Jan. 6 hearing told Trump knew plan to pressure Pence was illegal, went ahead anyway

Trump White House attorney John Eastman, at the center of the alleged scheme to send a false slate of electors to Congress and have Pence refuse to certify votes, based his reasoning on a theory the committee argued he never believed.

According to the committee, Eastman sought to take advantage of an ambiguity in the Electoral Count Act and claim the vice president could has the constitutional authority to reject electoral votes outright and use his capacity as presiding officer to suspend the proceedings.

"He described for me what he thought the ambiguity was in the statute. And he was walking through it at that time. And I said, 'Hold on a second, I don't understand you're saying,'" said former Trump White House attorney Eric Herschmann in taped testimony.

Showing past documents, the committee said that Eastman had dismissed the same power he later claimed Pence could have used.

"In this letter, an idea was proposed that the vice president could determine which electors to count -- but the person writing in blue negates that argument," said Rep. Pete Aguilar. "Judge Luttig, does it surprise you that the author of those comments in blue, are in fact, John Eastman?

Former federal judge Michael Luttig responded "yes" and called it "constitutional mischief."

The committee aired several clips featuring Trump, Rudy Giuliani, Jason Miller, Steve Bannon and others publicly pressuring Pence to refuse the Electoral College votes that were in favor of Joe Biden.

“I hope Mike Pence comes through for us,” Trump said in one video from his rally at the Ellipse on Jan. 6, 2021. “He’s a great guy. If he doesn't come through, I won’t like him quite as much.”

Marc Short, Pence’s former chief of staff, told the committee in previously recorded testimony that Pence directly conveyed his view to Trump “many times” that he didn’t have the authority to do what they were asking of him.

“He'd been consistent in conveying his position to the president?” the committee asked Short.

“Very consistent,” Short replied.

Greg Jacob, a former adviser to Pence, said they analyzed history and constitutional text to map out the vice president’s role when it came to certifying elections.

The two then examined “every single electoral vote count that had happened in Congress” since the country’s founding, Jacob testified. They found no vice president ever claimed to have the kind of authority Trump and his attorney John Eastman claimed Pence had.

“The history was absolutely decisive and again, part of my discussion with Mr. Eastman was, ‘If you were right, don't you think Al Gore might have liked to have known in 2000 that he had authority to just declare himself president of the United States? Did you think that the Democrat lawyers just didn't think of this very obvious quirk that he could use to do that?'”

Trump and Pence haven't spoken to one another since last summer, according to sources familiar with their conversations.

Pence defended Trump through a slate of controversies during their administration. But, as the House committee is highlighting at its hearings, Pence drew a line at Trump's alleged plot to overturn the election -- breaking from the president and drawing the rage of the Trump mob on Jan. 6.

When ABC News Chief Washington Correspondent Jonathan Karl interviewed Trump for his book "Betrayal," Karl asked about the "Hang Mike Pence" chants and whether Trump had been concerned for the safety of the man he chose to be his vice president.

“Well, the people were very angry,” Trump said.

“They said, ‘hang Mike Pence,’” Karl told Trump.

“It’s common sense, Jon. It’s common sense that you’re supposed to protect,” Trump said. “How can you, if you know a vote is fraudulent, right, how can you pass on a fraudulent vote to Congress?”

While Pence himself isn't testifying and has not sat before the committee, a range of former Pence aides cooperated with the investigation.

Since his term ended, Pence has publicly reiterated he had no power to overturn the 2020 results. But like other conservatives, he has said "election integrity" should be a national priority.

-ABC News' Katherine Faulders