President Obama to Say Democrats Will Use Reconciliation to Pass Senate Health Care Reform Fix, If Not Given Up or Down Vote

Where my teabag?

No matter what, pass healthcare, further bankrupt our nation, and miss the initial point of reform….pathetic

Um, Tim, Jay – what this will do is end the Dem party. Best of luck to you, haha.

Barry the brute, ramming this garbage bill down the ole coal shoot.

The American people don’t want it, they’ll force it, the Republic does not exist anymore, it’s a Socialist dictatorship.

At least with this we can be fairly sure that there will be a Republican congress come November.

Not surprising. Obama is a Chicago thug. What else do you expect ?

God help us…

Let the revolution begin!!! Taxation without representation.

If Oboma uses reconciliation he will lose my vote.

Go Obama!!! You’ll end the Democratic party now (that’s what will happen Jay). How many people can O throw under the bus so he can claim a legacy? This will be fun come election time.

Oh how I hope they do, they will doom their whole diseased and corrupt progressive party.
The left has been calling everyone that disagrees with them fascists for years, what irony that they turn out to be exactly what they say they despise most!
Go Obama, you are helping us destroy the progressives more than you anything we could do.
LMAO!

GO OBAMA!!! End personal responsibility and put everybody on the government dole!!

Will this man not stop in his goal of socializing our great country. The people have spoken in MA, we do not want your socialized health care system.

Sure, they may lose a few votes in November, but once they’ve put this albatross into place, Democrats will wield power over our health care system for generations to come.

Political suicide

Yeah! let Obama cram this monster down our throats and later watch his entire admin and party explode before our very eyes.

Boy he is one dumb man. What was the point of the summit? Nothing, that’s what, it was all just media showboating.
Obama is a zero. America, don’t believe one thing this guy tells you.

Bring it!

It’s about time. There are 290 bills in the Senate hopper that the House passed. The Republicans don’t want President Obama to succeed, so they dither and procrastinate and obstruct. Meanwhile, more people lose their insurance, premiums go up, and more folks die because they couldn’t afford to see a doctor.

Just remember the pendulum will swing the other way. Then who will be crying about fairness? We can’t have it both ways.

Democrats, exit stage left in November.
Republicans, enter stage right in November.
Didn’t Obama learn anything from Clinton’s first two years: urinating on the will of the public results in your majority in Congress becoming a minority.

Obama is a joke of a president. I hope he Fails……….

Goodbye Constitution and your checks and balances. Goodbye you outdated nation of laws.
It was a fine experiment while it lasted.

There will be hell to pay if the dems try it. We voters are ready, willing and able to oust anyone who does this. Though not all of us will be in the voting districts of the dems who vote for this option, but I assure you OUR MONEY will be there to help defeat and send these disgusting dems packing!!! We are arming our pocketbooks and our support to oppose anyone who goes this route!

Republicans truly are, the party of no..
Obstructionists unless it comes to funding war or bailing out big biz and banks..
And to top it off, stalling funding for peoples legitimate unemployment inusrance all while they get the best medical and great pay and benefits..
Brass balls.

‘Mercy of Insurance Companies?’ no way, we will be at the Mercy of the Government. I have two parties in the planning stages, November 2010, and November 2012. I can’t wait!

IS he planning on shutting down healthcare on saturdays to save money!

I’m busy sharpening the points on my pitchfork…
The not so bright above says to end the republican party and stuff this down their throats…
This is stuffing it down the throats of the American people. I’m not a Republican or a Democrat, but I have a mean pitchfork.

Absolutely no leadership here. It is his way or no way, in spite of the overwhelming rejection by the American people of the health care bill. And, for all of us anticipating the November elections don’t count the slick one out. I would bet the farm that he has something up his sleeve on the order of nationalizing illegal aliens in order to swing the vote. Remember, he is a Chicago thug and will stop at little to get his way.

This is NOT what should happen in a free republic- it is what one would see in a fascist dictatorship (hence the phrase DICTATOR). It was wrong when the Republicans did it but it is twice as wrong now as the Dems were very vocal in their oppostion to it. Obama and the Dems do not what this country was founded upon- one can only wonder if it is time for the second American Revolution.

Private insurance premiums will continue to increase as more and more people turn to Medicade for coverage, because of unemplyoment and vanishing insurance benefits. Health practioners will have to shift costs to make up the 40% short-fall from Medicade reimbursements.

The problem that AMERICA has with this bill is that OBAMA wants to MANDATE healthcare and the government does not have that right! It is clearly unconstitutional… Americans do not want to be forced into government health care programs, on the threat that they will be fined or thrown in jail, if they don’t conform to government standards. And the government does not have the right to FORCE one person to pay for someone else’s healthcare!! This bill would shut down many thousands of small businesses who cannot afford to pay for healthcare, period! The government doesn’t have the constitutional right to do this to them… It will cost this country more jobs, then where will all those people work??

Stop posting and get back to work – Obama needs you to make that extra $1 so he can spend $5.

Can we sell California to China to help pay for this thing?

Impeach this inexperienced marxist wannabe befor he totally destroys this country.

What is wrong with this President? The majority of people want health care reform but do not want this bill, yet he is willing to pull out all the stops to push it through? He is a bullheaded, divisive leader, far from what he promised to be and what his supporters painted him as.
This is the single biggest issue I looked to him on to determine my opinion of him, and if he resorts to encouraging reconciliation then all of the faith I wanted to have in my President will be out the window.

The “public’s option” will be secession in the end. Obama’s mistake is turning the heat up to quickly on the frog in the pot. He’s going to jump out, guaranteed. Poor plan, poorly executed on both an ideological and tactical level.

Good night Amerika,
The Republic could not be kept, Mr. Franklin.
I am sorry – we tried to stop them but to not avail.

Could Obama be that much of an idiot? How does Pelosi have him by the Balls so soon?
Stay tuned for the destruction of the Democrates….We will never vote them in power again.

sic. “too”

Drudge puts up a link, and in seconds the place fills with whiners who say they love democracy, and complain about it.
The funniest part (although tragic and sad) is there are people so brainwashed they themselves have no health insurance, and are in here sticking up for big business insurers who would rake them over the coals if they got sick.
What a neat trick.. the republican party sure knows how to get their puppets to dance..

Really….get a true accounting of their bills. 10 years of taxes, for 6 years of benefits? What kind of nut job thinks that way?!? I’ll buy my next non-GM car using that logic, will land me in jail.

Republicans ARE the Party of NO!!!
NO SOCIALISM, NO MARXISM, NO COMMUNISM

If this Socialist goes the Nuke route he and his cabal will suffer such a defeat that his Communist friends at ACORN will have to become established prostitutes.
They are in such distress of making a real living like all Dumbocrats who sell their votes to the unions.
OH the HUMANITY!

and the voters will nuke the Democrats in November

Hate, hate, hate. I’m proud of him.

it will be suicidal if Obama does this, but I don’t think he cares as long as he gets his way. He is too narcissistic to see beyond his own wants to what the American people want. One term for sure if he does this!

Last resort Kamakazie tactics. Funny how they’re trying to lay it off it as SOP. Representation without regard for the represented…Obamas true colors weill be hard to hide if this happens.

Can’t we all just get-along

They can’t force me to buy anything. The Constitution doesn’t permit the gov’t to do that.
Now that America sees what the Dems are like when they wield power, the Dems will never be trusted again by anyone other than weak-minded slaves.

This is all bluster. The healthcare bill as presently written is doomed. It is true that, if the Democrats try to go the reconciliation route, the Republicans cannot filibuster. HOWEVER, they can offer an UNLIMITED number of amendments, and I expect they will offer THOUSANDS of them. They will offer amendments right up until the November elections. This will never, EVER get a vote. Democrats know this. And they know that this bill is a big, fat loser politically.

The constitution has ONE PARTY— Republican. That is why we’re called a REPUBLIC– for the people, by the people.
The Democratic party needs to be outlawed like the Communist party, with their leadship jailed/executed for treason.

Let Us Be Europe

If Obama forces everyone to buy health insurance and continues along his arrogant way,it’s the political death nell for him and the democrats.The next GOP President should move to reform Social Security and the income tax by abolishing both…

Where is the military to protect us from ENEMIES DOMESTIC?!
They took an oath. KEEP IT.

The “nuclear option” meme is apparently complete. People, reconciliation is NOT NOT NOT the nuclear option that was threatened by the Repubs and panned by the Dems in 2004. Fox News and Drudge are trying this bait and switch to equate the two.
The real “nuclar” option is a point of parliamentary procedure whereby a legislature declars a filibuster unconstitutional and issues cloture despite the filibuster.
Reconciliation has been used several times, including by the Repub Congress to pass the Bush tax cuts.

I’m glad to see Hillary backing Argentina against the U.K. concerning the Falklands. This completely toasts her ambitions to be a 2012 candidate. THAT was easy enough!

IMPEACH

Buy a GM/Chrysler today and start paying for it, but take delivery in 2013. Sounds like a great plan – sign me up

Chas writes:
Good.. I think with Jim Bunning reminding everyone that even with insurance (unemployment insurance) the republicans have no respect for the hard working insured man and woman in the US. I understand we are spending over 50 billion this year alone to train Afghani’s to be policemen..
It’s time we got our priorities straight.. health care is screwed up.. only the very pampered don’t realize this.”
You understand nothing but what the left spoon feeds you. If you did have one ounce of intelligent comprehension, you would realize that Bunning merely objected to the stop gap spending which violated the Paygo Law Obama himself signed into law in February. The measure was not revenue neutral (as required by the law). Since all he did was object, the rules of the Senate would allow Dingy Harry to call a vote, and all that is needed to pass the measure is 51 votes – that’s it. So chas, when you stop drinking the koolaid and shake the leftie cobwebs from your vacuous skull, you might realize that Dems are the ones playing politics with hard working Americans, and that the media is in bed with them.

So many typos in this article…

THANK YOU PRESIDENT OBAMA! This is what the MAJORITY of Americans put you in office for. Obama became President because AMERICANS wanted hcr. and oh yeah Breaking News the Evil Senator Bunning just caved in Americans will get their unemployement benefits

@Smitty
You’re forgetting who has the guns and the real men. Hint: they ain’t Democrats.

Tim, Jay, it is funny to see you think that this bill will ‘kill’ the republican party, especially since the GOP has had such strong outings in the elections recently. News flash: Obama’s popularity rating is falling rapidly, and once this bill passes(if they do do this terrible thing), it will brand him and the whole of his party arrogant, and become even worse when it fails.
And that’s not even mentioning how the added debt will make the dollar decline even faster. Why is it declining? Because Obama is spending and spending YOUR money. I just hope that you see the light before Obama turns this country socialist, or brings the country down with him trying.
These are terrible times my friends, but it is always darkest before the dawn, and this is a rather dark night indeed.

Fight me republicans. fight me now. i will give anyone my address. u won’t stop this bill

Love the comments about outlawing the Democratic party. Seig Heil TPs

Old Geez:
Reconciliation is NOT the nuclear option that was threatened by the Repubs and panned by the Dems in 2004. Fox News and Drudge are trying this bait and switch to equate the two.
The real “nuclear” option is a point of parliamentary procedure whereby a legislature declares a filibuster unconstitutional and issues cloture despite the filibuster.
Reconciliation has been used several times recently, including by the Repub Congress to pass the Bush tax cuts.

Hey Jake, it’s called nuclear option, remember? Your ilk is losing this argument, aren’t you? (;0)

What a loser….

Harry Reid – Who is talking about reconciliation?
Classic

Health care legislation has already passed the House and the Senate. What is being done now are the fixes. The “nuclear option “is the filibuster and the unemployed have gotten a first hand tast of that at the hands of the G”No”P courtesy of Jim Bunning(R-KY). Reconciliation has another name and it is Democracy=50+1!

I work in an emergency room. If you can’t afford a doctor, you can come to the ER and you will be seen, regardless of your ability to pay. The law says we can’t turn anyone away. This well-meaning law has put many hospital ERs out of business.
Many private practitioners are dropping Medicare because of the government red tape. Just remember, private doctors are aging as a group, and many are retiring rather than put up with forced government. None of them are required to treat anyone. Young med students are looking at other career avenues.
This healthcare plan is the fastest way to destroy our fine but problematic healthcare system. The best way to immediately fix most of the system is to weed out the Medicare and Medicaid waste and corruption. An aggressive program could put billions back into the taxpayers’ pockets.

liberals hate America and want to ruin your healthcare system

Pay now – get later. Can I bring my 31M undocumented friends to the party?

Medicare for all? This proves most people do not understand math. As reported it takes 7, count them “7″ full time workers to pay for the benefits of 1, CCOUNT it “1″ medicare receipient. So if everyone, COUNT IT 302,000,000 million Americans go on Medicare, we need COUNT IT, 2,114,000,000, workers to pay for it.
Now That is Democratic Reasoning!!
Of course rationing will never happen, and expensive hips etc will always be availible???? RIGHT???

Are ranting platitudes the best commentary?
If not the current health care reform, what then?
I’ve not heard any alternative. It seems like political posturing to stage up for future campaigns.
As far as referring back to the days of the Founding Fathers goes, I have to say the country was designed by them to evolve according to the will of the people.
We have a highway system, didn’t have one then, Should we scrap the interstates because George Washington didn’t have a Chevy?
Think people. There are 300 million people in this country. And it is 2010, not 1776.

I still can’t decide whether Obama is an idiot or a liar. Perhaps both.

This is the 4th forum that “mdn” has posted the samething. Who is mdn?

Obama is the new Lincoln. Please put these republicans in their place. I will take up arms for Obama

Hmmm… truly taxation without representation!

Post after post we keep repeating the same old thing…”he just doesn’t get it…he’s not listening…”. WE THE PEOPLE are the ones that aren’t listening…we just don’t get it. Barack Obama is doing exactly what he wanted to do if elected….CHANGE AMERICA. NEVER…NEVER…NEVER did he say he wanted to make America BETTER…NEVER…NEVER…NEVER did he say he wanted to IMPROVE our country. CHANGE was ALL he ever PROMISED…AND NOW DEAR PEOPLE HE is doing just that, “CHANGING” America.

These statists do not care that the majority of Americans don’t want this, and they use every trick in the book to get their agenda passed.
This is not representative government. This is tyranny.
The Democrats are hypocrites. When Republicans had the majority, the Democrats complained heartily about using reconciliation, now it’s laudable. And they have progressively evolved the terminology (being progressives) from “nuclear option” to “reconciliation” to “majority vote”, to suit their purposes.
Have they no shame? No, they don’t. Any lie, any trick, any thuggery is appropriate to get their way. It truly is an Obamination, and the demise of a constitutional republic.

SERIOUSLY!?! Like there was ever a chance he wasn’t? These people are nuts by nature – look at the Obama loving professor who shot her colleagues and the nut-job who flew his plane into the IRS building. Brainwashed liberals who didn’t read his diatribe about health care and big business and his love of communism would like to believe he was something other than the typical nut-job liberals who will stop at NOTHING to force you into their little socialist pact.

Do the States have anything to say about any of this? No? Do the States have any say about anything? No? So what purpose do the State have? I’ve forgotten.

I thought this guy was supposed to be a genius? He seems just like a moron to me. Political suicide for himself and his party. I just hope the republicans have the balls to undo all this when the traitor is gone.

This is the last and final act before a marxist dystopia is imposed upon We The People. This is the stuff Civil Wars and Revolutions are made of. Go ahead morons. I double dog dare you!

Still no competition across state lines by insurance companies…proof positive that its about government control of your health care.

Do watch for Communist activists saying this is not 1776, and America must evolve. What they mean is George Orwell’s 1984. Don’t be fooled by the commie Vaseline.
ObamaCare is Communism. Argue with them, and they cut off your healthcare – PERIOD.

Dont you people realize that the only reason the republican party doesnt want this bill to pass is because they want the american people to all lose there coverage. They want us without health care and misrible. They dont want the economy to recove which is why they vote against using the stimulus. They want things as horrible for the american people as possible so they can say in 2012 “VOTE FOR THE GOP THE DEMS HAVENT ACCOMPLISHED ANYTHING AND YOU LIVES ARE STILL IN THE TOILET” What they are hoping is that the american voter is so stupid that they dont see that it was the GOP that blocked all the dems plans and stoped us from recovery and reform. And the sad part is they are probibly right from what I have been seeing on these posts. Its sad that the GOP can fool you people because you are as stupid as they hope you are.

Pitch a crisis, sweep in as the solution.
What criteria will this panel use to determine if rate hikes are excessive? In the end, this will be a political tool that merely rubber-stamps.
Health care isn’t broken…It’s just expensive.

Brilliant move – pass a bill that the majority of Americans don’t want, in a manner that crushes the usual Senate process. If this goes forward, I can guarantee that the Democrats won’t see a majority again for quite some time to come. Of course, if they DON’T pass it, they stand to lose a lot face with their constituents, so either way they’re not going to come out of this smelling like a rose.

Why wasn’t reconciliation a “nuclear option” when the Rethuglicans used it to pass an expansion of CHIP and an expansion of Medicaid? The last time I heard “nuclear option” was when whiney Rethuglicans were threatening to change the rules about filibusters, not because of reconciliation. Reconciliation has been used for non-fiscal reasons before, and it will be used again. Rethug’s just don’t like it when Dem’s use it to pass legislation. Whine Rethug’s, whine.

I dont know that Obama will actually meet half way on this bill with the 75 precent of Americans who are not in favor of the current incarnation of this bill. And is half way even enough considering the magnitude in which government tends to mismanage all of it’s existing tentacles.
I would rather see other things are fixed first, like SS, Medicaid, the postal system, law enforcement, education system, and massive spending cuts across the board. Those things should come first.

Well, they are going to do it. For all the Democrats out there cheering Chicago Jesus, enjoy the moment. You won’t always be in power. One day the precedent you are setting,will be used AGAINST YOU. Enjoy it. Sometimes when it looks like you won, you’ve actually lost.

Wonder how many of you realize that this stinker of a healthcare bill contains a provision called a “Marriage Penalty” ie if you are married you will be taxed at a per person tax rate much higher than what a single person or a cohabiting couple would pay. Just another Democrat provision to help destroy the family as well as any remaining scraps of morality. Interesting: Pelosi says she is draining the swamp when in reality she is busy building the world’s largest sewage lagoon! Want to see a real mess, just look at the district she represents which is San Francisco which is on the brink of anarchy and bankruptcy!

America rejected the health care plan!!So what is Obama doing??? Total disregard for his nation!!His ears can NOT hear!!

I keep reading how Obama was elected to “fix” health care. I must have missed something. I never saw the study that documented that. Some people voted for him to end the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. (too bad). Some voted for him so he would end “don’t ask, don’t tell” (oops. Missed that one too). Some voted for him based on his promise of transparency. (darn. that was a big-ass miss). Some voted for him to fix the economy (damn. We’ve dug ourselves into an even deeper pit since he took office). Yes, some voted for him based on his promise of health care reform, but they were just as delusional in believing him as were people who voted for him for other reasons.

Medicare operated by the same people who spent $24,000 on administration for every $4,500 handed out to take a car off the road in the cash for clunkers program. Imagine what great quality healthcare will be available when administration uses over 80% of the budget.

Colour me surprised.

Jaime, I cried out when Bush spent too much. And I, for one, agree that he spent too much. But since when did two wrongs make a right? You don’t fix spending problems by spending more. Too bad the Dems think money grows on trees in the upper-upper middle classes backyard. Big news: IT DOESN’T.

From some of the posts from the liberals, they would make you believe that most people don’t have healthcare.
30 million out of 250 million are without current healthcare coverage.
That is about 11%. And they want us to scrap our entire private insurance industry.

Government having full contol of The United States healthcare system equals less freedom!

At the mercy of the Insurance Companies or the Government. No winner there – except the Insurance Company or the Government.
Hate them so hard.

It’s incredibly interesting watching some republicans saying things like ‘time to get the guns’ and ‘vote as many times as you can in 2010 and 2012.
I wish they cold step back and see how really truly silly they look and sound..
They love this country and democracy so much.. except when they are not getting their way with it..
Fascinating..

Arizona Joe: Out of those “30 million” uninsured” that includes 12-16 million illegals.

Obviously the “fix” is in. Let us all remember ABC’s sympathetic and slanted coverage of Obama’s strongarming of the American people. Later, when this bill proves to be the disaster that objective people know it is, and the congress is busy trying to rescind legislation, we will remember we had ABC to thank for its propagandistic coverage.

Fascist, tyrannical bastards. Can’t wait to see them slither out of office in disgrace.

As a cardiologist, we are struggling now with cost to deliver care in the face of incredible reductions in reimbursement. To stay in the business of caring for our patients is what we want to achieve in 2010. As many other cardiologists have said, medicare recipients have seen the last of the abililty to access specialty care. We will pull out of the program as soon as we can make a way forward financially. We will not be dictated to by these idiots as to how to care for our patients. I would rather care for far fewer as evidence based medicine dictates than be given a set of parameters ok’d by some hack employed by those like obama. Everyone needs to scream at the top of their lungs and oppose this insanity.

I love the post by “Mike”…who see this all as a maneuver by the republicans. Read S-L-O-W-L-Y and understand. The DEMOCRATS have had a MAJORITY in the HOUSE and SENATE since 2007…even the “incompetent” G.W. Bush got legislation passed…these mouth-breathing nitwits can’t pass this crap holding ALL the marbles. This president, by the way, is in so far over his head he needs scuba gear. What a moron.
More PROgress
Less CONgress
Change…it’s ALL you’ll have left.

Cold civil war ahead. The future is not for the weak of heart.

Jeff,
The reason I wrote employee/employer is because for all practical purposes an employee could say, just as the business owner would say, it is part of their wage in effect.. or as in ‘I’m paying so much in workers comp for you, I can’t afford to give you a raise’..
So even though a worker is hourly, that workers comp certainly factors in to their real time wages as often as not..

If it gets passed… following the election in November… we REPEAL… REPEAL… REPEAL… this HC bill!

Go for it by acting against the American people’s whishes and the dem’s will lose control and Obama will go down as the worst ever failed one term US President in history. Oh ya, he has that title now.

If Democrats agree that reckless spending and debt were a BAD thing under Bush, why are they smiling and nodding now that Obama and his radical cabal of ‘czars’ are making it 5x worse?
‘Government run’ health care will turn out like everything else the government ‘runs’ – i.e., a disaster. They can’t even run the post office. Their car company is sinking. The schools they run are a national joke. They’ve run our farming industry into the ground. Their takeover of banks and housing has plunged the nation into bankruptcy. We must keep their claws off of our health.

And the Supreme Court will smack him back down so hard he will whimper for weeks to come. For a so called Constitutional scholar this fool seems to ignore the constitution.
By what right does the government have to tell me I have to buy something?

I would bet there are thousands in the wings just waiting to take to the streets — and the microphones — if the Obama Gang gets its way.

So for the past few years Obama has been saying that Bush was a terrible president, but now is defending the reconciliation maneuver on the basis that “Bush did it, so it’s okay if I do it.”
Wow. Obama and his staff are totally incompetent.
Posted by: Dave | Mar 2, 2010 7:09:35 PM
YOU PEOPLE MAKE ME SICK!!!!!! You had absolutly NO PROBLEM with Bush using this tactic again and again to bankrupt our country and give tax breaks to the rich but now that the Dems and Obama want to use it to give all of america afordable health care suddenly reconciliation is a terrible threat to our country. Go back to your hole you HYPOCRITE.
Posted by: Mike | Mar 2, 2010 7:13:40 PM
My only point is that Obama claims he is the anti-Bush, but he’s doing EXACTLY what Bush did and you love him for it.
Also, all of the recent insurance rate hikes have been in anticipation of this legislation passing. It’s a mess of a bill and is just going to compound the already huge problems with healthcare and health insurance.

The American people are hurting by way of the first stimulus that failed n agony, lost or losing homes, unemployment, illegal immigration, financial reform, bank bonuses, climate science of the lack thereof, union deals, et al., with a majority of Americans losing total confidence in this administration let alone politics in general and yet Obama continues to bang this healthcare tambourine? If I didn’t know any better I’d think Obama is seeking, looking and hunting down confrontation. As a wall flower Democrat who has had it with my own party Obama’s gyros are obviously off the chart to everyone except Obama. This is getting interestinger and interestinger and not in a good way. All hell is going to break loose and no one can say we all didn’t see it coming. Do it Barack, push that button and I will be surprised if half of America isn’t in DC within 72 hours. Just an observation beginning 20 years before there was a Barack Obama.

Republicans will have one more issue to run on- Repeal of ObamaScare. It might take this Novembers Republican takeover and a Republican president in 2012 but it will have to be done.

Are they removing the Louisiana purchase which gave $300 million to Louisiania. They have to go to reconciliation because I doubt all the Dems would buy into this. It is their election that’sup for grabs in November. Their is not enough in their to attract the Republicans. Obama threw a few crumbs at them. There was no real negotiation with Republicans. The joint conference was just for show. It is still a bad bill we can’t afford that will kill jobs with increased costs to businesses.

Ah, I see he is using the, “the Republicans did it first” defense. Brilliant Harvard educated lawyer!

HelloItIsMe,
I hope you’re right.

Why should we bother to “scream?” They are well aware that we don’t want this. They don’t care.

The nuke option is not a problem. Apparently if you get 50+1 in the Senate and 218 in the House, you can now push through 100% of your agenda. Let the Democrats play today, lose big in Congress in 2010 and 2012, have Obama lose in 2012, and the Republicans can do then do the same to repeal the Democrats garbage.

Most Americans want health reform, but not the reforms Obama is pushing. Claiming otherwise is a flat-out lie and everyone knows it.
PS Good luck rounding up the votes for this thing in the House. You’ll need it.

EbonyProgressive:
Good grief, man. A presidential election doesn’t decide what laws get passed. You look at the merit of the law in question. This law is garbage — for everyone. You think it’s good, but that’s because you haven’t thought about it enough. You think Republicans don’t want health insurance reform? You’re wrong. Wake up.

My Perogative..
That is where you are grossly mistaken..
You indeed already have been paying for not only medical, but retirement benefits for an entire generation..
Get used to it.. your either very new at this, or you are not very quick at getting up to speed.

Reconciliation is the nuclear option just under a different name. Love how when the GOP threatened to do this Obama called it a threat to Democracy.

Uh…an “up or down vote” is exactly what reconciliation is; it still comes down to a simple majority vote.
But Obama knows this…and he’s counting on your not knowing this.

Chas,
Workers do not pay unemployment insurance premiums. Only employers do. Where did you get such misinformation? I know. You didn’t bother to find out the facts, right? Well, you have them now. Unless you are an employer, you have not paid a nickel into unemployment.

A “Health Insurance Rate Authority”? Why do we need another federal agency to fund? Don’t states already have insurance commissioners? California does, and I’m pretty sure the other states do ,too.
Arrogance…pure, unadulterated arrogance. May each and every democrat incumbant for the U.S. Senate and House of Representativs have their campaigns fail…to go along with their failed leader.

As I taught my sons….”NO, Means NO!!”. Not “maybe”. Not keep trying, I may change my mind.
And don’t think I’ll respect you in November.

There will be a lot of collateral damage to the Dem’s for this bomb. And the smart ones know it. We’ll see who prevails.

That’s it…I am going to vote against EVERY SINGLE member of Congress who votes for this monstrosity via the nuclear option.
These Democrats are HYPOCRITES!!!
How was anyone ever deceived to vote for them in the first place? Maybe the media was irresponsible and didn’t really show who they were to begin with?
ENOUGH is ENOUGH!!!

Didn’t he learn our lesson in Iraq? I thought we voted out cowboy “hell with everyone else” diplomacy!

“We have Medicaid for poor people and Medicare for old people”
This is true, and thank god for both of them..
That said Medicare is good for roughly if you are a family of 4 and you make less than 1600 a month.. and it is short term. Most often after all the paper work gets done the parents are covered for emergencies and the kids get decent enough coverage for a fighting chance.
The poor *** that makes $1601 is simply out of luck..

I doubt if this passes but you never know with politics. Obama is clearly going for Jimmy Carter’s title of worse president and things are getting bad for all of us.
Health Care that kicks in in 4 years after us being taxed immediately is typical Dem plans. What is worse is the plans for the new levels of govt to intrude in our lives and make the HC choices for us. When none of our elected officials are required to be on the same plan it is clear that the Dems are too elite for the common folk.

Civil Disobedience of this BS because it will be a moot point by the time Obumble is gone in 2013. In the meantime, the legislation will be bogged down in the courts, and will not be enforced.

They are not “reconciling” two bills that are the same except in funding differences.
These liberal liars are creating an entirely new bill out of two bills that would NOT pass in the other chamber.
This is disgusting.
I can’t believe that ANYONE with a brain will vote for these lying liberals any longer.

Does anybody remember what happened when Carter tried price controls on gasoline? Anybody?
Rationing!!!! The Democrats cannot bend economics to fit their agenda. They try again, and again, and again…always with the same result.
Obama deserves to go down in the flames he is stoking. Lets hear a rebuttal to the economic analysis presented by Rep Ryan during the “summit”. I have yet to hear a single Democrat rebut the fact that this plan is smoke and mirrors, full of accounting tricks, and digs a multi-trillion dollar hole in the deficit. Obama said he wouldn’t vote for a plan that added even $1 to the deficit. Is he the biggest Progressive liar of all time?
Wake up America!!!!

>Reconciliation is not the nuclear option.
Yes it is.
“The nuclear option” is what the media and Democrats called reconciliation when the GOP threatened to use it to pass legislation the then-minority Democrats (aka, the “Party of No”) were gumming up.
The added irony is Harry Reid lying last week at the health care summit pretending he had never said anything about reconciliation when he had discussed just two days prior in an interview.
He’ll go along with this farce. Democrats had the votes all year…and didn’t pass it (they passed other legislation, however – like the “stimulus”). If they haven’t rammed their unpopular legislation through by now, it’s their own fault.
The nation is screaming through polling to STOP what they’re doing and start over.
And they will have none of it. You WILL take this bill, America. Whether we can afford it or whether you want it or not.
Open wide.

Obama is a psyco-marxist. What a loon job. He’s truly an idiot.

What happened to “listening to the American people”? Healthcare reform, in its current form was rejected by the people only to be ignored and rammed through anyway.

This guy is an arrogant foolish little minded man that refuses to listen to the people. This is tyranny at its best. Time to stand up and be heard and vote them all out and vote and end this nighmare.

John you need to get out a bit more. The nuclear option is where the filibuster is ruled unconstitutional.

If we can just pass a law and regulate health insurance companies into keeping rates low, wouldn’t free competition do the same?

I have said for a year – only idiots did not see this coming! It was clear as day.

The Omnibus Budget and Reconciliation Act of 1981 which went through reconciliation (go figure) had much more far reaching effects on social programs than this one will.
I don’t think that you’re going to get anywhere whining about procedure. Recent history suggests very strongly that the American people could care less how it passes.
When its implemented, the American people will make their judgement, but thats exactly what you’re afraid of, isn’t it?

This administration cares about only one thing…change. We, unfortunately, assumed the change would be an improvement, however, it appears as though the change is not the same old thing but MORE of the same old thing…bigger government with more control resulting in citizens having less of each.

Prepare to go bankrupt America. We cannot ever say that we did not know.

Wow. Tremendous ignorance of facts expressed by people reading Tapper’s page. How disappointing. The “nuclear option” for the clueless commentators, was a Republican idea to CHANGE the rules and kill the filibuster. It was NAMED that BY a Republican. A little research would behoove the ranters on here, but that’s probably expecting too much.
More research would illuminate that the reconciliation RULES, which are absolutely allowed and are PART of the rules, NOT the “nuclear option”, HAVE been used for substantial changes, including the actual Omnibus budget that allowed Clinton to give us a trillion dollar surplus in the 90s.
Also, look up “COBRA” to learn where the insurance rules for THAT came from.
Then come back and talk equipped with more than Faux News hyperbolic, BS talking points.

The Parliamentarian will rule that the bill doesn’t meet criteria for reconciliation (that’s only for budget bills) BUT BIDEN CAN OVERRIDE THE RULING.
THAT’s how they plan to cheat the rules.

THIS IS GREAT NEWS! I’m thankful we finally have a president for the people. Americans should not have to make the choice: bankruptcy or death any longer. And thousands have to make that choice every year. The Republicans have so deeply dug this country into the ditch it’s in, that Obama is a gentleman for allowing them into the discussion. The Republicans deserve nothing for all they did in the 8 years under Bush. I just wish Obama was more aggressive against the Republicans constant blockades and lies.

Time to get a super, super, super majority and vote all the morons out. And then let the President shut down the country when he veto’s everything. Lets see how that will work… Then maybe America will wake up to what is really going on.

What is it that just brought out all the crazies tonight?
Did they offer a free Sarah Palin book on some wingnut blog for whoever makes the most insane post here or something?

There already is a “Health Insurance Rate Authority” in each state. California’s Blue Cross 39% rate increase had to be OK’d by Caifornia’s insurance comission.
Obama wants to substitute his own authority, and for what? It’s a pure power grab, with no savings intended. He’ll just move money around so it looks like he’s saving it.

A lot of really hateful comments down there…
I’m uneasy about using such broad power to pass a bill, but I think it’s become clear at this point that it won’t happen any other way. I would urge the conservatives to remember one thing:
We liberals are part of America too. I hear a lot of talk from the right about how this isn’t “the will of the people,” but I have the distinct impression that you don’t consider people like me (liberals) to be among those people. As much as you hate this idea, please understand that there are many who feel differently, and we get a say too.

Of course he will, he will do whatever he can to take America to his socialist ideal, and if he bankrupts us, all the better, then he can use his powers of crisis to finish the deal.

Why do I hear NO ONE talking about all of the financial assistance and care cost write-off programs operated by some hospitals? Why don’t our myopic representatives pass funding bills (no strings please) for hospitals to expand such programs?
Let the hospitals determine who can and cannot pay. From what I’ve observed locally, they’re pretty good at it. But they could use more money channeled straight through their budgets to fund writing off the cost of those who cannot pay.
Don’t let these legislators remove more or our country’s localized authority and power. An overly centralized power is very easily destroyed and manipulated. And if it’s incompetent, EVERYONE beneath it suffers.
This healthcare reform bill is going to hurt the poor more than help them. It will eat up the generosity of local healthcare providers. Every decision will have to pass through the Shelob’s Lair of Washington.
Keep fighting this thing everyone!

1. The MINUTE this president signs that Bill, there WILL be a Constitutional Crisis and it will be challenged through an emergency action to the USSC. It is already set in motion and waiting for Obama to make his foolish decision.
2. November will make step-1 above look like a picnic!

In his remarks, scheduled to be at the White House, the President will paint a picture of what he will say will happen with a health care reform bill – skyrocketing premiums — Instead we will have skyrocketing taxes, everyone at the mercy of the Government industry as it will decrease the availability of Health care and you will see 80% premium increases proposed by the Government throughout the country. Look at the post office if you think the Government will run Health Care better. Social Security is Broke, Medicare is Broke, and the COUNTRY IS BROKE. Well my friends you will never see Government Health Care in the U.S. This is just a ploy to raise our taxes to pay off the debt they created!!! And health care will be overturned before it ever starts, but I will assure you that your taxes will never decrease. I Say “Impeach President O’Bama Now”!!!

Jake, I realize you had to edit that the President will not use the word *reconciliation* (which it is), but, I admire you for not changing your headline. I hope you will do the same in your ABC news report.

To all those hating on insurance companies(or rather, companies in general) and claiming the government has the right to pry into our lives I encourage you to read Atlas Shrugged. Please note that the book has it’s issues, but it also shows you the true ugly face of liberalism, and without the hard workers and the people who are thinkers and that actually is the atlas holding the world up, the lazy government and lazy people would fall in their miserable hole, while the real heroes can finally do what they want: worry about themselves and fulfill their own dreams.
And with that, I leave, hoping that maybe one day you libs will remember what I said. And if you don’t, well, then we will have to pay the price. Just like Russia did.

tanarg- You are a fool if you don’t think employees pay for Unemployment Insurance. Let’s do a simple example that maybe even YOU can understand…….
Company X has $100,000 annually to spend for employing 1 person. Is said person offered $100K a year in salary? NOPE. “Company” paid health insurance is $5,000 annually, FICA is 7.65% & Unemployment Insurance is 6.2%
Without getting into pre or after tax breakdowns, your pay is broken down as follows:
100K- 6,200 (6.2% for Unemployment) – 7,650 (7.65% for FICA Employer)- 5,000 (Health Insurance) = $81,150 Gross Pay. Even though the employer had $100K to pay, you only are offered $81,150 in Gross Pay plus “Free” Health Insurance. So, in the end, who is really paying for Unemployment Insurance?
Obviously, you have NEVER hired a single person, ran a business or even created a budget.

How it was named, who named it is really unimportant regading its threatened use. I always though it was only for budget issues, but i guess I was wrong. And will, all you elitist and smug little remarks will not make this reform something the American paople want.These people, Democrats and Republicans alike, were elected to serve the will of the people And don’t go on about fox news. i don’t think i have ever heard anyome there get a tingle down their leg when Obama spoke, and Maddow and Olberman do nothing but use talking points that have no basis in fact
Wow. Tremendous ignorance of facts expressed by people reading Tapper’s page. How disappointing. The “nuclear option” for the clueless commentators, was a Republican idea to CHANGE the rules and kill the filibuster. It was NAMED that BY a Republican. A little research would behoove the ranters on here, but that’s probably expecting too much.
More research would illuminate that the reconciliation RULES, which are absolutely allowed and are PART of the rules, NOT the “nuclear option”, HAVE been used for substantial changes, including the actual Omnibus budget that allowed Clinton to give us a trillion dollar surplus in the 90s.
Also, look up “COBRA” to learn where the insurance rules for THAT came from.
Then come back and talk equipped with more than Faux News hyperbolic, BS talking points.

As a conservative I love Obama. He is the best thing to happen to the GOP since Carter. In one year he has rebuilt the GOP and is creating more new conservatives than Reagan did.

You know, I’m one of the people whom Obama is going to give “free” or almost “free” care to. But if the cost of my “free” care is that others get screwed out of their hard earned money, I don’t think it will be fair to take my 80-90% subsidy. In fact, I don’t intend to apply for it because I think it is stealing.

it’s not too late to flee to Canada!!

Funny how the government don’t feel qualified to regulate cars, but they do think they know best how to run our healthcare. This is a blatant powergrab that does nothing to lower costs. TORT REFORM LOWERS COSTS! John Edwards sued doctors for genetic defects in newborns (not malpractice) and made upwards of $800 million. That’s real healthcare fraud and abuse not to mention the time and waste of resources. Term limits and vote the dems out in November!

By the way–the state of Mass passed mandatory health insurance and their rates went UP!!!So much for a good mandatory idea.

You have to feel for the President. Even though he didn’t wreck it, the economy is in shatters and the only way he thinks he can fix it is to spend more money and the Government is just the institution to do it. As an organizer in order to fix stuff was as simple as hitting the Government up for a grant or two. It worked for him then, why not now and he doesn’t even have to fool with grant writing.
Trying to get the economy moving is just too darn hard and difficult for he and his team but spending is so darn easy, giving his supporters what they want, when they want it will make him popular for years to come and by golly if you don’t like being part of the 40 or 50% getting more than they send to the Government then hey, you just wait…you’ll take those food stamps and love it! And if the Government says so, you may even get that sore throat looked after.

This country simply can not afford this. Why cant some Americans realize that we have to shrink government and its roll in our lives, we can NOT afford this. Heck, we can not afford most of what we have strapped ourselves with as far as programs socila security medicaid etc. We can not go much farther spending money that does not exist.

Gregg Banks, 95% of Americans have lower taxes? You are hence forth banned from posting your so-called facts. How many people in the US don’t pay any taxes? then tell me how you lower taxes on those who never paid them. Thanks for repping the blue team.

The Republican Party is truly the gang that couldn’t shoot straight. Thanks to their unwillingness to compromise, all its going to take now is one Senator to offer an amendment and the public option is back into the bill, and will get a majority vote. Thanks GOP for nullifying the effect of the DINOs like Lieberman, Landreiu and Nelson.

Obama can ACT like he is reaching across the aisle, but he is really backed into a corner — Spending 14 months on FAILED healthcare reform looks bad on the resume!! —- So lets re-cap the incompetence of Democratic healthcare reform —- First it was “we’re going to pass OUR BILL and you can’t stop us” — then “Ok, fellow democrats, we’ll remove these provisions so you’ll vote yes” — then “OK, fellow democrats, we’ll give you this bribe to vote yes” — then “watch out, we will use the nuclear option” — then, finally, this morning it was… “Hey, Republicans, if we put in some of your ideas in the bill, would you please vote for this, pretty please??”!!

We already have medicaid to take care of those who can’t get healthcare. Medicaid is a huge mess, it does not function properly. Now we are going to add millions more to some new program that will; be just as screwed up, and expect everyone to be better off?? there is no logic in that. Name one government program that functions as it was intended, that saved money, that created thousands of jobs, etc, etc… all the things Dems have promised national healthcare will do?? Every government endeavor has been a failure, and has cost far above what it was supposed to. Everyone is riddled with troubles.
You need to come to the realization that this has nothing, nada, zero, zip, zilch to do with health and everything to do with votes for Democrats, power, and control over our lives.

Chill, people. It’s your government. If you don’t like it, then stop choosing between the flip side of the same coin and vote in your neighbor. They’re probably sick of paying taxes so these idiots can test out all their wacko theories on us, too :)
Also, if you work for a corporation, you work for them. In case you didn’t already know that. So get back to your 9 to 5 – Paris Hilton needs a new purse for her cute li’l doggie poo.

He will note that the “fixed” bill will include the proposal for a new “Health Insurance Rate Authority” to set guidelines for reasonable rate increases. If proposed premium increases are not justifiable per those Health Insurance Rate Authority guidelines, the Health and Human Services Secretary or state regulators could block them.
_____________________________________
Will this regulation apply to the government taxing of policies which gets added onto the cost of someone’s premiums? Or what about what the gov’t mandates you spend/buy for the insurance coverage they say by law you must have?
OR rather are these regulations just being applied to private insurance companies? You know just like the regulations on wall street were applied to private banks but not fannie and freddie- which is where most of the toxic assets entered the system?
What a great way to get to single payer. So many unintended consequences so much irresponsible gov’t policy making.

If the democrats push this through, retribution will come and come hard in November.

Go ahead Congress, ram this through. It will be our turn to use the “nuclear option” in the mid-term elections.

Richard — “logically reason” about WHAT??? —– About a 2000+ page bill that DOESN’T EVEN ACCOMPLISH THE BASIC GOALS??? —– 1) Its way too expensive (10 yrs of revenue to pay 6 yrs of service?). 2) It will still leave 16 million Americans uninsured in 10 years (CBO figures). 3) Insurance premiums will still RISE for the average American, mainly because of the mandates place upon them, and no bill provisions which control costs. 4) Government entitlement programs always turn out to cost 10-20 times what they were predicted, why should this be any different?. 5) It adds many NEW TAXES to the average American. 6) It will take our freedoms away — Force an American to buy a product??? — Unreal, and UNCONSTITUTIONAL!!

The Peacock is ready to strut…again…

These are grounds for impeachment. The rules of reconciliation forbid this type of legislation. That’s why Repubs never pulled the trigger. This guy has to go!

The radical socialist Democrats will stop at nothing to destroy this once great nation.
Push this ObamaCare down our throats and you will never be elected to public office again.

”
A lot of really hateful comments down there…
I’m uneasy about using such broad power to pass a bill, but I think it’s become clear at this point that it won’t happen any other way. I would urge the conservatives to remember one thing:
We liberals are part of America too. I hear a lot of talk from the right about how this isn’t “the will of the people,” but I have the distinct impression that you don’t consider people like me (liberals) to be among those people. As much as you hate this idea, please understand that there are many who feel differently, and we get a say too.
”
You seem to speak from a “calm and rational” perspective, which I can appreciate! unfortunately the healthcare debate is discussed with unproductive anger (BOTH SIDES do it!)
Your point that “As much as you hate this idea, please understand that there are many who feel differently, and we get a say too” is correct. I feel the problem with the bill (and many others proposed by BOTH parties) is the one onesidedness. I feel they must start from scratch, and this time let the Republicans participate. This can’t be rushed in order to fulfill some arbitrary deadline. The government isn’t very good at reform to begin with, a rush can only make the outcome worse.
reconciliation would be political suicide (considering most people seem to oppose this specific draft). neither party can afford to alienate a significant portion of the population. This would be even worse for the Democrats, than the Republicans with the Iraq war!
At this point the polls seem to say the majority leans slightly right with this issue. Assuming this was the case, it would seem that the Democrats lack the backing to make reconciliation morally justifiable (IMHO).
-Nick

This is a clear, clarion call from the President. He’s saying that we no longer have a representative government. The day of reckoning has arrived and the radicals have taken over and will no take no for an answer. Americans are going to be forced to accept a new paradigm and witness the end of the American dream and way of life and there isn’t a damn thing they can do about it.

I’m guessing that most readers here are not aware that every other industrialized nation on the planet already has universal heath care, pays far less, and gets far more. Why do only low information voters read drudge? Its bizarre.

This is so pathetic. Obama has no power to implement a “nuclear” option. Congress needs to act. They are not going to. The dems in the senate are not going to get the dems in the house to pass anything the senate has already passed. the health care debate needs to be dropped for now. since the benefits don’t kick in for 3 years so what is the rush? Next issue. The lipstick has been applied, this pig is finished.

I see the Republican right wing smear artists are in calling the President names. Lovely crowd of people.

FINALLY! in 10 years, the American people will look back on this and be thankful.

Nick — You said “We liberals are part of America too” — Sure, and when Obama was elected by 54% of America, he was sworn in — Presently, There have been polls showing as many as 65% of Americans DO NOT want legislation in this form!! — So are the Dems “serving America” by cramming it down our throats?? — I respect your opinion, but you have been in the minority on this issue!!

To all Canadians, we enjoyed the Olympics very much but you can keep your health care system where it is. If your system was any good, would Provincial Premiers go to Miami to have routine procedures? Yeah, I didn’t think so…….

“Folks:
Aside from this very poorly written article lets deal with the issue here, health care.
We up here in Canada have had UNIVERSAL health care for decades. Even our “conservative” governments wouldn’t dare touch it. Now, why do you suppose that is?
This seems to me to be just a republican line in the sand. They don’t care what the issue is, any line in the sand will do.
Your country will pay dearly for this scorched earth rear guard retreat from a minority of your people. 51% constitutes a majority as far most democracies are concerned.
Whiners and losers the lot of them!
tinker”
First, tinker, we are not a democracy. We are a “representative republic”. This means we elect people to represent our (we the people) interests.
51% IS a majority, and since MORE than 51% of the people in this country DON’T WANT this version of healtcare reform it is incumbent on OUR REPRESENTATIVES to NOT force it upon us.

A bill that requires I buy insurance from a big corporation or pay a fine? Tell me again exactly which party is for big business and which one is for the individual…..

Does anyone still NOT get that this is about A) an instant, massive revenue stream for a BANKRUPT .gov, and B) a vehicle with which to justify meddling in every aspect of your life(which they will now have a vested financial interest in as health insurer)? Ya some guy 3,000 miles away cares more about your health than YOU do…

There is still no real tort reform in this, and the special interest corrupt deals are still imbedded – as is the Louisanna purchase corruption.
Back room deals, special interests, bribes, corruption – yep still Obama’s deal all the way through.
Make them pay for this stupidity in November – VOTE THEM OUT!

Do any of you liberals out there want to explain to me how PAYING 10 years for SIX years of service is fiscally responsible??? — I’ll wait!!!

I wonder if they’ve considered the consequencies of doing so.

Posted by: progressive mama | Mar 2, 2010 8:23:11 PM
“Really? Not Americans?
Even though we’re the ones representing for the liberal ideals this country was founded on.”
Really, Progressive Mama ??
Just what liberal ideals do you think this country was founded on, anyway ???
The federal government taking care of everyone was NOT one of the founding ideals.

Obama is doing EXACTLY
what a socialist would do.
Evil is as evil does.

I really don’t care what Obama says, he’s lying; he will say anthing to get what he wants including not telling the truth. But Democrats, do it, it will be at your own peril.
The unconstitutional bill will fail at the Supreme Court and them Democrats will end up in Antartica never to rule again.
Idiots we are, for electing this man as President, idiots!

Hey “The Truth funny if your healthcare is great how come your prime minister came here for healthcare?
Oh and by the way if we go by you and actually we should the majority of Americans do not want this healthcare pan to pass 65%
Obama took his time to get our troops supplies they needed, has put unemployment on the back burner, but hey Destroy our Healthcare yes thats a priority!!
If it passes it will put over 100,000 people out of work
Obama has already directly put one million people out of work, 22,000 in one shot, Since he blocked any funds for NASA 22,000 people lose their jobs, since he cut military spending over 100,000 people lost their job.
Now since this healthcare plan is unconstitutional it will cost millions to fight it in court. oh thats right Obamas friends will make money.

You clearly have been misinformed and don’t understand what the nuke option is.
Nuclear option:changing filibuster rules
Reconciliation: accepted rule of the Senate.
Posted by: progressive mama | Mar 2, 2010 8:32:56 PM
————–
Not so simple, of course. Reconciliation rules determine how and when it can be used, and when those rules are ignored we have a neutered Senate. We’re witnessing the destruction of the Senate as an institution, no two ways about it. You can try to convince yourself otherwise if you like.

Wow Progressive mama, but did you happen to realize most high IQ folks out there have not a lick of sense. Something we seem to be sorely lacking.

I did not vote for Obama but I think this bill is excellent.

I did not vote for Obama but I think this bill is excellent.
Posted by: mthsbth | Mar 2, 2010 8:46:42 PM
______________________________________
Good to see somebody telling the truth . . .

Why is it people who don’t want health care always bring up the deficit? Where were they when Bush was running up the Deficit? The fact is even though every westernised nation in the world pays for there citizens health care the Repulicans believe that Averge American should pay for there own health care with that $2,500 dollar dedcuctabile. Republican believe the money instead should be spent on bailing out the banks and the car industry which is what Bush did. Also spending trillions in Iraq and given out Trillions in Foreign aid. But help the Middle Class and poor in the US? Let them go work another job. Great attitude.

The arrogance of this move by the Obama Administration is breathtaking. And it is against the law. Reconciliation as is allowed to be used for legislation is limited only to matters of financial appropriations, NOT sweeping legislation. It is a complete abuse of our legislative system.
Regardless of which party you favor, this is patently unconstitutional, and to attempt using reconciliation this way is an abuse of representative democracy.
I look forward to this move being swiftly opposed and overturned by the Supreme Court. I would be every bit as angry if the Republicans tried a cheap stunt like this. We are a nation under the rule of law, and this is an absolute abuse of it.

Look for MUCH HIGHER interest rates; as well as, inflation….those, businesses who employ, that can afford to compete with the government for precious dollars will pay greatly in higher interest rates for those fewer dollars… so much for hiring more people……economics 101…

Reconciliation as is allowed to be used for legislation is limited only to matters of financial appropriations, NOT sweeping legislation. It is a complete abuse of our legislative system.
—
Brian the sweeping legislation has already passed in the Senate, a separate version in the House. The House will pass the Senate bill and the only thing that will go through Reconciliation is a very small bill that aligns the two– not a sweeping bill.
Reconciliation is a Senate rule– and it was designed for this very kind of thing.

Watching this healthcare fiasco has made me even more sick of the whole Washington than I was in the Bush years, and that’s saying something.
This bill is not about “health”, it’s a massive payoff to the insurance industry in the form of forcing the American people to purchase insurance from private companies. Right from the outset this bill is designed to scale back payouts that the government has to make, yet they have no problem with using the IRS to make you pay a little more.
This country is lost because more people believe what the idiot box tells them about “healthcare reform” than can be bothered to read the actual bill, and more people care about a smooth talking do the opposite President than care about individual liberty anymore.

The fall of the Roman Empire

This bill is going to bankrupt America. People who are educated but are “independents” need to wake up and see what is happening…Do you really believe in HUGE government because that is what you’re getting. Do you believe in government jobs as the main job path in life? you’re getting it. Do you believe that people unions and government jobs should be the norm? you’re getting it. It’s time to use your brain…one party is trying to consolidate money and power in Washington, one group is trying to reduce money and power in Washington…which one sounds better to you?

Good Lord people. The Senate already passed the bill. They don’t need to use reconciliation to pass the bill. They already did. Sorry, but this is going to happen whether you like it or not.
I really don’t see what everyone is getting so worked up about. This bill makes significant progress covering millions of uninsured people while forcing insurance companies to be more responisble and setting up systems to try to reduce the cost of health care for everyone. It maintains the status quo for the vast majortiy of people.
People against this bill, please do yourselves a favor and just try reading some real journalism about this bill. I’m not saying one side is right and one is wrong, but if you only believe one side all of the time, then you are brainwashed.

The reason why Anthem-Blue Cross (ABC) rates went up 39% in California was because they LOST 58 MILLION DOLLARS (per the WSJ).
Why the loss? King Obonehead’s changes in COBRA coverage.

Can’t believe how tickled I am to hear Barack the Destroyer say that. He’ll destroy the awful Lib Democrats while sealing his own legacy as the man who replaced Carter as “worse ever”. The National/Socialist party of the Democrats think that this lunatic bill won’t be rolled back. They think they’ll imput language that does not allow a roll back ever. Then the constitutional challenges will be in play for a few years, before reaching the Supreme Court. The bill will be recinded as unconstitutional. Finally conservatism will reign supreme for decades.
All Hail Barack the Destroyer!!!
Bringer of the next Reagan!!!

Radiomankc asks:
—So Republicans… do you represent the voters or the corporations? —–
We represent the Constitution, liberty, and self-reliance. Things leftwingers couldn’t care less about.

obama the far leftist want to take down the US and give you people free medicare.. like us in Canada, you wait to see a specialists, wait until you die. good luck people

I agree with Warren Buffett. Scrap this junk of a bill, start over, and do it right. Meaning, actually reduce healthcare costs, which this bill does none of.

So much anger and rage directed toward President Obama by people who probably (a) said nothing when the GOP used reconciliation, and (b) said nothing when Bush passed a trillion-dollar Medicare bill without considering how to pay for it.
Just look at these comments: “tyrant” … “Communist” … “dictatorship” … the blithering idiocy is so thick you can cut it with a machete. The only adjective missing from all this tripe is “uppity.”
We pay about double what most other countries pay per capita on healthcare, but have one of the worst aggregate health outcomes on the planet. Yet people still believe the system is just fine as is. Alrighty, then.

THANK YOU President Obama for standing up for what is right, and for fighting the right wing, the same people that nearly destroyed this country 2000-2008. Thank you for getting us back on track, and thank you for getting health care reformed.

Roflmao – too bad it takes something lie this to get people to wake up!
I love how no one is talking about the looming collapse of social security from 80 million baby boomers retiring.
THOSE guys are going to single handledly replace all those who vote for this boondoggle since the Gen xers and nexters together could not out vote them if they wanted too. The Gen xers are the ones who are going to have to support their parents inspead of buying the toys they have come to expect.
Fortunately, bandage fixes will not help this.

why is it that the white house is running congress, isnt there a separation of power anymore?

I am curious if all these people who claim they are for health insurance reform (there is no health “care” reform in the bill) are also willing to have their own taxes increased substantially to pay for it? It’s easy to be for a monstrous bill such as this as long as you know only the top 5% of the public actually has to pay for it. If you are truly for health insurance for all, then ALL should have some skin in the game and be willing to pay a lot more of their own cash to fund the program. It’s a dangerous game to allow people who don’t have a financial stake in paying for the plan to be able to lobby for a plan that requires others to pay the bill.

Hey Libs: If you still believe this bill solves an urgent crisis, then ask your congressman why the BENEFITS DON’T KICK IN FOR THREE YEARS–just the taxes. You really believe all those hurting uninsured children can wait 3 years? Really?

Mike G. states “The fact is even though every westernised nation in the world pays for there citizens health care…”
Here Mike G. shows us the problem. He believes that westernized nations pay for their citizens health care. That’s very interesting. Where do those westernized nations get the money to pay for their citizen’s health care. What products, goods or services do they produce through which they receive funds to pay for their citizen’s health care. Oh that’s right they don’t produce anything. What he meant to say is in every westernized nation they take from the working class to pay for everyone else’s health care. And as we see in Greece and Spain for example, westernized nations that rob from the working class to provide for all, more and more people stop working, more and more government corruption, and less and less for everybody. It does not spread the wealth, it spreads misery.

Because millions of illegals mexicans without insurance are flooding california thanks to the LIBERALS.
____________________________________
The Republican Bush was in power for 8 years – you got nothing accomplished on this?

Posted by: truth | Mar 2, 2010 8:55:49 PM
The fall of the Roman Empire
There are actually a lot of historical parallels here. The problem is most people think this quality of life and system of government are birth rights. That they cannot fail. I hope they are right, but history says the opposite.
“The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public’s money”
Alexis de Tocqueville

Why wait three years? Do it immediately or do not do it.

WE DO WANT REFORM!
—
See? Bipartisan agreement. Problem is that the Republicans had plenty of opportunity not to kick the can down the road and yet, they did.
Years ago, in the 90s, the bills the Republicans proposed looked much like what is going to be done now.

Hey, I’ve lived in Quebec for 13 years (after living in the USA for 29 years). The USA does NOT want a government run option. Every SINGLE day our local paper (Le Soleil) runs articles about the horrible wait times in hospitals; poor care; shortages of doctors; etc, etc…ad infinitum. Not to mention that when I visit most hospitals here they look like they are from a 1930′s movie.
Moreover, I have personally waited HOURS AND HOURS just so my kid could get a few stitches…on multiple occasions…(yes, my kids are a little accident prone!)
Those who are pushing for national healthcare KNOW NOT WHAT THE ARE ASKING FOR. Be careful what you wish for becasue you might just get it.

This will be good for Amerika.
You lost, get over it.
Hard left dead ahead!

Everyone who thinks this is a good plan…..
why is something similar in Massachusetts failing in such an extreme way? They had great healthcare resources before their “cost control reform.”
Cost controls limit choice, limit competition, limit innovation, limit quality and therefore WILL LIMIT LIFE.
Cut the ideology crap and use your brain. We can do what will help without turning the whole thing over to a bureaucracy.

Just how much money does Obama, Pelosi, Reid think that the average American worker can pay out in taxes, fees, gas, food, electricity, water….before we all go BROKE?????
___________________________________
When the Bush administration doubled the national debt to $10 Trillion dollars – and presided over the almost complete collapse of the U.S. economy – it was a done deal that the tax payer would be paying and paying for this.
Hypocrites.

Midwest says: —-I really don’t see what everyone is getting so worked up about—-
Good question, Midwest. Why should the nation be concerned about our pending bankruptcy and sticking our granchildren with the debt for this lousy Socialist healthcare system (that will be run as badly as all our other govt. agencies.) What a bargain! We should all stand up and cheer for the big favor they are doing us already over-taxed taxpayers. yipp-ee. :-(

Repeal, and then convict them for Treason

Thank you Mr. Obama for destroying what little was left of our country after George Bush left office. Thank you for completing the job. For tossing out the Constitution and for making sure that all of our grandchildren will have nothing to live on because they will be paying for your massive socialist programs for eternity. Thank you and sleep well tonight knowing that tomorrow you will rule the world.

Dear Progressive Mama:
You have read all 2,700 pages? That’s more than I can say for any member of Congress!

I thought Harry Reid told his “good friend” Lamar Alexander at the big summit that he was not entitled to his “own truth” that the Dems were planning a reconciliation way of passing this bill. Lamar was right and Harry lied.

If this is so good, why doesn’t our elected officials accept the same healthcare plan for themselves and their families?

Somewhere in Kenya, a village is missing it’s idiot.

Well I’m not happy about it, and anyone with half a brain should really, really get over the idea that this is about our health. As if the wannabe rulers in DC care about our health!!! It is about the government taking away our right to private conversations with our doctors. It is about fines and fees for not participating. It is about yet another government boondoggle so they can have more of our money to play games with while they are bankrupting our country. It is about paper pushers making the decisions about what care we can have and when. Where do you suppose the doctors are going to come from to take care of the 35 million they’re going to insure? Nurses? Facilities? Do we need reforms? Absolutely. Fix it so we can buy insurance in other states and that will open up competition in the companies so prices will come down. Reform the laws concerning frivolous lawsuits and malpractice (oh wait, I forgot, the lawyers don’t want us to do that cause they’re getting rich from it). Reign in the pharmaceutical companies. But instead of common sense we’re going to get more government access to our privacy, more government control of our money and higher taxes. Yep, that’s real hope and change. My hope is that November brings some change…..

Posted by: Becca | Mar 2, 2010 9:13:05 PM
Let me guess, you didn’t understand the housing bubble either– and you’re still bewildered or blaming the recession on the poor (or Obama).
LOL.

Obama has declared war on the vast majority of Americans. He is an egotistic maniac with no regard for the citizens. November will fix things and we will roll back anything he tries.

It amazes me that some people have such strange priorities. They take very little personal responsibility for their life and expect the government to provide for them.
I work with people who make a very nice salary yet complain when they have to make a $40 co-pay for a medicine that will cure their sick kid. These are the same people who have no issue spending $600/month on a car, $3k on a 60in HDTV, etc…..
For the vast majority of people coverage isn’t that expensive. I was actually surprised. I was laid off last year, I rejected the COBRA coverage because even with the subsidy it was higher than what I could buy on the street. I purchased a family plan (2 adults 3 kids) with primary care visits, drug coverage, and full dental for $305/month. It has a high deductible on hospitalization but it also caps and they pick up full coverage over the cap.
Most people spend more than that on less essential things in their lives every month.

Have you always wondered what it is like to live under a dictator?
Now you know.
Time for a new revolution to oust the tyrants.

Why doesn’t the government listen to the people and what they want. They really do not care for the people who voted them in.

are there more people who work ,or more on the dole? if more who work, when they get the bill they will vote in the GOP. and stop this maddness. If not, we are doomed anyway. buy gold, and look for a new place to imigrate too, where you are rewarded for your work, and it is not confiscated from you to support deadbeats

And I do hope there is something of good to be rescued from the wreckage of the Democratic Party once this painful, necessary purge is done.
Posted by: Carol | Mar 2, 2010 9:23:45 PM
______________________________________
We have barely begun to crawl out from the wreckage of the last Republican president – don’t even think about crawling back in that hole!

PS – Controll was spelled that way because I think those on this board who are going back to the “blame Bush game” are just TROLLing the boards.
And for the record. I think califpatriot nailed it!

Obama and his minions are determined to destroy a great health care system. The better to control the masses and create more downtrodden. The man should be impeached over this.
Oh by the way, what ever happened to “more Jobs,jobs,jobs? Not as important as a takeover of the country by the Commie bastards!

Brian the sweeping legislation has already passed in the Senate, a separate version in the House. The House will pass the Senate bill and the only thing that will go through Reconciliation is a very small bill that aligns the two– not a sweeping bill.
Reconciliation is a Senate rule– and it was designed for this very kind of thing.
Posted by: progressive mama | Mar 2, 2010 8:53:06 PM
===================
That is an outright falsehood. You’ve lost my respect.

Obama; thank you for taking politically courageous steps to bring our country toward the standard of healthcare enjoyed in the rest of the developed world.

I’m really a little sick of hearing how much Bush spent as an excuse. The economy was in the tank after 9/11 and the tech bubble burst and the tax cuts helped grow the economy through 2007. He financed Homeland Security, a war on 2 fronts and recovery from hurricanes and floods. Yes a lot of money was spent but we say something from it. Obama sepnt it on what? A stimulus that didn’t work, cars for clunkers as a payoff for his union buddies, and now a healthcare bill that will always put us deeper in the hole due to increased taxes on businesses and increased costs for all of us. So Bush is President but Obama is and is doing a lousy job.

Do you people not understand that there is no money?
Regardless of what Bush did, we cannot afford the current programs much less this monstrosity.
Where are the leaders that speak the truth? No you can’t continue to pay. The budget needs to be cut up to 50%. That means all social programs must be cut. SS, cut. Medicare, cut. Unemployment, cut. Everything, CUT.
Wakeup people, THERE IS NO MONEY!!!!!!

Obama Chavez at work!! More of the same crap – “WE KNOW BETTER THAN YOU” Attitude.

obama’s decision to back away from buying off those 2 senators (with special favors to their states) is not a concession of any kind because he has already decided he’ll only need 51 votes anyway!

Who is John Galt?

Obama’s Hugo Chavez Moment Continues.
If he wanted bipartisanship, he will get it in the form of bipartisan opposition to this unpopular legislation and the fact that he has chosen to break Senate rules to make it law.
Obama spits in the face of the American People.
The media is complicit.

And when the govt does force premium increases to be lowered, we will just see less benefits from the insurers.
Pricing freezing always leads to lower supply. Gas, wages, and now insurance.
Washington involvement is like a 3 year-old’s involvement in helping to fix dinner. Actually, I’ll prefer the 3 year-old.

Obama’s Hugo Chavez Moment Continues.
Posted by: Angelo | Mar 2, 2010 9:32:19 PM
____________________________________
Hey you left out Stalin, Mao and Jack the Ripper!
You’d better brush up on your smear campaign instructions.

Most of the progress made in our country is a result of Democrats such as Social Security, Medicare, Veterans affairs and Education Loans. However, I can’t tell you how many Republican families actively use these benefits to the fullest.

I work, but I don’t make enough money to afford this. I’m afraid I’ll have to pass!
Regarding paying the fine for refusing this, I can’t afford that either. So, what’s a fella to do?
ANSWER – Since I must prove to the IRS that I have the Gubbermint hell’th care, I simply quit dealing with the IRS. I file a new W-4 at work, claiming I’m exempt and get every cent of my paycheck. Then when it comes time to file…I don’t file.
Before you know it, with all that extra money coming in, I can buy a one way ticket to some other nice country, where I can live in peace.

Bush didn’t spend a fraction of what BHO has given us in 1 year.
Posted by: XEKE | Mar 2, 2010 9:33:56 PM
________________________________________
You apparently have no idea of what truth might consist of . . .
The Republican Bush administration doubled the national debt to $10 trillion dollars – after promising ‘smaller government’ and ‘eliminated deficits’.

Obama will be writing the bill? BAHAHAHAHA the 1,500 new global government lobbyists are writing the bill. There isn’t a single bill that gets signed by Obama that was not written by a new global government lobbyist. America will fall apart within a few dozen months. I hear Elvis will be on the new $1 trillion dollar note, and Obama messiah himself on the $1 quadrillion note.

Posted by: N Waff | Mar 2, 2010 9:36:56 PM
The only tactic the Republicans have is to oppose EVERYTHING the Democrats do.
Get Re-Elected First. Country Second.

Pelosi has said that her fellow Democrats need to vote for this bill even though they may risk losing their seats.
If this legislation is so popular, why would any Democrat be at risk of losing their seat?
Answer:
FAKE POLLS DO NOT TRANSLATE INTO REAL VOTERS
(Virginia, New Jersey, Massachusetts, November 2, 2010)

“Perhaps you and I have lived with this miracle too long to be properly appreciative. Freedom is a fragile thing and is never more than one generation away from extinction. It is not ours by inheritance; it must be fought for and defended constantly by each generation, for it comes only once to a people. Those who have known freedom and then lost it have never known it again. Knowing this, it is hard to explain those who even today would question the people’s capacity for self-rule. Will they answer this: if no one among us is capable of governing himself, then who among us has the capacity to govern someone else?”
- Ronald Reagan

Most Americans favour the elements of the health insurance reform…
This comment has been repeated ad nauseum and is a complete joke. Democrats sound like used car salesmen. You like the color, right? You like the interior, right? You like the cupholder’s right? The answer to all those questions can be yes and the customer still feel the car is a lemon.

According to a Rasmussen poll released yesterday, 52% of U.S. voters continue to oppose the plan proposed by the president and the Democrats. Only 44% support it
____________________________________
Nobody has seen the final plan. How can they intelligently approve or disapprove of something they’ve not seen yet?

Just who the hell does this guy think he
is? That call is not for the White House
to decide. It is a call for Congress
and unfortunately the VP has a role in it
all as president of the Senate. He’s as dumb as number one in the White House.

glen, what sort of moron are you?
We LOVE congress bickering, it means that there will be less friggin LAWS we don’t need!! It is the only think that is slowing them down from turning us into a fascist state.
And there are no “elements” of the reform bill we like as Americans. We don’t like price controls, we don’t like forced insurance, we don’t like govt run businesses. What the frick is there to like?
The answer is less govt, more competition, more transparency, and tort reform. Of course, this simple option will never happen.

Progressive mama. You are sorely ill-informed. Reconcilliation is ONLY for budget. Not legislation like this. Liberals are prime examples of the public education system. They only know what they are told, drone-like. You have no idea how to learn on your own.
Posted by: realist | Mar 2, 2010 9:34:55 PM
Dare ya to look up how it really works– and how the Dems set it up so it fits very neatly within the rules. You realize two bills have already passed, right? And that the House will pass the Senate bill?
Also, check out how the GOP set us up for this very moment.
then crow. It’ll be amusing.

I’ve got an easier plan… GET A JOB AND PAY YOUR OWN WAY !! It worked from the dawn of mankind, all the way through the 19th century. STOP ALL FORMS OF ENTITLEMENT MOOCHING

Democrats will Pass the Bill by:
August Recess
Labor Day
Halloween
Thanksgiving
Christmas
State of the Union
Easter <- Current Deadline that will not be met.
Cinco de Mayo
Memorial Day
Fourth of July
Labor Day
All the while loyal liberals donate buckets of cash for a bill that will not pass.
Charlie Brown meets football.

The bloodsucking entitlement moochers are killing capitalism

Reconciliation is just another mistake in the Democratic Deathmarch.
The Stupak Amendment in the House will most likely mean we never even get to the point where the Senate sees the bill again anyway.
Oh…and Dems need to decide if they want the public option or a big taxpayer giveaway to the insurance companies.
This will not go well for them.
They are better off dropping the legislation entirely.

Cut taxes. Cut Government to Constitutional levels. Promote unrestrained Capitalism. Watch America thrive.
Who is John Galt?

It should now be evident that Barack Obama is turning on the American people.
He is a traitor.

Debt when Clinton left = $5.674 trillion
Debt when Bush left = $9.849 trillion
So the national debt rose $ 4.175 trillion dollars in 8 years of the Bush administration, which means an average of $522 Billion a year each year Bush was in office.
Currently the national debt is $12.334 Trillion dollars. The national debt has increased a record $2.485 TRILLION Dollars in 1 year under Obama…at the current rate Obama will have beaten Bush yet again, doubling the national debt (and doubling the debt Bush incurred) in just 4 YEARS !

The Supreme Court is gonna love this one.
Even if it does pass, but I give it a year before it’s repealed, or declared unconstitutional.
And the Democratic Party wont see power in this country for DECADES.
November 2010, the second American Revolution begins.

Debtor prisons and work farms… instead of deadbeat unemployed moocher entitlements.

Goodbye Democrats! Many of you will be voted out in November. Most Democrats AND some Republicans are VERY out of touch with the Amercan people. Obama is the most inexperienced president in the history of our country… and now we’re suffering for it.
Some Senators and Representatives will know what unemployment feels like this November!

Wait until fall, Mr. Democrat! The nation is headed back towards freedom!

Isn’t it funny how the bank bailout cost $700 Billion with a B and was a 3 page bill that gave money away with no strings. While a bill that cost $700 million with and M and will reduced long term costs big time can’t get passed. health care cost in 1992 were 9% of out costs, now they are almost 20% and are project to reach 40%-50% in the near future if nothing is done. So what’s the smart thing to do?

Nobody has seen the final plan. How can they intelligently approve or disapprove of something they’ve not seen yet?
Posted by: tierra | Mar 2, 2010 9:41:52 PM
—————
This one is a classic. Tell me, by your own logic, how can YOU support this plan?
Posted by: Woody | Mar 2, 2010 9:49:54 PM
____________________________________
I haven’t seen the final plan – I don’t support or oppose it. That was the point.
The Republican right were quoting about opposition to something that doesn’t exist yet.

Obama and the rest of the Democrats are making a huge mistake. Our country simply cannot afford this.

Yay. Another step towards socialism. Let’s have Big Brother cuddle us and make sure we’re all safe.

No one understands: the Democrats are happy to lose it all in November, if they can install this never-ending entitlement. They have their eye on the big picture, which is a citizenry that doesn’t need family, or friends, or church, or charity… just the government.
Yikes.

The Wall Street Journal posted a scholarly piece several months ago in which the writer compared the health care costs in the 5 or 6 states that had passed ObamaCare style legislation. The Findings were that each state was near bankrupt, the cost of private insurance premiums skyrocketed, and the number of uninsured families increased. What we are dealing with here is a political agenda and not a health care crisis. We are seeing the repeat of FDR style politics whose proponents in the White House have no problem elongating an economic downturn and the hardships it is causing to millions of working people if it accomplishes their quest for power.

Face it people – Health Care reform is going to pass. Republicans – Please stop the temper tantrums! It’s beneath even you.

If there is any justice, only a small, small minority will be foolish enough to vote for Republicans again after Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz and that lying crowd.

Yes, the House of Reps can certainly pass the disaster that the Senate passed a few months ago. And yes, President Hussein can put his signature on it, and the disaster will become the law of the land. MY GOD.
But wait…..won’t his faithful believers wonder what that fiasco has to do with job creation? How will a monstrosity of re-arranging 1/6th of the economy have any GOOD effect on the economy, creating jobs? Answer: It Won’t.
Effect: More and more ppl will see that Obama is an unmitigated disaster, the worst President we could EVER have at a time of crisis, when we need LESS govt and LESS taxes, and MORE capitalism, and MORE personal responsibility, and MORE energy production — yes, oil — and instead we get the opposite. When will our people elect leaders who tell us the correct answers? Well, Scott Brown’s a start……so thank you Massachusetts!

Face it people – Health Care reform is going to pass. Republicans – Please stop the temper tantrums! It’s beneath even you.
Posted by: Angella B. | Mar 2, 2010 9:59:10 PM
______________________________________
I’m looking forward to seeing the final bill. I think it’ll be good enough the majority of Americans will get behind it.

If reconcilliation is such a natural fit for this legislation, why have the Dems been so reluctant to pull the trigger, and so vociferously deny considering it?
Posted by: n2vip | Mar 2, 2010 10:02:12 PM
_____________________________________
They’ve been working out the best bill – once they have the final, they’ll pull the trigger on it.

I’m looking forward to seeing the final bill. I think it’ll be good enough the majority of Americans will get behind it.
Posted by: tierra | Mar 2, 2010 10:02:42 PM
________________________________
But the Dems are saying that the majority of Americans are ALREADY behind the existing Senate bill. Oh Tierra you are so full of it.
By the way… I can’t make heads nor tails of the news on Rangel. Why won’t Honest Nancy toss him out? I’m from NJ and I know what happens when Dems get in power. The corruption just ooozes out of them and they protect each other.

It is like you start paying for a new car but you have to wait 5 years to get it delivered. Wow great idea!!!
Posted by: Mark | Mar 2, 2010 10:00:14 PM
Several reforms pertaining to denial due to pre-existing conditions and recision start immediately as does funding for community health centers, small business tax credits, temporary high risk pools, filling the Medicare drug donut hole, COBRA extensions and so on.
Also, the pilot programs which are at the heart of the approach to testing solutions to cost, and innovating so that we can find the best solution while we move toward universal coverage.

When this is passed, the USA will no longer be a CONSTITUTIONAL REPUBLIC. Reporters seem to have forgotten that they will also be living and dying under a socialist/neo-fascist system. Talk to your friends that live under these systems. If they are honest they will tell you that we are making a HUGE MISTAKE!

If there is any justice, only a small, small minority will be foolish enough to vote for Republicans again…
Posted by: tierra | Mar 2, 2010 9:59:26 PM
Well, if you ever move down here and become a citizen, you can vote against the evil Republicans yourself, eh.

- Ronald Reagan
Posted by: Duke | Mar 2, 2010 9:57:12 PM
Oh sheesh. Reagan and Rand quotes. I suppose you missed Rachmann’s article in Financial Times called “How Reagan ruined conservatism”?
“Palin’s book is smug, lightweight, nationalistic, entirely free of original ideas. How has this woman become the darling of the American right? How has she become so popular that some bookmakers make her the favourite to win the Republican party nomination in 2012?
And then I realised – the rot set in with Ronald Reagan.
This might seem an odd conclusion, since President Reagan is a conservative hero who won two presidential elections. But the ideas that are now known as ‘Reaganism’ are, in fact, profoundly subversive of some of the most important conservative values. Traditional conservatives disdain populism and respect knowledge. They believe in balancing the government’s books. And they are pragmatists who are suspicious of ideology. Reagan debased all these ideas – and modern American conservatism is still suffering the consequences.
The most damaging idea propagated by the Reagan myth is the cult of the idiot-savant (the wise fool).
….The damage Reaganism did to conservatism extends well beyond the Palin effect. The late president also became associated with a couple of bad ideas that helped make the administration of George W. Bush such a disaster. The first was fiscal incontinence; the second is the view that the key to a successful foreign policy is a rigid distinction between good and evil, and a strong military…”

This will be just like Social Security. The money will be collected for the next five years or so. The benefits will kick in but the money will not be there to fund the programs. Why? Because just like in the past these losers in DC will not be able to resist getting their grubby little hands on all that money coming in They will do everything to spend it and, when the program kicks off, all we’ll have is a bunch of IOU’s that will require massive tax increases to fund this huge entitlement program.

Do not pay taxes.
End the Fed.
Live free and thrive.
Subject and die.

75% of Americans don’t want this. Ladies and gentlemen, we have become a dictatorship. For those of you who voted for “Hope & Change,” thank you very much.
Fascism allows for private ownership of business, but government dictates how businesses should operate.
So now we have a Fascist Dictator for President.
Jefferson’s Tree Will Be Refreshed!

So now we have a Fascist Dictator for President.
____________________________________
The truth about the Republican right continues to leak out. Creepy.

What they don’t say:
One of the reasons for sky rocketing health insurance premiums is:
Medicare and Medicaid do not pay enough to cover the cost of the treatment. There fore, part of the cost is transferred to private insurance. This is actually a bigger factor than the uninsured using emergency rooms.
Think about it! Who uses the most medical care? Seniors or young, vital, but illegal, immigrants?
Obama is going to EXPAND medicaid and CUT funding for medicare. Private premiums will explode.
(and, NO, the CBO was not requested to calculate the effects of the changes in medicare and medicaid on private health premiums… wonder why?)

Looks like we’ll have 400+ Republicans in the house and regain the Senate after the November elections. I hope it won’t take long for the Supreme Court to over-rule this decision.

Polls of “Likely Voters” show 60+% opposition to Obamacare. It is NOT a sure thing to pass “reconciliation.” However, if it somehow does, it will trigger a backlash unlike anything we have seen in decades. My guess is, the few remaining sane Democrats know this and will stop it. But, with Obama/Pelosi/Reid in control, sanity is NOT in large supply!!!

They never say that WHY the health care premiums go up ? When states mandate that all insurance companies to cover procedures like Sex Change operations, tattoo removals etc etc…then everyone would have to cover that risk.
Every liberal I know does not ever forgets to setup appointments with his Shrink, Chiropractor, dentist (for cleaning) and all the other FREE stuff….then why NOT everyone’s premiums should go up and that gives an excuse to the communist Democrats to SAVE us from evil Insurance companies. What a freak-in retarded nightmare.

Go for it Mister President!!You have a mandate from the American people for change!! Obama!!!

If the Democrats go through with this it would be the 2010 equivalent of the shot at Ft. Sumter that started the Civil War. This will divide the nation to the extent that we will never again be united. It could get real ugly.
Let’s not for get that 5 short years ago, when President Bush considered using (but didn’t) reconciliation to push through stalled judicial nominees, Obama said this:
Obama: “He hasn’t gotten his way…uh…and that is now prompting a change in the Senate rules that really I think would change the character of the Senate uh forever and uh what I worry about would be that you essentially have still two chambers the House and the Senate but you have simply majoritarian uh absolute power on on either side and that’s just not what the Founders intended.”
Biden said this:
Biden: “I say to my friends on the Republican side you may own the field right now buy you won’t own it forever. I pray God when the Democrats take back control we don’t make the kind of naked power grab you are doing.”
Schumer said this:
Schumer: “We are on the precipice of a crisis, a constitutional crisis. The checks and balances which have been at the core of this Republic are about to be evaporated by the nuclear option. The checks and balances which say if you get 51% of the vote, you dont get your way 100% of the time. It is amazing its almost a temper tantrum.”
Reid said this:
Reid: “The right to extend a debate is never more important than when one party controls both Congress and the White House. The filibuster serves as a check, on power, preserve our limited government.”
and Baucus said this:
Baucus: This is the way that Democracy ends not with a bomb, but with a gavel”
How right he was.

Majority vote is not intended to pass legislation like this. Period. This is a direct shot across the bow of our Republic. Maybe in France or England people cave in and accept these disguised “changes,” but here in US we’re not going to put up with this anymore. The vote lever is our friend, and that that lever will hopefully make a difference in the next elections. Godspeed America. Godspeed.

How right he was.
Posted by: Mahakala | Mar 2, 2010 10:26:10 PM
They were talking about the nuclear option (which means changing filibuster rules)
Reconciliation is in keeping with Senate rules and is entirely appropriate for a small revision to bills which passed both houses in Congress with supermajorities.

carlos- he had a mandate based on he wasn’t Bush and people thought he would be a centrist not the leftist he is. He has done nothing to stop the backroom deals, the bribes to Senators for states approval and the giveaways to unions. So he mandate is blown as the voters have shown in the polls. They did not bargain for the change to a nanny state where taxes rise and nothing that govt does works. A lot of the voters have buyers remorse.

I lived in Europe for six years courtesy of the US military.
Their standard of living is about the same as an American at our “poverty” level. It was heartbreaking to talk to people who gave 70% of what they earned to their government and couldn’t do a darn thing to stop it.
Is this what we want?

Americans just took their government back from the Republican liars under Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz and the others.
Republican motto: Us First. Country Second.
Posted by: tierra | Mar 2, 2010 0:22:16 PM
____________________________
And handed it to the Democratic liars under Obama, Biden, Pelosi, Reid, Rangel, and the others.
Democratic motto: We really are bipartisan: We’ll plunge the nation even further into debt and let the future generations of both parties pay the bill!

Obama – a living example of the Peter Principal in action. You can include Pelosi & Reed in there too…

Sweet! Our debt gets to rise to even higher levels and our country can continue down the path towards tossing out the Constitution. Can someone hand our government officials maps to the National Archives?
Let’s enact legislation that more than half of Americans don’t want. I hope our congressmen are updating their resumes. I have a feeling a lot of them will be looking for new jobs soon.
As for reconciliation. This needs to just disappear. Both sides have abused it horribly.
To the American people: Please vote out the incumbents. It’s time for them to find new lines of work.

This is a representative republic, but even with the will of the People against this clown, he still thinks he’s right.
Click my name (below) to wear a message for the Clown Prince.

Pass the bill already ! If it does not show signs of working, do you all not think it could be overturned or changed. This is not the end all be all…this is a first stab at trying to fix a PROBLEM that is driving healthcare through the roof AND keeping tens of millions of people uninsured. Yes we need a starting point, and at least the Dems have the x?#@ to do it…unlike the Objectionist Right

So in 2012, I hope that Democrats don’t mind when Republicans roll back the health care bill with 51 votes.

This is not the nuclear option, Drudge. The nuclear option is to change Senate rules to eliminate the filibuster, something that has never been done (and hence the last resort, nuclear option). Reconciliation has been used several times, including by the last administration. It’s more like the tomahawk missile option.

Their standard of living is about the same as an American at our “poverty” level.
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Oh puh-lease. This is such b.s. Where did you live? Specifically.

Tinker:
1st, didn’t your PM just have heart surgery in the States? You might want to tone down about bragging about the Canadian health care system.
2nd, the 60 vote majority needed to pass a bill in the Senate is done for the sake of pragmatism. It used to be 67 or 2/3rds of the country. The idea is that major legislation needs more than a simple majority to be passed (to avoid the momentary political winds).
3rd, the majority of Americans oppose the current bill.
4th, Obama had both majorities to pass a bill for over a year. The fact is that even members of his own party opposed the reform they are proposing and needed to be paid off for their votes.
5th, (not related to you) How can Obama and this article compare reconciliation of TAX CUTS to $1 trillion in increased spending.

Good bye to the United States of America,The land of the free. Hello to the inept Socialist Republic of America, The land of the stupid majority that gave away their freedoms to be ruled by arrogant marxists.

Obama is now showing exactly how ugly he gets when his back is to the wall and things are not looking good for him. Just imagine what he’s going to look like in 2011 when he loses control of congress. He will not be able to handel not being king anymore.

Whose ‘greater good’, the Marxist Obama administration because it sure as hell isn’t for the American people?!!

If you really think the government can run health care, I have two letters for you: V.A.

Once this bill is passed, it will never be reversed. It is like trying to reverse social security, it is an entitlement.
This bill demonstrates that the only way dems can keep power is through entitlement and unions. With out those americans who have become dependent on entitlment they recieve for doing abolutly nothing but going to the voting box. The dems know that by pssing this bill, they will ensure a whole new generation of entitlement voters.

Down with Democrats who think they know what we adult individuals need to have, do, or BUY! Insulting to the voters.

Very very arrogant!!!

I am absolutely, unequivocally beyond disgusted with this man some call President. He is not MY president nor does he represent anything remotely close to my values or view!

November is coming soon enough. The generation of voters who hadn’t previously witnessed liberals at the helm, now has their practical example. They will help park the donkeys in the corner where they always belonged. Moderate Republicans can walk them over there and stand with them out of the way too.

What insanity!! Could it be that Obama has discovered being president isn’t as much fun as he thought it would be and he’s looking for an excuse not to run next term. Passing this bill will surely doom him, the Democratic Party, the economy, and impose a socialist noose around the neck of every American that will further our decline as leader of the free world.

He just isn’t that smart.
For almost a decade now I’ve heard Dumbocrats make fun of how Bush said “nuclear”, but they dont seem to mention the so called educated harvard Professor mention of “CorPPPsman”.
What an idiot…

Barrack Obama hasn’t got a clue how to be a leader. This is patently obvious and painful to watch.

@Adam: “These so called patriots are just raging Hannity Parrots.
Please Mr. President pass this bill and lets move our country forward.
I bet once the democrats have a plan to sell the midterms wont be bad at all.”
So you’re saying that the majority of Americans are “Hannity Parrots” then? That has to be what you mean. The most recent polling data shows that there’s a 10 point spread between those opposing and those favoring the health care takeover bill. In fact, the most recent CNN/Opinion Research poll had the spread at 20 points. I knew Hannity had a pretty decent audience, but this kind of overwhelming power that he’s wielding makes Rush Limbaugh look like the overnight DJ on a bluegrass station in Boston. Doesn’t it occur to you that the people elected to serve (supposedly) in Washington are there to represent their constituents? The fact that there is such a strong anti-incumbent sentiment now is testimony to the desire of the American people to have less government intrusion, not more.
The health care industry needs fixing, but not by a heavy-handed takeover without anything included to curtail the high living of med-mal lawyers.
Recall when the Republicans considered invoking the nuclear option some years back we had screaming, whining, howling in despair and gnashing of teeth from the Dems. Somehow it was wrong then but it’s right now? Come on. You can’t have it both ways.
For the record, I’d like someone to show me clearly how the federal government has the authority under the Constitution of the United States to do anything with regards to health care. The states could enact legislation as the 10th Amendment reserves for the states and the people all powers not specifically granted the federal government. This is not one specifically granted by the Constitution.

Any health care bill MUST include the policitcans who write it.
There cant be an us and them.
Name one government program that is run well….
Can we hold our breath until November?
Gawd I hope so…

Doesn’t matter what is in it when it passes. It will be struck down as unconstitutional by SCOTUS.
The constitution does not give the Govenment the power to govern health care.
Lot’s of time and money wasted by idiots.

Now it will become “uncool” to be a Dem and people will be embarrassed to be associated with this party. Americans are wising up.

Wow, I wonder if Tapper got dizzy with all that spin for his dear leader Obama.

Andy,
Reconciliation was established in 1974 and makes it easier for the Senate to pass bills to reduce the nation’s debt. The procedure has been used 22 times, and every president beginning with Jimmy Carter has signed bills that used reconciliation. Republican congresses have used it much more often than Democratic congresses.
Whereas reconciliation for comprehensive health care reform like the Senate and House bills which contain insurance reforms, couldn’t be passed by reconciliation, but things that have to do with, or score for, budget purposes can be in a reconciliation package. If they don’t score, or the score is only incidental to the aims of the policy they can be stricken per the Byrd rule.
So, the House passes the Senate bill and it goes straight to the President. No issue. Then a sidecar type bill to improve the bill– the reform package– can be passed via reconciliation totally in keeping with the rules and purpose.
Conrad points out that when Republicans used reconciliation in 2001 for the Bush tax cuts, they used it to increase the deficit. The whole purpose of reconciliation is for deficit reduction! Health care reform reduces the deficit over time.
If anyone distorted the use of reconciliation, its the GOP which is why their criticisms now are so hypocritical.

“because reconciliation rules are traditionally used for deficit reduction and health care reform will reduce the deficit” What a joke!! Using reconcilation for a social program like this will poison politics in this country like never before; it will be all out civil war.

When “We The People” Watch our government do business in the shadows of darkness the Light of Liberty will soon fade.

Now we must take our government from the Progressives!

No fear…. by passing this mess with 51 votes, they enable the voters who disapprove to undo the mess with 51 votes after the next election.
Fools gold, purchased by fools; all the while they claim the OTHER side marches in lock step and are too ideological!
Independents will not tolerate this abuse of power and will have to swing the ax once again against the majority.
When will both parties finally learn that the reason they cannot rule is because the keep abusing their power?

Using reconcilation for a social program like this
—
the bill for what the social program passed the Senate with a supermajority, and a similar bill has passed in the House. Now the House will pass the Senate bill– and voila, reconciliation wasn’t used to pass health care reform.
It will be used to pass some improvements — that indeed are keeping with the purposes of reconciliation.
Meanwhile, the GOP used reconciliation to add to the deficit, perverting the purpose of the rule. They are being hypocritical now in their criticisms.

Using “reconciliation” to start a civil war.
This will spread the deadly infection of special interest medicine that already takes your money, sucks you dry, and leaves you sicker. Flee if you can; you’ll probably die if you can’t. The US is broke, getting broker.

the bill for what the social program passed the Senate with a supermajority
—
ooops. the for what you call “the social program” passed the Senate with a supermajority.
Reconciliation isn’t being used to pass the Senate bill.

“The constitution does not give the Govenment the power to govern health care.”
I believe that Article 1, section 8 applies.

At the healthcare summit, Harry Reid acted as if Lamar Alexander was lying when he suggested the Democrats would use reconciliation. He kept saying that people had reported falsely that they would use the tactic. Are these people ALWAYS disingenuous? It’s so disheartening.

“Obama’s only mission is to rub everything he does into the face of all conservative Americans”
Oh, yeah everything always has to be about YOU, doesn’t it?

There American people SHOULD NOT STOP. PROTEST PROTEST PROTEST. DONT LIE DOWN and DONT let the democrats rewrite history and dont let them ram this bill DOWN our throats.

This is unbelievable. Barry needs to listen to the voice of people, not the voice of his ego. Go ahead and Rahm it through Chicago style, because stroking your ego is more important than our voices. This idea of ‘entitlement” is sickening. Come Nov the Democrats are done. Good luck on your own, Barry!

Health care reform will help most Americans, including many of those who are so vehemently against it. For those who worry about the cost of health care reform: The costs of not enacting health care reform are much, much higher. Its amazing to me that health care costs are through the roof, enriching insurance company middlemen and the people receiving bad health care oppose reform.

This effort by this administration will be the undoing of the Democrat Party, and guarantee this empty suit only one term in office. This bill should be deemed “unconstitutional” by the supreme court and kicked back to Congress where the new Republican majority will quickly crush it. A newer and wiser Republican congress will put forth a bill that uses free market principals to regulate costs…One can only hope.

But its making a comeback under the Democratic party that still upholds the liberal ideals our country was founded on.
—
Like running record defecits and hiring tax cheats to run the Fed? Oh wait, the nation was founded on ideals of entitlements and bailouts, Patriot Acts and running car companies!

$50 million for demonstration projects to explore alternatives to medical malpractice cases? Is that a joke? My bad, Obama is the joke…a real bad one who is inflicting a really bad dream on this country.
Wonder if I can get laid off and collect over $30 grand a year in unemployment benefits for 2 years to go along with free health care, food stamps and having my mortgage reworked so my payment is cut in half. The welfare state of mind is going to allow China to become the world power.

I was wondering why so many posters here are acting like the world is going to end if we get health care/insurance reform in this country. Why all of the manic hyperbole and violent imagery? Then I realized that Drudge is linking to this article using a picture of a nuclear bomb going off. Question answered. You people are being manipulated to ensure Republican victories in November…
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thanks for that information, Angela. i was wondering what in the heck was going on.

“Why all of the manic hyperbole and violent imagery?”
I agree. And no more shopping at Brooks Brothers!

since when does the president get to pass a bill? That is congress’s prerogative.
He should just butt out!
I’m sick of all these new taxes and government over-spending (with my money).

Now we can add health care to the long list of wonderful government run programs, such as: Medicaid (40% is fraud), Social Security (all your payments over you whole life have been spent by the politicians in DC and they gave you back IOUs – can you spell ponzi scheme), the SEC (they never did spot Madoff, did they?), The Post Office is bankrupt (Fed Ex & UPS are doing great), Fanny Mae & Freddy Mac (you can thank them for being upside down in you house), US Transportation Dept (boy, they were right on top of the Toyota thing). Border Patrol (we only have 20 million illegal aliens in the US). I could go on and on, but you get the idea.
What happened to Barry Obama’s laser like focus on jobs, jobs and more jobs?
Don’t worry, I doubt the Maoists in the House will support the Senate bill, it’s not extreme enough.
Don’t ever underestimate Barry’s ability to screw up anything and everything he touches – it will all cave in very soon. The writing is on the wall – Barry is going to be a one term wonder.

The world will not end if this passes, but certainly it will mean the end of some political careers. Btw, calling it ‘reform’ is a misnomer and in the eye of the beholder. I prefer to call ilt a ‘debacle’.
Bring it on. Pass something that the bulk of the American public is completely against. A tone deaf president and Congress can do no less.
You can also hurry up November. It cannot come soon enough for me.

I’m sick of all these new taxes and government over-spending
—
Specifically, what new taxes have you paid?
Or are you just making stuff up?

Many posters on this site seem to be worried about taxes and the deficit. Regarding the deficit, why does it matter if the country runs a deficit? How does it affect your life (it does not). Regarding taxes, how many of you earn more than $250K? If you do, then your taxes will increase. If you earn less than that (as I am sure many of you do), then your taxes will decrease under Obama. Health care reform now!

Yes, and since 80% of small businesses are LLCs (which are taxed as individuals) and almost all gross more than 250k, guess what?
If you work for a small business, you’re screwed! They’re going to get taxed.
Stupid liberals …

To the who wrote “Now, we must take our government back from the Progressives!” — I assume then that you’re in favor of a move REgressive approach? Perhaps the government should back off on ALL aspects of American life. That would really make your day, wouldn’t it? Then, when you need help after a natural disaster, you can just clean it up yourself. When your home is on fire, you can bother your neighbour for a bucket and some water. When you take a bite into a meal you bought from a supermarket and keel over with food poisoning, you can tell yourself “At least I didn’t have to pay for no FDA or food inspectors”. Do you understand that the insurance companies’ stranglehold on the health system is killing people every single day because they refuse to honor policies that were entered into in good faith? Do you understand that the bill that the Dems are proposing is designed to make health insurance MORE accessible to the people who currently have no coverage at all? Do you understand that America is the ONLY developed country in the friggin’ WORLD that doesn’t have some form of universal coverage? Americans pay the lowest rate of personal taxes of any developed nation, yet you complain as though you’ve just been mugged. For all the fools like you out there — PROGRESSIVE = PROGRESS!

I’ve got to give Obama credit … he managed to do what no other politician has done in years … he woke up and energized the majority!
People that were previously annoyed at the creeping descent into socialism have become outraged at the pace of Obama’s “change.” The next several elections will be among the darkest days for the Democrats, thanks to Barry!

Actually, Progressives believe in affecting leftist governance in a bit-by-bit manner (hence, the word progressive). Slow, steady, constant progressive steps over time.
You’re rather uninformed if you think progressivism is rooted in the more common definition of “progress” (e.g. technology, etc).
Grab a dictionary and a history book!

This is just a smokescreen, healthcare that is. They are going after the 51 vote option as an end in itself. If healthcare fails they will use it to expand the Supreme Court on a friday or Saturday night. BAM! 11 justices. Nothing you can do to roll that back either. Gay marriage, health care and everything else becomes a constitutional right. Obama is of the opinion that the 14th amendment ENDED the role of the states as lawmaking bodies. Period. How can you have “equal protection under the law” if the laws themselves are different from stat to state. THIS IS NOT A JOKE. No contitutional amendment required. pass a law and the president signs it and the court is expanded. period.

They want the 51 vote rule so they can expand the court to 11 justices. ARE YOU DEAF????

Will someone please open the doors and let the grown-ups back in?! As soon as this health care welfare for all has passed, these liberals will be talking about how “every American” has a right to quality, affordable cable TV, cell phones, ponies.
Sweet Jesus, people! Grow up and take responsibility for yourselves. The role of Government is NOT to wipe.

How ironic. It was both Obama and Biden who referred to reconciliation as the arrogance of power, when a Republican was in the White House. How times have changed.
Filibusters are now bad too. Didn’t you know, Comrade?

tone deaf Dems are jumping off the cliff like lemmings.They are a slave to the MSNBC/Huffington Post wing of the party.Wait till this November and I’ll show you guys what happens when you defy the will of the people!

The congressional budget office has said this bill is going to cost the american people, there children and their grandchildren there security
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Do you have a source? Because the real CBO says no such thing:
“CBO and JCT estimate that, on balance, the direct spending and revenue effects of enacting the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act incorporating the manager’s amendment would yield a net reduction in federal deficits of $132 billion over the 2010-2019 period (see Table 1).
It would also insure many of the uninsured, and make better coverage more affordable for the underinsured.
The truth is doing nothing will affect the health and security of our nation’s children (as well as small and medium-sized businesses) as medical inflation escalates and premiums are projected to double every seven year given the current trend lines.

Impeach

It would also insure many of the uninsured, and make better coverage more affordable for the underinsured.
Your health is your problem.

HEY TIERRA!!!!!
The dems motto is the people first at the cost of the country. And that is what our forfathers fought against enacting the rules of government. Reconcilliation is out of the boundries of intended uses in this case.
A government big enough to give you everything is big enough to take everything-Thomas Jefferson

Thomas Ranger, why not call it what it really is.
PROGRESSIVE = PROGRESS! …on the road to Socialism!!

And this could have been such an easy compromise to make: give money to the needy (pleasing the liberals) and require that it be spend in a competitive marketplace (pleasing the conservatives) under rules that guarantee reduced costs through fairness, transparency, and efficiency (pleasing the moderates, independents, pragmatists or whatever you call them.)
We will have the reform that works and works well, but first we must destroy this fiasco and again put a major party in its place.

T
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Thomas “Rump” Ranger- what a post-NOT! I suspect you are a beneficary of the redistribution of wealth-congrats!

Seems like an odd (or opportune) time for Anthem Blue Cross to propose a 39% premium increases in California. Has Anthem indicated support for obamacare?

You’re rather uninformed if you think progressivism is rooted in the more common definition of “progress” (e.g. technology, etc).
Posted by: Gulfstream | Mar 2, 2010 11:37:20 PM
Ah, but it is. Ask scientists. LOL.
I prefer looking at it from the perspective of progressive rock– just like progressive rock was about elevating rock music’s art cred, pushing technical and compositional boundaries, going beyond the usual chorus, borrowing from the best of jazz, world music and so on, progressivism is about progress, innovation and competitive edge as well as overarching themes and big concepts– pushing past the status quo, tackling the chronic issues, taking responsibility rather than kicking the can forever down the road. And true independence from corporate tyranny and wage slavery as well as opaque government.
Meanwhile, conservatism is about conserving the current power structure when it comes to wealth, the corporate nanny state, the military industrial complex, race and gender relations, science— everything. Studies have shown that conservatives are more fearful and resistant to change. They fight progress.
After the past decade, many of us are determined never to return to the dark ages. We believe in liberty, justice, science, technology, innovation and moving forward.

The liberals fully understand that in 20 years almost the entire country will have had no choice but buy their public health care, giving them control over our health, hence over our very lifes.
By making it mandatory for everyone to have health insurance, they quarntee that everytime a person changes jobs or tries to better themselves, they will have to buy public health care, as more and more bussiness will put a minium of a 90 day waiting periord on new hires from getting insurance. Once that person is on public health care and see that they are paying for it through taxes they will be less abt to purchase it a second time through their jobs.
In the end, we do exactly what Obama and the Libs want us to do, fall in line like good sheep.

“After the past decade, many of us are determined never to return to the dark ages. We believe in liberty, justice, science, technology, innovation and moving forward.”
Like I said Sister, you’ll be better off walking. And someday those windmills will be built off Cape Cod.

Well I hear a bell tolling for the Democratic Paryty in November if they cram this down the nations throat. I expect the states to sue on constitutional grounds (O’ has made lot’s of friends on the high court) and the Republicans will gut it like a fish as soon as they can figure out their head from their butt and regain power. The Dem’s are making the same mistakes they made in ’93 and it’s going to cost them power for another 10 years. Bring it on!!!

“….would yield a net reduction in federal deficits of $132 billion over the 2010-2019 period”
The old “collect 10 years of taxes for 6 years of benefits trick”….
Do you have an estimate of costs for 2014-2023? I’ve heard $2.5 trillion.
Not to get personal p-mama, but I’m thinking that you must not have children. If you did, I don’t think you would support to reckless spending of Obama and his Progressive colleagues. Do you really believe this explosive deficit spending is sustainable?
85% of Americans have health insurance. 85% of these Americans are happy with their insurance. Why do Progressives feel the need to blow up the current system and institute a massive government package? Why not an incremental approach? Have no lessons been learned from the experiment in Massachusetts?

Not to get personal p-mama, but I’m thinking that you must not have children. If you did, I don’t think you would support to reckless spending of Obama and his Progressive colleagues. Do you really believe this explosive deficit spending is sustainable?
———–
er children know Mandarin. They’ll need it.

If this comes to us, The unions own us. Pretty scary

Mr. Obama, sir:
I do not want your cr*p sandwich.
Cordially,
c’est moi

Posted by GULFSTREAM….”After the past decade, many of us are determined never to return to the dark ages. We believe in liberty, justice, science, technology, innovation and moving forward.”
But don’t confuse me with math!
This country is BROKE!!
Pass health care, carbon taxes, raise taxes, lower taxes, do what ever your pointy little heads choose to do the country will still be BROKE!!
The kind of reform required will come with blood in the streets, and don’t tell me that it can’t happen here.

frank – what else is Bush responsible for? Seems to me that its both sides fault. The Democrats were the majority party in the senate when bush said TARP was needed. The House is where all spending bills are allocated from. And it was in 2010 when the money was given out. So you are right…. it was just Bush’s fault!
i love it when Democrats try to sound educated by using scary language like neo-conservative…. how about neo-socialists, neo-liberals, or…. since you said “old school” neo-geo… at least it had fun games that people could play while reaching “across the aisle”.

progressive mama,
You sound like a stereotypical “conditioned” media- and college-brainwashed shill who took a few too many of Prof Komradsky’s Philosophy courses. Try acknowledging the real world.
As it is, a pressing “chronic issue” that is trumping all others, is the economic mess with its heavy job losses.
But your “progressive” narcissist-in-chief is not doing a damn thing to repair our once-thriving economy. Instead he and the rest of the authoritarian absolutist nutjobs are FIXATED on this healthcare debacle that nobody in their right minds wants, in spite of the Democrats’ superficial attempts to repackage it.
Now, please try not to be so tone-deaf.

WHY ARE THERE MORE HORSE’S BEHINDS THAN HORSES IN THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY????

Sorry Penny Saved, I meant to address that to Thomas Ranger. Sorry =/

Liberal progressives who live to tell others how to live, are very naive people. They do not know that you can pass as many laws as you want, and most folks are still going to do what they want to do. In Europe, there is a huge under the table economy, to avoid the high taxes. Every system gets gamed, and libs dont get that. They think with enough orders and mandates, society will somehow straighten and be “fair”.

WAKE UP and smell the coffee.
____________
There’s gonna be a tax on that too.

I have one insurmountable problem I have with Obamacare: It’s not American. American’s can rely on God, themselves and their neighbors, and don’t need the government any more involved than it is in our daily lives. For people who have come onto hard times, I’d say look to the kindness of your family, local community, or state, but not to the federal government. They have so much power over all of us already, power to do good or evil. No body made up of corruptable men should have so much power over their equals. Future generations will regret it.

“Every system gets gamed, and libs dont get that. They think with enough orders and mandates, society will somehow straighten and be “fair”.”
I’ve come to the conclusion there are two groups of liberals: (1.) The “believers” who believe that “fairness” and “equality of outcome” are worthy, necessary, and obtainable pursuits and (2.) The Progressive political class who takes advantage of the “belivers”. I feel somewhat sorry for the former (they really don’t know any better) and loathe the latter (they are hypocritical, dishonest, self-serving leeches with few life accomplishments).

We’re screwed.

Hey Dems have you not learned from history that the more entitlements you have, the more coruption?
It’s like gun laws that take guns from law abiding citizens…the only ones left with the guns are the criminals. And they are not worried about a fine.

It’s like gun laws that take guns from law abiding citizens…the only ones left with the guns are the criminals. And they are not worried about a fine.
Obviously, you don’t see the success gun control has had in DC.

This is not the “nuclear option,” despite Drudge’s lying headline.
Budget reconciliation is the same process used to pass Bush’s tax cuts for rich people that bankrupted this country. Except in this case, it’s being used to benefit the real people in this country.

But your “progressive” narcissist-in-chief is not doing a damn thing to repair our once-thriving economy. Instead he and the rest of the authoritarian absolutist nutjobs are FIXATED on this healthcare debacle that nobody in their right minds wants, in spite of the Democrats’ superficial attempts to repackage it.
Now, please try not to be so tone-deaf.
Posted by: DazzRat | Mar 3, 2010
12:05:32 AM
Its funny that you say to acknowledge the real world and then you bury your head deep in the sand. Of course, people want health care reform– dems are in the majority and most of them ran on health care reform. Its part of the platform. In fact, several presidents have wanted health care reform as well– President Obama isn’t the first. The problem with those who have been brainwashed by the cult of the idiot savante that the Right has been obsessed with since Reagan is that they arrogantly think they speak for Americans or “real” Americans or “the people” when they’re parroting exactly what the Koch brothers and front groups for Big Oil and the insurance and health sector lobbyists want them to. LOL. You’ll vote in Republicans who will be triple deficits and grow government while paying all of you lip service– and meanwhile, the middle class will shrink, poverty will increase, real wages and income will decline, medical inflation will escalate, the number of uninsureds will rise, the gap between the wealthy and the poor will increase, bubbles will continue to bubble then burst, science and innovation will be put on the back burner, wars will be begun on borrowed money, jobs will go overseas…. and then what? We’ve all seen the movie before. I’m not the one falling for it, and yet you call me the nutjob? LOL, LOL, LOL.
Personally, while President Obama is a progressive, he’s more of a pragmatist willing to work with a party I think totally disgraced itself the past decade and possessses no credibility at this point.
I’m a small business owner. Something really has to be done about health care. I also know people with pre-existing conditions who end up shackled to their jobs. To be competitive we need to make health care more affordable, accessible and portable. Personally, I’d prefer single payer or some other innovation that provides affordable and portable cradle to grave care and gets the burden off business’s back.
p.s. anti-elitist snobbery is elitism, see TNR’s article on the grotesque elitism of Sarah Palin

“How do you feel about the 9 lawyers with pro bono experience in defending terrorists housed in Gitmo that Holder (and by extension, Obama) brought into the DOJ?
Just when you think this administration cannot sink any lower….they always come through.”
As I have stated before – it is my prayer that when sanity comes back to the WH, and a new chief is installed, Obama and his administration will be tried and convicted for treason on several counts.

Obama just wants a notch on his belt. He really doesn’t care about the “folks” he likes to reference in his endless speeches.

“But your “progressive” narcissist-in-chief is not doing a damn thing to repair our once-thriving economy.”
Obama tried to fix the disaster he inherited from Cheney/Bush, but the traitor Republicans are more interested in seeing him fail that passing a stimulus package big enough to make a difference.
Please pull your head out of your and learn to think for yourself. Turn off Fox “News”!

“My bad. I’ll go back to my charcoal and cave wall for which us knuckle-draggers are known.”
Charcol creates carbon. Strike 2…

progressive moma,
they are not shackled to their jobs. They can carry there policy through cobra until their new insurance from their new job kicks in. Pre-existing is for those who were not insured and then became sick.

“$50 million for state grants for demonstration projects to explore alternatives to medical malpractice cases”
Jake, you should point out these ‘grants’ are only for states that give up any caps on attorney fees or noneconomic damages. This is a a gift of millions of dollars to the trial attorneys (the largest campaign donors) at the expense of the rest of us.
Why are we the only country with a contingency-based legal system, using non-health-educated jurors to decide complex medical cases? Many countries have had years of success with dedicated health courts. With dedicated health courts, more money goes to wronged patients, much faster, at much lower expense than our current system.

Your false assumption is that progressives don’t have problems with those very things.
But I’m sure it would be worse under Republican leadership. It always is.
As Weiner put it, I’ve never met a Republican politician who wasn’t a wholly owned subsidiary of the insurance and health sector lobby.
I’d add oil.
—
Awesome. At least oil runs my car.

“Budget reconciliation is the same process used to pass Bush’s tax cuts for rich people that bankrupted this country.”
EdC -
Could you please explain the following to me?
a.) Weren’t Bush’s tax cuts distributed across ALL taxpayers (not just the “rich”)?
b.) Federal tax revenues INCREASED after the tax cuts were instituted. Would this not imply that the tax cuts actually “paid for themselves” (and more)?
c.) Is it possible that maybe – stay with me here – the country is now “bankrupt” is due to runaway federal government SPENDING (especially noticeable since the Democrats tookover Congress in Jan. 2007)?
Your comments make for convenient talking points, but they are inaccurate.

they are not shackled to their jobs. They can carry there policy through cobra until their new insurance from their new job kicks in. Pre-existing is for those who were not insured and then became sick.
Posted by: Jak466 | Mar 3, 2010 12:28:17 AM
And if they have a pre-existing condition and an entrepreneurial spirit– or the desire to be self-employed?
Wake up.

PLEASE, please Obama, ram that healthcare through so that all your democratic buddies will sure be voted out of office in Nov. and when we finally get someone to beat you in the 2012 Presidential race, we will reverse this healthcare you rammed down our throats with the help of Pelosi and Reid. We, independents are moving as fast as we can away from the democrats and you all will be defeated at the polls soon and in the courts as we will mount massive Constitutional challenges to your highly socialist “Progressive” agenda!!!!

a.) Weren’t Bush’s tax cuts distributed across ALL taxpayers (not just the “rich”)?
- They primarily benefited the wealthy. Any crumbs for the rest of us were merely window-dressing.
b.) Federal tax revenues INCREASED after the tax cuts were instituted. Would this not imply that the tax cuts actually “paid for themselves” (and more)?
- Bush inherited a federal surplus from Clinton, which he promptly squandered.
c.) Is it possible that maybe – stay with me here – the country is now “bankrupt” is due to runaway federal government SPENDING (especially noticeable since the Democrats tookover Congress in Jan. 2007)?
- Bush ran up this mess with his tax cuts for rich people and vanity war in Iraq.
These points may be inconvenient for Republicans and their brainless enablers, but they are true. The only false talking points are over on the propaganda outlet Fox “News.”

Wonderful Pelosi, Reid and Obama. How about the millions who have lost jobs since you people took over? You are running our great country into the ground and the folks are well aware it is you who are doing it!!!

- They primarily benefited the wealthy. Any crumbs for the rest of us were merely window-dressing.”
Forward Bailout Brigade Barry!

“This is a bad precedent but the Democrats are desperate and desperate fools do desperate things.”
Republicans have used budget reconciliation more often than Democrats have. They set that precedent. If you have an issue with precedents set by Republicans — and in service to their corporate masters instead of the people — you should go wring your hands over that.

“Charcol creates carbon. Strike 2…”
Arrrgh! :^)

…In 2003, the Bush administration repeatedly lied about the cost of the drug benefit to get it passed, and Bush himself heavily pressured reluctant conservatives to vote for the program.”
Luckily the secret meeting Obama had with Big Pharma smoothed things out…

“These points may be inconvenient for Republicans and their brainless enablers, but they are true. The only false talking points are over on the propaganda outlet Fox “News.”

Even the headline to this blog entry seems to try and distance the president from the actual act of screwing America with a bill the American people have over, and over, and over again have shouted “NO” to. This is tyranny! Mr. obama, you will always be rightfully placed on the wrong side of history if you force this on us…just letting you know before you make the mistake – thank me later.

TIME TO IMPEECH THE COMMUNIST JOKER….

progressive,
then they should have given up some things like the fancy phone or sweet car or cable tv and BOUHGT INSURANCE.
It is not owed to anyone. You bargain for it in lui of wages. And if you are a business person you woulod know that or at least anticipated you would have to supply your own insurance. I shoulddn’t have ot give up wages to get my insurance then turn around and buy your dumbass insurance plan too.
Posted by: Jak466 | Mar 3, 2010 12:37:01 AM
—
You misunderstand. It has nothing to do with fancy phones. Try getting stage 2 melanoma, and a year later get in a car accident, that isn’t your fault but requires a lot of rehab and then check out whether you can ever leave the large group market and move to the individual and small group market under the status quo system. OR start up a business and hire someone with a pre-existing condition and find out what it does do your outlays for employee benefits.
Your self-centered talking points MISS the point.
You’d rather stay a wage and benefit slave than fight for liberty with a free independent entrepreuneurial spirit.
Sheesh, and you think you’re a “real” American?
(kidding on the latter… sorta.. you probably do, but bygones.)
lol.

Get Real!!!!
Posted by: Jak466 | Mar 3, 2010 12:40:24 AM
I suggest you do some research and be glad — even grateful– you’re kids won’t have to worry about because we’re passing health insurance reform.

“OR start up a business and hire someone with a pre-existing condition and find out what it does do your outlays for employee benefits.”
Lack of charity…

Reply to EdC:
“Bush inherited a federal surplus from Clinton, which he promptly squandered.”
He also inherited a recession from clinton.
And…
Yes i haven’t heard what fox news said… why don’t you inform me! as you seem to know exactly what they say everyday.

progressive,
I’ll take your last comment as I win

I’ll take your last comment as I win
Posted by: Jak466 | Mar 3, 2010 12:46:51 AM
That doesn’t surprise me. LOL. Its well known around here that I don’t think the average conservative is all that bright.

“It is not owed to anyone. You bargain for it in lui of wages.”
You don’t bargain for anything if Republicans get their way. Workers don’t bargain under the GOP “vision” for America. They work and, if they get sick, they die.

I hope the Republicans call his bluff. Obama is an amateur playing in the big leagues and like mighty Casey at the bat, he will strike out. While there will be no rejoicing in Mudville, the rest of the country will be relieved.

“Reconciliation is supposed to be used for budget bills, not anything and everything.”
Health care reform will reduce the federal deficit — that’s the whole point. What’s the matter with you — have you been hiding under a rock or watching Fox “News”?

Reply to EdC:
“Bush inherited a federal surplus from Clinton, which he promptly squandered.”
He also inherited a recession from clinton.
And…
Yes i haven’t heard what fox news said… why don’t you inform me! as you seem to know exactly what they say everyday.

“Health care reform will reduce the federal deficit — that’s the whole point.”
I guess your “non-Fox News” sources are haven’t let you in on the little secret that 10 years of taxes will be used to pay for 6 years of benefits…and the the steady-state cost of ObamaCare will be FAR from deficit neutral…

These stupid college liberals shure can wreck a country cant they? Thats what ignorance and inexperience will get you, a bunch of expensive mistakes. Thanks for ruining a great country fascist libs.

progressivem EdC,
I’m tired and have to save lives in the morning so I am going to bed. Yes, save lives.
Maybe you too need to take a college critical thinking class. It would really help with reading an article and applying logic.
I forgot a rule my father once told me. Only and idiot will argue with a moron so to you I say goodnight.
Becareful what you wish for…you just may get it. And getting windmilled is no good.

Maybe when it’s passed Obama can finally start paying attention to the real problem: all the millions that are out of work.

Ya baby Rahm it through! And when China and Japan quit buying are debt then what? Crushing taxes and fees? When will America wake up? Why do people think they are entitled to Heathcare? Anyone can get heathcare they just have to pay for it! Is Food the next freebee? or cars? housing? college?…how about the governement give us everthing for free and everyone is employees making $100,000 a year?

Bush inherited a surplus from Clinton!You just fail to say that Clintons lack of covert spending helped 9-11.That caused us lots of money.And then Fat man Al
[I need to make more money on global warming]Gore,s
internet stocks went from 5,300 to 1,000 in the internet.Alot of non tax dollars were inherited by Bush.And then for years after that people were not making money on stocks and also claiming write offs from the previous years losses.

Umm, that’s what we call a hypocrite.
Posted by: RichardTM | Mar 3, 2010 12:58:35 AM
I read Bartlett every day at the Capital Gains and Games blog– and I sometimes agree with him and sometimes don’t. What I appreciate about him is that he isn’t an idealogue. In fact, he’s an independent like I am– and he believes on looking at the present circumstances. Check out his blog post called Supply side economics RIP at CGG.
As a friendly FYI, its hard to be all that put out when a hyperpartisan jumps up and down to call you a hypocrite. So I forgive ya. i’m sure you just got all carried away in the moment.
lol.

Sometimes I think if China took this country over it would actually be an improvement. Really, really sad…

@ Texasbelle …God has given this country over. We kicked Him out and He was a gentleman and left. Now we see the results !

Posted by: RichardTM | Mar 3, 2010 12:58:35 AM
Oh, I’m sorry. I just realized that I did diss conservatives and I meant to diss “conservatives” and Republicans.
Now, I get why you were calling me a hypocrite.
I don’t think Republicans are conservatives. And I don’t think American libertarians of the laissez faire free market ilk are libertarians in the more philosophical sense. And I do mock that sort of pop sensibility — the sound bites that don’t match the self-identified labels. And/or the attempts to box up and define the opposition.
My “party” is anti-GOP (though there are couple of more independent-minded Republicans I like and admire.)
And as a small business owner, I would like us to tackle health care reform!

This thing is DEAD!!
Give it an up or down vote. It will never pass both House and Senate.
Maybe one or the other but never both.

This is not a budget bill. This is an all encompassing, life changing bill that the majority of us Americans do NOT support. There will be major housecleaning in Congress and of course the White House if this passes. Congress is supposed to represent the PEOPLE ! Didn’t Scott Brown wake these guys/gals up??!!

..Read: Where the debate stands on Obama Care….
Not a bad blog post but you still get reconciliation wrong. Its a complaint health care wonks and the wonkier journalists have with the less precise, more sensationalist MSM.
Its up to you, of course, how you want to be perceived.

Mr. President – “we the people” have said no, and no and no and no and no – what is it you do not understand about NO!
Perhaps the college of hard knocks prepares one for the Presidency a lot better than Harvard.

The Impeachment proceedings can’t start soon enough! Then we’ll put Pelousy up on charges of bribery and racketeering. Oh .. and that’s AFTER the Supreme Court strikes down this “Health”"Care” Bill unConstitutional because you CAN’T force every American to purchase insurance!

I see govt run health care
Posted by: For the Record
I am still waiting for an explanation of what the ‘take over’ by the ‘government run heath care’ actually is…… who, what is being ‘taken over’ ?

Obama has wasted a year on photo ops and healthcare so he will stop at nothing to ram this 2700 page bill down our throats.
According to the CBO Obamacare will raise insurance premiums for the average American, which is me!
Obama is a hazard even to democrats, maybe they will find a way to kick him out of office (disqualification?).

You are a progressive liberal.
Posted by: RichardTM | Mar 3, 2010 1:17:26 AM
In regards to hyperpartisan, aren’t you? If not, my apologies. That’s how it came across.
Yes, the country was founded on liberal ideals and I fully support those. And I do believe in progress. I also have libertarian leanings in the Chomsky-esque sense on various issues. My husband is more libertarian than I am. We both own businesses. I think it comes with the territory.
But on health care, yes, I’m liberal– I do think it falls under public health and safety, or should, and that government has an important role to play in providing for a national defense, infrastructure, disaster relief, and so on.
But, anyway, just an fyi– there is a difference between being a moderate and an independent. MOderate implies in-between. Independent implies not beholden to a given platform or party– independent, ya know? My goal is a four party system that breaks up the current concentrations of power.

The people have spoke and they clearly do not want this government controlled health care system. Congress people, you best start listening to us!

Remember this stament made at the healthcare summit:
“you will not believe this, and I know you won’t, but it’s true — her sister died. This poor woman had no denture. She wore her dead sister’s teeth, which of course were uncomfortable and did not fit.”
I didnt know Dental was cvered under this health care package!

Health insurance is a personal responsibility, it is not the responsibility of the employer or the government to furnish it. Give the people the amount that the employer pays for their health insurance in their pay and let them buy their own. That covers portability as it belongs to the indvidual, not the company plan. Allow the individual to deduct the amount they pay for their health insurance as a tax credit when they file their tax return. Create a pool for people with pre-existing conditions that will give them lower “pool” rates, however, there should be a waiting period before the insurance takes effect in order to preclude someone waiting until they need insurance before buying it. That’s like buying property insurance when you house catches on fire. It’s unconstitutional to force anyone to purchase a given product or service! People who truly need some sort of assistance should be eligible for a subsidy from the government to help pay for their insurance. They MUST provide proof that assistance is needed and should not be allowed to have cell phones or other “things” that are not absolute necessities, such as cable/satellite TV service.

US Unfunded Liabilities:
Social Security: $14,200,000,000,000
Prescription Drug: $18,800,000,000,000
Medicare/Medicaid: $74,700,000,000,000
Total: $107,700,000,000,000
Source: Federal Reserve
(Numbers Rounded to nearest billion)

how come no one brings up impeachment?someone somewhere has to have the jewels to bring it up. this administration is going to far and has no regard for our constitution,they think they can get away with anything.i am well aware of everything that is going on and know all about the elites running the show and how they operate.i know that if they are removed the elites will still be in power,but it will send a clear picture of our resolve as people of this republic. we need to get rid of the big three!and if those that replace them continue the same path we do the same to them until we get someone on our side that wont let there strings be pulled.

I’d rather continue to get financially clobbered and HAVE insurance than NOT. Which is the case right now due to prior conditions of health.

But, anyway, just an fyi– there is a difference between being a moderate and an independent. MOderate implies in-between. Independent implies not beholden to a given platform or party– independent, ya know? My goal is a four party system that breaks up the current concentrations of power.
Agree, somewhat, but I believe the term “independent” is most used by people who do not follow politics. Also, you might notice that McCain does vote independently on a lot of issues: campaign finance and immigration to name 2.
And no, I’m not hyperpartisan. You will notice no anti-Obama comments in my posts. I am a true Libertarian. Which means, to me, individual responsibility and accountability. There are consequences to our actions or inactions. If we choose not to study in school, it is harder to succeed in life. If we choose to go out and party and not focus on our personal well being, there too are consequences. We should not punish 95% of Americans for the benefit of 5%.
Finally, healthcare should be a government responsibility, just not a federal one.

Farewell Democracy. We will miss you.

So what is Bartlett’s opinion about healthcare? Please enlighten me.
Finally, the tax cuts did not increase our debt, the wars did. I now also see Bartlett’s last book and why you are now a fan of his.
Posted by: RichardTM | Mar 3, 2010 1:17:26 AM
You should read his most recent book. It might be enlightening. LOL.
As for health care reform, he writes more about other things but if I recall correctly supported a VAT to pay for it– which I get. I sometimes think we should sin-tax the heck out of pop and junk food, and legalize pot and sin-tax that too.
” A laboratory experiment conducted in the University at Buffalo’s Division of Behavioral Medicine showed that lowering the price of healthy foods did not result in “shoppers” improving the nutritional content of the foods they purchased.
While study participants did select more of the healthier options when they were less expensive, the shoppers used the money they saved on less-expensive healthier foods to buy more of the less-healthy options, results showed.
But when the researchers increased the price of foods such as hot dogs, potato chips and Ritz Bits Peanut Butter Sandwich Crackers by adding a 12.5 percent to 25 percent tax, the shoppers reduced purchases of these foods and spent a larger portion of their budget on healthier choices like bananas, tuna and chicken noodle soup. ” (University of Buffalo News Center)

I see govt run health care
Posted by: For the Record
I am still waiting for an explanation of what the ‘take over’ by the ‘government run heath care’ actually is…… who, what is being ‘taken over’ ?
Posted by: PO’d | Mar 3, 2010 1:21:43 AM
There will no doubt be a fine line between govt regulated and govt run. From the article, here’s an example of what can be a slippery slope. Regulation can be s good thing, but I suspect it could go horribly wrong in the hands of the govt. This is the type of govt run hc I am talking about. I know the House bill had over 100 new agancies. What about the Senate bill?
He will note that the “fixed” bill will include the proposal for a new “Health Insurance Rate Authority” to set guidelines for reasonable rate increases. If proposed premium increases are not justifiable per those Health Insurance Rate Authority guidelines, the Health and Human Services Secretary or state regulators could block them.

The voters will excersize the ultimate nuclear option on the first Tueday in November.

Finally, healthcare should be a government responsibility, just not a federal one.
Posted by: RichardTM | Mar 3, 2010 1:38:11 AM
Here’s my question on that. I like the idea of larger risk pools. As a small business owner, I’m disadvantaged by how the current market is set up. If it were a state responsibility versus a federal government responsibility, I don’t see how creating an exchange that would reach beyond state lines for additional competition would work.
Also, during times of recession, the inability to deficit spend comes into play, doesn’t it?

Thank God I had the freedom to invest my healthcare premiums in my wife’s education so she could become a nurse!

ObamaCare. Done deal. Next. Gas prices. $7.00 to $12.00 per gallon in very near future. Why? To be used as a “Cash Cow” to finance his Progressive, Liberal, Marxist agenda and bring America down to her knees and than rebuild her into what he thinks it must be. Next. Amerika, The Banana Republic. “Hey Mister! Would you like to screw my sister?” All this while He and the Mrs. eat $150.00 lb. steak and $200.00 Lobster and fly around in a $300+ million jet on the taxpayers dole. Hey, life is good if you know how to orginize a community. Next. Chapter 13.

The Democrats have controlled the House and Senate for the last four years. They have controlled the Executive branch for the last 14 months. They have no one to blame for the problems in this country, but themselves. If they pass this bill against the will of the American people they deserve what happens to them in November. The people are mad, and for good reason.

I dont understand what all the uproar is about. The majority of Americans are hard working people not lazy crack addicts. Unless you are currently uninsured arent you already paying for health insurance? So in a sense arent you already forced to pay for health insurance now?
Americans have spoken. We spoke in the presidential election. Obama won the popular vote and we want universal health care/health care reform!!
Im not an Obama fan but can someone please explain to me how he is a socialist and what makes him so different from Bush? If he is a socialist then why isnt Bush a socialist? Is it because Obama would rather spend trillions of dollars on Americans? The nerve!
How is it considered socialist to hold insurance/credit card companies accountable for immoral business practices?
When half of the bankruptcies in this country are due to health care costs isnt it time to either A. drive skyrocketing health care cost down by actually creating a free market competition or B. adjust wages to cost of living increases?
Since the business community will have neither this is what we get>>Someone can no longer afford their home due to expensive health care!
This recession is due by 95% of Americans being underpaid, less jobs, unemployment, increase in health care cost, high taxes all creating a record number of home foreclosures. This is all due to immoral greedy corporate executive/businesses monopolizing the market. CEOs salaries have risen 3 times as much over the last decade while regular Americans are actually getting paid less due to cost of living increases. The problem is not only the govt the problem is corporations! They should not be allowed to run a muck. They should not be funding politicians.
The reason companies outsource and dont want to hire Americans is because of the rising health care cost! The problem is this corporate culture that will be the down fall of America economy. People will no longer be able to create a viable economy if we dont have wage increases and price reductions.
Blame greedy corporations, NAFTA Clinton Reagan and Bush for outsourcing our jobs. Thats where all the jobs went.
Furthermore, any republican or democrat or individual for that matter that is against Obama universal health plan/reform is directly against the popular vote and thus democracy.
Bottom line is we need to limit the power of these corporations. These corps. need to get out of the democratic process because they are anything but.

progressive mama wrote:
Just for you, I’ll end with LOL.
LOL!!!

Socialist dictator!

Socialist dictator!
Posted by: AmericanInGermany | Mar 3, 2010 2:29:32 AM
___________________________________
The delusional paranoia of the Republican right wing – just as described in the Anti-Defamation League report. Creepy.

but… Now i love you.
—
Why am I reminded of the Van Jones-Glen Beck exchange?
(Again, just for you)… LOL!!!

Government of the people by the people, what a joke today. When will the people wakeup..thinking its all going to change in 2012. When we do decide to stand up it will be too late, if not already.

realnews: I can choose not to have an auto; hence I am not required to have auto insurance. I guess I’ll have to choose to die in order to avoid purchasing a government mandated health insurance plan.
There is a difference, no?

As Dennis Prager said recently, “The bigger the government, the smaller the citizen.” The Constitution was designed to limit government, not expand it. You progressives don’t understand that your individual freedoms and personal choice will be limited the more power and money (taxes) we give the government. Who’s to say that these politicians promising you the moon will follow through? Have you ever seen one do so? They won’t because many of them are corrupt. Why should they care when they don’t have to worry about healthcare for themselves? They have lifetime health coverage for the best medical treatment. They also have lifetime pensions even though they only serve one term. People who believe in universal health care coverage do so because they are under the illusion that somehow social justice will take place. It’s a myth because universal healthcare benefits are limited to a few as medicine is rationed. Look at the models out there in the real world. Why have Canadians come here for health care for so many years? Doctors’ hands are tied as to the kind of care they can give. Doctors are paid less, so fewer enter the field, consequently a shortage of doctors, which leads to longer lines, less qualified people to care for patients. Can’t you progressives see how people will suffer instead of benefit? Go look at countries who have universal healthcare before you blindly take the word of a politician here at home.

pull the nuke option, mr. obama?
DO IT YOU COWARD. you are history and you know it. I DARE you to do it. We’ll shred you and your precious progressive movement and shove you and all your traitor allies against the wall so hard you will think you were in 1950′s BERLIN.
you are NOT my president any more. YOU, sir, ARE FIRED.

You do have the option of not having health insurance. Health insurance as it is now is a luxury. Just like having a car is. Not everybody can afford it.
People who currently dont have health insurance are dying.
The argument was made its unconstitutional to force someone to pay for something they dont want. Then it ought to be illegal to force someone to pay for auto insurance. No matter if its a state law or not.

Why don’t news people like Mr. TAPPER
probe and ask this President the courageous things – like why continually present legislation that the majority of us don’t want.
Mr Tapper is it any wonder why your news group at ABC are letting go so many of those within your ranks? You are completely OUT OF TOUCH with millions of Americans – much like this President – who is sadly out of touch with us also…

Obama is a dolt, warning people that they will be “at the mercy of the insurance industry.” Instead he wants us all (uh, I mean, us peebs since Congress and the President will be exempt) to be at the mercy of government.
All hail Commissar Obama.

I hope you people are smart enough to realize that NO ONE is forced to buy auto insurance to protect themselves. You are required to buy car insurance to protect the person you hit while not paying attention on the highway. Car insurance and health insurance aren’t close to being the same thing. If you want to require people with V.D. to get health insurance to cover folks they transmit the disease to, then you can make an analogy.
Come on libs, think. I know you can do it!

I hope you people are smart enough to realize that NO ONE is forced to buy auto insurance to protect themselves. You are required to buy car insurance to protect the person you hit while not paying attention on the highway.
_____________________________________
You would be required to buy health insurance to protect the people who you would injure when they have to pay for your medical costs when you get sick, injured and you are uninsured. Everybody pays, everybody is covered.

The nuclear option is now the reconciliation option. Same thing, different name, was to be used for ONLY budgeting as the constitution requires congress to produce a yearly budget. It was not meant for passing major legislation, but hey, they’re democrats and can do what they want. Laws and procedures do not matter when liberal democrats want to do something. Want to experience socialized healthcare, go to England. I lived there for 10 years. I want to part of that for America.

Here’s the rub, with our fearless liar-er leader; Remembering that his goal is for the populace of the US to be ever increasingly dependent upon the gubmint for cheese, healthcare, etc, I fear that using the…
“Health Insurance Rate Authority” to set guidelines for reasonable rate increases. If proposed premium increases are not justifiable per those Health Insurance Rate Authority guidelines, the Health and Human Services Secretary or state regulators could block them.”…
will simply allow the gubmint to force the healthcare compnies to close. They will set prices so low that the health insurance companies will not be able to compete with the pricing the gubmint (which has no need to make a profit to stay in business as they can and will simply raise the taxes on citizens/corporations/gas/dogs/etc). Being able to endlessly undercut your competition’s pricing virtually guarantees your victory over them. We, as citizens will lose out on the greatest healthcare system in the world (albeit it imperfect) once it goes away.
That is his real strategy; making us all dependent upon the bigger and bigger gubmint, and keeping us equally, poorly covered. It seems that the goal is that nobody does better than anyone else anymore. If they do, punish them through taxes. If they can afford quality healthcare, take it away from them…
Equality at the lowest common denominator. A shame; this country had such great potential.
Nobama was right when he said that the country needed change, he was just off by a few years. 2010 sounds like a good year to start.
Wow,
RN

To force us to purchase healthcare under threat from the IRS is a violation of our 1st amendment rights. Recently the Supreme Court ruled that where you put your money is considered freedom of speech.

Im not forced to buy auto insurance but I am REQUIRED to buy car insurance? Does that even make sense to you?
I dont know where you people are from but in Illinois you are FORCED into buy auto insurance because without you can be ticketed. There was no peoples vote on this issue.
Tierra we are not the minority. We are the silent majority. We speak for the voice less. The voices that the meida drowns out and chooses to ignore due to corp interest.

Obamacare is, and continues to be, a gargantuan effort to control every aspect of our lives. Pelosi now uses the term “simple majority” to describe how she and the rest of her cohorts will inflict Reconciliation. Change of term but no change of plans. The American people have spoken LOUD AND CLEAR about NO OBAMACARE. In other words, the SIMPLE MAJORITY does not want any part of their healthcare bills.

This president is a clear and present danger to this country.
Posted by: Leeza | Mar 3, 2010 3:35:16 AM
___________________________________
Nonsense. This is exactly the delusional paranoia documented in the recent Anti-Defamation League report.
People with a mindset like yours are a danger to the country. Become worthwhile.

“you are NOT my president any more. YOU, sir, ARE FIRED.”
That’s not how it works, the bigger part of the population voted for him, he is the leader. If you distance your self form that consider your self no longer an American.

Many, many people would have liked to get rid of George Bush and the Republicans, but that is not the way it works – even though by the end he had the support of less that 20% of Americans, Bush remained President. And Cheney had only 11% approval.
Too bad the Republican right has no idea how to behave in a decent, civilized fashion in a democracy – they think they have the divine right to rule others.

Everybody will pay for insurance. >Everybody will be covered. If you have a body that can get sick, damaged, injured or diseased you will be required to get coverage.<
Not necessarily, Tierra. Not necessarily. As I said, there is still the Byrd Rule. Then, there is always the Supreme Court.

Tierra wrote: “Too bad the Republican right has no idea how to behave in a decent, civilized fashion in a democracy – they think they have the divine right to rule others.”
I agree Tierra! They dont want to pay for health insurance for others even though they would benefit when their time comes BUT have no problem with Wall Street bailouts and corporate welfare. Screw these greedy rich snobs. Let them go uninsured, bankrupt and fail like the average American does when the economy sinks.
ABC needs to start broadcasting REAL NEWS! Stop being complicit to corp take over. Corporations are ruining this country for profit motive. Love people over money. We are worth more!
Peace Im out for now!

btw, quality health insurance is a privilege in this country. It ought not to be. That is the bigger issue.

>During the administration of President George W. Bush, Congress used reconciliation to enact three major tax cuts, each of which was determined by the Congressional Budget Office to substantially worsen the fiscal position of the United States.<
Indeed he did. And, recall if you will, the American people were not overwhelmingly against his actions, as they are with this president's.
Hey, I didn't vote for Bush, nor did I care for him as a president. If you think holding up what Bush did justifies what this communist is trying to shove down America's throat, you are wrong. Sadly, pathetically wrong.

Overwhelmingly . …

Tierra, did you miss the little tidbit factoid that Obama bragged about? The “pay-go” budget rule? Oh, that’s right, he forgot to mention that wrapped up in that was a renewal of most of the Bush tax cuts.
Posted by: Leeza | Mar 3, 2010 4:20:59 AM
_____________________________________
Almost every economic advisor does not recommend putting additional taxes in place so soon after a MAJOR economic collapse – almost into a depression.
Seems to me the President is doing almost exactly what he promised regarding taxes during the election – increasing taxes on those earning over $250,000. Leaving the others as is.

The way I see it is that the people who have insurance are not the problem. If they want to help the un-insured so be it. That would be me. But when they write laws that if we don’t do this or that we will be fined or go to jail they overstep. They are there to serve the voting public. They have no right to run over us like we were nothing. All of you who are crying for this may find you actually still can’t afford this insurance but the difference now will be you can go to jail. Be ordered to pay these big premiums. We know they can’t afford medicade for all. You better wake up. They decide what you pay for the coverage they think you need. That is wrong in my book and a free society. They overstep. They should never have shut out the republicans. They had the majority and were drunk with power. That’s not how this works. They do not own you or me. Scrap this unholy bill and start over the right way or were will vote them all out and have legit representation in office. I don’t vote for my senator to tell me what to do. I vote for the person who will do what I want. They all lie.

POTUS-Go for it. After all, that is what elections are for!

I hope everyone understands the true reason for using reconciliation when it comes to Tax & Control Health Care. With only needing 51 votes you can give cover to 8 democrats who are in states that eill face tough reelection campaigns in 2010 and 2012.
Blanche Lincoln, Byron Dorgan, Russ
Feingold, would all be free to vote against the health care bill so they can save there jobs in 2010. we cold also see Bill Nelson Fl , Ben Nelson Ne and Mary Landrieu La look for some cover for the 2012 election by voting no.
The democrats would get the best of both worlds they can help keep there most vulnerable senate seats and still get there take over of jealth care.
The real question will the media report this side of the story.

I just wish Democrats would stop trying to ram this down our throats.
__________________________________
What’s with the oral fixation?
And since when did passing legislation suddenly get referred to as throat ramming?

Make me pay for people’s abortions? I am not ever paying for another person’s abortion. That is wrong and a disgraceful thing. Murder. The women who get these abortions are poor and the powers that be will help you kill your baby so they don’t have another mouth to help feed.
____________________________________
Surely you have researched this and know nothing in either bill changes the status quo regarding the funding of abortions.

You deluded Lefties here who believe the Bush tax cuts somehow worsened the economy seem to forget that he presided over the longest period of uninterrupted fiscal growth in this Nations history at some 25 quarters or 100 months.
______________________________________
Bush’s ‘fiscal growth’ was based on a falsely hyped up real estate market and an entire financial industry built on phony packaging of bad loans – AND IT ALL CAME TUMBLING DOWN.
And he doubled the national debt before the economy collapsed on his shift.
Bush left the country is the worst shape its been since the Great Depression.

Jobs gone with GATT and NAFTA. The Housing Bubble destroying mortgage wealth. The firesale is now over. . . the American People are the only things left to now be sold off. National Healthcare will officially turns our bodies over to a Marxist State.

Let the impeachment begin.
Posted by: Eileen | Mar 3, 2010 5:01:06 AM
__________________________________
The last Republican president left office with approval ratings of around 20%. In other words, 80% of Americans disapproved of him as President. There is no need to impeach him – he is gone.

POTUS is helping shift more Americans to government jobs, more Union jobs, and more government control over our daily lives. The objective: more people dependent upon socialists for their household incomes – a.k.a. more democrat control because people vote to keep funding their jobs. Wholly crap. This is the new America. Our fates can be changed in November 2010. If the Democrats win then, BIG BROTHER has us all by the balls and POTUS and his team of hard core, genuine socialists know it.

Seems to me the President is doing almost exactly what he promised regarding taxes during the election – increasing taxes on those earning over $250,000. Leaving the others as is.
Posted by: tierra | Mar 3, 2010 4:24:15 AM
_________________________________________
The passage of this bill will be the catalyst for the promised next depression. You liberals need to wake up. Just where do you think the money comes from to pay you your earned income? Now think, if you can. If you were on top of the food chain and had the peasants thumping at the city gates with their torches clamoring for your money, what would you do? Give them the money they want. Then turn around and jack up their prices for everything else they use, consume, burn and eat, right? The middle class will always pay dearly for the things it demands of big money. You’ll just pay for it differently. Then be put back to work thinking you’ve slain the dragon. The dragon, in this case your very own government, will be even bigger and hungrier than ever before.
Look how much bigger and slothful it is compared to when FDR brought on Social Security, Ike and the Highway System. The list is endless. Go ahead, Lefties. Make Big Money’s Day. They’ll still have money and your load to bear to break even (Stay Financially Afloat) will be even heavier. Big Money got that way and they’re not giving up. Not while they own the very government that controls and steals from your pocket via taxes.

The health care fiasco is primarily to repay the unions for support. There is no fiscal responsibility in government which makes it a “mark” for the mafia unions that control the Democrat party. Which current government program will this payoff be modeled after? I have a few suggestions – social security, medicare, the VA (Walter Reed anybody? Weren’t we told Abu Ghraib was a better place to get medical treatment), how about those jewels fannie mae and freddie mac?

Tierra and real news. I am an independant voter. I have no insurance. I am about to vote out a lot of folks in Arkansas if I can who make me pay taxes that are wrong. This is not a democracy. This is a republic. I want no hand out. I want them to work together and come up with a plan that I can afford. One I am not made to buy into. Or face fines or go to jail. This nation is broke. They can’t give free insurance to all. You will have to pay. Once it’s voted into law if it still costs more than you can afford what will you do then? Pay fines and go to jail. Thwy need to get this economy going. That is the main thing. Every day we suffer more folks lose their jobs and the un-insured numbers gets worse. I think they are dragging their feet so more folks will lose their insurance and scream for this bill so they can be rulers over us. I say no. This is my gut feeling. If this insurance was such a good deal there would be no threat of fines and jail over us. This is just scary. I hope you folks wake up soon. They can do this the right way and not make those that have insurance pay for us. They are not responsible for my house payment or car payments so they should not pay my health care bill. I just want good legislation to fix this problem so I can be more secure. I am taxed enough.

tierra wrote: “During the administration of President George W. Bush, Congress used reconciliation to enact three major tax cuts, each of which was determined by the Congressional Budget Office to substantially worsen the fiscal position of the United States.”
LOL Will you get over yourself? If you’d bother to actually do your homework instead getting your “facts” from moveon, you know that in 2006 + 2007 the treasury raked in record tax revenues both years(or so says the same Congressional Budget Office you tout).
I guess the tax cuts were just a coincidence.
The problem is/was the congress at that time spent more than the revenue that was coming in. Sound familiar?
Basically the Repubs became Democrats.
So yes, I agree. Spending like a Democrat put us in “substantially worsen the fiscal position” we find ourselves in.

I think the American people have spoken loudly about this and anyone who votes for it will do so at the peril of their jobs. No wiggle room here, you do as WE your bosses say, or to quote Donald Trump, “YOU’RE FIRED”
We’ll fire all the incumbents who vote for Obamacide, are you listening? You’d better, If not you will in November when you join us in the unemployment lines.

We need to pass a law stating that people being paid to advocate for politicians on web site comments and blogs disclose their affiliations in every post.
How many of the commentators here would be flagged as operatives of the current administration?

Lester: There is opinion, then there are facts. I just watched a special about British health care and a child had to wait 2 months for an MRI. Americans have MRI’s done the same day as ordered. Generally without a couple of hours. And, they do not cost us anything either. If we have insurance, the insurance pays. For those who do not have insurance, the hospital either relies on a welfare type of payment (Medicare, Medicaid, Medical, Champus, Hill-Burton, etc.) OR it is “eaten” as part of the cost of doing business. AMERICANS DO NOT SUFFER FROM NOT HAVING INSURANCE, and are NEVER turned away from lack of ability to pay; in fact, our health care is the best in the world (WHY did the Canadian PM just come here for treatment two weeks ago???)
Sadly, you are listening to lying Leftists; therefore, you are speaking nonsense! No American is EVER turned away for lack of insurance (except for that one instance when Mrs. Obama was in charge of care at a particular Chicago hospital; that episode has been WIDELY disseminated; she did wrong by a young man, but that no longer happened once she was removed from her position).
Lester, I spend a month a year in GB and have since 1971. Your attitude is one I have NEVER come across; I am treated like a much loved American cousin. I spent 5 months in Europe two years ago and was treated wonderfully in France, Italy, Germany, and Austria! Everyone knew I was American and they wanted to discuss the sports teams and their relatives in America. My daughter has lived in Canada since 1988 and travels to Europe, Africa, South American and Asia in her job. She has NEVER been treated as “unintelligent” and neither have I. You do NOT speak for Great Britain.
As for being “selfish” we just delivered aid to Chile (and are still in French Haiti) after removing the Butcher of Baghdad and saving MILLIONS of Iraqi citizens from rape, torture, maiming and murder from that insane dictator and his evil sons! How much aid does your island deliver around the world? A pittance compared to what Americans pay for the citizens of the world (maybe we could afford more if we didn’t have to carry so much of your share). And, we have NEVER colonized anyone; we were the victims of YOUR country, remember? And then we saved you THREE TIMES (WWI, and WWII, and the Cold War). Have you EVER read a book about democracy? Do you know how long we tolerated slavery (compared to your country)? Do you know anything of the history of America? (Read Alexis deTocqueville for starters, then move on to Alistair Cooke, and then Winston Churchill.) And of how incredibly GENEROUS AND INTELLIGENT the American people are? How we saved the world in WWI and WWII; we had NOTHING at risk but only our own CARING FOR OUR FELLOW MAN! The fact that you could EVER call Americans uncaring is pure fantasy! Ask some of your pensioners about America and what we did for them! Ask the Queen for Pete’s sake! Are you not aware that America REBUILDS vanquished countries after war? Have you not heard of the Berlin Airlift? Or the end of polio? Or the end of TB? Or of the strides America has made in the treatment of deadly diseases? Have you any idea how many airfields we have built around the world and the lives that have been saved due to our ability to evacuate the sick and injured? Or of how many dams we have built around the world? Or of the health programs we have established around the world? Do you know ANYTHING OF TRUTH?
Incidentally, ALL of the wonderful people I have met in the UK, and in Europe are aware that Americans are their cousins; not their enemy! You must be a raving Leftist to not know about the goodness of the American people (who are not a separate race but a MIXTURE of ALL NATIONS OF THE EARTH, who have learned to WORK TOGETHER IN FREEDOM. We tolerate the occasional Marxist (like Barack Obama, and his corrupt thugs) because we know the people are waking up and that he will soon be gone, and America will shine again. Until then, you had best mind the good that Americans do, respect that goodness, and stop making false claims! You appear to be jealous!

No federally funded abortion!

Keep in mind that all these “progressives” want is to move the ball a bit closer to the goal line. Passing this mess will be celebrated by these scum for decades to come. THe true believers don’t really care if they get re-elected. They will be heros to the clueless left.

We need to pass a law stating that people being paid to advocate for politicians on web site comments and blogs disclose their affiliations in every post.
How many of the commentators here would be flagged as operatives of the current administration?
Posted by: Accountability
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And call it ‘bandwidth reform’!

The TEA PARTY wants to send all of those Illegal Aliens back to wherever they came from and build a Concrete Wall 15 feet high topped of with Razor wire on our Southern Border.
Then Pull out of NAFTA and the WTO Trade Agreements and create 15 million Jobs almost over night.
Then prosecute every one of these people who insist we stay in NAFTA and the WTO for TREASON.
If the American Presidents and Congressmen LOVE China so much then we should deport every one of them to CHINA.
They sure as HELL do not care about America or any of the American Workers.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Sen. Fritz Hollings
Former South Carolina Senator
Posted: December 18, 2009 02:40 PM
They’re All Against Jobs
Who is against jobs in the United States? The big banks, Wall Street, the Council on Foreign Relations, the Business Roundtable, the United States Chamber of Commerce, the National Retail Federation, Corporate America, the President of the United States, Congress of the United States. Everyone is crying for jobs, but no one seems to understand why there aren’t any. And the reason for those opposing jobs is money.
Beginning in 1973, big banks made most of their profit outside of the United States. Industries off-shoring, investing, banks financing the investments, transfer fees, fees and interest on the loans made for bigger profits. Long since, the big banks under the leadership of David Rockefeller have led the way to off-shore and make a bigger profit. Goldman Sachs, AIG, Citicorp and Wall Street, conspiring for a bailout and now using it for bonuses, make more money from the off-shored operations.
The Council on Foreign Relations ought to be renamed the Council on Making Money. A recent PEW poll reported fully 85% of Americans said that protecting United States jobs should be a top foreign policy priority. But only 21% of the Council on Foreign Relations agrees.
Financial interests organized the Business Roundtable to continue off-shore investment and profit. The local Chamber is for Main Street America, but Tom Donahue and the United States Chamber have sold out to the financial interests and oppose jobs and producing in the United States.
Thirty years ago, hundreds of thousands of Arrow shirts produced in China were a best seller in the United States. But at Christmas time, the Chinese supply ran short and the retail stores had to order the same shirt from New Jersey. They made 20% less profit on the New Jersey shirt. Retailers are all for profit from imports and against domestic production and jobs in America.
Corporate America would fight any initiative by the President, the Congress, or the government to create jobs in the United States. That is, production that faces competition offshore.
In globalization, U. S. production cannot make a profit, cannot survive. Its competition will off-shore the same article for a lesser price, putting you out of business.
Moreover, Corporate America doesn’t have to bother with labor in China. The China government controls labor and you don’t have to worry about a work stoppage or minimum wage. All they have is a maximum wage.
And Corporate America does not have to worry with clean air and clean water or the environment in China. Nor does it have to worry with OSHA and all of its safety rules. Many times the factory building is furnished and you do not have to worry with capital costs. If you make a profit, you can just reinvest it in an additional operation and not have to pay any U. S. income tax. If the operation fails, walk away with no legacy costs. Corporate America bitterly opposes its government protecting and strengthening the U. S. economy because producing again in America will put the executives back to work. They can send a Jaycee to China to watch the quality control daily and sit on the 32nd floor on Sixth Avenue with the internet, keeping check, and, leaving early for a massage and drinks. With production in China they do not have to work.
As Commander-in-Chief, the President dithered for months over the number of troops. But he cannot equip the troops except for the favor of a foreign country. The War Production Act of 1950 requires the President to make sure that we can produce in country those articles necessary for our national defense.
Enforcing this law would limit the campaign contributions. Under Section 201 of the trade laws, the President is supposed to take action, like impose tariffs or quotas, when a certain production is endangered. Not only endangered, our automobile production has been bankrupted. But all the President does is give Detroit bailout welfare. The President does not want to limit the campaign contributions.
The same with Congress. Senator Byron Dorgan of North Dakota long ago tried to allocate the tax incentive for foreign jobs and production to domestic jobs and production. The Business Roundtable and the U. S. Chamber fought it like a tiger and killed it.
As the President said in his West Point talk, there is fierce competition in international trade and globalization. All countries move to protect and build their economies while the United States goes out of business. The one advantage that the U.S. has is its richest market in the world. It is fast becoming the poorest market and the U.S. is losing any influence to maintain a strong economy.
The economy is in the hands of Summers, Bernanke and Geithner. Campaign contributions are in the hands of David Axelrod and Rahm Emanuel (all five are CFR members and JEWS). The poor President is smart, diligent and working his head off campaigning. But he is inexperienced and not governing, and the Congress is in a Mexican standoff over an archaic filibuster rule that reveres democracy by the minority.
Of course, the media, which knows this and keeps it top secret, is owned by big business.
If I don’t meet you in the breadline, my children will.
Merry Christmas!
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I CAN CREATE 15 MILLION JOBS ALMOST OVER NIGHT right here in America !!!
Here is my Job creation Computations:
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Total USA Imports in 2006:
———————————-
$ 2,211.7 billion —– Total Imports.
$ -309.4 billion less — (minus spent on Imported Crude Oil)
————————————————–
$ 1,902.3 billion / 30 billion=63.41 million jobs lost from Imports. ==================================================
Total USA Exports in 2006:
———————————-
$ 1,451.7 Billion / 30 billion=48.39 million jobs America Created from Exports.
If USA Pulls out of NAFTA and WTO right now:
USA would absolutely gain a total of 63.41 million Jobs by Manufacturing all IMPORTS right here in the USA.
So, 63.41 minus 48.39 = 15.02 million NET JOBS GAIN. But, a lot of Exports must be purchased in the USA. That would mean an even larger number of jobs created in America than I have estimated.
My calculation means an ABSOLUTE 15.02 million Jobs gained if the rest of the world did not buy even one penny of USA EXPORTS.
SO MOTE IT BE. . . . .
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Harry Dingey,
About one-third of US imports are for oil. How does ending this increase jobs? Are you suggesting rickshaws and coolie labor!
BY: interventor, USA…..
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
NO, NO, NO.. Notice I have subtracted out the Import cost for crude Oil that was spent in 2006. We will still be forced to Import Crude Oil. Imported Crude Oil is another problem.
I am all for a Balanced International Trade with the world.
But, that will never happen as long as we remain a member of NAFTA and the WTO.
What I suggest is a very simple problem.
The American workers are out of a job.
So, “how can we find him a job”?
What we make in America and ship to the rest of the world are called EXPORTS.
The following is how many jobs that were created from Exports in 2006.
Total USA Exports in 2006:
———————————-
$ 1,451.7 Billion / 30 billion=48.39 million jobs was Created in America from Exports in 2006.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The following is how many jobs that were lost by allowing Imports into America in 2006.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Total USA Imports in 2006:
———————————-
$ 2,211.7 billion — Total Imports in 2006.
$ 309.4 billion —- (Subtract Dollars spent on Imported Oil)
————————————————–
$ 1,902.3 billion / 30 billion=63.41 million jobs lost from Imports into America.
If USA Pulls out of NAFTA and WTO right now:
USA would absolutely Create a total of 63.41 million Jobs by Manufacturing all IMPORTS right here in the USA.
So, 63.41 minus 48.39 = 15.02 million NET American JOBS GAINED by Pulling out of NAFTA and the WTO..
But, I think many of these Exports will still be purchased in the USA.
That would mean an even larger number of jobs created in America than I have estimated.
Also notice I have subtracted out the Import cost for crude Oil. We will still be forced to Import Crude Oil for now.
Any way you cut it, America would be better off Pulling out of NAFTA and the WTO.
The President and Congress all know this too. But, they also know the minute they pull out of NAFTA and the WTO the Money will stop flowing into their pockets too.
So, they refuse to do the right thing for America and the American People.
So MOTE it be..
Do you truly want to help straighten out the United States Government now? Then, copy and post this article everyplace on the Internet you can post.
BY: Harry Dingey
Have a good day my friends.

The idea of government running healthcare is downright scary! It is no wonder that the people have rejected the idea.

You’re lucky Obama has indicated he will do his best to keep those taxes low on those who can’t afford more.
Posted by: tierra | Mar 3, 2010 5:25:08 AM ************************************ Hey, Dreamer. Her’s a reality check foryou. Just how do you expect to pay for a $12T budget without higher taxes on everyone. Yes, even those on unemployment pay taxes. Just how do we do that when 10-12% of the work force is unemployed. BTW, consider this, please. If we give someone something for doing nothing, just how does that coerce them into finding work. Remember, please, you get what you pay for. Keep extending the unemployment benefits for those who can’t find or won’t find work. Just where are you getting this money? China? Germany? Who’s paying for this if 10-12% of our own work force is idle? I get it. You’ll just swipe your Visa card, ay?
Keep dreaming. Your President and Congress need every vote they can get this November and ’12. All that the right asks is: “Earn everything you take. How or why is that such a bad thing, Comrade?”

Just shut the epf up and take it! You are NOT gonna eph up my Socialiss agenda! You are NOT gonna epf up my legacy! My will be done, whetha you all like it or not!!

The house’s idea of this farce only passed it’s own members by 2 votes last time. You have to know the legislators doing the voting are watching these state primaries and sweating blood. And, hell, if they fool around very long Charles Rangel may not even be there.

Why can the govt help fund adoption with adoption credits but can’t pay for abortions. I would opt for a fully funded federal abortion program as it would end the lives of millions of unwanted children who probably have a higher rate of crime, etc.
For all you people against abortion, why don’t you step up and adopt all the unwanted children.

If this is what he meant by 
‘consensus’, Obama’s achieved it: moderates, conservatives and liberals are united 
in their opposition.
The ‘reforms’ are variously considered a sham, trivial or an
 institutionalization of the current disastrous health care system (only with 
more public subsidies to the insurance industry).
The confusion and endless gyrations evident in the plan (try reading it) are the result of trying to fit ‘reform of the system’ into the system’s current contorted, inefficient and costly contours (in other words, the plan is not a ‘reform’, but more pasting things on to a broken system).
Here’s what the people wanted when Obama and the Democrats started:
“A mere seven months ago (that would be around June 2009), The New York 
Times/CBS poll found that 72% of Americans ‘supported a government-
administered insurance plan—something like Medicare for those under 65—
that would compete for customers with private insurers.’”
From then until now, Obama has:

1. Rejected single payer; 

2. Stiff-armed the government option; 

3. Mandated individuals and families pay premiums to private sector insurers; 

4. Assured billions in tax payer subsidies for private sector insurers; 

5. Stipulated actual health care service at 80 cents of every dollar, while 
insurers can spend
20 cents of every premium dollar on lobbying, ‘sympathetic’ 
candidates, CEO bonuses, ‘administration’, fighting claims for treatment and, 
now we can add, participating on the new Federal ‘rate review’ Board.
The substance of the President’s proposal is the current costly, inefficient and 
ineffective insurance system on Federal steroids.
If Obama wanted to cast himself as a leader, this was surely his last chance, and he blew it with a plan to keep the current system in place, while supplementing it with taxpayers’ money in the form of mandated premium payments and Federal ‘subsidies’. That’s no reform at all.
A Down Vote is What the Non-Reform Deserves and hopefully, for the sake of the American people, a Down Vote is What the Obama Plan Will Get.

Please do. Ram it through, you Statists, and watch the winds blow.

Anybody care to stop hurling insults for a minute and help clarify something for me?
I’m wondering to what extent there are fixed rules governing the use of reconciliation; and who would enforce those rules. Where are these reconciliation rules defined–a federal statute or what? How could I read a layman’s summary of these rules?
If the use of reconciliation to pass this health care bill were actually against the rules, wouldn’t some person or body step forward and stop the proceedings? Who would that be and how would it happen?
Or are those who oppose the use of reconciliation here saying that it’s not actually against the rules; it’s just against the spirit and intent of the provision?

What happened to the term “Nuclear Option” that ABC newspeople were so fond of using when the Republicans controlled the Senate?

Even if this doesn’t pass the democrats are going to get their clocks cleaned come November. If they somehow do manage to force this down our throats, will ANY democrat seat be safe? Republicans need to challenge EVERY democratic held seat this year – Senate, House, state senate and house, local, mayor, dog catcher – everything. Democrats are giving the opposition the opportunity of a lifetime. Don’t pass it up.

The willingness of the press to “sand the rough edges” for Obama still impresses me. He is about to bully though a massive trillion dollar healthcare bill that will effect every single American, the “simple majority” of whom, vehemently oppose it. The soft and gentle headline? “Obama is OPEN to forcing vote on healthcare” ABC, still casting the president as a seasoned and restrained bystander, simply, passively, beautifully “open” to options, kinda like being open to new foods, or open to different cultures..If you want to know how a republican president doing the same thing would be treated, check out the Bunning headlines of recent days concerning the $10 billion. (1,000 billion = 1 trillion.)