Obama to Critics on Health Care: “What’s Your Answer?”

One need not have an alternative plan to recognize a plan offered is junk.

Maybe if he was willing to entertain some simpler, more reasonable ideas like tort reform, he would find some common ground.

First off, it isn’t healthcare that we are talking about, it is health INSURANCE. Since when is health insurance a right? If people want health insurance, they need to do what I and millions of others do, go to work and pay for it. As a single mother earning less than $25,000 a year, I sacrificed many luxuries to make sure I had health insurance for not only me but for my daughter as well. Affordable insurance is out there if people look for it and WANT to pay for it. People need to rely on themselves instead of a dysfunctional government.

Um, actually, there are a couple of Republican plans circulating at the moment. Paul Ryan is cosponsor of one and the Wyden-Bennett plan has bipartisan sponsors and seems the most sensible of the bunch so far (but I will admit I have not yet had the time to check any of the plans out in great detail– some of us have day jobs *G*)
And I would remind the president that the Democrats do not have a single reform package endorsed by the White HOuse,either. As with the stimulus plan, he’s outsourcing the writing of specific legislation to congress, and there are at least three bills being circulated by democratic groups, as far as I can tell. The Kennedy plan, which I thought would have had the WH seal of approval, has scared off some folks after the CBO report on its cost.
Republicans, like moderate Democrats, are not simply criticizing without offering alternatives. For example, rather than the government offering a public insurance program, some are proposing a voucher program to subsidize coverage for those who cannot otherwise afford insurance but who are not eligible for Medicaid or other existing government programs.
But it sounds better to create those straw men, as the president is want to do. You know, along the lines of “some say we should do nothing, but they are wrong,” when actually, the bulk of his critics are saying, do something more fiscally responsible than the massive bills being proposed by the Democrats, and do not rush such an important bill through just to be able to check the “accomplished in first year in office” box.

Ima- on the salary you say you make I find it difficult to believe you can afford health insurance. I made quite a bit more than you and when I was on cobra – I could barely afford it. Most everyone I know that are currently unemployed are desparate to find quality health insurance.at a reasonable price. I (we) would appreciate you sharing the name of your insurance carrier.
Thanks

With Obama, you either agree with him 100% on everything, or you’re in the way of his “change”. He will not accept opposing views. He says he “brings people together” but only long enough to tell those that may disagree with him on some issues that “he won”. He’s so petty. He lacks the maturity and skills to be a true reformer. But, most liberal are. RE: B.Boxer “please call me senator” (instead of ma’am). Embarrassing.

Here’s a solution, nationalize health care and institute a single-payer system. Ignore the morons who don’t know the difference between socialism and communism, who blather on criticizing the government without the least bit of understanding regarding public policy, who can’t speak beyond talking points. Literally any other solution will almost be worse than what we have now, and the current plans (contrary to what the mouth-breathers who’s opinions are limited to whatever Rush Limbaugh has to say on this board seem to think) is nothing but a giveaway to the health insurance industry.

So Jake, will ABC’s upcoming Obama infomercial include any questions from you? That might actually be worth watching. Otherwise, I’ll be taking a pass.

moderatet and steve,
Where were the Republicans with their when bush was president and obama was not in the picture? How all of a sudden the Republicans have this alternative plan as soon as Obama put forward his plan? I’ll tell you why! They have no plan but an opposition plan simply for opposition sake. If they were so interested in the health care situation..why now are they touting their so called plan. They never had a plan because AMA and health insurance companies have always been big supporters of the Republican party..its all about money, kickbacks, lobbying, and ripping off the public. The Republicans don’t care about affordable and accessible health care for all Americans..they talk a good game..its similar to the good game they talk about supporting our troops abroad and you are unpatriotic if you don’t, yet when the troops come home they are not treated well and a lot of our returning troops are on the street and begging. The Repubs talk a good game but follow them closely and you’ll realize its all flatulence..Republican flatulence..no substance.

Thank God I’m a vet with a 30 percent disability. Luckily I’m still working too, otherwise, I might be among the millions of Americans without access to health care insurance. My kids and grandkids aren’t so lucky, though. If you don’t agree with the public option proposed by the administration because you still have coverage or money set aside for emergencies, just imagine how it might be for you and your family.

I recently watched Michael Moore’s movie “Sicko” which compares the US medical / insurance system to those in Canada, Cuba, England, and France. All of those countries offer free medical care and free or cheap meds… They use higher taxes to pay for it, but it cuts out a huge amount of administration… Imagine how much money we’d save if we got rid of the insurance companies, the medical billing groups, administration depts for groups like medicare etc… I wouldn’t be surprised if the taxes we’d have to pay worked out lower than the premiums we pay now…
According to the Institute of Medicine of the National Academy of Sciences, the United States is the “only wealthy, industrialized nation that does not ensure that all citizens have coverage” (i.e. some kind of insurance).
I think it’s just because we have all the big insurance companies here that would cease to exist…. Seriously, look at how much money those companies have. It’s all money that could be used for health care, but instead goes to over paid CEOs and investors.

Stanley and Idiots, I do not think it advances the debate at all for the two of you to call Republicans, with whom you clearly disagree, “frontal-lobe-less” and “mouthbreathers” who simply parrot Rush Limbaugh and “morons.” And you continue to insist that Republicans are disagreeing just to disagree, even after that charge has been demonstrated not to be true.
I agree that an important component to true health care reform is tort reform, in order to get malpractice cases back in the realm of reality and to reduce the extreme expense of defensive doctoring. We also need to provide subsidies or vouchers to help people get the health insurance coverage they need.
We should be working on parallel tracks– providing help in obtaining and retaining affordable health care to those who are uninsured but want coverage (but NOT single-payer government health insurance or a public option, which is the first step toward single-payer) AND sensibly reducing health care costs through such steps as tort reform. We should not be conflating health care and health insurance.
We should not be demonizing people on different sides of the debate about how best to meet the goals of affordable access to quality health care for Americans. And we should not be calling those with whom we disagree silly names.

Yes health care needs to be fixed. But not with a hatchet. With Obama plan ultimately we will have lower quality health care and higher cost.
We need to be able to uptain insurance across state line, and we should receive a yearly tax credit for health insurance. I agree that health benefits should be taxed and in its place you would get a tax credit.
My daughter was thinking of becoming a Doctor, and I told her if Obama gets his way all her hard work and expense of going to medica school will not be worth it. I know I am not the only parent that feels the way I do.

ABC news is a joke for not letting others advertise against obama health plan.
I was a watcher of ABC news, never again

PM,
Well said! 50 millions Americans without health insurance = little access to quality health care. So much for the richest country in the world who claim care for all its citizens. I don’t mind giving $10 out of my paycheck every pay period to a system that will enable every citizen of this country to get accessible and affordable health care..if every blessed citizen(those with jobs and other wherewithal) would do the same..then the less fortunate among us..poor,vets on the street, the sick and shut in, the incapacitated..will all benefit..sounds idealistic but I believe its possible..how many of us spend ten dollars or more every two week on foolishness like cigarettes and alcohol thus killing ourselves and increasing our risk for degenerative diseases..Capitalism has encouraged selfishness…me, me, me,..I got mine now you get yours and its its killing our country..I believe Social democracy is the best form of Government..Check the Scandinavian countries and their standard of living..Social democracies..I suspect that president Obama is a Social democrat..The Repubs call it socialism to scare people.

kenneth K Cohen,
Well said and thank you for the post! I Say “Health care for all Americans”. Its doable!

A big step to fixing some of our health care issues would be to require all Doctors, clinics and hospitals to post all the pricing. If people knew the cost they could shop around and get a better price if they choose to. I asked my clinic were I get my mamograms how much it would cost, they couldn’t tell me at first. The price they finally quoted me was completely wrong.

Jaye,
The comment you made here really casts you in bad light… What happened to being a doctor because you want to help people??? It’s partly because people are going into the medical field for profit that it costs so much to see a doctor these days.
“My daughter was thinking of becoming a Doctor, and I told her if Obama gets his way all her hard work and expense of going to medica school will not be worth it. I know I am not the only parent that feels the way I do.”
Upper education is another area we really need to provide as a free service. Part of why people are driven to push for such large salaries after school is just to pay off their loans. Most educated people are better at taking care of their health too, so that’ll help bring down national health care costs in addition to it’s other wide spread benefits…

Ib Moller,
Research tells me that the Scandinavian countries have the highest standard of living in the world. So my question is what’s the point being the richest country in the world but yet does not have the highest standard of living in the world..what is more important to you?

Yehudit,
You are sadly mistaken…I am and has always been an indepedent voter..not democrat nor Republican..Partisans are never objective. But I am a big supporter of health care for every citizen of this country which boast to be the richest country in the world. Yehudit, does it make sense to boast of being the richest country in the world yet does not have the highest standard of living in the world..isn’t something wrong with that picture?..I vote policies and interest..not democrat or Republican. Yehudit, me thinks you are Republican..only a few of you are left..haven’t you heard! people are leaving your party in droves..Good for them!

It makes me sad that so many people are ignorant of basic logic skills to catch fallacies. Based on what I’m reading, Obama is:
1 “….calling out the critics for “tinkering” around the edge of health care reform with their own plans.”
2. “But for those who simply criticize without offering new ideas of their own, I have to ask —what’s your answer?”
3. “..it’s not acceptable to “pretend” that offering “meager tax cuts” is a good way to solve the problem.”
4. “pushed once again for the broad-base change that his administration has called for, rather than “subsiding a health care system that can’t contain costs.”
5. “warned that now, when things are starting to turn around in the economy, is when the criticism will get louder against the party in power”
6. “People started to say, ‘why do we need all this regulation?’ I’m sorry wasn’t it just in September that the financial system almost melted down? What are you talking about?”
7. The President said that this is “so predicable” because of the nature of how politics works.
8. This is when we hear the same voices advocating the same old policies that got us in this mess in the first place. This is when we hear that the change we seek just isn’t possible. ‘Can’t do it, system over load circuits’ breaking down’.”
9.Tonight’s fundraiser banned the donations and attendance of lobbyists, yet only for one night. The President has banned the DNC from taking lobbyists money, but not the Democratic arms in the House and Senate.
There are so many holes/problems in his speeches it can be embarrassing. I’m a little rusty at this, but here are a few examples:
1. This is ‘proof by lack of evidence’ (claiming something is true because no offers evidence to the contrary) used to try to dismiss his opposition. Also some ad hominem (attack the person making the argument not the argument itself).
2. This is a ‘red herring’ (introducing an irrelevant point into an argument). He is deflecting/evading answering criticism/questions. Again ad hominem.
3. This is another red herring used to dismiss his opposition.
4. Yet another red herring. The health programs being subsidized with costs that cannot be contained are medicare and medicaid. This is different than the private sector. It is a false equivocation to compare private insurance with government insurance. He uses circular reasoning to defend his stand (A is true because B is true, and B is true because A is true).
5. Again, proof by lack of evidence that the economy has turned around. Then he says this is why criticism grows… this is called a post hoc ergo proter hoc. (since A happens before B, A causes B).
6. He deflects responsibility [for his part in the mess (he voted for TARP)] and makes it all from September. He uses a ‘part to whole’ fallacy (what is true of part of something must also be true of the whole thing together). He is the innocent bystander who is forced to deal with making regulations and pass them speedily with is an exigency fallacy (an urgent need that demands immediate action). He also makes a straw man (changing or or exaggerating an opponent’s argument to make it easier to refute) out of the problems all being caused prior to his presidency and his actions have nothing to do with the problems.
7. Again, proof by lack of evidence, red herring, false equivocation, and etc. Legitimate citizen concerns over enormous deficits and hasty decision/passage of bills is not the ‘nature of politics.’
8. More of the same fallacies.
9. More of the same…
***Test your skills… see if you can find the ‘genetic fallacy’ (personal attack different than ad hominem in that it does not attack the person but the place where the argument comes from).

drjohn,
I said health care for all citizens of this country..if the illegals want to become citizens charge them a fee..when they become citizens then they can fully access health care. Trying to deport every illegal citizen would be more expensive than charging them a fee and granting them citizenship..of course we ought to try to weed out the criminal elements as much as we can. “Health care for all”.

jaye’
I’m independent like you! No system is perfect and every system has horror stories..are you telling me that there are no horror stories attached to the current health care system? There are a lot..Research the health care systems of the Scandinavian countries and singapore..If they can provide accessible and affordable health care for all their citizens ..then we can too! That’s all I’m saying.

I’ve worked before 18…. and deductions for Healthcare from MY BI-WEEKLY paycheck has increased 120% since the early 1990′s….. while my wages has decreased…. the procedures I NEED is Controlled NOT BY MY PRIMARY PHYSICIAN, BUT BY WASHINGTON CONNECTED MANAGED CARE. I WANT QUALITY AFFORDABLE HEALTHCARE. T

My sister is a MD…….. she went to med school NOT TO get rich, but because she WANTED to help others, while living a comfortable life. SHE IS DISAPPOINTED BECAUSE SHE IS NOT HELPING OTHERS, AND CAN ONLY LIVE A COMFORTABLE LIFE BASED ON WHAT SHE DOES FOR THE MANAGE-CARE COMPANIES. WRONG REASON TO BECOME A DOCTOR JUST TO GET RICH, ANYWAY.

The price for healthcare in the current system is soaring out of control and bankrupting the government. It also leaves many Americans uninsured. We need to spend what ever money is necessary and get healthcare coverage for all Americans without delay. It is not a Democrat or a Republican issue, it is an American issue.

Stanley – what planet are you from? You think your giving $10 a month will pay for insurance for the uninsured and yourself? In 1986, Germany was taking 35% of everyones pay for socialized medicine. In 1991 the Swedes were taking 49% of one’s paycheck. They are a WELFARE STATE and they practice INSTITUTIONALIZED WELFARE. They also have one of the heaviest tax burdens in the world. Today, an average Swedish working family pays about half its earned income in national and local taxes. Swedes also pay taxes on investment income. In addition, Sweden has a national 25 percent sales tax that is built into the price of consumer goods. Beyond this, employers must pay corporate taxes and make payments into government pension, unemployment, and other social welfare funds. The resulting tax burden is so heavy that Swedes have a special word for it, skattetrat, which means “tax tiredness.” People like you need to go live in another country for a while and WAKE UP!

How are these to begin with: 1) Send every illegal alien back to Mexico. That would get them out of the hospitals, playgrounds and crappy, corner-cutting businesses; 2) We HAVE everything necessary for great healthcare – it’s just expensive. Get the CEOs of every healthcare organization in one room and MAKE them freeze prices, submit to government audits and quit trying to make a buck off sick people via exaggerated bills i.e., quit charging $7 for one Tylenol. Obama had no problem getting the CEOs of all the major banks in America in one room and holding a gun to their heads if they didn’t take TARP money; 3) Send doctors AND insurance company staff to prison if they overcharge, refuse to bill properly for tests, refuse legitimate tests or collude with pharmaceutical companies, personal injury lawyers or physicians to fraudulently exaggerate claims. 4) Open congressional investigations into drug prices. If a drug company can’t offer a reasonable explanation why a drug is 10 times more expensive in America than in Mexico, void their patent on it and fine them $10 million. 5) Now that the FDA is in charge of tobacco, declare tobacco unfit for human consumption and ban it from the marketplace. Tobacco maims the health of hundreds of thousands of people for years before it kills them. This alone will save billions of dollars every year. And it will have the added benefit of reaping goodwill, as we discontinue exporting slow, painful costly deaths to other countries. 6) Have real penalties for self-created problems. If someone develops a heart condition because they are 100 lbs. overweight, they should forfeit a piece of your paycheck or Social Security. If individuals are responsible for their own health to a provable degree, they must be held accountable for negative effects. That’s enough to begin with. The resulting savings should be in the tens of billions. Obama – thanks for asking! I’ll be looking for the press release soon!

ResponsibleAmerican, thanks for reminding us of the true scope of the problem– we do not really need an expensive solution to provide insurance for 47 million uninsured because that is a bogus number to begin with. I think the 10 to 15 million who are actually in need of access to affordable insurance who want it and can’t afford to pay for it can be helped through a voucher program or tax credit or something similar. We can address portability and preexisting conditions as well without creating an unworkable and expensive public plan. Then we can get to work on the other important health care problem– out of control expense.
And to those of you parroting that tired old “scandanvian countries have the highest standard of living in the world” nonsense– I am not impressed. If you would trade your life here in its totallity for life in Denmark or Sweden, go right ahead but I would not trade places with the inhabitants of any other country in the world.

Go Obama!
We need real health care reform now.
The people in congress look like a bunch of clowns right now, trying to put together a “reform” package which is going to be worse than the problem it tries to solve.
It’s time to pressure your senators and representatives… single payer health care, right now.

The answer is ‘keep the status quo’ tinkering with the healthcare system of the USA will open a new pandoras box of problems like mass unemployment of those employed by private healthcare firms, corruption at the highest levels of government (and private drug companies trying to get their dirty hands on a $1.6 trillion dollar Obama hand-out), computer mistakes, government beauracracy and lines and i.d. requirements just to see a doctor like the 6 points of i.d. required at the DMV. Ruining the profession of being a physician in this country. These are just the problems I can think of. It will cause a ripple effect like when we took Saddam out of Iraq. The devil you know is nicer than the one you dont!

I feel that if Congress won’t act on a healthcare bill for the people who gave them their jobs, the only fair thing to do is for our elected officials refuse THEIR free healthcare. If the sorry bastards can’t do that, we MUST get rid of them. Either turn down their free ride, or give us our money back. Period. Of course they won’t, but we must insist. Write your Congressmembers and demand they give up their taxpayer funded healthcare until we, the people, receive the same consideration.

NOBAMA wants everyone to have health coverage insurance. OK – so I am reminded again of Ms. Thatcher’s words: what do we do when we run out of YOUR money….

Sorry, this is not right, as a leader he should not say or ask ” ok how are you going to do it”…he leads and say’s “this is how we are going to do it”…….some one please let him know this looks weak in the eyes of leaders that know how to lead…….should of been Hillary.

My answer, you jive turkey President, is to fix what is wrong with the system (medicare and medicaiad fraud, tort reform, corruption, theft, unfair business practices based on power of the insurance industry instead of the consumer, etc etc etc) and then see how much money is saved. Then as premiums subside, the finest healthcare industry in the world becomes affordable and accessible to anyone who wants it, at their own expense and responsibility.
There is no reason for Government to have any ownership of health care coverage. Period.

Single Payer Health Care. It’s socialized insurance, not socialized medicine. (But I know everyone gets freaked out by the s-word.) Imagine being able to go see whatever doctor you wanted, not have to worry about pre-existing conditions, and having your health managed by you and your doctor, not your insurance company! It’s cheaper than our current system, and we’d get better care. Imagine that! This is a helpful website (I’m not affiliated with it in any way, but I find it answers a lot of questions.)

Daniel Hayes – You said “The prez. and congress have free health care.” This is 100% incorrect. Since passage of the Civil Servant Reform Act of 1983 ALL Federal Employees (including members of Congress) participate in the exact same health benefits plan that all other full-time civilian employees of the federal government do, the Federal Employee Health Benefits Plan. They do not get “free health insurance”, they pay the same amount as any other federal employee. Once they leave Congress, they do not receive any form of health insurance beyond the Medicare available to all retirees. Similarly, Congress participates in the same pension plan that all federal employees participate in, the Federal Employees’ Retirement System. They can receive at maximum 80% of their final salary (value determined by formula which includes high three years of salary, length of service, and age at retirement)in Congress after five years of service if they are over 62, or after twenty-five years if under 62. Like all government plans, it is easy to find information about it:

Hmmm, funny that ‘government-based solutions’ and heightened spending under Bush and the Republicans brought economic disaster, but under Dear Leader’s ever-growing Megagovernment we will achieve Utopia.
I guess having someone in charge with a D after their name, doing the same stuff (but just way bigger and faster) is supposed to achieve positive results.

AP Top News at 4:00 a.m. EDT
House eyes new taxes as senators pare health bill
WASHINGTON (AP) – House Democrats have lots of potential targets for higher taxes as they aim to expand health care coverage, from wealthy Americans and the nation’s employers to anyone who pops the top on a soft drink. Also under consideration are higher alcohol taxes, increases to the Medicare payroll tax and a value-added tax, a sort of national sales tax, of up to 1.5 percent or more.
Any more questions ?

Single Payer or nothing. lets see the CBO write up on the single payer option. How come those figures weren’t released?

BK you are living in a fantasy world if you think that US health care is the best in the world. Look at the facts, instead of just blindly cheering on the home team, no matter how badly they suck.

ALL BARACK CHANNEL IS A DISGUSTING, LIBERAL STATION. GIVING OBAMA FREE AIRTIME BUT WHEN THE GOP WANTS TO PAY FOR THEIR AIRTIME TO DISPUTE THE OBAMACARE PLAN THEY GET DENIED? WAKE UP AMERICAN PEOPLE. ABSOLUTELY APPALLING.

Don’t worry, ABC has assured us (and Jake has assured us on Twitter) that Charlie and Diane are going to be fair. It isn’t an “advocacy” show. Jake, have you seen GMA lately? Diane and Charlie have Dr. Tim Johnson on their show! advocating Obama’s plan. Dr. Johnson has never advocated anything other than Universal Health Care. Linda Douglass, a former ABC newser now works for Obama and is coordinating this show. Bill Clinton’s former chief of staff, George Stephanopolous (who tried his hardest to get Universal health care in 93) is now the host of ABC’s This Week.
Sorry, ABC if you forgive me for not believing you when you pat me on the head and tell me to trust ABC.

Hank, I’m perplexed by your logic. No, I am not employed by any stretch by an entity “saved” by bailout money. I am a small business owner, as a matter of fact, as well as an academic. We work extremely hard and take care of our own health care costs. We have no connection to the auto industry, financial services industry, or any other ailing industry currently entangled with government money. None of our customers, as a matter of fact, are connected to bailout money either.
So does that mean that by your standards I am allowed to criticize the idea of the government taking over health care coverage after all? You need not exhort me to work hard– I am already working extremely long hours, and my spouse works even longer. We love what we do and we are prospering. But we are prospering because we are a company that performs, that delivers excellent service, that has an impeccable reputation in our industry, not because we depend on government subsidies.
Funny, you don’t seem to think cheerleaders for the ruinous “progressive” (your word) solution of single-payer government health insurance are wasting their time commenting here, just those who do not agree. (I know, that comment will get my post bounced, but I’m taking that chance.)

Too many Americans are unable to see the forest through the trees. And, therefore, they really don’t see that they are about to sell out many of their individual freedoms in the name of universal womb-to-tomb health care run by the federal government. Right now you have the Constitutional Right to refuse treatment for yourself. Once the federal government becomes the sole provider for our nation’s health care system it won’t be long before the federal administrative body (whether it is Medicare or a new Medicare-like administrative body), under the guise of cutting costs through their preventative health care plan, will dictate the products we can or cannot purchase, as well as, what food and beverages we can or cannot eat or drink. But most importantly IT will decide what medical procedures you MUST HAVE or WON’T ALLOW. And one criteria that may disqualify you for a particular medical procedure will likely be whether your lifestyle is consistent with ITS policies.

I got an answer…
How bout we limited or outlaw PPO/HMO to help promote competition among doctors. Competition is a known force to drive down prices.
Reduce costs to patients? Patients are at the bottom of the cost chain, lets go up to the top. How do we reduce costs on health care providers? How bout we start at liability insurance and some tort reform. Also R&D costs are past down to patients. How bout we assist R&D efforts to drive down those costs that are passed on to patients. Lets also end class action lawsuits that only make lawyers money and end up banning drugs, approved by the FDA, but get taken off the market because of some flimsy study.
Compensation for malpractice. The government already has a system in place that is for this issue. It’s the system for disabled veterans. A disabled veteran who has his arms and legs blown off gets $2600 a month, 100% disability. Institute that system for compensation and get rid of these 20 million dollar lump payouts that make lawyers money.
Emergency care. Lets make that a government service, like police and fire. Ambulator service can and probably should be a government function, emergency care.
Debt relief. Citizens who have large debts for medical bills qualify for no interest government loans that can be paid back over time with tax return deductions (or monthly pay system).
And finally free clinics. One of my doctors would volunteer at the free clinic. Those of us who really do care about the uninsured should donate to, or volunteer to help, free clinics and if you are in a somewhat larger city, I can garantee you that there are several free clinics. Make it a community effort.
Thats my plan.

“This would be an option. If you have private insurance, stay with it! Nobody will be forcing you to change. It also is rather humorous reading the Govt. will make your health decisions, where did that come from?”
Most people with private insurance is co-paid by the employer. My employer sucks up a large portion of my monthly premium. If government insurance is available, employers will drop paying their portion. Why suck up that cost when the government is taxing them for it and its available? That would leave me to suck up the rest of the cost that my employer currently pays. Fat chance of that as they suck up about $400 a month.
Government will decide what procedures it covers and procedures it does not cover. My aunt was just diagnosed with pancreatic cancer. The best hospital in the country is MD Anderson in Houston. My family is bringing her down there for treatment. Government insurance will tell you thats not necessary as treatment will be available in your own city.
So yes, they can, and they will make decisions for you in order for the government to save itself money.
What everyone should understand is that government insurance doesn’t just start paying your health care bills. It puts stipulations on doctors. It has approved procedures and unnapproved procedures. So if the doctor wants to get paid, he is not going to offer you procedures the govt won’t pay for.
My father in law lives in Germany. He has a bad back. He has been cut on 3 times and scar tissue is causing issues in his spine. There is laser surgery in Munich and we researched it for him because they can remove scar tissue with a laser. He has government insurance. He cannot get the procedure because govt insurance won’t pay for it.
Some private insurances here do the same, but you can fight it. You can’t fight the government, and you can’t sue them either. Well you can, but good luck.

“The only thing that concerns me is the FDA approved drugs and class action lawsuits.”
Yeah I think that it is the FDA’s role as a regulatory agency to ensure its safe. If they rule it safe, and it turns out that it isn’t, I believe no class action lawsuit should be legal, not against the drug manufacturer. If the drug manufacturer mislead the FDA, then the FDA can impose penalties for that. But new products need some kind of protection from endless lawsuits full of words like “may cause” or “could cause” stuff, never having proof. Just believe that the consequences of these suits shouldn’t be something we all pay for, and some lawyer gets rich off of.

KR – “Yeah I think that it is the FDA’s role as a regulatory agency to ensure its safe. If they rule it safe, and it turns out that it isn’t, I believe no class action lawsuit should be legal, not against the drug manufacturer. If the drug manufacturer mislead the FDA, then the FDA can impose penalties for that.” — That makes sense! Thanks for the detail. Seriously, I like your plan. Now, how does one get it in the hands of the correct people?

KR – While both sides have their “plan”. Yours really is a fresh look at the problem. You include things that I believe both parties would find acceptable. I’m going to attempt to post a web address that has the emails senators. It should follow this, just wanted you to know it was coming! Great job!

Trythetruth, as KR so well explains, single payer, government insurance will mean government officials make health care coverage decisions for you. Now, it is true, private health insurance providers make decisions on coverage. With government run health insurance, the same thing will happen, but it will be government accountants rather than insurance company accountants doing it.
As KR points out, it will be infinitely harder to fight the bureaucracy on a health care issue when it is the government on the other side. Now, I can go through channels to fight decisions of my insurance company. If I did not get satisfaction, I could ultimately take my business elsewhere. When the government provides the only option, there is nowhere else to go.
When you say the government is not going to take away private plans, that is either naive or disingenuous. Once there is a public option, it will drive the private options out of the market. Many of those pushing for health care reform are honest about wanting that to happen sooner rather than later, but others want to pretend that they are not just getting their foot in the door.

It appears that ABC has finally shown their true (all blue)colors to the nation. I enjoy Charlie Gibson’s style of presenting the news, but I will not watch any further ABC news programing until they resume reporting both sides of all political issues, including the current health care debate. I am an Independent thinker that votes across political party lines.

The truth is our heathcare insurance system is broken. It is too costly, it exludes those with pre-existing conditions by charging impossibly high prices and even for those it insures they are not protected from bankruptcies. (Half of all bankruptcies are because of medical bills and most of those had insurance.)
While our country spends the most on health care per person our country is rated 37th in overall performance.
Public insurance as an available option is completely necessary. Finally health insurance companies will have true competition.
Other cost savings with computerized medical records, additional research in the best treatments will save more.
With over 46 million Americans having no health insurance, millions more under-insured and all of us financially unprotected in the case of a catastrophic illness, it is time to fix health care.

“it is silly to think employers who now offer heath insurance co-pays will stop.”
Really? Why I agree it could be used to attract talent, most companies operate on fixed income/per product. If taxes are increased on them (as they propose) to pay for this new national health care, their costs will go up. They will cut it somewhere, and if their employees can get govt health care, they’ll drop their co-pay. Thats just common sense. Those in competition to get talent will offer insurance, but I’m guessing those people already have and afford health insurance, and are likely making good money as well.
I am a disabled veteran. I go to the VA hospital. What happens over time is that the folks that work there end up doing what it takes to make the government happy, not the patient. You as a patient won’t be paying the bill, the govt will. Thus, they cater to the govt in an almost robotic manner. You can see this when you go to any government run agency for your drivers license or tax commission offices.
And let me ask you this, what government agency, anywhere, runs so efficiently and effectively that you trust your health care in their hands? What makes you think that this plan will be any different than the abysmal program that is medicare/medicaid?
The answer is, it won’t be. It will be yet another, glutonous, bloated, innefficient government program we all pay for and complain about that runs up our national debt and we’ll be stuck with it. How can it ever be repealed? That would be unpopular, politicians would be demonized for not caring for peoples health, and politicians think of their re-election more than being good stewards of our taxes.

“As for the small poll that showed an 89% approval rating for their health care that was statistically too small to matter.”
But Lydia, you point out the ranking poll that shows the US 37th, when no I’m sure few if any in that poll experienced the health care system of other nations. It is a poll of self perception. Other nations also (mostly with government run media) have never experienced our system. So how is a ranking poll that is not a comparison poll, but individualized assesment poll, of more value than a small poll where you think the sample size is too small?
If our health care is so bad, then why do the leaders of many of those nations ranks above us come here for critical care? Because the best health care is right here, but we do pay for it. Good health care costs good money, thats how any system works.

Here is my answer Mr. President.
A wise and frugal government, which shall leave men free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned – this is the sum of good government.
Thomas Jefferson

THE FIRST part of the answer is to put an end to taxpayer funded treatment of illegal aliens. Part two is protection of doctors / hospitals from frivilous lawsuits. Once you’ve done those things, we can then take another look to see where we are. The last thing we need is European style socialized medicine.

Lydia wrote: “…it is silly to think employers who now offer heath insurance co-pays will stop.”
Right now unionized companies, when negotiating new union contracts have to also involve the health insurance companies since health benefits are a key component in agreeing on a new contract. If, however, these companies are given the option of providing health care or paying a 2% fee, it is a lot less hassle to just pay the 2% fee and let the federal government take over their employees’ health care plan. The human resources departments of large companies could probably trim their staffs if they don’t have to handle health insurances issues.

If you are going to say that providing government sponsored health
care for the needy is socialism then what would you call bailouts
for big companies? Chop liver?

I got an answer…
How bout we limited or outlaw PPO/HMO to help promote competition among doctors. Competition is a known force to drive down prices.
Reduce costs to patients. Patients are at the bottom of the cost chain, lets go up to the top. How do we reduce costs on health care providers? How bout we start at liability insurance and some tort reform. Also R&D costs are past down to patients. How bout we assist R&D efforts to drive down those costs that are passed on to patients. Lets also end class action lawsuits that only make lawyers money and end up banning drugs, approved by the FDA, but get taken off the market because of some flimsy study. If the FDA approves it, make it illegal to sue after that. If the FDA’s job is to ensure safety, and it doesn’t do it, then thats the FDA’s fault. If the FDA is mislead by the drug manufacturer, then the FDA impose penalties.
Compensation for malpractice. The government already has a system in place that is for this issue. It’s the system for disabled veterans. A disabled veteran who has his arms and legs blown off gets $2600 a month, 100% disability. Institute that system for compensation and get rid of these 20 million dollar lump payouts that make lawyers money. Payouts by those responsible be tied to the same disability scale of our servicemen.
Emergency care. Lets make that a government service, like police and fire. Ambulator service can and probably should be a government function, emergency care only.
Debt relief. Citizens who have large debts for medical bills qualify for no interest government loans that can be paid back over time with tax return deductions, dollar for dollar tax reduction for medical bills paid, or monthly pay system.
And finally free clinics. One of my doctors would volunteer at the local free clinic. Those of us who really do care about the uninsured should donate to, or volunteer to help, free clinics and if you are in a somewhat larger city, I can garantee you that there are several free clinics. Make it a community effort.
Thats my plan.
(repost from earlier in the thread).

It’s funny how the private health-care pundits in the US criticize Canada’s health-care system yet Americans have a lower life expectancy than Canadians.
You are being taken for a ride by the greed of the few and paying for it with a shorter lifespan. Don’t you get it?

HELP, MR. PRESIDENT!
I lived in Sweden for 7 years and saw their health care up front. Socialized medicine? Well we have the same thing in insurance medicine. What’s the difference? I’ll tell you. My doctor last week, prescribed a generic med for me for my arthrits which I can tell you is like taking a sugar pill. He almost cried because when he prescribed Celebrex 200 mg (which works-he’d given me samples) Medicaid turned down. In Sweden I had a prescribpion I took onece a day, and it stopped my enflamation, period. So now in the USA I take Meloxicam 7.5 mg…which I may as well throw down the toliet for all the good it does.
I think the President needs a public policy opinion poll…to go to the public and find out what it wants and needs. We will tell him. But, we Seniors are really tired. We have a prescription program thrown at us from Bush…which you need a lawyer to interpurt for you. Medicare costs a portion of your Social Security and then you pay for an independent insurance company on top of that. Sweden has higher taxes, yes, but they saved my life 2x in the hospital. Three weeks in intensive care…my bill was $125.00 for meals. I’m on Medicaid because of Reganeconomics..lost my job, too old – 50 – to get a new one, had to work Office Temps…no insurance, no vacations…etc. You can imagine when I went to Sweden and how medically happy I was. And, when my doctor prescribed a drug for me – he knew me, he knew how much pain I was in – not like here…I get a prescription from a group of people (who do not know me, nor my pain) and who are not licenced practioners…Not, fair, not God’s ways I really think that the “other fellow” took over this country and is working very hard to destroy all Obama’s good. I agree with all the man says…and I think a public opinion poll–one that is not biased would certainly prove that to the whole USA. GO OBAMA!!!!!

A lot of economists are saying that the higher deficits that this plan represents will cause inflation to rise making the dollar worth half its current value. Is this ok with you?
Posted by: Sam
A lot of economists? eh
were those the same guys who said everything was peachy keen with the economy around July 08?

“… I have to ask —what’s your answer?”
Simply delusional. Maybe Obama needs needs to hire a translator, watch ABC news, do a press conference with Tapper, and listen to C-SPAN before he asks this question. This is the most juvenile argumentative form I remember hearing from a supposedly “nuanced” President. The statement is evidence that he is the most partisan President ever, when he admits that he is unable to comprehend or identify the arguments of opponents to his policies. How can there be bi-partisanship without acknowledging Republicans.
I guess opponents of his policies don’t deserve any “empathy”, nowadays that’s just a legal term…

They’ll do anything to increase the U.S. Federal debt (especially War, Health Care, and Infrastructure). A big problem is that credit can grow on a whim now that it is no longer backed by anything (since 1971, see Gold Standard on Wikipedia). Even worse, the Federal Reserve has the fortune of creating as much money as it wants out of thin air, which is also the international reserve currency. And even worse, the Federal Reserve, which is a private entity, creates money at ZERO cost to itself (i.e. they just go a computer and enter a dollar amount to create in its bank account), then LENDS the money to the U.S. Government AT INTEREST. The Government (i.e. the American people) has to give real money to this private cartel of banks for their “service” of creating money out of thin air. The Government (i.e. the American people) is truly the loser in this system. Andrew Jackson (who was almost assassinated) eliminated the private central bank in 1833, but it just popped back up under the Aldrich-Vreeland Act and the Federal Reserve Act in 1913, immediately after Woodrow Wilson was elected. Wilson’s political opponent had also promised to sign the same Act, which was under a different name, if he were to get elected. The international bankers gave themselves once again control over the American monetary system without paying a penny. JFK started Silver-backed currency, then got assassinated a couple of months later. The Federal Reserve has never been audited, and Goldman Sachs, the leader of the banking cartel, truly rules the world… for now. Pelosi, Obama, Bush, Cheney, and most others in DC (except Ron Paul) are just spokespeople for the Federal Reserve.

“if we don’t provide a reasonable way everyone can afford health insurance.”
But thats not what this is. This is health insurance paid for by other people. Those that cannot afford insurance are being covered by people who do pay their own insurance. At some point, when are people responsible for themselves? Most of these people get 3k back at the end of the year in their tax return, why not have the government just keep that and put them on health insurance? It should be a safety net, not a system for all. And health insurance for a family can start around 400 buck a month. If your family goes to the doctor twice a year, for a 60 dollar visit and 100 bucks in prescriptions, I wouldnt buy insurance either.
Basic healthcare should be everyones responsbility, catastrophic health care should be insured. How we insure that doesn’t have to be an all or nothing approach. How about ambulatory care, emergency care, become government/state programs just like police and fire. But day to day, or long term treatment, be the responsibilty of the individual?
What weighs down the system in other countries is the abuse of the system. The system always has the best intentions, but it is abused. Germany just instituted a Co-pay because the system is out of control with abuse. When people have to take money out of their pocket and pay for their care, they have far more appreciation of it, and shop around for the best price for the best care. Thats what is missing, that is why the our system is expensive. Well one of the reasons, I have a post below where I think we could do more.

Lydia – You said “you are ignoring that of the 85% of Americans with health insurance, many of them are underinsured. That is why half of all bankruptcies are from medical bills, even thought the majority of those individuals had health insurance.”
Think about the hard facts there is no way that you will have 100% insurance, there will always be a point where your insurance will not pay for a procedure/medicine. Most states have a state required minimum for your auto insurance, this is a minimum and you could conceivably reach a point where you need more than the insurance policy will pay. Medical insurance is the same way, you pay for a set benefit package, the more benefits the more you pay in premiums. What you want is to have 100% coverage no matter what and you expect the government to pay for it.
So where does the money come from for the healthcare which you say is so badly needed? I won’t discuss the requirement for healthcare I just want to know where the funding is coming from, remember that on more than one occasion Dear Leader has said the country is broke.
And yes, I’m in the 85% who is happy with his healthcare but dreading the day when I will be forced into Medicare which is a poorly run GOVERNMENT HEALTHCARE program. If they haven’t made Medicare and Medicaid work over the past 40+ years what makes you think that all of a sudden they can come up with a program which is successful.

For those in the party of NO who oppose a public health-care system like the one in Canada, let’s see if you say the same thing when you turn 78 years old. Not fair? Okay, let’s make it 75 then. Sounds like a bad joke? Well it’s not a joke at all.

Jim, most of us who oppose universal single-payer (govt) health insurance also opposed the bailouts. And we are mostly not opposed to helping those who cannot afford basic insurance to gain access to it– we just oppose the public option. For example, I support government- subsidized health insurance or tax rebates where appropriate for those who make too much to qualify for Medicaid or are too old for SCHIP. I support pools for purchasing private insurance, so that individuals and small businesses can get the same sort of deals large employers now enjoy. I do not, however, support a single-payer plan or anything that opens the door to a future single-payer plan.

By the way networks such as CNN and FOX News only post little details about health reform benefits, funding and costs to simplify the debate when the real situation is more complex, because if the solutions required easy consessions and changes, then there would be no such health care crisis. Networks only post specific opinions of reporters and analysts who make opinions of pundits and political analysts who make personal opinions due to personal biases, and thus the debate can be easily controlled by repeating a few myths. Thus TV networks don’t provide actual viable reforms that truly cut health care costs with reform comprehesively as well as be adequately funded, but only pieces of fact and personal opinions about a complex issue that can give false impressions on people who don’t know much about all the full in and outs of the issue. Before looking to anyone advocating for any position, look at all sides of the argument, and if not then stay out of the argument and let those who know the facts decide the most informed, cost-effective decisions that will actually work and not be a waste of legislative time. C-SPAN also presents statements of opinions many times of officials as well as dry unfiltered positions of officials but these positions are not always made out of understanding all of the parts of complex debate. Look up all sides before ripping one side with myths or lies that dominate and delay effective legislation on health care reform!!

Nightline (ABC) has long ago betrayed its journalistic integrity even so far back as the campaign trail and this interview for tomorrow’s show is no different. My personal belief is that the answer to the healthcare crisis is in the free market. Tell people that paying $7.00 for inpatient aspirin tablets is not the final answer – a Nurse can – for perhaps $1.00 per elevator trip, go to Walgreens next door to buy aspirin for an overpriced $7.00 a bottle.
For the last 4 months I have worked for the nation’s largest COBRA administrator, and everyone calls to say that the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act is “Obama’s Subsidy” for people who were laid off and who are expected in normal conditions to pay 100% of the charges by insurance companies for continued healthcare coverage that they experienced under a Group Health Plan while at work. It is not “Obama’s Subsidy,” and in fact it is the former employer – not the government who is expected to pick up the 65% of the former employee’s Group Health Plan premiums. The fact that the general public does not realize it goes to the burden of the former employer, and not the government is the start of a clue of the entire deception of the Obama Administation’s goal to hide the fact that corporations are evil, and government equals Messianic salvation. Yes, employers can claim tax deductions on their 1099′s, but in fact this creates a cash flow crisis within the corpporations, and the result, in fact, is the predictable and manifest higher unemployment numbers.

Anthony, I don’t believe I will be taking the advice of one that seems to have no concept of how to make a point;being as you repeat the same argument and act as if it were a separate point. Although I do respect your freedom to speak.
I have been a Republican my entire life. I still am and I have worked for the Bush and McCain campaign along with donating more time and money than most people in this country ever have. I feel the Republican party is falling out of touch with mainstream Americans more every day. Universal Health Care is socialized medicine, just as our education system is socialized education.
When it comes to taking care of the health of our citizens, why would anyone object unless they have alterior motives like being in the pocket of big insurance? England and Canada seem to be able to make health care for their citizens available and financially viable. Why can’t the most powerful country on the planet do the same?
To refute your comment I think you should know that President Obama has recently stated that anyone who does not wish to have health care as an individual will NOT be fined for it. So everyone still has the right to participate or not. Although one will not realize how much he or she needs health care until he or she needs health care.
I towed the line on health care for a long time before I realized the ignorance in not caring for our people. However, I had to learn the hard way. I played hockey my entire life, including representing my country on the United States Jr. Team. I also worked 80 hours a week for ten years once my career in hockey ended at a major Division I College due to a severe back injury. I wanted to continue to work but it got to the point where I would return to work after a surgery, be able to work for six months and end up under the knife again. This ended a very promising work career and the potential for me to get any job in the future.
Now, since after 18 months after I had to leave work for physical reasons, I tried to purchase every insurance I could and money was no option. However, there are no insurance companies out there that will cover me due to my preexisting conditions. There is a state insurance option that is available as a last resort for people like me, but there are several problems with it.
First of all, they put an 18 month preexisting condition limit on all of my doctor bills, which put a $16,000 financial burden on me. Secondly, they refuse to cover the medications I need which costs me $2500 a month. I make a decent amount of money due to my life insurance policy that I put money in my entire life, but I don’t know of many people that can afford $2500 a month for medication. Therefore, I have to life in miserable pain and because I cannot have the proper treatments done, I will most likely never be able to walk again.
In short, there are hundreds of thousands of people in the United States like me – ashamed, demoralized and desperate. I am in favor of fiscal conservatism, a powerful military and low taxes. But if the government offers me a health plan that will allow me to purchase it and cover me for the necessary treatments and medications I need, ignoring my preexisting conditions, I have no problem paying whatever premium they see fit to charge.
Only the ignorant who do not see the suffering people in this country as people can be so obtuse;a country that is known around the world for it’s generosity. I believe in the constitution, yet I believe our founders would be baffled by our lack of assistance for those who truly need it. And I can finally say, with a whole heart and no reservations, that for the first time in my life, unless the Republican Party has a change of heart, I will never vote for a Republican candidate again until they get on board and pass a National Health Care Plan that can aid the suffering, the poor, the weak, the huddled masses who come here or have come here, yearning to be free. Freedom isn’t free and the pursuit of happiness will never be complete until all citizens of this great country can be bretheren, truly loving thy neighbor, caring about one another and ensuring that we are all healthy enough to pursue our American Dream.