Race and IQ: Should Scientists Even Study It?

Gee, scientists have no problem when it comes to studying fresh stem cells from harvested from embryos, the very stuff of life, but won’t study differences between naturally selected people. Race describes a series relatively well-defined characteristics of people. These scientists are lying behind their left-wing biases, not willing to go where the facts are.

One problem with studying race and IQ is that IQ is not necessarily a good measure of intelligence.
What is intelligence? How do you define it in such a way to remove it from such non-genetic factors as education, culture and social class?
And what, exactly, is “race”?
(Sorry, Jimmy: As a former student of biological anthropology, I can tell you that there are no clear-cut criteria of what constitutes race.)
Even if it were easy to define race, how can you truly determine it given the countless generations that different groups have interbred?
And what would be the purpose of such tests? Studying “race” and “intelligence” has nothing to do with research that could benefit neurological or developmental disorders. If you want to cure autism, mental retardation, or any other disorder, study the behavior and brains of people who are affected.

The problem with studying race and intelligence is that the studies are designed based on a European model. By that, I mean, IQ tests are usually written and are standardized on white, middle class individuals. When studying race and intelligence, one must look at the learning history, so to speak, of the race being studied. For example, those of African ancestary have a oral learning tradition, while those of European ancestary have a written learning tradition. Unless a study takes this into account, in my opinion, it is biased, because it is based on the premise that ONLY the European way of learning, or of acquiring intelligence, is the right way.

What exactly is the definition of “race”? Personally, I have native southmerican genes, and I look very native. My “race” is also mixed with European and Chinese. My European ancestors may have had Turkish background. My Chinese Great father may have been very intelligent I suppose. How will you study my genes? Does the fact that I have a degree in Science proves my intelligence or lack or intelligence?? Does the fact that I have lost money in my investments shows lack of intelligence? So glad the US now has an African American as a president!!!
I agree with Lookup. Money should fund other scientific needs in the world:
global warming, population explosion, pollution, etc.? Solar panels anyone?

Don Ferguson:”For example, those of African ancestary have a oral learning tradition, while those of European ancestary have a written learning tradition. Unless a study takes this into account, in my opinion, it is biased, because it is based on the premise that ONLY the European way of learning, or of acquiring intelligence, is the right way.”
It couldn’t be that the sub-Saharan Negro is the ONLY race on the planet throughout history that has never been intelligent enough to devise a written language could it? African history only began when the white man started writing it down for them. And if these tests are so ‘culturally biased’, then please explain why Asians from a completely different culture and upbringing do just fine on these tests.

Taylor: Why do you automatically assume that a written learning tradition is better than an oral one? African history was passed down from generation to generation, orally, instead of being written down. This is true for other cultures, as well. It should also be said that there were great universities in Africa while Europeans were still living in caves. This also does not make the African way of acquiring intelligence is better than the European way. My point was that, any IQ test, in order to be reliable and verifiable, must take this fact into account. And, by the way, Asians also have a written learning tradition. May be that is why they do well on these tests?

the problem is that race will contributevery little to IQ the large difference will come in social class since unfortunatly in america and western society black and east asian people are lower in social class than white people so that some (enough to possible knock a few IQ points off) may not have the funding and high level education available, this may not be right in all cases thou, myself a white british working class teenager raised by a single mother have an IQ of 131 proof that social class may not always affect intelligence.

While I am empathetic to learning more about ourselves, the genetic overtones makes this an uneasy topic. You only have less than a century to look back on the misdeeds by the eugenics movement in the first half of the 20th century. In the so called “name of science” pseudo-scientists and actual scientists were leading research into whether certain racial, ethnic, and disabled groups were inferior than the rest of the healthy Anglo Saxon population–and these people held high positions of power–and many convinced their state governments to perform forced sterilization procedures on many so called “defective” and “inferior” peoples. From this movement the Nazi groups helped gain momentum and the Extermination death camps and unethical medical procedures in Europe during WWII can be directly tied to the eugenics movement. It was only after the defeat of Germany when the death camps came to light for the general public that the eugenics movement was discredited by the federal and state governments, and the population in general–that was the main reason Americans did not commit the same barbarities the Germans did.

ps
The word “race” does not have the same meaning as it did 100 or 200 years ago.
It was originally used the way that we use “variations” or “subspecies” (actually somewhere in-between that).

Has Herbert Spencer taken over this blog? I’m sorry, Ned, but this is an assinine question.

The answer to this is quite simple – they can study it as much as they desire as long there is reason to believe there will be tangible benefits for mankind. Publishing the results is quite another story as this would be quiite foolhardy. Let’s assume the finding is that negroes are more intelligent that caucasians – hmmm, the study will be immediately discarded (the only persons who will accept the result will be negroes). The same will apply for almost any other outcome.

@Jim, who wrote:
“…it should also be said that there were great universities in Africa while Europeans were still living in caves….”
And the evidence for that is …? You’re pulling that out of thin air. Wishful thinking is most out of place here, and most unbecoming as well.
@Toby:
I disagree that eugenics was the basis of the Nazi program. And even if it was, that does not automatically discredit the genetic viewpoint at issue here.
Regarding the use/misuse of the word “race,” let’s just replace it with “area of ancient ancestral origin.” This is certainly not meaningless within the context of modern genetics.

Why were no academics who concur with the race/IQ correlation hypothesis quoted in this article?
Oh, wait, I know, because the author wishes to frame it as if no “reasonable” “respectable” academic holds such an opinion; but of course.
One problem: Longitudinal studies involving IQ testing of identical twins establish intelligence as 60-80% genetic. Said studies also establish differing average intelligences for separate racial groups. And no, race is not a “social construct,” genetic testing allows persons of self-identified race to be genetically identified as such with an accuracy above 99%.
Shall I be burned at the stake, now?

By the way, many of those forced sterilizations were done here in the US not Germany.

I would like to mention a very methodical study of this topic has already been done: “The Bell Curve: Intelligence and Class Structure in American Life” by Richard Herrnstein and Charles Murray, 1994, Simon and Schuster. Though it was a NY Times Bestseller, the authors were excoriated by the press at the time. New studies will only suffer the same fate as people seem to transfer their own feelings and biases to such work.

@Mike in NYC, in response to his argument against KMB’s post
Sorry to butt in someone else’s argument, but I do believe that KMB is referring to the civilization of Ancient Egypt. :) Though I don’t think all of the Europeans were living in caves at the time…

To state that a given ethnic group is more or less intellegent based on IQ exams is a very simplistic approash to intellegence. IQ test cheifly measure academic or grade school/collegiate types of learning abilities instead of introspective, perceptual, artistic, social, emotional, athletic,creative, spiritual, and above all moral intellegence.
The difference bewteen the highest scoring ethnic group verses the lowest scoring ethnic group or race is only at most a few points, which amounts to about 1/3 of an order of standard deviation.
As a middle aged conservative Catholic man, I am bound to accept the statement within the New Catholic Catechism of the Catholic Church that all human persons share a fundamental moral equality before their Creator.
We have lost sight of the spiritual. We all posess a spiritual, naturally immortal, incorruptable per addends and per se, eternal, radically endowed with free will, rational, directly and immeadiately created by God by a special act of creation, soul.
The brain based intellence so often tauted as being based on neurological giftedness is indeed good, but it is only part of the story of human onological makeup.
It has been said, that in this life, we see just a surface glimmer of our souls, as if a surface reflection on a wave in an ocean infinitely vast and incomprehensably deep and that within our soul, exists a vast infinite ocean of existence, incomprehensible.
In modern cognitive studies that want to reduce the human person to mere schoolastic aptitudes and negligable differences by race on standardized IQ exams to determine which race is more intellegent is one of the debasities of modern psychology and modern social science, which although good disciplines in themselves, have often led to a spiritual minimalist, or worse yet, a complete materialist view of the human person.
Is it any wonder why we within the U.S. as a counrty have scrapped 50 million babies from the wombs of their mothers since row verses wade. In the expediancy of materialistic or spiritual minimalistic existentialism, we see human life only in terms of whether or not it appears outwardly attractive or IQ test wise intellegent instead of how God sees us as well as the Elect in Heaven and the Poor Souls in Purgatory.
GOD BLESS!
Jim

I would think that there has got to be a difference in thought capacity (call it intelligence if you wish) between peoples whom moved from the origin at different points to different regions containing different environmental pressures (call these “races” if you wish). It is evident to all who have eyesight that there are clear differences between peoples from Asia, Africa, Europe, and even more subtle changes are evident from region to region. So if the pressures of natural selection have caused undeniable physical deltas, can we possibly suppose that some of that physical difference did not end up in the brain and its capacity, speed, or ability to call on memory to make decisions? I think not. I would have to say there are certainly differences in cognizant power based on natural selection and environmental pressures (means of providing food, warmth, protection). The only way to really test this theory would be to try to teach representative members of all regions something entirely new. Something unbiased. Something that does not require written language to understand, healthy physical attributes to perform, etc.. Take representative “blank slates” and study their ability to learn, utilize, and even adapt a previously unseen scenario. If data shows the Africans (e.g.) can learn an unknown skill faster, remember it longer, apply it more readily, and adapt it to applications where it is not already suited, then it may be safe to say the Africans have the upper hand in mental capacity.

This should be studied – if for nothing more but to the results could be quite surprising or interesting. No not because I am racist – if its even possible to be “racist” anymore (given that most races are no longer pure – thanks to America the “Great melting Pot”).
Oh, and to the comments about not having a written language would make the IQ tests bias against the Africa’s- I have 2 states to this.
1)- What about the people of Africa descent that grew up in America, Europe, or in the elite classes in civilized countries in Africa?
2)- Think about this. Native Americans had no written language (like an alphabet- they used mostly drawings in caves/canvasses and oral tradition) and ,after exposure to the Europeans that came over, wrote one. Sequoyah created the written alphabet and language rules for the Cherokee Indians. Amazing – a very intelligent man.
ops maybe its the things
3)- the Asians do and have had a written language but it different from most other languages still in use in the 21st century. Theirs language is caligorphy – symbols not letters. While primative, their civilization has been around and established for centuries before European civilization was thought up (abour 2000 years older- i do believe). They invented gun powder and the swords they created were far better quality than the European Knight’s counterpart.

Sure why not. People in grad school study the relationship between beer and getting it on for college students. Why not this.

People who say: “there is no race only the human race.” Are sticking their head in the sand and denying the stark reality before their eyes. Not only are the physical diffrences between the world’s races obvious but there are mental and genetic differences as well. If we were aliens from another planet and discovered Black, White and Yellow races living on this planet, they would be considered to be different species of the same genus. What is wrong with this?

the problem is that race will contributevery little to IQ the large difference will come in social class since unfortunatly in america and western society black and east asian people are lower in social class than white people so that some (enough to possible knock a few IQ points off) may not have the funding and high level education available, this may not be right in all cases thou, myself a white british working class teenager raised by a single mother have an IQ of 131 proof that social class may not always affect intelligence.

Race exists.
Anyone who says otherwise is lying and being ridiculous to make a point confirming their liberal biases.
Don’t show me a mixed race, nebulous person and try to make me classify him, just look at the white, oriental and black races side by side and if you can’t tell the difference, then you are lying, because you are not that stupid.
Thousands of years of evolution for the most part geographically separated, has made them quite distinct.
Don’t tell me that there is only a minuscule difference in the genes, because that’s all it takes. just a little, not a lot.
Look up the name of Darwin’s book.
Race is the same as species.

What is IQ?

IQ = Intelligence Quotient
It is a type of test that measures a persons ability to learn. Tells you how smart you are.

I don’t see why they shouldn’t. They study other things just as pointless.

@Larry:
The expression “real McCoy” predates Elijah. “Black Invention Myths” has something to say about him, as well.
I never said that individual blacks did not make contributions. But my assessment of modern civilization as being virtually equivalent to white civilization is obvious to anyone of average mental capacity who is not willfully blind.
It’s interesting that the few significant black accomplishments were made while sojourning in European cultures. In their native continent, nada. (The kora does have an appealing sound, though, I will say.)
And don’t start in about the Egyptians, please.

We are now in the days where facts are suppressed — and manufactured — to make Euros appear inferior. Not to mention Evil Incarnate.
“Fear of being inferior”? An ad hominem attack on those who don’t share your most cherished beliefs. Reality doesn’t share them either.

Please note – military might and not intelligence.

Hey Mike,
Here’s a suggestion – why don’t you google “white invention myths”? Let me know what you find. I think that may produce some interesting results.

There is a strong correlation between IQ and economic success. The lower the IQ, the less likely a person will prosper in the job market. Pretty simple. You all went to school. You knew the ones who just didn’t get it and weren’t likely to go on to become a CEO of Bank America or program computers.
Break it down. Over the last hundred years of testing, the results have been consistent. The average White IQ is about 100; the average Black IQ in this country is between 80 and 85. No, economic background does not affect it. Many poor Whites score higher than even middle class Blacks on average.
There are about 40 million Blacks in this country. That means that, on average, 20 million of them have an IQ or 85 or less. There are 200 million White people in this country. That means that at least 20 million or more of them at the low end have similar IQs below 85. What do those Whites and Blacks also have in common? Poverty, welfare, crime, frustration.
Low IQ is an equal opportunity offender at the low end. It is genetic, and no amount of public funding for schools will change that, regardless of race. This does not mean that all Blacks are not smarter than all Whites. There are millions of Blacks that are smarter than many White. What it means is that if you are an average Black with an IQ of 80, you are going to find it very difficult to get ahead in a society, like the USA, if the majority of people around you have at least a 20 point higher IQ.
On the other hand, if the average African-American went to Africa, where the average IQ is only 70, they would have a huge advantage and would not find a problem competing for well-paying jobs. It’s not that complex of an issue.

I strongly suggest that the person who mentioned Franz Boaz do some further reading to determine how Mr. Boaz came to his conclusion. It seems that most persons think that any printed material stating opinions by noted persons automatically translates to being factual. It is for reasons such as these that a person’s mind becomes warped. I was taught that Christopher Columbus discovered Jamaica. Since the Arawaks were already living there the printed material, recorded in most historical records, is obviously flawed. This is one of the most obvious examples of bias that can be created by written material. Let’s also not forget that the world was at one time flat. The comments therefore display a certain parochial nature which demonstrate a blocked mind typical of persons with prejudice. Unfortunately, minds such as these remain closed and thus limit the learning experience. Said comments also prove the point that reason cannot be presented to the illogical mind which is biased beyond normal boundaries. It would benefit those who eargerly slurp away at printed “facts” to carefully determine how those facts are derived.

This is just one racist article why would u write such a thing??
get a life

actually the wheel was invented in what is now called iraq.. so what does that tell ya Brian

As long as the government gives racial preferences, such as affirmative action, the government has an obligation to allow if not support the study racial differences.

James Bowery
I am not sure what you mean (a good example of my thought process being different from yours).
But I do believe if we are going to discriminate in Law that the reason for that discrimination should be investigated IN-DEPTH to either prove or disprove the basis for said discrimination.

If IQ is a measure of a person’s ability to learn, does that mean that if someone is unable to learn from their mistakes, that their IQ is zero? It’s this question that makes me doubt the validity of IQ tests.

Drew
I am familiar with that quote and it is the animosity between the two that was my reason for using them to demonstrate my point. What is genius? Having an aptitude for Math? Logic? The sanity of both men has been questioned. Does genius come with insanity or simply eccentricity?

Larry wrote:
“I strongly suggest that the person who mentioned Franz Boaz do some further reading to determine how Mr. Boaz came to his conclusion.”
I wrote that comment, Larry, and for years I have done ‘further reading’; in fact, I’ve read an enormous amount of the work Boaz and his disciples, like Margaret Mead. Boaz was first and foremost a Marxist, and all of his ‘scientific’ investigations were filtered through that ideology. He believed that through his studies, he could create the Socialist uptopian world society that Marx envisioned, regardless of what the facts were. Yes, he made the facts fit the theory.
He wanted to elevate primitive cultures and claim that they were as equally important as Western Civilization. At the same time, he wanted to primitivize Western Culture, much like Freud attempted in his obsession with sex. Like most Marxists, he desired to put everyone on the same level; and of course, he failed.
And yes, in his own writings, he admitted that failure when he had no choice but to acknowledge, based on his own observations, that individuals from primitive cultures did not have the same mental capacity of those from western european civilization.
However, he still maintained that the only way to equitably remedy this disparity was through miscegenation of the races, which is the Marxist’s utopia of final equality. By even suggesting this, he was implicitly acknowledging the genetic differences between the races which he spent his entire life trying to deny.

Brain Correlates of Non-Symbolic Numerosity Estimation in Low and High Mathematical Ability Children
Yulia Kovas1,3*, Vincent Giampietro1, Essi Viding1,2, Virginia Ng1, Michael Brammer1, Gareth J. Barker1, Francesca G. E. Happé1, Robert Plomin1
Abstract
Previous studies have implicated several brain areas as subserving numerical approximation. Most studies have examined brain correlates of adult numerical approximation and have not considered individual differences in mathematical ability. The present study examined non-symbolic numerical approximation in two groups of 10-year-olds: Children with low and high mathematical ability. The aims of this study were to investigate the brain mechanisms associated with approximate numerosity in children and to assess whether individual differences in mathematical ability are associated with differential brain correlates during the approximation task. The results suggest that, similarly to adults, multiple and distributed brain areas are involved in approximation in children. Despite equal behavioral performance, there were differences in the brain activation patterns between low and high mathematical ability groups during the approximation task. This suggests that individual differences in mathematical ability are reflected in differential brain response during approximation.

I am part Italian-American and part Applilatian-American…
What race does that make me????

Applilatian-American? What country is Applilatian?

Danny,
1. In relation to race, have you read the paper by Risch et al., Am. J. Hum. Genet. 76:268–275, 2005? There are readily identifiable clusters of points, corresponding to traditional continental ethnic groups: Europeans, Africans, Asians, Native Americans.
2. In relation to IQ being meaningless, then you think a surgeon could equally have an IQ of under or over 100?
There are some interesting physical correlates:
See Behavioral and Brain Sciences (2007), 30:135-154 Cambridge University Press:
“Overall, we conclude that modern neuroimaging techniques are beginning to articulate a biology of intelligence. We propose that the P-FIT provides a parsimonious account for many of the empirical observations, to date, which relate individual differences in intelligence test scores to variations in brain structure and function.”
Also, EEG studies show increased neural efficiency in the cortex of ‘brighter’ individuals:
“In the field of physiological study of human intelligence, strong evidence of a more efficient operation (i.e., less activation) of the brain in brighter individuals (the neural efficiency hypothesis) can be found”
Cognitive Brain Research
Volume 25, Issue 1, September 2005, Pages 217-225
There is also circumstantial evidence from twin studies & transracial adoption studies.
“Heritability estimtes for intelligence quotient (IQ) range from 0.50 to 0.80. This makes IQ a suitable target for attempts to identify the specific genes involved.” Chorney et al, Role of the cholinergic muscarinic 2 receptor (CHRM@) gene in cognition. Molecular Psychiatry (2003) 8. 10-13.
“A substantial body of literature from twin, family and adoption studies documents significant genetic effects on human intelligence. Heritability estimates range from 40 to 80% and meta-analyses suggest an overall heritability of around 50%” Dick et al, (2006) “Association of CHRM2 with IQ: Converging Evidence for Genes Influencing Intelligence.” Behavioral Genetics.
“Multivariate genetic analyses indicate that general intelligence is highly heritable, and that the overlap in the cognitive processes is twice as great as the overall phenotypic overlap, with genetic correlations averaging around .80.”
Plomin et al (2004) “A functional polymorphism in the succinate-semialdehyde dehydrogenase genes is associated with cognitive ability,” Molecular Psychology 9, 582-586

ps
Goethe (sorry for the former spelling) is best known for art*, Pasteur for biology, Einstein for physics and Tesla as a mechanic*
*in the original meaning, not modern.

Ben wrote:
“Members of all racial-ethnic groups can be found at every IQ level.”
While I agree with almost everything Ben wrote, this statement is completely false.
You will find no pure blooded sub-saharan Africans, Australian Aboriginals, South American Aztecas, or Maori with IQs in the 160 range. If the predictability of the bell curve is true, as you assert, then the chances that a population whose average IQ is between 60 and 70 or less would produce even one individual with an IQ of 160 is virtually impossible. Do the math yourself–you are talking about almost ten standard deviations above their norm. That only 3% of Whites score three standard deviations above the average, should give you some indication of what we are talking about here.
You also make the misleading statement that “Most people cluster around the average (IQ 100).” This is true only for Whites of European descent. If you include all racial minorities into the average IQ of all people living in the U.S.A., you would find the average to be around 90, if that.
Also, you neglected to point out that the reason Blacks in the U.S.A. have a higher average IQ than their ethnic brethren in Africa is because of their genetic admixture of both Causasian and Native American bloodlines. Blacks’ IQs rise somewhat proportionally to the amount of White genetics they have. Obama is a perfect example–he is 50% White, and 50% part East African (higher IQ than west African because of its Arab admixture).
Perhaps these were merely over-sights on your part, but I simply wanted to clarify some of your excellent points. And I commend you for citing Linda Gottfredson–she is one of the best sources for anyone interested in cutting through the Marxist political agenda of this area of scientific study. Well done.

Drew
Your idea of a high IQ is apparently someone who understands theoretical physics?
You did not answer my initial question. Civilization arose in the middle east, africa, china and south america first while europe was a latecomer. Why?
How do you know if those earlier civilizations are not the genetic heritage of “genius”?
You take the average IQ of supressed cultures and compare it to free cultures and expect to find high IQs. Do you what Natural Selection is and how it works?
The cultures that live in the most violent environments produce masses with lower IQ on average because the top of the curve is the physicaly most fit not the smartest at theoretical physics.

Excellent discussion and worthy topic, even for research and to evaluate what is IQ? I believe race IQ has been migration evolved and climate continues to affect IQ. I do believe sub-saharan races are negatively affected by climate and that this research would only help global assistance in affected regions. It’s all good… no research is off bounds.

What is interesting reading these comments is that it is clear none of you have read any of the research which has been done in this area.
You are all just a bunch of Joe Plumbers on this subject. The typical mob. Except your mob is self-selected too. Wealthy enough to afford the Internet and intellectual enough to read ABC news, it is very likely that your views will be Liberal.
Oh what You don’t like someone applying your own logic to yourselves?
lol noobs