Do Visits to Iraq Equal Perspective? Obama Says No

Rachel – you have to wait for Obama to come back with his “new” take after only a few hours visit. ONLY OBAMA’s perspective counts. Remember just weeks ago he only talked on the telephone with the head man from Iraq because it interfered with his campaign speaking engagement. He knows what is more important.

Obama is going to Iraq only because of McCain’s incessant chiding about visiting there. His visit isn’t going to change anything. His views won’t change, the perceptions from those who are already set in their opinions won’t change, and the war will continue.
More importantly, the Bush administration is planning a drawdown of troops in Iraq in September, probably about 50,000. This demonstrates that Obama was right all along, that the troops should be brought home.

mccain is cluless and he did lie mccain is a stubborn old man he wont listen to our military on the ground and why because hes prior military pow he is gonna feel he is much more experienced than gen patreus and his stubbornus will only be a disaster not only with iraq but with all countries!!!

Rachel
You would have to first understand that Obama is a weathervane. He turns with the wind.
He only wants to pander to everybody. He’s wishy-washy that way. Not a real leader or any qualities for one.
There is a very very fitting and true illistration out about him. He is in the White House, his so called wife by his side. He has redecorated. Osama bin laden’s portrait is over the fireplace. In the fireplace is the American Flag. His wife is sporting a, gasp, AR 15 over her shoulder.

Obama has said in the past that he had considerable “foreign policy” experience because he lived in Indonesia and abroad. But now he’s saying that visits to Iraq don’t count?? I don’t get it.

The point is 10 trips to Iraq
under the protection of the
Army is not going to give you
10 times the perspective of
another senator who has visited
Iraq only once.
There is so much information
about what is going on in Iraq
on the Internet and other sources
that the number of trips made
to that country under Army
protection are not indicative
of your grasp of what excatly is
the reality on the ground there.
Unless the tour gives you access
to classified information it
doesn’t amount to a whole lot.

“A man who believes in everything believes in nothing”.
That statement clearly defines Obama. He believes everything, one day it it this, the next day it is that.
As far as having lived in Indonesia, read his book: he did coke while living there, had a lot of Muslim friends and lived with his radical Muslim step father. His father visited him over a month there (his father had a Muslim burial.). That is what Obama now says is foreign experience?
Obama mentioned being on food stamps in his youth. Well, he and his family traveled to Indonesia, then traveled extensively on “vacation” throughout the United States. His parents were both highly educated. Where did the travel money come from and why with highly educated parents were they on food stamps?
He’s a liar and not fit to be our leader. He’ll say almost anything to get a vote. Don’t be mislead by this man; he has a silver tongue; too many people are spell bounded and fooled by him.

Obama has been right about this war in Iraq right from the beginning. His refinement probably involves just what kind of timeline that can be reached that is agreeable with the Iraqis. I heard 3 to 5 years but the Iraqis have also offered for us to leave right away so who knows. I do not see anything that involves lying. Now if you want to talk about flip flopping then all you have to do is look at the McCain record to find the King of the Flip Floppers. His record on vets issues, women issues, mass transit, torture, taxes, immigration, and his involvement with the Keating 5 scandal along with a few other lobbyist incidents where he was found with his fingers in the pie makes him unfit for any office. In fact the man should be in jail. Then there is his morals where he sets such a fine example cheating on his wives and referring to them with such affectionate names like c***. Then there is his or is its Bush’s economic policies that have left our country in such bad shape. Since there are no differences between the Bush/McCain economic policies we can look forward to 4 more years of the same. I like Obama’s position on many issues so he has got my vote.

and another thing, i recall after Obama DID travel going to Africa, Russia, Israel and Iraq in 2005, 2006-didn’t the media do a study on HOW MUCH MONEY HE COST THE TAXPAYERS TRAVELING. DIDN’T THEY COMPLAIN ABOUT HIM TRAVELLING?? Of course they did, even though he paid his own family’s expense to the Africa they still complained. Now they say he hasn’t travell ed enough. Can’t win with these people.

Iraqis want Bush and his troops
out completely – if you have been
following the news.
So what’s up with Bush and McCain
on that offer?

The best reason for Obama to go to Iraq is to question the commanders there as well as Iraqi officials without being a public spectacle. He may be able to sort out fact from fancy. The level of violence is down. But the cause may be less clear than the American people think.
By questioning them personally he will be able to change the the underlying assumptions upon which conventional wisdom is predicated. The question is will Obamas perspective be changed or maybe will the army leadership have a different perspective if the mission is redefined.

is not the senator from Illinois on the the committee for Afghanistan? but has he attended any of the meetings at all?NO No – he has not – strange and creepy

you poor imbeciles. you can keep on doing the same thing over and over again, but if you don’t have judgment and sound mental abilties, as mccain clearly lacks, doing things over and over won’t help.

Interesting comments but very little “listening” going on.
Leaders – Listen, consume information then make an informed decision. Obama has the right idea about listening to commanders. True his position may not change but he needs to listen.
If he changes his position people will call him a flip flopper, Why? Because most people have never lead anyone or anything. They mindlessly follow ideology and will follow the leader off the cliff. Sorry folks I guess I’m a true flip flopper, why, because I listened to my non – commissioned officers who gave me good information which allowed me to make the right decision.
Guess we don’t expect that from our politicians.

randy quotes “If Barack Obama believes that visiting Iraq and meeting with commanders will not give him any new perspective, then we can only assume he’s going just to smile for the cameras.”
sums it up right there =/
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IF Obama believes – but he doesn’t. He anticipates that he will be getting some perspective on Iraq. So he WON’T just smile for the cameras.

So Obama is planning a trip to Iraq but he doesn’t plan to develop any perspective out of this. Oh, I forgot, he lacks intellectual depth, he is more of a word processor, and somebody else writes the words. We so look forward to President Axelrod and the Obama Puppet!
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Obama — just messing with you, man!!!!
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I lost all respect for McCain when he said Iraq was safe and he then was shown with a flack jacket and body guards surrounding him as he walked the streets of Baghdad. The guy talks about Iraq in his own little fantasy world. It doesn’t matter how many times he goes to Iraq…McCain is going to say whatever that fits his idea of what should be happening in Iraq. He shouldn’t have wasted the tax payers money going over there because he comes back with inaccurate information anyways.

Obama is correct. What overall perspective can either candidate learn from a short visit?

Hunn? I am so confused. If it doesnt offer perspective as to what is going on the ground then why is he going? and why did he suggest that he may refine his policy after visiting and talking to the generals? Somebody explain. Or should I wait for Obama to comeback with another statement to clarify this?
Posted by: rachel | Jul 13, 2008 7:19:04 PM
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Rachel – you have to wait for Obama to come back with his “new” take after only a few hours visit. ONLY OBAMA’s perspective counts. Remember just weeks ago he only talked on the telephone with the head man from Iraq because it interfered with his campaign speaking engagement. He knows what is more important.
Posted by: Ann
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Rachael and Ann, really, there is no need for your snide remarks. When our politicians visit Iraq and Afghanistan, they are not taken near the fighting zones. They are taken to safe areas where the fighting isn’t taking place. Since they do NOT see the “war activities first hand”, they really do not get a genuine perspective of the war. McCain said things were fine when he visited Iraq and that General Patreaus was able to drive around in his Humvee without protection, when in fact, the general is well protected. A tape of McCain’s visit proved differently, McCain and the General were wearing protective gear, they were accompanied by two SWAT teams and there was a group of helicopters flying overhead. While there was no fighting where they were, those are the areas where suicide bombers can hit unexpectedly. This is what Senator Obama is talking about. The generals there are only allowed to discuss so much with politicians, so they really do not get a good perspective from there either. Is senator Obama going to get a different perspective, maybe, maybe not. I do know one thing, Senator Obama is a very aware and observant of what is going on around him and he does not miss much. Unfortunately, Senator McCain told a BIG Whopper about not needing protection in Bagdad. Doesn’t sound like “straight talking” to me. It really amazes me when you and people like yourselves make these crazy predictions, based on what?? I’ll tell you, your predictions are based on what you THINK is, and not on facts. Millions upon millions of Americans do not share your cynical views.

In the Nevada debate, Obama specifically said that he will get the US out of Iraq by the end of 2009! Just like that, no “refining”, no talking to ground commanders! And now he says he is “refining” his Iraq plan, and that he never changed his mind. So, not only is he ridiculousl inexperienced and seems to have learned his foreign policy from playing the board game “battleship”, but he has the audacity to lie about his Iraq plan! Why won’t the MSM focus on his lies?
Posted by: doublestandard
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NO doublestandard here. Refining his plans means just that: to improve, to make better. There are those of you that are quick to pounce before you do any real thinking, you seem to enjoy attacking Senator Obama. I can just see you and your ilk smirking evilly in you quests for “I gotcha”. Hilliary and Bill are the King and Queen of lies, distortions, fraud, and slander. And I am guessing you really liked and supported them and now you are going to vote for great grandpa McCain? Have fun, you’ll probably be changing his DEPENDS when he is placed in a nursing home in the not too distant future.

Rachel
You would have to first understand that Obama is a weathervane. He turns with the wind.
He only wants to pander to everybody. He’s wishy-washy that way. Not a real leader or any qualities for one.
There is a very very fitting and true illistration out about him. He is in the White House, his so called wife by his side. He has redecorated. Osama bin laden’s portrait is over the fireplace. In the fireplace is the American Flag. His wife is sporting a, gasp, AR 15 over her shoulder.
Posted by: Thomas T D
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Just what do you mean by “his so-called wife”? Michelle IS Senator Obama’s wife!! Goes to show your stupidity and ignorance in trying to make it look like Michelle is some hidden mistress he will bring to the White House through the back door. Shame on YOU! Your posting in its entirety is sick and indicative of your negative mindset. Lay of the methamphetamine!! It makes you see and think things that are there, you just don’t know it.

“A man who believes in everything believes in nothing”.
That statement clearly defines Obama. He believes everything, one day it it this, the next day it is that.
As far as having lived in Indonesia, read his book: he did coke while living there, had a lot of Muslim friends and lived with his radical Muslim step father. His father visited him over a month there (his father had a Muslim burial.). That is what Obama now says is foreign experience?
Obama mentioned being on food stamps in his youth. Well, he and his family traveled to Indonesia, then traveled extensively on “vacation” throughout the United States. His parents were both highly educated. Where did the travel money come from and why with highly educated parents were they on food stamps?
He’s a liar and not fit to be our leader. He’ll say almost anything to get a vote. Don’t be mislead by this man; he has a silver tongue; too many people are spell bounded and fooled by him.
Posted by: love234america
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Umm, love234, Senator Obama lived in Hawaii before his mom moved to Indonesia. He went to live with his WHITE grandparents in Hawaii when he was TEN years old. Are you trying to convince the world he was on coke while a child?? You are absolutely full of BS!! Your entire entry is full of lies and slander!! How can you look at yourself in the mirror?? You must really hate yourselft to hate someone else so much. NOONE believes your crapola, it’s all been debunked some months back. You are a broken record no one is listenting to!! I thought I’d remind you.

“A man who believes in everything believes in nothing”.
That statement clearly defines Obama. He believes everything, one day it it this, the next day it is that.
As far as having lived in Indonesia, read his book: he did coke while living there, had a lot of Muslim friends and lived with his radical Muslim step father. His father visited him over a month there (his father had a Muslim burial.). That is what Obama now says is foreign experience?
Obama mentioned being on food stamps in his youth. Well, he and his family traveled to Indonesia, then traveled extensively on “vacation” throughout the United States. His parents were both highly educated. Where did the travel money come from and why with highly educated parents were they on food stamps?
He’s a liar and not fit to be our leader. He’ll say almost anything to get a vote. Don’t be mislead by this man; he has a silver tongue; too many people are spell bounded and fooled by him.
Posted by: love234america
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And you will say anything to besmirch a good, decent man! You are a slanderer and a liar!!

NinaK: Look at the current cover of the New Yorker with Obama in Muslim clothes, hiw wife looks like a terrorist with an assult rifle, a U.S. flag is buring in the fireplace in the Oval Office. Obama finally picked out the right clothes and weapon for his wife.

Well I see the trolls our to bash Obama. Ok folks, elect McCain and see just how much more blood and treasure we will lose. I cannot believe the low information voters. Obama knows more about the Middle east in his little finger than McCain knows after all his visits. Did you see the interview with Obama on CNN. The man is brilliant. But I guess some of you want another 4 years of stupid.

So Obama is planning a trip to Iraq but he doesn’t plan to develop any perspective out of this. Oh, I forgot, he lacks intellectual depth, he is more of a word processor, and somebody else writes the words. We so look forward to President Axelrod and the Obama Puppet!
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Obama — just messing with you, man!!!!
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Posted by: WestCoastMessenger | Jul 13, 2008 10:45:
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What? Senator Obama lacks intellectual depth?? My, my, you are one delusional character!!. Senator Obama is a brilliant and intelligent individual, he had the depth of vision to call what would happen if we went to war with Iraq. He was right on the button!! Listen to his 2002 speech!! EVERYTHING he envisioned has, in fact, happened, down to the destruction of our economy. And you say he has NO intellectual depth??? Go back to sleep Rip VanWinkle, obviously you have been sleeping since 2001!! What woke you up??

NinaK: Look at the current cover of the New Yorker with Obama in Muslim clothes, hiw wife looks like a terrorist with an assult rifle, a U.S. flag is buring in the fireplace in the Oval Office. Obama finally picked out the right clothes and weapon for his wife.
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Love234. That proves absolutely nothing that Obama was muslim and that his wife is a terrorist. In fact, thats only a satire and meant to arouse the b*llshit thats being portrayed by the Obama’s in the media. The cover is offensive and a bit racist. But for someone as biased and naive as yourself, I think it would be best to read the article before spewing hateful garbage and lies concerning the Obamas.
I for one believe that Obama is the better of the candidates. His taken a stance that sometimes are popular to many and have taken stances that aren’t popular to other politicians. Like FISA and the Iraq war.
On the otherhand, McCain has done nothing more than flip flop. He has changed his stance on just about every issue dating back to 2000. McCain is no longer that maverick but a full time pander bear that will say anything to get votes.
McCain is not fit to be president. He can’t use a computer or surf the Internet, can’t manage his own personal expenses, has continuously flip flopped on just about every issue, his running for a Bush 3rd term, and his experience as a POW and a war hero doesn’t translate to being a leader of the United States.
Lets not fool ourselves into voting for a Bush clone. Lets get Obama in office and change and heal our nation.

“So, not only is he ridiculously inexperienced and seems to have learned his foreign policy from playing the board game “battleship…”
Sorry, doublestandard, but I can’t sit back and let you insult the game Battleship like that.

NINAK: Read Obama’s damn book “Dreams From My Father”. He ADMITS he was using coke. I did not lie. I have researched him exclusively, read both his books. HE LIVED WITH HIS MUSLIN STEP FATHER IN INDONESIA WHO WAS A RADICAL. READ THE DAMN BOOK. He lived with his white grandparents in Hawaii. His father from Kenya visited with Obama in Indonesia for over a month and they all visited together, Obama, mother, step father, father. READ the book. I am not a liar; it is in Obama’s own words in his book. You are apparently someone who does not read very much and are young and naive and apparent stupid. Get your facts staight by research and reading and not from the itnernet. Your young people are so convinced that what Obama is saying is true he has you brainwashed; you can’t seem to think or do your own research. What the hell is wrong with you? I do not lie; I am older, a Catholic and believe a man’s word is his true character.
Posted by: love234america
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love234
You ARE lying! You are saying that when Barack Obama was in Indonesia, he was on coke. Obama was a child during that time. He left indonesia at age ten(10)!! At that age you are very much a child!! So, yes, I stand by what I said, you ARE a liar because you are NOT telling the truth. You abviously did not pay attention to what you read in his books; what you have apparently done is interpret those books to fit what YOU want them to read. In other words, you obviously went into the books with a negative perspective so you put YOUR own “truths” into the books to fit your expectations. I see you are very good at namecalling! Is this what your church teaches you?? Umm, perhaps you misinterpret what your priest teahes, as well?? |

Hunn? I am so confused. If it doesnt offer perspective as to what is going on the ground then why is he going? and why did he suggest that he may refine his policy after visiting and talking to the generals? Somebody explain. Or should I wait for Obama to comeback with another statement to clarify this?
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It’s easy, really if you think about it for 2 seconds. How you apply knowledge is more important then the knowledge itself. McCain had the info on Iraq but chose to distort the facts to serve his purpose or false perception of Iraq. When Obama goes to Iraq it is in the perspective of listening to the Iraqi government and the troops and determining the best way to get out of the war safely and how to pivot to focus on Afghanistan. Remember the only people who want to stay in Iraq are Bush/McCain republicans. The Iraqi people want Americans out, the Iraqi government wants Americans out, and the majority of Americans want Americans out, yet John McCain is insisting on permanent bases and staying indefinitely. It would seem based that McCains perspective is out of touch despite his many visits to the region.

Only Republicans could believe that spending six long years in Iraq, losing 4,500 dead and 35,000 wounded US troops, and installing a corrupt governement that’s now controlled by Muslim fundamentalists in Iran is a success.
The “surge” is working?
That’s like bragging about how you saved the cat after burning the house down.
No wonder Republicans haven’t won a war since 1898 (Spanish-American War)…they’re as lousy at war as they are at running the economy.

the point obama is making is that after multiple trips to iraq, mccain still got his shias and sunnis confused. and then mccain misled everyone about how safe Iraq was during his infamous trip to an Iraqi marketplace under heavy protection of our military. but you obamahaters just don’t want to hear what he has to say.

Obama doesn’t even feel that it is necessary to be personally speak to the people that are conducting the war, General Petreus in particular, then why would he care about making any visits to Iraq? Apparently all of the information he needs to make big decisions he can get from the New York Times. Seriously, who needs military brass anyways? It’s like his attitude about the war is “Don’t bother me with the facts.”

Obama is going to Iraq because he was shamed into it. Before that he had no intention of going.
Obama only knows what his camp tells him, and many times has been wrong about the information.
Obama The day he talked about military, did not know who led a brigade and basic information. He only knew troop counts.
Obama was an anti war activit, who convinced the american people we were just wasting money over there. He was not interested in what was done, being done, even when the Leaders of Iraq said they needed American longer he did not care.
So Obama’s perspective on iraq is some what flawed. He always has been one to pretend he knows something, when he does not. Evident by all his flip-flops on everything.
Obama only cares about himself and used the war as a political ploy and campaign tactic. As he has done with everything else.
Obama is just trying to pull another snow job on the country. Which he will continue to, as long as the fools believe him.

It’s really funny all these comments about Obama pandering or supposedly flip flopping. It’s clear many don’t read or listen very well. I wasn’t aware “REFINING” was “CHANGING” a position. Matter of face “CHANGE” is a noun correct and means to change something. “REFINE” is a verb if I am not mistaking and means to improve or perfect. So what exactly is so so horrible about that? People want to harp on a couple of things Obama has “CHANGED” positions on but fail to mention that John McCain basically “CHANGED” his his entire campaign I believe simply to “PANDER” to the republican/conservative base that didn’t like him.

What, exactly, is a Chicago community organizer?

Wow! I just read the funniest viewpoint! McCain is not fit to be President because he “doesn’t use a computer….doesn’t surf the Internet…”. We have arrived, and intelligence is bliss! Pardon me, on the Iraq perspective, Obama will write his thesis on the history of Iraq, give a little speech, then go to Iraq for a few photo ops with the military, maybe even visit some troops. Then he will come back, more photo ops landing back in the US, give a major spiel on what we need to do, then say that is what he has said from the beginning. Can we live on soundbites for the next four years?
He and others were pushing so hard for Hillary to get out ahead of the timetable so that he would have “time to pivot” to prepare for the GE and John McCain. These charades seem to have been going on forever. Will they never end!