Ousted Wisconsin Democratic Delegate Speaks

Good on you to call her on her BS !

Yes, she has a right to vote for anybody. It is not a wise idea for democrat party to take away her convention credential because it makes some disaffected Hillary’s supporters more angry.

laura
if shes voting for a republican, then shes NOT a democrat
tahts that
she should go to the republican convention

Jake, at long last I agree with you. Her use of that code word outted her for what she is.

Did not have to push me out of the DEMOCRAT Party, I ran for my life, I am now an independent and will vote AGAINST Obuma!

I’m the same as HP Boston. Voted for Kerry, pissed off as hell at what went down in the primaries this year, now am an independent finished with the Democratic party! And it feels good!!

By virtrue of winning the delegates race, Obama is the Democratic nominee. If Debbie cannot support him and wants to remain a Democrat, it is only fair that she not attend the Democratic convention. But, she is very much entitled to vote for whoever she wants to be it Nader, Obama, McCain or Barr or Yogi The Bear.

I am an obamcan and so are hundreds
and thouisands of people. thank God 4 this lady .we agree for her to go.

What a shame… Another grown woman who acts like a cry baby. Grow up people, this is not about Hillary or any other woman, this is about our future and our children’s future. Hillary lost the race and we need to now move on.
A 50 year old, white, hard working woman voting for Obama because he is the right choice for change, good, honest change for our children.

Susie – Please list the equal rights that the Libs like Obama have given to woman!!
Now I do not support HRC, but she was unfairly treated in the primary. And actually if you dems did not have an elitist type primary she would of won!!

Smart, strong and honest woman.
I fully agree, country first, party the second
Dem. party is totally a mess.
I see lots of high profile Obama supporters are just opportunist. They think if they support Obama, they can get good positions, they don’t care the country.

Ding dong the witch is dead! So here’s the deal she should have left after supertuesday if the roles were revesed the Clinton hate machine would have forced Obama out. But since the Clinton’s were such an established name Obama did nothing but show them respect all the while Hillary was smearing and attacking Obama. Then she first says Michgan doesn’t count then when she’s losing she says “count all the votes”.
HRC is so fake she’s made of wax.

Syliva…this happens all the time in the world of politics…they all accept it and move on…these women, including HRC are showing how weak they can be by threatening to vote for McCain…they just show how ignoratn they are, and are VERY poor examples for our young women. We must keep trying and push for change, we don’t turn around and vote for the oppostion…DAAA

The DNC may have pushed one delegate out successfuly. But come Election day, there will be more crossovers to McCain…Something they can’t dictate!

I think that the dems have proven that they are anything but democratic. Just look at their primary fiasco, ACORN games, refusal to allow votes on energy policy, failure to support or even work with democratically elected leaders from other parties, just to mention a few.
Democrat is not a pejorative it is a misnomer.

Mary said:
Debbie Bartoshevich has integrity and good judgment.
Good judgement!!! OMG…she is like a child who got candy taken away…PLEASE…you Hillary supporters make me sick…This isn’t about you, Hillary or Obama. It is about our country and how we are going to recover from this mess we’re in.
Do you think John McCain will get us out? NOT…

Mary have you looked into HRC past associates??? I think not…

I don’t think Hillary would have been crying foul if the roles had been reversed….This shows that she isn’t really against the process…Just against it happening to her…

Good for her. So many of us are done with the “democratic” party. Because they have shown themselves to be undemocratic bullish sellouts by forcing this corny manufacteured candidate on us. I will be unregistering as a democrat after the annointment of that race0card playing no-nothing hack barack obama.

Who cares?
Obama 08

–Seems Mary is well informed and correct. Those criticizing her should do more research on Senator Obama and his background.

As an Indepedent, this primary has done sooo much good for cleaning out the trash in the Democratic Party. I have never wanted to be associated with the Dem label, as I have always viewed Dems as whiners prone to odd-ball conspiracy theories. I have always laughed that the Dems could sn@tch defeat out of the jaws of victory.
Now maybe with all the crackpots and n@tjobs gone, the Dem party can get on with being elected.

In fact, they just want hillary in 2012.
what a wild dream they have…
if obama loses this time thanks to these angry hillary supporters,
Hillary will never get nominated.
and she will never be an independent.
because she knows that she will be another Nadar…
So wake up from the dream for 2012.

“Good riddance to bad rubbish”?? Be careful what you wish for.
We are not republicans. Like many of us, I was a loyal Democrat for 40 years. This year I refuse to hold my nose and vote for Obama. As geevill said, there are millions of us. And millions of votes that would have gone to Hillary Clinton will now change the face of this election.

Bottom line: this is undemocratic and the woman has the right to vote for whomever she likes in the general. Everyone does — and the fact that she expressed a preference in public should not warrant punishment of this kind. Political speech is also at issue given that she was elected to represent others in her district and she made financial contributions to HRC. The most troubling part is that she was bounced (even though she apologized) for failure to honor Party rules which require that she support the nominee and remain loyal to the Party. So Party loyalty trumps freedom of speech and democracy? How democratic is that? Last time I checked, requiring an oath of loyalty was illegal.
More fundamentally — this is reflective of a larger policy of coercion and intolerance of dissent. It started with Jesse Jackson Jr. swearing to exact punishment on black politicians (and others) who “stood in the way” of the first black President by standing with HRC instead of BO. That pledge has been played out in New York where Obama supporters have organized to bounce black elected officials who stood with Hillary. Many speculate that Obama is aware of this — and perhaps sanctioned it. I am personally aware of instances where state legislators were threatened within de facto expulsion (political power sidelined) for not backing BO at their state conventions. This sort of intimidation is a huge problem that has not been addressed – notably, the same kind of intimidation that Hillary supporters received in the Obama-controlled caucuses.
Jake – I commend you for calling Obama out on his message control and Bush-like sidelining of the media. I believe that you are constitutionally permitted (indeed, mandated) to operate as a political check on potential abuses of power. Please keep up the push for facts and transparency. And please, look into the bigger picture here. There has been more subversion of democracy in this election that most people recognize. The Wisconsin delegate’s expulsion is just one tiny example. (I note, by way of example, that we still do not have a transcript from the RBC meeting — no one knows how the votes went down, and on what basis).
Obama has the potential to be the most powerful President in decades. His ability to command attention and allegiance is stunning, and the country (and the world) is all too happy to fall in line. It is more important now than ever before that the press stand firm. Please, do not back down.

BUH BYE!

She does have the right to support whomever she wants. But if she wants to be a delegate to the Democratic National Convention, she is bound by party by-laws, and by an oath which she would swear as a delegate, to support the Democratic Nominee.

DINO.
If it is actual issues that matter, these “former Democrats” would not even think of voting for any Republican for president.
I have my disagreements on some of Obama’s decisions and Senate votes. Overall he “gets it” and has worked a wonderful bottom up organization bringing in many new voters and talents from out side the DC Iron Triangle of influence.
Ms Clinton on the other hand shared McSame’s top down, big money, Iron Triangle dominated, K street organizational model favored by the sell out DLC. Hillary Clinton’s chief strategist was Mark Penn; Charlie Black, John McCain’s top adviser, is chairman of BKSH, the DC-based lobbying subsidiary of Burson-Marsteller — of which Mark Penn is CEO.
As a libertarian leaning independent, I understand that for libertarian ideas to work, the K street crowd and the Iron Triangle must be broken before these libertarian principles can be implemented. Until such a time, the government must be made to provide relief through regulations to level the playing field for non connected, sweetheart deals unfairly given to the big money interests.

becky, I agree with you, this is about our future and our children’s future. That’s why I’ll NEVER vote for Obama.
What used to be called the Democratic party now deserves the implications of calling it the Democrat Party. There’s nothing democratic about it.

Rassmusan poll has obama up by 9.

Ras-pollx
Military Veterans Favor McCain 56% to 37%

Gallup tracking has obama up by 8 nationaly and ahead by 13 in cali.
Not seeing your “backlash”

How sad. A Democratic Delegate speaks publicly that she is supporting the Republican candidate. Is there really any question that she has to go? Kinda’ like someone that works at Coke swigging on Pepsi all day every day. You don’t praise brand X in the house of brand Y.
To all those that claim foul in the primaries – Hillary Clinton’s campaign team made a number of tactical errors, supreme of which was not understanding the delegate count. Go back, read the articles, interviews. Team Clinton expected this all wrapped up by February 5th. The fact that Obama started out by winning Iowa shocked everyone. His run of 12 wins after February 5th, there was nothing Clinton could do. Her campaign decided on the “kitchen sink” strategy and all it did was make it all very ugly (and give McCain talking points when his turn came to compete against Obama). Had the Clintons had a clue about the delegates, she would have the nomination now.
So pleast stop crying unfair. Pleast stop saying that Obama treated her badly. He merely ran a better campaign. That’s not his fault – that’s her fault.
And I’ll echo comments already made – any Democrat that can say that McCain as President is better than Obama is either full up on the Hater-Ade or delusional. McCain wants to stay in Iraq, bomb Iran, let Phil “Nation of Whiners” Gramm decide our economic policy and continue the Bush tax policies and Oil Baron rape of our personal economies.
Seriously, people, in a choice between Obama and McCain? I’ll trust my next four to eight years to the skinny guy with the funny name – Obama.

Laura: Good for her. Now let’s hope the voter’s for Hillary Clinton will write her name in on the ballot or switch to McCain. I hope PUMA does a good job at the convention. I agree with PUMA, they know that Hillary got swindled by Obama and the DNC so if they can turn the tide so be it. And I don’t care about the blacks rioting. They want too much and are always crying racist and whining all the time. ——————
Hillary supporters who don’t want Obama to win need to support McCain, a write in will not help keep him from winning.

If the flake Obama can be “post-partisan”, why can’t Bartoshevich be post-partisan?
Maybe she doesn’t like seeing her political party hijacked by a mob-friendly fraud.

Barbara Bad comparison – My cousing works for Pepsi and actually does drink Coke there and they say nothing!

Monday, July 28
Race Poll Results Spread
National USA Today/Gallup Obama 45, McCain 49 McCain +4.0

Idiot.
And PUMA is a group of IDIOTS.

That is why there are more than 2 parties and an Independent Category to choose from …
This is America. Do whatever you want and STOP BITCHIN” …
President O. ’09

WOW, she was an elected CLINTON Delegate that was going to vote for Clinton at the Convention in AUGUST, as she was elected to do.
Then, because she felt that Obama was unworthy to vote for in NOVEMBER, she got thrown out of her ELECTED seat?
This is not only not right for her, but it screws the people who voted for her to be Delegate!
Unbelievable. I was on the fence on this election, but if this is what my 40 years loyalty to a Party has helped create, I am ashamed.
I’m done with the Democratic party, too.
Fini.

Why are we talking about “PUMA” voters? and why are we labeling anyone who is not Obama supporter as a “racist”? The only person we can’t trust is Obama. It has always been about him getting ahead.

This rubbish people talking about what she is going to go the democratic national convention and vote for McCain. I am from Wisconsin and she was Hillary delegate which means she was going to cast her vote for Hillary at the convention she has the right to vote for Hillary at the convention. The democratics are big bullies trying to silence the people who oppose them. this was wrong, number one it won’t stop her from voting for McCain in the GE and it makes the democrats look like jerks. I mean where to the democrats get off I mean ron paul is even having his own convention and the republicans arent throwing a fit, you mean this lady can’t come to the convention and cast her vote for Hillary? I am from Wisconsin and I find this disgusting.

This whole election process is rigged. I applaud Debbie Bartoshevich for her convictions. Shame on the DNC Party!

Hum. A private citizen states a choice. Fine! As a delegate to the Democratic National Convention she must adhere to the rules which state you will support the Democratic candiate, whoever it may be. To openly state otherwise is against the rules. Before anyone begins to attack, most primaries are not open, in order to vote in them you must declare a party affiliation. This has been challenged and upheld at the Supreme Court.
Come on everyone get a grip. The rules are essentially the same for a Republican delegate. You pledge to support the candiate of your party. The delegates are selected at the state conventions usually. Does anyone really think she would have been chosen if she had stated this preference before the selection process?
The name calling, back stabbing, cluelessness and yelling does not change anything either way. We apparently have our major party candiates for the election. Look at them make your decision based on your values and preferences. Stop this. I for one am getting tired of it and have this year not donated to either side nor have I made up my mind who to vote for in November. I have just this to say, even though I live in Arizona, I do not plan to vote for McCain. I am currently open to a third party candiate. P.S. I did vote for McCain for Senator but never again. He has caved in to the current administration and that I personally can not understand why.

“To openly state otherwise is against the rules.”

Wow! I think this is just the beginning. No matter how much the MSM tries to deny it, the democratic party is divided. I, too, will never under any circumstances, vote for BHO — the scariest man to ever run for POTUS in my lifetime.

Can we just agree that the dnc is a private entity and has the right to give and take away credentials as It sees fit? Why should they allow someone at their convention who openly admits that she’s voting for the other guy. this isn’t about hillary clinton or barack obama. this is about the rules, and some people’s refusal to follow them. For those people who were supporting clinton and now say no to obama, look in the mirror with the lights on and ask yourself why. Maybe the answer is clear. 1- HRC was the woman you’ve been waiting for to be the FIRST ONE. 2- BO is a black man, and you just can’t get over that fact. 3- You truly are a republican and were only supporting HRC because she’s a woman. Either way, make your choice and do what’s in your best interest. but there is no reason to insult a presidential candidate that, really, you don’t know.

McCain continues to run around crying about the surge this and the surge that. I mean who gives a darn anyway about these semantics from failed war that should have never been started??
The American people want this stupid Bush/McBush war finished and thereby stopping the cash hemorrhage down this rat hole Bush and McBush have created, that’s all…
Last week we saw McCain screaming ME TOO, ME TOO! On Obama’s 16 month timetable position, and whining about press coverage and other made up stuff like this troop visit in Germany (because they have nothing else to talk about)!
So now this week Obama is getting down to business on what really matters to Americans, the ECONOMY STUPID!
Let’s all just watch as Obama again sets the pace and how McBush comes running from behind screaming ME TOO, ME TOO, on this one as well….
How pathetic is this old fool McCain anyway???
Obama ’08!!!!

Grow up. The convention in Denver is serious business. It is about choosing the most electable Democrat–not about who the big rock star is!!
Proud pumapac.org member.
……..
Wahhhh!!! I don’t want to hear about the rules. Wahhhh!!!! I want what I want, when I want it!
Posted by: Victim Voter | Jul 28, 2008 6:42:06 PM

hmmmmm,
If everything you are saying about McCain is true, what can be the reasons anyone will choose Hillary over McCain, now or in 2012? Do they have the same policy positions?

“No one is electable when more than half of the electorate do not like you. Not even God.”
Posted by: curious voter | Jul 28, 2008 10:24:38 PM
but the curious thing is, curious voter,
that despite the polls which said the electorate didn’t like her, Clinton garnered just about as many votes as Obama did…..
So… go figure.
I think more and more Democrats are beginning to sizzle and steam because their candidate was selected for them and stuffed down their throat … and that might very well cause Obama’s
defeat.
But politics… is a very strange game!

Debbie has shown the courage of her convictions. Nancy Pelosi is jumping with joy. One less female to take away her thunder. She has a book out now. She’s what-3rd in line if BO gets elected? Hmmm…by getting rid of Hillary has she been setting herself up to move on up the ladder? What does she secretly wish???

If Hillary got about as many popular votes as Obama, and she was behind in both total elected delegates as wells as total superdelegates, why should have the DNC selected her instead of the one with more delegates (since the delegates determine the winner)? If she is running on her experinece, and she cannot beat a candidate with little experience in a Democratic primary, how can she beat someone like McCain who has decisively more experience in a general election? Remember, most of the Hillary’s haters (in the Republican Party, mostly, and a substantial number of independents) had not had their say yet but they would be there in the general election.
Hillary’s supporters will continue to insist she is more electable, and that is the reason the DNC should have selected her. How do you define electability? Do people just have to accept your words as they are?

Basically, this woman was punished for exercising her right to free speech–supposedly one of the basic tenets of our country. But the Democratic party kicks her out. I think this woman has a great case for a lawsuit, personally. No one can know who she really would have voted for and it’s nobody’s business.

I wish all these so-called inconsolable Hillary supporters would just go away, and vote for whomever the choose on November the 4th. Barack Obama won the nomination fair and square according to all the established rules. How do they think Obama supporters would have felt if the DNC had taking away the nomination from the candidate witht he most pledged delegates? After all presidential nominees (just like presidents) are elected by delegates not by the popular vote (and even in this category Barack Obama won very clearly, unless you unjustly choose to add votes from States like Florida and Michigan who broke the rules). What ever happened to American’s spirit of sportmanship and fairplay. You do not change the rules of a game in the middle of the game to favor a candidate, who losing according to the established (not to talk of mutually agreed upon rules, before the contests began).
That is called CHEATING by any measure of the word. The DNC did the right thing by refusing to cheat on behalf of Hillary, and her so-called (I called them so-called, because if they were truly Hillary’s followers, they would do as she now does, and get behind Obama’s candidacy). In any game or competition, someone has to win, and someone has to lose. this time around Hillary lost, and her so-called supporters should show some dignity (not to talk of maturity), and accept reality. If they are so devoted to Hillary, why don’t they rally around her now that she needs and contribute a mere $1.50 to her campaign. That would surely erase her $25,000,000.00 debt with quite a lot to spare.
If they cannot even give their darling president in waiting a mere $1.50, how can they expect to convince any one that the really support her, and are not in fact ‘Obama-hating republicans’ in ‘Hillary-supporter’ clothing?

I would agree that Nancy Pelosi, Howard Dean, and some parts of the party itself, did Hillary wrong, etc. However, if one is not supporting Obama for that reason, against John McCain this fall, I have a question to ask: who is it that truly suffers for your not supporting Obama?
The election this fall is REAL. It will have REAL effects that will be felt by every person in this nation, likely for generations to come. Obama is not Pelosi, nor is he Dean. He is the entire Democratic Party’s only remaining potential candidate against John McCain.
Are there issues with the party? Certainly. Once this election is over we will have time to deal with those issues (most effectively from the bottom up). But allowing a candidate whose policies diametrically oppose those of Hillary does no one any good. It may, however, do many great harm.
If the issue is the process and the party leadership, by all means, let us work to transform it. However, right now, we have an election to win whose outcome will likely define the next decade (and given global warming and energy issues), likely the decades to come.

Hillary stood for something when she was running. There were things that she wanted to accomplish for all of us. I (perhaps incorrectly) presume that those of us who supported her, did so because of what she stood for and wanted to accomplish for all of us.
What Obama stands for is and wants to accomplish is much in keeping with what Hillary did — and a far cry from what McCain would like for all of us.
Is Obama experienced enough to accomplish it? Well, he, at much the same age that Bill Clinton was back in ’92, actually has more experience, especially in foreign policy (which as a Governor, Bill Clinton did not have to deal with), than Bill Clinton did back then.
To any Hillary supporter who would now vote for McCain, I ask much what Hillary just did Tuesday night: Were you in it for her or in it for all of us?