President Obama: “What We’re Doing Is Hard”

It is hard work “TANKING” a whole economy and making sure the people are eating from your bake sale only!!
Too bad the media won’t do their job properly and “REPORT” the news!!
It does seem that ABC is waking up after the wreck happened. (too bad)

And Bush was mocked when he said Iraq was hard. Where is the mockery when Obama uses the same language? Of course it is hard work. Something Obama has never experienced before.

“Crack Heads” was he talking about the Democrat leadership?

The absolute best thing for Republicans to do is keep their mouths shut.
Instead, they have so demonized Obama and his health care plan as to lose public support and give the president an easy target to blame and attack.

Obama delays Guantanamo report…
White House misses deadline on spending cuts report…
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UPDATE: Administration Delays Key Budget Report…
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Poll: Public losing trust in Obama…
Things looking a little bad for Obama.

Beware of the Health Care Plan. Senior Citizens and newborns will not get the care they are now receiving thru private insurances. Sure it will be great in the beginning, but when the government sees it cannot afford the extra burden because we have no money (China is buying our debts)then they will start cutting care. Will Obama and the rest of congress go on this health care plan. If they will then I will have complete faith they know what they are doing. If they keep their coverage they have now then that only tell the whole story. It’s okay for us but not for them.

Welcome to the real world President Obama. What would be hard is crafting a bipartisan solution that solves real issues with health-care. What would be hard for you as a socialist is recognizing that healthcare is not a “right”, and that we have no obligation to provide healthcare to individuals that are not citizens. What would be hard is keeping your promises to those that had such faith in your oratory. What would be hard is telling the truth about the impact your programs will have on minorities who may not see an increase in taxes but will see the American dream taken from them with loss of jobs and no growth in our economy. You haven’t done anything hard yet Mr President!

How will this be paid for? Goldman Sachs got all the money.
Posted by: Broke | Jul 21, 2009 10:13:51 AM
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Reports this morning alleging that the eeeevil corporations that got bailout money are spending it lobbying. Will Obama address this?

jhm539 said he likes obamas’ clear command of the issues.
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Please allow me to clue you that he is only saying what his teleprompter is telling him to say.
No more …………No less!!
(and without the uhs, ers, ums and the fake stoic looks to the left and right; chin up like Lenin did!!

“We had this beautiful house, and there was a fire.”
Using arson as a metaphor? Sam Webb National Chair of the Communist Party USA would be proud:
“…As for our radicalism, we should be as radical as reality itself. And reality strongly suggests that our main task is to bring the weight of the working class and other democratic forces to bear on the reform process with the aim of deepening its anti-corporate content and direction.
“…Months ago it was said that the downturn could be “L-shaped” rather than “V-shaped.” In other words, the crisis begins with a steep decline in economic activity followed by long period of economic stagnation (As Lenin said, “the worse the better.”).
“I suspect that this is what will happen, thus making sustained government and people’s intervention an imperative. In my view this should take at least three forms:
“First, more economic stimulus: the economy is underperforming and nearly 30 million workers are unemployed or underemployed and that number hasn’t peaked yet.
“Second, restructuring is imperative. The old economic model that rested on bubble economics, cheap labor, financial manipulation and speculation, deregulation, capital outsourcing, environmental degradation, and so forth, has to be replaced by a new model that expands and restructures the productive base and is “people and nature” friendly.
“Finally, the economy has to be democratized. The wizards of Wall Street and inside the Beltway failed miserably, in fact, so miserably those economic decisions that affect the welfare of millions shouldn’t rest in their hands.
“…In the meantime, the struggle for immediate public sector jobs and relief should command our attention…”
This is why the press was negligent in exposing to the American people Obama’s connections to people like Bill Ayers, Bernadette Dorn and Frank Marshall Davis.
“Art, as far as it is able, follows nature, as a pupil imitates his master…” Dante

American Infidel:”Please allow me to clue you that he is only saying what his teleprompter is telling him to say.
No more …………No less!!”
What a crock. Obama has spent hours answering un-rehearsed and un-prompted questions at press conferences and interviews (to the point he was taking flak for too many press conferences!). On at least one occasion, the questions were even asked by Republicans (remember McCain’s good gotcha about the helicopters?).
You appear to be a very ill informed partisan if you are completely ignorant of the hours of actual policy discussion from Obama on record. And no, I don’t have a problem with “uhs” “ums” or his “boring professorial style” – I appreciate the content and depth of though he presents when answering policy questions.
It should noted that Obama is not unique in this – Bush Sr and Clinton also had pretty deep understandings of policy. Bush Jr was the outlier.

Broke:”How will this be paid for? Goldman Sachs got all the money.”
How can we pay for our current system? Do you understand that the US spends over twice as much as the average first world nation on health care? How can we afford NOT to adopt at least some of the proven health care models that have been shown to halve medical spending while providing equivalent levels of health?
Ask a small business owner about which is more affordable: The current 20% per year increase in insurance costs, or the government providing an option that is not profit driven.

“What We’re Doing Is Hard”
But Mr. Obama has been amazingly effective, although it has cost a lot of money. Who would have thought that in this information age, someone with as high a public profile could be so successful at concealing the facts of his early life?

jiva…our health care system is ALREADY THE ENVY OF FREE WORLD…OR DO YOU MEAN THE “SOCIALIST FREE WORLD”

jhw 539..all great intentions… HOWEVER THE CBO AND THE MAYO CLINIC SAYS THE PREZ IS FULL OF BULL AND THE NUMBERS ARE SIGNIFICANTLY HIGHER AND THE CARE WILL BE NO BETTER…what dont you get about this…this is no savings just another wealth transfer to those who bought the obama free lunch promise.

Complicating the situation is Obama’s decision to spend sums estimated in the hundreds of thousands of dollars to fight cases seeking the release of a state birth certificate that would put the questions to rest .

jhw 539…if the cbo and mayo says the numbers will be even higher…this would make us even LESS competive under THE PREZS PLAN. FOR AN ENGINEER YOUR LOGIC APPEARS CIRCULAR.

You naysayer republicans are funny! You are all over this “how are we going to pay for healthcare, it’s going to cost millions!” Where were you all when Bush was spending millions on the Iraq crap? No body seemed to mind that one. What ever happened to the 9 million that has never been accounted for? Where were you when Bush got his medicare prescription legislation voted in (at 3am) that cost us millions with no way to pay for it?? It’s not really funny, it’s pathetic.

…….and please shut up about the birth certificate issue. Don’t you realize how silly it makes you appear??

What is unique about American health care?
It is founded “in individual rights and limited constitutional government. Usually, the argument for health care changes carefully avoid this moral and political context entirely.”
A New York Times economist “…has stated that the only obstacles to universal health care are outmoded concepts of ‘ideology and personal choice.’”
“He is quite correct. Get rid of the ideas of individual rights and freedom of choice, and you remove all restraints on government power to rule individual lives. (That, itself, is an ideology.)”
“Without this context, the debate is reduced to dueling pragmatists whose primary concern is who holds the reigns of political power. The result is a choice between Socialism and State Capitalism, neither of which offer much hope for health care.”
“One side of the debate is condescending toward the unique American system and most things American.”
“They avoid American principles in their admiration for socialism and collectivism elsewhere. The argument runs that America is the only industrialized country without ‘national’ (i.e., government) health care.”
“They do not mention that we are also the only country founded on an ideology based on inalienable rights and the U.S. Constitution.”
“The other side of the argument is too often represented by those who claim admiration for all things American, but are often more interested in getting political credit for paternalistic handouts than principles…” ~Richard Ralston

–Where were you all when Bush was spending millions on the Iraq crap? No body seemed to mind that one.–
Especially the Democrats who kept voting to fund the conflict again and again.
But luckily, with Obama in the WH and a Democratically controlled Congress, US policy has changed and the troops have come home from Afghanistan and Iraq.

Hey network, nothing was said about Obama “owning” anything. The point I was trying to make was that Bush got his agendas passed that cost millions on the taxpayers backs and added to the deficit and no republican ever complained as much about spending as they are now! Quit trying to spin my comment. I know it’s hard for your species to do so……….

“‘Facilitating.’…Facilitating a discussion that solves these problems.”
“Facilitating” = “Cracking heads, Chicago style”

A blogger from Maine asked President Obama:
“Is this true? Will people be able to keep their insurance and will insurers be able to write new policies even though H.R. 3200 is passed?”
President Obama replied:
“You know, I have to say that I am not familiar with the provision you are talking about.”
Yup, cram it through, don’t read it, the President didn’t.

“…the effort had to be funded or we were not “supporting our troops”….remember that propaganda?”
Had to or what?

Today another million Americans in the waiting lines in hospital emergency rooms because they don’t have health care coverage – costing and overburdening the system.

Not as hard as dying of a treatable disease because some government bureaucrat decided you didn’t deserve medical care.

Amazing. You actually believe that when he took questions from Congressional Republicans, including John McCain, they were all in on it and the answers were rehearsed. Talk about not living in reality.
Posted by: jhw539 | Jul 21, 2009 11:27:24 AM
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The Land of Hope & Change: “The other side does it, too!”
Gosh, we thought He was different…

danita…so if they have guvmt health insurance guess what…THEY WILL STILL BE WAITING IN LINE OVERBURDENING THE SYSTEM….REAL DOCTORS WILL SEE PEOPLE WITH REAL INSURANCE>>>THE ONE WHRRE THE DOCTOR GETS PAID. uNTIL THE CBO AND MAYO CLINIC ARE REBUFFED AS FRAUDS THE OBAMA DOG DOESNT HUNT.

tjp612 . …
Good grief, I didn’t count them all! It’s a statement about how hospitals and emergency rooms are burdened by the large numbers of people who are showing up there because they have no where else to go. I’ll try to get an exact number for you.

Sheesh, this guy needs to stop insulting the intelligence of the American people by constantly getting on the tube pushing a bill he has no clue about what is in it. The American people are speaking out loudly against this bill to their representatives and those reps know their job is going to be on the line if this junk passes. Obama can call it “playing politics” all he wants to, but for a REAL change, the representatives are FINALLY starting to listen to their constiutents.

Former Mayor Ed Koch, who has been recovering for the past month from a heart valve replacement and quadruple bypass surgery, underwent gall bladder surgery Monday morning. Koch is 84. Would he have had all this surgery if he was on the Public Option? Or would he have been told to take a pain pill and accept his fate?

RYANC…THE CBO AND MAYO CLINIC ARE NOT RIGHT WINGERS.THEY ARE NOT LYING..THE BILL DOES NOT FIX ANYTHING AND ONLY MAKES IT WORSE…KIND OF LIKE THE STIMULUS BILL AND CAP AND TAX BILL. THE DEMS ARE DESTROYING THEMSELVES IN FRONT OF THE WORLD WHILE THEY HOLD A SUPER MAJORITY. HOW ABOUT SOME REAL IDEAS TO GET PEOPLE WORKING?

danita…here in california many doctors will not accept medicare medicaid because of the low rate of pay. they even post it at their office. its afree market out there….or at least it used to be.doctors incur 200k to 400k in debt to get there medical licenses…they want to earn money to pay it off.

a couple of big white elephants control health care costs…illegal immigrants and tort reform.those two items make up most of the cost and yet they are ignored by pelosi reid and obama…because it is ABOUT POLITCS mr o.

–Good grief, I didn’t count them all!–
Obama/Democrats don’t do “counting” either.

jennifert7 . …
“he (President Obama) is incompetent and the American people know it.”
No jennifert, we saw incompetence before and we know the difference, even if you don’t.

The president defended the August timeline, saying that “the deadline’s not being set by me. The deadline’s being set by the American people.”
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Really? What American people? Has he seen the polls or is he just dishonest?
What’s the hurry, Mr. President? This legislation will not be implemented until 2013 – FOUR YEARS FROM NOW! What’s the rush?

danita..i dont have numbers but you can pick any group od docs in california and many of them will not accept anything other than private insurance or cash. i know as i just went through 6 weeks of treatment for MRSA and had to chose a specialist and of the 10 names i was given about half would not accept medical medicaid as indicated on their advertisments

In fact, the blogger who has pushed poor Nataline Sarkisyan’s story to the forefront calls it “murder by spreadsheet”. She is a single-payer advocate. What she’ll call it when government denies service, I have no idea. But I don’t think the term or the Nataline story add to the debate.

“Afraid to answer this ‘hypothetical?’ I know. Much easier to deflect and cut-n-paste your Cigna story.”
Yes why focus on things like reality when we can deal with right wing fantasy.

ryanc…what do yo think about the cbo estimates and the mayo clincs retort? the point being if the obama option costs more and does less why would anyone vote for this? he has a real problem on this and it cant be spun away…hence the blue dog dems rebuff.

“But I don’t think the term or the Nataline story add to the debate.”
Better to lie and tell people grandpa is gonna die huh?
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No. Lying isn’t good.
OK, so use Nataline’s story. Do you know that a public option would have paid for her procedures? Remember, the (non-profit)hospital chose not to do it at their own cost, although they do other life-saving procedures with no repayment.

I see the American College of Emergency Physicians advocates for universal health care coverage.

Yes why focus on things like reality when we can deal with right wing fantasy.
Posted by: Ryan C | Jul 21, 2009 1:39:13 PM
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Fantasy? Obama says it’s already being done. Medicare and Medicaid are govt programs, right? Why wouldn’t he want to continue the process already in place? Private insureres doing it too? If so, his plan has to be competitive, right?
“I don’t think that we can make judgments based on people’s ’spirit.’ Uh, that would be, uh, a pretty subjective decision to be making. I think we have to have rules that, uh, say that, uh, we are going to provide good quality care for all people. End-of-life care is one of the most difficult sets of decisions that we’re going to have to make. But understand that those decisions are already being made in one way or another. If they’re not being made under Medicare and Medicaid, they’re being made by private insurers. At least we can let doctors know — and your mom know — that you know what, maybe this isn’t going to help. Maybe you’re better off, uhh, not having the surgery, but, uhh, taking the painkiller.”

I suppose right wingers are outraged that this family decided to sue.
Posted by: Ryan C | Jul 21, 2009 1:13:17 PM
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At would the family been able to sue on the Public Plan? Can you sue the government? Will you be able to sue the Public Plan and/or its participants? Is it in the bill? Does anyone know? We should probably know before we vote, right?

MayBee . ..
My family in Canada being treated for skin cancer and hip replacement (among many other things) not only have not been denied serice (as the fear mongers tout), they report that the treatment they get is excellent. A world-class hip replacement, world class oncologists and dermatologists, and so on.

see new york time op ed piece on the “liberals suicide march” and how they have misread their mandate. this is where we are after 6 months. what made bill clinton great is that he retooled midstream and adopted a conservative agenda. may i suggest that the dems revist history rather than rewrite it. i pray that obama does the same for the good of the country or were looking at another jimmy carter.

tjp612 . ..
“I see a coalition of seventeen state medical associations and three specialty physicians’ groups oppose universal health care coverage.”
tjp I’m always interested in learning – please provide names for this coalition and the speciality groups.

“At would the family been able to sue on the Public Plan?”
The suits involving Medicare seem to be health organizations suing on behalf of patients.
“Can you sue the government?”
You can now.

“And those kinds of decisions between doctors and patients, and making sure that our incentives are not preventing those good decision, and that — that doctors and hospitals all are aligned for patient care, that’s something we can achieve.”
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Thanks for posting this Ryan. The unprincipled cherry picking of the antiObama types gets really tired, really fast.
Petty, hypocritical and unprincipled.

MayBee ….
What does it tell you?

“What does that tell you, Ryan and Danita?”
It tells me why go thru a right wing filter when you can go to the actual interview.
OBAMA: …I actually think that the tougher issue around medical care — it’s a related one — is what you do around things like end-of-life care–
LEONHARDT: Yes, where it’s $20,000 for an extra week of life.
OBAMA: Exactly. And I just recently went through this. I mean, I’ve told this story, maybe not publicly, but when my grandmother got very ill during the campaign, she got cancer; it was determined to be terminal. And about two or three weeks after her diagnosis she fell, broke her hip. It was determined that she might have had a mild stroke, which is what had precipitated the fall.
So now she’s in the hospital, and the doctor says, Look, you’ve got about–maybe you have three months, maybe you have six months, maybe you have nine months to live. Because of the weakness of your heart, if you have an operation on your hip there are certain risks that–you know, your heart can’t take it. On the other hand, if you just sit there with your hip like this, you’re just going to waste away and your quality of life will be terrible.
And she elected to get the hip replacement and was fine for about two weeks after the hip replacement, and then suddenly just–you know, things fell apart.
I don’t know how much that hip replacement cost. I would have paid out of pocket for that hip replacement just because she’s my grandmother. Whether, sort of in the aggregate, society making those decisions to give my grandmother, or everybody else’s aging grandparents or parents, a hip replacement when they’re terminally ill is a sustainable model, is a very difficult question. If somebody told me that my grandmother couldn’t have a hip replacement and she had to lie there in misery in the waning days of her life–that would be pretty upsetting.
LEONHARDT: And it’s going to be hard for people who don’t have the option of paying for it.
OBAMA: So that’s where I think you just get into some very difficult moral issues. But that’s also a huge driver of cost, right?
I mean, the chronically ill and those toward the end of their lives are accounting for potentially 80 percent of the total health care bill out here.

“i am still curious about your views on the cbo estimates and the mayo clinic that put a fork in this bill?”
I was fine with the CBO figure.
Its a realistic assessment of costs.
And the Mayo clinic wants better pay for doctors while rationing care. The latter being a stickler for most people.
Of course that did not stop the right wing from exagerrating even that large number from the CBO.
I wonder why, is there something inherently dishonest about the right wing.

ryanc…i think there is something inherintly dishonest about any wing right or left. thats why i am an independent. do you really think nancy pelosi cares about you or me? no one has felt our pain since bill clinton who i voted for twice even though i would never leave him alone with any female i cared about.

I think doctor recommendation will likely carry far more weight than patient desire. That is how it is done now though obviously there are issues.
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But Obama isn’t talking about just doctor recommendations. He is talking about the government telling doctors what they should recommend.

Currently 85% of the American people are satisifed with their current healthcare providers. So instead of just tweaking the sytem to satisfy the needs of the other 15%, President Obama and the Left want to completely “overhaul” the entire system. “Overhaul!” That’s President Obama’s word. “Overhaul” means to dismantle in order to make repairs. So when President Obama and the Left say they just want to make the public option one of the 1,300 healthcare providers, they are not being honest with the American people. They really want to COMPLETELY OVERHAUL the system by making the federal government the sole provider of healthcare.
Do your homework and look at what will happen should the public option be implemented. If you have a company that is in business to make money…to make a profit…in order to stay in business they must make a profit. The federal government is not in business to make a profit. In fact as history has shown, it doesn’t even have to be revenue neutral…they can actually run a deficit. So here we have the President and the Left saying they want “to compete” with the private sector all the while knowing that the private sector CANNOT compete with the federal government. If the public option is cheaper and provides the same coverage why in the world would anyone stay with the private sector? They won’t! So when the public option is implemented it will eventually eliminate the private sector.

Here is a portion of the transcript of the ABC healthcare forum.
As you can see, the doctor asks how Obama can convince people they will not get every single treatment they want. Obama says only that it is important, but does nothing to explain HOW he will do it:
DR. JOHN CORBOY, NEUROLOGIST & MEDICAL PROFESSOR: Well, I think you still have to provide the appropriate care. And I think we all know that there is a significant amount of care that actually is inappropriate and unnecessary.
And the question then is — for you, Mr. President, is, what can you convince — what can you do to convince the American public that there actually are limits to what we can pay for with our American health care system?
And if there are going to be limits, who is going to design the system and who is going to enforce the rules for a system like that?
OBAMA: Well, you’re asking the right question. And let me say, first of all, this is not an easy problem. If it was easy, it would have been solved a long time ago, because we’ve talking about this for decades, since Harry Truman.
We’ve been talking about how do we provide care that is high-quality, gives people choices, and how can we come up with a uniquely American plan? Because one of the ideological debates that I think has prevented us from making progress is some people say this is socialized medicine, others say we need a completely free market system.
We need to come up with something that is uniquely American. Now what I’ve said is that if we are smart, we should be able to design a system in which people still have choices of doctors and choices of plans that makes sure that the necessary treatment is provided but we don’t have a huge amount of waste in the system. That we are providing adequate coverage for all people, and that we are driving down costs over the long term.
If we don’t drive down costs, then we’re not going to be able to achieve all of those other things. And I think that on the issue that has already been raised by the two doctors, the issue of evidence-based care, I have great confidence that doctors are going to always want to do the right thing for their patients, if they’ve got good information, and if their payment incentives are not such that it actually costs them money to provide the appropriate care.
And right now, what we have is a situation, because doctors are paid fee-for-service, and there are all sorts of rules governing how they
operate, as a consequence often times it is harder for them, more expensive for them, to do what is appropriate.
And we should change those incentive structures.

“Currently 85% of the American people are satisifed with their current healthcare providers.”
And yet a clear majority want health care reform and want the government to be a major part of it.
There is disagreement to what involvement of course.
Ahhh the fickle nature 0of the American people.

MayBee . .. again in Canada there is universal health care coverage and basically a single-payer system. The government does not tell doctors what to recommend. Doctors use their medical know how to decide on treatment for a patient.
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Yes they do, Danita. It is the basis of a national health care system. That’s also why people in Canada pushed to be able to have private, supplemental insurance after years of not being able to.
I don’t know what to say if you think it is a scare tactic to say that there are limitations the payment provided for health care in every system.
Do you think if we go to single payer here, or even a public option, people can have whatever procedure they want & that a doctor is willing to provide?

“Do you think if we go to single payer here, or even a public option, people can have whatever procedure they want & that a doctor is willing to provide?”
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Absolutely, my family in Canada can ask for whatever procedure they want and if the doctor agrees it’s appropriate – that is what happens.
And that includes a second opinion if the doctor you see doesn’t agree.
There might be the odd very rare exception to this, but in my brother’s family – nothing has been turned down.

Posted by: MayBee | Jul 21, 2009 2:49:12 PM
I see “necessary,” “adequate,” and “fee-for-service.” And of course, “change.”
So does this mean that patients will receive only “necessary” and “adequate” treatment by doctors getting paid by the hour or for a govt-determined fee?
What’s in the Plan?

You mean the best treatment assessment?
Do you think doctors shouldn’t have treatement standards?
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It depends on how the assessments are used.
Here’s how Obama addressed it in the ABC forum:
DR. ORRIN DEVINSKY, EPILEPSY SPECIALIST: Yes, in the past, politicians who have sought to reform health care have tried to limit costs by reducing tests, access to specialists, but they’ve not been good at taking their own medicine. When they or their family members get sick, they often get extremely expensive evaluations and expert care.
If a national health plan was approved and your family participated, and, President Obama, if your wife or your doctor became seriously ill, and things were not going well, and the plan physicians told you they were doing everything that reasonably could be done, and you sought out opinions from some medical leaders and major centers, and they said there’s another option that you should — should pursue, but it was not covered in the plan, would you potentially sacrifice the health of your family for the greater good of insuring millions? Or would you do everything you possibly could as a father and husband to get the best health care and outcome for your family?
OBAMA: Well, first of all, Doctor, I think it’s a terrific question, and it’s something that touches us all personally, especially
when you start talking about end-of-life care.
As some of you know, my grandmother recently passed away, which was
a very painful thing for me. ….
I think families all across America are going through decisions like that all the time. And you’re absolutely right that, if it’s my family member, it’s my wife, if it’s my children, if it’s my grandmother, I always want them to get the very best care.
But here’s the problem that we have in our current health care system, is that there is a whole bunch of care that’s being provided that every study, every bit of evidence that we have indicates may not be making us healthier.
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As you can see, he again does not answer the question.
Now, I don’t think we can have a decent health care debate unless the people developing the plan will talk very clearly about this issue.
Because, as you can see, there are people who think they will get whatever they want. And there are those who are scared they will be denied treatment.
So we should probably get that cleared up, no?

Ok, danita, your relatives can get whatever they want in Canada.
President Obama has indicated that isn’t how it’s going to work here. You might want to find out before you push for one thing and get something else entirely.

” President-elect of the Canadian Medical Association, Dr. Jeffrey Turnbull is chief of staff at the main hospital in Ottawa, Canada’s capital.
“On a recent morning, he met with several residents, a nurse and a pharmacist to review the charts of patients admitted overnight.
“Among them was Mrs. K, a chronic alcoholic. And Mr. R, with colon cancer. And Mrs. L, with a spinal injury.
“Turnbull’s team discussed each patient, ordering costly tests for several. Insurance was never mentioned.
“There was not one word today about could they afford anything,” Turnbull says. “You would have heard that in the U.S.: ‘We need to do a CAT scan. Oh, do they have insurance?’”

It’s kind of sad to see all the true believers here who are really convinced that the health care system will be better when administered even more by the government than it already is.

Hi Danita,
The ordered the expensive tests, but they will have to wait for 18 months…

“And once the competition is eliminated, what is the government’s incentive to continue in the best interest of the patient”
That same incentive Medicare has now.

And once the competition is eliminated, what is the government’s incentive to continue in the best interest of the patient? Or the doctor in that fact?
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Or the taxpayer.

“The ordered the expensive tests, but they will have to wait for 18 months…”
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Terry . . . please post wait times for these ‘expensive’ tests – wait times in Canada AND WAIT TIMES IN THE UNITED STATES.
No nonsense opinions now – post the facts for both countries.

“Mountain-bike enthusiast Suzanne Aucoin had to fight more than her Stage IV colon cancer. Her doctor suggested Erbitux—a proven cancer drug that targets cancer cells exclusively, unlike conventional chemotherapies that more crudely kill all fast-growing cells in the body—and Aucoin went to a clinic to begin treatment. But if Erbitux offered hope, Aucoin’s insurance didn’t: she received one inscrutable form letter after another, rejecting her claim for reimbursement. Yet another example of the callous hand of managed care, depriving someone of needed medical help, right? Guess again. Erbitux is standard treatment, covered by insurance companies—in the United States. Aucoin lives in Ontario, Canada.
“When Aucoin appealed to an official ombudsman, the Ontario government claimed that her treatment was unproven and that she had gone to an unaccredited clinic. But the FDA in the U.S. had approved Erbitux, and her clinic was a cancer center affiliated with a prominent Catholic hospital in Buffalo. This January, the ombudsman ruled in Aucoin’s favor, awarding her the cost of treatment. She represents a dramatic new trend in Canadian health-care advocacy: finding the treatment you need in another country, and then fighting Canadian bureaucrats (and often suing) to get them to pick up the tab.” – City Journal

Timmy . ..
As I cited in a previous post . . .
“My family in Canada can ask for whatever procedure they want and if the doctor agrees it’s appropriate – that is what happens.
“And that includes a second opinion if the doctor you see doesn’t agree.
“THERE MIGHT BE THE ODD VERY RARE EXCEPTION TO THIS, BUT IN MY BROTHER’S FAMILY – NOTHING HAS BEEN TURNED DOWN”
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You have cited one of those very rare exceptions – and you will note – in the end THE GOVERNMENT (THE GOVERNMENT-APPOINTED OMMBUDSMAN) SIDED WITH THE PATIENT.
“This January, the ombudsman ruled in Aucoin’s favor, awarding her the cost of treatment.”

You have cited one of those very rare exceptions
Posted by: danita | Jul 21, 2009 3:31:51 PM
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“government statistics on the health-care system’s problems are suddenly available. In fact, government researchers have provided the best data on the doctor shortage, noting, for example, that more than 1.5 million Ontarians (or 12 percent of that province’s population) can’t find family physicians. Health officials in one Nova Scotia community actually resorted to a lottery to determine who’d get a doctor’s appointment.” – City Journal

Posted by: Traffic Cop Timmy | Jul 21, 2009 3:22:57 PM
Ms. Aucoin should have stayed in Canada. They have a superior system.

“This privatizing trend is reaching Europe, too. Britain’s government-run health care dates back to the 1940s. Yet the Labour Party—which originally created the National Health Service and used to bristle at the suggestion of private medicine, dismissing it as “Americanization”—now openly favors privatization. Sir William Wells, a senior British health official, recently said: “The big trouble with a state monopoly is that it builds in massive inefficiencies and inward-looking culture.”
“Sweden’s government, after the completion of the latest round of privatizations, will be contracting out some 80 percent of Stockholm’s primary care and 40 percent of its total health services, including one of the city’s largest hospitals. Since the fall of Communism, Slovakia has looked to liberalize its state-run system, introducing co-payments and privatizations. And modest market reforms have begun in Germany: increasing co-pays, enhancing insurance competition, and turning state enterprises over to the private sector (within a decade, only a minority of German hospitals will remain under state control). It’s important to note that change in these countries is slow and gradual—market reforms remain controversial. But if the United States was once the exception for viewing a vibrant private sector in health care as essential, it is so no longer.” – City Journal

A couple of years ago, I met a Canadian, a rather wealth businessman. His wife, in her sixties developed breast cancer. She was cured, thank God. How was she cured? He brought her to the US and paid $80,000 in his own money. Thank God he had the money. I wonder how the average Joe handles the situation. In many cases they don’t have any option but hospice.

Timmy . .. .
Regarding ‘City Journal’ that you keep on citing. You should look at their own profile page where it states . ..
“All information on the site is provided for the entertainment of our readers, and is not to be considered as medical advice.”
Glad you’re enjoying their ‘entertainment’.

Posted by: Traffic Cop Timmy | Jul 21, 2009 3:50:04 PM
We’re going to have to raise taxes (surtax and VAT) and increase the defecit as well. Thanks again for your understanding.

40 million uninsured…10million…make over 75k and dont buy it, 10 million didnt fill out aid forms, 10million plus are illegal, and 10 million are under 34 and are invincible like my college eductaed kids. NO CRISIS HERE just plain ole MARCH TO SOCIALISM and POWER GRAB. fortunately we americans have awankened to this fraud. health care , budget deficit,stimulas that didnt, cap and tax, gitmo, afghhanistan and iraq….a whole lot of hot air.

Glad you’re enjoying their ‘entertainment’.
Posted by: danita | Jul 21, 2009 3:51:02 PM
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They write good stuff. You just don’t agree with it so you grasp at straws and make fun of them.
Maybe you should write to the author of the article and challenge him directly. I’m sure he’d welcome the opportunity.

“…cancer treatment under the Canadian health care system is world class.”
Except for people like Aucoin.
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Leuk, this rare case has been dealt with in posts below. It’s one of the few documented cases (and the government did end up sided with the patient) and this one case gets trotted out over and over again in attempts to discredit what truly is a world-class medical system.

Posted by: danita | Jul 21, 2009 4:03:51 PM
Funny, for a “rare case” lots of Canadians seem to come to the US.

Timmy . ..
All I did was quote from THEIR OWN self-described profile where they say -
“All information on the site is provided for the entertainment of our readers, and is not to be considered as medical advice”
They self define their information as ‘entertainment’ . .. self define.

“Leuk, this rare case has been dealt with in posts below.”
Translation: I’m wrong and I don’t want to talk about it anymore because it makes like argument look weak.

Yes, Canada indisputably has a world-class medical system – and it has universal coverage.
It’s revealing that the posters here are so ‘proud’ of the current American system when so many medical professionals agree it is riddled with flaws – and is twice as expensive per capita as the Canadian system.

danita…if it isnt good enough to force obama and his cohorts to use it….it cant be good. ask your president why he and congress dont have to use the govmt plan…who is being fooled here?

- and is twice as expensive per capita as the Canadian system.
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So, danita. In the forum questions I posted below, two different doctors asked President Obama about containing costs.
How do you think he is going to make the US health care system less expensive and provide everybody every treatment they want?

Posted by: danita | Jul 21, 2009 4:14:28 PM
Ah yes, the “rare case” argument. Nothing to see here, please disperse…

Okay, I’m off to get in line down at emergency, so hopefully I can get seen for this pain I’ve had in my stomach for 2 months . .. maybe so you pro-status quo people in the line up down there?

OBAMA has to have a vote now!because each day this bills odor becomes more foul to taxpaying americans and its dying as we speak.see the ny times piece..”libereals suicide march”. they are self destructing in front of the whole world that they care so much about and yearn for their approval.

Timmy . ..
I’m sure it is EXCELLENT entertainment just as they describe it . ..

David Gratzer is not a household name—yet. Gratzer, a physician, is the author of the book Cold Blue: Reviving Canada’s Health Care System, as well as dozens of articles attacking the Canadian system, most notably his 2007 piece: “The Ugly Truth About Canadian Health Care.” You read that right. His articles and book are about reforming Canada’s healthcare system, the same system that President Barack Obama has chosen as a model for this country to emulate as he takes us down the path towards socialism.
Dr. Gratzer, a guest on this past Sunday’s weekly FOX program Huckabee, talks about how he went from embracing the Canadian model of health care, to advocating for its reform. For all of its perceived virtues, he notes, Canada’s health-care system is lacking in three things: efficiency, innovation, and compassion.
Gratzer describes the day — back in 1997 — when he first became aware of how flawed Canada’s health care system really was:
“I was once a believer in socialized medicine. I don’t want to overstate my case: growing up in Canada, I didn’t spend much time contemplating the nuances of health economics. I wanted to get into medical school—my mind brimmed with statistics on MCAT scores and admissions rates, not health spending…what I knew about American health care was unappealing: high expenses and lots of uninsured people. When [Hillary Clinton's] HillaryCare shook Washington, I remember thinking that the Clintonistas were right.
“My health-care prejudices crumbled not in the classroom but on the way to one. On a subzero Winnipeg morning in 1997, I cut across the hospital emergency room to shave a few minutes off my frigid commute. Swinging open the door, I stepped into a nightmare: the ER overflowed with elderly people on stretchers, waiting for admission. Some, it turned out, had waited five days. The air stank with sweat and urine. Right then, I began to reconsider everything that I thought I knew about Canadian health care. I soon discovered that the problems went well beyond overcrowded ERs. Patients had to wait for practically any diagnostic test or procedure, such as the man with persistent pain from a hernia operation whom we referred to a pain clinic—with a three-year wait list; or the woman needing a sleep study to diagnose what seemed like sleep apnea, who faced a two-year delay; or the woman with breast cancer who needed to wait four months for radiation therapy, when the standard of care was four weeks.”
Take note of those wait times! Is this really the model that Barack Obama believes is the answer to America’s perceived health care crisis? In a country where people have come to expect nearly instant gratification for everything, are Americans now ready for a three-year wait for pain management, even if it’s “free”?
Americans aren’t the only ones who should be worried about the pending ruination of the world’s finest system of health care. Those Canadians who come the United States in the desperate hope of getting timely, advanced treatment for their serious illnesses—i.e., those Canadians who want a chance to live—are going to have the door closed to them when Obama’s health-care vision for this country becomes its worst nightmare.
And for those legislators actively involved in trying to push Obama’s health care reform bill down our collective throats, Dr. Gratzer has some advice for you: “Slow down, read the bill, and be careful what you wish for.”
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“Like Farrah Fawcett? She got a lot of false hope, expensive procedures and much pain from a place that could not save her anyway.”
She basically did everything from conventional to unconventional in a bid to save her life.
But if you want to discuss foreign treatment and stars, Magic Johnson comes to mind.

“Contributing author, Victor Davis Hansen”
ROFLMAO!
Yes let’s trust a neocon.

“Dr. Gratzer, a guest on this past Sunday’s weekly FOX program”
Shocking that FoxNews would have on a right wing quack who hates the Canadian health care system

“She basically did everything from conventional to unconventional in a bid to save her life.”
Excellent point. We need to get rid of those treatments so nobody can ever try again!

While many health care professionals and politicians support a single-payer system, this is NOT AT ALL what President Obama is choosing to emulate.
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And yet for some reason we were just subjected to about 200 comments about Canada’s health care system, rather than what Obama has said about what he envisions here.

Danita wrote: “I would support a single-payer system, Obama does not.”
Obama in January 2008 said (all-capital emphasis is mine):
“If I were designing a system from scratch I WOULD PROBABLY SET UP A SINGLE-PAYER SYSTEM…But we’re not designing a system from scratch…And when we had a healthcare forum before I set up my healthcare plan here in Iowa there was a lot of resistance to a single-payer system. So what I believe is we should set up a series of choices…OVER TIME IT MAY BE THAT WE END UP TRANSITIONING TO SUCH A SYSTEM. For now, I just want to make sure every American is covered…I DON’T WANT TO WAIT FOR THAT PERFECT SYSTEM.”
Obama’s own words don’t agree with your statement. Of course Obama supports a single-payer system–he even implies that THAT is the perfect system.

“OVER TIME IT MAY BE THAT WE END UP TRANSITIONING TO SUCH A SYSTEM.”
Even President Obama knows that the private sector cannot compete with the public option. He knows that the public option will elminate the private sector and leave the federal government as the sole provider of healthcare in America.

“Well then how about Chris “my leg is tingling” Matthews or Keith “RANT-MASTER” Olbermann. Can we trust them?”
Right wingers get so upset when you point out their sources are lunatics.

Here is an analogy: You have a gallon of crystal clear drinking water. Someone says I want to just add one more option by putting in some red food coloring, but I don’t want to eliminate the crystal clear water. Yet you know good and well that once the red food coloring is placed in the gallon of crystal clear drinking water that the entire gallon will become red drinking water.
THAT is what will happen with the implementation of the public option. It will eliminate the private sector and turn the American healthcare system into a single-payer system run and controlled by the federal government. To say otherwise is being totally disingenuous.

What concerns me is things that I’ve read about Obama’s Health care plans regarding the elderly. These are the people that fought for this country in WWII and should , in no way, have medical care rationed or told by the government when it’s time to die.

Tom Daschle “health care reform will not be pain free. Seniors should be more accepting with the conditions that come with age instead of treating them.” A federal council would approve or reject treatments using a formula that divides the cost of treatment by the number of years the patient is likely to benefit. How old is Ted Kennedy again? Ah, but old Teddy wouldn’t have to abide by the rules that the rest of the population would have to what with his exempted government health care.

“So the government can run healthcare far cheaper for the same service than private insurance and we fork over ever rising premiums why? ”
Because our founding fathers believed in the Free Market and Individual Freedom. We lose both, with regards to healthcare, as soon as the federal government overtakes our healthcare system.
It has been the entrepreneurial spirit and the drive to accomplish the American Dream through Capitalism, the Free Market and Individual Freedom that made the United States the greatest nation on earth. The Left sees those as the impediments to their agenda of controlling every aspect of our lives.

“Right wingers get so upset when you point out their sources are lunatics.”
And President Obama’s mentors and teachers–Frank Marshall Davis, Saul Alinski (as a student of his principals) were so pro-America, so pro-Capitalism, and so pro-Individual Freedom!!!!

Where are you pro Obama health care bill people? I’m looking for intelligent responses to the last 8 posts without, of course, name calling or juvenile putdowns of any kind. An adult discourse stating your views refuting what we’re saying would be welcome.

“Posted by: Kathy | Jul 21, 2009 6:39:23 PM”
Sorry we could not add such gems like this from you kathy.
“How old is Ted Kennedy again? “

President Obama: “What We’re Doing Is Hard”
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Tell ‘em, Barry. “It’s really hard werk!!” This sounds vaguely familiar.

“Suicide was rampant because of financial desperation and the British magazine at that time reported that “the US seemed to have forgottenhow to grow”.
The suicide rate rose between 1929 and 1933.
Or are you one of those right wingers who thinks FDR caused the Great Depression.

“Unemployment could have dropped from 25% to 10% or lower and in far less time without the New Deal.”
ROFLMAO!
Well at least fantasy is a step up from the usual right wing historical revisionism.
What’s next saying Government spending under the New Deal didn’t pull us out of the Depression rather MORE government control of the economy and more government spending during WW2 did?

“As a member of the Parliament surely she would get the best possible treatment in Canada, but instead chose to go to the US where we have such a terrible system.”
The whole story vs the right wing framing
“Stronach’s spokesman, Greg MacEachern, told the Toronto Star that the MP for Newmarket-Aurora had a “later-stage” operation in the U.S. after a Toronto doctor referred her.
“Belinda had one of her later-stage operations in California, after referral from her personal physicians in Toronto. Prior to this, Belinda had surgery and treatment in Toronto, and continues to receive follow-up treatment there,” said MacEachern.
He said speed was not the reason why she went to California.
Instead, MacEachern said the decision was made because the U.S. hospital was the best place to have it done due to the type of surgery required. ”
Stronach, who announced last April she would be leaving politics before the next election, paid for the surgery in the U.S., reports the Star.
“As we said back in June when we confirmed the surgery, this is a personal and private matter between Belinda, her family and her physicians. I think you’ll understand that because of respect for Belinda’s privacy, we refrained from offering specific details around her medical treatment,” said MacEachern.
While it is rare for MPs to seek treatment outside Canada, MacEachern said Stronach was not lacking confidence in the system.
“In fact, Belinda thinks very highly of the Canadian health-care system, and uses it when needed for herself and her children, as do all Canadians. As well, her family has clearly demonstrated that support,” MacEachern told the Star.

Danita,
More from Canada,
A report from the Wait Time Alliance (won’t you be glad when we get one of those?)
For cancer care, the study found that the median wait time for radiation therapy was almost seven weeks, exceeding the benchmark of four weeks. “This is troublesome given the clear link between a delay in radiation therapy and a chance of cure,” the report said.
Ryan,
She came here and paid with her own money because she wanted the best care possible for her late stage cancer. All the other platitudes about having great faith in the Canadian system is just so much political babble. When the chips were down, she put her money where she knew she would get the service.
The US provides a great escape valve for Canada’s system. When that escape valve is shut tight by our own socialized system, Canada’s system will be in serious trouble

Or are you one of those right wingers who thinks FDR caused the Great Depression.
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Ryan C,
No, ACTUALLY it is your hero Joe Biden who can’t seem to get things from that period of time RIGHT!
As ALWAYS, Lefties dont lie, they just forget the TRUTH!

Just think how much better we would be today if organizations like ACORN had not shaken down the financial institutions, the past three decades, forcing them to give mortgages to individuals that everyone knew couldn’t afford the loans BUT INSTEAD had shaken down the developers to DONATE one out of every 20 homes built to a poor family!

You wanted the job, Barry.
Stop whining and do your job, crybaby!!