'This Week' Transcript 7-21-24: House Speaker Mike Johnson & Sen. Joe Manchin

A rush transcript of "This Week with George Stephanopoulos" airing on Sunday, July 21, 2024 on ABC News is below. This copy may not be in its final form, may be updated and may contain minor transcription errors. For previous show transcripts, visit the "This Week" transcript archive.

KARL (voice over): While Trump is riding high up in the polls, Biden is in Delaware, sidelined by Covid, and facing a growing rebellion in his own party.

SEN. PETER WELCH, (D) VERMONT: The current situation is unsustainable.

KARL (voice over): At the beginning of the week, 20 members of Congress had called for the president to step aside, including just one senator. As of this morning, there are now at least 38 Democrats in Congress calling for him to drop out, including four senators. And some of those who continue to back the president are doing so less firmly.

SEN. ELIZABETH WARREN, (D) MASSACHUSETTS: If President Biden decides to step back, we have Vice President Kamala Harris, who is ready to step up, to unite the party, to take on Donald Trump, and to win in November.

KARL (voice over): Privately, the pressure on Biden is even greater. As ABC News first reported, Senate Democratic Leader Chuck Schumer has urged him to drop out, warning that if he stays in he’s likely to lose and will hurt Democrats running for Congress.

Democrat sources say Hakeem Jeffries, the party’s leader in the House, has privately said essentially the same thing.

It’s not clear what would happen if Biden bows to pressure and drops out. Vice President Harris would be the most likely successor. But "The New York Times" reported Friday that former Speaker Nancy Pelosi told California Democrats this week that she would favor a competitive process among multiple candidates rather than the automatic anointment of Harris as Biden’s replacement.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KARL (on camera): Meanwhile, there are signs that the public pressure on Biden is about to get more intense. I am told that a significant number of Democratic-elected officials, people who have not gone public yet, are about to go public in a coordinated fashion to make the case that Biden needs to get out of the race. That is, unless he makes that decision for himself, and makes it soon.

Martha.

RADDATZ: Jon Karl, thanks.

I'm joined now by former Democrat and now Independent Senator Joe Manchin of West Virginia, who still caucuses with the Democrats.

Good morning, sir. Great to see you.

SEN. JOE MANCHIN, (I) WEST VIRGINIA: Good morning, Martha. Good to have – to be with you. And thank you for having me.

RADDATZ: You bet.

You have known the president a very long time.

MANCHIN: Yes.

RADDATZ: He swore you into the Senate in 2010. So, let me ask you directly, do you believe President Biden should step aside as the party's nominee?

MANCHIN: Martha, it’s with a heavy heart I've come to a decision, and it's something I reflected on the last three weeks. The first week after the debate, I thought the president needed time to evaluate and make a decision if he was going to at that time. And then I thought, well, we'd hear from my colleagues who are in very difficult, challenging areas of the country, whether it be in Congress, as far as their districts, or in the states, as far as my senators. And they're speaking out now. And then when you see the donor class basically speaking up and saying that, you know, they want a different direction, if you will.

So, with a heavy heart, I have said the president has the ability, the president, Joe Biden, a friend to all of us, who we've known for a long time, has the ability for the last five months of his presidency to do – be the president he always wanted to be, be able to unite the country, bring it back together, to be able to maybe spend all of his time on solving the problems in Gaza, bringing peace to Gaza and to the Middle East. Also being able to dedicate his time to enforcing, reinforcing Ukraine's ability to defend and win their freedom, and then be able to show the rest of the world the orderly transfer of power from the superpower of the world.

He will go down with a legacy unlike many people as one of the finest and – and truly a patriot American. So, with that, I come with a heavy heart to think the time has come for him to pass the torch to a new generation.

RADDATZ: Have you spoken with the president about this? Have you spoken to him recently? And have you personally witnessed any sort of age-related mental decline?

MANCHIN: I have not spoken to him in the last three weeks. I've spoken to him prior to that. I’ve spoken to his associates and people he works with. And it's come to the – you know, to the place to where Democrats like me, who is a lifelong Democrat, when you think of this, I'm a Democrat in the mold of a JFK asking not what your country can do for you, what you can do for your country. My little state of West Virginia was excited about John Kennedy. We all wanted to be involved. And I come from a – from a family who believed that we're fiscally responsible and socially compassionate. We wanted to give everybody a hand up. And we believe that government should be your partner and not your provider. So –

RADDATZ: Senator Manchin, let me ask you again, have you personally witnessed –

MANCHIN: I did not, no

RADDATZ: You've not personally witnessed –

MANCHIN: I've been –

RADDATZ: When you watch him on the campaign trail, what do you –

MANCHIN: It's – it’s – it’s concerning. It's concerning when you watch him. I'm concerned about the president's health and well-being. I really am. But when I've been talking to him, you know, I can tell when he's in a good mood. He'll say, hey, Joe, Joe, how's it going? And when he's upset with me, he'll say, Joe, what's up? So, we're still communicating the way we always have

RADDATZ: But you have watched him. And – and you just said you thought he should step aside as the nominee.

MANCHIN: I think a new generation – it’s time for a new generation to try to heal the party and heal the country.

RADDATZ: Aside from that, if – if you have seen a decline in mental acuity, why should he remain as president?

MANCHIN: Oh, I – I think he has that ability. I – you know, it's – it’s – the toll of a campaign is unbelievable. I can tell you on a statewide campaign it’s relentless. I can only imagine on a national campaign

RADDATZ: So you think he's fine being president no matter what?

MANCHIN: I think basically he can finish this job that he started and finish the way he wanted to lead.

RADDATZ: You've had -- you've had more than 35, very close to 40 Democratic lawmakers telling him to leave or saying you're not -- or you're not going to win. He is hunkering down. He is on the campaign trail this week.

How do you convince him of what you believe is the right thing to do if he hasn't yet?

MANCHIN: Martha, Joe Biden has made some difficult decisions in his life. Very, very challenging times. He's always been a patriot. He has 50 years of public service dedicated to this great country. And he has a stellar reputation.

We haven't always agreed, he and I've had --

RADDATZ: But what you are saying others have said as well is my point. And he says he is not leaving. So in the end, might you end up with a weakened candidate given what you're all saying?

MANCHIN: Well, that's -- he'll make that decision. No one can make the decision. I'm giving you my -- my thought process with a heavy heart that I would say this to my friend. It's time. It's just time to -- a new generation to come in that basically can start and let him do the job he intended to do to heal the country.

RADDATZ: If he does step down eventually, what would you like to see happen next?

MANCHIN: I think an --

RADDATZ: Particularly Kamala Harris?

MANCHIN: An open process. I truly believe the Democratic Party needs an open process. How do they get Democrats like me that left?

Think about this, Martha, 51 percent of people who are participating in registering to vote in elections are independents, 51 percent. Only 25 percent are registered Republicans, only 23 percent registered Democrats.

If you can't bring people like me back to the party or back to this enthusiasm to be involved and give us hope, then, what's the purpose? They're just going to keep playing to the -- to their base?

RADDATZ: Kamala Harris is the first woman, the first Black American to be elected as vice president.

MANCHIN: This is not about race and gender.

RADDATZ: I know it isn't. But if you are trying to replace her --

MANCHIN: I’m not trying to replace --

RADDATZ: If the party is --

MANCHIN: Let the process -- let the process -- what a healthy competition, is what it's all about. And that's why I believe it should be an open process.

RADDATZ: Do you think Kamala Harris could beat Donald Trump?

MANCHIN: The process will show that. It depends on -- are they going to be coming back? You can't be everybody's provider.

The government should be your partner. The government shouldn't be able to tell you everything you have to do and how you have to do it and accept everything they think is right. It's what you do. We make our own decisions.

I have said this. I'm fiscally responsible and socially compassionate. I will always be that and I don't look at the other side as my enemy. And I don't demonize the other side. I work with them.

Let me tell you, there's so much talent out there and think about this -- I've got two neighbors, Kentucky and Pennsylvania, with two governors who are operating in states as Democrats, the states are overwhelmingly, basically, their legislature is Republican or split down the middle.

They haven't demonized. They haven't divided their country. They brought people together. So you have Andy Beshear and Josh Shapiro.

A lot of good people out there I want to get behind and support whichever is able to adopt an all-inclusive proposition.

RADDATZ: Thanks so much for joining us this morning, Senator.

MANCHIN: Thank you for having me, Martha. Appreciate it.

RADDATZ: And now let’s bring in Congressman Ro Khanna of California.

I know you just heard what Senator Manchin said. You have been a steadfast supporter of President Biden staying in the race, but a list of fellow Democrats publicly calling for him to end his campaign is growing by the day, more than 35 now -- Senator Sherrod Brown, Congresswoman Zoe Lofgren of California, Congressman Adam Schiff. Donors are hesitating.

Does this make you rethink your position at all?

REP. RO KHANNA, BIDEN-HARRIS CAMPAIGN NATIONAL ADVISORY BOARD MEMBER & (D) CALIFORNIA: Martha, no.

Look, I'm in North Carolina campaigning for the Biden-Harris ticket.

One of the things we underestimate is that Joe Biden actually has a coalition. African American women, blue collar workers, seniors who voted for him. And if he feels bullied out, those voters are going to be -- feel that they were bullied out. So, it is his decision.

Second, I have tremendous respect for Senator Manchin. But you heard him say, he’s a fiscal conservative and social compassionate. And he wants a more moderate ticket. Well, you go run for president if you want that.

Joe Biden ran for the primary. He’s running on a working-class agenda, rent caps, expanding Social Security. You can’t just have someone, after the fact, engineer a ticket that may not be consistent with where the Democratic primary electorate is.

RADDATZ: Well, Congressman, I -- you mentioned the voters not wanting to feel bullied. Sixty-one percent of the voters in our national poll think he should step aside. And it’s higher among Democrats.

KHANNA: Martha, I've been that polling. Here’s the challenge, that polling was almost the same a year and a half ago. There is no question that voters don’t like the fact that Joe Biden is 81.

But here’s what I'm not seeing. I'm not seeing a head-to-head poll saying Joe Biden versus Chuck Schumer, versus Nancy Pelosi, versus who else, who do you want as the Democratic nominee. The president always says, don’t compare him to the almighty. We know that voters are concerned about his age.

What I haven’t seen is a poll showing that another candidate, other than perhaps Michelle Obama, would clearly be the choice of the Democratic electorate.

RADDATZ: But – but I also want you to listen to what the president himself told our George Stephanopoulos in his first post-debate interview.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE STEPHANOPOULOS, ABC NEWS ANCHOR: And if Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries and Nancy Pelosi come down and say, we’re worried that if you stay in the race we’re going to lose the House and the Senate, how will you respond?

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I would – I’d go into detail with them. They all said I should stay in the race. Stay in the race. No one said – none of the people said I should leave the race.

STEPHANOPOULOS: But if they do?

BIDEN: Well, it’s like – they’re not going to do that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RADDATZ: So, what Joe Biden laughed off has now happened. And it is, as we said, it isn’t just lawmakers, it is voters. So, would you reconsider at some point, if this swells, for Joe Biden to step aside?

KHANNA: This is the president’s decision. You know, I've read all these journalists saying Biden world is saying this or he’s reconsidering. There are about three, four people who actually have this decision. It’s the president. It’s his wife. It’s a couple of his close friends. And it’s his decision about what he wants to do. And I trust him. I trust his patriotism to – to make the – the right decision.

And he – there’s a process in this country. If you want to run for president, go get votes in New Hampshire, in South Carolina, in Nevada. Put forward your economic vision. But you can’t – and maybe we should have, in 2022, had an open primary and we shouldn’t sort of discourage people running against incumbents. And that’s a conversation the Democratic Party should have. But you can’t, two weeks before the vote, say, we’re not going to honor that – that process.

RADDATZ: He is going back out on the campaign trail. He is 81-years-old, just recovering from Covid. We’re told he has been exhausted.

Is this really the right thing to do? You know what that split screen is going to show with the Republicans already as – with Donald Trump, with his fist in the air, and Joe Biden walking very slowly up the steps of Air Force One last week.

KHANNA: Here’s what I know. I know that the last thing that the president of the United States, Joe Biden, wants is to have Donald Trump become president. I know that the last thing people around him, like Jen O’Malley Dillon, who worked for President Obama, Ron Klain want is to hand the keys to Donald Trump. And I'm confident that if they didn’t think that they could win, and that the president could campaign, he would make the right decision.

I mean Nancy Pelosi was out here in North Carolina with me. She’s incredible. She’s 84. So, aging is different for different people. And that’s a personal decision that he has earned the right to make. Not because he’s president of the United States, but because he won the primary and had 14 million votes. And, really, it is his decision to make. And even the people calling on him to step aside acknowledge that it is his decision.

RADDATZ: Do you think those who are calling him to step – calling on him to step aside are, in effect, weakening the candidate if he does stay?

KHANNA: I don’t – look, I don’t believe that. I believe in a robust democracy. I think the – if the president of the United States can’t handle criticism from a few members of Congress or senators, then he doesn’t – he shouldn’t be president.

You remember Donald Trump ran against the whole party in 2016. You have to have an iron will to be president of the United States. And you have to be willing to have – believe in your visions, believe in the voters. And I think what Joe Biden is saying is, he brought factories back to America, 150 billion of manufacturing investment, compared to 70 billion under Donald Trump’s terms. He knows how to reindustrialize this country. He is saying he knows how to bring rents down. He is saying he knows how to have a bold vision for the working class in expanding Social Security. And he has that right vision. And he believes that vision is going to win. That’s the only reason to run for president or not, do you have the right vision for the right moment for the country.

RADDATZ: I – I just want to ask you, if he does decide to step aside, would you like to see an open convention?

KHANNA: Martha, I think it’s moot. I mean if he made that decision – I mean, the vote is on August 7th. I believe that the vice president would win that vote. I don’t think you’re going to see many people challenge her. I mean these are Biden-Harris delegates. It’s not an open primary. I think if it were an open primary, there should be many candidates.

But the idea that, in two weeks, someone not on the national stage is going to be able to put together a majority of Biden and Harrises delegates, I just think, is unrealistic.

RADDATZ: OK, thanks very much for joining us this morning, Congressman. We appreciate it.

Coming up, what's next for the Trump-Vance ticket following the GOP convention? And what will Republicans do if Biden steps aside?

I'll ask House Speaker Mike Johnson. We're back in two minutes.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MIKE JOHNSON, SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE & (R) LOUISIANA: We're watching the principles of faith, family and freedom that once defined our nation now being trampled underfoot by the radical left. As President Trump raised his fist and gave a rally cry on Saturday, now is our time to fight. And we will.

(APPLAUSE)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RADDATZ: House Speaker Mike Johnson at the Republican National Convention this week. And Speaker Johnson joins me now live.

Welcome to "This Week," Mr. Speaker. Former President Trump said he was going to use his acceptance speech to come together, to promote unity. And you echoed that, saying, "Treat one another with dignity and respect," and that "the discourse should not be personal or targeting people."

But after, truly, his emotional and very compelling first part of his speech, he turned to grievances. And I want you to take a listen to him last night at his rally.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT & 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well, I call her "laughing Kamala."

(LAUGHTER)

TRUMP: You ever watch her laugh? She's crazy.

She's nuts. She's not as crazy as Nancy Pelosi, crazy Nancy.

(LAUGHTER)

TRUMP: These are Biden indictments. These are a sick, weak, pathetic man who can't run an election, so he indicts his opponent, thinking that's going to win.

This stupid president that we have, stupid. He's a stupid person.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RADDATZ: Has he missed an opportunity to promote unity?

JOHNSON: No, he hasn’t. Look, there's campaign rhetoric on both sides. There has been. Remember, it was less than a week and a half ago that President Biden said we ought to -- we ought to put Donald Trump in the cross-hairs, effectively, "put him in the center of the bullseye," he said.

Now, he retracted that statement, and President Trump has said some things about unity that President Biden has said. But we are in the midst of a heated campaign, and it's beyond dispute that President Trump has been the most attacked and maligned public figure in the history of the country...

(CROSSTALK)

RADDATZ: But you yourself said that the discourse...

(CROSSTALK)

RADDATZ: ... should not be personal or targeting people. Have you just changed your mind? Is this now the campaign you want?

JOHNSON: No, look, I -- I articulate things in a certain way and Donald Trump does as well. But -- but his grievances, as you said, are because he has been the subject of so many attacks. He was speaking there in that clip about the lawfare that he's had to endure. I mean, they have turned the justice system against him because he's a political opponent of the sitting president. I mean, these are objective facts.

Some of these cases are being dismissed now, but they dragged he and his family through hell, literally, for years now. They tried to impeach him. They tried to attack him in every way. They now have turned the justice system against him.

So, I mean, I think the American people understand his frustration and I think -- I think he is echoing what many of them feel. Look at the size of the rallies. I mean, they have long waiting lines outside the perimeter of these events, because people long to hear his message. They want change --

(CROSSTALK)

RADDATZ: They -- Mr. Speaker, first of all, I will dispute. Those aren’t necessarily objective facts that you are saying.

But I want to turn to what is happening with President Biden. As of this morning, it does not look like he is going anywhere. But if he does step down, you said this week the Republicans are likely to bring legal challenges against any attempts to replace Biden on a Democratic ticket.

How would that work?

JOHNSON: Well, these elections are handled at the state level. Every state has its own system and in some of these, it’s not possible to simply just switch out a candidate who has been chosen through the democratic, small D, democratic process over such a long period of time. Fourteen million Democrats voted to make Joe Biden the nominee.

So, it would be wrong and I think unlawful in accordance to some of these state rules for a handful of people to go in the backroom and switch it out because they’re -- they don’t like the candidate any longer. That’s not how this is supposed to work.

So, I think they would run into some legal impediments in at least a few of these jurisdictions and I think they’ll be a compelling case to be made that that shouldn’t happen, and so I think they got legal trouble if that’s their -- if that’s their intention and that’s their plan. So, we’ll how it plays out. We don’t know.

I know the Democrats are in total disarray and I know the Republican Party is united like never before. So, we’re looking forward to November in this election cycle. It’s going to be an interesting time for the American people.

RADDATZ: One election law expert Rick Hasen said there’s no credence to that notion that since Biden isn’t the party nominee yet, but we’ll see how all that plays out.

Our most recent poll shows a huge majority, 61 percent wanting Joe Biden to step down. But our polls have also showed that the race is still a dead heat nationally between registered voters, 46 percent to 46 percent. What do you make of that?

JOHNSON: Well, look, we can -- I can cite to you a number of polls who say the opposite, that it looks like it’s -- you know, Donald Trump may be headed for a landslide. Now, don’t take my word for it, take a word of some of the top leading Democrats in -- and elected Democrats around the country who are in panic mode. That’s the headlines that we’ve been reading for weeks and I think that’s true.

I can tell you many in my colleagues on Capitol Hill, Democrats who are friends who are friends and colleagues, have lots of handwringing over this right now. They don’t know what to do and they don’t have a viable plan B.

They -- many of them don’t believe that Kamala Harris is a viable candidate at the top either. And they’re running out of time. So, it’ll be interesting to see what happens.

From our perspective, Martha, it doesn’t matter who they put at the top of the ticket. If Kamala is the nominee, so be it. She is the co-author and the co-owner of the policies of the Biden administration and she owns all these policy failures herself.

So, we look forward to a vigorous debate about those policies and about the two competing visions for America and I think the American people will side with the Republican Party. That’s what the demographic moves are showing. There -- there’s a record number of Hispanic and Latino voters, a record number of Black and African-American voters coming into the Republican Party. The Jewish community is more energized that I’ve ever seen, a segment of a population, because they feel like Joe Biden and the Democrats have abandoned Israel and in so many ways they have.

So, you see all these factors playing out across the country. And I mean, I’m traveling nonstop around the nation. That’s what we’re seeing on the ground.

So, polls are polls, but I think everybody senses something’s happening here.

RADDATZ: Mr. Speaker, I think you answered part of my next question already. But how would the GOP approach this race given different way if the nominee does end up being Vice President Kamala Harris?

JOHNSON: Well, you know, the interesting thing about this dynamic, whether it’s Biden or Harris is that both of these persons have held office. We had a Trump administration. We had a Biden-Harris administration, and people can compare the two.

That -- put the campaign rhetoric aside, how are you and your family doing after the first two years of the Trump administration, for example, and the first few (ph) years of the Biden administration? I mean, it’s -- it’s no contest. And everybody knows that, and I think that’s why we’re in such good position.

I think this election should not be about personalities but about policies. People understand, as Obama said many years ago, elections really do have consequences. They don’t like --

(CROSSTALK)

RADDATZ: President Trump was attacking her personally, as you know, last night. He wasn’t really talking about her policies. He was talking about her laugh. He was saying she was crazy.

JOHNSON: She -- we could run the tape of the terrible things that Kamala Harris has said about Donald Trump, of course, and Biden as well, and everybody in the Democrat leadership. I mean, this is -- it’s -- we’re accustomed to it now. It’s their standard practice.

But what we're -- what President Trump is trying to do on that campaign trail is prosecute (ph) the case to put forward his ideas and his vision as he did in that lengthy speech at the RNC. He has a lot to say because he has a lot of ideas. They're so many areas of public policy that must be addressed --

(CROSSTALK)

RADDATZ: Let me -- let me stop on one idea, sir. Mr. Speaker -- Ukraine. He says he could end that war in one day. How could he do that?

JOHNSON: Well, look, I have a lot of confidence in President Trump being able to end that conflict because he will project strength. We maintain peace through strength. We have not had that in the three and a half years of the Biden Administration. It's been exactly the opposite.

And that is why our adversaries are acting so provocatively as --

(CROSSTALK)

RADDATZ: OK. But peace through strength, that -- that may be what you believe in, but how could he end that war in one day?

JOHNSON: President Trump has the ability to pick up the phone call and make threats and demands of adversaries around the world that they pay attention to, because they fear him in some ways. There's real value in that.

I mean, look, think of it, what -- he said it in his speech, Russia did not invade Ukraine during his administration. We did not have the conflict in Israel, the war in Israel as we have, because Iran has been empowered under Biden. We did not have China acting so provocatively, as they are right now, around the world.

We've got hot wars around the globe. Our adversaries are nervous. We had the NATO Summit, you know, two weeks ago in Washington, and I met with foreign leaders, heads of state from around the globe that are our adversaries, and they are deeply concerned about the instability that America is projecting on the world stage because of Joe Biden and his weak leadership. This can't deepen (ph) --

(CROSSTALK)

RADDATZ: Mr. Speaker, I want --

(CROSSTALK)

JOHNSON: -- any longer. President Trump will do the opposite.

RADDATZ: I want to -- I want to get quickly to this as a -- as a quick question. We're learning more about the details, really startling details about the assassination attempt. There are reports that the Trump campaign asked for more protection, not at that particular rally perhaps, but over the last couple of years, and the Secret Service said basically that was true.

Do you think Kimberly Cheatle should resign immediately? Or that President Biden should fire her?

JOHNSON: Both. I called on her to resign over the weekend, and when it became apparent that she wouldn't, I think, on Friday, then I called for President Biden to fire her. The buck should stop at his desk.

We absolutely must ensure accountability so the American people can trust that this job will be done, that we will protect our presidents and former presidents. It's the number one job of the Secret Service, not anything else.

RADDATZ: OK.

JOHNSON: And I think Director Cheatle has shown the world and said that she has different priorities. She needs to go.

RADDATZ: OK. Thank you so much for joining us this morning, Mr. Speaker. We appreciate it.

Coming up, we're on the trail in the critical battleground states of Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania to hear from voters on where this race stands.

We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

RADDATZ: Up next, they're the three states that could very well decide this election. So, we traveled to Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania to ask voters what may shape their vote in November. ABC’s Terry Moran has that report when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

RADDATZ: The critical battleground states of Pennsylvania, Michigan, and Wisconsin were repeatedly mentioned from the GOP convention stage this past week in Milwaukee. They are three states that Joe Biden has to hold onto if he has any chance of winning re-election. But he's currently trailing in the latest polls.

So, as the Republican Convention wrapped, ABC’s Terry Moran hit the campaign trail to talk to voters in those key rust belt states to hear what's driving their vote.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TERRY MORAN, ABC NEWS SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): In Milwaukee this week thousands of Republicans united around former President Donald Trump as the party’s official nominee. But winning the White House will mean shoring up support from skeptical voters in this state, like Eric Sams.

ERIC SAMS, WISCONSIN VOTER: I watched the convention nightly with my wife. And every night I go to bed thinking, all right, I'm confident. I think I'm going to vote Trump. Vote Trump. And then I wake up in the morning and – and I'm just like, oh, but it's so difficult.

MORAN (voice over): Sams voted for Trump back in 2016, helping him win Wisconsin by a razor-thin margin.

SAMS: I like many things that Trump did. I just don't like the way he did it. His, you know, his character comes into play. His – his interactions and the bullying, I, you know, the names, the name-calling.

MORAN (voice over): Sams supported Nikki Haley in the state's primary, even though she had already dropped out by then. Like many Americans, he's frustrated with the choices in this election.

MORAN: Are you leaning one way or another? If the election were today, how would you go?

SAMS: I’d – I’d have to do Trump.

MORAN: Not happy about it, though?

SAMS: No, not happy at all.

MORAN (voice over): Milwaukee resident Heidi Janzen says she noticed a shift in tone from the Republican Party at the convention this week.

HEIDI JANZEN, WISCONSIN VOTER: I think the tone is a much nicer tone, I think, probably because of the assassination attempt.

MORAN: But that tone changed when Trump took the podium.

JANZEN: What I fear, and what I know will happen, is that that will all ramp up again. And one thing I really dislike about Trump is how he really plays on people's fears.

MORAN: Across Lake Michigan, at a brewery in Dearborn, a suburb of Detroit, we met Darren Proctor and his son Jack. The duo love to talk politics with each other, but neither is enthusiastic about November.

DARREN PROCTOR, MICHIGAN VOTER: I find myself really frustrated. You know, the fact that we have these as our choices, I think that, you know, we deserve better than this.

JACK PROCTOR, MICHIGAN VOTER: I feel that we should be passing the torch to younger generations.

MORAN: Darren's frustration comes from the last two elections.

D. PROCTOR: You know, in 2016, you know, I wasn't going to vote for Hillary Clinton. It just wasn't going to happen. So Trump was my protest vote; 2020, I wasn't voting for Trump that time. So Biden was my protest vote.

MORAN: The 50-year-old retiree doesn't think Biden is up for another term, and he wants to see the party nominate someone else.

D. PROCTOR: They have to unify. And if they can't unify in the next month, you know, they're going to be their own worst enemy, when it comes to that.

MORAN: He and Jack are open to Democratic alternatives, but no matter what, they won't be backing Trump, pointing to his speech at the convention.

J. PROCTOR: He proved again that he's still Donald Trump and he's still going to, you know, pull out the punches, kind of, like, from his old TV days.

MORAN: Dearborn Heights resident Kristina agrees. She can't get behind the former president, and she's not thrilled about Biden, but she worries about finding a new nominee.

KRISTINA, MICHIGAN VOTER: We have Biden now. I think it's too late to change. I think it will look sloppy and just disorganized if we change now.

MORAN: While she likes Vice President Kamala Harris, Kristina worries some voters won't.

KRISTINA: My concern is, if they switch to a woman now, it's a little late. And I'm afraid old-school voters are not going to be comfortable with that.

MORAN: Over in the battleground state of Pennsylvania, we visited Pittsburgh, a blue dot in a sea of red in that part of the state. And we met Darryl Brown there.

DARRYL BROWN, PENNSYLVANIA VOTER: If I have to pick, I'm picking Trump, because Biden's too...

MORAN: Old?

BROWN: Yeah.

(LAUGHTER)

BROWN: You said it, not me.

MORAN: But that's not the only reason Brown supports Trump and not Biden.

BROWN: He's too up and down. It's -- it's not even consistent. And economy-wise, I think the economy was better when Trump was in.

MORAN: Bethany Sunseri hasn't decided who she'll vote for, but she knows what's driving her vote.

So as the mother of young children, what are the -- what are the big issues for you?

BETHANY SUNSERI, PENNSYLVANIA VOTER: I think it's more about, like, civil rights being protected, and just ensuring that my children have choice in what happens to and for them.

MORAN: And so, when you look at -- at the choice you have, you're not happy?

SUNSERI: Not at all, no.

MORAN: Joanne Strugalski and ? are best friends with opposite politics.

JOANNE STRUGALSKI, PENNSYLVANIA VOTER: I'm a Republican. She's a Democrat.

TRICIA LARKIN, PENNSYLVANIA VOTER: But we have a lot of the same views.

STRUGALSKI: But we are best -- we are best friends.

LARKIN: Yeah.

STRUGALSKI: So what does it -- it doesn't matter. I mean...

LARKIN: And we have a lot of the same concerns.

STRUGALSKI: We do. We have a lot of the same concerns. We both -- we both love our country.

LARKIN: Yeah.

STRUGALSKI: We both want things to be a -- a certain way. We, maybe, have different ways of getting there, right?

MORAN: Larkin, a Republican, isn't set on voting for Trump.

LARKIN: I really want the border to be closed. And I think that any president can do that. I don't think that you have to be Democrat or Republican to do that, but you need to do it. It needs to be a priority.

MORAN: Two miles down the road in Pittsburgh's Lawrenceville neighborhood, we met Ivan Gil-Silva at his small business, Mi Empanada. He says he's struggled to stay afloat with inflation.

IVAN GIL-SILVA, PENNSYLVANIA VOTER: It became very difficult to keep up with -- it was, like, when do I raise my price? At what point, do I have to change it? I don't want to raise my prices yet. Is it going to go down? You know, do we stop selling chicken because it's too expensive?

MORAN: An Argentinian immigrant and a first-time voter this year, Gil-Silva says he's open to any candidate besides Joe Biden.

Who are you going to vote for?

GIL-SILVA: I am going to vote for -- you know, right now, it looks like it's going to be a Republican vote. I'm not -- I'm not voting for Trump. I'm voting for my interests. But if they put a candidate on the other -- if they were to put RFK as the Democratic, you know, nominee, I would probably vote for him.

MORAN: So if the Democrats come forward with somebody, you'll take a look?

GIL-SILVA: I have to. That's the whole point. You listen to both parties, see what they're offering, and what they're going to provide.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

RADDATZ: And we've got many months to come. Our thanks to Terry for that. And he joins our powerhouse roundtable, when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

RADDATZ: The Powerhouse Roundtable is all here, ready to dive into another very busy week of politics. Former DNC Chair, Donna Brazile; Former Trump Justice Department Spokesperson and "Dispatch" Senior Editor, Sarah Isgur; Politico Playbook Co-Author, Rachael Bade; and ABC News Senior National Correspondent, Terry Moran.

And Terry, and let's start with you. We just saw that interesting voter piece. You were at the Convention all week, mostly down on the floor. What's your takeaway from the week?

MORAN: Well, what you hear from voters is what you hear in all our conversations, right? And it's unprompted. It's what comes out naturally. You don't have to fish for it. Biden is too old. Trump is still Trump, and that's a problem for a lot of people. Immigration and inflation have shaken people's confidence in Biden's leadership, and abortion is still a huge issue.

And one more thing, it did feel talking to people like the fever is breaking a little bit. The people don't really want to be once again, caught by the worst people in their social media feed, you know? They don't want a national divorce. They just would like some pragmatic improvement in the country's leadership, and that was encouraging.

RADDATZ: And speaking, Rachael, of the nation's mood or what they wanted, I found at the Convention that the people there really did want to hear that message of unity. We heard it for about 20 minutes from Donald Trump --

(LAUGH)

RADDATZ: -- and then as our Linsey Davis said, it quickly went from grace to grievance.

RACHAEL BADE, POLITICO PLAYBOOK CO-AUTHOR & ABC NEWS CONTRIBUTING POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yeah. I mean, look, I think the former president certainly lost the moment at the Convention during his speech. I think, you know, a lot of the speeches leading up to that were very effective. I think the fact that Republicans decided to feature everyday Americans who have lost family members due to overdoses, fentanyl, crime, being --

(CROSSTALK)

RADDATZ: very moving.

BADE: -- very moving. But I think following the shooting, Republican Party talking about unity, they wanted to sort of build this moment up for Trump, and he very quickly, you know, lost the moment on that. So I don't know that it hurt him, but he really had a chance to reach out to those swing voters who are undecided, and I'm not sure he did that.

RADDATZ: Sarah, what do you think? It was -- seemed spontaneous that he went off prompter. We were following his speech and then, suddenly, he was over here and over here, and then the rally last night. It's back to the old Trump.

SARAH ISGUR, THE DISPATCH SENIOR EDITOR & FORMER TRUMP JUSTICE DEPARTMENT SPOKESPERSON & ABC NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Absolutely.