By Gorman Gorman

Nov 11, 2009 8:22am

Love to Hate: Democrats drive skepticism of health care reform

ABC News’ Rick Klein reports: Why ask a Republican when you can ask a Democrat?

Start with, say, Sen. Ben Nelson, D-Neb., who listened to former President Bill Clinton say inaction is the “worst thing we can do” and then said he wouldn’t mind inaction one bit if the alternative is the House-passed health care bill:

“It’s got a totally government run plan, the costs are extraordinary associated with it, it increases taxes in a way that will not pass in the Senate, and I could go on and on and on,” Nelson told ABC’s Jonathan Karl, in his latest “Subway Series” interview. (“I won’t vote to move it,” Nelson said.)

Move to Rep. Linda Sanchez, D-Calif., who voted for that same bill but doesn’t sound like she’d make the same vote on final passage:

“Has Congress become like an episode of Mad Men? The Stupak Amendment slams women back to a time of stenographs and unsafe abortions,” Sanchez writes in a Politico op-ed.

Add Diana DeGette, D-Colo., who’s among those threatening to help sink the health care bill if it still has the abortion provision worked in at the insistence of the US Conference of Catholic Bishops:

“Every group should be listened to, but I don’t think one group should be given veto authority over what we do,” DeGette tells the AP’s Julie Hirschfeld Davis.

Then choose a liberal activist or three, who are making noises about primary challenges against Democrats who vote against health care:

“It was kind of like a slap in the face from someone you’d expect to be a friend,” Tony Fransetta, president of the Florida chapter of the Alliance for Retired Americans, said of Rep. Suzanne Kosmas, D-Fla, per Politico’s Alex Isenstadt.

Health care was supposed to energize the base — and by that measure, maybe it succeeded beyond anyone’s expectations.

Reform efforts are back in one of those limbo states, now that the House has voted and the Senate awaits word on what an actual bill would actually cost.

These have been dangerous times for reform efforts in the past, since they opened the news cycle up for introspection and recriminations. This one’s no different — and addition still looks like subtraction for the vote counters.

“Yes and yes,” Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., said when asked whether the bill would be on the floor next week and be finished by Christmas. (Except the answer really might be “no and no.”)

Has hope changed sides? Yes — that’s a GOP lead on the generic ballot:

“Republicans have moved ahead of Democrats by 48% to 44% among registered voters in the latest update on Gallup’s generic congressional ballot for the 2010 House elections, after trailing by six points in July and two points last month,” Jeffrey M. Jones reports in his Gallup Poll write-up. “In the latest poll, independent registered voters favor the Republican candidate by 52% to 30%.”

Cue the Big Dog: “The worst thing we can do is nothing,” Bill Clinton said he told Senate Democrats Tuesday. (Think of the implications of taking that sentence literally.)

From one who knows — and who knows what it’s like to be a red-state Democrat: “It’s not important to be perfect here. It’s important to act, to move, to start the ball rolling,” the former president told reporters after his meeting with the Democratic caucus, per The Washington Post’s Shailagh Murray. “There will be amendments to this effort, whatever they pass, next year and the year after and the year after, and there should be. It’s a big, complicated, organic thing.”

On why the anger’s out there, Clinton’s argument, according to Sen. Sheldon Whitehouse, D-R.I.: “The reason the teabaggers are so inflamed is because we are close on health care,” Whitehouse said, per ABC’s Z. Byron Wolf.

“The appearance by Mr. Clinton, whose own attempt at a health bill failed 15 years ago, reflected the urgency Democrats feel to maintain the momentum behind the bill following its narrow House passage Saturday and signs of a tempestuous debate ahead in the Senate,” The Wall Street Journal’s Naftali Bendavid and Janet Adamy report.

(And Time’s Karen Tumulty solves a mystery: “A source close to Bill Clinton confirms that the cellphone call he received while talking to reporters in the Capitol was indeed from the Secretary of State. However, he informs us that the intriguing ringtone we heard this afternoon was a generic jazz one, which the former President picked because, well, he just likes jazz.)

Bring in the funk: “The latest Associated Press-GfK poll shows that Americans grew slightly more dispirited on a range of matters over the past month, continuing slippage that has occurred since Obama took office as the year began,” per the AP’s Liz Sidoti.

“They were more pessimistic about the direction of the country. They disapproved of Obama’s handling of the economy a bit more than before. And, perhaps most striking for this novice commander in chief, more people have lost confidence in Obama on Iraq and Afghanistan over the last month. Overall, there’s a public malaise about the state of the nation.”

Harry Reid’s other headache: “Republicans in New Jersey and Virginia didn’t just benefit from a decrease in the so-called Obama ‘surge’ voter turnout. They also did better among groups that went for Obama in 2008,” Amy Walter writes for National Journal. “What happens if similar patterns emerge in ’10, namely a decrease in the percentage of Democratic-leaning voters as well as a narrowing of the margin of victory among groups that were key to Obama’s victory?”

Ready for another round of this? “Republicans are looking to resurrect the angry town halls of August in the last few weeks of November,” Manu Raju writes for Politico. “Senate Republican Conference Chairman Lamar Alexander said Republicans are ‘quietly’ planning some 50 in-person and telephone town hall gatherings over the next three weeks to drum up opposition to Democratic health care bills.”

Your White House day: The president and first lady, joined by the Bidens, host a Veterans Day breakfast in the White House East Room. Then it’s on to Arlington National Cemetery for a wreath-laying ceremony at the Tomb of the Unknowns at 11 am ET, with remarks at 11:25 am.
 
At 2:30 pm ET, the president meets (for the eighth time on the subject) with his national security team on Afghanistan and Pakistan, in the Situation Room.

ABC’s Sunlen Miller has details, White House photos, and attendee lists from all eight meetings.

Look for an Afghanistan decision to be announced the week before or the week after Thanksgiving, ABC’s George Stephanopoulos reported on “Good Morning America” Wednesday.

Four options on the table — with a low end of 10-20,000 troops, to a high end in line with the McChrystal recommendation.

Today’s they’re talking exit ramps: “The president wants to press his advisers today for a clearer understanding of the American bridge out of Afghanistan,” Stephanopoulos reported. “He’s still not satisfied by what he’s heard about how this message ends.”

The Wall Street Journal’s Peter Spiegel and Yochi Dreazen: “President Barack Obama on Wednesday will consider a new compromise plan for adding troops to Afghanistan that would deploy 30,000 to 35,000 new forces, including as many as 10,000 military trainers, over the next year or more. The new scenario combines reinforcements for fighting Taliban insurgents with trainers aimed at rapidly increasing the size and capabilities of Afghan troops to take on more operations themselves. It wouldn’t aim to eliminate the Taliban, but weaken it until Afghan forces can secure majo r population centers themselves.”

Can the president count on Democrats in Congress to back him up? “I think that there is a great deal of reluctance to committing any more combat troops in Afghanistan,” Sen. Ben Cardin, D-Md., said on ABCNews.com’s “Top Line” Tuesday. “I think most members of the Democratic caucus believe it’s up to the Afghans to take responsibility for the internal security within their own country — that we should be focusing on the war against terror, against the terrorists organizations, most of which are now in the Pakistan area, not Afghanistan.”

Fort Hood fallout: “Two high-profile anti-terrorism task forces did not inform the Defense Department about contacts between a radical Islamic cleric and the Army psychiatrist accused of killing 13 people in last week’s rampage at Ft. Hood, a senior Defense official said Tuesday,” the Los Angeles Times’ Julian E. Barnes and Josh Meyer report. “The possible communication lapse recalls the kind of breakdowns of intelligence-sharing that plagued U.S. agencies leading up to the Sept. 11 attacks. However, it is striking because the interagency task forces were created in large part to make sure information is more easily and routinely shared.”

“As the nation mourned the 13 people shot dead last week at Fort Hood, Tex., finger-pointing in Washington intensified Tuesday about whether officials at several agencies had failed to coordinate as they tracked the suspect’s activities or to react to possible warning signs in the months before the attack,” Carrie Johnson and Spencer S. Hsu report in The Washington Post.

A New York Daily News headline the White House has got to like: “Obama to feds, Army: What did you know about Fort Hood killer and when did you know it?

Also making it a really interesting day at the Pentagon: “Top executives at Blackwater Worldwide authorized secret payments of about $1 million to Iraqi officials that were intended to silence their criticism and buy their support after a September 2007 episode in which Blackwater security guards fatally shot 17 Iraqi civilians in Baghdad, according to former company officials,” Mark Mazzetti and James Risen report for The New York Times.

At the White House, Anita Dunn is moving on, and Dan Pfeiffer is moving up.

The Atlantic’s Marc Ambinder, on the next White House communications director: “Over the summer, the White House’s Pfeifferian coolness on health care — even as the political world was going into a tizzy — came in for much external criticism. … Pfeiffer, colleagues say, was among those who regularly counseled his colleagues — and Democratic allies — not to panic. He and Dunn pushed to shift the president’s focus from cost containment to the concerns of middle class voters who worried that they might lose their insurance or their choice of doctors under the new plan.”

More fallout from the abortion provision:

“Once again, a group of mostly white men have decided to put additional burdens and increased difficulties of women — particularly low-income women,” Karen Finney writes at Huffington Post.

“The president has handed us a bill that reverses Roe v. Wade,” Terry O’Neill, the president of the National Organization for Women, tells ABC’s Jake Tapper.

(O’Neill will appear on ABCNews.com’s “Top Line” today, live at noon ET, right after a meeting at the White House.)

Stupak blowback: The Progressive Change Campaign Committee is launching online ads Wednesday (staring with 1 million-plus impressions) blasting Rep. Bart Stupak, D-Mich., for his leadership on the abortion provision in the House bill.

From the others side — more from Sen. Nelson’s interview with Jon Karl: “Federal taxpayer money ought not to be used to fund abortions. … So whether it is subsidies on premiums or whether it is tax credits or whatever it is … it should not be used to fund abortions.”

In the Massachusetts Senate race — closing an opening? “US Representative Michael E. Capuano, in a significant departure from his forceful rhetoric a day earlier, said yesterday that he would vote against a final health care bill if it includes a provision restricting federal funding for abortion,” The Boston Globe’s Matt Viser reports.

“If the bill comes back the same way as it left the House, I would vote against it,” Capuano said in an interview. “I am a prochoice person, and I do believe this is [necessary] to provide health care for everyone.”

Next up on financial regulator reform: Senate Democratic Policy Committee has a Thursday meeting set up for staff — to review polling on the subject. From the e-mail out to Democratic Hill staffers:”Please join us for a review of recent public opinion polling and recommendations on proposed regulatory reform, featuring discussion of recent polls conducted by: Lake Research Partners for Americans for Financial Reform; Benenson Strategy Group for the Service Employees International Union.”

From the annals of stimulus spin: “While Massachusetts recipients of federal stimulus money collectively report 12,374 jobs saved or created, a Globe review shows that number is wildly exaggerated. Organizations that received stimulus money miscounted jobs, filed erroneous figures, or claimed jobs for work that has not yet started,” Jenn Abelson and Todd Wallack report in The Boston Globe.

“The federal stimulus report for Massachusetts has so many errors, missing data, or estimates instead of actual job counts that it may be impossible to accurately tally how many people have been employed by the massive infusion of federal money.”

The Kicker:

“Are you from this planet?” — A Transportation Security Administration screener, caught on an iPhone recording questioning an aide to Rep. Ron Paul, R-Texas, in an incident that prompted a change in TSA screening policies.

“I don’t care what you write.” — Gary Jackson, former Blackwater president, to The New York Times.

For up-to-the-minute political updates check out The Note’s blog . . . all day every day:

http://blogs.abcnews.com/thenote/

Intern for the ABC News Political Unit:

The ABC News Po litical Unit is now seeking full-time spring 2010 interns in Washington, D.C.

The paid internship begins Monday, Jan. 4, 2010, and runs through Friday, June 4, 2010.

Political Unit interns attend political events and contribute to stories for the politics page of ABCNews.com. They also help ABC News by conducting research, maintaining our calendar of upcoming political events, and posting stories to ABCNews.com.

In order to apply, you MUST be either a graduate student or an undergraduate student who has completed his or her first year of college. The internship is NOT open to recent graduates.

You also must be able to work eight hours per day, Monday through Friday. Interns will be paid $8.50/hour.

If you write well, follow politics closely, and have some familiarity with web publishing, send a cover letter and resume to Teddy Davis, ABC News’ Deputy Political Director, at teddy.davis@abc.com, by Sunday, Nov. 22, 2009, with the subject line: “INTERN” in all caps.

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User Comments

Any Democrat who blocks this reform from passing – with a public otion – is clearly doing so to up their own political power and to gain contributions and favors from the insurance and pharmaceutical lobbies. These people will be exposed for what they are and this will damage their futures more than they know. The millions of Americans who put them in office and are counting on them to get this done will not tolerate that type of old Washington politics in this case. This time, we expect them to actually accomplish something important, and there is no big bad GOP to stop it, only the sleazebags within the Democratic party. It will be a good way for us to weed them out.

Posted by: iamwomaninMI | November 11, 2009, 8:59 am 8:59 am

Democrats must not be “hoodwinked and fooled” into an abortion fight that does not really exist! Democrats must lead by leading and accomplishing — like health care, which is tied to the deficit and the bankrupting of businesses and families. We cannot let abortion issues become an obstacle and get in our way of passing health care reform, we are smarter than that. We must keep our “eye” on the Prize — goal! We do not want to wear the title of a “do nothing Congress”!
GOP politicians and operatives continue to dishonestly and deceptively say that they cannot support a public option, they claim that they want to keep costs down for the American people! Really? This they claim all the while knowing that a public option/competition is the only way to really control cost and to bring about true reform thereby putting a definite Halt to the “out of control” medical costs and premiums crippling people and businesses today, making it harder and harder for average Americans and young people to realize and take advantage of the slowly, slipping away American Dream. One could ask themselves, If you happen to lose your job today or tomorrow in these unstable economic times and at a time when we currently do not have healthcare reform for all, who would pay you or your familiy’s health care costs, that is, if you are lucky enough to be able to see a doctor without insurance? This American Dream, now being called Socialism by the GOP has slowly been slipping away, and is in the last throes of dying, if we do not forge a new path onwards toward inclusion and cooperation for all. This dream of America will die to be replaced with just another third world country — only to go by the wayside and into the history books as another failed experiment.

Posted by: Angellight | November 11, 2009, 9:16 am 9:16 am

The ever growing entitlements and new taxes the Democrats are pushing are destroying what is left of the manufacturing base in this country.Maybe there are some moderate Democrats who don’t like the ideal of destroying the tax base and passing lame ass laws to reward deadbeats.

Posted by: Johnny L | November 11, 2009, 9:18 am 9:18 am

What is the point of all this anti-Obama smarm? To prove that health care reform is a complicated and intricate issue that takes skill and negotiation to tackle? Wow – what breaking news!

Posted by: matt | November 11, 2009, 9:28 am 9:28 am

What point is there, in passing a bill, which cannot stand up to review by the Supreme Court?
One which will not provide abortion coverage, which the court has clearly said is legal in this country, will by default, become an unlawful bill, which can be negated by the court.
Frankly, that is stupid.

Posted by: Rick McDaniel | November 11, 2009, 9:30 am 9:30 am

I wonder if Pelosi has that silly smile now?

Posted by: LongT | November 11, 2009, 9:30 am 9:30 am

Johnny, I agree. With the falling dollar, we could be taking advantage of export exchange rates now, if we manufactured anything the rest of the world wanted besides C-130 cargo planes.

Posted by: LongT | November 11, 2009, 9:32 am 9:32 am

matt; As I recall, before the congressional summer break it was suppose to be a slam dunk! No it’s complicated? Oh, I get it, spin.

Posted by: LongT | November 11, 2009, 9:34 am 9:34 am

Events keep proving the theory that GOP = Taliban on Women Rights and Ideology.
On another note, ‘black eye’ for so-called pundits. 2 weeks ago ABC broke news that they confirmed from ‘reliable’ sources that new Afghan policy will be announced before Nov 11. These guys do not have a clue about what is really going on. Do they?
How about the breaking news that Fox used video footage of 9/12 protests as footage for last week’s GOP ‘protests’? What a disgrace to the Media.
EOM. EOPFT.

Posted by: New Wave | November 11, 2009, 9:36 am 9:36 am

“shorTees” & “jonnie el”; LIES and Baited Distractions will NOT change the Need and majority support for Health Care (Insurance) Reform!!!

Posted by: bobj72 | November 11, 2009, 9:51 am 9:51 am

You cons say “once the government is involved in anything, they own your soul.” I guess you would rather have it stay as it is now, where giant corporations own yours? Is that it? Of course, what you said is baloney, but think about it. The government runs many public services, from the military to the FBI to any number of regulatory agencies. I guess they own our soul because they are involved in those activities too. You cons have no trouble when the government funnels trillions to the top 1 percent of our wealthy. You don’t mind if Pharmaceuticals and Big Insurance own your soul and;put you out to die if you don’t make them a big enough profit. I guess all your cries of “socialism” coming from the right don’t extend to corporate socialism where the government partners with big companies to funnel tons of goodies and subsidies to those big companies. You cons should be FOR this healthcare bill. It funnels multiple billions to the big Insurance and Phamaceutical companies in windfall profits from a forced, captive market where everyone has to buy into it. The biggest beneficiaries are the big corporations of this new health care reform bill coming down the pike. So why are you cons against it? I thought you were all for trickle down and for big corporate profits. What is your beef if this health care legislation does just that? Trickles your money into the pockets of big companies. Are you closet anti-capitalists?

Posted by: allen_osuno | November 11, 2009, 9:52 am 9:52 am

Of course the liberals make us all a little nervous. They draft a 2000 page bill that no one has read and expect us all to say yeehaa!
Liberals are socialists and they have been working overtime to undermine capitalism for years.
They have royally screwed up our economy with gov’t intervention, and now claim that the only way to get the country back on track is through more gov’t intervention.
These people have never run hotdog stands and they suddenly are qualified to run 1/6 of our economy?

Posted by: Dave from KC | November 11, 2009, 10:15 am 10:15 am

Let’s examine the REAL reasons Ben Nelson opposes health care reform. I got these facts from Center for Responsive Politics, so you can feel free to check out the facts yourself.
Of the top 20 industries that contribute to Ben Nelson’s political campaigns, the insurance industry takes 2nd place; 3rd place securities and investments; 4th place lobbyists; 5th place health professionals; and 7th place pharmaceuticals and health products. Over his political career, Ben Nelson has received $610,000 from the health sector and $ 739,000 from lobbyists.
His top 20 individual contributors include Amgen, Aetna, Healthsouth, Inc. IN addition, Nelson gets contributions from Altria, the nation’s major tobacco company, and his top political contributor is NelNet, which finances student loans.
For Ben Nelson, the current dysfunctional system of for-profit health care is a cash cow. Does Ben Nelson tell the public that whenever they are paying a health insurance premium they are giving him a campaign contribution?
In the mean time according to a study by the Harvard Medical School, 44, 000 Americans die because of inadequate medical care. Our infant mortality rate is twice as high as the infant mortality rates of Sweden and France, whose systems of medical care are cheaper than ours. According to another Harvard Medical School study, 2,266 veterans died in 2008 alone because they lacked health insurance. That death toll is 14 times higher than the 2009 death toll in Afghanistan, so Ben Nelson really knows how to support the troops.
Ben Nelson also fails to recognize that our current system of medical care sucks $ 2 trillion dollars a year from the economy, and the political campaign contributions that Ben Nelson receives is one of the reasons that our for-profit system of medical care is so expensive. In this regard the $ 1 trillion dollars that the current system costs, spread over a 10 year period, with the appropriate cost-cutting measures as really a bargain.
Ben Nelson opposes health care reform because he is making too much money from the present health care system. He is willing to kill thousands of Americans for his own financial gain. He is as much of a terrorist as Osama bin Laden.

Posted by: William Joseph Miller | November 11, 2009, 10:21 am 10:21 am

If Obamacare is so good, why do you have to imprison people who don’t want to participate?

Posted by: deanbob | November 11, 2009, 11:09 am 11:09 am

If you think the current healthcare system is killing people, what will you say when the numbers escalate along with your premiums (doubling?) and taxes (“I will not raise your taxes 1 cent if you make less than $250k”)?

Posted by: deanbob | November 11, 2009, 11:13 am 11:13 am

How much are politicians from BOTH parties making from lobbyists? Who is makeing the most?

Posted by: deanbob | November 11, 2009, 11:15 am 11:15 am

This plan filters away from 129 million people covering only 6 million people. Further more:
The anti-abortion Idea in America is not a Conservative cause. Following the idiocy of Malthus, Margaret Sanger, a Republican, Right Wing anti-black anti-Catholic, racist who odored Adolph Hitler, wanted to use abortion and “Birth Control” to limit the voter registration of Blacks, Italians and Catholics-abortion and Birth Control were the methods and she was aligned with Far Right Wing Nazi’s and Fascists not Liberals or Progressives. Pick up a history book now and then and learn a bit about sources.
Abortion was the brainchild of Hitler and it remains an inhumane horror out of the minds of self-centered people with no sense of shame or of humanity. My family, myself included, have been FDR Progressives for four generations. WE, are the heart and soul of Liberalism, not selfish people who slaughter the innocents following the dictates of Adolph Hitler. We have little in common with “The Christian Right.” Jesus, who opposed the Conservative Herodian Priests and the Ultra Conservative Romans was a Liberal/Progressive and stood alone against the forces of Darkness-the equivalence of the Nazism of his era. If those who accept the Holiness of precious life are to be lumped in with neurotic right wing fascists then the atheist Democrats who favor abortion need to be lumped in with Adolph Hitler’s Nazis.
I am a Ford Foundation Fellowship Recipient in Physical Anthropology, a Fellowship and scholarship winner in Architecture and art and rank in the top 1/4 of 1% in the world in IQ, so I think, and research.

Posted by: ProfessorEmeritus PeterBagnolo | November 11, 2009, 11:16 am 11:16 am

What point is there, in passing a bill, which cannot stand up to review by the Supreme Court?
One which will not provide abortion coverage, which the court has clearly said is legal in this country, will by default, become an unlawful bill, which can be negated by the court.
Frankly, that is stupid.
***************************************
It will cover abortion, just not elective abortion, using Federal Funds, and will not be negated by the courts.
Frankly, being a life long Democrat, I think it is stupid for the Party to support elective abortion. If it is the right of the woman to have one, fine, little I can do about it, but me paying for it? Forget it.

Posted by: Thinking | November 11, 2009, 11:35 am 11:35 am

The House Bill is the most rigid, intrusive and grotesquely expensive bill in the history of human kind. Why can’t Obama, Pelosi and Reid see the obvious. Their creation of another huge, inefficient federal bureaucracy will slow and disrupt the delivery of basic health care and subject us all to a labyrinthine mass of incompetent, unaccountable petty dictators? Holy Cow, there are 131 new bureaucratic governing boards being created to oversee who gets what health care if any. Plus by massively expanding the number of healthcare consumers without making due provision for the production of more healthcare providers means that we’re hurtling toward a staggering logjam of de facto rationing. Any Democrat who is responsible for creating such a massive government bureaucratic monstrosity which is designed to make government bureaucracy the biggest road block receiving quality health care should be run out of office.

Posted by: Gary | November 11, 2009, 11:38 am 11:38 am

wow … alot of of great arguments against pelosis health scare bill.in the mean time 1 in 5 californians are out of work. how disgraceful to put liberal ideology in front of crating JOBS in the private sector.climate change in front of JOBS. without a JOB you feel hopeless.so we would rather sacrifice jobs for climate change, health care, illegal immigrants and abortion. pretty interesting time for the democrats.

Posted by: catman | November 11, 2009, 11:54 am 11:54 am

Nobody I know wants Pelosi’s Bill. We want real reform, not govt taking over our futures. We want the illegals blocked, we want Tort Reform. Obama and Pelosi refuse to listen to Americans and it’s going to be too late soon enough when the Dems are all voted out. Slow down, write a small Bill and do it next year.

Posted by: msg | November 11, 2009, 12:09 pm 12:09 pm

Watched a Frontline on OPB last night of a dotor that visited every capitalist country that has universal health care for it’s people. This doctor visited countries like Great Britain, Japan, Germany, Taiwan, Switzerland, to discover why their universal health care works for their people. I will tell you that it was very informantive and I think that the United States could learn alot from what health care reform is and does for countries that. What’s remarkable in Japan and Taiwan there is no waiting for treatment, in Taiwan if you need to see a specialist you do not have to be refered you can set up an appointment. They use smart cards that all the citizens cary for their medical appointments that contain all your medical history and prescriptions, and every time that you go to the doctor he reads your smart card and is able to get your medical history at the time he see’s you. Also in all of the countries visited one important question was asked, do any of the people go broke because over the top medical bill’s. The answer is no, because there are limit’s in what the fee’s are and what is allowed by pharmacies, insurance companies and the medical profession. It was a very knowledgable and informative show and the Ameican People and our Government could learn alot from it.

Posted by: Katie McClure | November 11, 2009, 12:09 pm 12:09 pm

wow … alot of of great arguments against pelosis health scare bill.in the mean time 1 in 5 californians are out of work. how disgraceful to put liberal ideology in front of crating JOBS in the private sector.climate change in front of JOBS. without a JOB you feel hopeless.so we would rather sacrifice jobs for climate change, health care, illegal immigrants and abortion. pretty interesting time for the democrats.
——-
My husband lost his 80k a year job a YEAR AGO! There are no jobs! There is no hope of new jobs being created! Why Obama and the rest are focused on Bills that we cannot afford and will put more people out of work is shameful.

Posted by: msg | November 11, 2009, 12:10 pm 12:10 pm

EXCELLENT POST!
The House Bill is the most rigid, intrusive and grotesquely expensive bill in the history of human kind. Why can’t Obama, Pelosi and Reid see the obvious. Their creation of another huge, inefficient federal bureaucracy will slow and disrupt the delivery of basic health care and subject us all to a labyrinthine mass of incompetent, unaccountable petty dictators? Holy Cow, there are 131 new bureaucratic governing boards being created to oversee who gets what health care if any. Plus by massively expanding the number of healthcare consumers without making due provision for the production of more healthcare providers means that we’re hurtling toward a staggering logjam of de facto rationing. Any Democrat who is responsible for creating such a massive government bureaucratic monstrosity which is designed to make government bureaucracy the biggest road block receiving quality health care should be run out of office.

Posted by: msg | November 11, 2009, 12:14 pm 12:14 pm

Once again Democrats confuse activity with accomplishment. “At least we’re doing something” – just a rewording of Clinton’s “The worst thing we can do is nothing” – means nothing if the actions are counterproductive. It’s good that so many people see so much bad in this bill. The potentially bad thing is the lack of concensus of what that bad is – forced enrollments, lack of abortion coverage, huge taxpayer expense, etc. – although it is evidence of a broad rejection of this particular form of “reform”. I hope that this bill does fail in the Senate and gives Pelosi a slap across the face that makes here realize that the people in this country are not so stupid and so desperate to swallow any legislative swill that she brands “Dem-tested, President-approved”.

Posted by: Publius | November 11, 2009, 12:32 pm 12:32 pm

God Bless you ProfessorEmeritus Peter Bagnolo! Very well stated. Also, I love the thought of people actually thinking first, “AND” also doing research.
“If my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven and forgive their sin and will HEAL THEIR LAND”. 2 CHRONICLES 7:14

Posted by: godhearus | November 11, 2009, 12:36 pm 12:36 pm

“massively expanding the number of healthcare consumers”
This bill will create a total of zero new consumers. Everyone in American is already a health care consumer.

Posted by: gary | November 11, 2009, 12:39 pm 12:39 pm

catman | Nov 11, 2009 11:54:28 AM
Does Pelosi care more for her ideology than the people of California (especially those who are unemployed)? They have a chance to remedy that in less than a year.

Posted by: deanbob | November 11, 2009, 12:45 pm 12:45 pm

Democrats who think they must lead on healthcare also must believe healthcare to be more important than our nation and our freedom.
It is sheer insanity and stupidity to push for more spending with a deficit of $1.4 trillion and a national debt of $12 trillion forecast to double to $24 trillion by 2019.
If they love America why would they put us in such peril?

Posted by: Ed Taylor | November 11, 2009, 12:47 pm 12:47 pm

WOW!!! —- Gallup Poll: “independent registered voters favor the Republican candidate by 52% to 30%.” —- Take note Dems, don’t try to smash legislation through!!! — You will pay for it in 2010!! — Oh, and THIS BILL is definitely WORSE than doing nothing!!!

Posted by: HoosierValues | November 11, 2009, 1:01 pm 1:01 pm

The biggest frustration is that the politicians we “hired” to do the job can’t seem to come out with a bill that does what we want it to do for a cost that is acceptible. Toss in the rantings of radicals on both sides and it turns into a noisy mess. Apparently simplicity is not a policy politicians follow.

Posted by: Wayne | November 11, 2009, 1:03 pm 1:03 pm

I am concerned about the abortion issue and wonder why U.S. Catholic bishops were able to lobby our leaders. Never in this nation’s history has their been a greater need for separation of church and state. Women deserve the right to a safe inexpensive abortion, should they choose one.

Posted by: DaveM | November 11, 2009, 1:04 pm 1:04 pm

What were the Obama bribes?
The American Medical Association (AMA) was facing a 21 percent cut in physicians’ reimbursements under the current law. Obama promised to kill the cut if they backed his bill. The cuts are the fruit of a law requiring annual 5-6 percent reductions in doctor reimbursements for treating Medicare patients. Bravely, each year Congress has rolled the cuts over, suspending them but not repealing them. So each year, the accumulated cuts threaten doctors. By now, they have risen to 21 percent. With this blackmail leverage, Obama compelled the AMA to support his bill…or else!
The AARP got a financial windfall in return for its support of the healthcare bill. Over the past decade, the AARP has morphed from an advocacy group to an insurance company (through its subsidiary company). It is one of the main suppliers of Medi-gap insurance, a high-cost, privately purchased coverage that picks up where Medicare leaves off. But President Bush-43 passed the Medicare Advantage program, which offered a subsidized, lower-cost alternative to Medi-gap. Under Medicare Advantage, the elderly get all the extra coverage they need plus coordinated, well-managed care, usually by the same physician. So more than 10 million seniors went with Medicare Advantage, cutting into AARP Medi-gap revenues.
Presto! Obama solved their problem. He eliminates subsidies for Medicare Advantage. The elderly will have to pay more for coverage under Medigap, but the AARP — which supposedly represents them — will make more money.
The drug industry backed ObamaCare and, in return, got a 10-year limit of $80 billion on cuts in prescription drug costs. (A drop in the bucket of their almost $3 trillion projected cost over the next decade.) They also got administration assurances that it will continue to bar lower-cost Canadian drugs from coming into the U.S. All it had to do was put its formidable advertising budget at the disposal of the administration.
Insurance companies got access to 40 million potential new customers. But when the Senate Finance Committee lowered the fine that would be imposed on those who don’t buy insurance from $3,500 to $1,500, the insurance companies jumped ship and now oppose the bill, albeit for the worst of motives.
And who didn’t go along?
The only industry that refused to knuckle under was the medical device makers. They stood for principle and wouldn’t go along with Obama’s blackmail. So the Senate Finance Committee retaliated by imposing a tax on medical devices such as automated wheelchairs, pacemakers, arterial stents, prosthetic limbs, artificial knees and hips and other necessary accoutrements of healthcare.
This just proves that Obama, Pelosi, and Reid are no better than the crooks who are in prison.

Posted by: Sandcrab 1613 | November 11, 2009, 3:01 pm 3:01 pm

It looks like the reformers are going to lose because playing dirty pool works. The cost of health-care reform is massive and all sorts of inexact figures are cited by opponents, with no mention ever being made of health-care costs without reform.
The whole system of governance is being debased by shouting down progressive speakers and by some of the opposition actually LYING about health-care reform in public — Grassley talking about “pulling the plug on Grandma.”
The lunatics are taking over the asylum. It will be interesting to see what happens when Obama is voted out of office in ’12 and a true, charismatic, competent, thoroughly knowledgeable and morally pure leader like Sarah Palin takes over.

Posted by: Robert Maxwell | November 11, 2009, 3:02 pm 3:02 pm

deanbob..pelosis district is gerrymandered.the only she would lose is to become a conservative male

Posted by: catman | November 11, 2009, 5:12 pm 5:12 pm

What were the Obama bribes?
The American Medical Association (AMA) was facing a 21 percent cut in physicians’ reimbursements under the current law. Obama promised to kill the cut if they backed his bill. The cuts are the fruit of a law requiring annual 5-6 percent reductions in doctor reimbursements for treating Medicare patients. Bravely, each year Congress has rolled the cuts over, suspending them but not repealing them. So each year, the accumulated cuts threaten doctors. By now, they have risen to 21 percent. With this blackmail leverage, Obama compelled the AMA to support his bill…or else!
The AARP got a financial windfall in return for its support of the healthcare bill. Over the past decade, the AARP has morphed from an advocacy group to an insurance company (through its subsidiary company). It is one of the main suppliers of Medi-gap insurance, a high-cost, privately purchased coverage that picks up where Medicare leaves off. But President Bush-43 passed the Medicare Advantage program, which offered a subsidized, lower-cost alternative to Medi-gap. Under Medicare Advantage, the elderly get all the extra coverage they need plus coordinated, well-managed care, usually by the same physician. So more than 10 million seniors went with Medicare Advantage, cutting into AARP Medi-gap revenues.
Presto! Obama solved their problem. He eliminates subsidies for Medicare Advantage. The elderly will have to pay more for coverage under Medigap, but the AARP — which supposedly represents them — will make more money.
The drug industry backed ObamaCare and, in return, got a 10-year limit of $80 billion on cuts in prescription drug costs. (A drop in the bucket of their almost $3 trillion projected cost over the next decade.) They also got administration assurances that it will continue to bar lower-cost Canadian drugs from coming into the U.S. All it had to do was put its formidable advertising budget at the disposal of the administration.
Insurance companies got access to 40 million potential new customers. But when the Senate Finance Committee lowered the fine that would be imposed on those who don’t buy insurance from $3,500 to $1,500, the insurance companies jumped ship and now oppose the bill, albeit for the worst of motives.
And who didn’t go along?
The only industry that refused to knuckle under was the medical device makers. They stood for principle and wouldn’t go along with Obama’s blackmail. So the Senate Finance Committee retaliated by imposing a tax on medical devices such as automated wheelchairs, pacemakers, arterial stents, prosthetic limbs, artificial knees and hips and other necessary accoutrements of healthcare.
This just proves that Obama, Pelosi, and Reid are no better than the crooks who are in prison.

Posted by: Sandcrab 1613 | November 11, 2009, 10:35 pm 10:35 pm

All we have to do is use Obama’s travel expenses on improving health care. No one would need to pay a penny. 16 countries BEFORE his 9-day tour of Asia. Jeesh !!

Posted by: Zeke | November 11, 2009, 11:16 pm 11:16 pm

Health is an important matter in our lives and it has to be taken cared of for us to live a long and healthy life.

Posted by: spiritual tour | November 12, 2009, 3:28 am 3:28 am

shorTees” & “jonnie el”; LIES and Baited Distractions will NOT change the Need and majority support for Health Care (Insurance) Reform!!!
posted by Bobj72
So when are the Dems going to stop with all the Lies and Distractions?

Posted by: Johnny L | November 12, 2009, 9:15 am 9:15 am

The reason Democrats won’t be able pass any substantial health care reform before the election in 2010 is that they’ve chosen ultra-partisanship over progress.
Instead of governing, they’ve stayed in campaign mode, demonizing anyone who disagrees with them and racheting up the demagoguery to unbelievable levels.
Even staunch liberals like Camille Paglia are saying that the Democrats have hugely exaggerated the number of Americans that should be covered by any reform.

Posted by: Joe White | November 12, 2009, 1:01 pm 1:01 pm

How many Senators are Masons or Shriners?
Is the healthcare bill being proposed going to have an adverse affect on the Masons / Shriners since their biggest fund raiser is raising moneys to care for children without insurance?
They have several hospitals that help keep the doors open with donations the Shriners raise to help sick children. What will happen to their operations if all children in the USA now have health coverage? They carry a lot of clout in politics.

Posted by: Robert Bartosh | November 19, 2009, 4:58 pm 4:58 pm

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