'This Week' Transcript: Don't Ask, Don't Tell


AMANPOUR: You mean forcing them to lie about what they are?

MULLEN: And then -- and then asking individuals to come in and lie about who they are every day goes counter to who we are as an institute.


DONNELLY: He knows better than that.


DONNELLY: Because the law does not say that people can be in the military if they are less than honest.

AMANPOUR: Well, let me go...

DONNELLY: He knows that.

AMANPOUR: Well, let me ask Stacy Vasquez...

DONNELLY: Perhaps he ought to read the actual statute.

AMANPOUR: ... private first class, former U.S. Army sergeant, rather, first class. Stacy, you had to lie in order to serve, and you were thrown out when you were outed.

VASQUEZ: Yes, I was. I actually joined the Army right after high school. And every generation of men in my family had served in some conflict, and their service inspired me to go into the Army.

While I was serving for 12 years, I was promoted seven times, I was inducted into the Sergeant Audie Murphy Club, and I was the top recruiter in the entire Army. I had the misfortune of being outed to my commander by a disgruntled wife.

And in my discharge paperwork that my commander wrote and signed, I'll actually read you a short excerpt, and it says that "Sergeant Vasquez's record is exceptional. She continues to demonstrate professionalism and dedication to all of the soldiers, and that should be emulated."

AMANPOUR: Was there any unit cohesion problems when you were -- when you were serving?

VASQUEZ: I'm fairly certain that the Army wouldn't have promoted me seven times and awarded me dozens of decorations if there was a problem with me and unit cohesion.

AMANPOUR: I want to ask General Clark in a second about leadership, but, first, I want to go to the issue of gays serving openly in some 35 or more countries around the world, including U.S. allies, countries like Britain...

(UNKNOWN): We talked about that.

AMANPOUR: ... which have stood with the United States and continue to do so. In England, it was in 2000 that the -- that the ban on homosexuals serving in the military was lifted, and it was actually done by the European Court of Human Rights.

Here's Jim Sciutto.


SCIUTTO (voice-over): Patrick Lyster-Todd was a lieutenant commander in the British Royal Navy and gay at a time when homosexuality was still a criminal offense, punishable by imprisonment.

LYSTER-TODD: For me, I evolved a Jekyll and Hyde existence.

SCIUTTO (on-screen): Still a difficult and fearful, it sounds like, existence?

LYSTER-TODD: It was difficult.

SCIUTTO (voice-over): Coming out or being outed meant dismissal. Mr. Todd chose to leave voluntarily in 1992.

Pressured by activist groups and dismissed servicemembers, the military explored integration. But in 1996, Homosexuality Policy Assessment Team report found deep hostility in the ranks: 91 percent believed homosexual behavior was offensive; 95 percent said integration would hurt service standards.

The report concluded, "There is a military risk from a policy change. We must," quote, "deal with the world as it is."

Admiral Alan West was convinced the military simply wasn't ready for them to serve openly.

WEST: I mean, I now find it amazing that back in the 1990s I could have thought that, hmm, this is probably too much to do and that I was willing to accept a status quo which was so wrong. And I was.

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