President Obama Joins With McCain to Eliminate Raptor Fighter Jets

While I applaud Mssrs. McCain and Obama for their fiscal restraint (a trait not often witnessed inside of the DC beltway), production of these planes provide REAL jobs, not the type of jobs The One has touted in his failed “stimulus” package.
BTW, $1.75B is 0.22% of the funds ($787B) appropriated within the failed “stimulus” package.

tjp,
FYI: “Spending the $1.75 billion on seven more Raptors, the president wrote, will ‘waste valuable resources that should be more usefully employed to provide our troops with the weapons that they actually do need.’”
Does money spent for the military but on other projects somehow kill jobs? Or are the jobs that the 1.75Bn spent elsewhere create not “REAL”? That’s your implication.

Why not use the same money to make weapons our armed services actually need at the same facilities and by the same people who built the Raptors = Win/Win!

If Obama had his way our troops would be using soda straws and plastic swords to fight with. We can sell the F-22 to Israel/France/The UK/Holland and Germany not to mention others and provide thousands of jobs to Americans. But know let’s just kill the program and print more worthless money. Obama is a joke

Also, how is the stimulus plan a failure? None of the measurables were supposed to be evident until early 2010. It is only 5 months since the thing passed! Do you think billion dollar projects are planned, competed for, contracted for and built in 5 months?

Why is allowing the production of these planes any different from providing stimulus to the American economy? It is the wrong time to make these kinds of cuts.

The US should buy at least another 63 raptors,all the banking institutions that recieved bail-out should pay.[goldman-sachs et-al]

John McCain is a responsible leader who is wise to team up with the president to speak out against this wasteful spending. He believes in true bipartisanship– finding common ground where possible, not simply strong arming a political opponent to get in line with what you want. We moderates are glad to see such efforts and wish there were more of them.
Yes, airplane manufacture does provide real, substantial jobs. However, the way the manufacturing of these airplanes is spread over 40 states and 40 congressional districts is inefficient and done to maintain political support for the contract, not to built the planes as efficiently and cost-effectively as possible. McCain has long kept a sharp eye on such maneuvers. When military spending is needed, he says so loud and clear, and when it is wasteful, he says that, too. I am proud to have voted for him.

I agree with JJ,if they won’t buy more Raptors for US then they should cancel the export restriction and allow LM to sell 500+ to the allied nations.

If the Pentagon deems that we have enough already, or will have enough w/ the existing contract, then so be it. Why build more than we need just for the sake of doing so. I’m never in favor of spending government money for the sake of it, especially to build something that the purchaser really doesn’t need, want or desire. It’s a waste. If it were just Obama wanting this cut – rather than w/ McCain – I’d see it as simply a political move, but it seems legit (well, as legit as any government decision can get I guess).
Besides, I would presume we could build them up rather quickly if we ever truly need them in the future. Like in WWII.
And sure, compared to the porkulus package passed by the libs, this is a drop in the bucket, but to me, a tax dollar wasted is a tax dollar wasted. If you are going to spend our money, spend it on things we need (like armor for the Hummers??).

moderate,
Your claim aboutt WHY the component parts are spread all over shows an incredible lack of understand about the manufacturing of any complex product, mcuh less one of the the single most sophisticated machines ever built.
Try looking at ANY large machine built anywhere in the world. A company who is tasked with building that big product is not usually capable of producing every single component needed.
This is why niche markets exisit is the first place! Get A clue!
The shame here is not wether ot not a few more of these planes are absoultely “needed”. The real shame is that literally tohusands of jobs will be lost by not funding this plane.
I disagree with McCain here completely. I appreciate his stance, but given the hundreds of billions were are spending with very questionable results, at this time, spending 1.75 Billion to keep thousands employed is damn good deal!
Some one would be making the President eat those words….
Spending the $1.75 billion on seven more Raptors, the president wrote, will “waste valuable resources that should be more usefully employed to provide our troops with the weapons that they actually do need.”
The statement is wrong, because the 1.75 Billion was REMOVED, not re-allocated!
If this is considered wasteful Mr. President, then what do you think people with common sense think of spending 787 BILLION for virtually no tangible results at all?
So much for being for those middle class workers!
I am sure those 22,000 people and their families appreciate that the President does nto think they are worth 1.75 Billion dollars considering his mad rush to SPEND hundreds upon hundreds of BILLIONS in support of HIS agenda!

‘Try’,
Let me explain it to you…the President himself said, with the ‘stimulus’, unemployment wouldn’t go above 8%…he said it will return $1.50 for every dollar spent.
Did you recall him saying the ‘stimulus’ would not be effective in 2009, therefore, we need to pass it immediately?’
Could you provide the link or the quote in which he stated the ‘stimulus’ wouldn’t do much good this year…that we’d have to wait until next year?
It is pure spin from the White House and you are gullible.

Obama, the Second Coming,
Right now, given all we have beeen doing to “save” jobs, create jobs, calling bills jobs bills when they clearly are not…
This is an incredibly STUPID thing to do. Interesting that Chuckie Shummer is not defending this little expenditure with Americans dont care.
I am pretty sure that those 22,000 people an their families care a GREAT deal. I am sure that after watching Obama & Congress deal BILLIONS out to auto companies that failed anyways, that they will just “suck it up” and take it on the chin so everyone can say….”see we saved the taxpayers 1.75 Billion dollars!!!!!!”
Then they get to watch the gov’t spew billions like a an engine with a blown gasket and as the Great “Stimulator” oozes forth all that money they watch as it does nothing for them!
How many of those 22,000 do you think are going to find a job on one those so-called “shovel-ready” infrrastructure projects?

So conservatives think we’re supposed to use tax money to prop up an industry making equipment that is expensive to buy and maintain; equipment for the Defense Department that the Defense Department does not want, let alone need; equipment that according to Gates is already beginning to be made obsolete by the F35. But why would the DoD (remember that Gates is a Republican appointed by Bush, not really what you’d call an “Obamaniac” or a “Socialist”), and both sides of the Senate AFC, know better than Lockheed Martin what the DoD should purchase from Lockheed Martin? A conservative wrote on this board “But, my point is, allocating spending towards these existing jobs is a much better bet to create/”save” jobs than funneling funds through inefficient (and in some cases, corrupt) federal, state, and local bureaucracies.” Right, Lockheed, Boeing, et al, they’re never corrupt! They’re never ‘inefficient’. Why not throw our money away on an incredibly wealthy industry already completely subsidized by government in return for soon to be out of date technology we don’t want and can’t afford? I don’t get it, conservatives sound like anarchists when Democrats are in power, they sound like communists when Republicans are in power. Industries that are propped up with subsidies while at the same time being deregulated by Republicans for 20 out of 28 years are a major part of our economic woes today. Let’s not be conservatives and learn from our mistakes.

JJ and Valiant…Can’t sell classified programs to foreign countries in the name of saving jobs…

randyg…Ummm I believe you have defense contractors confused with our “the drinks are on me” present administration…you ain’t seen nothing yet, wait until Obama’s health/welfare program kicks in, but then again some who feed off of government sponsored social programs, because they are too lazy to work or retrain, won’t be complaining except at the defense budget…

“Do you think billion dollar projects are planned, competed for, contracted for and built in 5 months?”
————————————-
Do you understand what “shovel-ready” MEANS?????????? Just to bring you up to speed….Those projects have ALREADY been thru the planning & competing stages, they are READY to be awarded!
Some actually have, but here is the kicker….since we have such deep oversight, no one is actually keeping track of how many new hires if any these companies were making. If they were, I guarantee you we would all be hearing about it!
By the way, since we were told it HAD to passed NOW, before they even had a chance to understand the real state of the economy (Damn that Biden guy when he lets the truth slip out!)
So, now the “revised” exstimates are how many jobs THIS year?….How many next year?
By the way “genius”, how many of those F22 workers do you think are going to get jobs in the construction companies that will be building the “shovel-ready” projects?
So, lets spend hundreds of billions more dollars now to try to re-employ those we cold have kept employed with a “paltry” 1.75 Billion!

Danita,
So your ok with tossing all those jobs to the side in our current economic conditions? Your cool spending hundreds of Billions in hopes it may help the economy, but you dont want to spend 1.75B to keep 22,000 people working!
I am sure those people & thier families appreciate your liberal concerns!
So typical – Do as I say, Not As I Do!!!!!

What I don’t understand about this arguement is how 7 planes equals 22,000 jobs. They are still building 187 planes. It cannot require 22,000 people to build those 7 planes. Those 22,000 people would all be working on all of the planes. Cutting a little bit of excess from the bill goes to help pay for those huge stimulus plans already passed by the former and current administration.
If Lockhead Martin cuts 22,000 people just because it did not get a contract for 7 additional planes, that is Lockhead Martin’s cross to bear. This is a responsible thing to do, especially when the spending is going so high. If you spend more in some area’s you have to spend less in other area’s.
All you fiscal watch dogs must understand that concept at least. Crying like the sky is falling over 7 planes and people saying that will directly result in 22,000 jobs lost is disingenious at worst and nieve at best.
These 7 planes are probably a couple months worth of work and they would ideally be the last 7 planes of the project so by the time the previous 187 planes are built there could conceiveably be more money or different projects for those workers. It doesn’t have to be all doom and gloom. But I guess then you don’t get to lambast Obama if you don’t see it all that way.

“What I don’t understand about this arguement is how 7 planes equals 22,000 jobs. They are still building 187 planes. It cannot require 22,000 people to build those 7 planes.” Posted by: ZS California | Jul 14, 2009 4:36:14 PM
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Doesn’t make sense to me either ZS, and Mike’s post doesn’t explain how 7 planes equals 22,000 jobs being lost.

Think Hover Crafts and Cars!

danita…Without going too far out on a limb, the F-22 is anything BUT a piece of military crap. You are only displaying your ignorance on a subject you know absolutely nothing about….

“the F-22 is anything BUT a piece of military crap….” Posted by: Parallex View | Jul 14, 2009 6:02:08 PM
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“The pricey aircraft have never flown in combat and have had frequent maintenance problems.”
The F-22 has not received universally favorable reviews. And I stand by my original statement . ..
“I don’t not support the use of Government’s money on expensive pieces of military crap. If John McCain is against this plane, and he being a strong military supporter and a former pilot, something seems definitely to be wrong.”

“Also don’t forget the businesses that provides goods and services in these communities: restaurants, gas stations, etc., etc. that are part of the “multiplier effect” inherent within economies”
Funny, you didn’t give a crap about the millions of jobs attached to the auto industry in your zeal to stick it to the unions.
So are you a complete fraud in real life or just when posting for the GOP?

Maybe if MC Cain Had been flying a stealthy, super fast airplane like Raptor he wouldn’t have had the misfortune of being shot down; now, he wants other young American pilots to suffer his fate. I hope Obama doesn’t think like this old dummy.