Senate Democratic Leadership Will Pass Health Care Reform “By Any Legislative Means Necessary”

Reid and the Dems needs to get the Waxman out of their ears. The majority of Americans do not want this right now.

“…a decision to pursue reconciliation,” the somewhat controversial legislative process…”
For context, when were some times reconciliation was used and on what? I think it has been used since the Bush tax cuts in ’01 and ’03, and Reagan went to it just about every session to hammer through the Democrats, but it would be nice if your research minions could flesh this out.

The wiki list of reconciliation bills.
* Omnibus Reconciliation Act of 1980, Pub.L. 96-499 (1980)
* Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1981, Pub.L. 97-35 (1981)
* Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1982, Pub.L. 97-253 (1982)
* Tax Equity and Fiscal Responsibility Act of 1982 (TEFRA), Pub.L. 97-248 (1982)
* Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1983, Pub.L. 98-270 (1984)
* Deficit Reduction Act of 1984 (DEFRA), Pub.L. 98-369 (1984)
* Consolidated Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1985 (COBRA), Pub.L. 99-272 (1986)
* Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1986, Pub.L. 99-509 (1986)
* Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1987, Pub.L. 100-203 (1987)
* Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1989, Pub.L. 101-239 (1989)
* Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1990, Pub.L. 101-508 (1990).
* Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1993, Pub.L. 103-66 (1990).
* Balanced Budget Act of 1995, H.R. 2491 (vetoed December 6, 1995)
* Personal Responsibility and Work Opportunity Act, Pub.L. 104-193 (1996)
* Balanced Budget Act of 1997, Pub.L. 105-33 (1997)
* Taxpayer Relief Act of 1997, Pub.L. 105-34 (1997)
* Taxpayer Refund and Relief Act of 1999, H.R. 2488 (vetoed September 23, 1999)
* Marriage Tax Relief Reconciliation Act of 2000, H.R. 4810 (vetoed August 5, 2000)
* Economic Growth and Tax Relief Reconciliation Act of 2001 (EGTRRA), Pub.L. 107-16 (2001)
* Jobs and Growth Tax Relief Reconciliation Act of 2003, Pub.L. 108-27 (2003)
* Deficit Reduction Act of 2005, Pub.L. 109-171 (2006)
* Tax Increase Prevention and Reconciliation Act of 2005 (TIPRA), Pub.L. 109-222 (2006)
* College Cost Reduction and Access Act of 2007, Pub.L. 110-84 (2007)

“White House and the Senate Democratic leadership still prefer a bipartisan bill.”
Ridiculous. They need bipartisan support because they can’t even get 50 Democrats to vote for this thing.

“we are determined to get something done this year by any legislative means necessary.”
–> Uh: “something” … WHY? to try to pull Oblabla’s shriveled electoral chestnuts out of the fire, at the cost of screwing up medical delivery for MOST people? Too late for that.
Better whichever Democrats still AREN’T in league with the Obama cult had try to save the Democratic Party from this fraud’s serial flim-flams.
What the people want is Single Payer, not another crudely-disguised corporate tap on the Treasury. We can wait for the Dean administration in 2012.

The Dems, liberals and leftists will never compromise, they won and believe that to the victor go the spoils.
The Conservatives only want Barack Obama’s leftist policies to fail. He should learn to triangulate from Bill Clinton if he wants to have a successful presidency.
Conservatives want the economy to recover (jobs and lower unemployment mean more Americans will have private health care).
Conservatives want America to be strong again, not bending to our enemies and snubbing our friends.

“Obama’s job approval rating among Democrats in in the mid to high 80′s.”
I believe that is called preaching to the choir.
Marist Poll:
But, is President Obama on a slippery slope with Independent voters?
Currently, 47% of Independents nationwide say they approve of the job the president is doing while 37% disapprove.
This is the first time Obama has lost a majority of Independents since taking office.

The purpose of the reconciliation process is to allow budgets to be passed with a simple majority, since there is a constitutional requirement for a budget. It has only rarely been used otherwise.
My fervent hope is that the Dems will ram through a public option using that process. Before any of it takes effect, two-thirds of the current US senators, the president, and every representative (twice) will have to face the electorate. We’ll win, and win big. Look at the polls.

As of today, the GOP leads the Dems by a whopping 5% on the generic congressional ballot among likely voters. In fifteen months we’ll have the House.

Jake,nice bit of pandering to the right-wing by including the Malcom X clip, then bootstrapping it to a French philosopher.

Facist Hyena:”If what the GOP is doing now is bad faith, then I am all in favor of bad faith.”
No, cutting deals and demanding large concessions on the stimulus, getting them – and then voting down to the last one in the House against it was bad faith. And their constituents have that unprecedented partisan maneuvering to thank for their reduced influence on the health care bill. If they refuse to play by even the (very) minimal standards of respect followed over the last century in Congress, they will be left to rant in the corner.
Unlike Democrats with welfare reform, they are not interested in getting some safeguards for their constituents into the majority’s legislation, they are only interested in soundbites for their 2010 election run.

“The Dems will lose now, or they will be convincigly trounced in 2010 and 2012.”
I think the Democrats are likely to lose some seats in 2010 based on history.
The Blue Dogs are going to have figure out if they want to remain in office with robust party support.
The Progressive caucus isn’t going anywhere.

“Anyone here want to explain why they call themselves ‘Representatives’ if they are gonna ram this through against the voters will?”
It does seem a little deceptive, specious, even “fishy”, doesn’t it?

The Senate can only use the reconciliation process if the ostensibly non-partisan Senate Parliamentarian authorizes it to do so. He is charged with allowing the procedure only for measures that are primarily budget-related.
“Under Senate rules, it also would give [Parliamentarian Alan] Frumin, 62, broad authority to decide which portions of the Democrats’ bill are relevant to the budget and empower him to delete provisions he considers unrelated.
“’You’d end up with the parliamentarian of the United States Senate writing a health-care bill,’ said Senator Lamar Alexander, a Tennessee Republican.
“Provisions of a health-care plan Frumin may remove, lawmakers say, include a proposal barring insurers from denying coverage, the creation of a government-run insurance program and efforts to encourage preventive medicine.”
Can you loons tell how much I’m loving this?

“Denying that corporate polls — which are NOT, in any case, going Der Won’s way”
You just posted a different section of the same poll I referenced.
You’re either delusional or dishonest…which is it.

Imagine stupid me when I defended the Democrats against charges they were tax and spenders who couldn’t be trusted on foreign affairs. Now we have the Democrats passing new taxes every other week and with Medicare and Social Security broke, they will pass health legislation that is the biggest spending legislation of the last twenty years. When it comes to foreign affairs, we have a president who finds it easier to condemn the Cambridge police than he does to condemn an Iranian government that is killing its own people.

“Provisions of a health-care plan Frumin may remove, lawmakers say, include a proposal barring insurers from denying coverage, the creation of a government-run insurance program and efforts to encourage preventive medicine.”
That’d leave Oblabla’s spidery hands clean on it . . . if protecting this carnivorous hothouse flower is still uppermost in the intentions of the Congress, as does NOT seem, any longer, to be the case.

And now, Bush-style, He’s courting NASCAR? It’s toooo embarrassing.

This just goes to confirm that the Democrats don’t give a damn about what the American people think or want, they just want to serve their own political interest. They will sell their votes to the highest paying criminal lobbiest and support big business and bigger Government. They are all socialist with an agenda that does not benifit the American people, only themselves. Put them on the same type of healthcare that they want to put us on and put them on Social Security and take away their lifetime salaries when they leave office and their tune will change. Let’s vote these crooks out in 2010 and send COngress the message that we aren’t going to take this crap anymore.

“That shows just why we should never have allowed the Dems back into power. Now there’s hell to pay.”
Obama’s no Democrat, which HUGE slivers of the Democrats (outside the mob-friendly “leadership”) are finally beginning to discuss, in a roundabout way, in public.

Ryan C: Ah to have a simplistic view of the world as you do. For you the world is either support Obama or be some type of neo-con. This country is moving steadily towards a third party, with or without you.

“Obama’s no Democrat, which HUGE slivers of the Democrats (outside the mob-friendly “leadership”) are finally beginning to discuss, in a roundabout way, in public.”
ROFLMAO!
Look at all those qualifiers in that statement.
Obama’s job approval among Democrats is in the mid to high 80′s.

“kudos for [anti-war Gold Star mom Cindy Sheehan] at least being consistent.”
–> Being consistent on ANY subject is more than Der CHANGEling can manage.
(From the NASCAR thread: ““The key to making good predictions in sports is waiting until the last minute to make the prediction,” Obama said with a laugh.” Hahaha. One of those freaky forced laughs we won’t be hearing after 2012.)

If the dems try and ram this thru there will be chaos in this country. It is going to get real nasty, wait and see.

LET’S GET HEALTH CARE REFORM ALREADY!!! THE REPUBLICANS HAD THE HOUSE FOR 2001-2006 AND DID NOTHING ABOUT HEALTH CARE. PRESIDENT OBAMA PROMISED HEALTH CARE. MOVE ON IT ALREADY.

The Right has shown that they are unable to realize when their own party is making fools of them . Example: Gingrich inciting the right in making them believe that the left is going to kill their old family members. Fools are the Right. Fools are the Republicans. Fools are the neo-cons. Fools! Fools! Fools!

“Any Democrat — or registered affiliate of ANY political party — who missed Greta van Susteren’s reading of sections of HR3200 yesterday definitely should look it up on the internet.”
The right wing slip is showing…..

“Just like those on the right who may try to deny evolution, there are those on the left like Ryan C who try to ignore the laws of economics. The simple fact is that if the Democrats continue to spend at this pace, economic collapse will come to this country. Even Soros has stated as much. At that point you will see change you can believe in.”
ROFLMAO!
See the right wing can’t resist throwing in their favorite boogeymen.

“Seems to me the Dems had control of the house the last two years of the Bush admin. Why didn’t they purpose something then if they felt it was so important. Because THEY DON’T CARE ABOUT YOU, JUST POWER….HELLO….”
The Democratic Congress worked to pass SCHIP…twice.
Only to have Bush veto it.

worriedmom:”The Democrats want to ram this through because they want a large portion of the public employed by the government. Employees who will have to vote Democrat in future elections just to keep their jobs”
You should realize NONE of the bills propose to have any more health care providers employed by the government. None. The current proposal is that the government provides insurance, that pays PRIVATE providers, to an estimated 10-20% of Americans (by 2019). 80-90% of Americans will continue to have private coverage (based on the CBO analysis who price tag has the White house so irritated).

I see the liars and slanderers are still out here. The right-wing attack machine repeating the “talking points” fed to conservative extremists by the health insurance industry. Interesting how you ignored the true Nazis, Bush and Cheney, owners of the most corrupt administration in U.S. history. The bigots and racists carry on their campaign, attempting to sabotage the Obama administration. The Republicans and their supporters dug this hole in which our country finds itself. And then they are trying to sabotage Obama while he is attempting to fix your problems! Well, despite your efforts, Obama is fixing your problems! What ticks you off, is Obama’s popularity, here in the U.S. – and worldwide. The rest of the world hates Bush and Cheney. It drives you crazy that Barrack is admired and respected around the world. While you saboteurs continue your slander and lies, Barrack is gaining even more respect – and results! Why were you so quiet during the Bush-Cheney years?? Could it be that you ignored the heinous abuse of power by Bush and Cheney – because you are just like them?? Why else would you support that kind of corruption?? And for at least eight years! You have no excuses! You are what you support! Get over yourselves and do something good for the country instead of trying to tear it apart – solely for the purpose of regaining power. Your behavior clearly shows that you do not care about the country. You have no intention of pulling with this president, or any Democrat, to solve the worse economic crisis since the Great Depression! The Republicans are mostly responsible for the biggest loss of wealth in the history of the world – mega trillion$!! And all you can think of is trying to sabotage this president so you can have power back! Despite appearances, you are losing this battle. Have you noticed that the Republican’s approval rate is a meager 21%?? That 21% probably represents the number of right-wing extremists in the population.

Should these Spendocrat Senators have the guts to pass this through reconciliation they will have their walking papers handed to them come 2010 and 2012. Obama is already a lame duck over this and can kiss the White House goodbye in 2012. A 45 seat shift in the House is not out of reach in 2010. Fiscally responsible candidates Red or Blue will be taking their place. This anger is not just about health care, it is the mountain of debt, the passage of bills that no one reads in the middle of the night. These Spendocrats will have change they can count on starting in 2010, it cannot come soon enough.

I was stunned listening to Obama’s speech before the Veterans of Foreign War the other day. The way he justified our being in Afghanistan sounded like Bush justifying our presence in Iraq. It was such a stark contrast from Obama’s anti war rhetoric before being elected. Guess those morning updates on national security can turn any dove into a hawk. Or he was simply trying to sound tough before the VFW. Who knows? Like Shakespeare said, all the world’s a stage …

“Like Shakespeare said, all the world’s a stage … ”
Like he didn’t say, Oblabla’s gonna get the hook in 2012. If not BEFORE.

Do it Harry, go to reconciliation and defy the will of the American people. Please Harry do it and your entire party will be washed from the political landscape.

Sentinel needs to chill! You can spot them a mile away. Still fixated on Bush and Cheney while he’s being led like a lamb to the slaughter. And oh by the way apparently you haven’t noticed that Obama’s “popularity” is sinking like a rock….

“What does Harry Reid have to lose. He has an approval rating of 12%. You read it right, 12%. Of course the media is doing its very best keeping that as quiet as possible.”
Probably because that is not true.
May 09
“Half of Nevada voters had an unfavorable view of Reid, while 38 percent had a favorable view and 11 percent a neutral opinion.
The statewide poll of 625 Nevadans who vote regularly was conducted by telephone last week by Washington-based Mason-Dixon Polling & Research Inc. for the Review-Journal. It carries a margin of error of 4 percentage points in either direction.
Reid’s approval ratings at home have been subpar for years, particularly since he ascended to Democratic leader in 2004 and to majority leader in 2006.”
Its is certainly not a rating to write home about.
He won in 2004 with 61% of the vote in a year in which Democrats lost 4 seats in the Senate.

“When BUSH started talking like this, the media didn’t waste two seconds in giving him the alarmed and derisive dressing-down such remarks, pouring from the corruption of politicos’ posturing, demand.”
The right wing slip isn’t just showing…its all Belle Starr has left on.

ABC YOU SHOULD READ HR3400 and compare.

Sentinel …Your just flat wrong, Bush was no conservative, The Obama administration has him beat 6 to 1 as far as corruption, the Chicago machine is hard to beat, Tax cheats, pay to play,sex scandals, the list goes on. Obama doubled down on the warrantless wire taps, Halliburton, got $343,000,000
SEIU will get their pay off, Goldman Sacks will get their Cap & trade payday, Acorn and their voter fraud, the new Black panthers. Bush was a cub scout

Ooh, Ryan C I’m afraid your wrong. Harry Reid has an approval of only a third in his home state and less then half of that nationwide. Please get you facts straight. But the simple truth is, even a third is horrendous. Or at least it was when Bush had those numbers.

I can’t see how there can be bi-partisan health care when the republicans have not proposed a single issue…that I am aware. Maybe if the republicans would come forward with some proposals, we would have something which to base an opinion…but this disagreeing demostrates a lack of concern for the people and health care….

7 reasons to support Government Healthcare – NOT
The government now and has run:
1. Fannie Mae– it’s broke
2. Freddie Mac– it’s broke
3. Post Office– it’s broke
4. AmTrak– it’s broke
5. Medicaid– it’s going broke
6. Medicare– it’s going broke
7. Social Security– it’s going broke
The government is the majority share holder in both General Motors and Chrysler and both of them are broke.
Why would anyone be concerned about the government running this nation’s health care?

This nation is at a crossroads. The House is out of control and Henry Waxman and Barney Frank are prime examples of why we need to reel this congress in for replacement in 2010 if the nation lasts that long.
The Senate is just as bad, obviously viewing itself as the ruling class that will get its way. Consider this statement by Manley; “However,” he cautioned, “patience is not unlimited and we are determined to get something done this year by any legislative means necessary.”
Democracy has failed when the populace is considered a threat to the lawmakers’ agenda. It has failed when an arrogant congress and a glib speaking president unite against the will of the people with an attempted move into socialism.
They collectively pretend we are making false claims (Obama even says “bearing false witness” what a comment from a man committed to promulgating abortion!) yet they make no apologies for how the bill is written, if it really meant something else why did they choose writers who cannot express what they mean?
It’s a fight, and the question is will democracy win or will the administration and this out of control congress win?

Oh yes, the “screaming majority” filled with misinformation provided by Big Insurance lobby…Very good. This will pass, come hell or high water. Just watch.

Chargedmama: Another thing you can add to your list – the so-called “cash for clunkers” program has paid out only 2% of the claims, well below the $1 billion that was approved, let alone the 2nd and 3rd billion dollars. The New York dealers have pulled out of the program. It has been reported on Drudge that 50% of the dealers have terminated the program, and many of these dealers are fearing that they won’t be repaid. The joke’s on this country if we are going to trust an implementation of a program that is $1.5 trillion dollars. Wake up people, the list of programs where this government has failed and is failing is growing every year. Take a look at our education system with the high drop-out rate in spite of the nearly $12,000 spent per student.

“Ooh, Ryan C I’m afraid your wrong. Harry Reid has an approval of only a third in his home state and less then half of that nationwide.”
Which is about what the polls I posted said.
Apparently reading is not a strong suit with the right wing.
“Please get you facts straight. But the simple truth is, even a third is horrendous.”
My facts were straight the poster claiming his approval rating was 12% was wrong.
Like I said they are nothing to be proud of.
“Or at least it was when Bush had those numbers.”
They were horrendous numbers for Bush and if he had them going into 2004 he would have been in trouble.
As it stands he ended his Presidency with one of the lowest ratings in history.
The difference is Reid has no known opponent right now and the next election is still over a year away.
Like I said he won with 61% of the vote in 2004 when the Democrats as a party lost seats in the Senate.

“the so-called “cash for clunkers” program has paid out only 2% of the claims”
–> But these suckers can move FAST when they want to: remember how SWIFTLY a few TRILLION moved to the financial corporations . . .

Cash for Clunkers
“On Wednesday, Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood aggressively defended the program.
He is urging frustrated dealers to tap the brakes when it comes to their concerns about a payout.
“They’re going to get their money, we have the money, Congress provided the money they’re going to get their money,” said Secretary LaHood.
The CEO of America’s largest auto retailer, AutoNation, agrees.
And says part of the problem has been the overwhelming response.
“It is so successful beyond everyone’s expectation that the Department of Transportation was not prepared to deal with this unbelievable surge. They are on it, they are adding more resources every day,” Jackson said.”

The reconciliation process was suppose to be used for Budget purposes to keep thing running. Why do they think they can use it for this piece of crap Health Care Reform? Why is Obama and the Democrats so desparte to get this passed? It has nothing to do with Health Care it is a power thing. They think they do not have to answer to the people. They all forgot one thing they were elected by the people and for the people. We need to clean the House and Senate starting with the 2010 and 2012 elections.

The Dems will get 50 votes. Byrd will be there to vote. If Kennedy is alive he will be there as well. Kennedy will NOT miss it. He will be brought in by a stretcher to vote.

The Dems can count. They WILL have 50 votes for this.

The second chief architect is Berkeley Professor Jacob Hacker can be viewed in an online video clip making a presentation to the TIDES organization. In the clip, referring to his base health reform design, he actually jokes about the raw intent of his design, saying “Someone once said to me that this is a “Trojan Horse” for a single-payor system” (complete government control). “I said, well, it’s not a Trojan horse,” (he turns, smiles and raises his voice) “It’s just right there!!” (Laughter from the audience, surprised at Hacker’s candor) “I’m telling you we’re going to get there, over time, slowly, but we’ll move away from reliance on employer-based health insurance, as we should, but we’ll do it in a way that we’re not going to frighten people into thinking that they are going to lose their private insurance!”

If Reid and his ilk force the government option and the health plan on the American people and it fails; the mess could be huge and the work needed to correct it, unbelievable. If the democrats thought the dislike for GW Bush was something, they will find out what can be worse.

wow.. how can manley say “we will not make a decision to pursue reconciliation until we have exhausted efforts to produce a bipartisan bill.” when they will push something through “by any legislative means necessary.” funny how they hate on bush for being unilateral and praise Obama for being unilateral…

Obviously anyone who isn’t paying for Health Insurance out of their own pocket is against reform. Try $1000.00 per month on for size! For my wife and I…The premium will NEVER go down, it NEVER has.

screw harry reid. he and pelosi and frank are the height of arrogance and duplicity. i blame voters in their districts for inflicting this pestilence on the rest of us….

“Remember that Democrats had no intentions securing bipartisan support back in July.”
Geee is that why the Senate finance committee has been bending over backward for Grassley?
Right wingers are inherently dishonest.

Those of you who are getting all hot and bothered by the health reform issue should consider who is yanking your chain. Example: Tapper writes an article on the legislative process. Not very glamorous, right? So he adds a completely irrelevant reference to Malcolm X and, if you still dont get the point, there is even a video link. Result: Bingo! Temperatures rise, inflammatory rhetoric heats up and, by the way…ratings and site hits go up. You are being used, abused and then abandoned. Here, have a cigarette. Jake will call you soon…promise.

Obama changes his approach on a weekly basis. Remember in the spring when the rich were gong to bail out Medicare. Then it was cut deductions for giving (Biden is of course the most selfish S.O.B. around according to his tax returns). Unlike Bush, Obama wants to APPEAR bipartisan. But what he really wants is for people to embrace HIS plan. The media & his people created this ego maniac with his Greek columns and all. He deserves to get his #### kicked around for a while. Hopefully, there will be something short of govt.-incompetent health care and the current pathetic situation.

“Republicans are now viewed as dealing better with 8 out of 10 top issues like health care and even education.”
ROFLMAO!
Rasmussen always there to tell the right wing their ideas are popular!

“By any means necessary” is a phrase popularized by Malcolm X (demanding the rights of African-Americans to be respected in society), though it is thought to have originally been penned by French existentialist Jean Paul Sartre in his play about assassination “Dirty Hands” (in a line demanding the end of class).
Tapper’s insidious introduction of race and militancy in this article is reprehensible. To what possible end is this introduced into this piece? It is a disgusting piece of bad journalism. Tapper should be dismissed or called to account for this.

Rasmussen correctly predicted the 2008 Election and had Obama ahead the entire year. He also correctly predicted the Democrat gains in 2006 and 2008.
The ignorant teenage/college age vote that thinks history began the day they were born find it hard to believe that Republicans are now favored over Democrats on 8 of the top 10 issues facing Americans.
In the 20th Century, Republicans were President for 52 years, Democrats for 48 years. That’s the facts of history.
America will embrace a new President and their Party but they will throw them out of office as fast as they threw them in.
If Obama and Democrats continue to govern as leftists, they will lose in 2010 and 2012.
Ignorance of history will leave many juvenile Obama supporters in a bad place when reality sets in.

It seems as if the Democrates can’t agree with each other long enough to help the American public. Thanks, guys. For nothing.

OBama is out doing what he does best… preaching! I understand he is well rested from his vacation out on Martha’s Vineyard. He is, in fact, the first President elect preacher… a true professional speechman! Unfortunately he fails miserably in every other presidential duty. He is one seriously slippery fish! Caution, his spin cycle is in full effect!

AKPD: Ask David Axelrod about this – and how it is profiting from the Health Care Bill.

I’ve tried to remain impartial and understanding towards those on the right, but the actions of the last few weeks by those on the right have proven to me that they are willfully ignorant slaves more than eager to do the bidding of their finacial superiors as long as God is occasionally mentioned. The overt racism and anger and anti americanism shown (unapologetically) by the right sickens the stomache. This article is a perfect example. A subversive little mention of malcom X and Jakes got himself a hit. Disgusting.

‘Splain something to me lucy:
If all the town hall meetin’s are just packed with right wing wacko’s
Why is that every major poll shows Americans 2-1 ‘gainst this caca?
————————————–
Sure its not scientific.
But facebook has it 63-34 against health care reform.
And I’d trust an unscientific survey hands down over *anything* published the loons in charge.

““UPS and FedEx are doing just fine. It’s the Post Office that’s always having problems.” That’s a quote from Obama
And he’s using that to make his point about government run health care??? LOL. UPS and FEDEX are not government run and they are doing fine. The government post office has problems.
He really gets confused when TOTUS has a day off….

The Elitism and Arrogance of Harry Reid is astounding! He calls the old and handicapped Americans showing up to voice their fears at townhalls “EVIL MONGERS”! I not sure if that is better or worse than Nancy Pelosi’s “UNAMERICAN”, but it isn’t a good way to refer to the American people. Now he says he is going to cram Obamacare down the the throat of the American people whether they like it or not! I hope the voters of Nevada are taking note!

Leave out the word legislative in “by any legislative means necessary” and you know what you get? 1919 to 1937 .
Starting in 1919, Henry Ford set up the Ford Service, the largest private police force in the world-around 3000 gangsters, ex-convicts, prize fighters, wrestlers, and others. They didn’t wear uniforms or I.D.s and some worked in the plants. They engaged in spying, intimidation, and violence against people with
radical ideas. On May 27, 1937 presumably – under the auspices of “by any means necessary” Richard T. Frankensteen, U.A.W. organizational director, with coat pulled over his head, was brutally beaten at the gate of the Ford River Rouge —16 were injured. The same tactics exist to this day – only now they’re in Ann Arbor and used by the beneficiaries — the same descendants — of that unionization. Is that what is meant by “any means necessary?” If so, then stop right now because the people who’s parents fought for unionization from 1919 to 1937 are the very people who, while wearing suits an sitting in administrative positions in 2005 and 2006 and 2007 – embrace – “the by any means necessary” approach.
It’s not safe here. Do not use this approach.
Your secret service is not wrong. Please don’t come here. I’m not safe either.

Glad to hear it! Harry Reid is gone anyway since he is behind by double digits in nevada, and forcing this crap through will be political suicide for the socialist whackos that are in power now, I am happy they are so radical and fascistic in their actions, because it expedites GETTING THEM THE HELL OUT! Thanks Harry. And Harry, keep the change! ( ha ha, remember that song?)

Finally some guts. Democrats will not only do the right thing, but also get major political support by passing this without the Republican obstructionists.

“I am really tired of the blockage by the Republicans of health care reform.’
News flash: the Republicans can’t block anything. They don’t have the votes. It’s your gutless Democrats.

I completely agree with Angelo on this and would add another point. With the internet and 24-hour cable news, the shift against this administration has been even more swift, 6 months.
The demonizing has been absolutely OFFENSIVE and self-defeating. You can’t convince people by insulting them and calling them Nazis. The incompetence and arrogance of Obama and Congressional leadership are front and center. 2009 will be looked back as one of the worst and arrogant misinterpretations of an election and its perceived mandate.

Why does it have to be by any means necessary anyway? Why cant it simply be done slowly deliberately correctly and in a way that would benefit all people and not just the poor – why does it have to be Obama and the democrats way? Why not the correct way that would help all people? Even if it takes 10 years? Thats because the dems know if the republicans figure out a way to reform healthcare in some other fashion first without a public healthcare option and without passing a $1 Trillion dollar pork-laden bill – HR3200 will sink like the Titanic and all Obama, Pelosi and Barney Frank’s cronies in big corporate healthcare wont get their blood money and cushy government contracts. Shame on the democrats for evoking the Malcolm X race card to do it too!!

Thanks for Bailing Us Out, America! We Couldn’t Have Maintained the Status Quo Without You! – XOXO, Your Ivy League Overlords. (We now return you to your regular programming – enjoy this week’s battle over… healthcare. Btw, ever wonder why we chose to call it programming? We’re just SO clever, yes we are.)

It just occured to me that if ABC took our side instead of Obama’s we could easily out down the government takeover of healthcare!
How about it ABC whose side are you on?

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There has NEVER been nor would we ever expect to see bi-partisanship under the Obama administraion.
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Obama sold himself as the great UNITER but his administration and policies has brought the worse division across this nation in decades.
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Uh, am I missing something or doesn’t all the evidence lead to cheney, rumsfeld and other henchmen who lied to the American people about WMD’s in Iraq. Saddam had ZERO AND I MEAN ZERO involvement in 9/11. It was the wrong war. I believe in the second Amendment and the right to go to war in necessary but please don’t tell me that Iraq was a just war. If you believe that then you are something more than ignorant. We already had Saddam in a stranglehold at the 38th parallel with a no fly zone. They were not going to do anything. They were also a buffer to keep Iran in check. That buffer is GONE. Go tell your little story to all the thousands of Americans and hundreds of thousands of Iraqis that have lost their lives in this war. And tell your children how it bankrupt this nation.

There seems to be a lot of unemployed, depressed and helpless people all in favor of the Democrat plan. And, George Bush remains the bane of their existence.
No hope and change for them. Man up dudes.

BY ANY MEANS NECESSARY IS A VERY GOOD WAY OF PUTTING IT.

I have a hard time Harry Reid said such a thing… If he did, he’ll be apologizing to the GOP tomorrow and begging forgiveness form them… there has never been a weaker political “leader” than he… The GOP never sought “bipartisanshop” on anything… why should Democrats ask permission from the losing party which destroyed our country for anything? Especially when such losers have no interest in governing… only petty politics…

“How about it ABC whose side are you on?” – They would much rather stir up ideological conflict and watch the ratings rise than engage in substantive debate over healthcare reform. Dont let them use us. ABC is on ABC’s side. Its the same with all the networks. Change will have to start with us so, Ed, what do you think can be done to make healthcare better?

“The war in Iraq was to free and liberate a people from a despotic leader and further freedom and democracy in the world”
Funny that it does not say that anywhere in the Iraq War Resolution.

Elitist is as elitist does.

“Tell the Republicans in the Senate that they’re more than welcome to fillibuster but MAKE THEM DO IT.”
Do you even read the news? Don’t you know, Einstein, that the Republicans don’t have the numbers to filibuster? Republicans can’t stop this — it’s the Dems baby, and if doesn’t pass, it will be because of Democrats, not Republicans.

“Elitist is as Elitist Does.” – Forrest Gump III

reality check — It’s time for Obama to man-up alright — take responsibility for the legislation YOU want to pass!!!! — Don’t wait around for the “minority party” to compromise with you! — Pass what you thiink is right and live with the consequences!!! ——– Of course, we all know that the consequences will be the blue dog Dems being voted out, and the Dems losing their majority!!!! — Go ahead!!!!

“It is so easy to demonize “big insurance”" – I agree that one should not demonize anyone, but I also agree that it would be pretty easy with insurance companies. I worked in healthcare for 10 years and I witnessed folks who were thrown off their insurance plans just when they developed a catastrophic illness. Folks die because of the “bottom line.” I know that there are some good people in the health insurance field, but I often wonder how they sleep at night knowing what their employers do to maintain profits.

markfromatlanta — For every one of your “thrown out by the insurance company” sob stories — there are thousands of bills being paid by the insurance companies that keep responsible people (who purchased the policies) AWAY from the fear of declaring bankruptcy!!! — That will ALWAYS trump your few sob stories that were probably FRAUD to begin with!!!

“By any means necessary?”
Harry is bluffing to put political pressure on Blue Dog Dems. Any means necessary means of course the “reconciliation process”. The price would be too high for dems to pay, and Harry knows it.
Bottom line: this is not about Republican obstruction, it is about dem infighting in the face of strong public opposition, desperately trying create fantasy narratives to the contrary.

Quote: “It’s time for Obama to man up. Tell the Republicans in the Senate that they’re more than welcome to fillibuster but MAKE THEM DO IT.”
Isn’t it convenient to overlook the fact that the GOB doesn’t have enough vote to filibuster? Any attempt can easily be overridden. It’s time for Obama to man up and stop talking out of both sides of his mouth.

truthbetold wrote:
” ‘The war in Iraq was to free and liberate a people from a despotic leader and further freedom and democracy in the world’
Funny that it does not say that anywhere in the Iraq War Resolution.”
You’re right, tbt, it doesn’t. But, while it might not feel like it to the left, the various Democratic health care proposals constitute a more momentous undertaking for the country than the Iraq war did. And Bush didn’t have to “reconcile” that little beauty. Despite considerable resistance to the war it had much greater popular and legislative support than Obamacare currently does. This isn’t a budget rider or even a controversial court appointment. Reconciliation is a dangerous card to play, both because of the precedent it will set and the potential backlash should the reforms later prove unpopular.

Thanks so much for the Malcolm X reference. That was so important to the article.
“By any means necessary” has also been used a bazillion other times in the past 40+ years.
Good thing you’re trying not to stir anybody up.

===========================
“By Any Legislative Means Necessary”
===========================
translation: Damn the citizens we’re supposed to represent because they disagree with our ideology.
===========================

Let’s call the number gross income. The total income you have earned or received during the fiscal year.
Now, if your filing as a married jointly couple. You immeadiately receive a tax deduction of $12,400.
This is used to reduce your gross income. Now come those sweet kiddies. Each child is worth $3800 each in deductions. Two kids, OK? Ah, but you also get to deduct $3800 for each parent.
Where are we? $3800 x 4=$14,200.
Add the $14,200 dollars to the $12,400
dollar exemption for filing married jointly and you already have reduced your gross income by a total of $26,600. You own a modest home and pay 10,000 a year in mortgage payments (intrest), $1000 a year in taxes.
Voilla! Now you’ve reduced your income another $11,000 dollars. Your able to deduct a total of $37,700. If you are in sales you will have business expenses to deduct. For those of you who iremize, have capital gains and losses, own other properties, there are more deductions.
So when you take home $60-80 thousand a year, remember , you get a whole lot of deductions before you pay a dime in taxes. See , when you break down the numbers properly, it will cost you more in higher premiums, co-pays, deductables,and higherr premiums than it will EVER cost you in taxes to support a Publicly SEEDED, premium billing, government run health care plan.

Reid will ram through one of the absurd health care plans floating around Capitol Hill at his own risk. He is having major trouble here in NV politically (although, strangely, not in raising beau coup bucks from lobbyists, unions and special interest groups) and demeaning the protestors and other unhappy constituents as un-American has cost him mightily. This and the Cap and Trade nonsense may cook his goose here in Nov 2010. Reid has also refused to hold any open townhall meetings on the healthcare debate, preferring to preach to his union/leftist base and hold a bogus “phone townhall” (where I’ll predict the “callers” are stacked with union and Democrat hacks. “The times they are a changin’”, Harry. I’m sure if you lose your buddy Obama will appoint you Comissar of this that or the other to stay on the federal payroll.

The Democrats won’t ram anything through. Even Obama can’t be so naive as to allow that. It will come flying back at them shorty thereafter – and no one wants another Bush in the White House.

Thanks RhiannonHR: Problem is that most of us have trouble with all the legal-speak.
Can’t they have interpreters for this stuff?

Bipatisanship or lack of vision???.
Bipatisanship is a means not an end.It can never substitute for a party flatform nor vision.Enough of these republicans.If election has consequence then on with it!!!.

I’m afraid it’s worse than this. What you are witnessing is the “Change” that some were voting for. This is the eminent change from democracy to a dictatorship as part of that change to socialism. They fully intend on ramming this down the throat of every American whether you like it or not. None of them get it any more. None of them.

Thanks RhiannonHR: Problem is that most of us have trouble with all the legal-speak.
Can’t they have interpreters for this stuff?
Posted by: Jon F | Aug 20, 2009 4:11:11 AM
LOL Yeah, I know what you mean. Like I said before, it took me 3 days to get thru it all. A dictionary, thesaraus, and the internet are wonderful tools. Other than that, you’d have to know a paralegal, lawyer, or legal secretary.

Well, voter intimidation last Nov., union and ACORN thugs at town hall meetings. What can we expect from this comment?

The Dems keep talking about how health care reform is a “moral imperative”. President Obama even told a group of rabbis yesterday that “We are God’s partners in matters of life and death.” So what is the moral code of government run health care in “matters of life and death” when it comes to the Veterans Administration Page 24 of their health care manual instructs the veteran to INITIAL AND DATE the page, then fill out the checklist as follows:
What makes your life worth living?
Instructions This exercise will help you think about and express what really matters to you. For each row, check (✔) one answer to express how you would feel if this factor by itself described you.
Here are the answer choices, note that there is no “ok” choice, only “bad” choices: (what sick b*stard designed this?)
difficult, but acceptable
worth living, but just barely
not worth living
can’t answer now
And now the question:
a. I can no longer walk but get around in a wheelchair.
b. I can no longer get outside—I spend all day at home.
c. I can no longer contribute to my family’s well being.
d. I am in severe pain most of the time.
e. I have severe discomfort most of the time (such as
nausea, diarrhea, or shortness of breath).
f. I rely on a feeding tube to keep me alive.
g. I rely on a kidney dialysis machine to keep me alive.
h. I rely on a breathing machine to keep me alive.
i. I need someone to help take care of me all of time.
j. I can no longer control my bladder.
k. I can no longer control my bowels.
l. I live in a nursing home.
m. I can no longer think clearly-I am confused all the time.
n. I can no longer recognize family/friends
o. I can no longer talk and be understood by others.
p. My situation causes severe emotional burden for my
family (such as feeling worried or stressed all the time).
q. I am a severe financial burden on my family.
r. I cannot seem to “shake the blues.”
s. Other (write in):
Finally, to REALLY push the vet over the edge, here are the instructions at the bottom of the page:
Instructions To help others make sense out of your answers, think about the following questions and be sure to explain your answers to your loved ones and health care providers.
If you checked “worth living, but just barely” for more than one factor, would a combination of these factors make your life “not worth living?” If so, which factors?
If you checked “not worth living,” does this mean that you would rather die than be kept alive?
If you checked “can’t answer now,” what information or people do you need to help you decide?
You can access the book at www1 . va . gov / pugetsound/ docs / ylyc.pdf (you have to remove the sapces, my psots won’t appear for some reason if I link to it…)

Rob Clayton wrote: “The gov’t ( Obama ) is turning their backs on the US population. It does not matter 80% of the US is happy with current health care.”
Earlier this month, a Marist poll asked, “Do you think the current health care system in this country needs major changes, minor changes, or no changes at all?”
Major Changes: 65%
Minor Changes: 29%
No Changes at all: 6%
Welcome to the real world, Rob.

“So are you implying that any ‘major change’ (which is what Obama is pushing) is ‘good’ change?”
I’m not implying anything other than Rob Clayton’s “80% happy” assertion is way off the mark.

OK , it’s apparent ya’ll have no interest in your own self intrest.
Maybe this will help.anyone over 65 is already involved in medicare, a form
of socialized medicine. Read on
If ya’ll continue to baaa loudly and vote against G.S.A. H.C. You deserve what you get.
One of the mantras of the opposition to meaningful health reform has been a fear of a government takeover of the health care sector. This fear is expressed virtually nonstop on talk radio, the right wing blogosphere, Fox News and at town hall meetings across the country. As we know, for better or for worse, the Obama administration is not proposing a government takeover of the entire health care system, but overstatement and exaggeration is unavoidable in these kinds of debates.
The image of government takeover of health care is meant to strike fear into good market oriented Americans who believe the government can do nothing right, particularly in an area as difficult, personal and important as health care. The fear of government involvement in any aspect of our life is a deeply held American value which allows us to continue to believe in the myth of small government. It is any easy fear to exploit even when speaking to people who have good jobs because they studied at public universities, know their parents have enough to eat because of social security, drive to work on federally funded highways and generally live in the 21st century industrialized world.
Nonetheless, opponents of health care reform believe fear of government involvement in health care to be something shared by all Americans. Before we collectively start quaking in fear of a government takeover of health care it might make sense to slow down and consider that a fair amount of our health care system already has strong government involvement.
Old people, some poor people and veterans already have government supported health care through Medicare, Medicaid and various veterans benefits. These programs are, of course, far from perfect, but they are pretty good. While many seniors would like to see Medicare reformed, it is rare to see senior citizens, or organizations of senior citizens call for abolishing Medicare. Similarly, many veterans, some who served decades ago rely on veteran’s hospitals for an important part of their health care. My father is a veteran who voices more than the occasional criticism of the US government, but I have never heard him say that he wishes veterans didn’t get any health care or that the government should close the veterans hospitals.
Senior citizens and veterans are both well organized and powerful interest groups, representing tens of millions of Americans, but government involvement in the health care sector has hardly caused any pubic outrage among these two key constituent groups. On the contrary, both usually push very hard for the expansion of Medicare and veterans benefits. If the American people really wanted government out of the health care industry, or if the government was unable to play a useful and positive role in the delivery of health care, it is pretty likely that these groups would have made a lot of noise about this issue years ago, but they have not.
Medicaid recipients are not as well organized as either veterans or senior citizens, but recipients of Medicaid very rarely argue for weaker Medicaid programs or less involvement by the government in providing health care services. Again, the opposite is true. Recipients of Medicaid have often shown a preference for bigger programs with more government involvement.
Medicare, Medicaid and veterans’ benefits have become an indispensible part of our health care system providing valuable services and benefits to people, many of whom would have very few health care options were it not for these government programs. This is something which should be kept in mind when scare tactics about government takeover of health care are used. These programs also demonstrate the inaccuracy, or perhaps nuttiness, of some of the more outlandish claims about Obama’s proposed programs. For example, if the government were really going to ration health care or set up “death panels” as part of government health care programs, wouldn’t the government have started by doing these things to the poor, the elderly or disabled veterans-precisely the people who rely on the government for health care today.
The Obama administration, of course, is not proposing a full government takeover of the health care system, but they are proposing increased government involvement in health care. An incremental change of this kind, while likely to make a tremendous difference in the lives of some, although unfortunately probably not all, of those currently uninsured, is simply not a radical measure. It does not represent a new way of paying for health care services in the US, but a readjustment to the relative balance of the public and private sectors in health care and a way to leave fewer people with no health care at all, which is what most Americans really fear.,
Health Care

it’s time to put politics aside.
Why do you argue about individual politicians? They are not looking out for your best iterests.
Those baaaing for one side or the other are wasting sound space.
L:ook at the final plan. Don’t kill something because a clown like Grassly says so.
Please, this could finally be the time WWE THE PEOPLE bring balance back to our great country.
For the good of our nation, read, get educated on the issues, then come to a decision.
So many are against abortion.Some consider early term abortion murder. Why abort a plan that has not yet been written?
Ya’ll need to become thinkers.
SECREG_756

Why spend billions when you can spend trillions?
$9,000,000,000,000.00 in debt over ten years.
Change you can believe in.
By any means necessary.
Selfish waste gift wrapped by Obama.

Just wanted to let everyone know that Bill Moyers will be covering a cool documentary on his PBS show tonight called, “Money Driven Medicine”. It should be really interesting!