By Hope Ditto

Nov 17, 2008 8:24am

The Note: Obama, McCain Could be Valuable Allies

ABC News’ Rick Klein reports in Monday’s Note:

Questions worth pondering while you’re thinking about the prospect of a Palin-free week:

1. Who will play a bigger role in filling out President-elect Barack Obama’s Cabinet — Joe Biden, Bill Clinton, or Doris Kearns Goodwin

2. Will the Republican Party have to blow itself up to put itself back together? (Which of those directions does Mike Huckabee’s new book take the party?) 

3. Will the president-elect spend more political capital getting a playoff system for college football than he will pushing a bailout package to help save Detroit? (And will he spend this much time in the gym when he’s in the White House?) 

4. What does it say about the most open and transparent transition in history that Obama meets in super-secrecy with Democrats, while press releases are sent out for meetings with Republicans?

5. Who’s the more powerful Republican this week — John Boehner, Mitch McConnell, or John McCain?

The rival reclamation tour continues Monday in Chicago, with Obama set to meet at noon ET with that other individual who almost stopped him from becoming president: McCain.

McCain is at heart a dealmaker, and his return to the Senate as part of a diminished GOP caucus enhances his opportunities to cut them. Just like he’d have to if he’d won, McCain will be forced to work with Democrats — and, of course, there’s one Democrat in particular whose cooperation is vital if McCain wants to remain a potent force.

Read the rest of The Note — and get all the latest on the 2008 election, Congress, the White House and the wide world of politics every day — from Rick Klein by bookmarking this link.

McCain, R-Ariz., has no more friends in the Senate (in either party) than he did before he ran. And the Senate remains the place where some of the bolder Obama ideas may go to die.

But McCain won’t be speaking for leadership in the new Congress. Even more than after his 2000 run, he is one of a handful of senators whose celebrity brings power that can’t be measured by chairmanships or seniority (Hillary Clinton is another). When an Obama measure — any measure — is sent to Congress, who do you think will be the first lawmaker reporters seek out for reaction?

“Both have much to gain from swift reconciliation after a bitter contest,” The Wall Street Journal’s Jonathan Weisman and Laura Meckler write. “Mr. Obama’s pledge to move beyond the partisan bickering requires Republican partners. Sen. McCain would be a potent symbol — and one with a long history of working with Democrats on key issues on the president-elect’s agenda: climate change, energy efficiency and national service. . . . Obama aides stress the opportunity the president-elect is offering Sen. McCain.”

The Palin mania that’s enveloped the past week has mostly enhanced McCain by not focusing on his missteps (other than, possibly, his selection of Sarah Palin).

So the Arizona senator returns to the Hill with the potential to be more of a power source than ever — the one man whose reaction to an Obama proposal could immediately set the tone for debate.

“Sources close to McCain say their man wants to leave the campaign behind and return to the role he forged for himself on Capitol Hill as the leading reformer and bi-partisan legislator in the Senate,” Time’s James Carney writes. “By meeting with McCain so shortly after the election, Obama is demonstrating both magnanimity and self-confidence. But his move is also based on self-interest. Obama is keenly aware of the fact that, despite increased Democratic majorities in both the Senate and the House, he cannot enact the kind of sweeping legislative overhaul he envisions without the help of Republicans.”

With two years left on his term — why wouldn’t he want to be a player? And the choice of wingmen for Monday’s meeting — new White House chief of staff Rahm Emanuel for Obama, Sen. Lindsey Graham, R-S.C. — for McCain — says that both men are serious about a potential partnership.

Continue reading today’s Note by clicking HERE.

ABC News’ Hope Ditto contributed to this report.

User Comments

Figures. The idiot with no experience gets elected by the nitwits and druggies of America and then he has to call in the MAN WHO SHOULD BE PRESIDENT (McCain) to tell him what he should do.
All we have is the same empty suit in the White House that was on the campaign trail. All all the fools in America are to thank for this.

Posted by: Theologicalones | November 17, 2008, 8:47 am 8:47 am

If I were McCain, I’d tell Mr. BHO to figure out how to solve all his problems as President by himself. He made the promises during the campaign, so let him put his so-called promises to work. Obama is SO dumb he needs to surround himself with all the experts in every field. He’s nothing but an empty icon who made history. And that’s probably all he’ll ever make.

Posted by: SusieQ | November 17, 2008, 8:50 am 8:50 am

Typical of Obama. Reach out to the smart people for advice and then take the credit for himself.
Note to Hillary: Don’t lower yourself by accepting the Sec’y of State position.

Posted by: kathyKkalamazoo | November 17, 2008, 8:52 am 8:52 am

The statement in the second to last paragraph of the article says it all:
“But his move is also based on self-interest.”
No kidding? Of course, the junior jerk from Illinois is going to cover his a$$ by letting the experienced, knowledgeable people tell him how to go about being President.

Posted by: Jack | November 17, 2008, 8:56 am 8:56 am

How many more days until the 2012 election? Think America will still be voting or will we be under the dictatorship by then?

Posted by: seeingred | November 17, 2008, 8:59 am 8:59 am

“…he has to call in the MAN WHO SHOULD BE PRESIDENT (McCain)…”
Glad you filled in the blank for us, Theologicalones. I thought you meant Ron Paul.
And “should be” except, I suppose, for that pesky thing we call an election?

Posted by: Jamie | November 17, 2008, 9:01 am 9:01 am

Funny. All you who are bitter about Obama being President know now how I felt 4 years ago and 8 years ago. George W. Bush was a little different though. He didn’t need Clinton’s advice, he didn’t need ANYBODY’s advice, he knew it all.
And look where it got us. It will take a lot of work and cooperation to help heal this nation after 8 years of total neglect.

Posted by: TooBadSoSad | November 17, 2008, 9:05 am 9:05 am

Congrats Pres. Obama. How delightful to have a true intellectual as president. Reaching out to Mr. McCain after the slimey campaign he ran proves you are a true gentleman as well.

Posted by: Bryan Miller | November 17, 2008, 9:05 am 9:05 am

Totally fine with me if President-elect Obama involves John McCain in the future. But the second that Mr Obama extends any reconciliation toward Caribou Barbie, he runs a serious risk of losing my support.

Posted by: alj | November 17, 2008, 9:06 am 9:06 am

Republicans are a national laughing stock. Conservatism has died a violent death and been repudiated at the polls. Right-wing haters are going to have a long eight years out in the political wilderness.
Elections have consequences.

Posted by: Awktalk | November 17, 2008, 9:08 am 9:08 am

Thought I was in Faux News blog at first. No president ‘knows it all’ and as such can best be judged by the quality of their chosen advisors.
Those that pick lackeys and sycophants looking for agreement rather than widening discussion get narrow focused unimaginative results. Those that seek broad input from all sources have a much better chance of ‘fair and balanced’ decisions, provided that they can make contentious decisions at the end of the day. This seems to be Obama’s pattern; let’s see if it holds true.

Posted by: Chris | November 17, 2008, 9:14 am 9:14 am

Wow, you folks are hilarious. So he’s an empty suit AND a dictator? Fascinating. You all might want to get your delusion straight before posting.
He calls in McCain and everyone whines that he needs the old man’s help. If he doesn’t call in McCain the same people would cry that he’s going back on his word. He’s being bipartisan you morons, just like he said he’d be, unlike Bush who just brought in a gang of Texan idiots when his regime began. Obviously none of you have heard the word ‘bipartisan’ before — might want to look it up.

Posted by: bda | November 17, 2008, 9:15 am 9:15 am

Yes, Obama & McCain could very well be valuable allies. In fact Republicans & Democrats have always been extremely valuable allies against the “American People”.

Posted by: knot2hazy | November 17, 2008, 9:15 am 9:15 am

The commenters on this blog that try to belittle the President-Elect of our nation nust not like McCain much. If you don’t want him to work with the next president out of spite you don’t know John McCain. He puts his country first and will work with and respect our next president. I can accept that and appreciate that they are working to get our economy moving again and solve some of the big issues without the hyper-partisanship. Republicans must find an alternate path to victory than hyperpartisanship. Democrats will win that battle for the forseeable future.

Posted by: Elliot | November 17, 2008, 9:16 am 9:16 am

What happened to change! Democrats AND Republicans are sick, sick, sick of the elite, incompetent Washington bureaucrats running our government and seems no matter who we elect, all we get is a recycled government with a new figurehead! Surely there are some real experts out there to choose from for a new cabinet without recycling all the Clinton & Bush people – those who are responsible for the mess our country is in now. Why should anyone think they’ll be able to fix what they broke? Come on, Obama, let’s have some real change; get rid of the entrenched bureaucracy of both stripes. We need new people with new ideas, not a rehash of the past failed administrations.

Posted by: Dena | November 17, 2008, 9:16 am 9:16 am

I love how people are trying to insult Obama for surrounding himself with “experienced, knowledgeable, smart experts in every field” (just looking at the comments so far). You people are really reaching on that one.

Posted by: sven | November 17, 2008, 9:17 am 9:17 am

Boy, are those grapes ever sour (puckering)

Posted by: citizenw | November 17, 2008, 9:18 am 9:18 am

losers! say it one more time, President Barak Obama

Posted by: King T | November 17, 2008, 9:18 am 9:18 am

Wow – all I can say is “wow” about some of you who evidently learned nothing from this election and prefer to stew in your own cesspools this morning.
Have any of you seen what is happening on Wall Street? Or at your corner bank? There’s fire there, and at the manufacturing plants, and just about everywhere else.
Obama ran on a platform of change, and it seems to me that reaching out to McCain and his political bloc is about as changeful as you can get. The country spoke, and opted for this change.
We have a surplus of doo-doo in the news right now, and it’s going to take a concerted effort on both sides to set things right. Not only is the country watching, but the whole world. America is still the de facto leader of the free world, and petty partisan politics have no place.

Posted by: Jack | November 17, 2008, 9:18 am 9:18 am

Looks like a bunch of simpletons found a keyboard this morning. Unlike bush who surrounded himself w/local yokels from Texas P.E. Obama is looking for the best and the brightest to offer a confluence of ideas, opinions and theorems, to finally make government work for the people and just to function at all which it has not in 8 yrs. w/all the lies, deceit and misconduct in the currant admin. I really wonder about the reasoning behind the thinking I’ve read here today!

Posted by: jonny bullet | November 17, 2008, 9:18 am 9:18 am

Sounds like some people are having difficulty in accepting the peoples’ choice for President. The suggestion that President Elect Obama is incapable of being President because he is trying to surround himself with smart people is really stupid. If he wants to do a good job he must listen to and work with people like John McCain and Lindsey Graham. For those of you who didn’t vote for Obama. Lets wait and see how he does. He certainly couldn’t do worse than George Bush. And the “geniuses” who elected Bush are probably the same people who are now against Obama. If you don’t love America with a President Obama get the hell out of the country. “America-Love it or Leave it”.

Posted by: Jim Doyle in Beijing | November 17, 2008, 9:19 am 9:19 am

At least Obama is humble enough to except he doesn’t know everything, surround himself with talented people and truly reach out to republicans… It shows class and above all, it shows he is serious about cutting the dems vs reps attitude that has plagued washington and left the “status quo” as the in-fighting kept anything from being done…

Posted by: ridiculous | November 17, 2008, 9:21 am 9:21 am

It really speaks towards the mans intelligence to call on people with greater insight on issues than He has. If any of the idiots who posted negative comments believe that Presidents of the past were lone decision makers then you need to study politics alot more. Our current President Bush was the closest to a President trying to go at it alone and we can see where it has placed our country. Obama is making moves to unite a fragmented and split government, let us who really believe in America support his efforts.

Posted by: Troy | November 17, 2008, 9:22 am 9:22 am

John McCain can either be an Obama ally,
or he can be nobody. He is a warmonger that was busted and casted aside overwhelmingly by the American people on November 4 for supporting Bush’s wars unconditionally. And with bigger democratic majorities now in both the U.S. Senate and the House of Representatives, McCain’s prior clout under a Republican administration
has evaporated.
Obama doesn’t need McCain for anything,
but he probably wants to be what is called “Magnanimous in Victory” and thus allow McCain to fade out of his political career with a sense of dignity. That would probably enhance Obama’s charisma as a uniter of people of all persuasions that will help him govern the country with consensous. And for McCain it will be a nice bone to chew on on the dog days ahead of him until his retirement.
Nikos Retsos, retired academic

Posted by: Nikos Retsos | November 17, 2008, 9:23 am 9:23 am

Republicans shoouted their mantra “Country First” at their rallies. Now that the election is over we see clearly how hollow and hipocritical they are – by reading their posts here or watching Fox attacts. The anti-intellectual movement overtaking Republicans has left them bankrupt and irrelevant. McCain will return to his old self and become a leader in the Senate. His party has a lot of work to do before Americans trust them again – my guess is 12 years minimum.

Posted by: Robin from Colorado | November 17, 2008, 9:23 am 9:23 am

all fo you obama haters need to fall back yall are just mad just because he became president and he promised change and we are gonna get that so yall need to fall back and deal with the simple fact that he is president!!!!!

Posted by: too much info already | November 17, 2008, 9:25 am 9:25 am

Hate, fear and division. It’s all Republicans have. They sure don’t have any ideas, any knowledge about how to govern effectively and they sure don’t have control of the White House.

Posted by: thebob.bob | November 17, 2008, 9:25 am 9:25 am

I think President-elect Obama is brillent! Yes, keep your friends close and your enemies CLOSER! It makes total sense to bring on board those who who would otherwise lead the charge against anything you try to get done in the Senate.

Posted by: CLK8122 | November 17, 2008, 9:27 am 9:27 am

To those who make ad hominem attacks against President-Elect Obama:
The election is over, the majority of American voters have spoken.
Give President-Elect Obama a chance and give him your support as the President of all Americans.

Posted by: The Sparrow | November 17, 2008, 9:29 am 9:29 am

Barack Obama has selected Gregory Craig as White House counsel, a move that will recall some controversial legal cases over the last few years. Craig has plenty of experience in politics as well as the courtroom, having served as Bill Clinton’s legal counsel during the impeachment hearings.
Besides defending Clinton through the impeachment process, an effort that Craig lost, who else had the benefit of Craig’s counsel?
–Elian Gonzalez’s father – Craig represented the father who demanded the return of his son after his estranged wife died trying to take Elian to freedom. Most people saw this as a thinly-veiled publicity stunt from Fidel Castro, attempting to embarrass the US. The dispute got resolved when Janet Reno ordered an ARMED ASSAULT on the house where Elian’s family in the US provided him a home.
–John Hinckley, Jr – Craig presented and won the insanity defense that allows Ronald Reagan’s would-be ASSASSIN to spend weekends with his family now.
–Kofi Annan – The former Secretary-General of the UN hired Craig to defend his interests in the Volcker Commission probe of the OIL-FOR-FOOD scandal, which put billions of dollars into Saddam Hussein’s pockets while providing cash for Annan’s son, his deputies, and some for Annan himself.
–Pedro Gonzalez Pinzon – A Panamanian legislator wanted for MURDERING an American soldier in 1992. The Dallas Morning News demanded that Obama force Craig to drop the case during the campaign, but no report of whether he did is easily available.
I doubt that any President has selected the defender of a presidential assassin as White House Counsel before now. Does anyone want to guess how long that takes to become a Trivial Pursuit question?
Given Craig’s dubious client list, especially Gonzalez Pinzon as an apparent active client, this selection is a disgrace. The last person we need in the White House is an attorney who represented assassins, Castro and his goons, corrupt UN executives, and a suspected killer of an American soldier. Those are the people the White House should focus on STOPPING, not embracing.

Posted by: Obama's Culture of Corruption, Part 3 | November 17, 2008, 9:32 am 9:32 am

I hope the American people, even the bitter bloggers here, would follow the lead of Senator McCain and President-Elect Obama: we need to work together, and respect one another if we’re to help this great country.
Civility goes a long way to making the world a better place. Taking on a respectful tone does much to one’s dignity–name-calling posts just make McCain’s supporters look undignified.

Posted by: Beth in VA | November 17, 2008, 9:34 am 9:34 am

people stop criticising but you can only prayer for our leaders instead…..
we are grown up so let’s stop querelling because it won’t help & it won’t even reach to Pres. Obama neither MCcain…please stop it…may God lead our Leaders AMEN!!!

Posted by: sthembiso | November 17, 2008, 9:41 am 9:41 am

people stop criticising but you can only prayer for our leaders instead…..
we are grown up so let’s stop querelling because it won’t help & it won’t even reach to Pres. Obama neither MCcain…please stop it…may God lead our Leaders AMEN!!!

Posted by: sthembiso | November 17, 2008, 9:41 am 9:41 am

“The People’s Choice?” Yeah, half the country plus two percent is a real mandate there.
I hope he doesn’t cooperate. Liberal democrats have been doing it the last eight years, and they can’t expect everyone to bow down to BHO.

Posted by: Hoq | November 17, 2008, 9:43 am 9:43 am

I think it was once said “one of the greatest measures of intelligence is in knowing what you dont’ know.” That having been said, I don’t think that Obama exactly needs McCain to tell him what he does not know, he does however, need his support in the Senate.

Posted by: jrc903 | November 17, 2008, 9:46 am 9:46 am

Obama is showing his leadership at its best. McCain couldn’t change a diaper unless Palin showed him how…

Posted by: Ted in NJ | November 17, 2008, 9:47 am 9:47 am

Those who have commented on this article seem to have missed the important clue in the second sentence. Doris Kearns Goodwin wrote a book in 2005 about how Abraham Lincoln put together his cabinet and how he handled his political enemies. I was awed by Lincoln’s brilliance and skill. My first thought was that Lincoln must have been an extraordinarily self-confident man to not feel threatened by surrounding himself with people of different ideas – including people who had strongly opposed him. My second thought was how Lincoln’s decision to open his government to his opposition was one of the factors that made him one of our greatest Presidents.
Then, I thought that America needs another President with the same wisdom. At some point, I heard that Barack Obama had been influenced by Goodwin’s book. And the recent actions taken by Obama and his transition team indicate to me that he has learned something important from Abraham Lincoln. And Goodwin deserves great credit for writing her book.
And to all of the commentators who are making claims about what an Obama administration will be like (including dictatorship), I suggest that first of all reading some of our great historians is valuable. And I suggest that you have no more of a crystal ball than any of us. If you want a great America, then follow Abraham Lincoln’s example and see the greatness that can come from working together.

Posted by: Patti | November 17, 2008, 9:47 am 9:47 am

I voted for McCain, but even I have to give it up to Obama. He doesnt want to run the country into the ground. He is trying to reach middle ground, and that is a win-win situation for everyone. Atleast in these tough times he is willing to ask everyones opinion.

Posted by: Ralph | November 17, 2008, 9:50 am 9:50 am

You can start supporting the Impeach Obama movement now or after his first series of disastrous and devastating decisions against America. There is NO reason to “give him a chance” when all of his policies are a disaster for America. As far as race relations go, his poor performance will unfortunately destroy our confidence in Arabic- I mean black – people and set race relations back 50 years.

Posted by: Luke | November 17, 2008, 9:53 am 9:53 am

There is an old business truism:
First rate managers hire first rate assistants.
Second rate managers hire third rate assistants.
Obama is the finest example of presidential material we have seen in decades.
Thank God Almighty, we’re Bush-Free at last.

Posted by: Jerry Ulibarri | November 17, 2008, 9:55 am 9:55 am

There are a lot of comments here by bitter McCain supporters who are playing high-school games–”If my guy can’t be president, then I’ll make sure Obama gets no help from me.” The problem is that the country will suffer if Republicans go into pouting mode. The better–and more mature–response would be to do everything we can to make sure the next four years are peaceful and prosperous for everyone. I’m hoping that we as a nation can come together to make that happen.

Posted by: Michael Evans | November 17, 2008, 9:57 am 9:57 am

What a bunch of bitter people.. I do hope BHO NEVER gets anybody on his team to stand up for the ones who wrote these hateful comments. Please Mr Obama, keep them away from us by not getting them any advocates in your government, we had enough of them for the past 8 years.. look at what they did to us!~ Let them dwell in their misery.. by themselves…

Posted by: marietta | November 17, 2008, 9:58 am 9:58 am

Wow, it’s like I’ve stepped into the twilight zone. So Obama’s an “empty suit” and an “idiot” because he’s surrounding himself with bipartisan experts? Oh no, the President-elect wants to consult people actually knowledgeable in the field – on both sides of the political spectrum! What a tool! What a sham! How dare he!
Really, people. Save your invective for something else.

Posted by: Reason | November 17, 2008, 10:01 am 10:01 am

This is great, two liberals get together and it makes news. Let’s not forget the amnesty for all those illegals that are in the country. Just a reminder, Living her in AZ, we just had a 16 year old girl killed by an illegal who was drunk. A month before is was a phoenix police officer. This is what you have to look forward too. Oh, and for those of you who blame Bush for this mess. Remember, it all started with the fall of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. Of which both Dodd and Franks told us months ago that they were both fine. There is no problem with them. Wake up…

Posted by: Mo | November 17, 2008, 10:01 am 10:01 am

TO MANY OF YOU STILL SEE THRU CLOSED EYES. I VOTED FOR McCain,but he lost and now our–our President is asking him for advice. I think we need to be thankful that he is seeking advice from both sides of the table and one of our great minds in the Senate.

Posted by: Derrick | November 17, 2008, 10:01 am 10:01 am

Obama is playing the samrt role thats why he is where he is.Putting the republicans where he wants them to help move things when he gets in office.And still democrats will have the house majority….

Posted by: BWERNICK | November 17, 2008, 10:03 am 10:03 am

Caldwell and others calling out for people to put on Stepford Wife smiles about this election, it’s called democracy. Just “getting on board” and in essence giving up one’s principles is not democracy. Some people are not as eloquent as you nor as cultured, and some of these comments may seem harsh to you, but these are real people with real and true concerns. It’s not just “sour grapes,” just as it wasn’t just “sour grapes” when so many people expressed profound dissatisfaction with Mr. Bush (including me). What I am seeing is an efort on the part of Obama supporters to stop dissent, and that worries me more than any other part of his policy.

Posted by: Luke | November 17, 2008, 10:04 am 10:04 am

All I know is Sen. Obama has very, very little experience in the political spotlight, but now there is no turning back and he has a prove he is a man of his word….Yeah right. He will be blaming the Republicans for all his failures even though Democrats now control Congress. All we can do is wait and see his inexperience lead us to socialism.
I guess the African Americans have no excuses now for all the crime they commit. Everytime I watch the news there has been another killing or robbery and 95% of the time its a black person. If black parents would take charge of their kids and make them understand education and family is important then I feel they might have a chance of making a life for themselves. Instead they blame the white folks for their problems.

Posted by: James | November 17, 2008, 10:05 am 10:05 am

Political diversity, heated debates and the rantings on this blog keep our system honest. God bless all of you left and right. It makes our country what it is.

Posted by: Dubus | November 17, 2008, 10:06 am 10:06 am

To argue with a fool is something only a fool would do.
But to dance like life is beautiful, is what the winner of the election does.
Hhmmmm, grumpy dude ain’t dancing.

Posted by: We Won You Lost | November 17, 2008, 10:07 am 10:07 am

BWERNICK: Democrats need republican’s to pass the vote on the Auto Industry and they have already said “DROP DEAD”. What does that tell you. And the republicans show let it go at that. Let them go bankrupt who cares. They need to lay off over 3000 people which would save them thousands of dollars.

Posted by: Mariann Pepitone | November 17, 2008, 10:07 am 10:07 am

Derrick: Obama shouldn’t need all that advice. Being a Harvard graduate what happened to his smarts? He knew how to wheel and deal when he won the senate seat by playing dirty pool against the woman getting her signatures. Him and Dean did the same to Hillary over the delegates and superdelegates. Evidently he is not as smart as the people thought he was and its people like you and the majority of this generation of young people that voted him in. After he is sworn in then you will see the real Obama.

Posted by: Mariann Pepitone | November 17, 2008, 10:12 am 10:12 am

Not at all. The whiners that complain about Palin never would have voted for McCain anyway. She’s the only one that brought any excitement to the ticket, drawing bigger crowds than McCain at rallies. She was the only true conservative on the ticket, and an indication of where the party needs to return for any chance at returning to the White House.

Posted by: MC | November 17, 2008, 10:12 am 10:12 am

All I want to know is “where is Obama’s change” that he promised? His cabinet looks like clinton admin. reunion!!
So well anyone asked him this and remind him what he said several months ago that: “The real gamble in this election is playing the same Washington game with the same Washington players and expecting a different result.”

Posted by: Frieda | November 17, 2008, 10:14 am 10:14 am

Obama is reaching out to McCain for bi-partisan cooperation, negotiations and compromise so he can actually get things done and move our Country forward. He is NOT reaching out to McCain — like a few posts here suggests — to “tell him what he should do”. That type of post is absurd and just causes partisan bickering that we don’t need.

Posted by: BlueZolar | November 17, 2008, 10:15 am 10:15 am

Bryan Miller: I have to laugh at your statement. Obama may have been at the head of his class but came out nothing but an ass. He is as dumb as they come. He is only smart at being crooked and he has plenty of friends around in his same category to prove it. Especially the bomer Ayers, co-chairman with Obama at Acorn. And its people like you that can’t see beyond their lies because you are the same as they are.

Posted by: Mariann Pepitone | November 17, 2008, 10:16 am 10:16 am

The President-elect must still face Justice Souter by 12/1 and produce his original, non-forged birth certificate otherwise he’ll be tossed.

Posted by: Jim | November 17, 2008, 10:17 am 10:17 am

@Theologicalones
Maybe if you weren’t such a ignorant McCain fanboy you’d understand that no one person has all the answers, and that it is important to hear and understand viewpoints different than your own if you’re to make a truly informed decision.
If you really don’t like our new President that much then move to Canada, loser.

Posted by: Jasper | November 17, 2008, 10:18 am 10:18 am

Frieda: Obama’s change meant changing a white president to a half black president nothing else. But he duped the American people into thinking he was going to change politics in Washington. Changing should mean getting out the old and putting in the new. The only suggestion I can make is don’t vote for him in 2012. And after he is sworn in, you will see a different Obama. Also, Obama is half Kenyan and Kenyan’s like to rule.

Posted by: Mariann Pepitone | November 17, 2008, 10:20 am 10:20 am

Jasper: I don’t agree with you. I agree with theologicalones in what he said. Yes, the young generation of this country are the nitwits that put Obama in office who doesn’t know the least about politics or foreign policy. We all know now that by putting in Clinton’s people he needs extensive training. Obama read books on Abraham Lincoln who was republican and wants to do the same. Its called follow the leader. And his leadership will not be as good as Lincoln’s. Lincoln thought on his own not anyone else’s.

Posted by: Mariann Pepitone | November 17, 2008, 10:26 am 10:26 am

14 days and counting…. Is he a naturalized citizen or Kenyan born? Justice Roberts will not swear him in unless he produces something more than the forged document on his website..

Posted by: Jim | November 17, 2008, 10:29 am 10:29 am

@Mariann Pepitone
Well I’m glad you can see the future. You should try and make some money off of that.

Posted by: Jasper | November 17, 2008, 10:34 am 10:34 am

Jim: You are so right. Why didn’t the hospital in Hawaii show his birth records instead of refusing. Because he wasn’t born there he was born in Kenya. He was in Kenya at age 2 when his father abandoned him. When did he go to Hawaii? She married a man from Indonesia, divorced him and married a man from Hawaii. What a mixed up family. His father married and divorced four times, 7 more children.

Posted by: Mariann Pepitone | November 17, 2008, 10:35 am 10:35 am

Jasper. I don’t need the money and I don’t work. I mean what I say and say what I mean. The reason for Obama choosing many of Clinton’s people is because he knew what a great president Clinton and he wants to be known as the same. They are ten times smarter than Obama and can teach him the ropes on politics and foreign policy that he hasn’t learned yet. And believe me, he needs that training.

Posted by: Mariann Pepitone | November 17, 2008, 10:39 am 10:39 am

ME: Hang it up and get educated on politics. Obama doesn’t know his left hand from his right on politics or foreign policy. And Hillary is a good choice for him because she can teach him what he has never learned as a senator being absent 145 times.

Posted by: Mariann Pepitone | November 17, 2008, 10:43 am 10:43 am

Well I believe the first thing that really needs to be addressed is the race issue, There are still many people in this country that have trouble looking past the color of a persons skin, which is a meaningless characteristic when it boils down to intelligence let alone what needs to be accomplished for this country to turn the corner and regain our rightful place in the world as a super power. The day we as the people, ALL realize that we each have our own ideals, morals, and ethics that influence our decisions, that a typically based of our individual circumstances, then we would be able to understand each persons perspective on a topic or issue, and find the compromising middle ground that works for everyone. And also allows true progress in this country rather then the political deadlock we’ve seen over the past 8 years
But until that day arrives will we as Americans, fully have the ability to control our destiny. Manifest destiny allowed us to control what is now the lower 48. Now I am not saying take over the world but, we must lead by example for democracy to spread across the planet allowing every person to have a life that is truly the means something in this world, and are allowed the opportunity to make the best of their life. Because Human life is the only real resource we have complete control over.
We as the Human race need to remember our role on earth and figure out our purpose rather than worrying about IPODS and useless technologies. If we were able to stop the expansion of new development and focus on the areas we are now, and ensure we fully understand our surroundings from sea to shining sea, from the ground all the way to just in the grasp of space then we can find the new technologies of energy, to get away from fuels that destroy the atmosphere, that causes us to rely on foreign countries who do not understand what we stand for in this country and why what we stand for is the only true way political views should be addressed .
The one thing that American stand for more than anything is the ability to change their ideals to maximize their situation. If you understand history and what our ancestors stood for and did to ensure their voice was not only heard but imprinted in history, then you can understand why this is the same kind of ordeal, things are different but ironically they are the same just more complicated, and we have a lot more people on our hands.
America we need to regroup and grab control of our selves. If we do not start spending money the economy will do nothing but continue to slow, and eventually be too far gone and we will end up in the worst depression ever. Not just here in the US, but a global Depression. We have the ability to get ourselves out of this mess that not just BUSH and Clinton got us into, but we the people allowed ourselves to get into. So Can we all please stop complaining about things and get our hands dirty and fix this.

Posted by: LEGENDARY MPTERRY | November 17, 2008, 10:43 am 10:43 am

Yes so ridiculous that Justice Souter would like to see the original (unforged) copy which has been sealed as have all of Obama’s school records, etc… He’s had months to produce it – but instead has sent legal teams all over the world to seal and hide records.
Why has he been hiding it? Why did he post an admitted forgery on his web site? Why did he take an army of lawyers to Hawaii when he was visiting his sick grandmother? The questions keep mounting… 14 days…

Posted by: Jim | November 17, 2008, 10:47 am 10:47 am

I knew it was too good to last. Mariann, someone of your advanced years should know better!

Posted by: ' | November 17, 2008, 10:47 am 10:47 am

junebugs, get a grip.
Even Sarah Palin said that Obama’s win was the right thing for America.

Posted by: Yawn | November 17, 2008, 10:54 am 10:54 am

You all know OBAMA is realted to Cheney right… 8th cousin i do believe

Posted by: LEGENDARY MPTERRY | November 17, 2008, 10:54 am 10:54 am

Luke: You hit the nail on the head. Emanuel is not happy about Obama’s friendship with Hamas whom he knew while he was campaigning. Obama likes the terrorists and most of them like him that’s why he is close friends with Ayer’s. He didn’t care that Ayer’s bombed this country as long as he donated to his campaign. That’s the kind of true American Obama is. And this country should have sentenced Ayer’s to life in prison for what he did.

Posted by: Mariann Pepitone | November 17, 2008, 10:56 am 10:56 am

Mariann,
Terrorist’s?
Really!

Posted by: ' | November 17, 2008, 10:57 am 10:57 am

14 days Happy – if he produces the same forged document he has produced so far, he’ll be tossed. You can be sure that the most Conservative Justice in the US (the only one who can swear him in) Chief Justice Roberts, will not swear in someone who has been hiding records and forging documents unless he is certain he meets the qualifications of the Constitution…. The questions Justice Souter will have for him will be very interesting to hear… Rest assured at least 2 other Justices have taken note of what is transpiring…

Posted by: Jim | November 17, 2008, 10:57 am 10:57 am

So is that what everyone is gonna do bitch about who should be in or why he was elected, way dont you all realize we need to be discussing what needs to be done here in the country rather than btich about who is the guy that makes the final decison. lets get things on th eball, and rolls in the pipeline to get accomplished rather then sitting back and waiting for the right guy to come along and aww us by his presence!

Posted by: LEGENDARY MPTERRY | November 17, 2008, 10:59 am 10:59 am

Ayer’s, Ayer’s, it’s too much for me to handle, Mariann!

Posted by: ' | November 17, 2008, 10:59 am 10:59 am

bitter out of touch lame angry republicans… how does it feel to see your party in the toilet? even joe the plumber cant help you now.

Posted by: sk8boardgrind | November 17, 2008, 11:08 am 11:08 am

I think Mariann Pepitone is actually Sarah Palin venting her dissapointment in a way she cant do with her real name LOL. At least the lack of intelligence is frightening similar.
Keep an eye on Russia from your house instead. Who knows, Putin can invade any minute now…

Posted by: JoeShmoe | November 17, 2008, 11:11 am 11:11 am

Whatever happens, it’s not going to be pretty. Obama has 6 months to make significant improvements on the economy before he will be grouped in with the rest of Beltway traitors. McCain would have had a similar daunting task. The more things change, the more they stay the same.

Posted by: soothsayer | November 17, 2008, 11:15 am 11:15 am

JoeShmoe, you could be right. That would also explain Mariann’s misuse of me.

Posted by: ' | November 17, 2008, 11:15 am 11:15 am

To all the folks dissatisfied with the election results, I understand where you’re coming from. I was shocked and disbelieving after both Bush wins, and griped long and loud about them. I still gripe about them.
I do think that regardless of experience, having a man in the white house that is smarter than me is important.

Posted by: chasbro | November 17, 2008, 11:19 am 11:19 am

Yes soothsayer – you are right. We voted in many of them 2 years ago with great promises of ending the war, reviving the economy, etc… and look what happened. The worst Congress we’ve ever had – nothing got done. Now we’ve voted in even more of them and the ones who created the problems are still there. We never learn and we’ll get what we deserve….

Posted by: Jim | November 17, 2008, 11:28 am 11:28 am

As a Republican voting for Obama, I think we can get more done if we use all the resources. Obama will use anyone that will help fix the last 8 year republcan blunder.
During the election I would have voted for McCain but not the Republcan party. I think that the Karl Rove “one world government” was to much to handle.
With a crisis this serious it’s time to drop the politics and get the job done asap. We may be looking for the last crumb to eat soon, not who the leaders are. They can do only so much. Its up to the US population to look beyond this and move forward.
During the Bush administration he would often comment that HE WASN’T FOLLOWING the POLL APPROVAL numbers.
Think he is now?? Hmmm, probably not.
Sad, looks like the US population does know something.

Posted by: Ed Patrick | November 17, 2008, 11:31 am 11:31 am

Ed you are a awesome person for seeing that

Posted by: LEGENDARY MPTERRY | November 17, 2008, 11:38 am 11:38 am

But Ed, if the most important issue is the economy, exacting where did the republicans blunder during the last 8 years? The Obama campaign was asked this repeatedly yet could not come up with a single failed policy that led to the financial crisis. Now plenty of information is available on the failure of Fannie and Freddie (and who received 4126k from them in just 2 years). Whose blunder was it to force banks to make sub-prime mortgages and F&F to buy them? Bankers didn’t wake up one morning and say to themselves, “You know, we’re going to lend up to half our funds to those who can’t afford a mortgage” They were forced to by whom….? Maxine Waters thought desktop underwriting of mortgages by F&F was a great idea. So did Barney Frank. They are still in office and still sitting on the finance committees. How are they going to solve the problems if they don’t understand and they are part of the problem?

Posted by: Jim | November 17, 2008, 11:38 am 11:38 am

LET’S QUIT THROWING STONES AND GET OUT OF THIS MESS.

Posted by: Ed Patrick | November 17, 2008, 11:46 am 11:46 am

Pepitone: you claim that the “young people of this country are the nitwits that got him elected.” Just another example of your lies here. Obama won an electoral landslide made up of all kinds of voters. He won the young vote, the older vote, working class, union members, educated people, Catholics, women, and even 24% of the right-wing Evangelical crowd. So there fore your statements about “young people” is completely wrong.

Posted by: William J. LePetomaine | November 17, 2008, 11:55 am 11:55 am

Jim
I am a republcan for limited government. If you subscribe to the total conservative package as it is being propogated now it is the “Big Fish Eating the Little Fish” theory. This works to a degree, but when all the little fish are gone then the big fish dies. We fight over who is in control, but we always forget that when the political spectrum is in the middle that the US actually moves forward. It’s not the Right, or the Left that cause progress, its the movement from right to left that propels the US forward. Wouldn’t it be neat to actually get the balance and really move forward. This is not a hate message to anyone. It’s a desire to get us out of the crazy mess we are in and move on. Everyday we fall behind is a day that costs us in the future.

Posted by: Ed Patrick | November 17, 2008, 11:58 am 11:58 am

I wouldn’t be surprised to see more Republicans walking this path, seeking some relevance in a post-neo-conservative world.
I don’t expect the fringe right will go quietly into that dark night… but they’ll have to share quarters with the 9/11 conspiracy believers, black helicopter watchers, and various other tinfoil hat types.

Posted by: Yukon Sam | November 17, 2008, 12:04 pm 12:04 pm

Since the republicans conservatives know only how to practice the most hard edged form of partisanship, they can’t accept any other form of working with the opposition and get things done. What happened to their motto “country firt” ?. One advise to you morons “be a maveric” and than, the country will come “first”.

Posted by: Frank | November 17, 2008, 12:11 pm 12:11 pm

Agree Ed. But are we saying those who created the mess, took bribes from Fannie and Freddie, and are still in charge are now going to magically change? The mess we are in was due to social engineering by the government and there is no indication that those involved have taken any steps to reverse the course they started some 30 years ago. How do we move forward if they are in charge and they do not see the problem they have created? If desktop underwriting is “good” and forcing banks to lend to people who otherwise could not afford a mortgage or a car loan is still an acceptable way of doing business in Washington we’re all in trouble. You have to remove the source of the problem, not reinforce it which is what the election just did.

Posted by: Jim | November 17, 2008, 12:19 pm 12:19 pm

First off, Obama is a freaking US citizen. Even if he wasn’t born in America, as long as his mother was a US citizen (she was), then Obama is a US citizen. That is in the Constitution. Saying he isn’t is just a slimy, low-down form of racism.
Second, the reason the Democratic congress has not been able to accomplish anything is Bush. Bush vetoed EVERYTHING. He used his vetoes more than any other president ever. Instead of working out a compromise (something Obama seems willing to do), he stopped any kind of progress, even when it had bipartisan support.

Posted by: Reason | November 17, 2008, 1:33 pm 1:33 pm

There are no laws, as far as I can determine, that “force banks to lend”. There are laws prohibiting discrimination in lending and encourage community investment. Obviously, those who wish to discriminate seek to undermine such laws; just as obviously, it is in the public interest not to allow the erosion of these regulations.
The roots of the financial crisis are complex, but one of the proximate causes were predatory lending practices initiated by financial institutions, backed with the outsourcing of risk represented by Mortgage Backed Securities. The banks made risky loans not because such were mandated by the government; they made risky loans because doing so was remarkably profitable, and the risk could be sold to investors who didn’t quite comprehend the complexities of what they were buying.

Posted by: Yukon Sam | November 17, 2008, 1:51 pm 1:51 pm

Welcome Back Senator Kennedy…
Ted Kennedy returned to the Senate today, nearly six months to the day after the seizure that led to the diagnosis of his malignant brain tumor. He was accompanied by his wife and dogs, and was greeted by over 100 staffers. Kennedy spoke about working with President-elect Barack Obama on a variety of issues, including healthcare.

Posted by: becky (the real one) | November 17, 2008, 1:57 pm 1:57 pm

Jim
I am in total agreement with you on the last post. Don’t have the answer to your quest for new leadership, just know that things had to change.

Posted by: Ed Patrick | November 17, 2008, 1:57 pm 1:57 pm

Ok so Yukon there are laws that make it to where banks have to lend (which was signed by Bill Clinton and put in to effect during his presidency), but your looking from the wrong perspective on this issue, and most are… Those banks have those rules so lower income falies have oppurtunies to get homes, they banks just took advantage of them by allowing other banks to refinance those mortages, when they know they people couldnt afford to stretch money (that they didnt have) out over a longer period of time so they could make a damn profity of these people debts.
Debts are bought and sold in the US daily. That’s our problem fake money that doesnt exist. The credit industry just allows those who lend to take advantage of those who arent smart enough to manage what they already have or those who live outside their means based of desires that society drives them to..(competeing w/ the Jones).
We Cannot fix these problems by playing the same games with the same rules that got us into this mess in the first place.

Posted by: LEGENDARY MPTERRY | November 17, 2008, 2:14 pm 2:14 pm

Yukon – you to research some. Banks did not suddenly change the way they did business over hundreds of years. They were compelled to do so.
Clinton Administration regulations in the ’90s added teeth to CRA (Community Reinvestment Act), requiring banks to show compliance with meeting low-income loan targets or face civil actions that could assess a $500,000 penalty for each violation.
In addition, for 1996, HUD required that 12 percent of all mortgage purchases by Fannie and Freddie be “special affordable” loans, typically to borrowers with income less than 60 percent of their area’s median income. That number was increased to 20 percent in 2000 and 22 percent in 2005. The 2008 goal was to be 28 percent.
The banks were kept from rebelling by using Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac’s deep pockets to buy these poor-quality loans and take them off the banks’ books.
And Reason – Obama has never shown any one a real birth certificate – for some reason he chose to post a forged/ doctored birth certificate on his website. Also read the petition before the Supreme Court and the reasoning relative to his mothers citizenship status at the time of birth. You’ll then understand its not a slam-dunk that he is a naturalized citizen. My guess is, based on the documents presented to the court, he is Kenyan by birth and that is why he (Obama) had his records sealed in Kenya, Hawaii and Indonesia.

Posted by: Jim | November 17, 2008, 2:19 pm 2:19 pm

Jim,
Are the photographs of the birth certificate at Factcheck forged/doctored also?

Posted by: Yawn | November 17, 2008, 2:32 pm 2:32 pm

Yawn – yes. Of course, the Supreme Court will not accept what is posted on a web-site or speculated on the web, they will want a true birth certificate and resolution of the other documentation presented to them. Plus, there is the issue of the Electoral College – in a number of states, electors are considering state law suits demanding proof of birth and citizenship before they cast their vote in mid December.

Posted by: Jim | November 17, 2008, 2:39 pm 2:39 pm

Let’s talk about YOUR homework, Jimmy. There are no penalties associated with non-compliance with the Community Reinvestment Act (unless it’s also a violation of the Equal Credit Opportunity Act, which prohibits discrimination). The Act specifically requires that loans be made in accordance with “safe and sound operation”, a provision apparently not much regarded by predatory lenders.
And there’s no evidence whatsoever that Obama’s birth certificate, freely viewable on the Internet by anybody who cares to search for it, is anything other than genuine. That’s just tinfoil-hat talk.

Posted by: Yukon Sam | November 17, 2008, 2:40 pm 2:40 pm

Sorry but it is doctored and the Supreme Court agreed to review and has asked them to produce the original document by 12/1. They don’t take cases like this one unless there is substance.
The Clinton Administration did impose regulations fining banks up to $500k for violations of CRA and HUD did impose targets on banks to loan. Its in the books.

Posted by: Jim | November 17, 2008, 2:47 pm 2:47 pm

Jim,
I didn’t ask about the Supreme Court or the Electoral College, I asked if the photographs at Factcheck were doctored or fake. Also, why would the director of Hawaii’s Dept. of Health lie about it?

Posted by: Yawn | November 17, 2008, 2:48 pm 2:48 pm

Exactly Legendary – if the fed was pushing banks to make improper loans then everyone jumped in because it was profitable. But no one wanted to hold bad mortgages. F&F bought much of it and the rest was securitized, sliced and diced and sold to investors with AAA ratings. Everyone assumed the price of housing would rise – no one ever thought prices would go down and the house of cards built by social engineering would collapse.

Posted by: Jim | November 17, 2008, 2:52 pm 2:52 pm

Which photos at Factcheck are doctored? What about them makes you think they have been doctored? And why would the director of the Dept of Health lie about the birth certificate?

Posted by: Yawn | November 17, 2008, 2:53 pm 2:53 pm

No one has touched, seen or felt the original document. They (Factcheck) have touched, seen and felt a document that was issued in 2007 which of course is not the original. That has been sealed. I don’t know why the director would need to lie nor do I know why Obama would need to take many lawyers to Hawaii with him when he visited his grandmother… and this case was filed with the Supreme Court. Why not simply produce the original that was filed in 1961? In any event, we’ll see in the next 2 weeks.

Posted by: Jim | November 17, 2008, 3:04 pm 3:04 pm

Yes not just profitable but ludacrisly profitable. Greed is the biggest problem when it comes down to politics and money. If banks werent private then it may allow this greed to be controlled more but then again who says that would make the officals incharge corrupt due to hand outs by others. just like in any others case.

Posted by: legendary mpterry | November 17, 2008, 3:17 pm 3:17 pm

Jim,
Of course it wasn’t the original birth certificate. The Dept of Health doesn’t release originals, they release certified copies.
Politifact put it best when they said, “It is possible that Obama conspired his way to the precipice of the world’s biggest job, involving a vast network of people and government agencies over decades of lies. Anything’s possible. But step back and look at the overwhelming evidence to the contrary and your sense of what’s reasonable has to take over.”

Posted by: Yawn | November 17, 2008, 3:34 pm 3:34 pm

Thanks Yawn – I’ve seen the comment yet the photos released by Factcheck over time have changed. Who knows why.
Call me a cynic, but when someone presents an abstract of a legal document and calls it valid in something this important, I have doubts. (And if they previously posted a forgery on their web-site as well). If you were buying a piece of property in Hawaii for example, and someone presented you with an abstract of the deed, rather than the original deed, would you not feel uneasy? Would you not want to check the original before investing? I think that’s the reason the Supreme Court is asking for the original – the long form that shows father, mother, date and place of birth, etc…
Politics, power and money are strong motivators. Here in New York we had the seemingly ideal governor (Spitzer) not too long ago – tough on crime, etc… he had it all to lose and he did – quickly. It is hard to say why those in power or seek it will do the strangest things to get it and then lose it.

Posted by: Jim | November 17, 2008, 3:44 pm 3:44 pm

Cynic Jim,
According to Factcheck, the Hawaii Department of Health’s birth record request form does not give the option to request a photocopy of your long-form birth certificate, but their short form has enough information to be acceptable to the State Department.
And what about the birth certificate photos posted on either web site was changed or forged? You still haven’t answered that.

Posted by: Yawn | November 17, 2008, 4:36 pm 4:36 pm

Yes Yawn, there are many places you can find people who have investigated this – start here:
There are actually 4 parts to this story. This is not the only investigative look but is representative of the work that has been done. Other sites have printed out the Photoshop data indicating the posted documents have been manipulated and exactly how in Photoshop they were changed.
As the article mentions, Barack Obama has claimed in writing to have a valid printed document: In the first chapter of his book Dreams From My Father, describing his origins, he wrote about finding a local Hawaiian newspaper article about his Kenyan father: “I discovered this article, folded away among my birth certificate and old vaccination forms, when I was in high school.” Why not simply produce it? Why post forged documents?
Its clear that his campaign has been playing fast and lose with this – there’s a lot at stake. Given the laws at the time of his birth, his citizenship is not a slam dunk and definitely in question and floating doctored copies of a COLB around the internet makes a normal person suspicious as to motive and purpose.

Posted by: Jim | November 18, 2008, 8:59 am 8:59 am

Yes Yawn, there are many places you can find people who have investigated this – start here:
There are actually 4 parts to this story. This is not the only investigative look but is representative of the work that has been done. Other sites have printed out the Photoshop data indicating the posted documents have been manipulated and exactly how in Photoshop they were changed.
As the article mentions, Barack Obama has claimed in writing to have a valid printed document: In the first chapter of his book Dreams From My Father, describing his origins, he wrote about finding a local Hawaiian newspaper article about his Kenyan father: “I discovered this article, folded away among my birth certificate and old vaccination forms, when I was in high school.” Why not simply produce it? Why post forged documents?
Its clear that his campaign has been playing fast and lose with this – there’s a lot at stake. Given the laws at the time of his birth, his citizenship is not a slam dunk and definitely in question and floating doctored copies of a COLB around the internet makes a normal person suspicious as to motive and purpose.

Posted by: Jim | November 18, 2008, 9:43 am 9:43 am

Yawn – Since when did the internet have the final say on anything? I voted for and support Obama but if he can’t produce the real deal he can’t be president, period, end of story. Now, I for one would think, and this is just my opinion having gone through the SCI background check to get a TS clearance, that all of this has already been done since he has already had his first TS briefing. But, once again, show me the money(birth cert)!!!

Posted by: Chrs | November 18, 2008, 9:51 am 9:51 am

No birth certificate has yet to be produced….

Posted by: Jim | November 18, 2008, 11:04 am 11:04 am

And if your read their articles, you will see they do not rely just on one person’s analysis.
You’ll also see references to a one Jay McKinnon. Research him for a while. After all – he produced the “genuine” birth certificate for Obama, didn’t he? Or did he produce a hoax, which he now admits…

Posted by: Jim | November 18, 2008, 11:32 am 11:32 am

The very same document that Jim’s experts claimed were photoshopped was seen, examined, touched and photographed by Factcheck staffers. They found it to be an absolutely valid birth certificate that is acceptable by the State Department. The original 1961 birth certificate is held by the Hawaii Department of Health.
What’s also telling is that the Honolulu Advertiser newspaper published Obama’s birth announcement on Sunday, Aug. 13, 1961. As Factcheck puts it, “Of course, it’s distantly possible that Obama’s grandparents may have planted the announcement just in case their grandson needed to prove his U.S. citizenship in order to run for president someday. We suggest that those who choose to go down that path should first equip themselves with a high-quality tinfoil hat.”

Posted by: Yawn | November 18, 2008, 12:56 pm 12:56 pm

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