-vote or let things stand as they are.

“maybe she thought that things will take care of themselves and those votes in those states will not have a big impact at the end of the campaign.”
Exactly, now she cares because she is losing and not the revisionist history that her husband is trying to put over on the average voter now. But it really does depend on what your definition of is is.

Yup, the only way to save America is for Hillary to go Independent and win!
A Lieberman saw the light. I think Clinton will be seeing it too.
I agree Ben!
Hillary wins as an INDEPENDENT candidate!

I guess it’s OK for Obama to do whatever he wants.
IMAGINE if it were CLINTON using LAWYERS to prevent a RE-VOTE!
It would be the dreaded Clinton Machine.
Hillary in 08
as a DEMOCRAT or an INDEPENDENT

The dreaded Clinton Machine is under sniper fire right now and is having trouble refueling.

i like how you use words like ‘illegal’ and ‘disenfranchised’.. i guess, if it is not for Obama it must be either ‘illegal’ or ‘disenfranchised’ :))
maybe you don’t know this yet, but DNC does NOT make the laws in the states of MI or FL :)
disenfranchised – how were people in Florida ‘disenfranchised’? Did anyone stop anybody from going to the polls and express their WILL?
i’ve never heard that anywhere – but maybe you know something i don’t..
–
–
EVERYONE HAD A CHOICE, EVERYONE HAD A BALLOT.
DEMAND THAT ALL VOTES ARE COUNTED!
let the best WIN! whoever that is.
but:
COUNT THE VOTES IN FL AND MI!
WHY HAS IT BECOME SO DIFFICULT IN THIS COUNTRY TO SIMPLY:
COUNT ALL VOTES!!

i am not ‘for’ or ‘against’ anything :)
i can’t be because i am not in this race :))
the only thing that i am for is: COUNT ALL VOTES! because i am a citizen of this great country of ours!
and YOU should be for that as well.
Clinton has already said she is for a re-do, DNC has already said they are for a re-do, Obama as far as I know is the only one hiding behind a rule.
if all 3 parties agree on this, they will find a solution with the states.
here is the thing: the approach Obama campaign is taking is soooo stupid that i can’t believe it. i sort of like the guy, seriously. not a lot.. but i do.. he made a few things happen. really good things happened. but the way they are handling this thing with FL and MI is SOO bad that you have to stop and wonder for a second. what the heck are they thinking? there is NO way they can win this and the longer it sits out there without Obama coming out and speaking strongly FOR a re-vote OR sitting the delegates, the worse it will be if he ever is allowed to become the nominee by the super delegates (they WILL decide this anyway, you know that).
–
EVERYONE HAD A CHOICE, EVERYONE HAD A BALLOT.
DEMAND THAT ALL VOTES ARE COUNTED!
let the best WIN! whoever that is.
but:
COUNT THE VOTES IN FL AND MI!
WHY HAS IT BECOME SO DIFFICULT IN THIS COUNTRY TO SIMPLY:
COUNT ALL VOTES!!

DNC does NOT make the laws NOR the rules in FL or MI! i am not sure what is so difficult about understanding that? DNC makes the rules about sitting delegates.
you are equating the fact that people exercised their constitutional right to vote to the fact that the DNC rule does not allow sitting the delegates. the DNC rule CANNOT make the votes in FL or MI illegal – to even say that is an absolute NONSENSE! All DNC CAN do is to decide whether to sit the FL or MI delegates or not.
BUT, you are forgetting something very important here:
BOTH FL AND MI have a SAY at the Convention! They HAVE THE RIGHT to come to the Convention and MAKE THE CASE for the delegates to be seated. That plus the fact that CLINTON wants that too, put Obama in a very inferior position (not to say how ugly it will look politically..). THERE WILL BE A BIG HUGE FIGHT – make no mistake about that.
So, STOP calling people who went to vote based on their constitutional right to vote, illegal. You wouldn’t like it if they did that to you!
how many times do i have to repeat this:
OBAMA IS THE ONE WHO OPPOSES A RE-DO IN FL AND MI!!!!!!!!!
not the Clintons, not the DNC and certainly not me.
hope you got it this time..
–
EVERYONE HAD A CHOICE, EVERYONE HAD A BALLOT.
DEMAND THAT ALL VOTES ARE COUNTED!
let the best WIN! whoever that is.
but:
COUNT THE VOTES IN FL AND MI!
WHY HAS IT BECOME SO DIFFICULT IN THIS COUNTRY TO SIMPLY:
COUNT ALL VOTES!!

now now, you tried to make DNC make the laws in FL and MI. now that you failed it seems to me that you are turning around and trying to make those rules yourself..
hear me out on this one:
FL and MI make the laws AND the rules regarding ELECTIONS in their states.
got it? try repeating that a few times.. i can understand that for some people it might take a short while to get that. but it is true: the states of FL and MI are in charge of the ELECTION laws and rules in their states.
–
EVERYONE HAD A CHOICE, EVERYONE HAD A BALLOT.
DEMAND THAT ALL VOTES ARE COUNTED!
let the best WIN! whoever that is.
but:
COUNT THE VOTES IN FL AND MI!
WHY HAS IT BECOME SO DIFFICULT IN THIS COUNTRY TO SIMPLY:
COUNT ALL VOTES!!

maybe whomever told them to follow anything BUT the state’s official ELECTION laws/rules committed an illegal act.
–
EVERYONE HAD A CHOICE, EVERYONE HAD A BALLOT.
DEMAND THAT ALL VOTES ARE COUNTED!
let the best WIN! whoever that is.
but:
COUNT THE VOTES IN FL AND MI!
WHY HAS IT BECOME SO DIFFICULT IN THIS COUNTRY TO SIMPLY:
COUNT ALL VOTES!!

nope.. FL and MI legislators made what hey thought were the best decisions for their people. they really did want their people to have a bigger voice in this election. there was a disagreement with the DNC. i happen to think that the DNC played a strong hand there and they should have found a way to solve the issue. clearly, no one thought of this scenario.
hate to say this, but Obama is the ‘one’ who is standing in the way of solving this issue…all he needs to say is a very simple statement: every vote must count in AMERICA! easy enough? apparently, not for Obama..
–
EVERYONE HAD A CHOICE, EVERYONE HAD A BALLOT.
DEMAND THAT ALL VOTES ARE COUNTED!
let the best WIN! whoever that is.
but:
COUNT THE VOTES IN FL AND MI!
WHY HAS IT BECOME SO DIFFICULT IN THIS COUNTRY TO SIMPLY:
COUNT ALL VOTES!!

It’s easy to blame the DNC or the Obama Campaign for the voter problem in MI and FLA but the truth is, this whole issue was started when the elected officials in Florida and Michigan arrogantly decided to break Democratic party rules and move the dates of the primaries to an earlier time without any good reason.
They knew what the consequences would be for that move and they didn’t care about whether they would lose their delegates or that the voters would be disenfrancised, they just didn’t want to wait their turn like the other states did.
If you want to blame anyone, blame your elected officals and fire them for stiffing you.

How can a Democratic Party silence the voices of voters in MI and FL? Obama sent his people to Michigan to block a re-vote because a re-vote in MI is to his disadvantage.
Obama claims to have won the popular vote? Not quite because 2.5 million votes in MI and FL were not included.
And he is afraid to have them counted?
If there is no revote in MI and FL, and if Obama is the nominee, then his nomination is totally illegitimate.
I and my friends want no part of that nomination and we are ready to vote MCCain. A new poll out shows 28% of Hillary voters will vote for MCCain.
Yes, we will vote for MCCAIN. And this number will grow. If Obama does not want to hear the voices in MI and FL, then we like our VOICES heard in November.
Obama may win the Democratic nomination by shutting down the voices in MI and FL.
But then, that is as far as Obama will go. He will just stay the Democratic nominee.
The Republicans will hold on to the White House. We, the 28%, will ensure that.

From what I understand Barack Obama is leading mainly because he wins caucuses. Texas had a primary and a caucus, and Hillary won the primary while Barack Obama won the caucus. He actually took more delegates from Texas because of a caucus that many claimed was unfair with all types of voting irregularities, including bullying and cheating. Caucuses are not fair. I feel that Obama people are rigging the system and using lawyers to argue technicalties instead of true substance. Voting should be fair; otherwise, it is meaningless. This is a big story media…look into the caucus process.

To texasdemocrat. Please leave the spin to the experts, Bill and Hillary.

is obama borrowing a page from gwbush’s democracy? clearly, obama doesn’t want MI and FL to participate in the democratic process – the reason is becoming pretty clear: with MI and FL in the mix he loses.
all this talk about him being ahead in the polls is just a bunch of nonsense entertained by the same people who said that FL2000 was fine..
–
COUNT THE VOTES IN FL AND MI!
WHY HAS IT BECOME SO DIFFICULT IN THIS COUNTRY TO SIMPLY:
COUNT ALL VOTES!!

WHATEVER…. BILL & HILLARY JUST FOLLOW THE RULES FOR A CHANGE!

rules are always meant to be broken, the united states was founded on not wanting to pay taxes on tea, an some other things, as far as florida and michigan votes go, clinton should get what she has won, the people of those states will be heard either today or tommorow, like the saying goes pay me now or pay me later.