GOPers to Biden: Stop Using Stimulus Jobs Numbers

Yes, because the big problem with the economy is Joe Biden pointing out that spending half a trillion dollars on infrastructure, scientific research grants, health care subsidies, unemployment benefits, salaries for police, teachers, etc creates jobs…
Glad to see the Republicans are staying focused on the important stuff: Bumper stickers for their next election. At least this nonsense isn’t kneecapping foreign policy like when they condemned Clinton’s clumsy effort to kill Bin Laden back in the 90′s as “Monica Missiles.”

the california state prison system alone got caught adding 16000 fake jobs to the stimulas fiasco today, and they were caught by democrats.

If the Obama administration could give us an accurate account of jobs created then I would say it is fine to announce the new jobs, but they have been fabricating job numbers in counties that don’t even exist. This seems to me to be fraudulent. Anyway, vote for Ron Paul in 2012 even if he doesn’t run.

If the Whitehouse succumbed to all GOP requests, the Whitehouse would be doing nothing at all. Its apparent the GOP has no agenda other than taking back power, no matter the cost. The GOP has proven itself incapable of doing anything positive for America. That’s why I am now an Independent, a former GOP’er.

independent1959… iam an independent also, formerly a dem. men and women need jobs more that we need cap and trade a health carte plan that raise premiums and tax without providing care for 5 years. both parties smell bad but one generates jobs while the others taxes people who have jobs.

Indpendent1959 -Doing nothing is actually preferred. Everything the government touches seems to turn rancid. Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, Sallie Mae, FHA, FDIC have all contributed greatly to the boondoggle we are in. They are all forms of government regulation on the free market leading to misallocated capital resulting in bubbles that must eventually deflate. What needs to happen is a shrinking of government and government intervention. The central planners have failed. What we will see soon is a currency crisis and a greatly reduced standard of living. The good thing is that we will be less apt to bomb other countries.

gsplsngr – The government has no way of determining what jobs are best to grow the economy. That is why these stimuli fail. The free market must dictate job growth or job loss. Employing a bunch of government officials to oversee so-called shovel-ready projects is a joke and quite frankly costs even more money.

Catman…I guess you mean the type of tax credits that have enabled the rich to be richer and allowed them to transport their jobs overseas with to further fatten their bottom lines? I do not know what world you live in but I have watched that good old conservative propaganda concerning “free unregulated economic policy” along with tax breaks for the rich just about bankrupt our nation. And yet Boehner and his bozos just want to propose more of the same. There is a real good reason that the middle class has been stagnant in their wage and benefit situation the past two decades. Thanks to conservatives “bow to the rich”.

Huh: I disagree with your opinion of doing nothing. Nothing is a track to assured failure. I do agree with your penultimate sentence. I stopped supporting the GOP due to the fact the GOP led us to the point of a devaluing dollar, long-term artificially low interest rates, a false faith in supply-side economics and GOP administrations who racked up $8.3 trillion of our $12 trillion debt.

jhw539…the govt didnt create the internet….al gore did…please get your facts straight.

I’m happy the government doesn’t get its economic advice from many of these commentors or Fox News. The naysayers would Hoover us right into a much more severe economic situation.

jhw, I base judgement of transparency for government by accuracy as well as content.
I’m not saying the administration is deliberately lying because I don’t know. But I do know that a person can lie 3 ways:
1. Tell what is known to be untrue…commission.
2. Say nothing when you should—ommission.
3. Deliberately pick & choose—trickery.
I can’t prove it, but I believe the administration is quilty of all 3…my personal opinion.
Transparency from a government must require accuracy.
I do agree that all government bodies should be totally open about its dealings where security is not risked. But simply pointing at the Republicans for not doing so does not remove the burden from President Obama’s administration.
He promised increased accuracy, increased oversight, and transparency. I expect him to live up to those promises.

Indpendent1959 – Should be interesting to see what the outcome of so much government interference is. Greatly devalued dollar combined with enormous deficits and out of control debt burden seems much worse than allowing the free market to be free. Of course we would have to end corporatism, and the only way for that to happen is to vote for people with the integrity of Ron Paul. Fat chance of everybody being that honorable.

the party of no has no room to complain about anything. they created this mess and can offer nothing to make it better.

Sorry if I don’t share your opinion that our nation is ‘rancid’.
Amen, jhw! Our country is having a lot of problems, but we are still the best nation in the world.

Joe is getting his facts from Charlie Rangel and his VIP info from Dodd.

Huh? Here we go with the Republicans Crying again! They are such babies….they just don’t ever have anything positive to say. NO NO NO! No credibility!

I just found out that climate change is a farce. Many emails exposing fraud have been posted on the internet totally reversing anything I believed.

jhw539 – Many of those things could be developed in the free market or at the state level. To send money to DC to be redistributed is part of the problem. Education is a failure, medicare and medicaid are fiscal calamities, public university tuitions are through the roof thanks to Sallie Mae, we can’t shoot the pirates more than half the time. While it is true the Federal government has got a few things right. More often then not they get it wrong at huge expense to the taxpayer. This is the point I am trying to make. Government through tax laws and regulations have moved our industries overseas, gutted the middle class, and bailouted failed institutions sending us into fiscal ruin.

bobcat – Wah! Don’t consider myself republican because lately they have been a bit too militaristic for my liking.

Joe…………don’t bother listening to the Republican peanut gallery.

jhw539…the govt didnt create the internet….al gore did…please get your facts straight.
catman | Nov 24, 2009 2:04:50 PM
Ha ha. (Anyone who cares beyond the joke, wikipedia has an excellent summary.)

As a right leaning Independent I can be more open than the blind following Left and Right. It’s obvious that when Bush passed TARP or whatever the 800billion dollar fund for Wall Street that it was a horrible decision. “No string attached,” and as a Dem recently stated it was written in 3 pages of language (not sure if this is true.) Bush doubled the Debt to around 10 Trillion in 8 years. Obama’s estimates are to triple this over the next 10 years, not including health care! So doubled TO 10trillion in 8, or Triple 12.5 trillion in 10 years equals…..upwards of 38trillion dollars for all of you liberals who are hoping the government gives you a free education. Great point by the way…If Healthcare is SOOOO important; why would we consider passing a bill that would not even provide coverage for 4 years? Because insuring people right away is not important, Democrats controlling yet another entity is.

Biden needs to not only shut about the saved or created crap, he needs to apologize to the American people for making us all a little dumber every time he talks.
He is a complete moron and without the protection of the liberal media, he would have been exposed as such a looooooong time ago.

Many of those things could be developed in the free market or at the state level.
Huh | Nov 24, 2009 2:22:38 PM
They weren’t, not in the US nor in any other country in the world. Libertarian fundamentalism is as practical as Communism – sounds nice on paper, but an utter failure in reality. And we live in reality.
It’s not coincidence that the government build Hoover dam, created the interstate system, created and funded the internet, etc. These are the types of Commons programs that do not have a direct payback but enrich all of society. What private force would EVER create the internet we have today? Many private networks tried, stagnated, and then they fell over themselves in the rush to plug into the Internet.

how can they tout any jobs data when its suspect??? they even admitted numbers of jbs saved/created at that stupid recovery.org website cannot be valdiated.hmmmm.. meanwhile, msnbc is reporting a 1/4 of all mortgages are at risk of foreclosure. have a great day everybody!!

Republicans, sheesh. If an idea or solution crossed one of their minds, it would a red letter day in our history. The GOP is known for their tantrums, linear thinking, and their complete lack of anthing intellectual. Bunch of babies….

One wishes Biden would shut up that’s for sure, but it’s not going to happen any time soon that’s for sure.

Joe Biden was a “Jack-ass” when he was a U.S. Senator so why would he be anything else as a Vice-President? Did he have some dramatic change -over in January 2009? No, that is why he is still a fool. Don’t mess with Joe – because he is already one.

You Lie! Is more appropriate

From the Washington Post today:
“Joblessness for 16-to-24-year-old black men has reached Great Depression proportions — 34.5 percent in October, more than three times the rate for the general U.S. population. And last Friday, the Bureau of Labor Statistics reported that unemployment in the District, home to many young black men, rose to 11.9 percent from 11.4 percent, even as it stayed relatively stable in Virginia and Maryland.”
Hey Joe, YOU LIE!!

The letter nails it-
‘Created or saved’ was made up by politicians- it is NOT an economic metric.
Not only the administration, but the media repreats the phoney metric ‘created or saved’.
Mr. President and Vice-President (and all media who repeat it), it is the unemployment rate that matters, stupid.

jhw539
The private sector of the American free market system is the reason 90% of all pharacueticals have been created, and why anyone can buy a laptop for $200 now, and why ever person in line at the food kitchens in my city have cell phones, and why we can all fly from one corner of the USA to the other for $350, and why the best schools, hospitals and treatment facilities were built HERE IN AMERICA, and why are “poor” people are FAT.
Capitalism produces so much more then a gov’t run by barney frank, harry reid, and nancy pelosi ever could.
Without the invisible hand, aka the profit incentive, the whole world would look like the soviet union or china.
The free market system has given Americans (and much of the rest of the world) a quality of life that they would never have been able to enjoy without it. We are the single greatest contributors to AIDS research/treatments (contrary to rev racist’s claim that “America created the AIDS virus”. The list of examples are endless.

Apparently Biden’s motto is: Repeating a lie often enough the people will begin to believe that it is the truth. (It’s called brain washing.) At what point does devotion to this administration give way to reality? People are wising up to their magician trick of distracting our eyes and ears while their hands/minions are up to no good.

What? Tell Biden to stop lying? How unthinkable.

With Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Ashcroft and “Brownie”, we eventually knew that just about anything they said was a lie. This is the main reason the GOP lost last year. Should this administration prove to be anywhere near as truth-challenged, it too will be out.

He should shut up just like the GOP should quit manufacturing its racism, fear, and hatred. Keep it up Joe!
Posted by: chuck
___________________________
Maybe, chuck, you can show me an example or two of the Republicans spreading racism and hate.
In 2002, during the Paul Welstone funeral the Democratic Congress turned the funeral into a political rally shouting anti-Republican slogans in the same room where the coffin was. This was not the only time your party did it. They did the same thing at the Caretta Scott King funeral.
Since the GOP is supposed to be the party of hatred, I wonder if you can show me an example of when the Republicans turned a funeral into a political rally, shouting anti-Democrat slogans.

Right behind, you know how to “trick” also, sound like Bamy, you don’t seriously think anyone that works for a living believes you…..or do you?

“I greatly appreciate the free market, but I am not so foolish as to dismiss the small but critical role the government plays in keeping it working.”
—
I will definitely second that view, jhw. The important key to remember (and is often ignored by both the market place and government)is that a delicate balance must be maintained for it to work.
When one grabs too much control is when ethe economy suffers.

45% and dropping. highest disapproval rating yet. obama needs the counsel of bill clinton and learn to dive to the middle or go down with the socialists

Malcat…if you stay up to date on issues, if you do not alllow your church, political party or anyone else to control your thinking with narrow minded propaganda…you have no reason to “feel insulted”. My beef is with those who listen to “conservative soundbites” and then go out and cut off their own nose and vote against themselves. They do it so easily too by demonizing government in their propaganda. Do you know of anywhere in the world where you could live without a government? All that garbage about not trusting the government is a “red herring” to make us all take our eyes off the ball – i.e. our own welfare. All that misuse of terms such as liberty, freedom and the “sanctity of the constitution. All misdirection so they can fear monger and spread conspiracy theories. Now if you don’t fall for that crap, then good for you. You have no reason to be insulted.

Mary, I am beginning to believe that Obama wants the black race to be unemployed and dependent on the government. Their unemployment numbers are not so shocking, are they?

Our very educated experts have their degrees based upon real science obtained through discoveries of some not so expert minds and/or the philosophy of pied-pipers. Too many of our experts fall into the category of what a sharp minded 11-year old shared with a group of adults about being perceive as smart. “If you can confuse people they’ll think you are smart.” So it is wonderful that people get degrees based upon what they can regurgitate from their predecessors or professors. The disappointing aspect of this is that these degrees are presumed to convey credence that they have our best interest in mind or that their ideology has a practical application in our free society. And of course like Biden; if they can keep us confused we’ll follow them with the hope that they know something we don’t.

Since when does the GOP and it’s “Manson followers” tell our country’s President and Vice-President what to do? I am so tired of hearing the Republicans speak their vile, racist, hipocritic “better than thou”, crap;. The ones who should shut up are them!!! If Republicans were to win in 2012, I will move from the United States.

Tyrone – You nailed it!

“Since when does the GOP and it’s “Manson followers” tell our country’s President and Vice-President what to do? I am so tired of hearing the Repuglicans speak their vile, racist, hipocritic “better than thou”, cra;. The ones who should shut up are them!!! If Republicans were to win in 2012, I will move from the United States.”
———-
Marina, I’m thinking you already live outside the US.
You see, in the US everyone gets to speak their mind. Everyone gets to partipate in government.
The President of the US, and all federally elected officials work for every American citizen…not just those in their own party.
In the USA, each Congressional representative gets to ask the administration whatever they deem necessary.
Of course if you do live in the US, feel free to move somewhere else where the citizens are controlled by whoever is in power instead of the democracy we have here.

I thought the Bush tax cuts were going to create jobs. How’s that working now???

“You see, in the US everyone gets to speak their mind. Everyone gets to partipate in government.”
Hilarious! Well said malcat.

Wow, its obvious by the posts I’ve read hear that the dumBO lemmings still can’t see the emperor has no clothes. The only thing the jr community organizer has been transparent with are the bribes he is using from his transparent porkulus to sway senators on the ponzi scheme health care. The spineless one has to lie about job creation so that you lemmings keep drinking the kool aid and not ask to see the receipts for the union pay offs, the bank bonus pay offs, the trip to Denmark..etc It is the same reason the spineless one will not make a decision regarding our troops. He could care less about American soldiers. Its all about the dumBO. How am I going to look with a decision to reinforce the troops? OOPS, can’t do that the moderate dems won’t back my ponzi scheme…How will I look if I begin to pull troops back? OOPS lose support from the hard line dems for health care ponzi scheme. You dumBO worshipers got just what you deserve. A worthless, spineless, narcissist community organizer. Just keep lying dumBO, maybe it will come true.Choke on that hope and change.

1) catman – Al Gore did not create the internet, you bozo, it grew from a defense project ARPANET (which by the way, my cousin DID help create, hence I know my facts). Al Gore as a senator pushed legislation that made it what we recognize and use today. 2) The economic disaster we face today is far older than Bush or Obama. It has been a long time coming – about since WW2. Grow the &^%# up and learn to read real history and not believe everything you are told by people who are foaming at the mouth while they talk. 3) Todays Republicans have hijacked the name of a party that used to stand for something besides hate and greed. 4) Decide on your agenda – he is a socialist, he is greedy, he has done nothing, yet he is gutting the constitution, health care will bankrupt us, but wait, somehow tax cuts won’t – nothing the right says makes any damn sense – it is all mutually exclusive! In closing I guess you find that black guy in office pretty hard to swallow… and Boehner needs to stop baking his brain in the tanning bed. Really.

“His administration worked hard to get the money out for states to stimulate the economy with jobs and to get people busy working. ”
———
Vicki, since the much acclaimed website that is supposed to report where the money went is hideously flawed with inaccuracies right now, we don’t know where the money went.
Right now, to name a couple,
1)it reported 9 jobs were created when what happened was: a shoe manufacturer in KY got a grant for $890 for 9 pairs of workboots.
2)it reported several new jobs created when $37000 dollars was used to give COLA raises to existing employees.
I’m a data analyst. When my data is found to have those types of errors, ALL the data is suspect until audited and verified.
The Chairman of President Obama’s Recovery Board has stated that he cannot verify the data posted on recovery.gov. He has stated he doesn’t even know who got stimulous money.

Pali 4 Prez: I’m still waiting!

He should shut up just like the GOP should quit manufacturing its racism, fear, and hatred. Keep it up Joe!
Posted by: chuck | Nov 24, 2009 2:03:43 PM
So is that the democrats answer to everything? If you disagree with them you should just shut up. And then do some name calling to deflect attention from the awful job the stimulus is doing. Why don’t you provide some proof that the stimulus worked? Or show how the numbers are legit. Probably because the facts are not on your side so you need to create a diversion.

Vice-President Biden can keep right on talking about the jobs created and the jobs saved because he has the information to back him up. Rubber-stamping republicans have proven how disgusting and rancid they are concerning anything for average working people. Republican focus is how much money they can pump into fat cats pockets while railing at big government. There is only one word to describe Congressional republicans right now and it is hypocritical. How can anyone trust corporate bought-and paid-for republicans doing their greedy worst to cause everything in our government to fail?

I think the real issue on jobs is we need to make the people who hire people feel they can do so and make money. To do that the country has to stop fighting over the health care reform bill, just do something and move on. When the world does not end and people do not start to die in droves because of it, we will get a rebound. Right now the “right” springs a leak everyday over some piece of silliness and the evening talk shows go nuts over stuff like Sarah Palin writing a book! COME ON PEOPLE. We have much to get done, and we need to move past this “stuff”.

Steve
She went after the leader of the Alaskan republican party for his coziness to big oil. She took on big oil itself for its strangulation over alaska. She sold the private jet and fired the private chef. As a result, both the republican and democratic establishments HATED her but she was loved by the people (90% approval rating when mccain picked her).

Wouldn’t it be nice if the Liberals would realize that they are driving this country into the toilet. (cheapshot and I’m proud of it).

Steve: not all names are listed but I am sure you could find them with a little effort.
She resigned a good position (Alaska Gas and Oil Regulatory Commission) because a fellow Commission member (Chair of the Alaska Republican Party) misused his office and position. He was using the fax, computers, printing room and all to promote the Republican endeavors while in a state job. That is a huge no-no in any government employment position.
She resigned and made her point, and within weeks Randy Ruderich (the above bad guy) found his butt out on the street and a subsequent investigation found him guilty and he was fined $12,000 Next she went after our most horrible Governor ever, Governor Murkowski, and damned if she didn’t beat him! All of us here in Alaska, except the Democrats, are sick of our state’s corruption. That fact was shouted to the heavens after she was elected with an overwhelming point spread. After she got into office she started going after corrupt legislators, put four of them in prison, and indicted six more..
This is the difference between Obama and Palin she fires corrupt individuals he appoints them as Czars!

Bumbling Biden doesnt know how to shut up.. and Obama cannot stop lying… God help America !!!

huh@2:22 You hit the nail on the head.

Miscalculation my foot! When you start reporting jobs data from districts that don’t exist you are simply making it up. Biden, Obama, or anyone in Congress doesn’t have a clue on what the numbers are. Most states are using stimulus money as a one time band aid before they lay off more people next year.

LETS BLAME EVERY THING ON EVERYBODY ELSE
WHAT WE NEED IS A NEW CONGRESS…ONE THATS WANTS TO WORK FOR AMERICANS AND NOT FOR THIER PARTY OR THIER PERSONAL INTREST

Can we get Bidens comments on the hacked
emails regarding the scam of global
warming ? Better yet, ask Obama for a
comment.

batesba74
Thank you for articulating better then I could!
Also, while she was fighting corruption in Alaska , BO was in bed with convicted felon/slumlord to obtain a 2 million dollar mansion for himself (truly change we can all believe in).
I wonder why we never heard about the scumbag tony rezko, aka obama’s senate campaign fundraiser? Or how BO rabidly campained for blago? Or how bill ayers threw BO a political fundraiser in his living room!
And BO aligned himself with criminal organizations like ACORN, who used their thug-like methods to FORCE banks to lower their lending standards.

Both parties are flawed. The Dems have problems but I do not believe they are worse than the GOP who drove this nation down in this decade. I am not for tax cuts resulting in greater deficits/debt, I am not for legislation elbowing in on the Bill of Rights (The Patriot Act), I am not for being led by the nose via fear (Rove/Bush/Cheney), and no one lied more than the last administration. I am not for intolerance of gays or other peaceful Americans. I believed in GHW Bush’s ‘kinder, gentler nation’ which obviously was not endorsed by Bush II. Palin’s or Limbaugh’s narrow definition of ‘true’ Americans is contradictory of what America is. So you see, the Dems win out by default until something better comes along.

I say blame Obama, that my new motto. Those democrats wanted change, its coming. When the health care package gets approved just watch what that will do to unemployment, it will hit a new high, that will be a change.

The GOP won’t admit any progress in this country. It would screw up their mantra and agenda.
Thanks to their extreme ideology, they’ve lost the moderates. Thank you GOP. Keep sending in the clowns.

Palin 4 Prez Any time

Racism?! I’ve stopped marking one of the above because I would be denying my Native-American heritage. So I’m glad to see ‘Other’ as an option. But still too many are looking at my skin color with an eye of prejudice. So I don’t see Obama as black, white or …. I just see him as someone using his skin color to take advantage of people that still claim to be Black, White, Hispanic, ?-American, etc… He used it to sway the Black vote and to get the votes of the Whites that genuinely have a desire to share in an experience that can be viewed as an amends for the atrocity of White slave owners. I had tears of hope for reconciliation when Obama made his victory speech and at the inaugural. Sadly it has become all too obvious that his agenda is not reconciliation with the preservation of our liberties. So Palin has done a great service in convincing us that we are still smart enough to peek behind the curtain and comprehend what this administration is up to. And Biden is helping us realize that this administration is not as brilliant as we had hoped.

mrgmorgan56@2:39 The GOPers aren’t as smart as the Dems who have brought great ideas to the table like negotiating with religious terrorists who have vowed to kill all infidels, take the wealth away from those who have earned it and provide jobs for the workers, be the “Sugar Daddy” for anyone who can’t/won’t make it on their own, refuse to harvest our own energy resources, use taxpayer dollars to bail out failed businesses run by crooks, support labor unions that drive up the cost of manufacture rendering us unable to compete with foreign manufacturers and forcing our businesses to relocate overseas, advocate the killing of unborn children so the irresponsible mothers can look good,welcome illegal immigrants into our country and give them all the benefits of citizenship without any of the liabilities, provide affordable home mortgages to people who can’t afford mortgages, make healthcare insurance affordable for people who can’t afford premiums or co-payments, refuse to reform tort law, eliminate the word God from all public places while reserving the right to teach about Buddha and Confuscious in our schools. Brilliant freaking liberals!!

He should shut up just like the GOP should quit manufacturing its racism, fear, and hatred. Keep it up Joe!
Posted by: chuck | Nov 24, 2009 2:03:43 PM
So is that the democrats answer to everything? If you disagree with them you should just shut up. And then do some name calling to deflect attention from the awful job the stimulus is doing. Why don’t you provide some proof that the stimulus worked? Or show how the numbers are legit. Probably because the facts are not on your side so you need to create a diversion.

The phantom congressional districts: You are aware the erroneous districts are due to individuals at the worksite level (stimulus funds recipients) not knowing what congressional district they are in? They filled out the forms without checking and that data resulted in the hoopla. From what I understand, the zip codes were correct and the districts are being corrected.

Independent1959 | Nov 24, 2009 4:51:20 PM
The GDP increased almost 100% on the strength of increased Government Spending! Also Reagans tax cuts lead to record growth and job creation.

Third Quarter GDP Growth Revised Down, Inflated By Government Spending!
wow that headline sure pops up a lot.
I dont think inflated is a good thing in this case, what about spending in the private sector, the spending that creates jobs?

jhw539 –”Like the Internet, US government created, funded, nurtured, and still controlled? Or Hoover dam? Or the Interstate system? Or universal education? Or Medicare (go for it Republicans – be ideologically honest and dismantle Medicare)? Or the public university system (California’s alone is better than any other nation’s in the world)? Or overseeing the growth of the most prosperous free nation mankind has ever seen?” –
The internet – From a business standpoint its one of the greatest technological breakthroughs we have ever had – from a private standpoint its a cesspool that promotes illegal activity and crime without regulation.
Hoover Dam and the interstate system – both products of Keyesian economics and while we reap the benefits today, they NEVEr accomplished their intended goals of restarting a staggering economy – under the new deal, 8 years of infrastructure spending left us with a still record setting 17% unemployment rate (sort of like where we are heading today)- it took pure free market economics spurred by the onset of WW2 to end the depression.
Universal education – you mean public schools?? are you actually trying to say that our public school system si something to brag about?? its one of our biggest failures.
Medicare – another unsustainable government program that is now touted by this administration as the program that they will be skimming 400 billion in “waste” off of to fund healthcare..
So now we are actually using the waste of previous government programs to fund new ones??

Private sector spending is down due to the recession. This is why government steps in to spur the economy. I much prefer defined government spending as it eventually reaches a conclusion. Tax cuts are like candy to children, once started it is very difficult to end, resulting in continual budget deficits. Again, research the national debt charts.

CND FOX – “Catman…I guess you mean the type of tax credits that have enabled the rich to be richer and allowed them to transport their jobs overseas with to further fatten their bottom lines?”— There has been a lot of folks on here being asked to back their statements up.. you should try it as well.
Here are the facts, those tax cuts affected middle class business owners as well as wealthy companies. through those tax cuts the economy grew EVERY TIME THEY WERE USED. Every time keyesian economic “infrastructure” spending has been used, it has failed…
Time for you to back up YOUR “facts”

“Yes, working together would be good. Need I remind everyone it is the GOP who embraces ‘culture wars’? Intentionaly divisive, weakens our nation.”

“Shut up Republicans! You had 8 years and screwed up the country the worst since the Great Depression! Please Shut up and let the new President do his job without your unpatriotic complaints.”
—-
Endrepubs: like I posted earlier in this country no one has to shut up.
This isn’t some two-bit dictatorship where the party in power is all powerful.
This is the United States of America. In this country, the elected representatives are required to serve all constituents, not just those who voted for them.
In this country, the minority party can talk all they want. They can ask questions and they are entitiled to answers.
The Democrats didn’t shut up when Republicans are in majority and the Republicans don’t have to shut up now.
If you don’t like it, feel free to exit.

jhw539 -”Yes, yes it is. Look up the definition. The administration posted all the data they had. A lot of the data they had, that had been submitted, was bad. BECAUSE of the transparancy, the errors were caught and pressure brought to bear…. Not transparent would be the standard operating procedure of having all the data cleaned, collated, triple checked, organized, bound and printed in triplicate…” ———
Submitting bad data is not transparency and even if it was, then the administration should not have touted as evidence that they were successful something that they knew was simple raw and unchecked data.
Since when is correcting data to reflect accurate outcomes less transparent than posting and quoting raw and unchecked data.. that argument is insane even for you on your most kool-aid induced stupors.. oh but wait… in todays world, something that is in the encyclopaedia is suspect, but something blogged on the internet becomes immediately undisputable FACT…
How silly of me.. i have to go now and validate the existance of aliens becuase joe schmo siad he saw them and posted it on his blog.. IT MUST BE TRUE..

independent 1959…a cpa who likes taxes doesnt bode well for your clients. tax cuts for hiring people in the private sector…the only way this job picture will turn around as it did for regan. i would have dealt with jobs before i dealt with cap and trde and health scare….in the meantime 45% and dropping….not a good sign.

This will be classic, I can’t wait untill the Bush tax cuts roll back so all you haters who have no clue of what you are talking about get an increase too. The best part will be when lower income earners will make just enough to not get a subsidy for their new found health insurance and have to buy this trash, energy bills will go up with cap n trade, then Bush tax cuts expire and boom…..Bye bye Barry.

independent 1959…there was no true growth under bush? the only ILLUSION of growth i have seen come from joe biden.whatever it takes to keep people working…whether it artifically low interst rates or mortgage lending or tax cuts, jobs are much more important than what has been done to date.kissing foreign dignitary but is not creating jobs.

malcat: You and all of your extremist right-wing fanatics need to practice what you preach. Your the last people in the world that have ANY PLACE WHATSOEVER to preach to any person or group about what is right or wrong. There is no truth or reality in anything you have posted on any of these sites. I have yet to see you present a balanced approach or solution in any of your posts. You are a perfect example of all the reasons why the right-wing fanatics have RUINED the Republican party and why it will not see power again for the 20-30 years.

jhw, I understand what you are saying about raw data. I’m a data analyst myself so I have personal understanding.
But there is a difference in raw data and unverified data. One should always verify the incoming data is correct and then make it available as raw data. This should be done without tampering such as slice-and-dice and massaging that one does to analyze the data.

Why does anyone CARE? The Republican Political Machine ran trillions through Iraq looking for “Weapons of Mass Destruction”. They borrowed trillions more from China without disclosing it in the National Budget. If you WANT a bad economy, follow the experts, Bush/Cheney and the rest of their party.

2010 and 2012 will be great years, the liberals both dems amd repubs alike will get the living crap kicked out of them……..cant wait

I’ll handle this: Dlboggan, have you ever read the constitution? Probably not. Most of the garbage you wrote about are things our government stuck themselves into. Our government is there to protect us and not much more. Social security, medicare, medicade, Hoover Dam someone else brought up, schools, are all things that some politician thought they had a great idea for the (greater good). Look how well all that crap turned out. Police and fire are on the local level, all that other trash is just that…. Trash.

Stickman, I have to disagree on your comments about Medicare and so forth. While it is true that the Constitution lists very few ‘jobs’ of government, providing for the common good definitely should include providing for citizens in need of help.
Of course, like all things human, sometimes we do a good job, sometimes we really can screw things up.

I have to go donate blood, malcat I appreciate your honesty. I think however if we had anything close to the personal responsibility lets say the people of China have with a 50% savings rate we wouldn’t need the likes of Harry & Barry helping us out. I never thought I would use China as a better example than us but there it is. Anyway I am no expert but I know when government is doing to much and to litlle….. This folks is way to much. IMO.

I live in Los Angeles, and Tim Cavanagh of the LA Weekly used a similar approach that the stimulus was a fraud – that it did not produce jobs – only pork barrel projects. However, what Cavanagh and other stimulus critics are really committing errors of admission.
For example, one of the stimulus projects in Los Angeles County involves a SMAP project by Cal Tech. That sounds like a typical pork project unless you take the troube to go to the Cal Tech Website to find out what the SMAP involves. When you do, you’ll discover that SMAP includes a satellite with scientific instruments. Someone has to make this scientific equipment, as well as the satellite and the rocket to launch the satellite. So SMAP does provides job. Furthermore some of the purposes of SMAP, includes flood and drought forecasts, long-term and more reliable atmospheric forecasts, as well as studies of agricultural and ecosystem productivity and wild fires. I’ve just provided a smattering of the purposes of SMAP – but I’d also suggest that this research is desperately needed for our economic survival.
The Los Angeles Metropolitan Transportation Authority “is getting” $ 850 million for “projects ranging from Gold Line East extension to HOV lanes.”, according to Cavanagh’s article. However, he does not state WHEN the MTA will receive these funds (the use of the progressive tense indicates that MTA has not yet received the money) or how many jobs will be created. However, an expansion of LA’s MTA project is desperately needed. And once the project is started, jobs will be created. The same applies to the $ 1.5 million West Hollywood will receive for “highway infrastructure.” and an energy efficiency project. Supposedly two jobs will be created by the energy efficiency project, however, all of these projects require the purchasing of various supplies and equipment, expenditures that will generate jobs.
A similar lack of analysis is present in Cavanaugh’s report that LA County is creating a $ 15.4 million grant to make energy-efficiency loans to homeowners. Again, Cavanaugh failed to mention whether any loan money has actually been spent. Nor does he seem to realize that weatherizing homes creates jobs both for installers and the people who manufacture insulation. Nor does he understand that weatherizing homes is an important factor in cutting down on energy use, and vital for saving our planet.
Again, this report, like all reports on the stimulus contains a lot of half-baked facts. It seems like someone just did enough on-line research to prove an a priori thesis – that the stimulus is horrible – without actually analyzing what the data means.

The gop just hates it when Americans find jobs.It means their outsourcing is failing.

The liberals in America haven’t got a clue of whats goining on. While they are trying to demonize conservatives and boasting about how smart they are-the American dollar has fallen 30 cents below the Euro dollar under their control.
Under the Democrat’s control the American dollar will soon be worthless.
It wasn’t long ago the Euro dollar was worth less then the American dollar. Now its worth more.

These blogs are worthless talking points… Hope these folks are getting paid for it. It wouldn’t be the first time, and it won’t be the last.

independent1959… iam an independent also, formerly a dem. men and women need jobs more that we need cap and trade a health carte plan that raise premiums and tax without providing care for 5 years. both parties smell bad but one generates jobs while the others taxes people who have jobs.
Posted by: catman | Nov 24, 2009 1:46:32 PM
_______________________________________
surely you jest in your insinuation that Republicans create jobs. Can you please explain to us which party was setting policy when the economy (which eliminated all of these jobs) was run into the ground? What party was it that took us from the black and cutting deficits to 12 trillion in the hole? Wouldn’t that be the same party you think is creating jobs? Hmmmmmmmmmm……..I wish you could explain to us in detail how that works. I’m sure it would be a great work of fiction.

wouldn’t it be nice for the Obama administration to say just one thing that was truthful?

I don’t believe it is too much to ask for reliable and verifiable data.
The government has lots of professional actuaries and economist in their ranks. I just don’t understand why that talent was not tapped by the administration to complete these measurements. If they had utilized the talent in their ranks, this would not be an issue at all.
I know the administration is learning as it goes, but the first lesson the Obama staffers should learn is don’t generate their own metrics. Leave that work to the professionals that are at their disposal. All they have to do is ask and any of the capable agencies would provide the help needed.

The Republican party of today = The party of hate, the party of no, the party of miss-information, the party of lies, the party of hypocrites, the party of deception, the party of twisted truth, the party of exclusionism, the party of extremism, and the list could go far beyond the 1000 characters allowed here.  The Republican party will not see real power again for at least 20-30 years if ever at all.  It will most likely come back under a different name as the “Republican” party has been overcome by extremists that are more Republican than American.    America is not going to allow the extremists on any side destroy this country.   The present day Republican Party took it too far and it will pay for it’s arrogance for several decades.  The balance that kept the extremists out of both parties over America’s more prosperous years is what I hope to see again.  A balance between both the Liberals and conservatives that creates the needed checks and balances to prevent abuse and destruction of any part of American.  The middle class is what makes the country great, not the Corporations, not the military, not the elites, not the rich, not the poor, not the extremists of any kind.   The middle class makes America work and makes it succeed.  NO MORE EXTREMISTS and right now, the Republican party is nothing but that.

My fine extremist right wingers: It is wonderful to see that you have not lost your venom with your distaste all things Obama and also wonderful to see that your ugly screams of distortion, miss-information and lies end up being your own worst enemy. You are turning most of America away from your party in droves by making yourselves less trustworthy with every post you make here and elsewhere. Also, do understand one other major point, whatever you say or do here on these pages will have absolutely NO AFFECT on how these situations are going to be handled nor any affect on the final outcome. So, my fine extremist right-wingers, keep on screaming and alienating your fellow Americans with your messed up version of life and reality. I am actually NOT happy about the Republican parties demise and implosion due to it’s extremists that have taken over a once proud party. We need a proper balance between our two parties. There has to be proper trust and respect between liberals and conservatives. America is MUCH better when that is the case. Unfortunately, this is hardly possible with the present Republican party. And so, like your inability to have any affect on the present doings of our present elected government officials I will also have no affect on your extremist attitudes and the self-destruction and implosion of your party. I hope that your party makes a comeback some day but I do not foresee that for probably 30-40 years if ever. It will most likely come back under a different name when and if it does.

For you extremist right-wingers spouting your hate of sharing for the common good and calling communistic or socialist? So, if you think that you don’t want to have anything to do with the government, let’s take ALL of that away. You do not need anything from anyone else. Let’s move you off to your desert island so you can live by yourself. Good luck in finding that isolated location somewhere on this planet. By the way, if you have any problems, don’t call any of us. Since you don’t want to contribute to anyone else’s needs than you don’t need our help. But, than again, dare I ask? Being a Republican, the stereotype is that you are a Christian. I mean Democrats are all pagans you know. And if you are a Christian, was it not Jesus that has encouraged us all to help our fellow man? Might we be able to call Jesus the first Socialist. Oh, I guess that would be wrong? I mean, is it wrong for us to share our success for the needs of others and for our society? But, you probably want to live on that desert island. Another question, If you home is being robbed, should I, as a publically paid officer be obligated to protect your home since you do not want to pay for that service? Should I let your house burn down if you don’t want to pay for that service. Am I obligated to sell you untainted and unsafe food if there is no one making sure that I don’t do that to you. Since I built that bridge to cross that river, should I let you cross it since you don’t want to help pay for it? How does your attitude differ from those that refuse to not work and live off of us because they don’t want to work? They don’t want to work for it. You don’t want to pay for it. Find that desert island yet?

Yeah, I’m sure Joe is going to do what ever the GOOBers tell him to do… like they really matter any more. LMAO!!

CND Fox wrote: “At least this administration is making an attempt to be transparent. Let’s just get the numbers accurate and move on to reducing unemployment instead of all this useless political posturing.” Obama transparent? Bwahahahahah…have you been living under a rock for the last 11 months? Accurate numbers? With Obama? Hun, this ain’t ever going to happen. Obama is what people call a liar…probably a cross between a sociopathic to compulsive one—doubt that he could tell the actually truth even if someone put it up on his teleprompter. He would still choke up trying to spit it out. Then you have the problem with unemployment–Obama is a socialist marxist..they always (there are no exceptions) chase jobs away. Obama must chase jobs away to try to get the American people more willing to rely on socialism as the government grows making us serfs and his reign that of President (King) of the world in his tiny ego infested mind. Not to mention Higher taxes always equals less jobs. Truth hurts, but seriously the bots need to learn to deal the cruel facts.

I never cease to be amazed at how the left continues to support Obama, even in light of his non-performance. The republicans get the blame for pointing out his failure, but it’s us tea-baggers and Fox News who keep his feet to the fire.
SNL did pretty good with its Obama in China skit, and SNL is generally considered left of left!
Climate-Gate is the latest issue, will Obama still go to Copenhagen with a load of myth in spite of the ever gowing truth of fraud? Even consensus is losing ground fast. Some 31,000 of which almost 10,000 are PhDs compared to the 3,000 at most that support the few on IPCC!

It is simply amazing how these Liberal Elitists we have trying to run things actually think us poor dumb nobodys can not see the stupid games they play with the numbers.
When you are loosing 50,000 to 150,000 jobs a month for a year, its ridiculous to continue claiming you have created or saved 640,000 jobs.. Obama, its time you got yourself and your cronnies off the “Are you smarter than a 5th Grader” show and started dealing with facts, in keeping with your failed promise of transparency. There is nothing more pathetic than an elitist who has to manufacture his facts and then believes no one will notice…I used to think impeachment was a bad idea, Im beginning to change my mind…