RYAN: I beg to differ. We do not have a normal recovery today. Just look at the jobs numbers we just got on Friday. And what we're saying is it's President Obama's failed leadership and flawed policies that are why we have such stagnant recovery.
And so what Mitt Romney and I are saying is if we get the right policies in place - that's what the Romney-Ryan five-point plan for a stronger middle class is all about -- these are good economic pro-growth policies -- that if we get those pro-growth policies in place, we think this economy can grow a lot faster than it's been growing.
STEPHANOPOULOS: But Moody's Economics says --
RYAN: If we get that growth, well get those 12 million jobs.
STEPHANOPOULOS: But Moody's Economics says that on the current path, the government's -- the country's on path to create 12 million new jobs.
RYAN: We've been growing under 2 percent, George. We are not on that kind of a path. We need to get on that kind of a path. We need to get on a faster growth path. And that's what I'm saying. Pro-growth economic policies, an energy policy that puts people to work, lowers gas prices; an education policy so workers can get good jobs in the 21st century; getting spending and the deficit under control, because that's hurting the economy; helping small businesses; building things, making things, growing things in America, selling them overseas with better trade. These are the things that have worked in the past. They're proven success stories. We want to reapply those policies to the times so we can get the kind of growth we need.
STEPHANOPOULOS: You and Governor Romney have argued that your tax cuts will be paid for by closing loopholes for the wealthy. But President Clinton took dead aim at that argument on Wednesday. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CLINTON: If they stay with this $5 trillion tax cut plan, they'll have to eliminate so many deductions, like the ones for home mortgages and charitable giving, that middle-class families will see their tax bills go up. Or, two, they'll have to cut all the programs that help to empower middle-class families and help poor kids.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
STEPHANOPOULOS: How do you make the math work without eliminating the big deductions that middle-class families rely on?
RYAN: Well, first of all, that -- those claims have been pretty discredited. There have been five different studies --
STEPHANOPOULOS: How have they been discredited?
RYAN: -- that show -- that this -- that this plan works. So the analysis you're citing wasn't even an analysis of the Romney plan.
But here's the point I am trying to make here, George. We think the secret to economic growth is lower tax rates for families and successful small businesses by plugging loopholes.
Now the question is, not necessarily what loopholes go, but who gets them. High-income earners use most of the loopholes. That means they can shelter their income from taxation. But if you take those loopholes, those tax shelters away from high-income earners, more of their income is subject to taxation. And that allows us to lower tax rates on everybody -- small businesses, families, economic growth.
Here's where the president wants to take the country. He wants to add a job-killing small-business tax increase on top of the current code, add even more loopholes and deductions to the code, more Washington picking winners and losers. That will crush jobs.