The June Myth
Email"It’s still early," said Sen. Hillary Clinton, D-NY yesterday. "I mean, everybody is so focused on where we are right now — I guess I remember that, in June of 1992, that’s when Bill really wrapped up the nomination — the middle of June, after the California primary."
We’ve vetted this claim before and found its accuracy to be wanting.
Then- Gov. Bill Clinton literally did not secure enough delegates through the primary and caucus process until the California primary, June 2, 1992.
But he had sewn up the nomination long before then.
Months before then.
Moreover, the first real contest that year was on February 18, 1992. (No one competed in the Iowa caucuses since Sen. Tom Harkin, D-Iowa, was a candidate that year) The first real contest this year, the Iowa caucus, was January 3, 2008. So you’d also expect that race to last later in the calendar — it started more than a month and a half later.
But regardless of that, here are some key dates for that 1992 race that indicate how misleading this argument is.
February 18, 1992 — Sen. Paul Tsongas, D-Mass., wins New Hampshire primary. A scandal-plagued Gov. Bill Clinton comes in second.
February 20, 1992 — San Diego Union-Tribune headline: "Tsongas got most votes, but Clinton says he won".
February 25, 1992 — Sen. Bob Kerrey, D-Neb., wins the South Dakota primary.
March 3, 1992 — Clinton wins Georgia. Tsongas wins Maryland. Harkin wins Minnesota and Idaho. Former California governor Jerry Brown wins Colorado. Still all very much up for grabs.
March 5, 1992 — With no money, Kerrey ends his campaign. "We were ready to go full throttle," Kerrey says, "but unfortunately we ran out of gas."
March 7, 1992 — Clinton wins South Carolina.
Harkin announces he will drop out.
March 10, 1992 — Clinton cleans up on Super Tuesday, winning Florida, Louisiana, Mississippi, Oklahoma, Tennessee, Texas. Tsongas wins Massachusetts and Rhode Island.
Kerrey: "I would say he’s got a very clear path to the nomination. But it’s not a path without mine fields. There are still things out there that he’s got to worry about. He’s got to win."
Jim Lehrer on PBS: "David, how close is Bill Clinton to being the Democratic nominee tonight?"
David Gergen: "He’s on the verge."
March 17, 1992 — Clinton wins Illinois.
At this point, it becomes clear Clinton will be the nominee.
Tsongas drops out. Only Brown remains in the race.
March 20, 1992 — The Dallas Morning News: "Former Sen. Paul Tsongas abruptly halted his presidential candidacy on Thursday, effectively ending the Democratic contest and turning the primary campaign into a mop-up operation for Arkansas Gov. Bill Clinton. ‘It was clear that we did not have the resources necessary to fight the media war in (the April 7) New York (primary),’ Mr. Tsongas told a packed crowd of supporters in Boston."
The Boston Herald: "A no-holds-barred presidential race between Democrat Bill Clinton and President George Bush – in a clash of generations and vastly different values – was all but sealed yesterday as Paul E. Tsongas ended his quest for the Democratic nomination."
March 24, 1992 — Brown wins Connecticut. Clinton holds a seven-to-one lead in delegates.
March 26, 1992 — Harkin endorses Clinton, expressing concern that the fight between Clinton and Brown will cause divisions in the party that would hurt the nominee in November.
"I say it’s time for Democrats to link arms, dig in our heels, set our sights to work together to put Bill Clinton in the White House in 1992," Harkin says.
Harkin is the first of Clinton’s former opponents to endorse him, and the party begins to officially rally around the presumptive nominee.
April 1, 1992 — Former President Jimmy Carter endorses Clinton, calling him "an honest, decent, competent, idealistic, practical man" who doesn’t deserve to have his character questioned. "Pretty obviously, Gov. Clinton is going to get the nomination," Carter says.
April 4, 1992 — Before the New York primary, Gov. Mario Cuomo says Clinton would be a "superb president."
April 8, 1992 — Bryant Gumbel: "Good morning. Arkansas Governor Bill Clinton, call him flawed, call him slick, but call him a winner this morning. He swept the primaries in New York, Kansas and Wisconsin. Big strides toward the Democratic nomination that seem his for the taking today, Wednesday, April the 8th, 1992."
As a slap in Brown’s face, Tsongas — no longer in the race — comes in second in New York.
April 12, 1992 — House Majority Leader Richard Gephardt, D-Missouri, endorses Clinton. "Bill Clinton will be the kind of president the United States needs to recapture our economic strength and leadership in the post-Cold War world," Gephardt says.
House Speaker Tom Foley, D-Wash: "All the dominoes are falling in favor of Clinton. He is going to be the nominee."
At the California Democratic convention, Brown says Clinton is likely to be the Democratic presidential nominee, and says he will back Clinton if he is nominated.
Austin American-Statesman: "Brown strongly indicated that, having lost the New York primary Tuesday, he will campaign as a crusader for political change rather than as a serious contender for nomination. Ron Brown, national party chairman, said the comments were ‘very positive’ and hinted that the contest has entered a new phase. The two met privately earlier in the day."
April 14, 1992 — Clinton wins the final round of Virginia’s caucuses. "Uncommitted" comes in a strong second,
Brown comes in a distant third.
April 19, 1992 – Senate Majority Leader George Mitchell, D-Maine, endorses Clinton.
Earth Day, 1992 – Clinton challenges President George H.W. Bush to a face-to-face debate on the environment.
April 28, 1992 — Clinton wins Pennsylvania primary, having earned 1,466 of the 2,145 delegates needed to win. Brown has 316 delegates.
And on and on…
This notion that the 1992 presidential race was not over until June is literally true. But it was truly over about five or six weeks after the New Hampshire primary.
Interesting, though, how Bill Clinton and his campaign lobbied big name Democrats to rally around him once it became clear that mathematically he’d be the delegate winner. Though Brown, aware that some horrible big story about Clinton might break and change everything, stuck around.
- jpt
Rick Santorum Sweeps 3 States 
Pentagon to Open Additional Jobs to Women
Hillary is out on the Ledge right now threatening to jump, if she does not get her way. And the Democratic Party is her hostage.
She’s not gonna let facts about 1992 get in the way of her narrative.
New slogan of the superdelegates: Vote for Hillary or ELSE!
Posted by: The Commander Guy | May 8, 2008, 9:01 am 9:01 am
I don’t remember so many people telling Huckabee to drop out and he was really was behind, why the double standards for Sen Clinton? Has everyone forgotten that Sen Obama was suppose to win Indiana, he did not win Indiana and are we surprised that he won a state that was 40% black? There is a lot of time between now and June 3rd and anything could happen.
Posted by: Kardasia_Prime | May 8, 2008, 9:06 am 9:06 am
Vote Mccain will have the house and senate so will be ok. The hell with the Dems.
Posted by: Bishop | May 8, 2008, 9:09 am 9:09 am
You know she does not have the guts to get out of this
Posted by: older person | May 8, 2008, 9:19 am 9:19 am
She needs to stop this silliness now, she tried and and gave it a good run, now the dems need her to support Barck and move forward, John M. is having his way around the country and gaining support, time to move on!
Posted by: Rob | May 8, 2008, 9:21 am 9:21 am
As a former Hillary supporter who wanted a woman as the next POTUS, I’ve realized this is not the one…she distorts the truth with such ease that it scares me.
Why would someone spend $11,425,000 to become the POTUS? POWER! She would have to work 28+ years to recover that investment.
Let’s change Washington! Obama doesn’t owe anyone anything…except people like me who has donated to his campaign and all of America who wants to change the status quo that the Clinton brand represents.
OBAMA/SEBELIUS ’08 & ’12
SEBELIUS ’16
Posted by: Roxanne | May 8, 2008, 9:21 am 9:21 am
Kardasia_Prime said,
I don’t remember so many people telling Huckabee to drop out and he was really was behind, why the double standards for Sen Clinton? Has everyone forgotten that Sen Obama was suppose to win Indiana, he did not win Indiana and are we surprised that he won a state that was 40% black? There is a lot of time between now and June 3rd and anything could happen.
You are wrong. I was a strong supporter of Gov. Huckabee, the GOP forced him to pull out and he stayed in the race until Sen. McCain got the nomination. Please get your story straight. Sorry, you’re a Dem, I guess that’s why you don’t know what happened.
Posted by: Chan | May 8, 2008, 9:23 am 9:23 am
Obama didn’t win the so-called “tiebreaker” state of Indiana, even though he was ahead leading up to their primary. And for Hillary Clinton to have won in North Carolina meant she needed over 70% of the non-black vote.
Obama clearly has had an advantage in the DNC coronation: beside the relentless cheerleading from the media, he also has, along with Pelosi and Dean, ensured that Floridians are disenfranchised. It says a lot about Obama’s character that, although he taught Constitutional Law, when it suits his personal ambitions, he doesn’t support counting all the votes.
Finally, even if Obama were to suddenly make a token offer to count Florida now, the damage has already been done to Hillary’s campaign, since losing votes cast in two key states cost her vital momentum for primaries since Florida and Michigan.
Posted by: andre | May 8, 2008, 9:29 am 9:29 am
@ Kardasia_Prime
For the record, North Carolina is 75% white and 22% black…
Clinton had the majority of the black vote until her husband made the obvious race-baiting excuse as to why Obama won S. Carolina. Why didn’t he include himself and Edwards in his discussion regarding who won S.C. in past primaries? Because he wanted America to start thinking of Obama as black instead of a human being who happened to be born that color.
OBAMA/SEBELIUS ’08 & ’12
Posted by: Roxanne | May 8, 2008, 9:29 am 9:29 am
The race is over, she is only fooling herself, she is a very proud person, but sometimes it just does not work out…
Posted by: Rob | May 8, 2008, 9:34 am 9:34 am
It will be interesting to see how quickly supporters turn on Obama once elected.
He will be in a constant fishbowl with all of America watching, as he tries to please blacks, whites, veterans,his anti-Americans friends,rich,poor.
Al Sharpton has already criticized Obama’s weak response to the Sean Bell case as pandering to whites.
It began when he used his church and pastor to get ahead politically.
Go Hillary or McCain!
Posted by: cindy in nc | May 8, 2008, 9:41 am 9:41 am
She could turn out to be more powerful then Obama in the long run. Without being the president.
Posted by: Melissa | May 8, 2008, 9:42 am 9:42 am
Jake,
Thanks for covering this.
I have also heard that only 45 states took party in the primary/caucuses in 1992. Is this also true?
Why does Hillary demand every state count, but she refuses to admit the National popular vote count is a injustice to the 14 states that have held caucuses?
The elected pledged delegate count is the only accurate method of deciding who the people of all 50 states and territories voted for.
Posted by: Dan | May 8, 2008, 9:43 am 9:43 am
If only more people would have voted for Hillary she would be the nominee. If only the Democrats had the same rules as Republicans, Hillary would be the nominee. If only……..
Posted by: Progressive Democrat | May 8, 2008, 9:48 am 9:48 am
Again there is misleading in her message : voters will still vote , when she will end.
We can see it is going on in GOP.
So they WILL have their chance to be heard.
Clintons are Phony forever.
Posted by: LINDA,FL | May 8, 2008, 9:49 am 9:49 am
The process should go on. If Obama is so great let him get the total pledged delegates he needs. Right now there is no proof he is so awesome. Just the opposite. Why did he lose Indiana if he is so great?! And don’t forget he also lost Pennsylvania, Ohio, and Texas. And if you care to count them also Florida and Michigan. Obama is a highly flawed candidate and I hope we don’t get stuck with him as president of the United States.
Posted by: Luis | May 8, 2008, 9:50 am 9:50 am
this is not even entertaining anymore. this is political obesity, an attention dependency disorder. the clintons’ are strung out on applause. they can’t put it down, they can’t just quit. like any junkie, they have lost all sense of proportion or grace. they cannot tell the truth as most people know it. they are the truth. Hillary, Bill, go inside now and be quiet for a long time. the world does not need you.
Posted by: jggrimm | May 8, 2008, 9:50 am 9:50 am
people like to site that she somehow came back in Indiana and even though she barely won, and obviously she needed to win big in both states to have any clear path to the nomination before last tuesday she had a slim to none chance of taking obama, but there was a chance coming off Obamas worst few weeks in the campaign, but she didnt deliver…she couldnt pull the trigger in NC and Indiana, had she…this would be a different race
Besides that people wont look at the fact that obama in Pennsylvania came within 10 of her 26% lead… but taht doesnt matter, she came from behind to win…lol cmon
lol, why is it that hillary supporters arent completely fed up with the way she has conducted herself in this primary?
i was a hillary supporter up until she started using terribly dirty tactics to win, moving the rules around any way she can to show that she can win…whats the latest one
oh yes, 2210 delegates to win…wierd, didnt hear about this until after indiana, oh and…she agreed that she would not campaign in florida and michigan and that SHE knew the votes wouldnt count…
back then she said…. yea no big whoop
suddenly now… wait if i can get all the votes counted from there i will have a better chance… as long as you odnt give obama any votes from michigan…)
Posted by: bhrandon | May 8, 2008, 9:52 am 9:52 am
people like to site that she somehow came back in Indiana and even though she barely won, and obviously she needed to win big in both states to have any clear path to the nomination before last tuesday she had a slim to none chance of taking obama, but there was a chance coming off Obamas worst few weeks in the campaign, but she didnt deliver…she couldnt pull the trigger in NC and Indiana, had she…this would be a different race
Besides that people wont look at the fact that obama in Pennsylvania came within 10 of her 26% lead… but taht doesnt matter, she came from behind to win…lol cmon
lol, why is it that hillary supporters arent completely fed up with the way she has conducted herself in this primary?
i was a hillary supporter up until she started using terribly dirty tactics to win, moving the rules around any way she can to show that she can win…whats the latest one
oh yes, 2210 delegates to win…wierd, didnt hear about this until after indiana, oh and…she agreed that she would not campaign in florida and michigan and that SHE knew the votes wouldnt count…
back then she said…. yea no big whoop
suddenly now… wait if i can get all the votes counted from there i will have a better chance… as long as you odnt give obama any votes from michigan…)
Posted by: bhrandon | May 8, 2008, 9:54 am 9:54 am
All these comments from Clinton supporters are now COMPLETELY starting to look like people of some weird religion…
They are so hanging on that they don’t care that the ship is sinking…they are still saying they are going to win.
Hello…when you are paddling and screaming for the race officials to stop the other candidate because you are the better competitor…
It’s done.
Posted by: dl | May 8, 2008, 10:11 am 10:11 am
I have CNN—Donna Brazille’s BLESSING to stay home or vote for McCain.
I’m so glad she’s around to show us her most unbiased views.
She is the TYPICAL Obama Supporters…. she will risk losing it all.
Posted by: carpenter.nyc | May 8, 2008, 10:14 am 10:14 am
Obama is the one going into the general with a big hole in his boat.
A big sail does not make up for a HOLE in his boat.
And as they look forward to the winds to push them along….they will only sink faster.
Posted by: carpenter.nyc | May 8, 2008, 10:17 am 10:17 am
Sen. Obama still has ways to go. If Sen. Obama is the Democratic nominee, it would be a big mistake! I am sure the Republicans are going to make Rev. Wright his running-mate in the fall. Having not won even a one major state during the primaries, including California, New York, Texas, Massachusetts, Ohio, Florida, Michigan and Pennsylvania, how can Sen. Obama be a serious front runner? He manipulated the caucuses with small groups of zealots; but they are not in play for the presidential election, Mr. Obama is going to find himself stuck! Our media is wrong to ignore the power and the importance of Latino vote; especially in these 08 elections, the largest minority in the country; a much larger than the black American vote. The Washington media establishment is misleading the country just as usual─ now cheering for Barack Obama are the same people who took us over the cliff in Iraq. Sen. Clinton was able to bring back the Reagan Democrats back into Democratic Party fold, which I think is a huge accomplishment. Sen. Clinton has shown growing support across the demographics, except among African Americans, who have voted mostly for Sen. Obama in overwhelming numbers. But with the solid support from women and Latinos Sen. Clinton, and working Americans Sen. Clinton is best able to defeat Mr. McCain and the Republicans in the fall. On one on one match ups in many critical states like Ohio, Pennsylvania, Florida, Michigan, shows that Sen. Clinton is much better-stronger candidate. Mr. Obama’s coalition that giving him the primary victories are the same that gave the nomination to John Kerry. Without winning the major battleground states Pennsylvania and Ohio, Florida and Michigan Sen. Obama is unlikely be a strong candidate against Sen. John McCain. The best chance of winning the White House for the Democrats is still with Sen. Hillary Clinton.
Posted by: charleychaplin | May 8, 2008, 10:19 am 10:19 am
I guess nobody has ever sen the party split before if you are a long time democrat you should know nobody is going to win in Nov. except Mccain and Iam a democrat
Posted by: Bishop | May 8, 2008, 10:19 am 10:19 am
Exit polls said 40% of the people who voted in the democrated primary were African Americans.
Huckabee appeared on SNL and other shows and had some critics but not as many as Sen Clinton for dropping out. Most shows like Morning Joe were saying that he should stay in until McCain hit the number and that’s what he did.
Posted by: Kardasia_Prime | May 8, 2008, 10:21 am 10:21 am
Fact Hillary can still win.
Posted by: Bishop | May 8, 2008, 10:21 am 10:21 am
If only my candidate, John Edwards would have stayed in the race, he could still have a chance. He has 12 delegates, all of the Super’s could support him and make him the candidate. Come on John, If Hillary can claim that argument, so can you.
Posted by: Progressive Democrat | May 8, 2008, 10:23 am 10:23 am
@nyc
you made me laugh to funny.
Posted by: Bishop | May 8, 2008, 10:26 am 10:26 am
DL -
1) Carter won even after Kennedy tried to switch delegates on the convention floor, Mondale lost b/c he looked like a stick against someone like Reagan, Dukakis wasn’t hurt by Jesse Jackson’s continued “run” in the preimary it was Willie Horton/”Helmet in a tank”. And Clinton won despite Brown’s persistent and hostile campaigning. Not one was hurt by a “campaign to the convention”.
2) If you seriously think the press is simply reporting the facts on the ground, then you’re more gullible than I’d have thought. The bobbleheads have aagendas and most of them either fall into the Chris “I get tingles” MAtthews vein who hate to see their Obama get flustered or the Maureen “nothing the Clintons touch is good” Dowd vein.
Posted by: CJ | May 8, 2008, 10:28 am 10:28 am
Carter did not win Regan did he lost his bid for a second term because Kennedy took it to the floor
Posted by: Bishop | May 8, 2008, 10:30 am 10:30 am
MG,
I wonder how Hillary explains the very first state, Iowa. It is 92% White and she came in third behind Obama and Edwards. More race baiting coming from the Clinton campaign, imagine that.
Posted by: Progressive Democrat | May 8, 2008, 10:32 am 10:32 am
Bishop – You’re right on the fact, wrong on the reasoning. Now that my brain/finger connection is working again, try this: Carter won the nomination, but lost to Reagan — do you really think Kennedy campaign was the reason, and not Panama Canal, Iran hostages, oil shortages, and USSR invasion of Afghanistan? His approval ratings by summer before election were dismal (not compared to GWB’s not, but pretty bad for the time)
Posted by: CJ | May 8, 2008, 10:37 am 10:37 am
It’s only 4 years. You know what you will get from McCain. You have no idea what BO will do.
Posted by: fat cat | May 8, 2008, 10:38 am 10:38 am
If any one thinks that there are not a bunch of women who have put up millions and millions of dollars for Clinton and marched in the streets in the late sixty’s and seventy’s So we could get into Harvard and yale Hillary was one of three women who got to go to yale in 68 we are the ones who fought and are still fighting.This is just another fight. there are many of us and we will not vote Obama.
Posted by: Bishop | May 8, 2008, 10:42 am 10:42 am
Bishop
Anyone who thinks that thiose same women who fought for women’s rights…are now going to vote for McCain.
Is just angry that their candidate lost.
Posted by: dl | May 8, 2008, 10:47 am 10:47 am
true but It didn’t help that Kennedy would not even shake Carter’s hand I know Hillary will not do that and who will talk bad about Bill he got out of a hospital bed AMA to campaign for Kerry But for months Obama went around saying her voters will vote for me but I don’t thik mine will vote for her.and I am only going to run once. I’ve never seen anything like this .
Posted by: Bishop | May 8, 2008, 10:51 am 10:51 am
Clinton’s bad judgment has brought her to this place. Starting out with the best name-recognition, political campaign structure and money on hand, she continued to look to bad advice from Penn and Bill, while everything around her fell apart. Not to mention the bad money management. Apparently she still has not learned anything from the experience, so anyone who tells me she is the ‘best experienced’ makes me laugh. Hanging on to bad advisors and bad management throughout makes me think the country would end up even worse off if she were elected. She needs to do the right thing for the Party and her country and put her own personal desires behind those interests.
Posted by: bernadette | May 8, 2008, 10:52 am 10:52 am
Mccain will still have to get the house and sen. to aprove any judges and they the DEMs are picking up seats.
Posted by: Bishop | May 8, 2008, 10:54 am 10:54 am
I’m with you Jim
Posted by: Bishop | May 8, 2008, 11:01 am 11:01 am
Hillary.. full speed ahead I will never vote for BO!
Posted by: staniam | May 8, 2008, 11:02 am 11:02 am
Commander Guy…yes or else..so what are you going to do about it?
Posted by: Jim | May 8, 2008, 11:03 am 11:03 am
I will tell them and to bad we will lose again. anyone but Obama mighty white of him to agree to sit Fl. and MI after the fact. just talking to the white side of Obama
Posted by: Bishop | May 8, 2008, 11:05 am 11:05 am
He said it over and over in the start of this . It is true
Posted by: Bishop | May 8, 2008, 11:07 am 11:07 am
AGBI
Are you Donna Brazille?
YES WE MC CAIN
YES WE MC CAIN
Posted by: carpenter.nyc | May 8, 2008, 11:08 am 11:08 am
AGBI Two police officer’s sentence to ten years yesterday for the grandmother in Atlanta that one I think it should have been at least fifty.
Posted by: Bishop | May 8, 2008, 11:14 am 11:14 am
I don’t know who he said it to but it was a news channel and it was in March and he said it often he didn’t think his voters would vote for Clinton but her would vote for him
Posted by: Bishop | May 8, 2008, 11:19 am 11:19 am
nyc I agree
Posted by: Bishop | May 8, 2008, 11:21 am 11:21 am
The problem is the media is always making up stuff.
Posted by: Bishop | May 8, 2008, 11:24 am 11:24 am
we are who we have been waiting for weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
Posted by: Bishop | May 8, 2008, 11:26 am 11:26 am
as long as she’s somewhere on the ticket – we’ll vote for them both in a ny minute.
Posted by: meandshelia | May 8, 2008, 11:30 am 11:30 am
It seems the one news reporter driving the “clinton as vp” story seems to be Georgie S.
I personally just want the Clintons gone…go retire somewhere and build your library. There are new sheriffs in town trying to clean up the decades old down hill mess we have finally found ourselves in.
Posted by: dl | May 8, 2008, 11:30 am 11:30 am
Who has less backbone than Howard Dean…….
I’m suprised he can still hold his OWN head-up
Posted by: carpenter.nyc | May 8, 2008, 11:30 am 11:30 am
I would not trust the Clintons standing behind me for a minute if I was the one person who could be removed in any way for her to finally achieve her dream and his legacy.
Posted by: dl | May 8, 2008, 11:32 am 11:32 am
Carpenter NYC
Dean may have gotten stuck in a bad situation left to him from Terry McAuliffe and the people who designed the system…
but considering he didn’t roll over…
I think having no back bone…is not his problem. It seems with all the times he could have thrown Clinton and her campaign under the bus and said…”hey, you guys designed this system” and didn’t.
speaks volumes.
Posted by: dl | May 8, 2008, 11:35 am 11:35 am
Tuesday night knocked a bit of wind out of Hillary’s sails but once she regroups her determination will be solid as ever. And West Virginia next week will offer a big lift.
People are foolish to think this will be over before August. Even if Hillary withdraws in June, I’m sure she’ll just suspend her campaign like Edwards did. That way she can get right back into it come August if the situation has changed.
And she’s right to hold on. Sooner or later women will start to realize that they’ve taken Hillary for granted, that getting behind a woman for the White House is as noble a goal as getting behind a black man. If that perception changes (perhaps via a media backlash?) she’s got a chance. This race is being decided on identity politics but women haven’t participated in it as fully as black people have. Women need to give Hillary the same edge that Obama has gotten from this part of his base.
C’mon, women, wake up!
Posted by: Vnd | May 8, 2008, 11:36 am 11:36 am
Bishop say – “The problem is the media is always making up stuff.”
Some may say the problem is that some (say wingnuts) create their own reality.
Posted by: The Commander Guy | May 8, 2008, 11:37 am 11:37 am
Dont forget “out of many we are one”.
Posted by: Lovy | May 8, 2008, 11:38 am 11:38 am
Bishop
You are on here as much as I am… and I have a good job… a really good job…and there was a time that I did not.
So I understand how the healthcare and economic packages work on the ground for people who don’t have money.
I also understand what it is to turn that around …
I also have met and seen all of the candidates up close and in person (my good job afforded me that chance and living in New hampshire) so I know which ones spoke directly like normal people about problems and solution s and how to approach those…
I also know which candidate walked into rooms like they were royalty and were just awaiting their coronation.
I was a Clinton supporter just like everyone else…until I saw them over and over in my home state for the length of last year. Obama is who he says he is… Clinton is who the political playbook says she is.
That is why I switched. he is the real deal…faults and all.
I wish everyone could have the job I do so they could see all the candidates over and over like I did up close and personal and then make a reasoned judgement.
It’s hard to break out of 15 years of arguments with republicans defending the Clintons…to realize …they are not the bar…they are far from the bar.
It’s hard to change.
Posted by: dl | May 8, 2008, 11:42 am 11:42 am
never said he was bad – have family who voted for him – just feel she’s the more qualified.
and the main reason we would not vote for him if she isn’t on the ticket is because of the way the MSM and democratic antagonist (strategist)have done all they can to slander and belittle her. we don’t need to be harvard grads to see that’s just not the american way.
Posted by: meandshelia | May 8, 2008, 11:42 am 11:42 am
Dean didn’t get stuck with anything he is all about the fifty state thing.
Posted by: Bishop | May 8, 2008, 11:43 am 11:43 am
carpenter,
you’re an idiot.
Posted by: X | May 8, 2008, 11:46 am 11:46 am
i hope obama does not let sen. clinton campaign in the fall for him.
he should just let her go back to work in the senate.
i am sure the dnc will approve of this
Posted by: jgaw | May 8, 2008, 11:46 am 11:46 am
Carpenter NYC
the country wins if we get Obama and everyone knows it.
what is it going to be on the night that Obama wins…
on the streets of our allies nations there will be celebrations…in the villages across the world… those same nations we need to want to “buy american” …those same allies we need to support the war on terror and help us with intelligence…
those same villages where al quaeda is recruiting using Hillary’s “obliterate Iran” video loop to recruit …
we need to regain our standing as a beacon and one candidate will do that.
Read the international news…who is going to have the peoples of the countries of the worlds most on our side… those same people’s who elect their leaders. Those same countries that we need help from in dealing with this war…the environment, the economy…and the war on terror.
We need truth in washington not spin…or theater… (hello gas tax)
America wins…BIG if Obama wins.
Posted by: dl | May 8, 2008, 11:51 am 11:51 am
dl Hillary always thought this would be a hard race she and her Husband have always had to fight I lived in AR. and she visted every county and most school’s and worked very hard to improve education and they have moved up due to her efforts. State paid pre-k was one of her ideas she didn’t give up on health care she works her heart for people most people who get to know her know this about her. And get a job is like get a life just a saying
Posted by: Bishop | May 8, 2008, 11:58 am 11:58 am
Obama couldn’t even BRING PEOPLE OF CHICAGO TOGETHER ….. for 8 Years as a state senator — and Yes he was PRESENT……and that’s all he was.
Any Laws passed while he was thereswas thanks to EMIL JONES….Obama’s Politicial UNCLE.
Obama is an empty Gucci suit. And yes he ONLY has 5, but I doubt it’s from Sears.
Posted by: carpenter.nyc | May 8, 2008, 11:59 am 11:59 am
Nicholas…If Obama is unelectable, why is he winning
Posted by formerhillary.
=============================
Because the activists and left wing
liberals control the agenda in primaries
and all caucuses.
Here what happened in my home state.
My home state is a”RED STATE”.
I vote for Hillary and they told me to
come back at 7 pm for a”delegate”
I went back and the place was full of
blacks waiting on line to get in.
Fight broke out.I went back home.
Hillary won my state but Obama got more
delegates.
Wrong,wrong,wrong………..
DNC DONE WRONG TO HILLARY……
Blacks are the driving force for Obama.
I’m NO longer a democrat.
The party is dominated by blacks and
left wing liberals.
I will vote for McCain in G.E.
Posted by: Nicholas | May 8, 2008, 12:06 pm 12:06 pm
You will see in ht enext few primaries that without the black sympathy vote, Hillary will do VERY well. She is still the best candidate to beat McCain. As soon as Obama would be nominated, Carl Rove would have Obama’s campaign dead in the water. He’s been working on just that for wome time now. Hillary has fought the Republicans for years, and she’s still the only one tough enough to handle them in a Genreal Election and WIN.
Posted by: SM | May 8, 2008, 12:08 pm 12:08 pm
dl sez: “America wins…BIG if Obama wins.”
That’s a mighty big ‘if’, dl. Anyone know what the spread is in Vegas on this contest?
Obama would go into the GE with very big character deficits and more to come. The Dems are on a death march to the sea with major contributors such as Weinstein noticeably upset with the DNC.
This ain’t over.
Posted by: len | May 8, 2008, 12:08 pm 12:08 pm
Hillary thought she was gonna inherit the presidency like Bush Jr. did.
Hillar was wrong; so
Hillary was not ready on Day ONE.
Hillary says today that she has found her voice……. finally fter 35 yrs of experience, that is. But this is to late, because
Hillary already got Beat.
Posted by: The Commander Guy | May 8, 2008, 12:09 pm 12:09 pm
Clinton himself said as much. From Page 407, My Life:
“On April 9, Paul Tsongas announced that he would not reenter the race. The fight for the nomination was effectively over.”
Posted by: DAZ | May 8, 2008, 12:09 pm 12:09 pm
nick,
the black are being USED by the liberals
any hard working black person will realize, obama is not the one.
Posted by: jgaw | May 8, 2008, 12:10 pm 12:10 pm
This Democratic election process has been enough for me. I was a life long registered Dem, but now because of the DNC’s support of obama, I am changing my registration to Republican. I have had enough of the manipulations of this Party in favor of obama. I am delighted that he will never be elected president of this country, because no matter what he or his followers say, he is not presidential material. I almost get sick at the thought of obama, wright and Michelle in the White House serving tea to the leaders of Iran and Hamas, with Louis Farrakhan and William Ayers in attendance – no, it won’t be publicised. Further the thought of Wright and Michelle, both Anti-Americans and black racists, will attempt to change the entire protocol of the White House to favor their causes. It is unthinkable and totally unacceptable. I will vote with pleasure for John McCain.
Posted by: Lou | May 8, 2008, 12:11 pm 12:11 pm
melissa – I absolutely believe together they could do so much good for this country. they are both aware of the need to go across the aisle. what better place to start than right now in this race to the white house? i think that the people who are against this don’t really have the interest of the entire american people foremost. instead only their political interest. also, everyone previously had been saying if Hillary was the nominee Obama HAD to be the vp. she has been an equally strong candidate and has earned the 2nd postion if she doesn’t win the 1st. a win-win for all.
Posted by: meandshelia | May 8, 2008, 12:13 pm 12:13 pm
IMO they want Hillary out early so they can leak any dirt they need to get out about Obama so by the GE it will be old news and they can yell foul if the repugs use it. Obama is going to declare victory on May 20th just like Bush did to Gore in 2000 .Is Rove running Obama campain and then they wonder why her supporters are ticked.
Posted by: Bishop | May 8, 2008, 12:13 pm 12:13 pm
I am not a republican I am a die hard Hill fan
Posted by: Bishop | May 8, 2008, 12:19 pm 12:19 pm
This slick Willy spin on Bill’s primary experience is undoubtedly why one political analyst said Hillary would not be Obama’s VP despite the votes she might be able to bring because Obama would need a food taster. I was stunned even at the apparent joke. Is the opinion of her that bad?
Posted by: Oscar Meyer | May 8, 2008, 12:19 pm 12:19 pm
riiiiight bishop.
Posted by: The Commander Guy | May 8, 2008, 12:21 pm 12:21 pm
It seems that Obama biggest sin is that he had the audacity to get more votes than Hillary.
How dare Obama do this when it was HER turn to be president.
Posted by: The Commander Guy | May 8, 2008, 12:26 pm 12:26 pm
Oh, how I love a fighter like Hillary and if I were her I wouldnt give up either. Barack Obama is the wrong choice for the nomination and if he were the win it, Mccain would beat him badly because Mccain represents America. Barack Obama does not!! Go Hillary! We love you.
Posted by: andrea | May 8, 2008, 12:27 pm 12:27 pm
Obama couldn’t outspend Hillary in Pennsylvania for a win and he couldn’t outspend her in his own back yard – Indiana to buy a win. Hillary is the stronger candidate. The next few primaries do not have the obligatory black vote in his favor. We’ll see that Hillary is the the stromger candidate.
Posted by: SM | May 8, 2008, 12:28 pm 12:28 pm
Can Hillary claim more pledged delegates? No. (even with MI and FL.)
Can Hillary claim majority of popular vote? No. (even with MI and FL)
Can Hillary claim winning more Primary and Caucus states? No. (even with MI and FL.)
So why would Superdelegates want to thwart the will of the voters to appease Hillary? NOT GONNA HAPPEN.
Posted by: Progressive Democrat | May 8, 2008, 12:35 pm 12:35 pm
It’s all about Ms. Clinton’s EGO. She needs to accept the math, unite the party and stop the selfish pursuit of a goal that cannot be acheived.
Posted by: Lynne | May 8, 2008, 12:37 pm 12:37 pm
Voter’s Remorse to all who voted for Obama.
They want their votes back.
Posted by: carpenter.nyc | May 8, 2008, 12:38 pm 12:38 pm
The Commander Guy said: “How dare Obama do this when it was HER turn to be president.”
Right, Commander. We all know that it’s Obama’s turn because Michelle Obama told us so. In fact, threatened us.
Posted by: cappamore | May 8, 2008, 12:40 pm 12:40 pm
I voted for Obama along with millions of other new voters. I think it’s time to grow up, Clinton supporters, and realize that we have a candidate, a big election in the fall and a nation that needs our solutions.
The primary is over – unless Clinton gets 76% of the vote in each of the remaining states – and that is including in the math all of the Fl and Mi votes.
For as much as Hillary talks about “count the votes”, she is ironically begging the superdelagates to ignore the national VOTE totals and give her the nomination. Like I said, EGO.
Posted by: Lynne | May 8, 2008, 12:45 pm 12:45 pm
In the late 1970s, the Clintons and McDougals buy land in the Ozarks with mostly borrowed funds. The Clintons get 50% interest with no cash down. The plot, known as Whitewater, is fifty miles from the nearest grocery store. The Washington Post will report later that some purchasers of lots, many of them retirees, “put up houses or cabins, others slept in vans or tents, hoping to be able to live off the land.” HRC writes Jim McDougal, “If Reagonomics works at all, Whitewater could become the Western Hemisphere’s Mecca.” More than half of the purchasers will lose their plots thanks to the sleazy form of financing used.
The McDougals will be among a number of close HRC’s friends and business associates who will end up in jail. Others include her law partner Webster Hubbell and financial middle man David Hale.
Posted by: Progressive Democrat | May 8, 2008, 12:46 pm 12:46 pm
Obama and his rich Bleeding Heart Liberals will raise our taxes….
Everything will go up.
And Obama with his Militant America Hating wife are laughing all the way to the bank.
Thank you Obamabots for selling out our country on the bases of JUST WORDS.
Posted by: carpenter.nyc | May 8, 2008, 12:46 pm 12:46 pm
WHY HILLARY CAN BE NOMINATED…I recently heard most of the ,week of 9/11, Pastor Wright hate speech about the attack on the Twin Towers. It was the coldest cruelest speech I have ever heard. While even countries that do not like us much were in sympathy this guy was screaming and that ” The chickens had come home to roost.” That the attacks were indeed justified and he goes on for a long time listing reasons in a screaming hateful voice. There was no sign of empathy for the victims or their greiving families. That speech was over 6 years ago. Of course Obama knew of this speech, he is attuned, he had to have at least heard about it if he was not there and yet he had Wright be the one who baptised his childern later and continued attending for years. Wright is not just offbeat or “eccentric” as Obama tried to make us believe in his Philadelphia speech. He is a vessel of hatred and racism and it does rub off on Obama…What the super delegates should consider and maybe Pelosi and others are starting to think, is that while, true, for the supers to be the deciding factor in this election will make many livid for some time, that maybe because Obama is truly probably not electable by the USA as a whole, that we Democrats need to come to our senses here. Hillary has not used and could not use things like Wright’s hate speech videos in her ads but the Republicans will, and much more that she did not use. Republicans will juxatapose Obama saying good things about Wright with exercpts from those videos with Wright’s extreme hatred of most about the USA. It is hard to believe that so many believe that Obama will triumph in November. I would like to know what their reasoning might be. If we count his big loss in very key Florida where he was on the ballot and some more wins by Hillary then she has a case.
Posted by: bruce | May 8, 2008, 12:46 pm 12:46 pm
Two months after commencing the Whitewater scam, Hillary Clinton invests $1,000 in cattle futures. Within a few days she has a $5,000 profit. Before bailing out she earns nearly $100,000 on her investment. Many years later, several economists will calculate that the chances of earning such returns legally were one in 250 million.
Hillary Clinton makes a $44,000 profit on a $2,000 investment in a cellular phone franchise deal that involves taking advantage of the FCC’s preference for locals, minorities and women. The franchise is almost immediately flipped to the cellular giant, McCaw.
Posted by: Progressive Democrat | May 8, 2008, 12:48 pm 12:48 pm
Oh, fercryingoutloud. Nit-pick, nit-pick, nit-pick. No matter how hard you and your talking head cohorts try, Hillary is NOT going to drop out of this race. Sheesh. What a pathetic story.
Posted by: Vickie | May 8, 2008, 12:48 pm 12:48 pm
To Progressive Democrat:
The percentage of the African American and white vote in Iowa has nothing to do with Obama’s victory there – It was the sad fact that Iowa and the majority of other states won by Obama were caucus states – a fundamentally flawed, antiquated and undemocratic process that disenfranchises thousands of voters.
The other fact leading to his victory there was Clinton’s refusal to withdraw her name from the Michigan ballot which damaged her with the zealots in the left wing of our party.
And just for the record I’m a proud liberal Democrat that will be voting McCain in the fall. and it has nothing to do with the color of the candidates’ skin and everything to do with the content of their character.
Posted by: oldspice | May 8, 2008, 12:50 pm 12:50 pm
progressive dem,
why are you talking about that stuff?
we all know the story, we all may have facts for the supermarket tabloids to add that you did not read.
Posted by: jgaw | May 8, 2008, 12:51 pm 12:51 pm
Oh, gee, you mean she’s not telling the truth?
Posted by: John | May 8, 2008, 12:51 pm 12:51 pm
A drug dealer donates $20,000 to the DNC, attends a Christmas reception hosted by Hillary Clinton, has his photo taken with the Clintons and Al Gore and then — three weeks later — is arrested for smuggling 6,000 pounds of cocaine into the United States. It should have come as no surprise to anyone involved. After all, Jorge Cabrera had already served two prison sentences — one for trying to bribe a grand jury witness and the other for filing a false income tax return. Later he will be back in the news when a businessman pleads guilty to laundering $3.5 million for Cabrera between 1986 and 1996.
“I see the White House is like a subway — you have to put in coins to open the gates.” — Clinton contributor Johnny Chung talking about the $50,000 he gave Hillary Clinton’s top aide while seeking VIP treatment at the White House.
Posted by: Progressive Democrat | May 8, 2008, 12:52 pm 12:52 pm
Oldspice,
You are a liar. Any proud liberal democrat would never vote for McCain. Maybe Nader but not McCain. Try again.
Posted by: Progressive Democrat | May 8, 2008, 12:55 pm 12:55 pm
All Obama has are JUST WORDS.
( And most aren’t even his own words )
JUST WORDS
YES WE CAN
JUST WORDS
HOPE
JUST WORDS
CHANGE
And without a speech he can read from—-he stammers like a jackhammer…..cause he really is lost without JUST WORDS…. preferably written of course.
The Democratic Party has become a laughing stock to the Republicans and all Independents.
NOT because Hillary has done her job BUT because the Democrats took hook line and sinker to JUST WORDS.
Posted by: carpenter.nyc | May 8, 2008, 12:58 pm 12:58 pm
So if someone give Obama $ 625000.00 to purchase his House, it’s ok?
Cause he couldn’t buy his Dream House without REZKO.
uh uh…boneheaded.
Posted by: carpenter.nyc | May 8, 2008, 1:03 pm 1:03 pm
Carpenter NYC
Obama at the least writes almost all of his own speeches by himself.
It’s funny because those words have concepts behind them that Hillary doesn’t seem to get.
and the Republicans aren’t laughing when Newt and the rest are saying Republicans need to shape up because right now …Obama looks pretty concrete to the attacks they were going to use that Hillary already did.
When Newt, Joe S. and half of the Fox News boys are telling the republicans to worry and get their act together…they ain’t laughing…they wanted to face Hillary…
Posted by: dl | May 8, 2008, 1:06 pm 1:06 pm
The chances of Obama, who cannot debate, who lives by the script of Deval Patrick(Governor of Massachutes), who has many things to explain, whom Hillary could not really go after as he is in her party, getting the Presidency of these United States by beating a universally admired war hero, who spent 5 years in captivity in serving his country, who has been considered the most willing to work with Democrats Republlican in the Senate, who has many years experience in key debates and is definitely ready for prime time, is about 10,000 to one. Time to get real and get off the Obama trip before he drives us into 4 more years of vetos and judges who lack understanding.
Posted by: bruce | May 8, 2008, 1:06 pm 1:06 pm
You know carpenter NYC
all these amorphous …incendiary “old” campaign tactics that you right about…won’t hunt anymore when the US is getting worse.
The whole Taxes will be raised thing… as opposed to McCain?
so we should borrow more money from China?
Because his policies won’t add up. The war alone with what it is taking financially is going to put the burden squarely on the backs of our kids and grandkids.
A war and a foreign policy stance that is making us less safe by far not more.
Economically McCain doesn’t have a leg to stand on.
Posted by: dl | May 8, 2008, 1:12 pm 1:12 pm
dl…Newt said on The View, Hillary would be harder for McCain to run against. They can’t wait to go against Obmama and are creating attack ads as we speak. Behar, said this on The View yesterday or the day before. REPUBLICANS KNEW HILLARY IS TOUGHER TO BEAT…SHE IS LEFT OF CENTER, McCAIN RIGHT OF CENTER….OBAMA SO FAR IN LEFT FIELD, MIDDLE AMERICA (majority of population) WILL NOT VOTE BO!
Posted by: Debra | May 8, 2008, 1:14 pm 1:14 pm
McCain won’t come close when more soldiers are dying…more are committing suicide…more starving villages ravaged by war and famine are being convinced tat the US is a “war mongering nuclear satan” in the words of al quaeda…
More foreign companies see less market for people”buying American”…
More focus on the consumption of oil rather than the painful unavoidable removal of dependence on it.
and more super conservative people chosen for the highest law enforcing body and authority in the land.
America will not make the same mistakes it has with fear and the Bush administration…when that fear and those policies got us here.
Posted by: dl | May 8, 2008, 1:18 pm 1:18 pm
If the war becomes the prime issue McCain will not be hurt that much. He is very good at adjusting his message. He will remain against withdrawas and as to the 100 years remark, all he needs to say is “Do you think I meant that literally?” I mean get real. He is good. He beat a pile of very good oponents while Rush, O’Reilly and other Republican string pullers were raving against him. Obama must be sent to the showers and Hillary “Rocky” Clinton sent in to close out this guy McCain.
Posted by: bruce | May 8, 2008, 1:22 pm 1:22 pm
Debra
Newt said on the view two weeks ago when it looked like Hillary had a chance and the republicans wanted her to be the nominee. As soon as Obama was locked in Newt sent out the letter (which Giuliani actually backed up as well)…
You prove my point the republicans wanted and pitched Hillary every chance they could…they did not want him to be the nominee. As soon as the NC vote came in …you saw the phones of every old “red dog” light up and letters and interviews went out saying…”fellow republicans we are in for it…you better change”…
Guess what they see the writing on the wall. They wanted to run against Hillary…they got Obama… soon to be President Obama.
Posted by: dl | May 8, 2008, 1:26 pm 1:26 pm
Obama can’t win WV so he won’t go there.
Posted by: Bishop | May 8, 2008, 1:29 pm 1:29 pm
To Progressive Dem:
Liar? …Yet another reason I have lost faith in the left wing of my party…it’s been overtaken by a bunch of rude 13 year olds.
First of all, I wouldn’t honor Nadar with my vote since he saw fit to put his ego in front of the greater good of our country in 2000 and helped hand the White House to George Bush.
Second, whether or not you see it this way – the Presidency is a unique and precious position – and I’m sorry but Obama is undeserving of the honor -
To sit in that church for 20 years and use Rev. Wright for his own political needs and then throw the man away like a piece of garbage when he’s no longer of use was disgraceful and to conspire with his supporters in the Florida and Michigan legislatures to disenfranchise those voters because it serves his short term political needs speaks volumes of what kind of man he truly is.
I may disagree with McCain on things but he has proven himself an independent thinker and a man willing to take positions outside the hard line of the Republican party. He served his country with honor and distinction and if given a choice between the two, this liberal Democrat will have no problem making one.
Posted by: oldspice | May 8, 2008, 1:30 pm 1:30 pm
The supporters of Sen Obama & CSen Clinton had better realize that this was a fight within the Democratic Family and that the most important thing is not the candidate his or herself but the ideas and solutions put forth to help America. A McCain Presidency means no end to Iraq, an end to Roe v. Wade, through the appointment of 2 Conservative Supreme Court justices, No economic, educational and enviromental plan to lead America into the future! I personally think Sen clinton should run her historic candidacy to the end of the primaries, because she owes it to her supporters.
Sen Clinton campaigned today in West Virginia and she refrained from attacking Sen Obama and concentrated on the issue of importance to the Citizens.Democrats the fight between the family is over, now is the time to make fundamental changes in the Politics of old. Now we have a chance to
have government of the people and for the people!
Democrats are on course to victory unless we get caught up in petty distractions
Dems united 08
Posted by: jld1959 | May 8, 2008, 1:31 pm 1:31 pm
Why won’t many Democrats vote for McCain. He was the one Republican who the Party actually attempted to get to switch a few years ago. He will garner the huge Latino vote as though they like Hillary a lot they also like McCain’s immigration stance. They went for Hillary in the primary but Obama can forget them. McCain has often co-sponsered bills with Democrats. He has often angered the Republican right by his rejecting their views. He has always been considered the darling of the Independents. If the Democratic Party does not dump Obama and damn the outcry from the left, then John McCain will be the next President.
Posted by: bruce | May 8, 2008, 1:33 pm 1:33 pm
Hillary won’t beat McCain…it is an election to “change” the direction of the White House and Washington…
Obama represents that best overwhelmingly… but McCain (even with his horrible policies and wanting to further the mobvement to change the highest court in the land)…represents change better than Clinton…she is part of the Bush/Clinton “thing”…
It’s done all but her choice to quietly and respectfully get out support the party and make an attempt to regain her seat (hoping that now that she has pissed off even half of her state she can get it again) or attempt to ruin him and the party in an attempt for a run in 2012 and be shown the door by every person who believes that the policies of ending the war, making us safer, getting our standing back in the world, a woman’s right to her own body, and affordable healthcare… they all will start to stand up and show her the door at that point…whether her supporters are still blindly marching off the cliff with her or not.
Posted by: dl | May 8, 2008, 1:33 pm 1:33 pm
Would everyone be suprised Obama won NC??
It would be suprised if he didn’t win…
So why are people so excited about Obama winning NC? He was so expected to be backed up by his loyal AA half brother….
It just proved again and again the same patters Obama has since day one: he continuously won overwhelming AA and he was continuously defeated among white votes and other minority votes..
There is nothing new here, is there???
Posted by: True Truth | May 8, 2008, 1:34 pm 1:34 pm
As you say she is technically right.
The republican do not want to run against Obama especially Mccain. They know everything they say is going to be turned into race.
If Mccain is smart he would put a woman other than Condi Rice on the ticket. Many woman are ready to bolt the democratic party. I have been a democrat for 37 years never voted any-other way. Yesterday I changed my affiliation to no affiliation. I will not blindly vote democrat anymore, my vote will have to be earned.
Posted by: Florida Cat | May 8, 2008, 1:42 pm 1:42 pm
If Obama’s change/hope tone worked, he should have won majority of white votes and other minority votes….
Besides, what is the exact change he will bring to America with the same old politicians backing him?? Does he have a new vision of foriegn policies (the same old talk on War on Iraq and trade)? Does he have any new plans to boost our economy? Does he have any feasible solutions to our oil problems, healthcare problems, social security problems, immigration problems???
Please don’t do the change just for the sake of change.. If there is no substance, it is just a fool…
Posted by: True Truth | May 8, 2008, 1:42 pm 1:42 pm
Why does Obama run scared over debates? You’d think he’d want to warm up for McCain, if he has this nom so in the bag. I just spoke to a young man in Hillary’s Oregon office and they are still working hard to get him to debate her. They have offered four different dates and he still won’t commit. He has done this since February, because we all know he is better SCRIPTED! Oh my god, his stutter and stammer answers are hard to comprehend. I signed a petition to get him to debate Hillary in Oregon….puss that he is.
Posted by: Debra | May 8, 2008, 1:42 pm 1:42 pm
Bruce…well said…McCain’s the man to do it, if Hillary isn’t the woman to get the nom. It’s pathetic the media/press are so liberal and do not represent the majority of Americans. You should see the horrible cover of TIME next week…they are so slick pushing Obama. Well I have spoken to Hillary’s offices in the upcoming states and she is staying in this. Anybody this close in votes, would be stupid to drop out now. HILLARY OR McCAIN ’08!
Posted by: Debra | May 8, 2008, 1:49 pm 1:49 pm
Well we know she isn’t good at math…maybe she can’t read a calendar either.
Either way she is not getting out and plans an ugly ugly floor fight right after she keeps telling us Obama is the “black” candidate. I know he is and this older white woman will keep on supporting him.
Posted by: Math | May 8, 2008, 1:49 pm 1:49 pm
McCain is a great hero and a great Senator. I am glad he is one of our great leaders.
But what he has signed on for and is promising to do with the White house…will weigh so heavy on future generations that it would be impossible for anyone who cares about women’s right to choose, not being financially beholden to china, who understands that all of our issues and the road we are going down have direct relation with how the world is progressively more and more viewing our country, how our safety has to do with the intelligence we receive from other countries, how the Buch economic policies of protecting the haves and saying the market will protect the have-nots…is another reason we are HERE…NOW at this point…and looking down the road at a potential disaster with oil dependence and terrorism rising out of hatred for our country.
McCain fortunately does not have the hand to win when it is finally brought out into the light of day from the shadows it has been in from this extended primary on the democratic side.
The problem is now…will there be enough time for people’s eyes to adjust.
Posted by: dl | May 8, 2008, 1:51 pm 1:51 pm
Yeah!!!OldSpice….how beautifully said. Take comfort their are millions of us who think likewise. I listen to Repbulican talk radio often, and yesterday a gentleman called expressing his fear and anxiety over this election, but Hugh Hewitt, said don’t worry, Sen. McCain will not let these out of touch liberals take over this great country. I beleve that. An Obama presidency would be devastating….it’not going to happen with college kids/blacks/radical-liberals the bulk of his base. Rest assured.
Posted by: Debra | May 8, 2008, 1:56 pm 1:56 pm
Hillary’s comments in USA Today about white voters demonstrates how divisive and self-serving her motivations are at this point. She knows that she cannot win the nomination, but she is in effect ‘poinsoning the well’ for Obama. She is tacitly signalling to white voters that she understands that they won’t vote for Obama in the general.
The superdelegates or party elders would be wise to get her out of the race or tell her to stop the racist comments.
Posted by: suzanne | May 8, 2008, 1:57 pm 1:57 pm
Obama can’t beat McCain if he can’t win white votes and majority of Independents…..
Less and less people believe his change/hope and more focus on the capability, experience and strength and policies…
He is no longer to attract independents or Reps after all his weaknesses came out…
So the question is: can his loyal AA and young voters boost him enough to win over McCain??
Posted by: True Truth | May 8, 2008, 1:57 pm 1:57 pm
Debra
every woman that has fought for the protection of women…and Roe vs. Wade.
Should be bothered by the fact that you post things like Hillary or McCain.
What you prove is that it is not about ending the war
or the economy
or our standing in the world
or healthcare
or the mortgage crisis
or our dependence on oil
or a right leaning supreme judicial body
or any of the other issues that McCain holds and Hillary “supposedly” holds…
It is about Hillary.
Well it’s not and I think most Americans know it is about them and the government they elect…not Hillary winning her position.
Posted by: dl | May 8, 2008, 1:58 pm 1:58 pm
dl…for delusional…yeah the Republicans were all surprised Obama won NC. Right. You can keep telling yourself that, but since I am a registered Republican, who voted for Hillary here in Calif, the circles I run in know she is the stronger candidate against McCain….just look at her campaign. She is still surviving with millions supporting her and Obama is running from debates again. I KNOW Hillary would be a more formidable candidate against McCain. OBAMA WILL LOSE!
Posted by: Debra | May 8, 2008, 2:02 pm 2:02 pm
carpenter.nyc…we all know this and I’m with you. Unfortunately our MSM is all owned by the same billionaire liberals “bundling” money into BO’s campaign. TIME magazine is putting out this weeks cover page with Obama’s mug and the headline “And the winner is…”
Boy those leftys wish. It just won’t happen with mainstream Amercica WHO HAVE HISTORICALLY VOTED MIDDLE RIGHT..LAST 8 OUT OF 10 ELECTIONS FOR PRES. HAVE BEEN REPUBLICAN! Obama is unelectable on issues of character, judgement, patriotism, and experience (he has only worked 143 days in Senate.)
Posted by: Debra | May 8, 2008, 2:16 pm 2:16 pm
Debra
“just look at her campaign”
she is losing.
and she had the entire democratic establishment behind her at one time …and in most states…
actually really I should say…she lost.
She lost with millions and millions of dollars and eight years of imagery of her IN the white house…and the name recognition as the “queen” of the party…
and she still lost…and had to loan her campaign money and be a deadbeat on bills.
She lost even though not a single scandal was brought up from the “lists” of scandals in her background…and she is the one that is a “fighter”? yet never answered a single question about any of those scandals in herlong list… and she lost.
She lost with a surrogate out campaigning and getting her twice the press coverage if not more with the last Democratic President out on the stump EVERYDAY pitching for her.
and she lost.
so I agree “just look at her campaign”
Posted by: dl | May 8, 2008, 2:46 pm 2:46 pm
and I never said the Republicans were surprised by Obama winning NC
I said they were panicked at what happened that night…
because their last hope of Hillary being the nominee was done …
You can try and twist that but the letters and statements are out there. You as a registered republican…(now arguing for Hillary lol) should know when you watch FOX the tone changed.
Did you never ask yourself why when over the past few years all the republican pundits would laugh and say Hillary will have to avoid all the scandals…everyone would say…what Hillary brings to a run for the presidency was the clinton years …but she also brought the scandals…as soon as the primaries started and she announced… the republican pundits never mentioned (ever) any of the Clinton scandals…
why would that be? hmmm…they didn’t hold back on Obama?
Have some common sense. I am not spinning the letters newt wrote and Fox News was saying the night and next morning after NC and Ind. … or Giuliani’s reinforcement of what Newt said.
Posted by: dl | May 8, 2008, 2:53 pm 2:53 pm
Debra is a 28% er Bush Loving Republican. The Democrats could run the socialist Senator from Vermont, Sanders against the decrepid and feeble minded McCain and still win. No matter how loud the Right wing nuts claim the Democrats are “liberal”. All they have to do is look at the last 8 years and say, no more.
Posted by: Progressive Democrat | May 8, 2008, 3:04 pm 3:04 pm
dl…yeah, I watch FOX news and Hannity and O’Reilly have done this country a service for exposing Obama for the loser he will be in Nov. No one backed off on the Bosnia fire, her only big slip up. Bill’s not running so bringing up his old news ISN’T news.
Can’t wait to watch my other candidate of choice, McCain, tonight on O’Reilly.
Posted by: Debra | May 8, 2008, 3:23 pm 3:23 pm
Most of America is remembering that Hannity, O’Reilly, Fox are half the problem that got us into this situation in the first place.
It was those news outlets that was the megaphone for the old scare candidate last time…
We will make sure as Americans that people remember that.
Posted by: dl | May 8, 2008, 3:45 pm 3:45 pm
dl…get this straight. I am a 49 year old Republican. I love Hannity and O’Reilly for expressing views MILLIONS of us have. Some Amerians sitll hold values and love of our country dear to our hearts. Not the zealous, radicals that support Obama, tho. I was just reading of the threatened riots that will take place from the black organizations, letter to Dean, if Obama is not the nominee. What a shame…I wonder if they will riot when McCain wins in Nov. I am not a racist. I don’t care if Obama is purple….I don’t like him for a President. Pure and simple. I knew about Wright months ago, and the more I found about Obama the more I knew I could never vote for him. I have looked at this from hiring an employee standpoint, for the highest office in our country. I have two applicants for the job, either would be fine with me….Clinton or McCain.
Posted by: Debra | May 8, 2008, 3:54 pm 3:54 pm
DL – so many counter-arguments, so little time …
“HRC had it all … and lost it” – polls were all it ever was, and early ones at that. People don’t make up their minds until they have to. Equiv of saying “Yes I want steak for dinner” when that’s the only choice, and then opting for shrimp when it’s available.
“Repubs are scared to run against Obama, why else did they go easy on HRC and never bring up the scandals?” … Hmm – b/c REPUBS WASTED 8 YRS and more than $70M (don’t forget the cost of COngressional investigations to add to Starr/Ray) to prove that they couldn’t prove anything! Not their best moment then, and certainly not a good idea to remind everyone of their tactics and failure back then.
“McCain is McBush … and its the end of civilization” … only one word – CONGRESS! Almost all of the points you mention, need to run through Congress. I’d rather vote in the right Dems (and get them to man-up) than vote for Obama.
Posted by: Sandy | May 8, 2008, 4:29 pm 4:29 pm
Debra,
As a union member for all of my past working life, I made the choice to be a Democrat at the age of 18.
Although I didn’t always agree with party positions (I am pro-gun, against illegal immigration rights, etc.), I always voted for the Democrat presidential candidate.
And, there were some losers: Carter, Mondale, Dukakis, Kerry just to name a few. They were the most liberal of the liberals, but I tried to remain loyal to the party that I thought best represented my views.
Was I ever wrong! And this year’s nomination debacle courtesy of the Democrat leadership and the DNC was the last straw. Obama is the worst of the worst.
Any party and candidate that is so two-faced as to cry and whine about the elections of 2000 and 2004 while they unashamedly move to do the same thing (in one way or another) to Michigan and Florida voters has lost national and international credibility and my support…permanently.
For 34 years I was a Democrat. I am now registered as an independent. As with a growing number of dissatisfied and disgusted Democrats (and former Democrats), I will vote for whoever is running against Barack Obama.
The Republican party and the ranks of independent voters will grow exponentially this year as the exodus from the failure of the Democrat party and its leadership continues.
Posted by: Jayhawk | May 8, 2008, 4:32 pm 4:32 pm
By the way, dl, neither the Republicans nor any one else that can read were surprised that Obama won a state where about a third of Democrats are minority with almost 98% of that group voting for the half-black candiate.
Get a grip on the reason that Obama has won where he won. Minorities gave him caucuses and the resulting delegates in states where he could have never won a primary.
While Democrats have admitted time and time again that their rules are a flawed and have failed the process, changing them for the next election will not help them in this one.
Republicans could run Pee Wee Herman against Barack Obama and win by a landslide. Obama has effectively split the Democrat party along almost every line of contention possible.
President McCain…
Get used to it…
Posted by: Jayhawk | May 8, 2008, 4:41 pm 4:41 pm
Since when would putting the “Freddie Kruger” of American Politics, Hillary Clinton on the Democratic Ticket, be anyone’s idea of a dream? Clintonista’s in the mainstream media are trying to sell this story the same way they have tried to maintain the pseudo reality that she has a path to the nomination. It is clear powerful forces are trying to force Obama’s hand into choosing her. First of all this would be a catastrophe. Trust me Hillary does not want to “count all the white people” who support her. Because that pool of folks just ain’t all that deep. The fact is that there are a hell of alot of white men and white thinking women who really detest the racist, deceptive and fraudulent campaign that she has waged. Hillary has employed every tactic from George Wallace, Jessie Helms, Lee Atwater and Karl Rove’s playbook and truthfully it has made more and more American despise her and everything she represents. She lost. She should withdraw, apologize and exercise some dignity and class. But I am afraid that her blind ambition for power will make that very unlikely. So, I say to Hillary, you think all the white people are with ya? Think again honey. It just ain’t so. I grew up in a family of construction workers and electricians. None of them are for your candidacy my dear.
Posted by: Christopher London | May 8, 2008, 5:02 pm 5:02 pm
Jayhawk, you sound like me I have been a democrat for 37 years never voted any-other way. Yesterday I re-register as no affiliation. I will never again give my vote blindly.
Posted by: Florida Cat | May 8, 2008, 5:07 pm 5:07 pm
FOX is more balance than NBC/MSNBC or CNN. When was the last time Keith O had anyone on who disagreed with him?
Posted by: Florida Cat | May 8, 2008, 5:10 pm 5:10 pm
So once again Hillary gives her “version” of reality. Always thinking that the rubes won’t know any better.
Maybe she should have those contact lens she wears looked at because they sure don’t help her see things as they truly are.
Posted by: Richard | May 8, 2008, 5:22 pm 5:22 pm
Christopher so sorry you have to bring race into your comments. It doesn’t matter if Obama is purple….it’s what he stands for to many Americans (except the 98% of black support) that makes him unelectable. I get so frustrated as a 49 year old white Republican who crossed over for Hillary. OBAMA IS INEXPERIENCED (143 days worked in Senate so far), LACKING CHARACTER AND JUDGEMENT (I can’t even list all his negatives here) and LACKING PATRIOTISM (McCain will cream him here).
I DON’T CARE ABOUT HIS SKIN COLOR…..I WOULD HAVE VOTED COLIN POWELL.
I AM NOT A PARTY LOYALIST. Ninty percent of the time, I vote Rep, but not always. Economy, national security are of importance to me….BUT I VOTE WITH MY HEAD AND MY HEART everytime.
NO OBAMA ’08….HOPE CHANGE HATE
Posted by: Debra | May 8, 2008, 5:25 pm 5:25 pm
With regard to Obama’s so called lack of experience, just look at JFK, who was very inactive in the senate, was frequently ill, and was not a great orator until he started running for president, and improved dramatically. JFK’s experience was practically non-existent but was a revered and fine president. Obama actually writes the majority of his speeches, unlike JFK and Reagan. Obama is the brightest president we will ever have, and has consistently shown good judgement with regards to the Iraq war and foreign policy in general. His poor judgement was in underestimating the character of several people he associated with, or more pointedly, people that other people introduced to him so that they could help with his fund raising efforts. These are easy lessons to learn, especially for a younger politician. Hillary has made far more mistakes, bith on her own, and with flawed associations, and the modern press writes them off as previously ‘vetted’. Same for big BIll. We all make these types of mistakes, just not to the horrendous extent for which the Clintons have shown time after time. One of Hillary’s former employers during the Watergate times, who has no axe to grind, said that Hillary was one of the biggest liars he ever had working for him, and he had to fire her for her dishonesty, while refusing to write her a letter of recommendation- only one of two people ever under him that he could not in good conscious support with a letter of recommendation. This speaks volumes about her character, even when she was a young democrat in her 20′s. Bill of course is far worse, but their bad behavior accounts for while they are still together. they are two peas from the same pod.
Posted by: rob | May 8, 2008, 5:35 pm 5:35 pm
Rob…I believe JFK had 12 years in the Senate NOT 143 days.
Posted by: Debra | May 8, 2008, 5:41 pm 5:41 pm
This should play out until August, when they can revote in MI. All Americans deserve a vote….OBAMA ONLY WINS 26% OF WHITE WORKING CLASS…OBAMA IS TOAST.
Posted by: Debra | May 8, 2008, 5:44 pm 5:44 pm
LOL Debra, how do you figure Obama is toast, wishful thinking right. And there won’t be any revote. They’s already a plan on seating them.
Posted by: ll | May 8, 2008, 5:47 pm 5:47 pm
Obama and foreign policy? What planet did that take place on? Must be the same planet Rob is on, because it sure isn’t here.
Has Obama even been to Iraq? Oh, that’s right. Obama did go to Somalia and play dress up with a turban.
Obama didn’t vote on going to into Iraq as he was not yet a member of the U.S. Senate. Obama just stated his position as many Americans did.
When in the United States Senate, Obama voted exactly the same on Iraq war bills as Hillary Clinton except for one time when he voted with John McCain. Of course, a lot of times he missed votes or just voted “present.” There’s real leadership.
As I have stated before, Barack Obama is no John F. Kennedy. A better Obama correlation would be Louis Farrakhan, Tony Rezko, or Jeremiah Wright.
When I think of JFK, I don’t just think of his political service. Like John McCain, John Kennedy’s character was shaped by sacrifice and service in the military. Has anyone ever heard of PT109?
Before people on blogs compare great men like John F. Kennedy to political hacks like Barack Obama, they need to at least have a semblance of accurate information and show some respect for those who have made the ultimate sacrifice for their country.
Posted by: Jayhawk | May 8, 2008, 5:58 pm 5:58 pm
Excellent comments Jayhawk.
Posted by: Debra | May 8, 2008, 6:22 pm 6:22 pm
How do you experts know what kind of president Obama will be, the same things you say have been said about every candidate who has run for president. Only time can tell, not know-it-alls, John Kennedy won the presidency by a thread bare margin and seems to have done alright, even by your self important standards.
Posted by: fool me once | May 8, 2008, 8:12 pm 8:12 pm
REV. Wright’s and his connection with OBAMA of 20 years with audacity and hope would have turned away many votes. If we took that off OBAMA’s popularity vote, he is not so unelectable.
take away the rural American votes, the catholic votes, the working class …
He is a shaky candidate in Nov
Now he is so conceited, he needs a spank and shoes in his mouth.
Posted by: John_Lai | May 8, 2008, 10:36 pm 10:36 pm
Sandy
get your facts straight…
I never said anything about Hillary having it all and polls and whatever…you should get your commentors straight. Hillary did have the backing of the democratic elite and lots o moneys that she lost…but nothing that has anything to do with polls?
and if I hear this stupid Starr report investigated and found nothing argument again…ugh…
Republicans wasted 70 million dollars and focused on getting BILL OUT OF OFFICE…that was the point…once they had Monica and him lying on the stand and to the American people that’s what they focused on…and yes they did find out and drew up documents to go after Hillary for White water…but they knew it would be just another legal battle and fought off scandal from the Clintons and SHE was not the target… it is even being reported today from that 1200 page playbook the they had waiting for her… they have one for Obama too, but it ain’t as long as the Clinton’s… years and years of scandals that have lots of details that you all have not heard…and some you have but most of America thinks the Clinton scandals are MOnica and some word “whitewater” oh and maybe something to do with cattle…they don’t know all the details with Hillary…they think it is all Bill.
and you think voting for Mccain is going to help us keep congress…or that his agenda will “keep it in check” with all of those things… especially with our efficient congress. A president (especially a first term President who beat out the dems this time after Bush) can get things done eventually. Supreme court justices can only keep going back so often if they are in the range and have not decided anything that was illegal or vastly to the right. As long as they have shown judicial prudence…whatever that may mean.
Voting for McCain shows congress that the American public is okay with his choices.
But obviously you don’t get that.
so i guess those issues aren’t as important as your anger toward you nominee not getting elected.
Which if it is the case makes your comments not worth much to most. Most Americans want the issues taken care of not the candidate. They want the candidate who will best carry out the issues. Not make more issues with their fighting or making issues that don’t help them.
Posted by: dl | May 8, 2008, 10:56 pm 10:56 pm
dl…it’s not just issues and policies here, my friend. Americans want to vote into the highest, most esteemed position in the world…someone who is deserving to represent us and work on our behalf. All politicians have baggage….but it better not be WHITE HATING, ANTI AMERICAN BAGGAGE for this great office of President a candidate has to earn! Obama’s 143 days working as a Senator does not qualify, and knowing what we know about him now, I don’t even think he should have his senate seat.
Posted by: Debra | May 9, 2008, 1:30 am 1:30 am
Carl Rove is on Fox saying Obama rubbing Clinton’s nose in it by claiming victory on May 20 is really the wrong move. Obama supporter caught on tape violations in voting booths..I have heard nothing but trouble with caucuses and intimidation by Obamabots…will someone look into these dishonest voting situations, like Indiana Mayor of Bend turning in suspicious votes so late Tuesday night. CNN Wolf and Anderson could not believe and another Mayor in Indiana (Hillary supporter) was embarassed it was lookig dishonest. Mayor of Bend said it was because of 11,000 early votes they were still counting.
Anyway, Carl Rove said this thing should play out and Obama is wrong at suggesting he is the winner May 20.
Posted by: Debra | May 9, 2008, 1:38 am 1:38 am
dl…it was so great tonight on Hannity and Colmes, I found out Colmes is a Hillary supporter. I knew where Sean stand (firmly in the right). I love Fox News…fair and balanced.
Could someone explain campaign finance 101 to me….because with individual contributions at $2,300 tops, and Obama’s core group being colleg kids, African Americans and liberals…how is there that kind of money in his campaign? I know he has 5 billionaire liberals behind him, but how do they “bundle” money? There is no possible way with his wins he could amount to this much. I know they outspend Hillary 3 or 4 to 1 and the money never ends. NO WAY this is poor grassroot supporters with his core group. Who are these lefty liberals with billions to buy a presidency? One of them lives in San Francisco where BO made his “clinging” remarks. Seriously want to see his fundraising books.
Posted by: Debra | May 9, 2008, 1:56 am 1:56 am
rhbate…give it up. No one believes McCain has a Hagey relationship for 20 years buying his BS ideology. Don’t even compare to Obama/Wright…we all see through that. Obama said in his famous “kick Wright to the curb” speech..”I should have vetted my pastor”. What crap! Twenty years and you can’t “vet” your pastor? It would have taken most of America about 20 minutes to figure out Wright’s hate filled rhetoric. I’ve vetted Obama…and he’s out!
Posted by: Debra | May 9, 2008, 2:01 am 2:01 am
catleya…I worry that there is some buying of voters in W. Virginia or KY right now. I know she is expected to win, but Obama campaign is probably outspending again, 4 to 1, and if you see enough commercials from the guy who has money to burn, maybe it will sway voters. I hope the good people of KY and WVirginia are true Hillary supporters and remember Obama’s small town people comments. Looking down his nose at the hard working Americans who make this country great. He was with the snotty liberal millionaire group in San Francisco that he fits in with so well. I hope those comments are still burning in the ears of voters in upcoming states.
Posted by: Debra | May 9, 2008, 2:31 am 2:31 am
rhbate…not going to happen…ever…hands of time will never turn back the clock to ideals/laws of the 70′…quit your scare tactics.
McCAIN ALL THE WAY (if not Hillary)!
Posted by: Debra | May 9, 2008, 4:55 pm 4:55 pm