Calls for Repeal of “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell” -When Will the President Act?

The sooner the better. The Israeli army allows gays and lesbians to serve openly since 1993.

Obama won’t touch this with a ten foot pole.
He will say he will let the Defense take a look at it.

It is so easy to be the champion of the ‘oppressed’ middle class. I bet Obama wont touch a real injustice like Dont Ask, Dont Tell. That would be too much like a profile in courage.

Who cares?

Gays and Lesbians have been serving for years, they just can’t tell anyone that they are. They have given their lives for this country just the same as straight people. I don’t see anything wrong with repealing the policy.

Look, they serve in the military now. Having them open about their sexual disposition is just not necessary. What they do in their home can stay in their home, it doesn’t belong in a military environment.
Posted by: KR | Mar 3, 2009 8:10:48 AM
That is sort of a double standard. How about the ‘straights’ that rape women in the military and the affairs that go on. I know a bit about the military because my dad was in the Air Force and I saw what goes on with the straight folks. That does not belong in a military environment either but it’s still rampant.
I am sure that most gays and lesbians would still not broadcast it due to some of the attitudes of the testorone filled he-men.

what are you afraid of KR?
If you’re on a sinking ship & that naked homosexual sailor reaches out to save you. do you grab his hand or die?
Posted by: homophobic | Mar 3, 2009 8:27:35 AM
Exactly!

The left is going to be very disappointed. Repealing DADT does nothing to consolidate O’s power. His goal is to convince the gays he can screw them because they have no place to go.

“what are you afraid of KR?
If you’re on a sinking ship & that naked homosexual sailor reaches out to save you. do you grab his hand or die?”
There are over 300,000 in the Navy. They come from every walk of life in the United States and other nations. Many from other countries serve in the Navy to get their citizenship.
Don’t talk to me like it’s ME who is afraid of that. But don’t be so stupid to think there aren’t people who would take offense to it. For the left who seem so concerned about offending people, you have no concern at all for anyone who doesn’t agree with your view of society. Fact is there are people who have no issue working with gays, they just don’t care to know. Because if they know, they will inevitably act differently towards them in situations of nudity. If you are so naive not to think that won’t happen, then you haven’t had to live on a ship.

“That most people who aren’t fond of gays and lesbians think that all gays and lesbians think about is sex. They are no different than straight people, except for who they love.”
Ever hear of the “Love boat” cruise? The first carrier to have women aboard. I forget the actual numbers, but out of like 18 women on board, around 10 or so were pregnant before the end of the cruise. A prostitution ring was on a carrier, found and convicted those involved. Even gays have been found engaging in sex on the carrier.
I think people fail to picture what this really is. This isn’t about gays serving in the military. They are already there. This is about them being able to be openly gay. What is the real difference in the long run? Straight people aren’t openly straight in the military, what does it matter?
By the way, in all my years I have never seen anyone booted for being gay. Even some who have accidentally been discovered as gay, are not booted. Sometimes they are relocated to a different command, but seldom are they ever booted just for being gay. When they are, you usually hear about it on the news. It’s not many at all.

“Most people like that are not comfortable with their own sexuality. People are afraid of what they don’t understand and most won’t take the time to learn about other people. Attitudes are changing about homosexuals but there is still a long way to go in regards to that.”
I think this is where we have issue. You think the government should force people to modify their behavior. I would disagree. This is still a free nation, well for the time being anyway. When the government starts telling people how they should think, we run into very dangerous ground.
Look, personally with me I don’t have any problems with it. But let me share with you some history. When women were first allowed in the military, and began going into area’s usually just for men, it became big PR campaigns. The first female F14 pilot, who was pushed into flying the F14 even when she didn’t feel comfortable flying it, killed herself and her back seat RIO. I have also witnessed abuses by certain women, who have gotten pregnant just before a deployment for the sole reason not to go on deployment. I have also worked with some great female officers and sailors who I had just as much, if not more confidence in then some of my male fellow sailors.
But it doesn’t change the fact that the military has had to go to great lengths to modify itself for female presence in certain area’s of the military. On the whole, it was good thing for females in the military, but it is also constant struggle to accommodate.
Openly gay will open up another complexity for the military to deal with. It injects politics and activism into an environment where it has no place. They can serve, they do serve, why is that not enough?

Posted by: KR | Mar 3, 2009 8:58:45 AM
Why do they have to be treated as second class citizens like women used to be? There are a lot of women that have died for this country as well as gays and lesbians.
So basically what you are saying is it should be men and straight only so that we don’t have to “accomodate” the others.

If he get everything done today what will he do tomorrow?
Posted by: jb | Mar 3, 2009 9:04:38 AM
I think he will continually work to get this country back to what it once was, whether it is 4 or 8 years that he is in for. There is plenty for him to keep busy for more than 8 years.

How many people have not enlisted due this policy? Why would they want to take the chance of getting booted out?
I don’t see what the problem is.”
You bring up something absolutely mythological, how many people pray to the sun get sunburned? No one can possibly say how many it is, and should have nothing to do with why they join. Our military is an all volunteer force. We want people to join to serve their nation, not for a paycheck or to prove some point. And there is nothing to say that gay’s cannot join. What the policy says is that if you join, keep your private sexual activities PRIVATE.
Posted by: KR | Mar 3, 2009 9:12:08 AM
You missed my point. How many able bodied people have they lost in recruiting due to this policy. No it doesn’t have anything to do with a paycheck, but why would somebody subject themselves to getting booted if they were found to be gay or lesbian or put up with harassment.
Do you really think these people chose that lifestyle? I don’t and that is where some people just don’t get it.

” but why would somebody subject themselves to getting booted if they were found to be gay or lesbian or put up with harassment.”
There is no task force out there looking to find gays. I knew of several sailors who were gay, found by accident typically, but there was no action taken against them. They still serve today because they don’t display it at work or in uniform. If they go participate in a gay parade in uniform, you bet action will be taken. But if I wore a uniform in just about any demonstration or parade (not designed to honor the military), I’d probably get kicked too.
“Do you really think these people chose that lifestyle? I don’t and that is where some people just don’t get it. ”
In some cases yes, in some cases I think its biological or psychological. But that’s just my opinion. I don’t by the “born that way” crap in most cases. Again, that’s just my opinion. Why should I force my opinion on morality issues on you through government policy? That’s what the president is asking the military to do with this issue.

“Intellects – Because if you don’t agree with us, you must be stupid.”
Sound Familiar?”
and I called someone stupid or not an intelligent person… where?
That post where you got that was directed at someone who seems to claim only intellects exist in the democratic party. I have not used that anywhere here, so not sure what connection you are trying to draw.
I am trying to give people a broader perspective, something they will not see in the news, from someone who has gay family members and served in the military. Is my experience not relevant?

“Intellects – Because if you don’t agree with us, you must be stupid.”
Sound Familiar?”
and I called someone stupid or not an intelligent person… where?
That post where you got that was directed at someone who seems to claim only intellects exist in the democratic party. I have not used that anywhere here, so not sure what connection you are trying to draw.
I am trying to give people a broader perspective, something they will not see in the news, from someone who has gay family members and served in the military. Is my experience not relevant?

“My only hope is that people treat each other with respect no matter who they are. One by one we need to change how we look at others because we are one people with one common purpose.”
I couldn’t agree with you more. However, that unfortunately just isn’t the world we live in. We have to admit that if we are to make sensible decisions on issues like this.
I served overseas, I’ve seen the worst and best in people. Military experience has been a blessing and a curse. There is one thing that will always be true though, the world is an ugly place and our nation, as powerful and good as it is, cannot change the fundamental flaws of mankind. Doesn’t mean we shouldn’t continue to try, quite the contrary we should stay vigilant to what our fellow man can be. But we should also be realistic that changing the flaws of human nature is unachievable, and always be prepared for the worst in people.

“Sigh, I guess I just can’t get you to understand” my point KR
In addition, your post was not addressed to one person – it was one of many divisive statements about the “Democratic party”.
Yes, your experience is very relevant. It would hold more weight if you maintained the same amount of respect you demanded.

“”Sigh, I guess I just can’t get you to understand” my point KR
Understand my perspective, I did not put anyone up to intellectual measure with that statement, as I am guessing you were trying to connect?
“In addition, your post was not addressed to one person – it was one of many divisive statements about the “Democratic party”.”
Ok so if someone says the democratic party is the party of intellectuals, and I point out by saying that you infer that there are no intellectuals who disagree with democrats, therefore they must be stupid, is a divisive statement?

“So why should these gay and lesbian have to live in constant fear that some repressed homophobe is going to come along and destroy their career and life?”
Do they live in constant fear? You say thousands serve, which I agree, but you say they all live in fear? I think I would disagree. How hard is it to keep your sexual life private? Is it really that difficult?

Yes, KR, they do fear. Even if they keep everything private, all it takes is one grudge to begin an investigation which would lead to a discharge.

If we want a job, why don’t we all join the military? We will have 3 squares a day and a warm bed to sleep; until we are called to do the job we were hired to do then we can all scream and yell and figure a way to get discharged.
Maybe this is obama’s solution to our economic problem…hummmm maybe something to think about. Is this his next step??

I am a moderate-leaning-conservative lesbian living in Alaska. Had I felt my sexuality could have been kept quite I would have joined up – however, in civilian life it’s difficult enough.
remember, “don’t tell” includes not talking about your partner, faking interest in the opposite sex, inventing stories of past relationships, not “acting gay”, etc. . .if you’re not gay then you haven’t been there, and you don’t understant.
how would you feel as a straight person if you were afraid to wear a wedding band, couldn’t talk about your husband or wife, or had feign same-sex attraction? the shame and the fear are misery enough.
I know several people who would choose to serve if the ban were lifted, and none who’d walk away.
additionally – I was born a lesbian. My partner and her sister were both born lesbians. two of my guy friends were born gay. my bisexual buddies, on the other hand, are just sluts. take it as you will.

“Hamas is a fundamentalist Islamic organization intent on the eradication of the state of Israel and all its citizens; a violent fascist regime that allows honour killings and the execution of homosexuals”
A potential secondary effect of open homosexuality in the military if captured. The rest of the world, and many of our enemies, aren’t as tolerant of homosexuality as the west is. Typical procedure when an american military service-person is captured is they google their name, check out their myspace, etc. So they would find out, probably can now.
Note: I’m not supplying this as a reason not to change the policy, just pointing out a potential ramification of that policy change.

” Ultimately I was discharged, despite NEVER making a statement to the military.”
First off, they read all the emails out of Iraq. You would know that having a clearance and being an officer. Second, I would say you have a sound legal case. Whats stopping you? As an officer also for 12 years, I’d support you.

Oh, by the way… despite the DADT policy, I have witnessed at least 14 gays pursued, investigated, and booted due to ‘homosexual conduct.’ Also, yes they can start with a simple grudge.
I was almost booted because I was attempting to collect rent from a fellow soldier who hadn’t paid his half in four months. He went to the command and said “she’s gay.” The only reason I did not get an investigation was because I had some very good upper chain that let my work speak for me, not accusations.
I fear about loosing my job if i cross the wrong people, but most understand the team concept, and know who i am beyond my uniform. I’m not fighting for gay rights per say, i just want to be albe to support my family and get the same benefits for them as straight families do.