South Dakota Switchers, Screw-ups and Signage
ABC News’ Sunlen Miller reports: Former Sen. George McGovern appeared at Barack Obama’s Sioux Falls, S.D., rally, and explained why he switched his early endorsement for Sen. Hillary Clinton, D-N.Y., to the senator from Illinois.
"I do so partly because I believe he now has an insurmountable lead, and we Democrats everywhere need to be gathering in a united way behind him," McGovern said to the 6,500-strong rally. "And I hope that will occur soon."
While McGovern made his switch to Obama official earlier this month, this was the first time the former presidential candidate made an appearance with Obama.
McGovern referenced his friendship and history with both Clintons. "Last October, I endorsed Sen. Hillary Clinton. She and her remarkable husband, President Clinton, way back 36 years ago, worked their heart out for me in the ’72 presidential campaign. And let me make clear, while I endorsed Sen. Obama, the Clintons had been my treasured friends all these years and that will continue; after all we’re all joined behind Barack Obama."
McGovern said that Obama represented a "ripple of faith and hope that began to reach us from Chicago, the heartland of the country, that ripple first touched down in Iowa."
An ode to his Iowa days — or a candidate who is in multiple cities every day — when Sen. Obama took the stage, he made a campaign blunder.
"Thank you Sioux City," Obama shouted. Quickly realizing his mistake, that he was in Sioux Falls, S.D., he shot back, "I’ve been in Iowa too long."
Midway though Obama’s stump speech, there was another distraction: A Hillary Clinton supporter waving a "Hillary for President" sign caused a small ruckus, which displeased Obama supporters in the audience around her.
"Oh let that person with the Hillary sign put up their sign," said Obama, stopping his speech to address the murmur to the left of him. "This is a free country, and we’re a united country. I don’t know what all the fuss is about."
Obama continued about the dust-up: "We’re gonna have a lot of Hillary signs at the convention. There will be a lot of Obama signs, too."
Although saying that Hillary supporters had a right to wave their sign, the presidential candidate did offer up a manners lesson at the end.
"The only thing I will say is that person behind you probably can’t see very well. That’s not very nice of you. … That’s just not being neighborly."
The lone Clinton supporter stood up, holding a blue Hillary sign over her head for the duration of Obama’s 45-minute stump speech.
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Democrats will be United.
I could careless of what Hillary supporters state on blogs and articles…they WILL vote Obama.
And I say so b/c, after the first Obama/McCain debate… our choice will be clear.
This nation needs a new path and McCain only offers the path Bush has lead us.
Posted by: Vanessa | May 16, 2008, 10:53 pm 10:53 pm
Operation Turn Down!!! like you need to understand what that is girl, this has legs and its growing.
Posted by: SJ | May 16, 2008, 11:11 pm 11:11 pm
what is operation turn down????
Posted by: indigogrrl | May 16, 2008, 11:13 pm 11:13 pm
Operation Turn Down is ridiculous. Say it works. Do we get to blame you when McCain appoints a Supreme Court that overturns Roe? Because I will. Hillary has faced some sexism in this campaign, but it’s nothing compared to the racism and rumor mongering Obama has endured. At the end of the day, he won, she lost and we’re all Democrats. We need to stop this ridiculous name calling and get it together.
Posted by: CJ | May 16, 2008, 11:25 pm 11:25 pm
I love that lone Hillary supporter! Given that the Obama camp is so vicious, he was brave. Good for him.
As for the post that said Hillary supporters will vote for Obama, not gonna happen. Not in November, and not in this life. Not ever.
Posted by: Emily | May 16, 2008, 11:32 pm 11:32 pm
Obama’s Website says he’ll negotiate with Iran… “unconditionally
***************************************
This is BS.
Obama08
Posted by: Thinking | May 16, 2008, 11:33 pm 11:33 pm
There have been many Obama supporters who have heckled Hillary Clinton during her rallies and so I dont see why he is so annoyed by it.
Posted by: Joan | May 16, 2008, 11:34 pm 11:34 pm
Vanessa:
You are being delusional. I will NEVER
vote for Obama. Even if a dream ticket is proposed, I will NOT vote for Barack Obama. Only Hillary or McCain, or maybe, Nader.
Posted by: minil | May 16, 2008, 11:54 pm 11:54 pm
How rude and divisive for John Edwards to endorse Sen. Obama on the day after Sen. Clinton’s West Virginia primary? Then in the same breath talk about “party unity?” This is very typical of Obama campaign. Talk endlessly about high ideals for America and then take a real “low road!” Is this the “new politics” that Sen. Obama is promising us? But I have to tell you if our now “presumptive nominee” Sen. Barack Obama is going to be the “real” Democratic nominee, sadly, another “George McGovern” fate tragically awaits the Democratic Party. It’s heartbreaking to watch the DNC self-destruct and its super-delegates squandering the distinct advantage they have to re-gain the White House in 08. But don’t be surprised; knowing the fact that DNC houses the longest list of losers of any American organization! The impending Democratic presidential loss to John McCain has to be blame on the same old politicians who have never won presidential elections, calling the shots for DNC, and fumbling the chances: Ted Kennedy, John Kerry, Tom Daschle, Bill Bradley, John Edwards, Bill Richardson, Howard Dean, Nancy Pelosi and as you know many of them ran for president and lost! Now they are all endorsing and supporting Sen. Obama. They are playing the same old loser’s game. That game is called the “idealism” game. These democrats have a penchant for being indulged in idealism, just like Barack Obama. As you know idealists like George McGovern never made it Washington. And many of them are examples of such idealist losers. All this has happened before. They all said they are going throw the bums out and clean up Washington. But they all lost to the Republicans. And when you at things in the light of what happened at the Democratic primaries in Florida, Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Texas, New York, Massachusetts, New Jersey, and in many other states, and especially when you look at the 41 point victory of Sen. Hillary Clinton over the “presumptive nominee” in West Virginia, isn’t it obvious Sen. Obama can’t win; he isn’t strong enough, his base isn’t wide enough; he has a very narrow but deep base, but not good enough to win a presidential election. He has failed to get the support of women, so called “Reagan Democrats” or working class white voters, rural voters, labor union households, Latinos, older Americans and so on; you know in spite of the media spin and promotion Sen. Obama is no more better than another George McGovern or Mike Dukakis! We all know that Black American and city liberals never won presidential elections for democrats. Sen. Obama had successfully maneuvered himself to be the front runner, with a help of zealots in caucuses states to get most of his delegate numbers. No matter how many congressional seats they win in the fall 2008 election if the Democrats fail to win the White House, the situation that we have right now─ with President Bush vetoing everything ─isn’t going to change. The unfortunate thing for the Democratic Party in this election cycle is that they have a presidential candidate who really can’t win. Besides there’s even more bad news. Remember, just before the general election in 2004, Massachusetts judge sanctified gay-marriage, which galvanized the conservation vote resulting in John Kerry’s defeat and George Bush narrow win. Just the same way now that California Supreme Court decision allow gay-marriage would surly bring lost of social-conservatives to 2008 polls and ensure the defeat of Barack Obama, just as it happened before. The Democratic party it known for its capacity for “Snatching the defeat out of the jaws of victory.” Sen. Obama can’t even change the defeatist dynamic of his own party and how can he propose to save America from its continuing decline?
Posted by: charleychaplin | May 16, 2008, 11:56 pm 11:56 pm
He wasn’t annoyed by it, his supporters were. He handled it well, although the Hillary supporter being the type of people we are silently made their statement, while Obama supporters are obnoxious buffoons.
As to the professional poster Vanessa who is so sure, along with CNN talking heads, that Hillary supporters will just do what they’re told and vote for the Dem nominee, no, we don’t vote for just any left wing radicals the DNC has chosen to run the country.
I say Obama should just go back and straighten up the Chicago southside and figure out who owns his backyard now that Rezko is on trial and transferring Obama’s backyard around like it’s a $625,000 hot potato bought by a Syrian and paid for by Saddam’s bagman Auchi.
Well, now that I mention, it is a hot potato, or will be by the time the 527′s tell the public what the talking heads won’t tell them.
But in October. Over and over.
No, won’t be many people voting for him and his Muslim criminal connections. Not to mention Farrakan and I don’t know how many Muslims converted to Black Liberation Theology, good golly, yeah, that’s who working class America wants for their president.
rd
Posted by: rd | May 16, 2008, 11:58 pm 11:58 pm
Hillary has said she will go on until everyone has voted…and Obama say’s he’s having a party on 20th to celebrate being a Dem’ nominee, say’s who?! How arrogant can he get! He has no respect for Hillary, or the party! His comment regarding celebrating negates the fact that States are still to vote, plus DNC decide on the 31st about FL & MI, but is he concerned, NO WAY!!! He thinks he’s UNTOUCHABLE and his smugness makes me so very angry!
What he forgets is that the States he won will revert to Republican in the GE! He’s also ignoring the fact that super delegates can change their minds, right up to the point that they vote. He thinks Edwards endorsement of him helps get the white working class vote, and it will take much more than that!
I believe Hillary can do it! Especially when you have the McCain campaign gunning for him and the Rezko trial will show his links with all the corruption he’s linked to. Hillary has all the swing States and only she can win the GE to be the first Woman President!
Posted by: Di | May 17, 2008, 12:07 am 12:07 am
Well, as soon as this hits the MSM you’ll see another switch a roo….right back to Hillary Clinton.
Anyone that cares about our country will take the time to read this. It’s our political “cesspool of corruption”.
http://www.opednews.com/articles/genera_evelyn_p_080512_curtain_time_for_bar.htm
Posted by: SadStateOfAffairs | May 17, 2008, 12:11 am 12:11 am
Keep posting Emily…you’re the only one who obviously researches (unlike dead-in-the-head Fred).
Posted by: Di | May 17, 2008, 12:14 am 12:14 am
Barack Obama has upheld the Democratic Party’s principle of the “Big Tent.” Clinton has put a circus in it.
Posted by: bob10001 | May 17, 2008, 12:18 am 12:18 am
Im an registered democrats, but vote for mccain on general election. I am so sick all those old dems who go behind OBAMA now, they think the can win. Our family would vote for mccain, unless if hillary is a nominee,
Posted by: tonni | May 17, 2008, 12:18 am 12:18 am
I’d like to invite Hillary supporters to join me in writing in Hillary’s name in November. If you truly believe she’s the best person for the job, then let’s give her our support in November. We’ve already lived through two terms of Bush and survived. It can’t get any worse.
Posted by: goldenstate | May 17, 2008, 12:28 am 12:28 am
I was t hinking of Votign Mccain if Obama gets the nomination but the truth is despite what the Obamabots say Hillary is undesputably ahead in the popular vote and if FL/Mi arentcounted she will have the right and the backing to go independant and in a 3 or 4 way race in November Hillary Clinton will clean Obamas clock once again… this guy and these supporters think they have it but they dont even have a clue! THe media is starting to wonder about this guy….if he loses badly in KY that will be a rebuke he cant deny no matter what Oregon does and that will be closer than NC! I am fed up with Obamabots the people who know about american history,government and the electoral process are now takign over goodbye obamasnits!
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 12:29 am 12:29 am
CJ I have no idea what Operation Turndown is but I’m assuming it’s Clinton supporters who won’t vote for Obama. Your point about Roe vs. Wade is something I’ve certainly considered but in all honesty I’m not too concerned about McCain in regards to the abortion issue. If McCain were to get in and have the opportunity to appoint a Supreme Court justice the Senate has the right to approve every nomination by a majority. Rarely do they reject a nominee but it has happened for example two of Nixon’s choices were rejected. Even if Obama does not win the Presidency I have no doubt that the Democrats will do extremely well in the November election this year. I would think an overwhelmingly Democratic Senate will be cognizant of the Roe vs. Wade issue. The make-up of the Senate is as important as the Presidency when it comes to Supreme Court Justices. If Obama were to go back to the Senate one would have to question whether he would reject such a nominee because he comes from the perspective, as do some other Senators, that the President has the right to make his own appointments. Obama approved Condoleeza and defended his approving Casey on those merits. Republican appointees are have a tendency to be more diverse then the Democratic appointees have been. An example would be on the issue of whether it was constitutional for the State to prohibit partial birth abortion all of the Democratic appointees said no and with the Republican appointees half said no and half said yes. What’s important is whether a President nominates someone who is restrained enough to just interpret law rather than change it.
McCain supports stem cell research which does not make him the darling of the pro-life groups. In fact the far right is just as concerned about McCain appointees as the Democrats are. McCain has pandered to the far right in recent years ,no doubt due to his Presidential aspirations, but issues such as abortion and gay marriage are just not his issues (his issue is foreign policy) and I would be very surprised if there were a litmus test in regards to abortion for McCain appointees, in particular since given his age he will possibly not be a two term President. I think the abortion issue will be a scare tactic used by the Obama camp towards those Clinton supporters who are contemplating jumping ship but many of your Clinton supporters are older women and while no doubt they have had a strong committment their entire adult lives to reproductive rights the abortion issue may not be what tips the scale this time in their Presidential choice. While I totally respect anyone’s choice to vote for Obama, I would hope that his younger voters take his message of “change from the bottom up” to heart and utilize their enthusiasm and energy in the most effective manner by getting involved in causes they believe in or want to maintain rather then placing all of their faith in either one individual Democrat or one individual Republican. When you look at the most important changes that have occurred in this Country, in which the young have been the benefactors of and even Obama, those changes have come from a collective of like-minded individuals who had the courage to stand on their convictions and got out and made their voices heard whether it be civil rights, women’s rights or reproductive rights, gay rights or ending a war .
Posted by: alpaig | May 17, 2008, 12:40 am 12:40 am
Voting for Hillary is not a racist act, of course. But the margin that she one in West Virginia (a margin she has not come close to in any other state) can only be explained in one way – and we have polling questions to prove it. SHAME ON WEST VIRGINIA and shame on die hard Hillary supporters that are not offended by people afraid of voting for a “Black” candidate. Keep making excuses folks. You are on the losing side of history, finally! You will look like those pics of White folks yelling at forced integration in the 50′s. We all look at them now with sadness and pity. Just wait.
Posted by: Joel Wyatt | May 17, 2008, 12:50 am 12:50 am
Operation turn-down explains why the US middle class will be extinct in four years — go for it — I am sure that the tax for the top 1% won’t impact your families –NOT!!!!!
By the way you should research “projection” While Obama may not be perfect I doubt he ever called his wife a “cxxx” in public. Look who brought Obama up — his mother – he is his mother’s child. I am sure mild mannered military McCain will be just as collaborative and empathic as Obama.. NOT!!! Talk about a low level of rational thought
Posted by: Gra | May 17, 2008, 12:53 am 12:53 am
Joel
Its not gonna happen… WVA is not racists… she won in nearly every demographic again… you will not deny us period! We will take it national as independant and beat you to piecces Obama and the surrogates suggested it was race in the beginning it was not made race by the clintons ever… Obama is an amateur and should not be president this is not about race … we will not abide reverse racism LEAVE!
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 12:56 am 12:56 am
Catleya
This thing is turning around toward Hillary .. even on the most hardcore Obama networks today they were getting a little exasperated! it was our fault to let him take advantage to begin with but we will finish this! Obama will not be president!
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 12:58 am 12:58 am
GRA
you all, and Obama himself playing up the single mother thing with obvious present day contradictions to the narrative will backfire! I guess if you hear somethign over and over enough you begin to believe it but dont you are about to be let down!
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 1:00 am 1:00 am
Those worried about every little word Obama says, well, none of them, come time to be president are going to be able to have things fall the way it’s envisioned today. What tomarrow brings is a long way off. As for barack’s arrogance, show me a leader, superstar, hero or anyone constantly in the limelight and I’ll take a little arrogance any day as it’s necessay part of a confident leader.
Posted by: Ken Berg | May 17, 2008, 1:11 am 1:11 am
I appreciate many Hillary supporters saying here that they won’t vote for Obama in the GE, and I’m one of you!!! Yes, we need to have such a tenacity to stand up strong for our belief. Hillary is the best candidate who cares deeply for the American people and has a strong record of fighting for the country. Obama is just an opportunist who promote himself by making empty promises and raising false hopes. The majority of the democratic party has been mistreating Hillary and shown no respect for her. This party’s nomination system is a joke. I can’t believe such undemocratic caucuses system actually exist! I can’t believe this party allows Obama bribe those superdelegates in order to get the nomination!!!
Screw them up! We need to pay them back and hopefully they’ll learn a big lesson in the fall.
Posted by: Cici | May 17, 2008, 1:14 am 1:14 am
It is politics folks. Here is how it works. Someone wins, someone looses, then they compromise.
This blog sounds like the Congress and the White House where nothing has been accomplished in 8 years.
Might be that couple hundred of you will carry through maybe even a couple of thousand, so what?; it will make no difference. The only thing you will accomplish is remaining angry.
Obama08
Posted by: Thinking | May 17, 2008, 1:24 am 1:24 am
Awesome aall the super delegates should step up and be counted so we can unite the party and start the process or Reclaiming America.
Vote OBAMA 2008
Posted by: Lou | May 17, 2008, 1:29 am 1:29 am
Anne and Cici are dead on and all you Obama snots will be very sorry because either in the nomination process or the GE Obama will be soundly defeated the SD do not have to go with popular vote .. and that argument is moot because Hillary will have the popular vote! and Hillary can and will crush you in a GE 3 or 4 way matchup… theyve done the numbers, theyve had it planned all along and all you young, and rich elitist obamasnobs will pay and cry in the end believe me it will happen!
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 1:30 am 1:30 am
Fakebama
you may say that and Mr $400 haircut breck boy.. isnt going to reverse the working class vote for Obama
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 1:59 am 1:59 am
Anne
Im not sure Freud or any psychologist can help Obama and his Obamateam
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 2:01 am 2:01 am
catleya
yea did you see the medias fake surprise today abotu the women taking out a full page ad in USA Today.they didnt know peopel could be this fed up with a subverted process!
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 2:03 am 2:03 am
are you guys real? You would sell your freedom for anger? Boy am I glad I am an Independent. Are group has been waiting for a change in Washington. I guess you are telling me that if you don’t get your way I might as well stay home? Is this what you want? Is Mrs. Clinton more important then America? Is Obama the most important? I am sick of this when you all grow up let me know. Until then we can be at war another 4 to 8 years, you can pay higher taxes so the rich get richer and the middle class moves to a point they don’t exist. OK as long as you like others making your decisions I will go along with that. Thanks
Posted by: Independent | May 17, 2008, 2:07 am 2:07 am
Are you better off today then you were in 2000? In 2004? Is America better off? Be careful how you answer, your phone is being tapped and, on the say so of the executive branch, poof, you’re gone. Remember, the Republicans have kept you safe from abortions and from being forced to marry a homosexual and made sure that you can say “under God” in the Pledge of Allegiance. So, as you give up your home because of the unregulated mortgage industry, show your appreciation and Vote Republican. It Can’t Get Any Worse!
Posted by: thebob.bob | May 17, 2008, 2:09 am 2:09 am
Independant
Hillary or Mccain no other candidate will do!
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 2:10 am 2:10 am
thebob
it maybe cannot get any worse but Obama will not do any better! accusing Clinton and now Mccain aof what he himself is doing is farsical at best!
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 2:12 am 2:12 am
When Hillary had a protester at one of her meetings waving a sign, the Secret Service frog marched him out of the building and intimidated him for forty five minutes. Obama was pretty cool about this.
For the angry Hillary supporters, I have a suggestion. How about if all of you get together and make a list of everything that Obama has done that you feel was hurtful to Hillary personally, including his official surrogates on news shows. We’ll do the same about Hillary and her official surrogates. But neither side gets to count unofficial supporters who the candidate has no control over. Then we submit our lists to a neutral judging panel to decide who was more unkind/negative. We decide before hand what the loser has to do to make it up to the winner, but it can’t be government policy. That’s for elections. The prize might be eating a humble pie. Or doing the other’s yard work. Or something else that just gives recognition for the humiliations suffered. Think about it.
Posted by: karela | May 17, 2008, 2:18 am 2:18 am
ok let me state the facts. My choice is Obama or McCain do the math. You Democrats have some strange rules. I don’t understand them, but I am pretty good at math.
Do you have any unity in your party or is Hillary owed the nomination? Like I say you need to explain the rules? so you I take it are willing to torpedo your own candidate just to wait four years and see if you can get Hillary elected in 2012? By then the rules will change.
Posted by: Independent | May 17, 2008, 2:48 am 2:48 am
I don’t understand fill me in are you willing to give up your freedom to get a woman elected? Is this that important?
Posted by: Independent | May 17, 2008, 2:54 am 2:54 am
are you voting for a woman or a President? Are you willing to let a party that has nothing to run on win the White House? and if she doesn’t win in 2012 then what? Why have parties? That is the reason I left the party during the Regan years.
Posted by: Independent | May 17, 2008, 2:57 am 2:57 am
right on magda!!! that is why hillary should run as an independent, or all of us write her in on the ballat . we don’t want a bigot in office.
Posted by: carlasue | May 17, 2008, 2:58 am 2:58 am
Hillary ran and lost do you think she is going to run as an Independent?
Posted by: Independent | May 17, 2008, 3:04 am 3:04 am
do you guys do your homework? Do you read about where they stand on the issues? Hillary and Obama are not far apart? I don’t understand your brand of politics? you all revert to name calling? Do you think the numbers will change if you call names and say give me my toys I am going home if I can’t have my way? Is Hillary that much better? She couldn’t run her campaign? If she had run a good campaign then I think she might of won?
Posted by: Independent | May 17, 2008, 3:11 am 3:11 am
I could care less what McGovern thinks. Obviously, his ideas were rejected many years ago…he is wrong to back Obama because he has not won important swing states where he outspent Hillary 3 and 4 to 1. If he can’t beat Hillary under those circumstances, then pray tell how is he going to beat McCain in those conservative-leaning states? Whether it’s race or lack of experience, or sleazy and outrageous associations with Rezko and Wright, whatever, Obama possesses many negatives which could easily bring on his defeat. Hillary has all the necessary ingredients, except that she is a woman and this makes her iffy…but she, of all the candidates in the whole race, knows what it is like to be in the White House. She has advised a sitting president and she has demonstrated over and over again in debate after debate that she can handle the job on Pennsylvania Ave.
Posted by: Two-cats | May 17, 2008, 3:15 am 3:15 am
Carlasue
I have been on here since the Obamabots complained that ABC was biased against Obama in the last debate that is as dumb as it gets! Obama shouldve been run out of the race a longt ime ago and run out of the senate on a rail… he hasnt done anything and would be powerless to do anything as president… Democracy will not be subverted… Hillary will be back and will win and justice will prevail!
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 3:21 am 3:21 am
I repeat again I am no part of your party. I looked into the Rezko charges and Obama is not there. I don’t understand this gotya politics. What has happened to issues? Rev. Wright has a right to lead his church in his way. He has done may good things for his Country. How are you to judge Obama by his minister? Have you looked into Hillary and the people she meets with in Washington. So she meets with them. Do you have a problem with Hagee or Parsley? or is this a race thing? I am white male Independent and am not swayed by character assassination. I guess we have parted ways when politics becomes more of a caracter issues then one of our freedoms or what is best for our Country? I guess we are a lost cause.
Posted by: Independent | May 17, 2008, 3:23 am 3:23 am
Hillary didn’t loose, yet.
It would be fun if she run as an independent but I don’t believe she would do that.
It’s not about a woman. It’s about the woman, it’s about the candidate that I believe would be the best for the job. Putting a woman on Obama’s ballot would not help him, it’d probably hurt him.
I am an independent Hillary supporter and I don’t like the dems nomination process.
Posted by: magda | May 17, 2008, 3:23 am 3:23 am
Democratsunited
you Obamabots are united as one… and no one will join you… there is no argument you can make the general public who know the gavity of elections and their meaning and what the constitution says about said elections etc … and how the DNC is going along with the “50 state strategy” that will not win Obama 5 states nationally in the GE! We will not permit this anymore… we the responsible electorate that have made our voices heard will prevail and put your ill dfated aspirations to rest once and for all!
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 3:25 am 3:25 am
Magda
the clinton people already did the math on the Clinton indepenxdant run and she olls the best … way over the top in fact in that scenario… these Obamaphiles wont know what hit them… and they deserve it if they didnt learn the process!
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 3:27 am 3:27 am
american vet
we are not republicans… we are mad as hell true democrats and independants that will not permit this subversion.. Hillary will be given the nomination by the SD’s at the convention or she will go independant and slam both Obama and Mccain… you better believe it will happen… I suggest you not interfere!
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 3:30 am 3:30 am
well I have to be honest. I will vote for Hillary or Obama as they are the closest to my issues. I will not bite off my nose to spite my face. I just don’t understand your party. ncdem and magda McCain has nothing to run on. to vote for him is a vote against my children and grandchildren
Posted by: Independent | May 17, 2008, 3:30 am 3:30 am
Two-Cats,
First of all, I am going to assume that you are an intelligent person because your post did not contain the insane dribble and useless Obama bashing that normally pops up on these boards.
Now, to address some of your points.
First of all, it is grossly offensive to concentrate your battles in only the swing states. Its offensive to the rest of the states. We live in the United States of America. Not the United “Big” STates, or the United “SWING” States. Hillary made this mistake before and it cost her the nomination. She only focused on the big States. I would also add that states like New York, California and Michigan are True Blue States. There is no reason to believe that those states will not vote for the nominee of the party as they have in the past.
Secondly, You bring up all of Obama’s negatives, saying that the republicans will use that against him. Why do you fail to acknowledge the entire host of Clinton negatives? Did you know that the GOP was rallying a massive attack machine specifically designed to take down Hillary? They even had a nice smear movie that was going to be released. It was called, “Hillary, The movie”. The point is, No one is perfect. No matter who the nominee was going to be, the GOP would have found something – anything to use against them.
McCain has his share of problems that will be surfacing soon. He has already been caught up in lies. His lobbyist campaigners have some extremely bad ties and he too, has some pastor bigotry problems. They are about to be unleashed on him soon.
If we are to beat the GOP machine, we have to be United, Not divided.
Posted by: DemocratsUnited | May 17, 2008, 3:32 am 3:32 am
Independant
there are a majority of democrats who say they will not vote for Obama and therefore he will not become president but if the process is subverted you better believe we will elect mccain to keep Obama out!
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 3:32 am 3:32 am
ncdem,
Do you think she is ready to do that?
That’ll be awesome.
Posted by: magda | May 17, 2008, 3:39 am 3:39 am
I can not believe that you ncdem would cast great pain on our Country for selfish reasons? Are you telling me 300 million people must suffer for your righteousness? are you serious? you can’t be that small minded.
Posted by: Independent | May 17, 2008, 3:39 am 3:39 am
Democratsunited
we are going to beat the GOP machine and you will not be a part of the process!
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 3:40 am 3:40 am
Independant
riteousness it is and not just myself… we will not permit it if someone doesnt speak up I will… this man Obama cannot become president anyway
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 3:42 am 3:42 am
ncdem,
First, let me ask, does the NC in your name mean Nort Carolina? You must have been hurt when that state went heavily for Obama.
Second. Obama is polling well in a lot of states — including some of those red states that Democrats have problems winning. He may not win most of thos swing states, but some of the other state will be turning blue.
I know that there is nothing I can say that will convince you, but the voters have spoken.
Third, your assertion that Hillary will run as an independant is not only false, but simply outrageous!!! Lieberman tried that same tactic and look where that got him. She has PROMISED to compaign for Obama should he win the nomination. That would be another one of her LIES if she ran as an indy wouldn’t it?
Then, she would have NONE of her support from the DNC and would have to return any money that was raised for her through the DNC. Het big DNC donors would cut her off and would sue her to get their money back because that thought they were contributing to a democrat–not an independant. Given how broke her campaign is already, she would be forced to use her own money.
Naww, she will be a good democrat and campaign for Obama when she loses. Plain and Simple.
Posted by: DemocratsUnited | May 17, 2008, 3:43 am 3:43 am
Have you done any research on Hillary? I suggest you do before you try to subvert the process. Think …. that would do us all some good
Posted by: Independent | May 17, 2008, 3:45 am 3:45 am
DMK
yes we must do something liek that to show we are serious…at least the obama people think they are right and have pages of useless talking points but we know we are right!
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 3:46 am 3:46 am
independant
all you have done is research on on Hillary to subvert the process… dont say what you are doign then blame us.. it will not be stood for anymore!!!!
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 3:48 am 3:48 am
Carlasue
absolutely none of the people on the extememes of democracy want change because it will hurt them financially … Gore tried to be populist but the republicans called him sortof a pansy… now they are being queit in hopes that Obama gets elected thats not gonna happen! nobody but real centrists want real change and its not just a slogan
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 3:51 am 3:51 am
SO NCDEM,
how will you beat the GOP Machine??
Also, you are lying when you say that democrats will not vote for Obama. Why does he poll better than Clinton in every single National Poll released? WHy does the national polls show Obama beating McCain from 2 to 7 points? I am sorry, but your logic is flawed.
Furthermore, What is your problem? DO you have a problem with democracy? Why can’t you accept that more people voted for Obama and that’s that? That is the American Principle in which this COuntry was founded. Where was all this outrage when Bush stole the election in the year 2000? Democracy has taken its course, and when you Include Michigan and Florida, Clinton will still be behind, with no chance of catching up according to a recent AP article.
SO, I ask, if the people have spoken, what is your problem?
Posted by: DemocratsUnited | May 17, 2008, 3:51 am 3:51 am
ncdem,
you are right. people are afraid of change. but in the long run it would not hurt them finacially because hillary would choose to save the working class and poor from higher taxes and expenses. i know what you are saying….gore, and kerry tried what we are talking about…but they didn’t quite make their mark. hillary nails it right on the head.
if obama gets elected the dem nom, watch out everyone…our economy and world respect will go down the toilet.
Posted by: carlasue | May 17, 2008, 3:55 am 3:55 am
Independant
nah thats just what the Obamafiles told you to say!
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 3:57 am 3:57 am
tj, dmk, you guys know what you are talking about. it is simply about values in our country. they have all benn lost through the bush years. dmk, i also wrote the ‘great’ dean and expressed my opinion as well. obama does NOT represent the backbone of what america is. hillary does. and that is why i am standing beside her all the way. thanks.
Posted by: carla sue | May 17, 2008, 4:00 am 4:00 am
DMK
Good for you… yeah Iand I know what you mean about Dean I dont think he read a letter that countless Hillary delegates sent to him about Mi and FL but the DNC has organiztional rules but they cant subvert the constitution and anyway Hillary still beats Obama in their rules if the superdelegates do their real duty as an independant judgement.
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 4:02 am 4:02 am
carlasue
because Obama walks and talks like a democrat but everything everything is tongue in cheek because he never really was that impoverished!
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 4:04 am 4:04 am
guys, can we really count on the supers to do their job? this is what i find so heart breaking. i don’t think they do. they are almost like a herd of sheep following the leader, and believe me, edwards is not the leader.
i want to hear and hear loudly, the voices of michigan and florida in this election. we are not a democaratic society, process, and election, withouth all 50 (not 57) states being counted and heard.
Posted by: carlasue | May 17, 2008, 4:07 am 4:07 am
Carlasue,DMK,TJ etc I think we all ought to be delegates demand to be delegates to the Dem convention or some other exibit of democracy for the republic! I will write a letter to Dean too but it might be more influential to show up!
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 4:08 am 4:08 am
DMK,
The link YOU pointed me to not only shows Obama ahead of Clinton, It shows Obama beating McCain by 4 points. What are you talking about?
Its your choice not to believe polls, but it is what it is. Obama has enough support TODAY to beat McCain–at leats in popular vote. So, I fail to see your point.
Posted by: DemocratsUnited | May 17, 2008, 4:10 am 4:10 am
ncdem, right on. if you are going to talk the talk you better walk the damn walk! obama cannot do that. he is a hypocrite to society and the democratic party with all that has come out about him. shame on you obama. you are not about truth, and justice, you are about advancing yourself, and self-serving opportunity for your own satisfaction. shame, shame, shame.
Posted by: carlasue | May 17, 2008, 4:11 am 4:11 am
ncdem, hell yeah, i will be a delgate. and believe me brother, i have a whole lot of relatives in the states of iowa and wisconsin that wish they could recind their votes, take them back, and vote for hillary. if all of what obama was and is came out when it should have, this election, and primaries would have been decided by a landslide. guaranteeeeeeeeeed.
Posted by: carlasue | May 17, 2008, 4:16 am 4:16 am
Democrats United, I fail to understand your use of the term, offensive. I am not discounting any blue states. I assume that they will vote Democratic but it is possible some of them may not. I focus on the swing states because we have to win them or the game is up. Period. There is no reason to believe that any of the red states will go for Obama, the states where he got most of those popular votes he likes to brag about. Those states are going to McCain. That leaves the swing states and I don’t see him winning there when he can’t even beat Hillary spending 3 and 4 to 1.
As for Hillary’s negatives, I know that many people don’t like her or trust her; however, that didn’t stop them from preferring her in the swing states. Plus, there is no conceivable reason to believe that the people who hate Clinton are going to like Obama any better. In fact, they are already showing how much they dislike him by their votes (remember W. Virginia) and in the comments you are reading here.
Posted by: Two-cats | May 17, 2008, 4:17 am 4:17 am
Carlasue and NCDem,
Uhh, Clinton was never Impoverished, and neither was McCain. In fact, Cinsy McCain is worth over 100 million Dollars. The Clintons have made that much in the past 7 years.
Obama may be rich now, but he was not Always rich– with him having to use Student Loans to go to College.
Posted by: DemocratsUnited | May 17, 2008, 4:18 am 4:18 am
Oh, and don’t worry. FL and MI will have their delegates seated. But, they will be seated in a manner that does not change the outcome of the election—Not like they cpuld now, anyway.
Posted by: DemocratsUnited | May 17, 2008 4:15:08 AM
LOL… Do you realize how stupid you are?? You just proved something: the election outcome was predetermined! You just said it: But, they will be seated in a manner that does not change the outcome of the election. A Change we can believe in!
Posted by: DMK | May 17, 2008, 4:18 am 4:18 am
DEMOCRATS UNITED…some of what you say is true to fact. but please listen here….the GOP already has their strategy lined up against obama. they don’t have a leg to stand on against hillary. change is a common word that is not always welcome, especially in a manufacturing enviornment. trust me i know. we need a president that can stand up to that dumb mc’can’t, and lead the world to peace, and our country to prosperity once again!!! just like in the 90′s when bill had office. go hillary…..
Posted by: carlasue | May 17, 2008, 4:35 am 4:35 am
horray to Hillary supporter….show obama how brave you are because he’s not brave but a wimp. If he is weaker than hillary and his wife, then that gotta make you wonder hiis weakness.
Posted by: hannah | May 17, 2008, 4:39 am 4:39 am
DemocratsUnited
You also need to keep in mind that there is only 27 percent of the electorate that is registered Republican. McCain is having trouble bringing his base together. The Dems picked up seats in LA, MS, and IL in the off elections. Rendall has said that any Dem will win Pen. Ohio, and Texas had Republicans crossing over to vote to keep the Democratic race going in hopes that the two candidates would cause major damage and the Republicans could walk in. I think they called this the Limbaugh factor.
McCain has a campaign staff filled with lobbyists. He has nothing to run on but fear. I don’t think this is going to work this time.
Posted by: Independent | May 17, 2008, 4:40 am 4:40 am
DemocratsUnited, John Kerry tried to win every state he could and failed. He focused on the blue states and the swing states because that is the only place where he had any hope of winning. The 50-state strategy is a campaign magician’s trick designed to inspire Obama supporters so that they do not lose morale when the candidate loses important states. I do not believe it is possible to win any of the red states. It would be wonderful if South Dakota broke out of the red zone but that is not really likely. I think I remember that Wyoming was supposed to be changing. That state hardly had enough Democrats to make any kind of a showing in their caucus even though it was well attended by the few Democrats who live in the state. There is hope and optimism and then there is reality…the red states will stay red and the blue will remain blue. That leaves the swing states and Obama did not do well in them.
Posted by: Two-cats | May 17, 2008, 4:44 am 4:44 am
Carlasue,
I understand what you are saying. I do. My stepfather in Chicago was laid off plenty of times from several jobs, due to them being “outsourced”.
But, don’t believe that the GOP can’t attack Hillary. You have to understand. NO ONE SAW OBAMA COMING. The GOP has been preparing for War against Hillary for the past two years. They have been designing a machine specifically to take down Hillary, which included a movie, called “Hillary, the Movie”, because they thought she was who they would be up against. I will admit that they are working out the kinks and retuning the machine for Obama.
Hillary and her ataff have also been preparing to take on the GOP. Maybe that’s why they slept on Obama. They were looking too far ahead into the General. But, whats done is done. These two forces and their supporters have to stand United. With the machine and organization that Obama has built, the GOP will not stand a chance.
Posted by: DemocratsUnited | May 17, 2008, 4:46 am 4:46 am
The Limbaugh factor is an excuse for losing.
Posted by: Two-cats | May 17, 2008, 4:46 am 4:46 am
technically two cats you must remember Gore and Kerry lost only by the rigging of the vote. That is why they are registering over 1 million new voters. You can not rig a landslide.
The Republicans are worried. With things looking like + 30 seats in the House and a + 6 to 8 in the Senate they are rattled. That is why they are hijacking the blogs trying to put as much negative out as they can.
Posted by: Independent | May 17, 2008, 4:49 am 4:49 am
indenpedent- what? when did Texas become a swing state?? It’s a red state, BRIGHT RED!!
two-cats – I do agree with you. Red states will remain red and blue stays blue so the matter is the swing states. And obama surely haven’t shown as a favorite.
Posted by: hannah | May 17, 2008, 4:49 am 4:49 am
Texas is not a swing state but Obama is within 4 points and the primary isn’t over yet. Wouldn’t that make you nervous?
Posted by: Independent | May 17, 2008, 4:52 am 4:52 am
Two-Cats,
Obama did well in Pnnsylvannia. He just didn’t win. He did Very well in Indiana, but was a few thousand votes shy of winning. Obama won Missouri, which is a Swing State, BTW. He didn’t do well in Florida, but he did not campaign there. He is polling a little better down there now, though McCain is
polling better.
Oh, and don’t say that red states don’t change blue. California changed Blue. yes, it did use to be red. So did Illinois, an ex red state. The dems lost Texas to the GOP some time ago, but all Obama has to do is spend a little more time with Latinos and I’ll bet you he can flip Texas, looking at the current General Election poll numbers.
The point is, Obama has never let anyone tell him what he can’t do. I am from Illinois. I wrote a letter to him, urging him NOT to run in late 2006 when the rumors started circulating that he was contemplating running. I did this because I, too felt he was inexperienced and that I did not want to have to choose between Him and Hillary. But, he did anyway and to my surprise, he is winning the nomination. If Obama says he can do it, He will do it.
Posted by: DemocratsUnited | May 17, 2008, 4:57 am 4:57 am
Independent, The last poll I looked at had McCain leading Obama something like 53 to 39 in Texas. Texas is still red!
Posted by: Two-cats | May 17, 2008, 4:58 am 4:58 am
he was undeclared until last week. got a lot of good things off the site. for both candidates.
electoral-vote is another GREAT site. There you will find a map used by a lot of news sorces that covers President, Senate, and House seats. also links to many different websites. I guess some of you haven’t done your homework.
Posted by: Independent | May 17, 2008, 4:59 am 4:59 am
Independent – come on, the last time i remember texas is blue is when JFK asked Johnson to be his vice so that he could carry texas. Even when Pres Clinton is very popular and won by landslide in 1994, he still didn’t win Texas. What make me nervous?? we’re just discussing here. why would that make me nervous?? you’re a little weird thinking we’re all republicans posting here.
Posted by: hannah | May 17, 2008, 4:59 am 4:59 am
Democrats United, If Obama is our nominee, I hope you are right. However, we must agree to disagree…I think Hillary is the stronger candidate!
Posted by: Two-cats | May 17, 2008, 5:01 am 5:01 am
hi democrats united. here i am again. i live in missouri. i can tell you obama won by one delegate. if that. missouri is a swing state, true, a bellwether state, yes, but damn it, i am tired of missouri, my state, slanting toward the damn republicans. it is about time they recognize, see, and acknowledge that times are hard, the economy is bad, and this is the real kicker……it is REALLY bad here in the show me state. thanks.
Posted by: carlasue | May 17, 2008, 5:01 am 5:01 am
sorry i mean clinton in 1996 (not 94). he seems to shrug off Virginia and Kentucky because he knows that he doesn’t do well, well, when it comes in november, he’ll realize how much he needs these states. I don’t know about michigan but there’s no chance obama is going to carry Florida, not to mention that he’s to blame for their vote counted, but Florida has becoming more red than blue. They have had republican governors and these governors are pretty popular in florida. Anyway, this discussion really gets no where because we’ll just have to see.
Posted by: hannah | May 17, 2008, 5:05 am 5:05 am
Carlasue
Im sure that it has been said to Obama in ptivate by non other than Hillary herself even when she was the front runner… these Obamabots got greedy they thought if Bush can do it they can… and maybe they got some help thats the false “republicans on these sites” they talk about they have about 10 thousand alabis for this and that but none will work!
Posted by: ncdem | May 17, 2008, 5:07 am 5:07 am
two cats and DemocratsUnited check out the site you will get alot of information you can’t get bouncing around these sites. You need to give it a try. You will also be surprised the the Super Delegate is on the Rules committee. I may have said more then I should of but take my word for it you will get a lot of GOOD information at both sites.
Posted by: Independent | May 17, 2008, 5:11 am 5:11 am
democrats united….thanks for your kind words as well. we may agree to disagree, but we still rejoice in this thing called freedom of speech. i don’t really know if obama grew up impoverished or not…i did. but that is not the issue. i just want someone to understand how it is to be that way, weather they have been or not.
i truly understand what you mean about people posting hate messages under your name. it has been done to me…and believe me, i thought i was going to be dead hanging from a tree the next day. or whatever means of killing me they thought of.
if obama gets the nom, the only way he can truly win is having hillary on the ticket. she is a fighter, and he would acknowledge that. i truly want hillary to win, not just because i am a woman, and by the way i don’t wear pantsuits, i wear jeans and t-shirts to work, as i work in a factory, i think hillary is the strongest to defeat mac’can’t.
Posted by: carlasue | May 17, 2008, 5:13 am 5:13 am
Democrats – don’t even worry about someone fake your ID because I’ve seen that happened before and I was able to tell that is a different person so whomever you were talking to, i’m sure they know it wasn’t you. I do agreed that it has been amazing how much money obama has raised but don’t forget that was before issues such wright and cling to guns. He still has so much trouble some demographic traditional democrat voters. If McCain doesn’t get his share of these voters, then obama will win the nomination.
Posted by: hannah | May 17, 2008, 5:15 am 5:15 am
Carlasue,
You are right about Missouri. I have been there several times. There is a culture war breing between rural conservatives and St. Louis County liberals. Its just like my Home State of Illinois. You have the very liberal Chicagoans vs. the very no-nothing conservatives in central and southern Illinois. The younger people in Southern Illinois are more progressive that their older parents. That’s why Rod Blagojevich was the first democratic Governor elected here in the past 30 years.
Speaking of which, I here that democratic Sen Claire McCaskill of Missouri won by a nose.
Posted by: DemocratsUnited | May 17, 2008, 5:15 am 5:15 am
democrats united..thanks. missouri is a battle of urban v rural. i have lived here over 25 years.
we need to live in a country where peace and prosperity conquer all. the clintons have proved they can do that. the bush administration has sunk us all in a deeper hole everytime. i would more than welcome the clintons back in the wh. it would mean gaining back world respect, prosperity, a boombing economy, and jobs and a roof over all of our heads. gas would be cheaper too.
Posted by: carlasue | May 17, 2008, 5:25 am 5:25 am
Carlasue – i mean seriously, i don’t understand the intention of these media attacked Clinton. I have never seen any mediators treated Clinton they way they did. Especially Tim Russert (ughh, i really h*te this guy), he literally jumped and slapped Hillary in the face in the debate. This has happened throughout all the debates she has. Then obama cannot even take 1 hard debate with ABC. It does make me mad when I think about it. I was going to vote for McCain (for being brave as a war hero and fight against his own party) then seeing how tough Hillary is, I decided to vote for her. But now, I am going back to McCain because Hillary is not the nominee. And no, i will not write down her name because I have to prevent obama being the president.
Posted by: hannah | May 17, 2008, 5:25 am 5:25 am
well ncdem facts are facts depends on if you want to read them. I gave you two great sites with lots of information I guess you are just in denile
Posted by: Independent | May 17, 2008, 5:27 am 5:27 am
Democrat – i know you despise republicans but obama brought wright issue upon himself not republicans. And comparing mccain’s pastor to obama’s pastor is absurd because mccain doesn’t attend the church over 20years nor call his pastor “spiritual advisors” or put him in high positions of the campaign. obama’s relationship to wright is like a father that he never had.
Posted by: hannah | May 17, 2008, 5:32 am 5:32 am
hannah, and ncdm, first hannah. thanks. i dont understand the media attacks against hillary either. i am not going to sit here and say they did it just because she is a woman. that would be biased. i turly believe that hillary can out debate obama and mac’cant on any day of the week.
ncdm. keep fighting. you are the best of the best. hang in there brother. we have had to battle the idiots of idiots, davis, jen, commander guy, and all the other republican, left wing idiots out there that oppose our true beliefs. the hard working middle class like us, and i can attest to that, deserve a president that thinks of us and wants to reward our hard efforts for keeping the manufacturing plants open and alive. after all, that is the backbone of the strength of our country.
Posted by: carlasue | May 17, 2008, 5:35 am 5:35 am
when the wright thing went down your own super delegate stated that wasn’t going to hurt him. NcDem ya got to do what ya got to do. I raised three children on my own and have lived on food stamps myself. I remember making 5.30 an hour. I went through two surgeries from a military injury and am medically retired. so I guess I should bow to McCain the problem is he wants more wars not fewer. Like I said Hillary or Obama works for me.
McCain has turned his back on me and my brothers. He voted against the GI BILL although I guess you wouldn’t understand.
Posted by: Independent | May 17, 2008, 5:38 am 5:38 am
Partly because she’s a woman. she tried to do the healthcare when was the first lady and that got alot or mostly men hating her (some democrats and mostly republicans). I know she has her faults but her toughness is beyond obama. She has been exposed and tested even with bad things and she kept on fighting to prove but democrats just don’t see it. They jump on the wagon with obama, whom will get exposed again before the election. even republicans start to admire the fight Clinton is taking with her own party.
Posted by: hannah | May 17, 2008, 5:44 am 5:44 am
democrats united…you may be right about the iowa contest. in fact, you are. but i will say this sir, with all due respect, i was born and raised there with over half of my family stll there living in the northeast part of the state. they all voted for obama. that was fine then, but this is now. i speak to my relatives weekly, and i cannot tell you how much they regret their vote. they are almost jumping up and down screaming for the opportunity to change their minds like the supers have the right to do. what a shame. like i said, i was born and raised in iowa, i live in missouri, and my goodness…..the changes of minds i have heard over the last 5 months.
Posted by: carlasue | May 17, 2008, 5:46 am 5:46 am
Carlasue,
I am sorry to here that about your family. They should not let issues like Wright or the bitter comment affect their opinions about the man. Nothing in Obama’s past has shown that he remotely believes the same things that Wright does. NOTHING. Obams lived in rural America when he was in Kansas. He said he misspoke when he made the CLinging statement and I believe him. Just like you believe CLinton when she said she misspoke or misremembered the Bosnia Incidents. And I’m sure that if you and your family believe that she does not share the same views of her Husband, whom received 800,000 dollars from the Columbian government for giving a speech in favor of free trade, why is it so hard to believe that Obama does not share the same political (not spiritual) views as his former pastor?
Posted by: DemocratsUnited | May 17, 2008, 6:01 am 6:01 am
Carlasue,
Good Night and sweet dreams
Posted by: DemocratsUnited | May 17, 2008, 6:03 am 6:03 am
Democrats – I’ve watched and listened to all (the whole thing) sermons there are availabe about wright. there are a lot of things he said are true. But what is wrong is nothing he said good about this country and if he reminds people of Niroshima but not pearl harbor then that’s wrong too. As an immigrant, I’ve learned to lvoe this country and will never leave it. I may not understand how Blacks feel but I will live and die in America. I’m sadden to see many liberals who take this country for granted because they haven’t seen how people on the other side of earth live.
I still do believe there’s American Dreams. Maybe I’m more conservative than I thought I am but in this country, if you works hard, you will get better. I mean my parents don’t even speak English and have been working in factories (meat-packing and auto parts) and they do alot better than some Americans. it’s because they’re willing to work 7days and 12hours a day when the plants offer them overtime.
Posted by: hannah | May 17, 2008, 6:08 am 6:08 am
Amazing with how many people wish they can take their vote back, after voting for obama. Some think he is the peoples choice.
We do not want Obama as a nominee or president.
The majority of the people have said that.
Those wish to jump on the obama bandwagon because they think he is winning are not want America needs or wants in a nominee or president.
He has proven over and over again, he is not fit to be preisdent. By what he says and does.
The Democratis voters need to Banned together and vote the DNC and Super Delegates out of office, for their stupidity and going against the people.
That is something that needs done.
The DNC and super Delegates playing god and political fixer with this election is uncalled for. Refusing to listen and count all the people for this election is unforgiving.
Say hell no to Obama and those forcing him upon this country.
Do it for America!
Posted by: seah | May 17, 2008, 6:11 am 6:11 am
Seah,
It is so funny how you talk about people who regret voting for Obama.
I have heard from a mass amount of people that regret voting for Clinton.
But to put everything in perspective, Obama is still ahead of Clinton in the polls, so their must not be too much regret out there.
Posted by: DemocratsUnited | May 17, 2008, 6:30 am 6:30 am
ncdem,
Hillary and Obama will win with the SAME constituencies. That is the problem with the democratic party. We are talking about who can win with what constituencies when we should not EVEN BE HAVING THIS divisive converstion. We should be more focused of Party Unity no matter who the nominee is. There were a lot upset dean supporters wh swore they would not vote for Kerry, so Dean had to campaign hard for Kerry to bring in his supporters.
This is why it is always BAD to have a prolonged nomination fight. Hillary should have ended this thing after she won Texas, so that she goes out on a high note and focused on party Unity. With a prolonged fight, feelings get bruised and hurt, and the bitterness (gasp!!!!) carries into the general election. I say Hillary (not Obama) should have dropped out because it became clear that she would not win the delegates needed after her Texas and Ohio Win, in which she only netterd 4 delegates for the night. It was the first election night of the campaign that she walked away with more delegates.
When she won New Hampshire, her and Obama split the delegates. When she won Nevada, Obama actually won one more delegate than her. On Super Tueeday, Obama netted about 10 more delegates than Clinton altogether. Then came the 11 contest blowout that pushed Clinton so far behind, she could not catch up.
Posted by: DemocratsUnited | May 17, 2008, 6:41 am 6:41 am
Democrat party ‘s screwing up itself.
Sen McCain-08
Posted by: The truth | May 17, 2008, 7:31 am 7:31 am
- i want to vote democractic – howver, if obama is the nominee – no – he has no experience, michelle obama’s “first time proud quote”, the bitter quote, and 20 yrs at rev wirght’s churuch – and the only person i believe who spoke the truth was rev wright when he said “barack is a politician – politicians do what they have to” – so unforturnately it is McCain 08 for me.. and thank you DNC for picking the weaker candidate…
Posted by: sokadija | May 17, 2008, 7:38 am 7:38 am
Isn’t it a little more than curious that Obama talks about being a Washington outsider and wanting to bring a fresh view to Washington, but is surrounding himself with the good old boy, Washington insiders like Kennedy, McGovern, Kerry. What have they done in Congress to earn our respect after all these years?
Posted by: glenn mcgahee | May 17, 2008, 8:04 am 8:04 am
I think Mccain will be president why would Kennedy and Pelosi split the base is my question what is the pay off for them.
Posted by: Bishop | May 17, 2008, 8:14 am 8:14 am
I decided to post the afore mentioned article, simply because I think voters have a right to know the truth and decide, without media bias, always gunning to negate Hillary’s campaign race…she is the best qualified candidate and the ONLY candidate to win the GE and become the First Woman President!
GO HILLARY
Posted by: Di | May 17, 2008, 8:15 am 8:15 am
First she blames a Black Man; then she says he can’t win the white vote; then she blames the DNC; then she blames men in general; now she blames the media.
When is she going to accept responsibility for her failures?
Isn’t this the same kind of polarization we have seen from her with her healthcare thing under Bill?
She unstable, and unable to get a grip on reality.
Posted by: Thinking | May 17, 2008, 8:23 am 8:23 am
Thinking… Oh Lord.. Thinking is back OR was that you last night, DemocratsUnited? LOL
READ THE ARTICLE ABOVE POSTED BY Di, AND EDUCATE YOURSELF.. OBVIOUSLY YOU ARE NOT THINKING CLEARLY.. Its not enough to just think!
Posted by: DMK | May 17, 2008, 8:25 am 8:25 am
Comparing to the heckling suffered by Chelsea, Bill and Hillary, this is just small matter.
Educated supporter; they aren’t.
Hillary supporter; you are brave. My heart goes with you.
As to McGovern and BO, birds of the same feather flocks together.
Posted by: John_Lai | May 17, 2008, 8:26 am 8:26 am
Interesting to hear Obama make such a strikingly Republican argument: to the man with the sign, consider the effect your entitlement has on your neighbors! Finally, a Democrat who understands the difference between micro and macroeconomics. One man stands with a sign and achieves his objective, but limits the freedom of all those around him.
Posted by: Baskin | May 17, 2008, 8:38 am 8:38 am
Obama said to the brave Clinton supporter “That’s not very nice of you”. But perhaps Obama should talk to his omnipresent thugs – on most every blog; on every message board they can sign onto all the while mocking the ones that forbid them access; their plathoric letters and phone calls; and their endless vile against the Clintons and all of Hillary’s supporters.
They are perhaps the least-informed large political group this nation has ever witnessed – - and at the very same time they are your quintessential ‘not very nice’ political operatives.
Yes?
Posted by: Bonnie | May 17, 2008, 8:42 am 8:42 am
You people are deluding yourself if you think Hillary will play the spoiler. She would ruin herself and Bill with her. There is no way she would win as an independent, and no way she could come back get the party support afterward.
Posted by: Thinking | May 17, 2008, 8:42 am 8:42 am
Joel Wyatt is absolutely correct.
These are the kind of distractions voters gravitate to every election cycle.
Racism IS alive and well, and this year racism will be THE distraction that will turn this upside down.
You already see it happening….every little thing Obama says they jump on. All the manufactured bs, they jump on. And the democrats, and women will not realize until its too late, just how stupid all this will be. These people are taking all these little non-issues and turning them into major issues to continue to give the impression its not race, but that is exactly what it is.
Nothing you can do at this point but watch it happen. It is so sad and so disappointing.
Posted by: LA in Indiana | May 17, 2008, 8:49 am 8:49 am
Hillary is not losing sometimes thing just are not how they appear. go Hillary all the way to the floor
Posted by: Bishop | May 17, 2008, 8:52 am 8:52 am
I’m sick of the racist democrats…it is time for a third party.
bill and hillary can be co-presidents of appalachia.
Posted by: LA in Indiana | May 17, 2008, 8:53 am 8:53 am
Racist democrats – what exactly did Bill and Hill do for you? Where did your states jobs go? How much improvement has there been in homelessness and poverty in your state? Exactly what programs did Bill create to help deal with those kind of problems anywhere? He is now using money that was obtained from giving speeches in countries that could be considered a conflict of interest with his wifes campaign , but that doesn’t matter, nor do the lives of the 39 people who have worked for them and have died unexplained. They are so like Huckabee with his gun remarks – what dorks.
Posted by: jozy | May 17, 2008, 9:00 am 9:00 am
This is not about race this is about people who have been waiting for Hillary to run because we think she is smart and she is part of our movement that goes back to 1968 watch Iron Jawed Angels that and the fact that Bill Clinton lifted alot of us up when he was in office.
Posted by: Bishop | May 17, 2008, 9:01 am 9:01 am
MY health care is to stay away from Dr.and I am in the business.
Posted by: Bishop | May 17, 2008, 9:18 am 9:18 am
Whatever bishop.
They can try to clean it up, but its too late, the big cat is definitely out of the bag.
Working on Obama’s campaign here in Indiana I KNOW its not all white people, because the majority of his support here comes from white people. So I know its not all. And these people, after hearing all this bs against Obama, they KNOW these are the distractions the republicans seek, and they’re not falling for it.
I work with them….a surprising (to me) number of older white women, white men, and younger white people….and yes I was surprised, but I have learned a lot by watching them….how they work, how they think. They are extremely passionate about Obama.
They know his story and his lifes work. They are not being fooled by the Wright bs, nor any other bs.
Posted by: LA in Indiana | May 17, 2008, 9:19 am 9:19 am
As we know Hillary’s
Posted by: Bishop | May 17, 2008, 9:21 am 9:21 am
Right bishop…I know hillary’s too, AND bills. I voted for him twice.
But I’m angry we have bush, and bill is part of the reason we got bush.
He disgraced OUR house, not his own.
They had 8 years in the white house, and she was first lady, not president. Its time to move on.
Posted by: LA in Indiana | May 17, 2008, 9:28 am 9:28 am
Clinton left office with a 60% ap. rate Al Gore lost his own race and Newt and the repub worked on seats for 15 years and the ones won in the south this week were won in districts Hillary won
Posted by: Bishop | May 17, 2008, 9:34 am 9:34 am
Right bishop….people are voting for bill, not hillary. I almost fell into the same trap.
A lady in Guam said she voted for hillary because she has her husband to help her…
Posted by: LA in Indiana | May 17, 2008, 9:41 am 9:41 am
I am not voting for Bill I think Hillary will be even better. I like her i support her just like you support Obama and finally will show them how to dress he always looks very daper.
Posted by: Bishop | May 17, 2008, 9:45 am 9:45 am
Seeing how the two Hillary rallies I attended not only had an Obama supporter with a sign but Obama supporters who constantly were hackling, I feel little remorse that Obama supporters got a taste of their own medicine.
Posted by: gaypastor | May 17, 2008, 9:55 am 9:55 am
Is anyone else as annoyed as I am with the AA’s constant harping on race???! Now we ALL know who’s been playing the race card………
Posted by: DMK | May 17, 2008, 10:01 am 10:01 am
The only way Hillary Clinton could get my vote is if she promised to pick up the tab for the passports, airfare and hotel bills we’ll all need as we try to get jobs overseas. But that would be pandering, right? Wonder if her supporters would hold up signs that say that!
Posted by: NAFTA | May 17, 2008, 10:03 am 10:03 am
I went to a JD dinner rally and Obama could not be there but ten minutes before Hillary came in to speak a bus load of High School kids who supportobama came in and boo her during her speech.
Posted by: Bishop | May 17, 2008, 10:05 am 10:05 am
Hey NC Hows it going read the same thing a did you hear the con. call yesterday at TM she is going all the way.
Posted by: Bishop | May 17, 2008, 10:09 am 10:09 am
DC do you remember Daddy Bush signed NAFTA in Dec of 1998 with the prime and the MEX president. and if Bush had inforced the trade laws we would not be in this mess IMO
Posted by: Bishop | May 17, 2008, 10:14 am 10:14 am
dang that should be a 92
Posted by: Bishop | May 17, 2008, 10:17 am 10:17 am
It was way cool she was really up said she is ahead in the pop.
Posted by: Bishop | May 17, 2008, 10:19 am 10:19 am
I knew me to so uneducated but well off any way
Posted by: Bishop | May 17, 2008, 10:21 am 10:21 am
I don’t know how they do it I can’t function when I go on short trips which I might make on the 31st she asked if we could to try to be at the hearing.
Posted by: Bishop | May 17, 2008, 10:25 am 10:25 am
if you vote out of spite
I hope you recognize how proud you will make your children years from now.
the country is crumbling…Mccain wants to stay an “empire”… that is not what our forefathers wanted…in fact they feared it and wrote a constitution to make sure we wouldn’t become that.
McCain has no plan… he wants to step into the Bush train and ride in the same direction…
only problem is we see the cliff coming.
It’s great when you hear the couple of Hillary supporters still on here saying “we’re with mccain Obama is a liar and a crook” “they stole the election from us” and they say they are going to get on that same train… all the while they have kids that they are going to leave that train to …that much closer to the cliff.
The train and tracks are built on policies… Hillary policies were no where close to McCain’s …but you all don’t care…you care about your anger toward someone who beat your candidate…
It is dumb, yes, dumb to vote out of spite… and an action that no future generation would be proud of.
Posted by: dl | May 17, 2008, 10:32 am 10:32 am
Well the hearing is in DC and is open to all so a friend of mine has to be in dc on the 30th might stay over big time Hill supporter also and her husband is driving up so I just might go wish I had gone for Del. this year but I didn’t the convention is going to be broadcast live all day but I guess the MSM will find some way to lie
Posted by: Bishop | May 17, 2008, 10:35 am 10:35 am
and by the way…isn’t it funny how so many voices on the Hillary side from these blogs ‘have left the building” so to speak.
It may be because most people are smart and put the country ahead of their own spiteful anger.
People are not dumb they want the country back…they know Mccain does not do that…and they are smart enough not to vote like a 5th grade fight…they vote for the country not because they are angry that their candidate lost.
Most Hillary supporters are smart and have no question they would never vote for Mccain.
The couple of voices on here just bring the rest of Hillary’s campaign down a notch. Most of her supporters are embarrassed by people who put the individual candidate ahead of the soldiers dying, the childrens healthcare, the economy, the housing crisis, the falling numbers of US supporters, the increasing numbers of terrorists who hate the US from our foreign policy…
Americans for the most part are smarter than that only when fear and spite get involved are they not.
Posted by: dl | May 17, 2008, 10:39 am 10:39 am
Bishop are you Lannie the lawyer?… or Bill O’Reilly? or sean hannity?
Because you sound like those three great Americans.
Posted by: dl | May 17, 2008, 10:41 am 10:41 am
The best thing about this “operation turndown” thing Hillary supporters are proposing is that it is a win-win for the Democratic party. We rid our party of uneducated man-haters and racists. I see this as a very, very good thing! What a great country this can be when the real Democrats unite!
Obama ’08
Posted by: faithrepost | May 17, 2008, 10:42 am 10:42 am
Hillary or McCain for White House.
No one else qualifies.
Posted by: Jkan | May 17, 2008, 10:45 am 10:45 am
jkan, you need to listen to what Hillary is saying. She says do NOT vote for mc-more-war, his polices would do further damage to the country. Hillary and Obamas’ policies are very similar. Obama will be able to clean up the mess caused by the entire bush-league. Obama 2008!!!
Posted by: pt | May 17, 2008, 10:50 am 10:50 am
TT to the Speaker of the House they know are base why would they divide us in such a year.
Posted by: Bishop | May 17, 2008, 10:50 am 10:50 am
Di wrote: “I decided to post the afore mentioned article, simply because I think voters have a right to know the truth and decide, without media bias, always gunning to negate Hillary’s campaign race…she is the best qualified candidate and the ONLY candidate to win the GE and become the First Woman President!
GO HILLARY”
Di, that was the most informative post I can recall ever having read here. Thanks so much for that very insightful info.
Hillary ’08
Posted by: rd | May 17, 2008, 10:51 am 10:51 am
This is only the first sign of his trouble. 50% of Hillary’s supporters will never vote for OB according to exit poll.
Posted by: Laura | May 17, 2008, 10:54 am 10:54 am
Hillary supporters need to get real and throw their support toward Obama. We do not need another 4 years of bush-league policies. This country cannot afford that, financially or morally. Hillary can still do a lot of good in the senate, or maybe the Supreme Court. Let’s get this clean-up started. Obama 2008 will be Great!!!
Posted by: pt | May 17, 2008, 11:01 am 11:01 am
NCDem, then you are not a true Hillary supporter. My guess is that you are a rush limbaugh right-winger that like to post to these sites thinking you will swift-boat the democrats. WON’T WORK… Obama 2008!!!
Posted by: pt | May 17, 2008, 11:11 am 11:11 am
I am a woman, a black woman and I will not vote for Hillary because she wants to MANDATE healthcare and this will only line the healthcare industry’s pockets. That would reverse ALL of the progress that has been made with regard to my household income and the ability to provide for my family. Equal pay for women and equal pay for blacks did not come to be just so the CEOs in the healthcare business can take it right back by enacting some goofy Clinton laws.
Clinton’s mandate will take money out of yours and your family’s household income. Think, people think!
Obama’s plan is much more reasonable because it is not overbearing. His approach is to make healthcare more affordable. That gives me a real choice.
If Hillary ends up with the nomination, I believe there are many voters that will end up voting for McCain, like him or not, based on this healthcare/household income “issue”. I know I will because at the end of the day, politicians won’t pay the bills, so I’ll be damned if I pledge allegiance to a party over taking care of my family.
Obama ’08!
Posted by: HealthyWoman | May 17, 2008, 11:15 am 11:15 am
Evan
it is not about the candidate
it’s about the policies and tone…
it is about getting us off the road that we have been on for 8 years…that heads toward the cliff.
have you seen McCain’s “road”? It’s the same one.
Posted by: dl | May 17, 2008, 11:18 am 11:18 am
now McCain has an ad to use Obama and McGovern prefect together.
Posted by: geevill | May 17, 2008, 11:19 am 11:19 am
evan,
I just think that some of you on here do not think thru things. I am a college instructor and I am used to encouraging my students to THINK. I like to country too much to see it continue down the same path.
Posted by: pt | May 17, 2008, 11:25 am 11:25 am
Vanessa you are hillarious and wrong and no matter what orders you give, a good number of Hillary democrats will not be voting Obama if he is the nominee in Nov because we do not believe he is qualified for the job, nor do we believe that undemocratic caucuses in red states and disenfranchising 2.3 million democrats is the way to the White House.
Sorry Vanessa, Mr Obama is unelectable and many many many Hillary supporters, the working class, rural voters and women WILL NOT vote for him.
Posted by: s.b. | May 17, 2008, 11:33 am 11:33 am
Whether you like it or not, Obama has already won.
It is time to get behind the democratic nominee. The divisiveness has to stop.
Posted by: LA in Indiana | May 17, 2008, 11:34 am 11:34 am
Its interesting that the caucuses that have been in place for years, is now considered undemocratic?
Undemocratic now because he won.
One good turn deserves another.
Posted by: LA in Indiana | May 17, 2008, 11:38 am 11:38 am
You are so wrong, LA. No one has won yet.
Hillary ’08
Posted by: rd | May 17, 2008, 11:38 am 11:38 am
rd, so you choose to ignore the math as well.
Posted by: LA in Indiana | May 17, 2008, 11:40 am 11:40 am
I’m so impressed on Hillary clinton’s remark saying thatI don’t believe in quitting. I may not win but I will fight until every voices are heard. She’s a very gracious, smart, and brave. I also believe her comment that she will be the better president. I truly believe it. Obama is all but talk.
Posted by: emily | May 17, 2008, 11:46 am 11:46 am
It is a good thing the Obama supporters are so vicious. They will need it when the walls of the rebub machine start to grind up their messiah!
Posted by: HP Boston | May 17, 2008, 11:51 am 11:51 am
agreed, Yavo.
Hillary ’08
Posted by: rd | May 17, 2008, 11:57 am 11:57 am
HealthyWoman, you are not an Obama supporter, you are a Republican. Spare me.
Hillary ’08
Posted by: rd | May 17, 2008, 12:00 pm 12:00 pm
Media and Democratic party have tried to paint a perfect picture for Sen Obama. So, they disregarded Sen Clinton’s supporters. Democratic party will regret what they’ve done now in Nov./08.
Sen. McCain 08.
Posted by: The truth | May 17, 2008, 12:03 pm 12:03 pm
If you want to have votes in all 50 states count, you have to count all 50 states. That means not only MI and FL but all the caucus states. Furthermore, candidates don’t determine the ways the various states count and credit votes. The states do. The candidates learn the rules and agree to abide by them,but they can’t try to change them –only the states can do that at their respecitive state conventions and all 50 of them did that last year. If you live in a caucus state and want it to be a primary state, join the party, get elected as a delegate to the party convention, and work through the system to change the state rules for primary elections. But as long as one state plans to remain a caucus state, the only common denominator between those states and primary state will continue to be pledged delegates.That’s why the delegate count is the one that determines the nominee for the national party convention.
So the popular vote effort, while interesting is not going to determnine the nominee this year.
All the candidates knew the rules when they declared their intent to run and started working to get on all the primary ballots.
Superdelegates are not going to risk a party catastrophe in order to take an election that one candidate has one by the only metric that matters, and give it to the candidate who came in second, no matter how close the second place finish was. That’s not how people who play by the rules act.
I have not yet been convinved that HRC is a better candidate than Obama,because she is losing to him in all the metrics, and she’s run a campaign that is in serious debt. How can a candidate who can’t win their party be the party’s strongest candidate?
Threats, tantrums, etc won’t help the party. Voters who truly support what HRC has stood for her whole political life would NEVER vote for McCain. Those who support HRC primarily because they are against Obama, will probably vote for McCain whether or not his policies will be helpful to them or their communities. People who haven’t yet decided will have the months before the general election to see how the two choices measure up to each other and they hopefully will decide “for” someone instead of “against” someone else, but as long as they vote, the will of the people will be determined in that November election.
Posted by: Irene | May 17, 2008, 12:07 pm 12:07 pm
A candidate who cannot handle disruption from supporters of the other side won’t be a candidate for long, for sure. Don’t know where Obama’s supporters got their bullying attitude…, and that is a question because that sort of behavior was observed over and over in the Texas caucus that followed the primary. Yes, Obama did win a lot more states than Clinton but she won the most populous ones and the ones with the blue collar working folks in them, white…? yes, probably more than black, but he still has a long way to go to win the general election. So to denigrate Clinton’s wins in Appalachia amongst whites won’t do a damn thing for Obama amongst the rest of the working class, some of whom are Republicans looking for a way not to vote for McCain.
Posted by: MJCupstate | May 17, 2008, 12:49 pm 12:49 pm
I see all the bitter Clintonistas are out again today.
Still, “not voting for Obama..EVER!” are we?
Still thinking, “only Hillary can beat McCain in the Fall!” are we?
Still yammering about MI and FL, even though Hillary SPECIFICALLY stated those votes would never count?
What kind of lives do these people have when they are so loosely rooted in reality?
Seriously, if you’re going to delude yourselves this badly, I might as well extend my compliments to the Easter Bunny!
Posted by: Texas Voter | May 17, 2008, 12:51 pm 12:51 pm
Texas Voter,
Impressive arguments. You’ve almost convinced me. Obama must be an excellent candidate because he is backed by insulting Obama Zombie bigots like yourself. One correction, though, there is no bitterness on my part, only commitment and persistence. The bitterness was that which Obama brought into the race by exacting class warfare against the working class voters by using the same “bitter” indictment. Very impressive. You notice that Karl Rove is taking him up on his parlay now, have fun! Oh, and you don’t really need our votes right.
========================================Obama, bitter, bitter, Obama
========================================
Posted by: WestCoastMessenger | May 17, 2008, 12:56 pm 12:56 pm
Good for that Clinton supporter!
Posted by: Vnd | May 17, 2008, 1:12 pm 1:12 pm
MJCupstate,
If my stated had voted earlier in the primary, like the “most populous” ones, Hillary would have gotten my vote too. I was familiar with her, impressed by HER when her husband was president, and she had yet to do or say anything that would have turned me against her — except for her Iraq War vote. Unfortunately for her, the battle was prolonged and the general public got to see other sides of her: An ugly side, an irresponsible side, and a calculating devious side, and was turned off by her.
Don’t forget, it was Hillary’s election to lose. She had name recognition, lots of money, lots of influential friends, the good ol’ prosperous days when the Clintons were in charge, universal healthcare, and “no more Bush.” No one really knew who Obama was. Edwards was probably her toughest competition.
However, Hillary lost many supporters. Obama won them. And the ones she continues to win, she really doesn’t need to spend more to garner their support because she would have had them anyway. She’s proving herself to be wasteful and ineffective — such a disappointment to see coming from a smart woman.
Posted by: Perplexed | May 17, 2008, 1:13 pm 1:13 pm
The references to what started in Iowa are extremely painful to those in Iowa who worked on behalf of Sen. Clinton. So many–particularly older voters–simply didn’t think Sen. Clinton needed their help, so they didn’t change travel plans as the caucus date continued to move, or those who worked an evening shift didn’t feel the need to skip work. I know it sounds like excuses, but I don’t think it’s an accident that she performs better in primary states. Did her campaign make mistake in their approach to caucuses. YES! Does that mean her support is to be discounted….we’ll see come November. Obama may be busy running again McCain right now, but he has work to do concerning Clinton supporters. He hasn’t jumped the inexperience (or voting “present”) hurdle yet.
Posted by: joywinnie | May 17, 2008, 1:24 pm 1:24 pm
Gladly, Yavo! Hillary won the primary by 100,000 votes. She netted 5 delegates.
Unfortunately for you and your candidate, she was absolutely blown out of the water in the caucus, so much so that it erased all 5 delegates and netted Obama a 4 delegate overall victory, and since the Democratic Party chooses nominees based on delegates, Obama got the victory.
I hope this helps lift the haze.
Texas Voter
========================================
Good. So, then you truly believe that he “won”?
OK, two more questions:
1.) With regard to the Caucus, what was the COMBINED total of votes cast for both candidates?
2.) With regard to the Caucus, on the basis of what PERCENTAGE of the vote has Senator Obama been declared the “Winner”? You may use either the NY Times web site, or the CNN web site to source that information.
I am looking forward to your response, if any.
Posted by: Yavo Lem | May 17, 2008, 1:38 pm 1:38 pm
Many of you are preaching a doom and gloom scenario if McCain is elected. You forget one very important element: our Democratic Congress. They vet appointees to the Supreme court. And Republicans know that if Roe vs. Wade is overturned, they can kiss the presidency and congress goodbye as far as being a majority again.
Thus my choice is McCain. I have seen what 7 years of a quasi one party system can do and am not about to let it happen with an inexperienced and untested young man.
I’d rather have a more balanced checks and balance system.
Posted by: cynic444 | May 17, 2008, 1:38 pm 1:38 pm
Does anybody remember the two Bush campaigns? Bush refusing to debate; Bush never giving a good debate performance; the Press never asking Bush any “real” questions; the Press rushing to defend his many gaffes; Bush making some inane joke every time seriously challenged on issues; an atmosphere of don’t pick on him; the idea that he doesn’t need to be qualified, we’ll just pick a staff (and VP) that are smarter than him) or he’ll just “delegate”. And all the while millions of Americans swearing they loved the guy based on the media’s perceptions. Sound familiar? And look where we are today. As they say, been there, done that.
Posted by: druggstohr | May 17, 2008, 1:56 pm 1:56 pm
Obama ’08! Nobody else before Barak Obama could defeat the Clinton attack machine — at least that’s what they used to say before we got the Internet.
President Obama will be so great for hearing and responding to the voice of the people! Oh yeah..
Posted by: Joyous | May 17, 2008, 1:57 pm 1:57 pm
Yes druggstohr, I remember that. Why vote for the media darling, Clinton? Seriously, the media doesn’t pick my candidate for me and neither will those pushy, deluded Hillary supporters. I have yet to see a reasonable argument presented from any of them about why Hillary would be a good president.
Obama ’08
Posted by: Nodrugs | May 17, 2008, 2:02 pm 2:02 pm
Well lets see, we’ve got Operation Turndown, which is a movement to simply turn down the nomination of Barack Obama, we’ve got Operation Independent, which is all Hillary Dems switching their party affiliation to Indendent to protest the effort to demean and force HIllary out of this race, we’ve got Clinton Supporters Count too, which is growing into the hundreds of thousands to storm the convention in Denver to protest the hijacking of the Democratic Party by the Obama wing, and we have millions of people pledging to vote for John McCain to deny Obama and his wing a victory. And yet Obama and the DNC and his tunnel focused supporters STILL think that we will all “fall in line” like little sheep and forgive and forget the months of constant abuse and belittling of our candidate and her supporters? And save your “but Obama has had abuse too”. That is not justification or an excuse for you supporters of Obama that have heaped it onto us. It don’t fly. You have made this bed, you lie in it. And when Obama looses in November, don’t come blame us Hillary supporters, blame yourselves. You reap what you sew, and you are the ones that have alienated us to the point of no return.
Posted by: jdona | May 17, 2008, 2:16 pm 2:16 pm
A candidate with a 20 million debt is the best candidate for a bad economy? God help us if hillary gets the democratic notimation…I’m an independant who won’t vote for McCain because he’s too close to Bush but Clinton is far too corrupt(and doesn’t seem to understand the truth) for my tastes.
By the way, for those complaining about bittergate…he was talking about PA and they ducktape, not cling, to their guns and religion. Also Hillary only leads if you don’t give Obama any uncommitted because he removed his name as requested by the DNC but hillary didn’t because “It’s clear that contest won’t count for anything…” so to count it like that is pure BS. I’m sorry Hillary supporters but Barrack has the popular vote and will continue to have it unless there’s a picture of Barack highfiving the reverend Wright after a crazy/paranoid/racist speech.
He has the most grassroot, popular vote, pledged delegates, super delegates(Hillary orginally lead by more than a 100), and fundraising therefore indicating he is, by far, the strongest candidate despite being a black man. The saying that the black man must be twice as good as the white person to get anything has been shown in the race very clearly and Barack clearly qualified for the presidency. Dems, you wanted to win a presidental campaign…? Then you need a candidate who appeals to MOST independants and some ticked off republicans. Barack Obama does and Hillary Clinton doesn’t. It’s that simple.
Posted by: Matthew Gatto | May 17, 2008, 2:23 pm 2:23 pm
*uncommitted in Michigan
Posted by: Matthew Gatto | May 17, 2008, 2:27 pm 2:27 pm
Primaries do not nesscarily indicate general election strength. Kerry won West Virginia with 67% of the primary vote and yet lost it in the general election by a margin of 12% despite democrats outnumbering republicans 2 to 1.
Posted by: Matthew Gatto | May 17, 2008, 2:33 pm 2:33 pm
Amy, I’ll agree with you that his abortion position and gun control bothers me greatly but our troops need to come home and the second amendment ain’t going anywhere plus the new democrats in congress will be conserative ones who won’t remove the partial birth ban so I’m not worried.
Posted by: Matthew Gatto | May 17, 2008, 2:36 pm 2:36 pm
Under Bush we have people making millions and paying less in capitol gains tax (18%) than someone making $50,000 a year pays in Income taxes (33%), this wont change under McCain. He wants to keep things exactly the same where taxes are concerned. Middle class workers who are struggling to make ends meet are paying almost double, while the cream of the crop are keeping an extra 15% of their income. Which breaks down to $150,000 a year on 1 million dollars, which means Anheuser-Busch, Cindy McCains company under the capital gains tax kept a total of $317,250,000. that would have been paid in taxes before Bush. No wonder McCain doesn’t want to change it and no wonder cindy doesn’t want to release her tax information…..Think about it Three Hundred and Seventeen Million Two Hundred and Fifty Thousand Dollars.
Posted by: Be ever vigilant | May 17, 2008, 2:37 pm 2:37 pm
*bothered
Posted by: Matthew Gatto | May 17, 2008, 2:38 pm 2:38 pm
Matthew Gatto:
Primaries do not nesscarily indicate general election strength. Kerry won West Virginia with 67% of the primary vote and yet lost it in the general election by a margin of 12% despite democrats outnumbering republicans 2 to 1.
*********************
This is exactly the reason why we can not have Obama on the ticket!!! Why Kerry lost? because democrats defected to Bush!!! This time, it will happen for sure if OBama is the demo nominee!!!
Carrying WV will not necessarily carry WH, but losing it will for sure lose WH. Obama is leading democratic’s hope to sink!
Posted by: Amy | May 17, 2008, 2:38 pm 2:38 pm
I don’t even trust Obama has the ability to get our troops home — If you have just paid a little attention to his dancing grounds: when and how he will get the troops home. He has no plan! He even knows very little about how Iraq situation works. He has never been there!! His advisors are writing out his plans which he doesn’t even have a good understanding!!! One of his top advisor said his plan is “best scenario” case, another has recently revised his plan to say that there will be substaintial millitary force there after his 16-month withdrawl deadline.
Listen to NPR, read some NYT articles (they tried to be as objective as they are, although I know most of the journalists and reporters are already in tank with Obama) – you will know Obama’s Iraqi position is indeed a fairy tale!
I trust Hillary’s ability to get things done!
Posted by: Amy | May 17, 2008, 2:46 pm 2:46 pm
Maybe so, but you need independant strength as well which Hillary…greatly lacks. Also Hillary won by the same margin…what makes you think that Hillary will keep the democrats happy? Remember, she voted for the Iraq war and she didn’t say that it was a mistake until very late in the campaign. That, among other things, such as her complete lack of honesty(Obama lied too but it’s a lot less often) may cause democrats to not turn up for her or go to McCain especially since she’ll have to get it without the popular vote AND pledged delegates in the primaries and have the superdelegates overrule it.
Posted by: Matthew Gatto | May 17, 2008, 2:46 pm 2:46 pm
The only way the Republicans win is if we let them. This division has to end.
Fine, Obama is untested but McCain’s known record is heinous. I would rather go with untested than with what I know is going to be a nightmare. I know what Obama is ideologically and that is more than enough. He will be less likely to get bogged down in old style politics and he will go in and get things done because of it. He will surround himself with good people.
Your second amendment rights are safe, in fact Obama voted against taking people’s guns away in a federal emergency. Hillary voted in favor of taking them away.
Think before you vote McCain out of spite and anger.
Posted by: PLEASE THINK` | May 17, 2008, 2:47 pm 2:47 pm
That’s why the president gets good staff for the withdrawl plans…and has them do it. Very rarely does a president get involved in such deep military matters(and for good reason).
Posted by: Matthew Gatto | May 17, 2008, 2:50 pm 2:50 pm
Redclary, They’re voting 92% for him because of the numerous borderline racist comments from Clinton’s camp at an attempt to get more white votes. Barack does not gain from a white versus black division. Simply put, there’s 3 times more white people.
Posted by: Matthew Gatto | May 17, 2008, 2:55 pm 2:55 pm
Why Obama’s misspeak is only gaffes but Hillary’s are “lies”. About Bosnia, there are other reports out there showing there were dangous sitiations, there were cases where airplane she was in landed perpendicularly, there was a pilot saying they were indeed told to put on bullet proof jackets. For this one, I am sympathic with her rather than descrediting her. I could understand her frustration of having to say something to bolst her experience — which she has, but was ridiculed by Obama as “having tea parties with foreign leaders’ wives”. I accept Hillary’s flaws as a human being, but I judge her qualification based on what she has done, what she can do.
OBama will be the nominee because of media hype. But he will not get my vote!
Get it?
Posted by: Amy | May 17, 2008, 2:57 pm 2:57 pm
Perplexed not only them people.
There are plenty of female, independent thinkers 60 plus like me who spent countless hours researching everybody before I make my mind who vote for Sen.Obama.
He is the best we have seen in years in leadership qualities and passion and love for this country.
Posted by: lea | May 17, 2008, 3:03 pm 3:03 pm
Now that your mention it he is black, also good looking and has a great smile.
Most important is very intelligent and learned.He is also compassionate,well mannered and civil toward everyone.
He was raised by a mother who had great respect for all people and helped women in Indonesia start their own business with micro loans.
As they say behind any great man that is a ‘good’ woman.
Posted by: lea | May 17, 2008, 3:13 pm 3:13 pm
…wiping out Iran after we’re in two wars is the path you want? Interesting…
Posted by: Matthew Gatto | May 17, 2008, 3:14 pm 3:14 pm
I didn’t hold the Bosnia fire against Hillary. Because I know from personal experience, that long ago events often get distorted. She could have remembered hearing gunfire in the distance and never felt safe or comfortable on that trip — 10 years later, it became sniper fire.
It has to be difficult living in her position. Always guarded and can never roam freely and live like a regular person. That has to be stressful.
Therefore, where Hillary lost me was during the debates and in her speeches. There was clear disconnect, ambivalence, “flip flopping,” and poor logic.
* “I voted for it before I was against it” — in regards to the war
* “I voted for it but hoped it wouldn’t pass” — in regards to mortgage lending
* Mandatory health coverage — Garnishing my pay check if I choose not to purchase it. I juggle bills monthly to keep everything on.
* Reading her speeches, word-for-word, rarely lifting her eyes, often stumbling over the words, mispronouncing many. Clearly no personal attachment to her rhetoric.
and all of this was before her campaign got nasty.
To me, she just isn’t credible … and I used to adore her.
Posted by: Perplexed | May 17, 2008, 3:18 pm 3:18 pm
RD,
can you explain what is socialism and liberatanianism, I think may be mispelled.Better check it out.
I understand that many of our socialistic institution are already in place” schools,libraries,social security,social medicine,medicaid,wick,and so many other hand outs to help those who have needs.
Libertarian…well the word stands for liberal as spending with out restraint?
I think Bush has been pretty dam liberal with our future tax money when he borrowed money to go to Iraq…for oil?
I think Bush is pretty dam liberal with my money by giving tax cut to the well to do who have money in the stock market.
Let’s face it capitalism works only if everyone is fair and honest, if the government does not give away our money to big contractors to do the job they are supposed to be doing etc….
Oligarchies is a good term.
Posted by: lea | May 17, 2008, 3:25 pm 3:25 pm
Obama Delegates,
You’ve proven the point that it’s possible to get a young, unproven senator to the cusp of a nomination by exploiting the crazy anti-working class rules of the Democratic Party. You haven’t proven the point that it is possible to bring the same character into the White House using real world rules. All history bears against you and those that ignore history are condemned to repeat it. Now is the time to change your vote.
Clinton ’08
========================================
Obama Delegates, it is not to late to change your vote!
========================================
Hillary ’08 or ’12, you decide; the lower the number the higher the IQ of the Democratic Party!
========================================
Posted by: WestCoastMessenger | May 17, 2008, 3:31 pm 3:31 pm
Hillary is not tenacious, she is obsessive. Obsessive about Hillary. She is single track, and this not good in a President. She changes her position to fit the mood. How is any other country to read this woman? With Hillary our stand in the international community will be in a flux as our position will change with the wind.
Posted by: Thinking | May 17, 2008, 3:33 pm 3:33 pm
One thing both sides Clinton and Obama are very aware of is the McCain bloggers, these people are going everywhere posing as Clinton supporters saying they will vote McCain if Hillary isn’t the nominee. There is even some speculation that these “bloggers” are possibly being paid. My question is why are the Republicans so afraid of a Democrat getting in office, are they so afraid they are going to lose their tax cuts and their pork barrel spending, that they would rather try to destroy the Dem party than see a Dem as President?
Posted by: Be ever vigilant | May 17, 2008, 3:45 pm 3:45 pm
Ms Tech, I so understand that, I am 42 white,female, I worked hard from 16 until I became disabled, her comments made my skin crawl, I saw it as very racist and demeaning even a overall disregard for the inteligence to the people of America in general, While it may have won her WV and may even win her KY, it diminished my respect for her as former First Lady as a woman and even as an american. Had she made a similar statement while employed at most companies in the US, she would have been fired.
Posted by: Be ever vigilant | May 17, 2008, 4:10 pm 4:10 pm
Regarding Bill Clinton’s remark about the South Carolina primary… Why did he use Jesse Jackson’s name regarding ’84 and ’88 when South Carolina didn’t even hold a democratic primary those years? John Edwards won in 2004. Why didn’t Bill cite Edwards’ win? Bill, himself won there in ’92. He could have just as easily said, “I won in South Carolina in 1992.”
Posted by: Perplexed | May 17, 2008, 4:17 pm 4:17 pm
I couldn’t resist. That post had me laughing so hard I have tears in my eyes.
They say laughter adds years to your life. I’m gonna keep reading these Clinton posts and live to be 200, I tell ya!
Posted by: Texas Voter | May 17, 2008, 4:27 pm 4:27 pm
I emailed Howard Dean and the DNC too — regarding Michigan.
Like me, my family was formerly in support of Hillary too. But when they went to vote in Michigan and recognized no one’s name except Hillary’s, they voted for her. Some friends also told me Obama and Edwards names were not on the ballot and the poll worker did not tell them to vote “other” or whatever it was, so they voted for Hillary too.
Therefore, if it was a “real” contest, the results would not be the same.
It is unbelievable that Hillary thinks she won in an uncontested, non-existent primary. It is disturbing that she protests to break the Party’s rules so she can win. Another strike against her! And this makes her the equivalent of George W. Bush.
Posted by: Perplexed | May 17, 2008, 4:39 pm 4:39 pm
John, I have sent my comments to the DNC about the FL and MI voters, their reply was ” if FL and MI would run a new caucus and schedule a new vote all votes would be counted and all delegates seated, if they don’t none of the votes will be counted and the delegates will be seated after they have a nominee”, I understand that it wasn’t the fault of the people in FL or MI, perhaps calling your State Legs and asking them to set a new caucus and schedule a new vote would have a better effect. Then everyones votes would be counted and the delegates seated according to those votes.
Posted by: Be ever vigilant | May 17, 2008, 4:41 pm 4:41 pm
LeeLee07,
I’m a little disappointed that you didn’t respond to my question regarding the South Carolina primary remark — especially when you seem to be so well informed.
Please explain the intent of invoking a Jesse Jackson /Barack Obama comparison when South Carolina didn’t hold Democratic primaries the years Jesse ran.
Posted by: Perplexed | May 17, 2008, 4:46 pm 4:46 pm
Perplexed – Maybe because JJ did win SC and it was a FACT. SC has a large black voting block. Clinton was acknowledgeing Jesse Jackson won SC because of AAs supporting him and he expected the same results for Obama. He was right. You haven’t answered MY question why the remark was racist!!!! Maybe like I said, you should stop “reaching.”
A Proud, Black, Hillary Supporter
Rise, Hillary, Rise!’08
(It ain’t over until the lady in the pantsuit says so!)
Posted by: LeeLee07 | May 17, 2008, 4:56 pm 4:56 pm
And the actual slogan comes from the hardcore biker world not the campaign trail and has been in use for many years.
Posted by: Be ever vigilant | May 17, 2008, 5:04 pm 5:04 pm
Yavo Lem I sure hope you are right! I just can’t vote for Obama. I still have Hillary stickers on my car, and I won’t give up till she does. I can’t believe the way the media crammed Obama down our throats. I had to stop watching Olbermann because he made me so mad it made my blood pressure go up. Lets just keep the faith. Most of the Hillary supporters I know will not vote for obama. If the people who have already voted wished they could take their vote back, is there anything they could do. Most of his bad “STUFF” hadn’t come out at that time.
Posted by: Carol in Alabama` | May 17, 2008, 5:06 pm 5:06 pm
about la. crossing over, i live in n/w la. and in the primary obama won. but they did a poll recently in this part of la. and mccain was way ahead.
Posted by: dj jones | May 17, 2008, 5:14 pm 5:14 pm
No not all wealthy are opposed to paying more some actually think they should, but there are those elite few ie. Bush, McCain, etc.. who think it is a bad idea to make the wealthy pay more, especially since it does cut into their pockets. And since that comment was directed at McCain and his desire to keep those tax cuts in place and make them permanent should be a strong indicator that the working class is not in his list of top priorities.
Posted by: Be ever vigilant | May 17, 2008, 5:16 pm 5:16 pm
Kerry – Good God, the hits just keep oooooooon comin’!!!!
Hilary’s father, Hugh Rodham, owned a textile plant. Yep, that’s one hardscrabble life when your father owns the plant!
Also, how can you keep a straight face and type “Clinton Foundation”? Who were the beneficiaries of the “Foundation”? You guessed it! Bill and Hilary!!!!!
Goodness, I’m laughing so hard my sides hurt!!!!!
You Clintonistas DO know you lost, right? It was in all the papers!
Seriously, can you guys come up with anything substantive? ANYTHING?!!
Posted by: Texas Voter | May 17, 2008, 5:23 pm 5:23 pm
Now I’m laughing because it was Hillary who began boasting that she was winning the un- under- lesser-educated people and labeled Obama as the elitist.
Personally, I don’t believe one has to have a formal education or post secondary education to be smart. There are multi-degreed, master degreed people who display no kind of sense whatsoever.
I respect those who work with their hands, as well as artists, farmers, performers, inventors, etc. I also enjoy being around intellectual types sometimes. All kinds of people are needed to keep this world interesting.
In the same regard, I prefer to live in an area where people of various ethnicities live. I enjoy learning about others’ cultures, traditions and religions. I love ethnic artwork, sculptures and textiles.
I hold no animosities towards anyone based on their skin color, level of “formal” education, or socio-economic status.
Everyone has a right to vote for their preferred candidate. I only stated how Hillary LOST my vote.
Posted by: Perplexed | May 17, 2008, 5:57 pm 5:57 pm
LeeLee07,
Yes, I wrote exactly what I intended — based on the actions the candidate performed.
Hillary was proud and bragged that she can shoot (although I don’t remember what kind of animal, so I wrote “possum”). She also said she could drink (and I don’t remember who either) under the table — and the news in Pennsylvania showed her drinking shots of whiskey and mugs of beer.
Both she and Obama tried their hand at bowling. Obama said he didn’t bowl. However, Hillary boasted she has her own bowlingball — yet she only threw them in the gutter.
And until a few days ago, Hillary was still boasting she wins the lesser educated voters. While Bill is still preaching that.
And we all know who they mean.
And this isn’t specific to South Carolina. It’s been throughout her campaign since she lost 10 states in a row.
Posted by: Perplexed | May 17, 2008, 6:15 pm 6:15 pm
I never said that Obama was responsible for the T-shirts nor do I think that Hillary was responsible for the Curious George. The tone of the campaign is what I was referring to. This whole Democratic Primary has stooped to such a bottomless pit of filth that voters will vote for the Republican and we only have ourselves to blame. It has put the Democratic Party in the gutter with all the filth and will not wash away easily. Obama will not win against McCain is the bottom line. All you rabid Democrats can only blame yourselves for this. THE blacks democrats, the white democrats, the female democrats, have won their little Primary game but have lost The Election
War. Together we stand or divided we fall and we have let them divide us. Democrat against Democrat and White against Black.
r
Posted by: redclary | May 17, 2008, 6:46 pm 6:46 pm
Yeah, the price is over $20 million in debt, eating a lot of crow, and a lost candidacy.
You take care. I’m hungry and need to do something other than sit here.
It’s been fun.
Posted by: Perplexed | May 17, 2008, 6:51 pm 6:51 pm
No, we are not voting for Obama.
Obama is democratic Bush.
“Mission accomplished” without accomplish anything.
McCain is proud of this country and served it well (not like somebody’s wife who is making $300K and still not proud of the United States).
It is Hillary to the end!
Posted by: Viki | May 17, 2008, 9:11 pm 9:11 pm
I resigned from the Dem party and WILL NOT vote for Obama. I am so sick of this “They will get behind the nominee” crap. Not me, Not ever. I was a voting Democrat for 40 years. The DNC decided to shove Barack Obama down our throats and I refuse to swallow. Will be voting for, campaigning for and fundraising for John McCain if Obama is the nominee. How in the heck is Obama going to get elected without all the Hillary supporters come November. You are DILLUSIONAL if you think we will vote for him come November. It just cracks me up to here Obama supporters say that. NOT happening. Go look at some of the CLinton blogs. These aren’t youung, first-time voters. These are die hard life-long Democrats resigning from the party. Many of whom are aged 40 and above and most, contrary to the pundits, college educated. The DNC has sold the Obama supporters and the Obama campaign a promise that’s not worth zip. The CLinton supporters will not fall into line like good little sheep and spew the party line. Enjoy the 15 minutes of fame IF it comes because there will be no reward at the end.
Posted by: Wyoming Dem | May 17, 2008, 9:21 pm 9:21 pm
IL Obama lover, other Obama lovers, and Vanessa: understand. We are voting, have voted for, and support HIllary because we love her. We are NOT voting for Obama because we do NOT like him.
Posted by: Milly | May 17, 2008, 9:25 pm 9:25 pm
Obama and Supporters -
You will reap what you have sown.
Hillary Supporters will ensure your harvest will be very, very bitter…
A Proud, Black, Hillary Supporter
Rise, Hillary, Rise!’08
(It ain’t over until the lady in the pantsuit says so!)
Posted by: LeeLee07 | May 17, 2008, 9:26 pm 9:26 pm
A write in for Hillary may well be a vote for Obama. In some states the vote would automatically go to the person that is actually on the ballot. Please check your state rule before doing a write in. Also please be aware that a write in will more than likely help Obama win.
If you research Obama’s voting record (when he votes) you will find he voted with the Republicans on many issues. Given this, his lack of integrity, and his racist friends a vote for McCain is not all bad. It also serves as a protest vote to the DNC.
Posted by: swannyj | May 17, 2008, 9:32 pm 9:32 pm
Obama said himself that McCain is better than Bush.
Kerry wanted McCain to be his running mate in 2004.
He repeatedly asked McCain before McCain said no.
So for all account, McCain is an acceptable candidate for Democrat.
It’s Hillary or McCain. No Obama. Not Now. Not Ever. DNC can take a hike! and take the pony unity with them.
Posted by: JoeySky | May 17, 2008, 9:35 pm 9:35 pm
ROFLMAO Hysterical that the Obama supporters think Hillary supporters would vote for him. Cracks me up and made my day. Earth to Obama people…
Not happening EVER. DNC & Howard Dean can go screw themselves. We are resigning from the Democratic party in droves. You can easily verify that because the Democratic Party is not getting any donations!!! Begging letters for money every day. Lets hope Obama and his deep pockets can keep funneling money to the DNC & The Superdelegates. I am STILL LAUGHING!!!! Vote for Obama…give me a break. HAH!
Posted by: Kellermen | May 17, 2008, 9:36 pm 9:36 pm
I know when I went to hear President Clinton speak awhile back there were all sorts of interruptions by Obama supporters, which I found to be rude, this person silently held up a sign.
What a great show of diligence from the Hillary sign holder!
Posted by: Oliver Twisted | May 17, 2008, 10:21 pm 10:21 pm
Let us ponder this… John Edwards left his name on the ballot in every one of Clinton’s stronghold states. Yet, he removed his name from every state Obama was expected to win. One could argue that this was a ploy to keep Clinton’s popular vote down. Tell me the announcement of Edwards endorsement wasn’t strategically planned. Edwards has been in Obama’s pocket all along.
Posted by: Kate | May 17, 2008, 10:26 pm 10:26 pm
Vanessa
It’s my guess that the people from the blogs that are saying they won’t vote for Obama are telling you the truth.
My guess is most of us will be sitting out this election if Obama makes it to the nomination. As someone who has been marginally involved in politics through the years and witnessed the Obama thugs take over the Texas caucuses to pervert the election here I know several people that could never in good conscience vote for him. Many people here in Texas voted for Bush twice….McCain is a lot more experienced and centrist than Bush so they will vote for him.
Posted by: Jackie | May 17, 2008, 10:29 pm 10:29 pm
For me, this year, its not the party it the person.
Will be Hillary or McCain. Never Obama
Clinton supporters – pleae….do NOT stay home and do NOT write in Hillary – it will count as a vote for BO.
And for those who think Hillary supporters will just “come home”, shut up, and pull the lever for Obama – that’s a change you better not believe in.
You get what you sow ….meaning that Obamanation, and the Dem party of 2008 who has lost their way, will get what they deserve …. they will lose the GE.
Operation turn down in full swing.
Posted by: 2cents | May 17, 2008, 10:30 pm 10:30 pm
Like so many Democrats McGovern is showing his lack of loyalty and overwhelming fear that they can’t get the Presidency back.
Bush has been a terrible president, but watching and listening to Kerry I’m doubtful he could have done any better.
Hillary Clinton should hang in there…I’m not sure that the Democrats understand that the crowds that Obama draws don’t help him win states like WV, PA, OH…etc.
Posted by: Jackie | May 17, 2008, 10:34 pm 10:34 pm
OBAMA cannot win the people over so the party pundits send out back stabbers after Hillary:
See the trend:
Richardson
Joe Smith
John Edwards
McGovern
He is never a good player one one one.
He ducks debates
He ignore 2M votes from MI and FL.
Ever Since Rhode Island,
Obrama lost
Rhode Island
Texas
Ohio
Pennsylvania
Indiana
West Virginia.
The only race he won was from NC with 30% of black population voting 92% for him. His support is getting slimmer every day.
The party is worried that he would finish in landslide losses.
After West Virginia, Kentucky would be another landslide losses. Oregon is going to be close. Then all the way downhill for BO who pretended he didn’t care.
Hillary is gaining heavily in popularity votes. BO’s support is history. He is on his way down floated only by party and media pundits with fabricated election rules.
Posted by: John_Lai | May 17, 2008, 10:55 pm 10:55 pm
He needs to lecture his own fanatics about manners. The boo everybody. My favorite was booing Congresswoman Sheila Jackson-Lee in Houston April. She was talking about the Democratic Party.
Posted by: Jay | May 17, 2008, 11:05 pm 11:05 pm
Read this article by Roger Aronoff of the National Ledger and you’ll be even more confident that Hillary will at least win the nomination.
Also, there is supposedly a Michelle Obama tape of her trashing white folks that will be used by the Republicans as an October surprise. Carl Rove is in possession of it. Some billionaire who doesn’t like the Republicans or Obama wants it before the Dems go to convention and will pay $1 million for a copy of it. Interesting to say the least.
Anyway, check this guy Aronoff out. I know you’re going to love his article.
http://www.nationalledger.com/artman/publish/article_272620600.shtml
By the way, I’m very grateful for all the effort the Hillary Team is putting into getting her elected. Thank you.
Most of all, thank you Hillary for not giving in. You’re a champion for the people.
–Kent
Posted by: Kent | May 17, 2008, 11:16 pm 11:16 pm
It is important for all the Clinton supporters to understand one thing.
“IT IS OVER” It is now time to unify the party to defeat McCain.
The sooner we all join together the better. We can not endure as a country a third GW Bush term.
Posted by: Duke | May 17, 2008, 11:17 pm 11:17 pm
South Dakota, don’t be razzle dazzled by Mr. Politics as Usual, Chicago Style”. Check his record before you decide and I know you will vote Hillary 2008!
From former Barack supporter from Illinois
Posted by: Lizben08 | May 17, 2008, 11:18 pm 11:18 pm
Hillary has the electoral votes to win!
She also knows there are not 57 states.
Follow the Obama trail and you will vote for Hillary!
Posted by: JOYCE BLACKWELL | May 17, 2008, 11:20 pm 11:20 pm
Hillary supporters will never vote for Obama because we know he is a liar and a racist.
If Obama is nominated we will leave the Democratic party and will all be campaigning for McCain and voting for McCain.
We don’t want Obama. He is dangerous for this country.
Posted by: BillDemo | May 17, 2008, 11:21 pm 11:21 pm
GOD BLESS OBAMA AND HIS CAMPAIGN
Posted by: Wanda | May 17, 2008, 11:25 pm 11:25 pm
You know as a child I can remember chanting NIXON NIXON He’s our man throw McGovern in the Garbage Can ! I guess even thou Nixon got impeached that McGovern still belongs out with the TRASH !
Posted by: Mrsawd | May 17, 2008, 11:29 pm 11:29 pm
Democrats will united? In your dream! Can’t you see so many Clinton people have made their minds they won’t vote for Obama? I’m one of them. Nothing that he says will change that! 联合个屁!
Posted by: dragon | May 17, 2008, 11:32 pm 11:32 pm
I am sure he must have been thinking about the 57 states that comprise the Organization of the Islamic Conference, not the USA. Check it out, it has 57 member countries
Posted by: Jay | May 17, 2008, 11:52 pm 11:52 pm
I looked at Obama as a candidate early on, however, there is no way he will win. His ego has him running around as the winner saying he will make an announcement. The fact is that until the committee meets and decides on Mi and FL no one knows what the threshold is for winning. His wife is another reason I would not vote for him. I feel she influences in a negative way. He has not given any specifics to any questions. He blew off questions to Sweetie, for his waffle, and to an xray technician that asked him how he knew he could be trusted, he does not give anything but a bs answer. He tells him he has 4-5 months to look and see if he is consistent, etc. Once again he acts as if the convention is over and it is not. Until the votes are cast, there is no nominee.
Posted by: Tiger | May 17, 2008, 11:54 pm 11:54 pm
I think this is the biggest mistake this man made he must not have a single brain cell in his head. BO is arrogant, dishonest, not trustworthy and his judgement has brought in major concerns with everyone in America Such as: Wright, Ayer,Rezko,and none other than the Nadhmi Auchi who by the way was Saddam Hussein money man for none other than Saddam Hussein. Oh, I forgot what is BO middle Name “HUSSEIN” Under no uncertain terms would I ever vote for Him..Nor, my family and friends….You can count on that……….!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted by: Suzanne Martin | May 17, 2008, 11:54 pm 11:54 pm
Why on earth would voters choose the candidate with no substantive record, a history of bad judgment and questionable associations?
Obama is unelectable. He’s won a SINGLE primary since February. Clinton is beating him in the popular vote. It’s only because of this ridiculous system that the democrats use that he has more delegates.
If that’s how they are going to choose the next nominee, be prepared to welcome John McCain as our 44th President.
Posted by: s. Valenti | May 18, 2008, 12:04 am 12:04 am
I was disrespected by Obama as a voter when he removed his name from the ballot in Michigan
I was disrespected by Obama as a woman when he called a reporter sweetie and brushed her off
I was disrespected by Obama as an American by his wife’s comments and his misguided belief not wearing a flag pin showed love for his country.
I was disrespected by Obama as a Christian when he stayed in a Church for 20 years spewing hatred.
Trust me I will vote for Mc Cain before I ever vote for Obama.
Posted by: StarDust | May 18, 2008, 12:16 am 12:16 am
This should be a no brainer. I keep hearing experience is less important than change. Hillary epitomizes not just change but real tangible change. Because of her dedication and experience she has learned what works and what doesn’t in numerous areas of service. Some call her a liar (sometimes even worse) but what lies has she committed that disadvantage anyone. What lies has been so great that it changed the world. Oddly the ones who accuse her have really never met her. She is the change we need. We need a president who is intelligent, caring but also willing to fight for what they believe to be in the best interest of those they serve. We know where she comes from. Contrary to those who have met her they cannot stop praising her caring, listening and determination to bring about good resolutions. Obama frightens many of us. His overall Illinois senate performance record is not fully known due to lack of adequate paper trail for that time. I also have friends who lived in the district he represented and cannot believe how he has fooled people to believe that he cares about the welfare of his people. The slumlords and slum areas are still there and were no better when he was there. The same feelings of fear were the same we had when the current Bush was running for office the first and second time. Both times we were right to be fearful. Obama skills as an orator would be great for speaking to improve civil and human right issue, similar to the task that MLK took on. With the world in the shape it is today he is not ready for the highest position of the USA. Many of us feel he is a puppet in a much larger political scheme. But his past accomplishments do not standout to be embellished. Hillary’s accomplishments speak for themselves. I could go on and on about Hillary, but I hope we have hit the real standout issues of qualification in this troubled world. I will say this, if it is change one truly wants Hillary would be true change. A woman running things the way they should and need to be run….
Posted by: Cynthia E Washington | May 18, 2008, 12:21 am 12:21 am
Nearly 17 million have voted for Hillary. We all have our reasons for doing so. (Here are 100 of them: http://www.mydd.com/story/2008/2/29/205555/359 ).
The vast majority of us see in our candidate a brilliant, articulate woman of substance and depth, who has a sophisticated grasp of the smallest details of every issue that arises in debates–on foreign policy or the economy or health care or education. Someone who has PROVEN with her LEGISLATIVE EXPERIENCE what she believes in, and who and what she is associated with and supports.
Her opponent offers a dream and inspiring speeches. He’d make a great motivational speaker or minister. But the presidency is not an internship. This country is in the worse shape it’s been in in decades, and we need someone who will give us PROGRESS, not “change.”
Posted by: SMac | May 18, 2008, 12:26 am 12:26 am
I am a Hillary supporter. I will not vote for Obama if he is the nominee. He is not qualified, nor is he experienced enough to lead the United States through all these problems. He is not an honest person. I feel that the Republicans funded his campaign. Also, the Republicans and Independants voted for him in record numbers to knock Hillary out of the race, therefore, Obama will be the front runner – and will lose to John McCain in November. People believed all that junk he was talking about, “Change” – But he could not tell you how he would make these changes. He is so full of it. He lied and disrespected the American people about his comments about small town people, and he lied about his relationship with Rev. Wright. He has been friends and sat under this man for twenty plus years – and when the negative comments came out and he wanted to win the voters over – he then denounces him. Please, give me a break.
He would not debate Hillary for the last two debates – tell me, will he be able to skip out on debating McCain? I think not. Democrats can forget winning in November 2008. I also agree with the previous post about John Edwards. He has been in Obama’s pocket since he left the campaign trail. He wants to be vice.
Women, don’t you see whats happening here. They don’t ever want a women to be president. We could have made all the difference in the world by supporting Hillary. They want it to always be a man’s world. Hillary is the best qualified and experienced candidate. She should be the nominee, and then win the presidency. Not Obama or McCain. I will not vote for Obama. I do not trust him at all. I will not vote in November, or I will vote for the first time, Republican.
Posted by: Shirlene Robinson | May 18, 2008, 12:28 am 12:28 am
Perhaps what impresses me most about Sen. Clinton is illustrated in this story. She stands strong even when being counted out by mostly male pundits who have no right to determine our leader.
A woman who has withstood SO much sexism and media bias, and STILL is ahead in the popular vote. Still is far ahead of Obama in the electoral college map. Given what she’s been up against (while everyone has protected Obama with cries of “racism” there’s been nary a whisper about the disgusting sexism in this campaign), I am so impressed. If she’s been able to withstand all this and still be where she is, she will fight for us until the bitter end.
GO HILLARY.
Posted by: Veronica | May 18, 2008, 12:29 am 12:29 am
Obama, a phony, arrogant and slow motion puppet. He is going to be worse than Bush if he is picked. His trademark “CHANGE” will be a big joke.
Is Ted Kennedy getting better now? So he can stay behind this puppet to have their unique “CHANGE”.
Lord, what’s going on in this world? A junior senator is trying to be the president just by big talk? Those who behind him must open your wise eyes: BETTER SAFE THAN SORRY!
Hillary, you are the ONLY ONE we need!!!
Posted by: goodcitizen | May 18, 2008, 12:29 am 12:29 am
What a traitor!!!!!!Friends need each other the most when the going gets rough. I got one question for McGovern. When the Clintons supported him in his 1972 bid, did they jump ship or did they go the distance with him?
I bet they went the distance!!!!!!!!
He should be ashamed of himself. A real Judis!!!!!!The sad thing is that Obama will lose for the same reason McGovern did!!!!You would have thought McGovern would have learned his lesson!!!!!The Clintons learned it. You can’t win without the working class!!!!!!So the DNC, and their corporate media freinds may have screwed Clinton out of the nomination by disenfranchising Fl and Michigan, and by engaging in race baiting and sexism, but they have also screwed the people out of a democratic president!!!!!
Clinton has come closer to the finish line than McGovern ever achieved. She may be behind in delegates, but she is likely to carry the popular vote. If she can get Fl. and MI seated and convince delegates that her general election math makes her a safer bet for victory in the general election, she could take the nomination. She is beating John McCan in all matchups. Obama has been consistantly losing to McCain for 2 months. If it continues, and they make him the nominee, we will lose!!!!
Posted by: Kendall Johnson | May 18, 2008, 1:41 am 1:41 am
BO fanatics are radicals so we can’t expect any manner from them.
The democratic party has shown eccentricity and ignorance of people after they won the majority in congress. They are holding 2M people hostages for OBAMA; never before have so many people been intimidated by the party.
It is no longer a party for the people, of the people and by the people.
Now you have back stabbers lining up to show their loyalty to the party pundits against the people; they are irrational.
Joe Andrew coming out of nowhere try to sway voters in Indiana primary. Aren’t superdelegates supposed to see things according to their own conscience.
John Edwards who claimed to be working for the poor. In his endorsement speech of BO praised Hillary but stabbed her anyway. Hillary has got the vote of confidence of the working class and the poor. Contradictory!!!
McGovern reversed his endorsement because he showed bad judgment. Why would voters believe on him? Yet BO used him to stump against Hillary. BO do not have the gut to debate Hillary and shows us that he is better because he knows that he is inferior to Hillary.
BO’s advantages come from the party who have been making new rules and fix primary for him. Now they are coming out to gang tackle Hillary while people are voting for Hillary in large measure.
What does it say? The party is against the wish of people. We need someone strong and tenacious to clean the party and lead the party.
BO lacks tenacity and a good record to substantiate his poetic promises of change. He did learn from the playbook of Bush in smearing. Go to FACTCHECK, you can find out many instances of his smearing.
In general election, the rules are different, BO will face landslide losses. No sensible person can vote for a quitter and whinner like BO. We need strong leadership. That is Hillary who can change America.
Posted by: John_Lai | May 18, 2008, 2:19 am 2:19 am
CJ–
Not too worried about your blaming Hillary when McCain wins. After the GOP is done skewering BO, it’ll be pretty clear that Hillary’s not too blame.
Posted by: Leia | May 18, 2008, 10:47 am 10:47 am
So, he misspoke about how many states there were! He probably was sleep deprived from campaigning so hard! This is nothing compared to Hillary’s blatant lie about ducking sniper fire in Bosnia! Much bigger blunder! Or her lies about NAFTA, her experience, the gas holiday . . . I could go on and on!
This woman does nothing but manipulate and lle, using smear tactics, anything to win!!! This is why Obama is winning in all catagories, even including Florida and Michigan!!! People saw thru her and realized she is just in it for the power and prestige and for herself! She not only is a liar but an egomaniac who is not dealing with reality! Let her stay in the race to the end . . the guys in the white jackets will be coming for her when reality sets in! Voting for McBush instead of her is like committing suicide! If she were to be elected, it would be like having a smarter Bush in a pantsuit in office!
Posted by: sharong58 | May 18, 2008, 11:32 am 11:32 am
I applaud the Clinton supporter for her courage! Get used to this Obama there are many to come, all the way to Denver!
Posted by: anne white | May 18, 2008, 11:53 am 11:53 am
Every primary is decided long before the last vote is cast. The same was true when bill clinton got the nod.
Would somebody please look up the definition of the word courage? KTHX.
Posted by: CC | May 18, 2008, 12:19 pm 12:19 pm
Some people just won’t accept that Barack has won this nomination fair and is the nominee.Clinton supporters are threatening to vote for McCain regardless of his f%#k up policies. This just proves that some folks will take the worst old whiteman over something new and promising. In my opinion if there are some dumb Hillary people that want McInsane in office then by all means cast your vote for the klan in hiding.
Posted by: Kate Poe | May 18, 2008, 1:42 pm 1:42 pm
Just as I suspected, the same people blogging over and over again about if Hillary is not the candidate than vote for McCain. So, Operation Chaos is alive and well on this blog. And for the true Hillary supporter if you think for one minute that you will steal this primary for Obama, I would love for the GOP to go after the Clintons. Also, stop your threats to the rest of the Democrats Party. Don’t vote for Obama and see how the rest of us will make sure the Clintons never serve in Politics again EVER!!!
Posted by: Dee, St. Louis | May 18, 2008, 3:39 pm 3:39 pm
Vanessa, I *will not* vote for Obama. Votes are not commanded or owned or taken for granted. In a democracy, votes are *earned*.
As time goes on, too many Obama supporters resort to verbal abuse, disinformation and sheer thuggery. If this is the change we’ve been waiting for, I pray it will be rejected soundly in November.
Obama has been the most divisive candidate of my lifetime and I remember Nixon.
Posted by: abehn | May 18, 2008, 6:56 pm 6:56 pm
I like John Edwards until the day after W VA when Hillary won by so much he came out and went for Obama he said to bring unity to the DNC will it just torn us apart.
I am a Hillary supporter and will NOT VOTE FOR OBAMA in November.
There is no way I could sleep at night if I did. That is one thing I can not do for Hillary is vote for Obama.
Posted by: sharon | May 19, 2008, 12:48 am 12:48 am
Pathetic attempt by Republicans – posing as Clinton supporters!! It won’t work – not this time. We know we have a great candidate in Barack Obama. Your slander and attempts to undermine his support doesn’t hold water. He is beating John Mccain in all the GE polls and beating Clinton in the national democratic nomination polls. He ran a great campaign – funded by over 1,500,000 grassroots supporters (average donation of 96 dollars). Clinton is 20 million in debt and she ran a negative campaign that many who initially supported her did not like. Democrats will be united in the Fall and we will beat McCain! Hillary and Bill will wholeheartedly back Obama after June 3rd. Hillary is a smart politician and she knows that her future poltical career depends on how she helps to unify the party after June 3rd. She has been a worthy opponent and would have made an excellent president -if only she had not had such bad advice from people like Mark Penn who convinced her to run a negative campaign and if she had not had financial advisors who so badly mismanaged her finances and fundraising.
Proud Obama Supporter!!
Posted by: Pat on the Lake | May 19, 2008, 1:00 am 1:00 am
I love ABC’s censorship – blocking comments that are pro Obama. I don’t expect much better from ABC – the ALL About Clinton network!I doubt I’ll see this comment posted either.
Posted by: Pat on the Lake | May 19, 2008, 1:08 am 1:08 am
Worriersome and worriersome. So, now I should vote for the person I don’t really want in case people get angry later and won’t vote for my candidate if my candidate wins because I voted for them? Is it just me? Or, what?
END ELECTIONS NOW! SAVE US FROM DEMOCRACY! Odd advice about the dangers of not uniting the party by someone who kept his race going all the way past Oregon in 1968 against Bobby Kennedy.
The people that are so worried that a primary election will divide the party are acting like the democratic process is scarring us for life.
But worse, the people that are saying this are backing the very candidate that is reckoned to lose if running against Sen. McCain in nearly every national poll conducted throughout this election cycle – Barack Obama. So, is this like projecting their fears, or something?
Hillary supporters – do as Ralph Nader suggested to Hillary Clinton when she was being pushed to drop out of the race for the sake of letting Obama win – “Just tell them this is democracy. Get use to it”.
Posted by: Vic from Oregon | May 19, 2008, 1:26 am 1:26 am
McGovern is a flip-floper just like BO.
They are coming out to silence people and tells us that the race is over; in fact it isn’t. They are telling voters now that their votes shouldn’t count. They are refusing the right of voters to nominate. They are liars and breach the rules of nomination. They are trying to push candidates out rather than candidates crossing finish lines. They can win it and they foul.
BO is a phony. His poetic promises of change is only supported by hot air.
Todd Spivak of the Houston Press has documented how Obama accomplished next to nothing in his first six years in the Illinois legislature.
Then Emil Jones Jr. an African American with thirty years in the legislature made Obama a sponsor of 26 bills that became law. This is how BO portrays himself as a highly successful legislator.
This is just like giving him the ball at 1 yard line.
Has Obama repaid Jones? Yes. He has provided tens of millions in earmarks for Jones’ district. As to such actions, Jones famously said: “Some call it pork; I call it steak.”
Michelle Obama’s salary at University of Chicago Hospitals when her husband won the US Senate seat was $121,000. Within weeks of his swearing in, her salary went to over $320,000. The following year Obama did an earmark request for $1 million for her employer.
BO has used bombastic high-flown language to fool millions of people by poetic promises of change. In reality, he has taken considerable money and support from all sorts of corporate and other special interests. Remember his Bittergate talking to billionaires in San Francisco!
BO’s credential passed in the net is fabricated and not true; FACTCHECK says don’t believe it.
BO ducks and quits on debates, people and the truth. BO does not have the stamina and tenacity to be a true, and solid reformer. BO does not have what it takes to win a nomination and he is counting on the party to send Joe Andrew and John Edwards to stump for him. Hillary has won the support of the working class, the poor, and John Edwards back stab Hillary to endorse BO. He is this sorts which make up the Democratic party. It’s time that we have a candidate to clean up the party. Hillary is tough enough to clean up the party.
The party and BO screw voters, tampering fairness, bending party rules, misleading voters, breaches democracy.
We are sore because BO is a candidate at fault and he is a phony we can’t accept. Ain’t nobody can stick it down our throat.
Posted by: John_Lai | May 19, 2008, 2:18 am 2:18 am
This young Hillary supporter, and many others in the same demographic are not just contemplating voting for McCain if Obama is the Nominee, WE ARE VOTING FOR McCAIN!
We don’t trust Obama and his true agenda. The Republicans will bring out the TRUTH about Obama!
Posted by: Susan | May 23, 2008, 1:12 am 1:12 am
For you Obama supporters who say that if the nomination is “stolen” from him, then you will make sure that the Clinton’s get their payback, I have this to say: I am a Hillary Clinton supporter, but more importantly I am an American, and it is my duty to make sure Obama doesn’t get in. He is an inexperienced liar with terrorist relationships. He is a big divider. He is pompous, arrogant and downright rude.
I more want Obama to NOT get in than I want Hillary in, even though I know that she would be great for the country.
Posted by: Ann | May 23, 2008, 1:22 am 1:22 am
Repubs: Should Hillary go down, we’ll make sure that McCain gets in there. A lot of us are switching our party to independent, not that it makes a difference. Either, we’ll give them ‘Hill or Rain McCain!
Posted by: Anna | May 23, 2008, 1:38 am 1:38 am