changes everything. Washington consumed by the president trump's firing of James Comey this week. Vice president pence right there. The big question now, what is going to happen next? We're joined by two of America's top lawyers. Laurence tribe, consistetitutionconstitutional law professor at Harvard and Ken Starr. President trump must be impeached, here's why. Why? Because he's shown no respect for the rule of lauf. He regards himself as above the law. He thinks it's appropriate to essentially have a job interview with the FBI director. As we now know, the FBI director wanted to be reappointed. And the president essentially told him, well, we'll see. It depends. Will you plead loyalty to me? Kings and monarchs and dictators seek that kind of loyalty. He essentially said, if you say sure me that this meddlesome Russia investigation will go away, maybe I'll keep you on. That's obstruction of justice. Even within the technical term of the criminal code. But they're not relevant. The most relevant thing, because impeach smt our system's last resort for someone who treats himself or herself as above the law, most relevant thing is whether this president, by his recent course of action, on top of his violations of the foreign corruption or emoluments clause, he's shone he cannot be trusted to stay within the law. Our last resort is to get the person out of office. The president also said in the same interview, he wanted the investigation to be done properly. He does have the right to fire an FBI director, doesn't he? Sure. The right to fire does not include the right to fire in the context of what amounts to a bribe that is to say, I can fire you, you know, but I won't. If you do what I have no right to ask you to do. And that's to lay off. Of course the president said he wants to get to the truth. He always says that. But I think we all know that those words do not speak as loudly as his actions. Procefessor Starr, your response? I have the greatest respect for professor tribe. Very fond of him. But I emphatically disagree. I agree what he said in terms of the last resort, that is correct. We don't want to go through this. Think the key point is what is the reality as opposed to what is the tleerry? The reality is, and we just heard it from senator Warner. The investigations are going forward. He just said, we're going to get to the truth. And I have the greatest respect for the FBI. There are other 10,000 special agents. There's now a very able, acting director of the FBI. In fact, if anything, the issues with respect to his spouse have been raised. Think we need to allow the FBI to do its work. My two tours of duty at the justice department. My role as independent counsel, I worked with countless FBI agents. The directors are always people of complete integrity. Let's aslllow the system to work. The law has expired. By the deputy attorney general rod Rosenstein could appoint a special counsel. The Democrats saying it is necessary at this point. Does the fact that theuty attorney general is involved in the firing, was asked by the president to come up with this explanation, should he be pointing a special counsel? I don't think it causes any reason whatsoever, I was surprised to hear senator Warner say, very uncomplimentary things about the memo. I think Americans should read the memorandum. It's a three-page memorandum and let the people decide for themselves. Rod Rosenstein is a great patriot. He's overwhelmingly respected. He was confirmed almost unanimously by the United States senate. He just took office. Let's give him the opportunity to come to his own judgments instead of putting all his pressure on him. I'll just say this. There's a huge cost. Think the nation knows this. With the appointment of a special prosecutor. The first is delay. A special prosecutor, special counsel is a startup operation. He or she has nothing, absolutely nothing. Go to go get office space, among other things. Here's the key. The FBI is going the continue to serve whoever that special counsel is, heaven vforbid, if we have one. More over, that special counsel is like wise going to come under political scrutiny. I can seek for that. Lawrence Walsh in Iran contra can speak to that. There's no way to isolate from criticism. Let's trust our guardrails. The checks and balances that we have, especially with the senate intelligence committee. I think we should be reassured when we have chairman burr and senator warper, both very respected members of the senate, both saying, Democrat and Republican, we're going to get to the truth of the matter. Professor tribe, you heard that. Trust the guard rals. Trust is not what the framers of the United States constitution and of this country relied on. It's true that the president hasn't yet succeeded in ripping the guardrail apart. But I don't think we need to wait. Yes, there should be a special counsel. And that special counsel, as Ken Starr, a friend, whom ied a mare, can do the job effectively. That's not enough. The whole country needs to get to the bottom of the Russian collusion allegations. But in the meantime, we have a president who himself says trust me. He does not accept the boundaries of law. He base you cannily says that if anybody gets too close for comfort, I'm going to get rid of them. As long as that's in place, we cannot afford as a country to put our fate in the hands of someone so whimmsical. The idea it could take time to get office space, my goodness, when we're at the verge of having the fundamentals of our system collapse, we can afford some office space. This is a serious matter. The only way the avoid a konks constitution gnat crisis, and I'm not saying we're there yet is to reassure the pluck that the person leading the government is someone who has loyalties to someone other than himself. From fersz Starr, we're out of time. If you were looking into this case, would you be demanding tapes from the white house, if they do, indeed, exist? Absolutely. The investigation has to be thorough. You go where you think the truth is. You take the steps. I would say this. I know you have to go. We need to allow our system to work. Our system is not one person. It is the office of the presidency. It's the entire truck chur that our famers put in place. It's the men and women of the FBI who we can trust in terms of the integrity and professionalism. That is all we have time for today. Thank you both very much for your time. Thank you.