'This Week' Transcript: Holder and Giuliani


BECK: It's easy to follow the Constitution when you benefit from it or you're not affected by it. But what happens when you go against what you want to do, when you want to strap this guy down to the rack and make him talk, but you don't because it violates the Constitution? That's what makes this country different.


TAPPER: It's obviously not "Fox and Friends." It's his own show. But here we have Glenn Beck saying that there's nothing wrong with Mirandizing somebody like Shahzad, who's an American citizen. And you have not only Republican leaders, but Attorney General Eric Holder talking about changing the Miranda laws.

I never thought that I'd -- I'd see Glenn Beck as a beacon of reason when it comes to this specific issue, but what's going on here, Shelby?

STEELE: Well, I think people are genuinely confused about -- about this issue. I mean, I am. I hear -- I hear all sorts of -- you know, some people say you need -- you don't need -- doesn't really matter whether you Mirandize people or not, because they're going to be -- they're going to talk, and you want to befriend them, and you want them to give you information, and when they do give you that information, it may or not be held against them anyway.

So it's -- it's difficult to -- it's difficult to know what to -- which way to go on this. I think Glenn Beck is sort of taking the classic constitutional position and saying, let's -- let's make sure we do it the right way. This is what makes us unique as Americans, and so let's Mirandize people that we may suspect are terrorists.


PODESTA: Yes, well, you know, for all those people who want to, as Mayor Giuliani said, put him in -- into the military system, I think if you look back and see what's happened, Shahzad, Abdulmutallab, the Headley in Chicago, Zazi, they were all given their Miranda rights. They kept cooperating. They kept talking, as Shelby was indicating. They got actionable intelligence out of them.

If you look at the two cases under the Bush administration where U.S. citizens were declared enemy combatants...


TAPPER: Al-Marri and Jose Padilla, yes.

PODESTA: ... al-Marri and Jose Padilla, they were put into a military detention system, they didn't talk for years. Finally, you know, the cases ended up being resolved on the other side.

So I think the real question is, what works? And I think there's some indication that the path that the attorney general has proceeded down is working better than -- than -- than the alternative there's being suggested.

I think this idea of expanding the public safety exception is one that ought to be taken up by Congress and probably will be in short order.

TAPPER: Robin, what's wrong with the argument that this is a war that we're in and so we should treat these individuals as enemies of the state and treat them -- you know, Dr. Sam Mudd, who was accused of participating in the assassination of Abraham Lincoln, he went before a military tribunal. I mean, it's not like these things were just hatched up by George W. Bush. Why is it so crazy?

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