By Julia Hoppock

Oct 7, 2008 12:33pm

Doodles of Dreams

Do you remember last year when Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., donated a doodle for an auction to benefit The Neurofibromatosis Association and epilepsy research? The doodle, of some of his Senate colleagues, sold for more than $2,000 on eBay.

Now we have a doodle from another campaign 2008 rock star, Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin.

New Republic senior editor Noam Scheiber went up to Alaska to profile the governor and during a visit with Palin’s former colleague on the city council, Laura Chase, found this document — the  back of a Wasilla city budget which Palin doodled on in 1996 as she plotted her mayoral campaign.

She makes notes on slogans: "You would be my boss! No tax increase! … Wasilla needs a conservative choice in leadership."

She makes notes on her resume: "Life Long Alaskan; Graduate: Wasilla High School, Univ. of Idaho (Bach. In Journalism, minor Politics); Wife, mother of three, Homeowners, Businesswoman, TAXPAYER!;…NRA supporter," "taxpayer!"

There’s a close-up scan of the document HERE.   

**

Two policy items of note:

Planning out her campaign promises, Palin writes, "no automatic pay increase for the mayors position" and also "City Hall says it sees the need for an increase in sales and property tax to pay for some local politicians wish list. There is no need to raise taxes, Wasilla is collecting two million dollars a year than what we had projected when we sold the sales tax proposal to you four years ago."

Both of these are forms of claims she has since made on the vice presidential stump -– that she took a pay cut as mayor, and that she fought taxes.

The reality of both is more complicated.

"As mayor, I took a voluntary pay cut, which didn’t really thrill my husband,” Palin said on Sept. 9 in Lebanon, Ohio.

According to documents released by the city of Wasilla,  Palin’s mayoral salary did, indeed, drop from $64,200 in October 1996 to $61,200 in January 1997.

But then, a year and a half later, in June 1998, it increased to $68,000.

It went down again one year later, in July 1999, to $66,000 (still higher than her starting salary) but then it increased again, to $68,000 in October 1999, staying at that level until October 2002, when she left office.

So, for most of her time in office, Palin took a raise.

As for taxes, Palin at the vice presidential debate on Oct. 2 said, “as mayor, every year I was in office I did reduce taxes. I eliminated personal property taxes and eliminated small business inventory taxes, and as governor, we suspended our state fuel tax. We did all of those things knowing that that is how our economy would be heated up."

All true.

But Palin didn’t mention the sales tax (though she did mention it in her 1996 doodle) which did go up during her tenure.

Politifact has a thorough look at her debate claim, but the bottom line is that Palin supported a referendum (as did voters) to increase city sales taxes by a half percent to pay for an indoor sports center.  One of the ways that Palin as mayor was able to afford lowering all the other taxes was because the sales tax brought in more and more revenue to local government coffers -– almost $6 million in 2002, an increase of approximately 50% from the time Palin began as mayor –- a testament to the city’s growth.

“Under Palin’s mayorship,” notes Politifact, “the city also took on an additional $23.7-million in long-term debt to finance the sports complex, as well as for street and water projects.”

So noted. (Though not so doodled.)

- jpt

User Comments

Who cares about Doodles?
How about a story about McCain’s direct connection to the right-wing terrorist group USCWF?

Posted by: Sarah | October 7, 2008, 12:38 pm 12:38 pm

- “the city also took on an additional $23.7-million in long-term debt”
a true Republican

Posted by: jeru | October 7, 2008, 12:38 pm 12:38 pm

Wow Sarah Palin lying…again.
Its starting to become dog bites man at this point.

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 12:40 pm 12:40 pm

McCain/Palin are both HONEST – we can TRUST them to take good care of our country. Obama is an Arrogant, Radical FRAUD – with very questionable “friends” – I do NOT trust him.

Posted by: Molly | October 7, 2008, 12:40 pm 12:40 pm

Obama needs to keep his day job

Posted by: smith | October 7, 2008, 12:42 pm 12:42 pm

“McCain/Palin are both HONEST – we can TRUST them to take good care of our country. Obama is an Arrogant, Radical FRAUD – with very questionable “friends” – I do NOT trust him.”
I think molly is very subtly trying to tell us something.

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 12:46 pm 12:46 pm

Hi,
I am not as angry or passionate as some of you guys are, but I I will say this:
Palin and McCain seem to stand for hatred and bigotry
and that is not the world I want my children to inherit.
We need to look towards the future for our economy and our children.

Posted by: vbywest | October 7, 2008, 12:47 pm 12:47 pm

Hello Ryan C,
Why do you trust McCain/Palin after all the scandals they have been involved in? After all the mud slinging and outright lying? After this economic fiasco where McCain suspended his campaign to “put Country first”? Are you kidding? Are you serious? Well, I believe your built in prejudices have blinded you to the truth. How sad…btw you are now only one of 20 diehards who are truly blind or at least until you lose your job or bank account…is this subtle enough?

Posted by: Reality check | October 7, 2008, 12:52 pm 12:52 pm

the doodle is telling in that palin and McCain are cartoon characters
fixin to fix things!
those mavericks!

Posted by: Gus | October 7, 2008, 12:52 pm 12:52 pm

“Palin and McCain seem to stand for hatred and bigotry
and that is not the world I want my children to inherit.’
No you should leave your children in the hands of Pastor Wright on Sundays and Ayers’ school indoctrination program during the week. You’ll children will be safe from hate then.

Posted by: Mack | October 7, 2008, 12:54 pm 12:54 pm

Sarah, you can worry all you want about USCWF and Iran Contra, at least they weren’t terrorists bombing the US and telling kids to kill their parents.

Posted by: samhiguchi | October 7, 2008, 12:56 pm 12:56 pm

Psssst Reality Check, I support Obama.

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 12:56 pm 12:56 pm

Why won’t Barack Obama just answer questions about his associations in an honest manner?
If he were truly innocent, and had nothing to hide, he simply just state the truth and that would be the end of it. Instead, he has lied to us about his relation to Ayers and others.
Clearly there is something there. How bad it is I don’t know. But reguarly speaking with and conversing with (there are email and phone records) and kicking off your political career at the house of an unrepentant domestic terrorist isn’t a good thing.
This alone should have disqualified Obama.

Posted by: JA | October 7, 2008, 1:00 pm 1:00 pm

I totally expected a heart dotted “i”
at least I got the star at the end of the “n”
and Palin is the only one who you could characterize her policy scibblings as “doodles”
lol

Posted by: dl | October 7, 2008, 1:01 pm 1:01 pm

Sarah Palins husband was anti-American secessionist, and why was she palling around with them?

Posted by: watching | October 7, 2008, 1:01 pm 1:01 pm

“If he were truly innocent, and had nothing to hide,”
So does that mean Palin is guilty in Troopergate?

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 1:02 pm 1:02 pm

I will take a “doodle of dreams”
Pitbull Palin Bites Obama on his Ayers
over
“I seek daily to imitate his faith” ~ Obama in a letter 5 Feb 2007
On Jeremiah Wright, Obama’s Father Figure

Posted by: CrystalD | October 7, 2008, 1:02 pm 1:02 pm

Molly says and I quote
“McCain/Palin are both HONEST”
shall we go through the list of lies that they and their team have pushed on us for the last 8 years and they are continuing
they lied to us about wmd
they lied to us about Palin’s readiness and brains
they lied to us about Katrina
they lied to us about Presidential signing statements
they lied to us about the economy
they lied to us about Libby
they lied to us about being greeted as Liberators
they lied to us about mushroom clouds
they lied to us about Gonzales
they lied to us about global warming
they lied to us about the fundamentals of our economy being strong
they lied to us about judicial appointments
they lied to us about abu ghraib
they lied to us about secret prison camps
they lied to us about “mission accomplished”
they lied to us about closed door energy policy meetings
they lied to us about Afghanistan
they lied to us about lobbyists writing their economic proposals
they lied to us
they lied to us
they lied to us
same lying team
same lying tactics
9th year
throw McCain and Palin out on their a$$es.
America get angry
…for being lied to… still…
throw these bums out! NOW!

Posted by: dl | October 7, 2008, 1:04 pm 1:04 pm

“A critic of Sarah Palin’s is suing to make sure any government-related e-mails Palin sent from private accounts get saved.
A former state worker filed the lawsuit against Palin in Anchorage Thursday. Palin’s gubernatorial spokeswoman says she can’t comment.”

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 1:05 pm 1:05 pm

Funny, I read today that Sarah from the State of Alaska for misusing tax money. She has to pay $25,000 back to the state because she used this money for her children. It also read that although her income showed to be low that she used $45,000 in tax payers money for herself and her family.
Funny the way the media works. Sarah, really, like we would never have found this out.

Posted by: beck | October 7, 2008, 1:06 pm 1:06 pm

wow jake — really awesome journalism here… now back to real issues please!
ps. palin is a talking head, and unqualified as most americans already know… hence, obamas lead in the polls

Posted by: earthisnotflat | October 7, 2008, 1:07 pm 1:07 pm

The pay increase for Palin was a mandatory increase approved by the counsel which she opposed.
That is why it dropped down to $66,000 and went back up to the exact same amount a year before. Typical government – automatic increases with no respect to performance or desire to cut spending.

Posted by: Eric Blair | October 7, 2008, 1:08 pm 1:08 pm

CrystalD: more like “junk yard dogs”.

Posted by: beck | October 7, 2008, 1:08 pm 1:08 pm

So Palin who has been screaming about taxes was actually cheating on her filings.
How utterly Republican.

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 1:09 pm 1:09 pm

“what leader emails any professional email to their spouse?
can anyone think of any job related emails that you would copy to your spouse”
People flipped when Hillary was appointed to lead the health care fight in the Clinton White House.
This guy doesn’t even have an official or sanctioned role in government.

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 1:10 pm 1:10 pm

I agree. Sarah Palin is part of Alaskan Independence Party. Therefore, she is strongly anti-American. She needs to be exposed.

Posted by: smihtville01 | October 7, 2008, 1:11 pm 1:11 pm

Funny that Palin listed one of her qualifications as “taxpayer” when she may owe thousands of dollars in back taxes for the $25 grand the state gave her for her husband and kids to stay at home. I think “tax evader” would be more fitting.

Posted by: Jason | October 7, 2008, 1:12 pm 1:12 pm

Sarah Palin doesn’t just ‘pal around with terrorists’….
she literally sleeps with them.
Todd Palin was a member of the domestic terrorist group AIP for many years.
She spoke at their convention just months ago..wishing God’s blessings on them!
AIP = Domestic terrorist group.
Sarah Palin sleeps with our enemy.

Posted by: Old Woman | October 7, 2008, 1:12 pm 1:12 pm

John McCain would pay for his health plan with major reductions to Medicare and Medicaid, a top aide said, in a move that independent analysts estimate could result in cuts of $1.3 trillion over 10 years to the government programs
But Douglas Holtz-Eakin, Sen. McCain’s senior policy adviser, said Sunday that the campaign has always planned to fund the tax credits, in part, with savings from Medicare and Medicaid. Those government health-care programs serve seniors, poor families and the disabled. Medicare spending for the fiscal year ended Sept. 30 is estimated at $457.5 billion.
Mr. Holtz-Eakin said the Medicare and Medicaid changes would improve the programs and eliminate fraud, but he didn’t detail where the cuts would come from. “It’s about giving them the benefit package that has been promised to them by law at lower cost,” he said.

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 1:13 pm 1:13 pm

Wow awesome job. Now about those boxes of documents regarding the Obama-Ayers Annenberg challenge? or the Universoty of Chicago lectures organized by Michelle Obama with Obama-Ayers-and the Black Radical Congress people.

Posted by: geevill | October 7, 2008, 1:15 pm 1:15 pm

Because most people don’t understand how local politics works, should the article mention that the city council sets pay, not the mayor. The mayor is not king of the town and doesn’t vote on resolutions or ordinances (even those involving pay) – it’s the town council that has that power.

Posted by: Sea Shells by the Sea Shore | October 7, 2008, 1:17 pm 1:17 pm

I’m surprised Joe Biden didn’t claim his father worked as a salesman for Dunder Mifflin back in Scranton. been to Katie’s lately?

Posted by: geevill | October 7, 2008, 1:18 pm 1:18 pm

This is one independent woman who will be voting for Obama and am I am proud to be his supporter. McCain and Palin are dividing this country and when Obama becomes president he will have to work diligently to promote our healing.

Posted by: Independent | October 7, 2008, 1:20 pm 1:20 pm

Where’s page two where she lists her five year plan to go to was with Russia and decrease women’s rights? I agree with the previous comment. I would have thought the I in Palin would have been dotted with a heart.
Oh well, in five weeks no one will remember her name. Enjoy the 2008-09 winter in snowy Alaska Sarah.

Posted by: Lauren | October 7, 2008, 1:22 pm 1:22 pm

“Because most people don’t understand how local politics works, should the article mention that the city council sets pay, not the mayor.”
Palin claims to have taken a voluntary pay cut.
So is she lying or can she set her own pay?

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 1:22 pm 1:22 pm

Several tax experts said they believe Republican vice-presidential nominee Sarah Palin is required to pay federal taxes on $25,000 in reimbursements from the state of Alaska for her children’s travel expenses.
The Alaska governor released her 2006 and 2007 tax returns on Friday, sparking a lively debate on tax blogs and among tax professionals over whether reimbursements and per-diem meal payments from the state should be subject to federal taxes. Since taking office in December 2006, Gov. Palin, whose state salary is $125,000 a year, received reimbursements totaling $43,500 for travel and lodging for her family in connection with state business. Of that total, $25,000 was for her children’s travel and the rest was for her husband, Todd, the Washington Post reported.

Posted by: beck | October 7, 2008, 1:24 pm 1:24 pm

Ryan C – McCain’s “health care plan” is to give a tax credit to people that would allow them to purchase their own health insurance – this means a person would not be dependent on his/her employer to choose their health care plan for them. This would make insurance easier to obtain, less of a burden on small businesses and cheaper (more competition = better prices). It would also result in fewer people NEEDING Medicare/Medicaid, which is the ultimate goal – those programs need to be replaced with something better and everyone in this country knows that.

Posted by: Me Again | October 7, 2008, 1:24 pm 1:24 pm

rick
nice that you think all the lies from the Bush Cheney Mccain palin team is “drivel”
maybe you don’t understand what the “change” that everybody is up in arms for.
it sure ain’t what Palin and mccain has been showing at their rallies in the past two days.
and it sure isn’t in their tactics
and it sure isn’t in their policies.
so if we don’t have change
you must think the last 8 years were good.
you then must be a very smart man…
you probably voted for Bush …twice.
lol
throw these moron lying bums out!
same team
same tactics
9th year.

Posted by: dl | October 7, 2008, 1:24 pm 1:24 pm

Several tax experts said they believe Republican vice-presidential nominee Sarah Palin is required to pay federal taxes on $25,000 in reimbursements from the state of Alaska for her children’s travel expenses.
The Alaska governor released her 2006 and 2007 tax returns on Friday, sparking a lively debate on tax blogs and among tax professionals over whether reimbursements and per-diem meal payments from the state should be subject to federal taxes. Since taking office in December 2006, Gov. Palin, whose state salary is $125,000 a year, received reimbursements totaling $43,500 for travel and lodging for her family in connection with state business. Of that total, $25,000 was for her children’s travel and the rest was for her husband, Todd, the Washington Post reported.
While several tax experts have raised serious questions about whether the payments to Gov. Palin are taxable income, they said the case was clearer cut for treating the reimbursements for the children’s expenses as taxable income. “The kids are a slam dunk problem,” said Robert Spierer, a partner with the accounting firm Perelson Weiner LLP in New York City. “The husband you could make an argument that he had to be there because it was required for spouses to be there.”
But not the children, he said. “I don’t think I would ever claim that on my clients’ returns. I can’t think of a real strong argument for it.”

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 1:24 pm 1:24 pm

Hopefully, the TRUTH with set Obama and the race baiters free. Maybe he can get a job with a domestic terrorist. Whatever…he’ll have plenty to talk about in the unemployment line with Barney(I lost my Fannie) Franks. Let the lying begin!!OOPS….it already has with this crew!!

Posted by: commrat72 | October 7, 2008, 1:25 pm 1:25 pm

“AIP = Domestic terrorist group.
Sarah Palin sleeps with our enemy.”
Old Woman, please remove the tin foil hat and try to absorb this. Trying to equate Todd Palin’s membership in the AIP, a bunch of moose hunters sitting around the keg complaining about “big government”, with domestic terrorism is both sad and laughable.
Every American can relate to the image of bombs and the Pentagon, bombs and the Capital, bombs and a NYC police precinct. They cannot and will not relate to a moose lodge with a policy paper.
Tell me, why does Obama support the Akaka Bill. If you don’t know, the Akaka Bill would grant “special status” to so called “native Hawaiians” over all other citizens. Even it’s author understands it is a precursor to secession from the Union. This is a real bill in the Senate that is being held back for vote until after the election.
Could Obama still be President if the state he is from leaves the Union?

Posted by: Woody | October 7, 2008, 1:26 pm 1:26 pm

Me again
that is a bunch of bologne.
I encourage everyone to look at your post and then go check the facts.
Mccain’s health care proposal will be disastrous.
period.
just like the last 8 years and the rest of his deregulation arguments

Posted by: dl | October 7, 2008, 1:26 pm 1:26 pm

Mccain doesn’t worry about health care…
he married his.

Posted by: dl | October 7, 2008, 1:26 pm 1:26 pm

MCCAIN AND PALIN SHOULD BE CHARGED WITH PUBLIC INCITEMENT
In some European countries (Britain for one) McCain and Palin would be charged with public incitement for calling Obama a terrorist or implying that he is one, that “he is not one of us” and suggestively using his middle name to imply that he is an Arab terrorist in disguise. A sheriff in uniform (shockingly) made this shameful speech calling Obama’s middle name for effect—making it seem like a state-sponsored action (NOTE: Florida Governor and Joe Sen. Lieberman were watching approvingly). During Palin’s public addresses in California and Florida someone in the crowd shouted that Obama is a “terrorist” and in Florida one person raised the issue of assassination. The shout rang out: “Kill him.” What better proof than this that McCain and Palin are inciting the crowd to harm Obama? The Secret Service and the Justice Department should take such public speeches more seriously. The question now is: Who is the real John McCain? Remember that McCain was a Board member of an extremist organization (Singlaub’s US Council for World Freedom) that provided a forum for anti-Semites, racists and supported terrorist ultra-right wing death squads in Nicaragua and other Latin American countries. Secondly, why is McCain so angry—especially against Obama? There are so many who would hold McCain and rifle-packing Joe Six Pack responsible should anything ever happen to Obama! Clearly, this is McCain-Palin idea of change—cultural division, hatred, and conflict, anger and total avoidance of what really matters to the people like health care, economic prosperity, security at home, and popular leadership of the US abroad.

Posted by: Dr. Sam | October 7, 2008, 1:27 pm 1:27 pm

What kind of “respectable” journalist digs thru people’s trash? “On a recent reporting trip to Alaska” my a$$ !!! More like a dirt-digging expedition, worthy of the National Enquirer.
This seems to be the best you leftists can come up with … how about something with real implications and importance like Obama’s at best questionable sources of funding? and don’t pretend there’s nothing there.

Posted by: Rick58 | October 7, 2008, 1:28 pm 1:28 pm

seems to me that Palin has nothing over the Washington insiders.
It appears she can be deceptive w/out even having been an insider.
Imagine how she’ll be if she should become a Washington insider.
I shudder to think of how that’ll go

Posted by: Mary | October 7, 2008, 1:28 pm 1:28 pm

Woody
Todd Palin belonged to the party that wanted to NOT BE PART OF THE US.
and now he is going to be 2nd dude?
this is the worst Presidential ticket
that we have seen in our nation’s history.
Period.

Posted by: dl | October 7, 2008, 1:28 pm 1:28 pm

Me…said:
is to give a tax credit to people that would allow them to purchase their own health insurance -
Do you know how hard it is to get insurance outside a group plan that you can afford? I guess you have never had to do that. Try being laid off and see what you get, HAAA

Posted by: newvoter | October 7, 2008, 1:29 pm 1:29 pm

Ryan C – She did take a pay cut in her first year. Again, the mayor does not have voting power when it comes to anything the council decides, including pay. The mayor works for the council – just like you don’t control your employer’s payroll decisions, a mayor doesn’t control their’s either. The question really is this – since the council overrode her desire for a paycut, what did she do with the money? Did she donate that money? Did she somehow give it back to the community? The question of what the council did doesn’t matter – it doesn’t reflect on her as mayor (if Palin had voted for a pay raise, then we wouldn’t be having this discussion, but she didn’t).

Posted by: Sea Shells by the Sea Shore | October 7, 2008, 1:30 pm 1:30 pm

“McCain’s “health care plan” is to give a tax credit to people that would allow them to purchase their own health insurance – this means a person would not be dependent on his/her employer to choose their health care plan for them”
McCain will tax any employer provided health insurance as income. So basically anyone that has health benefits will see a tax increase.
His tax credit means out of pocket costs for everyone with the hopes that the credit will cover what you ultimately pay out. That may be fine for young healthy people, but for everyone else the cost is likely to exceed the credit.
Oh and to pay for the tax credit he is going to massively cut MediCare.
His health care plan is exactly as Obama states it is, a disaster.

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 1:30 pm 1:30 pm

You should have mentioned… I’m suprised you didn’t… that the city VOTED on the new sports complex. Just a minor detail in your Palin details.
I can’t wait to see what else you can come up with, surely there is something to be found in her child hood!

Posted by: debra | October 7, 2008, 1:31 pm 1:31 pm

Palin is one of the most corrupt governors ever. As mayor she put Wasilla in 30m debt and as governor she has been involved in several corruption investogation. Something stinks in Juno..

Posted by: thetruth | October 7, 2008, 1:31 pm 1:31 pm

debra…just because the city votes for it doesn’t mean it is right…please…
You can have all the Reps push it and the poor taxpayers end up paying for it.
Votes mean nothing. And what was the vote anyway? Do you have the numbers?

Posted by: forthegoodlife | October 7, 2008, 1:33 pm 1:33 pm

What kind of “respectable” journalist digs thru people’s trash? “On a recent reporting trip to Alaska” my … !!! More like a dirt-digging expedition, worthy of the National Enquirer.
This seems to be the best you leftists can come up with … how about something with real implications and importance like Obama’s at best questionable sources of funding? and don’t pretend there’s nothing there.

Posted by: Rick58 | October 7, 2008, 1:34 pm 1:34 pm

“Ryan C – She did take a pay cut in her first year. Again, the mayor does not have voting power when it comes to anything the council decides, ”
But she could have refused the pay increases.
Otherwise it looks like her voluntary paycut what just a political stunt.
Which makes sense when you look at how she operates.

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 1:34 pm 1:34 pm

Sea..you failed to mention that she got a pay increase the next year to $68,000. She was smart though, she took pay degreases each year but they never went below the original salary of $64,000.

Posted by: newkid | October 7, 2008, 1:36 pm 1:36 pm

“that the city VOTED on the new sports complex”
You mean the city council loaded with Palin cronies?

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 1:36 pm 1:36 pm

newvoter – yes, I do know how hard it is to get insurance outside of a group plan. I also know, I’d never let my employer choose my house, my bank or my car – why would I want them picking my health insurance and which doctors I visit? I’d rather choose it myself, like I choose which grocery store I shop at. McCain’s plan is designed to make it easier to go outside of a group plan. More competition = better prices.

Posted by: Me again | October 7, 2008, 1:36 pm 1:36 pm

I see another four years of the same crap with McCain/Palin. I am tired of working and having nothing to show for it, as I have in the last 7. Republicans are running the economy as well as the country into the ground. Help us Obama!!!

Posted by: Sarah | October 7, 2008, 1:37 pm 1:37 pm

When any government undertakes to say to its subjects, This you may not read, this you must not see, this you are forbidden to know, the end result is tyranny and oppression no matter how holy the motives.
John McCain is a sponsor and supporter of domestic terrorism. He does not beleiive that those that bomb clincs where abortions are performed and that those that assault individuals entering and leaving such places should be prosecuted or held accountable for any fines they incur as part of any prosecution.
John McCain also supports the ideals of the Klu Klux Klan and other openly racist organizations, he ardently opposed the MLK holiday and supported the flying to the Confederate flag over government buildings, only reversing his position when it became a political liability.
John McCain was not found innocent in regard to the Keating scandal, the senate committee investigating did not believe that it had jurisdiction over him because he was a member of the house at the time. He was the only government official involved in the scandal that had actually traveled with Keating and had over a quarter of a million dollars invested with him.
To incite hatred of your opponent is the lowest form of politics. Disagree with them, certainly, attempt to persuade the electorate that your position is the better one for the nation, of course. To appeal to the lowest common denominator is beneath those that should even seek such office. You do not represent me Mr. McCain. You do not put yoru country first. You are disgrace to every office you have held and every uniform you have worn.

Posted by: Louis | October 7, 2008, 1:38 pm 1:38 pm

Woody,
Please explain how the Akaka bill is different from rights we grant to Native Americans on the mainland in terms of self governance.

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 1:38 pm 1:38 pm

Ryan C and newkid – I suggest you sit in on a few of your own town/city council meetings so you can see first-hand that the mayor does not have the power to override the council – it’s not the way it works. Since the mayor doesn’t control the council, the question really is this: how did she handle their decision to override her request for a pay decrease?

Posted by: Sea Shells by the Sea Shore | October 7, 2008, 1:39 pm 1:39 pm

dl:
“Todd Palin belonged to the party that wanted to NOT BE PART OF THE US.
and now he is going to be 2nd dude?”
Your point is well taken, he was a member of a party that did not want to be part of the country. And then he wasn’t. Do you disagree with my assessment that it was and is an all bark, no bite party?
For years in RI we had the Cool Moose party. The leader ran for governor and got 20% one year on a platform of “A strange man for a strange job”.
Please answer my question on Obama’s support of the Akaka bill. This isn’t a bunch of moose hunters screaming into the wilderness, it’s a real, live bill.

Posted by: Woody | October 7, 2008, 1:39 pm 1:39 pm

McCain believes in the market. He wants to free you from employer provided health care plans and allow you as an individual to choose. He wants to free us from state regulations.
So he wants us to have health insurance like we have car insurance? I don’t know about you but I am buying mine from the English lizard. I can’t stand the Cavemen.

Posted by: ricky | October 7, 2008, 1:40 pm 1:40 pm

Rick…ok let’s did. Where did that story come from originally? Tell me…

Posted by: thetruth | October 7, 2008, 1:40 pm 1:40 pm

In Response to this Gobbly Goup
“McCain/Palin are both HONEST”
shall we go through the list of lies that they and their team have pushed on us for the last 8 years and they are continuing
they lied to us about wmd:Reading from a declassified portion of a report by the National Ground Intelligence Center, a Defense Department intelligence unit, Santorum said: “Since 2003, coalition forces have recovered approximately 500 weapons munitions which contain degraded mustard or sarin nerve agent. Despite many efforts to locate and destroy Iraq’s pre-Gulf War chemical munitions, filled and unfilled pre-Gulf War chemical munitions are assessed to still exist.”
they lied to us about Katrina: Did they say there was no hurrican coming? Stay home it will be fine. No Warnings were issued. The people failed to head warnings, and then cried fowl when faced with the reality of their own foolishness.
they lied to us about Presidential signing statements
they lied to us about the economy: Who Obama’s advisors who ran Freddie and Fannie into the ground.
they lied to us about being greeted as Liberators:
My brother served in Bahgdad and had IRAQIS Sheilded him from mortor attacks. Iraqis asked him why some “Americans” were trying to leave them out to be destroyed like at the UN at the end of the Gulf War.
they lied to us about mushroom clouds:
Mccain and Palin?
they lied to us about global warming:
Who Al Gore who was so conserned he did NOTHING until after his failed bid for office.
they lied to us about abu ghraib
You’re right terrorist deserve warm milk and cookies with Santa.
they lied to us about secret prison camps
You’re right we should divulge every piece of information and strategy while at war.
they lied to us about “mission accomplished”
In the context of Liberation it is.
same lying team
same lying tactics”

Posted by: MrBear | October 7, 2008, 1:41 pm 1:41 pm

rick
rick rick rick58
“Obama’s at best questionable sources of funding?”
lol
nothing like the 120k or so plus plane flights and vacations Mccain took the first time we lost a trillion dollars
you remember when he was flying around and hanging out with the guy that raped our economy the first time we had to bail out the deregulators that mccain is so fond of whipping to the back of the room.(..like he is trying to do with healthcare…)
so mccain learned his lesson from the whole deregulator thing and Keating?
oh that’s why he hired the deregulating lobbyists not only to RUN his camapign (Davis and Black and the 23 other deregulating lobbyists in his inner circle) but had them write the future economic plan for all of us…
Gramm
oh and did we mention the Enron Loophole that gramm wrote before McCain hired him to plan our economic futures.
this is a joke
the worst ticket our nation has ever seen.
period.

Posted by: dl | October 7, 2008, 1:41 pm 1:41 pm

Under the McCain Plan, your employer can provide you with health insurance as good as a “Member of Congress”, and you would pay no more in taxes – regardless of your tax bracket. In fact, you would have some additional money left over from the McCain tax credit to put in a health savings account.

Posted by: CrystalD | October 7, 2008, 1:41 pm 1:41 pm

ricky…does this sound familiar? Isn’t this how we got in this mess, on Wall Street, in the first place, by letting them ” do their thing”?

Posted by: formerhillary | October 7, 2008, 1:42 pm 1:42 pm

The question is simple, are you doing better than you were 7 years ago and if things keep going the way they are, will you be doing better 7 years from now?

Posted by: Louis | October 7, 2008, 1:42 pm 1:42 pm

Woody…I think you better back track a few steps and take your foot out of your mouth and also those fingers out of your ears.
If you want truth of the AIP connection just go to you tube and type in Palin AIP member…
Now, that is only if you really want the truth but then again, you may think not knowing is your truth.
Look at the rest of the vids there as well, very enlightening.
She supported that group all the way into this year.
Obama/Biden ’08

Posted by: Bev | October 7, 2008, 1:43 pm 1:43 pm

Sarah, “I am tired of working and having nothing to show for it,” With all due respect, how is Bush’s fault that you have nothing to show for your work? Regardless of who wins, you’ll still have to work, still have to pay your bills, you’ll still have to make sure you save $$ from each paycheck. Neither Obama or McCain will change that. Tax wise, not much will even change for you, but for the company that employs you, depending on who wins, things could change pretty dramatically.

Posted by: Beautiful day | October 7, 2008, 1:44 pm 1:44 pm

“Palin is one of the most corrupt governors ever. As mayor she put Wasilla in 30m debt and as governor she has been involved in several corruption investogation. Something stinks in Juno.”
Hey genius, it’s “Juneau”, “investigations”, and I think “$30M” is a better abbreviation for 30 million dollars.
More exaggerations, lies, and bad spelling from the elite leftist intelligentsia …
(Hey guys, I’m just having a little fun here. Vota for Obama, I don’t care. I think all sides should just cut the crap and discuss the issues. We’re all smart enough (even you) to listen and decide for ourselves without all the name calling, trash talking, garbage digging stuff that this race is becoming reduced to.)
America is better than this.

Posted by: Rick58 | October 7, 2008, 1:45 pm 1:45 pm

Mr Bear
same team
same tactics
the lies that you all want to minimize from the past 8 years
have most of America furious.
those lies are what got us here.
so I guess your post argues that the last 8 years were good…
lol
do they let you use the computer for the full hour at the institution or is it cut off earlier than that.
McCain Palin are the same lying team from the last 8 years
with the same lying tactics from the last 8 years
and the same destroy our country policies of the last 8 years
America GET angry!
throw these bums out!

Posted by: dl | October 7, 2008, 1:45 pm 1:45 pm

Crystal, you are incorrect, under the McCain plan, all health care benefits will be subject to taxation. YOu get taxed for what your insurance covers. In order to pay for his plan, McCain will cut medicaid and medicare. His entire plan will, at best, cover an additional 5 million more people. Obama’s plan covers 28-40 million more, costs less and offers more choices. The reason why McCain is not talking about the issues is because he has already lost on all of them.

Posted by: Louis | October 7, 2008, 1:46 pm 1:46 pm

“I suggest you sit in on a few of your own town/city council meetings so you can see first-hand that the mayor does not have the power to override the council”
I would suggest that you not ascribe the way your particular town works vs others especially Wasilla.
Let’s check the code shall we.
2.16.080 Veto by mayor.
The mayor may veto an ordinance, resolution, motion, or other action of the council and may strike or reduce appropriation items. A veto must be exercised before the
regular council meeting and must be accompanied by written explanation of the reasons for the veto. A veto may by overridden by a vote of two-thirds of the council within twenty-one (21) calendar days following the veto, or at the next regular meeting, whichever is later. The veto does not extend to the adoption or repeal of a manager plan of city government. (Prior code 2.16.070)
It would appear that you are quite wrong.
 

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 1:47 pm 1:47 pm

The McCain plan transforms the current tax code to provide all American families – including the self-employed and the uninsured – the same tax benefit, a $5,000 refundable tax credit ($2,500 for individuals) that was previously only available to those with employer coverage. Families can use this credit to purchase insurance of their choice, including keeping their current coverage.
This is an approach supported by Barack Obama’s own Senior Economic Advisor Jason Furman who wrote that “we could scrap the current deduction altogether and replace it with progressive tax credits that, together with other changes, would ensure that every American has affordable health insurance.”

Posted by: CrystalD | October 7, 2008, 1:48 pm 1:48 pm

Woody is absolutely right about old Todd Palin and his secessionist Moose hunting party. They know if they pull out of the U.S. they will be invaded by either Russian or Canada and have to learn another language. Or they could join NATO or OPEC. Hawaii is another matter. The AKAKA pl;an just purposrts to put native Hawaiian’s first. Right after they restore the Queen the local Japanese will sell them out to Tokyo and you will need a passport to vacation there.

Posted by: ricky | October 7, 2008, 1:48 pm 1:48 pm

“I think “$30M” is a better abbreviation for 30 million dollars.
More exaggerations”
You’re right.
Palin left Wasilla “only” $22,000,000 in debt.
Basically $2500 per resident of Wasilla.

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 1:49 pm 1:49 pm

To bad you can’t find doodles from Obama it would be nice to see any thing from his days as a sen in the state of ILL.

Posted by: Bishop | October 7, 2008, 1:50 pm 1:50 pm

Look for all of her populist rhetoric, I am one of you, Joe six pack, Shinny City on a hill, she is still a politician, a Republican at that.
The scary part is she is totally unaware of the world outside of Alaska.

Posted by: Thinking | October 7, 2008, 1:50 pm 1:50 pm

“Old Woman, please remove the tin foil hat and try to absorb this. Trying to equate Todd Palin’s membership in the AIP, a bunch of moose hunters sitting around the keg complaining about “big government”, with domestic terrorism is both sad and laughable.”
I am sorry but I have to say this…The founder of that AIP was no drunk sitting around a keg.
He died in 1993 from a bomb he was making, so what was he going to blow up.
Get the facts..Mr Dude was a member from 1992 to 2002…a member while the founder was still alive.
Think we can connect her and dude to a terrorist????
Just do your homework and look it up.
Obama/Biden ’08

Posted by: Bev | October 7, 2008, 1:50 pm 1:50 pm

“In some European countries (Britain for one) McCain and Palin would be charged …” OMG, let’s turn the USA into a frickin’ nanny state like Britian !!!
If you like it so much, MOVE THERE !!!!!

Posted by: Rick58 | October 7, 2008, 1:51 pm 1:51 pm

Ryan:
“Woody,
Please explain how the Akaka bill is different from rights we grant to Native Americans on the mainland in terms of self governance.”
You’re a smart guy Ryan and I think you already know. Akaka has no interest in seeking tribal recognition for Hawaiians nor complying with the Bureau of Indian Affairs criteria for tribal recognition. This bill is all about providing special status to “Native Hawaiians”, not Native Americans. He wants to reestablish the Kingdom of Hawaii, complete with its own government with full powers, usurping all federal authority. Sounds like “secession-light” to me.
Of course this is all done under the name of reconcilliation and reparation.

Posted by: Woody | October 7, 2008, 1:51 pm 1:51 pm

MrBear
also
you do realize that your explanations for the lies of the last 8 years are the same things Bush and Cheney said…
lol
you know after they lied to us.
excuses and more lies are what it adds up to…
same team
same tactics
and if you can’t see that you are getting lonelier by the day
idiots got us Bush Cheney
now the same “logicians” is arguing for McCain Palin.

Posted by: dl | October 7, 2008, 1:52 pm 1:52 pm

MrBear
also
you do realize that your explanations for the lies of the last 8 years are the same things Bush and Cheney said…
lol
you know after they lied to us.
excuses and more lies are what it adds up to…
same team
same tactics
and if you can’t see that you are getting lonelier by the day
idiots got us Bush Cheney
now the same “logicians” are arguing for McCain Palin.

Posted by: dl | October 7, 2008, 1:52 pm 1:52 pm

BD,
The tax plan Obama proposes puts more money in my pocket, his health care plan makes that more affordable, his education plan makes it possible for my kids to go to college if I can’t pay cash for it. Yeah, Under Obama, I think things will be better. Under McCain, my son will be drafted, my company will stop offering insurance, I’ll pay more since the ins companies will have $5K promise from the GOP and not provide much in the way of coverage. Schools will get worse as it becomes more about the tests and less about getting the best people to teach.

Posted by: Louis | October 7, 2008, 1:52 pm 1:52 pm

Democrats=no personal responsiblity. Only want to be taken care of. Pro-socialism.

Posted by: southern_conservative | October 7, 2008, 1:53 pm 1:53 pm

“The McCain plan transforms the current tax code to provide all American families – including the self-employed and the uninsured – the same tax benefit, a $5,000 refundable tax credit ($2,500 for individuals) that was previously only available to those with employer coverage.”
I am a non smoker in his early 30′s with no preexisting conditions.
$2500 would pay for about 7 months of healthcare based on what my employer currently pays in a group plan.
So basically John McCain would tax my remaining 5 months of healthcare as income.
My coworker whose wife and he are in their 50′s? Well the combined credit would pay for about 5 months of their health care leaving them to be taxed on the remaining 7 months of healthcare as income.
Thanks to John McCain, many people would be getting the same healthcare for more of the cost.

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 1:54 pm 1:54 pm

I was just thinking. It is too bad Cindy McCain kicked her drug habit before writing a “tell all” biography was the way to get back in good with the public. Then we would know whether it was John that caused her problem.

Posted by: ricky | October 7, 2008, 1:55 pm 1:55 pm

Rick58: “…elite leftist intelligentsia.”
For someone with such deep opinions about spelling, I am quite amused that you seem to have your own personal definitions of words like “elite” and “intelligentsia.” I guess in your world the worst person imaginable would be Albert Einstein – if he also a Navy Seal.
Selecting leaders on the basis of them NOT being better leaders, and NOT being intelligent does not make a whole lot of sense.

Posted by: jhw539 | October 7, 2008, 1:55 pm 1:55 pm

Just happend Today…Democrat Ed Schultz raido talk show host from 820am WCPT in Chicago Just called Sarah Palin a “Political Whore”….
I am so offend..

Posted by: GoUSA247 | October 7, 2008, 1:55 pm 1:55 pm

(a) Reaffirmation- The delegation by the United States of authority to the State of Hawaii to address the conditions of the indigenous, native people of Hawaii contained in the Act entitled `An Act to provide for the admission of the State of Hawaii into the Union’ approved March 18, 1959 (Public Law 86-3, 73 Stat. 4), is reaffirmed.
(b) Negotiations-
(1) IN GENERAL- Upon the reaffirmation of the special political and legal relationship between the United States and the Native Hawaiian governing entity, the United States and the State of Hawaii may enter into negotiations with the Native Hawaiian governing entity designed to lead to an agreement addressing such matters as–
(A) the transfer of lands, natural resources, and other assets, and the protection of existing rights related to such lands or resources;
(B) the exercise of governmental authority over any transferred lands, natural resources, and other assets, including land use;
(C) the exercise of civil and criminal jurisdiction;
(D) the delegation of governmental powers and authorities to the Native Hawaiian governing entity by the United States and the State of Hawaii;
(E) any residual responsibilities of the United States and the State of Hawaii; and
(F) grievances regarding assertions of historical wrongs committed against Native Hawaiians by the United States or by the State of Hawaii.
(2) AMENDMENTS TO EXISTING LAWS- Upon agreement on any matter or matters negotiated with the United States, the State of Hawaii, and the Native Hawaiian governing entity, the parties are authorized to submit–
(A) to the Committee on Indian Affairs of the Senate, the Committee on Energy and Natural Resources of the Senate, and the Committee on Resources of the House of Representatives, recommendations for proposed amendments to Federal law that will enable the implementation of agreements reached between the 3 governments; and
(B) to the Governor and the legislature of the State of Hawaii, recommendations for proposed amendments to State law that will enable the implementation of agreements reached between the 3 governments.
(3) GOVERNMENTAL AUTHORITY AND POWER- Any governmental authority or power to be exercised by the Native Hawaiian governing entity which is currently exercised by the State or Federal Governments shall be exercised by the Native Hawaiian governing entity only as agreed to in negotiations pursuant to section 8(b)(1) of this Act and beginning on the date on which legislation to implement such agreement has been enacted by the United States Congress, when applicable, and by the State of Hawaii, when applicable. This includes any required modifications to the Hawaii State Constitution in accordance with the Hawaii Revised Statutes.
(c) Claims-
(1) DISCLAIMERS- Nothing in this Act–
(A) creates a cause of action against the United States or any other entity or person;
(B) alters existing law, including existing case law, regarding obligations on the part of the United States or the State of Hawaii with regard to Native Hawaiians or any Native Hawaiian entity;
(C) creates obligations that did not exist in any source of Federal law prior to the date of enactment of this Act; or
(D) establishes authority for the recognition of Native Hawaiian groups other than the single Native Hawaiian Governing Entity.
(2) FEDERAL SOVEREIGN IMMUNITY-
(A) SPECIFIC PURPOSE- Nothing in this Act is intended to create or allow to be maintained in any court any potential breach-of-trust actions, land claims, resource-protection or resource-management claims, or similar types of claims brought by or on behalf of Native Hawaiians or the Native Hawaiian governing entity for equitable, monetary, or Administrative Procedure Act-based relief against the United States or the State of Hawaii, whether or not such claims specifically assert an alleged breach of trust, call for an accounting, seek declaratory relief, or seek the recovery of or compensation for lands once held by Native Hawaiians.
(B) ESTABLISHMENT AND RETENTION OF SOVEREIGN IMMUNITY- To effectuate the ends expressed in section 8(c)(1) and 8(c)(2)(A), and notwithstanding any other provision of Federal law, the United States retains its sovereign immunity to any claim that existed prior to the enactment of this Act (including, but not limited to, any claim based in whole or in part on past events), and which could be brought by Native Hawaiians or any Native Hawaiian governing entity. Nor shall any preexisting waiver of sovereign immunity (including, but not limited to, waivers set forth in chapter 7 of part I of title 5, United States Code, and sections 1505 and 2409a of title 28, United States Code) be applicable to any such claims. This complete retention or reclaiming of sovereign immunity also applies to every claim that might attempt to rely on this Act for support, without regard to the source of law under which any such claim might be asserted.
(C) EFFECT- It is the general effect of section 8(c)(2)(B) that any claims that may already have accrued and might be brought against the United States, including any claims of the types specifically referred to in section 8(c)(2)(A), along with both claims of a similar nature and claims arising out of the same nucleus of operative facts as could give rise to claims of the specific types referred to in section 8(c)(2)(A), be rendered nonjusticiable in suits brought by plaintiffs other than the Federal Government.
(3) STATE SOVEREIGNTY IMMUNITY-
(A) Notwithstanding any other provision of Federal law, the State retains its sovereign immunity, unless waived in accord with State law, to any claim, established under any source of law, regarding Native Hawaiians, that existed prior to the enactment of this Act.
(B) Nothing in this Act shall be construed to constitute an override pursuant to section 5 of the Fourteenth Amendment of State sovereign immunity held under the Eleventh Amendment.

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 1:56 pm 1:56 pm

southern conservative
democrats recognize how well the last 8 years of your candidates policies has worked.
and that 4 more and we may not have a country …
what do you think the global financial crisis is going to do to terrorism ?
what do you think the Bush McCain policies are going to do to get us support in fighting that terrorism?
how big do you think our target is going to get…
and how many allies more will we have walk away from us because of all this and how much worse will it be if we elect Mccain?
bad… it will get very bad.

Posted by: dl | October 7, 2008, 1:57 pm 1:57 pm

GoUSA247: “I am so offend..”
Yes, I’m SURE you are. Since the Republicans showed such gallantry to Senator Clinton. She has never, ever been called any even slightly offensive terms during her time in the limelight – not once, even by the most minor of Republicans. Nope, not in “help-I’m-being-oppressed!” Republican world.

Posted by: jhw539 | October 7, 2008, 1:57 pm 1:57 pm

CrystalD,
Here is the deal. McCain gives me $5000 for my wife and me to purchase my own Healthcare. Curently I pay $2,171 and my Employer pays $9,030 Total cost $11,204. Who is going to pay the $6,204 differance? Me. An encrease in my cost by almost $4,000 a year.
This doesn’t even gaurntee that I can find an Insurance Company to cover me or for the current cost. Most likely because of my age the premiums will be higher.

Posted by: Thinking | October 7, 2008, 1:58 pm 1:58 pm

Thinking,
And if you stay with your employer based coverage you will be taxed on it.

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 2:01 pm 2:01 pm

I agree with southern_conservative. There is no substitute for personal responsibility. So when Bush and Cheny leave office they either forgo their pension or, if they insist on staying on the taxpayer dime, let them do it at
CampFed.

Posted by: ricky | October 7, 2008, 2:05 pm 2:05 pm

Jake asks “Do you remember last year when Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., donated a doodle for an auction to benefit The Neurofibromatosis Association and epilepsy research?” No, I don’t. But I remember when the stock market was plunging 800 points and you were writing about pet wigs.

Posted by: ricky | October 7, 2008, 2:07 pm 2:07 pm

Come off it Ryan C. Quit arguing with Woody and admit that those native Hawaiians would be better off with a President McCain. Then they could have thier own tribal casino.

Posted by: ricky | October 7, 2008, 2:10 pm 2:10 pm

Thinking – the part of the equation that you are missing is that a freer, more competitive market would result in lower prices. Right now, your employer decided what features you need in your health insurance based on the health issues faced by all your coworkers. You might need a more basic plan, you might need a more complex one. The bottom line is you would chose what you need, not your employer. Yes, you’d still pay your share, but chances are, that premium would be much lower.

Posted by: Me again | October 7, 2008, 2:11 pm 2:11 pm

I’m surprised Joe Biden didn’t claim his father worked as a salesman for Dunder Mifflin back in Scranton
—————–
I’m surprised Palin got a coherent sentence out without making an ass of herself again.

Posted by: Rachel in VA | October 7, 2008, 2:13 pm 2:13 pm

“the part of the equation that you are missing is that a freer, more competitive market would result in lower prices.”
LOL.
Spoken like someone who has never sought health insurance for themselves or their company.

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 2:14 pm 2:14 pm

yes, for those offended by ed s. remarks about palin
remember the rally MCCAIN had and the question from the audience was
“HOW WE GONNA BEAT THAT *****”
(referring to sen. clinton)
John mccain response: that is just what we are trying to do.

Posted by: omg | October 7, 2008, 2:15 pm 2:15 pm

“The bottom line is you would chose what you need, not your employer.”
And under McCain if you stay with the employer plan you will be taxed on those benefits as income.
McCain plan will force people to drop their employer coverage and get the most basic health insurance that they can afford while waiting for McCain;s tax credit during filing time, hoping it will offset the outlays one has already made.
The McCain plan = Less health care for more money

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 2:16 pm 2:16 pm

Louis, Obama’s health care plan is nothing but a campaign promise. The country can’t afford it, Congress won’t pass it and we are in the midst of a nursing shortage that’s expected to worsen each year when it hits crisis point at 2025. Our health care system simply can’t be converted until the nursing shortage is addressed, and Obama knows it. Universal healthcare is a pipe dream and nothing more. Obama would do better to look at a more realistic free-market model.

Posted by: Howdy Do! | October 7, 2008, 2:17 pm 2:17 pm

Does any Republican here think that people should have their healthcare benefits taxed as income as John McCain proposes?

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 2:18 pm 2:18 pm

“The country can’t afford it”
The country can’t afford it thanks to Republicans blowing a surplus and turning it into massive deficits.

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 2:19 pm 2:19 pm

Me again: Ya, not so… Saw an expert on TV on McCains plan… bad… did not recommend it. You will be paying more, really think about it. Common sense…

Posted by: beck | October 7, 2008, 2:21 pm 2:21 pm

Thinking – Here is the deal. McCain gives you $5000 for you and your wife to purchase your own Healthcare. Curently you are lucky enough to have healthcare partially funded by your employers. Today you pay $2,171 and your Employer pays $9,030 Total cost $11,204. Now you would pay nothing to healthcare, and your employer would also pay less – $6,201 to the insurer, because the money is going directly to the insurance company to reduce the amount the insurance company bills. Your employer should continue with their plan for coverage, because McCain’s plan has no impact to your employer’s making arrangements to provide healthcare for employees. The Insurance Company would have an obligation to continue coverage, and if you choose to get your healthcare coverage elsewhere, pre-existing conditions would be covered. Most likely as you get older the premiums will be higher, as they do get higher today as you age. For middle-income folks who have zero benefits from their employer and pay out of pocket $12,000 per year, or for those who can’t get healthcare because of cancer 7 years ago or because they had a biopsy or heart check at one point and don’t have an employer who provides benefits or healthcare subsidies, McCain’s plan is a big improvement. Obama’s plan leaves out folks who earn middle incomes and are near retirement age and can’t get healthcare from any providers. McCain’s plan provides a fairer solution for everyone.

Posted by: Chuck | October 7, 2008, 2:21 pm 2:21 pm

McCain is just proving with the health care debate
that his policies are from someone who has never had to worry about healthcare
has no clue what the issue is
because he never has had to.
He doesn’t have to worry about Medicare or Medicaid…
or fiinding coverage
he married his healthcare provider.
This deregulated open market system is someone who speaks for the wealthy and doesn’t realize what the rest of America is facing….
just like most of his policy stances…he does not understand the shortage of family practice physicians…and what it is like to not be able to afford healthcare or find health care for that matter.
the worst ticket in the history of our nation.

Posted by: dl | October 7, 2008, 2:22 pm 2:22 pm

Ryan C – It’s not true that people would be forced to drop their employer’s health care – they could keep it if they want. That’s the beauty of McCain’s plan, nobody would be forced to do anything and a more free market would force insurance companies and hospitals to be more competitive. that means lower prices for you and mean AND better service. You wouldn’t pay more (heck, you could keep the plan you have now if you’re so happy with it), the choice would be yours.

Posted by: Howdy Do! | October 7, 2008, 2:22 pm 2:22 pm

Howdy Do!: “Universal healthcare is a pipe dream and nothing more. ”
This is nonsense. WE HAVE UNIVERSAL HEALTHCARE – NO ONE DIES IN THE STREET UNABLE TO GET HEALTHCARE. But as has been pointed out by both Republicans and Democrats, we have very inefficient, stupid health care. It is a better investment to give a kid $20 in antibiotics rather than wait for them to show up septic in the ER and run up a 5-digit bill getting better.
WE HAVE UNIVERSAL HEALTHCARE NOW, BUT HEALTHCARE BY EMERGENCY ROOM IS INEFFICIENT, EXPENSIVE, AND BARELY EFFECTIVE.

Posted by: jhw539 | October 7, 2008, 2:24 pm 2:24 pm

beck – well, if you saw it on tv, who am I to judge? I guess reading both plans and judging for myself is just silly if the media is willing to let me know what’s best for me. Thanks for the tip!

Posted by: Me again | October 7, 2008, 2:24 pm 2:24 pm

GoUSA247: If you’re just going to post the same thing over and over, at least take the opportunity to do a bit of copy-editting. Or wait for the official McCain talking point; it should be out any minute now.

Posted by: jhw539 | October 7, 2008, 2:26 pm 2:26 pm

Howdy DO
are you just not that well read
do you understand that hospitals really can’t get “more competitive” unless they trash our care.
Hospitals are subsidized as it is…including charitable donations that are drying up because of the rest of the Bush Mccain policies
this debate is a joke.
Mccain Palin is the WORST ticket we have ever seen in the history of our nation on ALL of these issues.
ugh
and they are unethical to boot.

Posted by: dl | October 7, 2008, 2:26 pm 2:26 pm

To bad you can’t find doodles from Obama it would be nice to see any thing from his days as a sen in the state of ILL.
And Health care is DOA for both party’s more lies

Posted by: Bishop | October 7, 2008, 2:27 pm 2:27 pm

Thinking – the part of the equation that you are missing is that a freer, more competitive market would result in lower prices. Right now, your employer decided what features you need in your health insurance based on the health issues faced by all your coworkers. You might need a more basic plan, you might need a more complex one. The bottom line is you would chose what you need, not your employer. Yes, you’d still pay your share, but chances are, that premium would be much lower.
———————————-
Your assumption that premiums will go down makes no sense. All you’ve said is if you take less health care coverage, then your cost could go down. And that is even a guess at best.
In your “free market” theory you fail to recognize that companies buying large group policies are able to negotiate better rates because they are buying in volume. As individuals, you will not have that leverage. You will be at the mercy of the insurance companies and on your own.
The point is that for the same coverage, under McCain’s plan, costs to individuals will go up. And there is no assurances in his plan that one will even be able to get insurance.
McCain himself admited when questioned that many seniors, and those with pre-existing conditions, will lose coverage completely because insurance companies will see them as high risk.His response was, “Well, we’ll need to consider that.”
So to pay more deductables, have less coverage, and pay more for a policy is a good thing for some reason?

Posted by: Rachel in VA | October 7, 2008, 2:28 pm 2:28 pm

jhw539 – I’m not sure how you’re defining universal healthcare, but no, we do not have it in this country. Millions of people go without basic medical care because they don’t have insurance and can’t afford to pay a doctor. And yes, people DO in fact die because of it (not to mention the lack of preventative care that leads to many deaths). As for people dying in the streets – every now and again, there’s a horrific story of people dying in hospital emergency rooms. ~~ And $20 antibiotics for kids?? where are you buying your antibiotics? The last antibiotic I bought was $4! You need to look for a cheaper pharmacy.

Posted by: Howdy Do! | October 7, 2008, 2:29 pm 2:29 pm

Rachel have you been listening to pundits instead of reading transcripts of the debate. Find one coherent sentence after “Can I call you Joe?”

Posted by: ricky | October 7, 2008, 2:31 pm 2:31 pm

jhw539 – I’m not sure how you’re defining universal healthcare, but no, we do not have it in this country. Millions of people go without basic medical care because they don’t have insurance and can’t afford to pay a doctor. And yes, people DO in fact die because of it (not to mention the lack of preventative care that leads to many deaths). As for people dying in the streets – every now and again, there’s a horrific story of people dying in hospital emergency rooms. ~~ And $20 antibiotics for kids?? where are you buying your antibiotics? The last antibiotic I bought was $4! You need to look for a cheaper pharmacy.

Posted by: Howdy Do! | October 7, 2008, 2:32 pm 2:32 pm

I see in that a woman who wanted to make a difference.

Posted by: wahm5 | October 7, 2008, 2:33 pm 2:33 pm

jhw539 – I’m not sure how you’re defining universal healthcare, but no, we do not have it in this country. Millions of people go without basic medical care because they don’t have insurance and can’t afford to pay a doctor. And yes, people DO in fact die because of it (not to mention the lack of preventative care that leads to many deaths). As for people dying in the streets – every now and again, there’s a horrific story of people dying in hospital emergency rooms. ~~ And $20 antibiotics for kids?? where are you buying your antibiotics? The last antibiotic I bought was $4! You need to look for a cheaper pharmacy.

Posted by: Howdy Do! | October 7, 2008, 2:33 pm 2:33 pm

McCain’s $5000 for healthcare, would be paid for from Medicare and Medicaid changes to improve the programs and eliminate fraud. One place they could start is that when hospitals bill Medicare, they charge double or triple what they charge the average insurance company. If you use the $5000 to offset the charges on the average $12,000 per year healthcare policy on your employer based coverage you will be taxed on the amount over $5000, but for most people this is a savings over what they are paying out of pocket today. It makes the tax system fairer because for contractors and others without any subsidized healthcare, they are paying taxes on every dime, and then having to use the after tax money to buy a $12,000 per year policy.

Posted by: Chuck | October 7, 2008, 2:34 pm 2:34 pm

Bishop[
Healthcare can’t be DOA
if we don’t reign in healthcare somehow …whether it be buy focusing in on cost, prevention and universality
our country will go down the tubes.
Obama knows we have priorities on cost
Billing costing more than the actual healthcare.
a lack of family practice docs and nurses and a problem with retention
a malpractice insurance redundancy issue that is getting passed on to all of us.
and pharmaceutical sales and marketing that is still too infiltrated in the system…
Universality helps…but by reducing bureaucracy not increasing it.
the free market and deregulation of the healthcare industry makes a handful of hospitals better but overall it will shrink the market not increase it…
when as it is the overhead of the uninsured and the lack of charitable donation reductions we are about to see are going to make things VERY BAD…
and as more people are uninsured or have higher premiums…and not getting early detection and prevention
the costs are going to sky rocket
and that does not take into consideration the aging baby boom population
so everyone needs to get their heads out of their butts
energy and healthcare are the hurdles and keys to our future.
MccainPalin the worst ticket we have ever seen in our nation.

Posted by: dl | October 7, 2008, 2:35 pm 2:35 pm

Howdy Do!: “a more free market would force insurance companies and hospitals to be more competitive.”
All the reputable economists I’ve seen don’t quite concur with your assessment. What it would do is make insurance companies be more competitive for HEALTHY people. Anyone who actually has a health problem, who currently gets covered via an employer’s insurance pool, will flat out not be able to buy insurance. And, just like auto insurance for high risk drivers in many states, the government will have to provide them coverage.
Due to the chronic nature of many health ailments and magnitude of costs they can incur, insurance companies will be in a race to exclude anyone who may actually need them.
Have high cholesterol and a grandfather who died of heart disease? Mom had breast cancer? Worked in a coal mine for a few years? Live within a 4 mile radius of a trash incinerator? Well, no private health insurance, from anyone, at any price, for you. The private market is about optimizing the profit from providing health insurance, and that is indisputably done by optimizing their methods of excluding anyone who needs it.

Posted by: jhw539 | October 7, 2008, 2:37 pm 2:37 pm

Meet me here in four or eight years and Health care will still be DOA

Posted by: Bishop | October 7, 2008, 2:38 pm 2:38 pm

Howdy Do! The last antibiotic I bought was $4! You need to look for a cheaper pharmacy.
Glad you posted! Please share your pharmacy sources. I would like to switch immediately for my medications to your pharmacy. While your at it, send your list of doctors too, because I pay $45 per visit or more and that’s with my insurance coverage.

Posted by: Tonya | October 7, 2008, 2:39 pm 2:39 pm

If elected, Obama’s cabinet: Ayers, Jeremiah Wright, Pfleger, Louis Farrakhan, Fannie Mae CEO, Freddie Mac CEO.,ACORN exec.

Posted by: southern_conservative | October 7, 2008, 2:41 pm 2:41 pm

Bishop
do you get what is about to happen with baby boomers?
if healthcare isn’t on it’s way to being resolved in the next 4 years
this past three weeks will be nothing compared to what it will be like when we “meetyou there 4 years from now when you say healthcare will still be DOA”
energy crisis and healthcare HAVE to be the priorities
and mccain’s plan is wrong…dead wrong.

Posted by: dl | October 7, 2008, 2:41 pm 2:41 pm

Wow….You all are drinking some serious h8trade. I think she is awesome, and I cannot wait to see her as Vice President.
You Rock!

Posted by: Chris BurkMenn | October 7, 2008, 2:43 pm 2:43 pm

LOL, republicans are actually defending forcing people to pay taxes on their health care benefits as fair!
The same Republicans who scream about asking someone making $250K+ a year to pay 4% more in taxes want everyone with employer health benefits to pay taxes on them and call that fair.

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 2:44 pm 2:44 pm

jhw539 – I’m not sure how you’re defining universal healthcare, but no, we do not have it in this country. Millions of people go without basic medical care because they don’t have insurance and can’t afford to pay a doctor. And yes, people DO in fact die because of it (not to mention the lack of preventative care that leads to many deaths). As for people dying in the streets – every now and again, there’s a horrific story of people dying in hospital emergency rooms. ~~ And $20 antibiotics for kids?? where are you buying your antibiotics? The last antibiotic I bought was $4! You need to look for a cheaper pharmacy.

Posted by: Howdy Do! | October 7, 2008, 2:44 pm 2:44 pm

Chris Burkmenn
from your post…
I take it you would vote for the old farah fawcett poster too.
Palin may as well be Peter Sellers riding a missile.

Posted by: dl | October 7, 2008, 2:45 pm 2:45 pm

Howdy do!:”jhw539 – I’m not sure how you’re defining universal healthcare,”
Sorry, I thought putting it in caps would help you notice the definition I am using: “NO ONE DIES IN THE STREET UNABLE TO GET HEALTHCARE.” You can expand that to no one is walking around with bone sticking out of their arm because they can’t get healthcare, or a festering wound because they can’t get healthcare (OK, you might argue the lack of mental healthcare may result in such conditions, but that’s a stretch).
“As for people dying in the streets – every now and again, there’s a horrific story of people dying in hospital emergency rooms.”
As there are in countries with good universal healthcare, such as France, Canada, or even Britian. Universal healthcare does little to address local pockets of malfeasance.
” ~~ And $20 antibiotics for kids?? where are you buying your antibiotics? The last antibiotic I bought was $4! You need to look for a cheaper pharmacy.”
Antibiotics are not cheap in the US – even a basic one like Amoxicillian will run you $10, and I was factoring in a few bucks for a nurse to take a temperature and write a script. But that does not impact my argument in any way:
1. The US governments are paying for universal healthcare.
2. The type of universal healthcare they are paying for is very expensive and provides very poor care for the dollar.

Posted by: jhw539 | October 7, 2008, 2:45 pm 2:45 pm

And…let’s not forget Tony Rezko, who is going to be talking like crazy for a more lenient deal. Can’t wait! “Birds of a Feather.”

Posted by: southern_conservative | October 7, 2008, 2:45 pm 2:45 pm

Well since they have been saying the same thing about health care since I left home and I am now a grandmother and in the healthfield I say Health care is DOA and the insurance and the DR.

Posted by: Bishop | October 7, 2008, 2:46 pm 2:46 pm

jhw539 – I’m not sure how you’re defining universal healthcare, but no, we do not have it in this country. Millions of people go without basic medical care because they don’t have insurance and can’t afford to pay a doctor. And yes, people DO in fact die because of it (not to mention the lack of preventative care that leads to many deaths). As for people dying in the streets – every now and again, there’s a horrific story of people dying in hospital emergency rooms. ~~ And $20 antibiotics for kids?? where are you buying your antibiotics? The last antibiotic I bought was $4! You need to look for a cheaper pharmacy.

Posted by: Howdy Do! | October 7, 2008, 2:46 pm 2:46 pm

Tonya – WalMart only charges $4 for all generic drugs – they advertise it pretty aggressively.

Posted by: Howdy Do! | October 7, 2008, 2:47 pm 2:47 pm

howdy, why is it no one says we can’t afford a trillion dollar war or an 800 billion dollar bail out but health care, whoa nellie, that is too expensive! That is crap. we can afford it, we chose to have 47+ million people out of health care and another 100 million with inadequate health care because there is profit in it.

Posted by: Louis | October 7, 2008, 2:51 pm 2:51 pm

Ryan:
“Does any Republican here think that people should have their healthcare benefits taxed as income as John McCain proposes?”
I’m not a Republican but I am a conservative so I’ll give it a shot. The answer is an emphatic “No”! However, both health care plans stink because they fail to address the heart of the problem: administrative costs.
We should scrap Medicare, Medicaid and employer based health care and use the Swiss plan as our model. The Swiss by nature are more conservative than liberal yet successfully nationalized their health care system.
The odds of all this happening here are about 1,000,000 to 1 because it’s a radioactive political subject and it makes too much sense.

Posted by: Woody | October 7, 2008, 2:51 pm 2:51 pm

“Taxpayer” – ha, ha, ha. Jake you are too sly for throwing that one down.
Not only is Sarah Palin a habitual liar, we also know she is the ultimate TAX DODGER!!! Oh, $40K+ in allowances for her kids and husband’s travel and she didn’t pay a dime in taxes? Plus another $17K in allowances for staying in her own home – and no taxes? And another several thousand in bogus deductions?
Oh, say it aint so Sarah!!!! Sarah, you better get the number of Cindy McCain’s lawyer, the felony fixer. And you better make it quick, doggone it!
As if McCain’s campaign hasn’t been proven pitiful enough, every tax professional pointed this tax dodge out from a mile away; except, of course, for the three blind mice that are advising McCain on economics and vetting all his staff and appointments.
Even the WSJ went after Palin on this. Here’s what their tax pros said:
“The Palins did not report as income some $43,000 that the State of Alaska paid the Governor as an “allowance” for her husband and children’s travel. Can they do that? No, most likely not.”
The Palins deducted $9,000 on their 2007 return, claiming it was a loss from Mr. Palin’s snow machine racing activity. Can they do that? Most likely not, but more info could make the deduction o.k. If any of the above issues goes against the Palins they then risk getting hit with the section 6662 penalty for “negligence or disregard of rules or regulations.” ”
Lying, Tax Dodging Sarah, it’s time you pay up the $20K+ in taxes and penalties you owe America!

Posted by: Bud | October 7, 2008, 2:52 pm 2:52 pm

omg: the difference is that Hilary Clinton is a *****! And she’s married to an impeached president that you people wanted to put back in the White House.

Posted by: southern_conservative | October 7, 2008, 2:52 pm 2:52 pm

WISE UP AMERICANS!!
To McCain, Palin and the Republicans you are all just TERRORISTS AND COMMUNISTS if you do not hold the same beliefs that they do…
Look out if they get elected, as the only thing they will shake-up in Washington if they get elected is your rights!!!
Welcome to a Republican administration that will be even more secretive and evil that Bush/Cheney could have ever hoped to be…
Welcome to the Palin/McCain NEOCON POLICE STATE!!! Where you will be branded a communist and a terrorist if you do not agree with their right wing-nut evangelical views!!!
Vote for smart, educated and inclusive leaders this time! Vote for OBAMA/BIDEN ’08!!!!
Please you “Joe Six-Pack” people, let’s not elect the DUMMIES AGAIN!!!!

Posted by: Davis | October 7, 2008, 2:52 pm 2:52 pm

That scan looks like the half-baked musings usually found in a middle-school History notebook.

Posted by: Bill | October 7, 2008, 2:53 pm 2:53 pm

“It’s not true that people would be forced to drop their employer’s health care – they could keep it if they want.”
Sure they could keep it and pay the taxes on their health benefits.
The point is many people will not be able to afford this tax increase and will have to drop their employer healthcare plan to lower their tax liability.
After my tax credit from McCain I will have to pay between $300 & $400 more in taxes.
That’s for the same plan I have right now.
What’s that you say? I could shop around?
I am a single healthy person.
On the market, I could get bare bones coverage(no scripts, larger copays etc) for about $2500 a year.
So for a single healthy person, I’ll break even cost wise but have a much less comprehensive plan.

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 2:54 pm 2:54 pm

Bishop it sounds like you are one of the baby boomers.
and if you are in the healthcare field
you have to know that Hospitals as it is (wasteful or not)
are getting subsidized not only from our government but by a team of professionals raising charitable funds…
and as more and more people are losing coverage…you should realize that those costs are getting passed on to everyone.
you should also realize when Obama says “universality” but also says it is about “cost” and that universality may help but unlike other dems he says it is not the answer to reducing costs…
he is right.
He also talks about his awareness of bureaucracy causing more problems…
He gets this…better than any candidate I have ever heard talk about it. (and I saw them all in NH)
McCain couldn’t show you what an insurance application looked like…
never mind how difficult it is to resolve the numbers from yuor household budget with those…
he is not a numbers guy
because he has never had to be.
and it shows.
with the economy…baby boomers…the billing issues and red tape out of control… that the malpractice issue needs to be addressed along with a free market way to address pharmaceuticals.
ignore the spin
this time vote for the smart guy.
not the soundbite team
whose policies are the same ones that brought us…HERE.

Posted by: dl | October 7, 2008, 2:56 pm 2:56 pm

“We should scrap Medicare, Medicaid and employer based health care and use the Swiss plan as our model. The Swiss by nature are more conservative than liberal yet successfully nationalized their health care system.
The odds of all this happening here are about 1,000,000 to 1 because it’s a radioactive political subject and it makes too much sense.”
Woody just blew my mind by advocating single payer.
I think I may be speechless.

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 2:56 pm 2:56 pm

and Woody
Obama talks about administrative costs ad nauseum
so you are wrong.
he gets it
Mccain doesn’t.
because in mccain’s defense he’s never had to
and he never will have to.

Posted by: dl | October 7, 2008, 2:58 pm 2:58 pm

Don’t worry democrats. Obama will take care of you. You will never again have to take personal responsiblity.

Posted by: southern_conservative | October 7, 2008, 3:00 pm 3:00 pm

souther conservative
again
the whole dems want to be taken care of…
no dems want to not have the trashing of our country healthcare standing economy
that we have seen over the past 8 years.

Posted by: dl | October 7, 2008, 3:02 pm 3:02 pm

southern_conservative
the way things are going in this country…. it really doesn’t matter………the bad times are here, and, they won’t be fixed for a very long time…

Posted by: ........... | October 7, 2008, 3:05 pm 3:05 pm

Louis – I don’t know. I was opposed to the bailout, opposed to this expensive war and agree that government priorities are just not in sync with the American public. But given the circumstances, McCain’s healthcare plan is simply more realistic than Obama’s idea for universal health care (honestly, if I thought it would work and if I thought the timing was right, I’d support the idea for universal healthcare too – I just don’t think now’s the time)

Posted by: Howdy Do! | October 7, 2008, 3:07 pm 3:07 pm

I guess if you cut your finger it’s George Bush’s fault. You people ever heard of Congress? Not to mention all the committees & subcommittees. Last time I looked we have a democratic congress. Democrats are so quick to blame others for their own problems.

Posted by: southern_conservative | October 7, 2008, 3:15 pm 3:15 pm

Palin accused Obama of exploiting the health care and Social Security issues to win votes among seniors in Florida.
“Our health-care plan will give millions of middle class Americans access to better health-care coverage without costing you a dime,” she said, saying middle class families would receive a $5,000 tax credit to buy coverage.
How can she say that with a straight face?  Has she not read McCain’s health care plan.  It is paid for by taxing employer provided health care plans and cutting funding for Medicare and Medicaid.  And McCain wanted to privatize social security. Thank God that did not happen we would all be in an even bigger world of hurt now that the market is tanking.
McCain, you have been on a US Govt health plan your entire life….but nobody else should have that benefit.

Posted by: becky | October 7, 2008, 3:20 pm 3:20 pm

John & Cindy McCain care with there 7 houses, 12 cars, and Cindy $300,000 diamon penant she wore at the RNC… they really care! They are so out of touch, greedy, and acting like crazy OLD man, if he is acting like this now, how would he act IF he becomes President. He a stubbard OLD man with a DITSY side kick!
Get out of here an go retire in Arizona

Posted by: Neice | October 7, 2008, 3:22 pm 3:22 pm

“You people ever heard of Congress? Not to mention all the committees & subcommittees. Last time I looked we have a democratic congress.”
Yes, since Jan 2007 we have had a Democratic Congress.
The 7 years before that it was a Republican House and 5 1/2 years before a Republican Senate.
With a Republican in the White House the whole time.

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 3:23 pm 3:23 pm

“Woody just blew my mind by advocating single payer.”
I think I’d pay to see that, your mind blowing up, that is. ;-)
Conservativism doesn’t have to mean demagoguery. Nor does liberalism for that matter.
The biggest problem with the Swiss system is government controls/limits on salaries for doctors and nurses. That’s a tough pill to swallow for conservatives, but all things considered I think it’s the best system for our country. The clincher for me is everyone feels some pain (copays for all) and everyone benefits (preventative care for the most needy, fully computerized system, transferrable records, etc.)
Again, it makes too much sense so it will never happen.

Posted by: Woody | October 7, 2008, 3:25 pm 3:25 pm

southern_conservative…not a history major I see…Clinton was not impeached, he served 8 years duhhhhhhhh.
Read much?
Obama/Biden ’08

Posted by: Bev | October 7, 2008, 3:26 pm 3:26 pm

Howdy DO
I think Obama is going to try and get universal healthcare by getting costs down first…
the entire primaries that’s what he talked about …cost…. and universality out of that cost.
(besides children…they are a priority obviously)
it was the biggest disagreement that i took away from all the times I saw them really between he and Hillary…
she focused on the universality bringing down costs similar to E. Edwards but he kept talking about cost.
I wish that everyone got to see him answer questions on this…
it was the issue that made me want to support him.
it was the issue where he sounded more middle of the road and practical than Hillary.
but yet determined to reform the healthcare before it broke us with baby boomer retirement.

Posted by: dl | October 7, 2008, 3:35 pm 3:35 pm

Is McCain and Palin’s plans is to have clan meetings? McCain and Palin didn’t say a word about what was say. Is this where McCain and Palin want to take this nation? And just WHO is Palin?

Posted by: Ethel | October 7, 2008, 3:39 pm 3:39 pm

Why do we bother talking about Sarah Palin? She is ignorant, coarse and an embarrassment, especially to modern women.

Posted by: Passin Thru | October 7, 2008, 3:49 pm 3:49 pm

I question the patriotism of both Sarah and Todd Palin. It’s no secret that Alaskan’s have no respect for those of us who live in the ‘lower 48‘. But the part that really troubles me is the association and membership that both Sarah and Todd have in the Alaska Independent Party which calls for Alaska to secede from the United States.
AIP founder, Joe Vogler has made the following comments regarding seceding and the United States in general: “The fires of hell are frozen glaciers compared to my hatred for the American government,” and “I won’t be buried under their damn flag,”
Sarah and Todd Palin have never repudiated or distanced themselves from those statements.

Posted by: PhilBgood | October 7, 2008, 3:55 pm 3:55 pm

Sarah Palin is slightly full of herself, ya think??? The McCain’s are rich and have no clue how the rest of us live from paycheck to paycheck. They own 7 houses??? Isn’t that nice? And to think that there are still people who think they can buy their groceries and pay their mortgage just on their right-winged principles. If you think the economy is bad now, it can only get worse if McCain is elected. Take the Palin blinders off.

Posted by: Mitsy | October 7, 2008, 3:57 pm 3:57 pm

Lynn Forester de Rothschild mentions the Pumas in a Pennsylvania newspaper:
“One organization – PUMA, which stands for PEOPLE United MEANS ACTIONy – has more than 5 million members across the country, she said. Jamie Brazil, a longtime friend of the Clintons and the Rodham family, is serving as national director of Citizens for McCain. Brazil accompanied de Rothschild on her Scranton visit.”
“Barack Obama has never had the mandate of Democrats,” she said. “And Howard Dean and Nancy Pelosi ignored the 18 million people that voted for Hillary Clinton. They can’t be surprised at the 5 million to 7 million Clinton supporters who are now supporting McCain.”

Posted by: HP Boston | October 7, 2008, 4:10 pm 4:10 pm

“Lynn Forester de Rothschild”
You mean the same lady who called Obama elitist for his statements on people she characterized as “rednecks”?
You’re treating her as the voice of authority on PUMA?
ROFLMAO!
According to Gallup, Obama currently enjoys 86% support from Democrats. McCain enjoys 88% support from Republicans.

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 4:27 pm 4:27 pm

If it weren’t for Bill Ayers there probably would not be any Barack Obama in politics.
Was Barack Obama selected and groomed by Ayers (and others in Ayers circle) to be their inside man in political office?
After all:
- It was Ayers that in 1995 had “a coffee” in his house to introduce Obama as the new person running for office in Chicago politics.
- Prior to that it was Ayers who personally selected Obama to oversee the distribution of grants in Chicago of a $100,000,000 Annenberg Project (Ayers was also on the board of directors).
- Later between 2000 and 2002, Ayers helped select Obama for the Wood Fund of Chicago. Ayers had been on the Board of Directors since 1999.
Ayers put Obama on those boards so Obama could use the money and power to purchase influence, be very visible and make a name for himself in Chicago.
Again, without Ayers there would be no Obama.
———-
The question is, how early did Obama know Ayers?
They were both in New York in the mid-1980s. Ayers lived not far from Obama. Both were going to school and/or working in NY.
When Obama leaves NY where does he go?
Chicago. Ayer’s home town.
Obama had never been to or had any connections in Chicago. Of all the cities in America to live Obama chooses the home town of Bill Ayers?
————
Did Ayers (and associates) help arrange for Obama to get into Harvard in late 1988?
In mid-1988, Obama traveled for the first time to Europe for three weeks and then for five weeks in Kenya, where he met many of his Kenyan relatives for the first time.
Obama started Harvard in late 1988.
How could Obama pay for all the travel to Europe and Africa plus tuition and living expenses at Harvard? All on the salary of a Community Organizer?
Who was sponsoring Obama? Ayers and associates?
——————
How far back does the connection between Obama and Ayers really go?
Was Barack Obama selected and groomed by Ayers (and others in Ayers circle) to be their inside man in political office?

Posted by: Zank | October 7, 2008, 4:59 pm 4:59 pm

Shortly after John McCain’s announcement that Palin would be his running mate, several polls a showed a strong swing of white women toward McCain. An ABC News/Washington Post poll conducted immediately after the Republican convention showed a 20-percent swing among white women toward McCain. White women went from supporting Barack Obama 50-42 percent to supporting McCain 53-41 percent, a swing that helped McCain close a six percent gap in the poll in only a week.
But Obama has since regained his lead with white women in most polls.
And Obama now leads among all women voters “despite all the talk of disaffected Hillary Clinton voters and the fact that Sarah Palin might pull some women voters from the Republican ticket to the Democratic ticket,” Carroll said.
The shift back toward Obama reflects that “the gender gap is not about the gender of the candidate, it’s about the issues,” said Debbie Walsh, CAWP’s director.

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 5:05 pm 5:05 pm

Perhaps you never took basic economics.
The goal of taxes is to maximize revenues while minimizng loss of transactions.
When you tax something like sports, you cripple demand and destroy economies. When you tax something inelastic, people hurt less and they benefit more.

Posted by: John | October 7, 2008, 5:32 pm 5:32 pm

Sarah Palin….the real deal, real Middle American, ready to represent ME in the WH. I trust her completely. OBAMA AND TRUST ARE TWO WORDS THAT I COULD NEVER PUT TOGETHER.
NEVER OBAMA.
McCAIN/PALIN ALL THE WAY!

Posted by: hanna | October 7, 2008, 6:06 pm 6:06 pm

There are still going to be probably about 7 million Hillary supporters THAT WILL NOT SUPPORT OBAMA. That being said they are spread throughout the country and not just in the 7 states that determine this election.
THIS ELECTION RESULT WILL NOT BE MALE/FEMALE, BLACK/WHITE……it will be young and stupid voters who have no perspective on life and are being supported by mommy and daddy still. They should not be allowed to vote until 21, and I will work for that after this election is over. Must be 21 to vote, unless you are serving this country or employed full time.
THE YOUNG AND STUPID KOOK AID DRINKERS WILL ELECT THE ROCK STAR DUDE INTO OFFICE. Sad statement about our country.
HILLARY SUPPORTER FOR McCAIN/PALIN

Posted by: hanna | October 7, 2008, 6:12 pm 6:12 pm

“it will be young and stupid voters who have no perspective on life and are being supported by mommy and daddy still. They should not be allowed to vote until 21, and I will work for that after this election is over.”
Hear that young voters?
Right wingers want to take away your rights.
Something guaranteed by the 26th Amendment to the US Constitution.
Why do you hate the Constitution of the United States hanna?

Posted by: Ryan C | October 7, 2008, 6:47 pm 6:47 pm

HILLARY SUPPORTER FOR McCAIN/PALIN
Posted by: hanna | Oct 7, 2008 6:12:17 PM
==================================
don’t embarass Hillary

Posted by: palin is failin' | October 7, 2008, 6:49 pm 6:49 pm

MORE INFO ON AIP – TODD PALIN’S ANTI-AMERICAN SECESSIONIST GROUP
AIP’s founder Joe Vogler’s greatest moment of glory was to be his 1993 appearance before the United Nations to denounce United States “tyranny” before the entire world and to demand Alaska’s freedom. The Alaska secessionist had persuaded the government of Iran to sponsor his anti-American harangue…
Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said Thursday the solution to the Middle East crisis is to destroy Israel.
So much for Palin’s tough talk on Iran. Her friends in the AIP were clearly collaborating with Iran. Her husband was clearly a member of this fringe party for seven years. And Sarah Palin herself clearly supported them, praising their “good work” and asking God to “bless them” only this year.

Posted by: you betcha that's a problem | October 7, 2008, 7:35 pm 7:35 pm

Maybe she should doodle smething from Joe Vorge or from the Mugee the witch-hunter. “American schools are full of witchcraft and sorcery.”

Posted by: mara | October 7, 2008, 7:49 pm 7:49 pm

Ryan, The idea that Hillary supporters wont support Obama sure was true in August – but you re right – it looks completely different now. Last week, someone (I’d take a wild guess and say the McCain campaign) tried to start a political meme that women were for Sarah Palin. Posts showed up on every site, always from new posters, always with the same language, and always devoid of data. Sarah Palin. according to every single poll has the lowest approval rating of any of the candidates. The only women who appear to support her are solid Republicans who would have voted for McCain no matter who his VP was. It was a bad gamble – and a terrible choice. It makes you wonder who John McCain would appoint if her were ever elected. If he picks a VP on the role of a dice, how would he appoint cabinent members> supreme court justices? Nominte for head of the CIA?

Posted by: mara | October 7, 2008, 7:55 pm 7:55 pm

I thought she said she didn’t belong to the Wassilla Assembly of God??? Its listed on the right toward the bottom.

Posted by: tim | October 8, 2008, 10:40 am 10:40 am

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