'This Week' Transcript 8-11-24: Republican Vice Presidential Nominee JD Vance, Sen. Amy Klobuchar and Charlamagne tha God

A rush transcript of "This Week with George Stephanopoulos" airing on Sunday, August 11, 2024 on ABC News is below. This copy may not be in its final form, may be updated and may contain minor transcription errors. For previous show transcripts, visit the "This Week" transcript archive.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANNOUNCER: THIS WEEK WITH GEORGE STEPHANOPOULOS starts right now.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JONATHAN KARL, ABC "THIS WEEK" CO-ANCHOR: Campaign sprint.

DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We're going to have the greatest election victory.

KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE U.S. (D) AND U.S. PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We have the momentum, and I know exactly what we are up against.

KARL: Less than three months to Election Day. Republican Vice Presidential Nominee J.D. Vance ramps up attacks on his new opponents.

J.D. VANCE (R-OH), VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Kamala Harris has bent the knee to the far left of her party.

KARL: This morning we go one-on-one.

VANCE: The Kamala Harris campaign has – has frankly distorted what I said.

KARL: How’s that distorting what – I just read your words. How’s that distort what you said?

In the tightening battle for the White House.

I mean are you guys still the front-runners here?

Plus, reaction from our powerhouse roundtable.

Battleground blitz.

HARRIS: With Tim Walz by my side, let us fight for the promise of our future.

KARL: Vice President Kamala Harris debuts her running mate, rallying voters in critical swing states.

GOV. TIM WALZ (D-MN), VICE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: We aren't going back. We aren't going back.

KARL: Will her bet on Minnesota's progressive governor pay off? We'll ask the state senator, Amy Klobuchar.

And –

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD. ‘THE BREAKFAST CLUB' CO-HOST & AUTHOR, 'GET HONEST OR DIE LYING': I don't think it's a honeymoon phase. I just think people haven't been energized in the Democratic Party in a long time.

KARL: Charlamagne Tha God on Harris, Trump, and the brand-new presidential race.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: From ABC News it’s THIS WEEK. Here now, Jonathan Karl.

KARL: Good morning. Welcome to THIS WEEK.

What a difference a few weeks makes. Before President Biden dropped out of the presidential race, that was three weeks ago today, Democrats were discouraged, Republicans were on a roll, and it looked like Donald Trump was well on his way to winning back the White House.

Now, a new "New York Times"/Siena poll of the battleground states likely to determine who will win shows that the Kamala Harris-Tim Walz ticket has the momentum, leading Trump-Vance by four points among likely voters in Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin. That's a dramatic change after what "The Times" is calling the worst three weeks of Donald Trump's 2024 campaign.

After a rough start as Trump's running mate, J.D. Vance is now leading the Republican effort to define the Harris-Walz ticket and to regain the momentum. I caught up with him this weekend at his home state of Ohio. We started with the state of the race.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KARL: Thank you for joining us, Senator Vance.

So –

SEN. J.D. VANCE (R-OH), VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Thanks for being here.

KARL: I saw Kamala Harris said that she's the underdog in this race. Is that the way you see it? I mean are you guys still the – the front-runners here?

VANCE: Look, I think that we are going to have a very tight election, Jon, and that we just have to sprint to the finish line. We have about 88 days to actually persuade the American people that President Trump should be their president and be their vice president, and I think you just take nothing for granted. You don’t believe any polls. Whether the ones that are good for you or bad for you. You just try to persuade people as much as you can and the chips are going to fall where they are.

KARL: But Trump seems to think that he's got a huge lead. I mean he just said it at the press conference. He suggested it could be a landslide looking at polls. Do you tell him that you need to kind of like temper expectations here?

VANCE: Look, I – I think President Trump is extremely confident. Look, I'm extremely confident. I think we're going to win. I also think that we have to work as hard as possible for the remainder of the election to try to persuade Americans to vote for us. That's the name of the game.

But yes, look, do I think President Trump is actually as confident as he pretends to be in public? Yes, he actually is.

KARL: Yes.

VANCE: But we still have to work very hard.

KARL: So, there's been a lot of talk about racism and whatnot. You faced some really nasty stuff. I saw this thing that Nick Fuentes – of course, he's an avowed white supremacist – he said, “What kind of a man marries somebody named Usha? Clearly, he doesn’t value his racial identity, his heritage.”

I mean this is racist garbage.

VANCE: Yes, it is.

KARL: But this is also a guy that dined with Donald Trump at Mar-a-Lago during this campaign.

VANCE: Well, and Donald Trump doesn't know anything about and frankly doesn't care for. But, yes, look, my – my attitude to these people attacking my wife is, she's beautiful, she's smart. What kind of man marries Usha? A very smart man and a very lucky man, importantly.

KARL: Yes. Yes.

VANCE: And – and my view is, look, if these guys want to attack me or attack my views, my policy views, my personality, come after me, but don't attack my wife. She's out of your league.

KARL: But what – I mean how – that dinner that Trump had – and, of course, it was Kanye West, the guy that's praised Hitler, who arranged it all. That – that was back a year and a half ago, and Trump still hasn't given a full-throated denouncement of this guy who is – he said that terrible stuff, but he said – I mean he's a white supremacist.

VANCE: Look, I think he’s – he – President Trump has issued plenty of condemnations on this. The one thing that I like –

KARL: But not of Fuentes. Yes.

VANCE: The one – the one thing I like about Donald Trump, Jon, is that he actually will talk to anybody. But just because you talk to somebody doesn't mean you endorse their views. And look, I mean Donald Trump spent a lot of quality time with my wife. Every time he sees her, he gives her a hug, tells her she's beautiful, and jokes around with her a little bit.

I'm not at all worried about Donald Trump. I'm worried sometimes about these ridiculous attacks. But again, this is what you sign up for when you come into politics. I wish people would keep it focused on me. But, whatever. They’re going to say what they’re going to stay. My wife’s tough enough to handle it and that's a good thing.

KARL: All right, let’s focus on something that's gotten a lot of attention. I mean, you know, this cat ladies comment.

VANCE: Sure.

KARL: You talk about the Democrat Party dominated by childless cat ladies. Put that aside.

You also made a policy proposal –

VANCE: Yes.

KARL: Which was why Tucker Carlson had you on for that interview. And you said, you advocated giving extra votes to people with children, which seems a little – I mean –

VANCE: Well, Jon, it's – it’s not a policy proposal. It's a thought experiment, right? Democrats said we should give children the right to vote. Some Democrats had said we're going to give children did right to vote. And I said, well, if we're going to give the rights to the children, then we should actually just allow the parents to cast those votes, right? I trust a parent more with a decision like that than I do say a 14-year-old. So, it's a thought experiment.

There are, though, policy positions behind my view that the country should become more pro-family, right? One – one thing I – I learned as a dad is, after a second home – after our second child we brought home – we have three little kids – we got these ridiculous surprise medical billings from the hospital because we had chosen an out of network provider, of course, at this most stressful of all imaginable moments.

KARL: Yes.

VANCE: I've actually introduced legislation to stop moms and dads from having to go through those surprise medical billings. We want to expand the child tax credit. There's so much that we want to do, Jon, to make the country more pro-family.

And I think it is – is, frankly, shameful that the Harris administration has lied about what I actually said. Look, sometimes family doesn't work out for people, and that's OK.

KARL: So – so –

VANCE: But I do think that Kamala Harris herself has pursued some anti-family policies, and that is a problem. It’s something we ought to push back against.

KARL: So, I – put aside whatever other people – I mean I listened to your entire speech.

VANCE: Please.

KARL: I listened to the whole thing. And, you know, I saw – and you did say you weren't talking about people who physically can't have children. I mean that's not what you were saying.

VANCE: Well, and sometimes it just doesn't work out, right?

KARL: And – and that didn’t work out. You did say that.

VANCE: Yes.

KARL: You called it throat-clearing, I think. You said, you know, I – look, I'm not talking about that. But you did say –

VANCE: Well, because I knew people would try to misrepresent it. So, it’s important to be clear.

KARL: But – but let's look at – let’s look at what you exactly say.

VANCE: Please.

KARL: You said, “When you go to the polls in this country, as a parent you should have more power. You should have more of an ability to speak your voice in the democratic republic than people who don't have kids.” I mean you are directly saying that people with kids should have more of a voice in our democracy.

VANCE: But –

KARL: Thought experiment or not about how that is done, but that is the principle. And you – and – I mean, I could read on. But – but you are expressing a principle here.

VANCE: Again, Jon, it's a thought experiment. I’ve been a senator for two years. Have I proposed any legislation to the effect? Of course, not. Sometimes people make remarks in response to something that somebody else has said. If it was a policy proposal, I would have made the policy proposal in my two years in the United States Senate.

Now, I do think, Jon, to be clear here, because I think it’s important to focus on what I actually said. I do think becoming a parent affects you in a very profound way. I've seen friends of mine, certainly in my own life, becoming a father does really give you this incredible perspective. You have this little life that you have to take care of. It's an amazing thing.

KARL: Sure.

VANCE: And it does make you think differently about your responsibilities.

So – so, yes, I absolutely do think that being a parent changes you in a profound way. I do not think that we ought to be changing the way that we do votes in this country. I was responding to a Democratic proposal in a very, very thought experiment way.

KARL: And – and you predicted that you would get attacked.

VANCE: I did. Sure.

KARL: You said, “I'm sure (INAUDIBLE) at "The Washington Post" will come out and say, well, doesn't this mean non-parents don't have as much of a voice as parents? Doesn't it mean that parents get a bigger say in how our democracy functions? Yes, absolutely.”

So, do you regret saying that? Do you take that back?

VANCE: Look, Jon, again, I'm talking about a thought experiment here. And do I regret saying it? I regret that the media and the Kamala Harris campaign has – has, frankly, distorted what I said. I'm trying to make –

KARL: How’s that distorting – I just read your words. How’s that distorting what you said?

VANCE: Because they have turned this into a policy proposal that I never made, Jon. I said I want us to be more pro-family. And I do want us to be more pro-family. And I do think, look, when you’re a parent and you have children, you obviously have a different perspective. And that's – and I said that too. And I certainly believe that. But I think that the idea, Jon, that I actually want to change the American voting system to give 12-year-olds the right to vote and then give control over to their parents, it's ridiculous. I never said that. I was responding to a Democratic line.

KARL: OK. I mean, it was a speech on the – anyway. We’ll – we’ll – people – the speech is online. People can watch the whole thing.

VANCE: Please, but – but – but in the – in the beginning, Jon, I say, Democrats have proposed giving these rights to children. I say, if we're going to give them to children, let the parents cast that vote.

KARL: So I want to ask you about abortion. There's this proposed amendment that's going to be on the ballot in Florida that basically codifies a constitutional right -- state constitutional right to have an abortion up to about 24 weeks. I assume this is something you oppose.

VANCE: Well, what I believe -- and I’m running to be the vice president of the United States -- is that the American people have to make this decision and President Trump has said explicitly they're going to make this decision on a state-by-state level.

He won the nomination of our party. He's determined what the platform is and I think that he's doing something that's actually very, very important, which is to try to help the country find some common ground.

Look, California is going to have a less restrictive abortion policy than Ohio, where we're sitting. Ohio's going to have a less restrictive abortion policy than Alabama. I think the people have to make these decisions and that's the way for us to come together as a country over a very tough issue.

KARL: But -- but this should be -- I assume this is an easy one for you. I mean, you've been very clear about how you feel about abortion. I mean, if you -- you compared it to slavery.

VANCE: I didn't compare it to slavery, Jon.

(CROSSTALK)

KARL: Well, the impact on the society to slavery, yes.

VANCE: But ask the question -- go ahead.

KARL: Yes.

So I mean just again this -- the idea of codifying whatever the state codifying a right to abortion up to about 24 weeks, isn't that something you oppose?

VANCE: Well, look, in Ohio, we had a referendum in the state and I --

KARL: And you made your position clear.

VANCE: And I aggressively advocated for the pro-life view because I want to save as many babies as possible.

Also importantly, Jon, the people of Ohio decided by about a 60/40 margin to reject the pro-life framing and you have to respect the will of the people.

That's all that Donald Trump has said. That's what I believe and as someone who really does want to say, Jon, I do want us to become a more pro-family country. I want us to have more babies and more families. I want our neighborhoods to be filled with the laughter of children and thriving families.

We and the pro-life community I think have to figure out how to better make our case to the American people and how to make it easier to have a baby. It's way too expensive. Housing is through the roof. Medical costs are through the roof.

President Trump and I have actually advanced a series of policies that would make it easier for us to have families I think that's where we're focused on as a presidential ticket and as the president has said, on abortion policy specifically, the states are going to make up their minds.

KARL: And Donald Trump's going to have a chance to vote on that and he says he's going to offer his position didn't say what it was. Would you be disappointed if Donald Trump says that he supports a constitutional right to abortion?

VANCE: I’ll let Donald Trump offer his position and I’ll -- I’ll talk about it then.

KARL: What would you encourage him to do on that though? I mean, this is a pretty fundamental idea for you. I mean --

VANCE: Jon, what --

KARL: -- you’ve been such a leader in the pro-life movement.

VANCE: What I would encourage him to do is to do what he's done up to this point which is to try to find some common ground here and try to advance some pro-family policy so that people feel like they have more options, right?

A lot of the reason that women choose to terminate a pregnancy is very often they don't feel like they have any other choice. We want to give them more options to choose, to have that baby, to make it easier to raise that baby.

I think Donald Trump has shown real leadership by focusing on that and not on the culture war topic of what each individual state's abortion policy should be.

KARL: All right. You've said that Donald Trump is the greatest president of your lifetime.

VANCE: He is.

KARL: Who in your mind is the greatest vice president of your lifetime?

(LAUGHTER)

VANCE: It's a good question. I haven't thought much about that.

I think George W. Bush -- excuse me, George H.W. Bush did a very good job as vice president. You could pick a number of guys who have done a perfect job but the president really sets the tone for policy, and I think a lot more about the president than about the vice president.

And fundamentally, my role in the administration is to support him enact the -- in enacting the agenda. That's what I’m going to work on.

KARL: Trump was asked recently very directly, would you be ready to be president on day one? (INAUDIBLE)

VANCE: Sure.

KARL: And it was notable that he didn't answer the question. Instead, what he said is the vice presidential candidate doesn't matter.

I mean, what did you make when you -- when you heard him not answer that directly?

VANCE: Well, he said that a million times both in private and in public.

KARL: He said --

(CROSSTALK)

KARL: -- are you ready?

VANCE: Most people -- oh, come on, Jon. Most -- he's right.

Most people, 99 percent of the country, they don't vote on who the vice presidential nominee. They're voting for Donald Trump or for Kamala Harris, not for J.D. or Tim Walz, right?

But what I think that he does believe because he made it the main focus of his vetting process is, do I think this person can be president on day one if God forbid something happens? Yes.

So I absolutely am sure that Donald Trump is confident in my abilities. I also think that he's right that the politics of this really don't matter that much.

KARL: One of the proposals in the platform, you've talked about it, Trump's talked about it is a mass deportation. Now, I know you’ve said, he said, you'll start with the easy ones, the criminals, people commit crimes, deport them.

But he said deporting 15 to 20 million people. How do you actually do that?

VANCE: Well, Jon, we have to start with the fact that we have a wide open southern border because our border czar actually set a lot of open border policies. They suspended --

KARL: You know she's not actually -- she wasn't the border czar.

VANCE: Oh, that was what the media called her.

KARL: I know, but --

VANCE: She assumed the title. She had control over a lot of our border policy at a time when they were suspending –

KARL: Well, it was the – the root cause of the migration (INAUDIBLE) –

VANCE: Look, let me tell you this, Jon. The time there was spending deportations.

KARL: Yes.

VANCE: They stopped Donald Trump's remain in Mexico policy. And they reinstituted catch and release. They basically threw open the gates of our country, and now we have a ton of fentanyl, a ton of people suffering and a ton of Americans –

KARL: But how are you going to get 10 to 15 to 20 million people out of the country?

VANCE: Well, the first thing you have to do is to stop the bleeding. Stop the open border. Get Kamala Harris out of there and actually reimplement the remain in Mexico policy, rebuild or finish Donald Trump's border wall. And you do that and you stop the bleeding.

Now, you’re right, once you do that, one you stop Kamala Harris' open border policies, you’ve got to do something with the people who are already here. And I think that you take a sequential approach to it. You are going to have to deport some people. If you’re not willing to deport a lot of people, you’re not willing to have a border when there are 20 illegal aliens in our country.

KARL: But 10 to 15 million people, this is, like, I mean –

VANCE: Well, Jon, I think that's the wrong attitude to take of it. OK, So they’re – so they’re – so they’re –

KARL: I mean are you going to knock on doors and ask people for their payers? I mean what do you do?

VANCE: Well, again, but I – let me (INAUDIBLE). I think there’s a wrong – this is the wrong attitude towards it, right? There's 20 million people here illegally. You start with what's achievable. You do that. And then you go onto what's achievable from there.

I think that if you deport a lot of violent criminals and, frankly, if you make it harder to hire illegal labor, which undercuts the wages of American workers, I think you go a lot of the way to solving the illegal immigration problem.

But look, President Trump is absolutely right, you cannot have a border unless you're willing to deport some people. I think it's interesting that people focus on, well, how do you deport 18 million people? Let's start with 1 million. That's where Kamala Harris has failed. And then we can go from there.

KARL: And finally, before you go, we commit to this race to kind of sticking to the facts. I mean I heard Donald Trump give this speech in Montana he just gave. And he said that Tim Walz has signed a letter letting the state kidnap children to change their gender, allowing pedophiles to claim – you know, I mean, to be exempt from crimes. I mean this is not true. It's not remotely true.

VANCE: Well, what President Trump said, and I haven't watched the whole rally. What President –

KARL: What he said was not true.

VANCE: What President Trump said, John, is that Tim Walz has supported taking children from their parents if the parents don't consent to gender resignment. That is crazy. And, by the way, Tim Walz gets on his high horse about mind your own damn business. One way of minding your own damn business, Jon, is to not try to take any children away from me if I have different moral views than you.

KARL: He has not signed a law allowing the state to kidnap children to change their identity.

VANCE: They have – how would you – what I just explained to you, I would describe as kidnapping, Jon. He has absolutely done this stuff.

KARL: That's crazy.

VANCE: It’s not crazy. Jon, come on. You should not –

KARL: It’s not what he signed.

VANCE: You should not be able to take people’s children away from them if you dis –

KARL: And that's not what he’s proposed.

VANCE: If you disagree with decisions about gender reassignment. Yes, he has proposed that, Jon. He absolutely has.

Now, here’s the – here’s the more important thing, Jon. Why aren’t – why aren’t we talking about inflation? Why aren't we talking about the fact that groceries are unaffordable thanks to Kamala Harris' policies, and so is housing? We've talked a little bit about the border. Why aren't we talking about the fact that the entire world is on fire because of Kamala Harris' foreign policy? She's just asleep at the wheel.

We have a set of plans. You talk about sticking to the facts. Donald Trump and I have a set of plans to lower the cost of housing and food.

KARL: We should stick to the facts (ph).

VANCE: To bring peace back to the world with American leadership. That is all that we want to do. And I think it's telling that the Harris administration is focused so much on these side issues instead of on the real substance, why Americans are – are unhappy with Kamala Harris’ leadership.

KARL: We're – to be clear, I just asked you about something that Donald Trump brought up, not something that the Harris campaign brought up. I was asking about Donald Trump’s words.

VANCE: No, I'm saying that –

KARL: But thank you – thank you –

VANCE: Fair. But the Harris – but, Jon, the Harris campaign, what are their policy views? They don't have a policy position on their website. Should she sit down and answer tough questions with you?

KARL: Yes. Absolutely.

VANCE: I think she should. Where is she?

KARL: Well, I – we – we – we –

VANCE: But we respect the American people enough –

KARL: We hope she'll be on the show soon.

Thank you.

VANCE: I hope so too, Jon, because the person who wants to be our president ought to sit down for some tough interview. I'm willing to do it. And I wish she would too.

KARL: All right, J.D. Vance, thank you for your time. Really appreciate it.

VANCE: Thanks, Jon. Appreciate it, man.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KARL: Our thanks to Senator Vance.

Coming up, he said the 2024 race would come down to a contest between the cowards, the crooks, and the couch. So, what does radio show host Charlamagne Tha God think of the race now that Vice President Harris is on top of the Democratic ticket? We'll have that conversation when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD, 'THE BREAKFAST CLUB' CO-HOST & AUTHOR, 'GET HONEST OR DIE LYING': Don't debate Donald Trump. Donald Trump is going to run circles around him and make him look insane...

(LAUGHTER)

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: ... to all of America. Donald Trump is going to make him look old and frail. You know why? Because Donald Trump is an entertainer.

KARL: Yeah.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: Joe Biden is -- he's really about business. He's a politician. He's actually in there doing the work.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KARL: That was 'The Breakfast Club' co-host Charlamagne Tha God, when we spoke with him back in February. He was certainly right about what would happen if Biden debated Donald Trump. Six months later, we talked to him about the state of the race now, how Kamala Harris can win and how she could lose.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KARL: I think it was exactly six months ago when we sat down, or just about six months ago, and you said there was no "main character energy" with Biden; nobody was inspired by the Democratic ticket. What about now?

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: Oh, there's definitely a lot of "main character energy" on the Democratic ticket. I mean, that's always been my frustration, you know, from the beginning, right? Because we know who the vice president is. We know who Kamala Harris is, like, she has super "main character energy."

KARL: And I think you -- you said the race was between the crooks, the cowards and the couch.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: Yeah.

KARL: And you were -- the couch, meaning apathy, was going to...

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: Yeah.

KARL: ... had the lead. What about now?

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: I think there's less apathy. But, you know, if I'm the Democrats, I'm not spiking the football yet. The job is not done, you know? You still have to bring this thing home in November.

I think that there's a lot of energy. People keep calling this "the honeymoon phase." I don't think it's a honeymoon phase. I just think people haven't been energized in the Democratic Party in a long time. I think a lot of voters, you know, if you're not a Democrat, if you're an independent, you know, or an undecided person, you haven't been this -- you haven't been energized for something in a long time.

The last time we felt energy in a campaign was 2008, when President Barack Obama first ran. This feels like, whoa, there's, like, real energy. You want to be involved in...

(CROSSTALK)

KARL: I mean, that crowd we saw -- that crowd we saw in Michigan...

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: Absolutely.

KARL: ... this was something else.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: And look at all the new registered voters.

KARL: Yeah.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: Like, when people are energized enough to say, "Hey, I want to go out and register to vote and be a part of this process," that's when you know you've got real energy.

KARL: She had protesters out in Michigan.

PROTESTERS: (Inaudible).

KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE U.S. & DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: You know what? If you want Donald Trump to win, then say that. Otherwise, I'm speaking.

(APPLAUSE)

KARL: What did you make of the way she shut them down?

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: I've seen that before. She shut me down like that.

(LAUGHTER)

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: We've seen it on TV. When I had my -- my talk show on Comedy Central, she shut me down like that.

So who's the real president of this country? Is it Joe Manchin or Joe Biden, Madam Vice President?

HARRIS: Come on, Charlamagne.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: I really...

HARRIS: Come on, it's Joe Biden.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: I can't...

HARRIS: No, no, no, no. no. No, no, no, no, it's Joe Biden. And don't start talking like a Republican about asking whether or not he's president.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: And that's how she shuts you down behind the scenes as well, if you're having a conversation. It's not a shutdown. It's just, like, "Listen, respect me. I'm the most powerful woman in the world. I want you to listen to me."

KARL: So you said something when we spoke six months ago. You said Biden should not -- "No, don't debate. Whatever you do, do not debate Donald Trump.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: Was I right?

(LAUGHTER)

KARL: Did he -- well, what do you -- you said that -- you said that Trump would make him look old and frail.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: Yeah, I don't know why people didn't see this coming. That was the other frustrating thing. I'm glad that, you know, they have a lot of energy in the party now, but they could have done this a year ago. And they could have avoided all of the backlash they're receiving now with people saying, "Oh. there was no primary. The people didn't decide this, this was a coup that the party -- that the party threw, that the party did. It's like, oh, you could have avoided this a year ago because we all saw this way back when.

KARL: Nobody stood up to run against him. I mean, Dean Phillips, but no -- no major national figure on the Democratic side even hinted about challenging him.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: Well, they should have been having those back room conversations with him a year ago.

KARL: Yeah.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: Actually, they should have been having them four years ago. They should be like, hey, you're a transitional president, you're here for, you know, a good time, not a long time and we are going to set up the future of the Democratic Party.

Because they got -- they got a fantastic bench, you know? Whether it's the vice president, you know, who's currently running, whether it's Governor Josh Shapiro, whether it's Gretchen Whitmer, whether it's Wes Moore, you know, whether it's Secretary Buttigieg, they got a great bench.

KARL: What do you think of the Tim Walz pick? You didn't mention his name just then.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: I didn't know him.

KARL: Yeah.

(LAUGHTER)

KARL: Most of America didn’t know him.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: Yeah, I just found out about him over the last couple of weeks.

At first, I was a little bit disappointed like I knew she -- we knew she needed a DEI higher, right? We know she that she needed --

KARL: So Tim Walz is the DEI higher on this ticket?

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: Absolutely. We know --

KARL: Diversity, equity, inclusion.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: She needed a white male to make America comfortable. It is what it is. No need for us to, you know, act crazy about it. You know what it is.

KARL: You -- you've known Kamala Harris for a while, you know her pretty well. What are her politics? Because they're trying to portray her as a, you know, far-left, the squad, all that.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: No, no, she's very -- she's very moderate. You know the thing that I like about her and her messaging is very clear even though she doesn't have it up on her website yet, but the messaging is very clear.

You know, she wants to rebuild the middle class. You know, she wants to give everybody an opportunity to start a business, she wants to give everybody an opportunity to be a homeowner, you know, she's a leader on mental health, right?

Like when she launched her first mental health plan when she ran for president, I was with her, you know, in South Carolina. And those are the things that American people care about.

KARL: Does she need to show distance between herself and Biden or some different --

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: Absolutely.

KARL: So how did she do that?

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: By talking about what she's going to do for the next four years. Like I know that you know, they want to keep her paired to you know the successes that they had while she was vice president, and that's cool. You know, to harp on a couple of those because a lot of those things, you know, were her idea like, you know, the cap on -- the $35 cap on the insulin, things like that.

KARL: Yeah.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: So that's good to say, hey, I was the person behind that. But you still got to tell America what you're going to do for the next four years, because like I said, the job's not finished. Like this isn't no slam dunk victory, like there's still people who have to be, you know, incentivized to get up off the couch, like votes are earned, not given.

KARL: You wrote about her in your book. You said, when I endorsed her in 2020, it was because of my private conversations with her, not because of the persona she presents to the public. The vice president needs to talk to the world the way she talks to me.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: That's right.

KARL: So what is that like? What -- what's different?

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: I mean I think we've seen it the last couple weeks. We just -- you just -- you just brought up, you know, what she said to the protesters. That's just -- that's the real her.

And I think a lot of times you know in politics, man, especially when you -- a woman of color, they don't want to be perceived as the angry Black woman.

But I mean, look, we got a lot to be angry about right now, like we really do, and I think that people see that and they see passion because that's what it is. So I -- I think over the last, you know, few weeks, in the -- in the press, we've actually seen the real her.

And she does need to do more interviews, I’m not going --

KARL: Yeah, how about -- she hasn't done -- she hasn't done an interview yet.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: Or a press conference.

KARL: She hasn’t done a press conference yet.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: Yeah.

KARL: So I mean, why is that? I mean, I -- you know, she's new to the -- to the job, but it's striking that we really haven't seen her answer questions yet.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: I really don't know. I mean, it's the bottom of the ninth inning, right? Like I feel like she should be any and everywhere, you know, having these conversations.

I don't -- I truly don't know why she hasn't, you know, done any interviews yet because that's the only reason Donald Trump is still, you know, sucking the -- sucking the air out of the headlines, because he keeps headlines going, like he's everywhere.

You saw him at the National Association for Black Journalists Convention. You saw him on with Adin Ross. He's going to be on with Elon Musk. He's always calling into conservative talk radio.

Which is one of my biggest issues with the Democratic Party, they don't use -- you know, the -- they don't use the media that supports them the way that the right uses the media that supports them. Like, you know, sort of the last four years, you know, she's had plenty of platforms that she can be going on, from radio to podcast, right, that actually support her, and you know support Democrats.

But they haven't been doing that.

KARL: What did you make of the way she responded to his comments about her just turning black?

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: I don't even think that she should have responded. I don't think she should have dignified that with a response.

KARL: But she didn't directly respond. She just basically said a version of there he goes again.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: And that's true. Yeah, there -- there he goes being racist again, you know? That this we seen this, you know, play from Donald Trump before.

We saw it with the birtherism with President Obama, like this is the card that he plays. And I mean, at this point, it's like, you know, we don't know that trick already?

KARL: Yeah.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: Like, why is the media being distracted by the things that he's saying? We need to stop making those things headlines and make both these candidates, the vice president and Donald Trump, focus on the issues because people are out here hurting, man.

KARL: So bottom line, how does Harris win this election and how does she lose it?

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: How does Harris win this election? She wins this election by constantly going out there and talking about the issues, you know, don't get distracted by all of the racist insults that are going to come your way, the sexist insults that will come your way. You got to go out there and really engage people. You have to go out there and really shake hands and kiss babies.

You have to go places that people normally don't go. There's new voters turning 18 every day. So, you have to find a way to go out there and engage them. So, I think she should use a lot of new media. Yes, she should sit with people like you, Jon, of course.

KARL: Yeah.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: I do think she should go to Fox News, but she should be going on these podcasts and she should be talking to these TikTokers who are already supporting her, right? She should be doing things like that. Engage this new audience because right now, you got all of this energy. She's never been this viral, she's never been all over social media in a good way like she is now.

So now that you got those people's attention, go out there and talk to them and tell them what your future looks like, because those kids are the future. That's how you win this election. And how does she lose --

KARL: How does she lose?

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: How does she lose it? She loses it because if all of Donald Trump's cronies around the country refuse to certify the results of the election and she loses it if Donald Trump, you know, challenges the results of the election in the supreme court, which is no longer a legitimate institution. They are completely corrupt. If he challenged it and go to the Supreme Court, and the Supreme Court overturned the results of the election.

KARL: And I would just say, he tried everything and he was president of the United States, so he had power to try everything, and he failed, and the Supreme Court told him, no way.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: I just feel like they're more emboldened now, but what I would say is that, you know, Democrats only (inaudible) -- they always have the largest voter turnout in history, right?

KARL: Do you think we'll see that? The largest voter turnout?

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: I don't think they had a chance in hell of getting that with President Biden. I think they have great chance of getting that with Vice President Kamala Harris.

KARL: All right.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: But she got to go out there and earn it.

KARL: All right, thanks to Charlamagne. Coming up, Democratic Senator Amy Klobuchar. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. TIM WALZ, (D-MN) VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I'm sure it's true here in Nevada, as it’s true in Minnesota. We respect our neighbors' rights to make their own personal choices.

We don't have to agree with them or make the same choice, but we know that this nation, things work best when you mind your own damn business. You mind your own damn business.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KARL: Democratic Vice Presidential Candidate Tim Walz last night on the trail in Nevada.

I'm joined now by his state's senior senator, Amy Klobuchar.

Senator Klobuchar, thank you for being here.

I want to start –

SEN. AMY KLOBUCHAR, (D) Minnesota: Thank you, Jonathan.

KARL: And I want to start with something that's just out a few minutes ago. An interview with President Biden where he was asked about his decision to get out of the race. And he said this. He said, "What happened was a number of my Democratic colleagues in the House and Senate thought I was going to hurt them in the races." Well, you're a Democrat in the Senate. Were you worried that if Biden stayed in the race, he was going to hurt Senate candidates?

KLOBUCHAR: I think what President Biden did, and he made that decision himself. I – I haven't heard this interview. I assume he's just explaining what led one of the many reasons he made that decision.

He made the honorable decision. He took the honorable path. And, for me, I am not looking in the rear-view mirror about who said what and who hurt whose feelings. For me this is about as Kamala Harris has said over and over again, this is about moving forward, and not going backwards.

And to get a bigger picture view of this, she has ignited the country, starting in Philadelphia, to the heartlands of Wisconsin, to that jam-packed rally in Arizona with 15,000-plus people. People are interested in moving forward and they respect President Biden. I love Joe Biden, but we are moving forward as a party and as a nation. And Tim Walz and Kamala Harris are bringing America with them like we've never seen before.

KARL: So – so looking forward, the Republicans, Trump and – and Vance and others, are trying to define Kamala Harris' radical left, ultraliberal. What – what is your sense? What – how does she need to answer those attacks to appeal to independent voters, not just the base of the party but independent voters and to disaffected Republicans who don't like Trump?

KLOBUCHAR: Kamala Harris is voice of the future. But when you look at what she's done in our life, she was a prosecutor, running the biggest attorney general's office in the United States of America. She put people behind bars. She went after murderers and rapists. So, they can try to paint her whatever way they want, but that was her north star for many, many years.

She then comes to the Senate. We all know what she did there. You know, cross-examining those very Supreme Court justices who Donald Trump said he was proud to put on the court. And he says he's proudly responsible for overturning Roe v. Wade.

I cannot wait for that debate on ABC on September 10th where you're going to have, on one side, a prosecutor, and on the other side, someone with over 100 felony indictments and 34 felony convictions.

So, they can say what they want, but I think the facts are going to speak for themselves. And certainly, the way she's generated excitement, because of the fact that she keeps her high, the Charlamagne Tha God was just explaining, keeps her head high and just lets all of that – whatever they’re going to – names they’re going to call her and things they’re going to do, she’s going to throw it right back at him. They go after him on – her on coconut trees. Now you see coconut tree memes. You – you – they are – she is not going to let this get to her. And nor is Tim Walz, who was a fantastic choice for vice president.

KARL: OK, so there's something else Charlamagne said, and actually something that J.D. Vance said. It was one of the few things where they absolutely agreed on, is, you know, Kamala Harris has yet to hold a press conference. She's been in this now 21 days. She has yet to do a single interview. Why is that, and is that going to change?

KLOBUCHAR: Twenty-one days, Jonathan.

KARL: Three weeks.

KLOBUCHAR: She started running for president. Be – no, let me –

KARL: Yes, OK. Go ahead.

KLOBUCHAR: Before that she did tons of interviews. She's done interviews with you. She's done interviews. I'm sure she's going to do interviews. Just last night in Nevada she talked to the press.

I was reading about some of her answers like she is going to talk to the press. And I think that debate itself, which Donald Trump had backed out on, he backed down, now he's back firmly committed, at his press conference.

To me, that is going to be a premier moment where you're going to see these very different visions for the country and very different people. And the people of this country, if you look at what's happening with the momentum and the polls and what's happening in swing states like Wisconsin, with the numbers changing, what's happening in Michigan, what's happening in Pennsylvania, it is incredible.

The people of this country, independents, moderate Republicans, as well as, of course, Democrats, are saying, "Wait a minute, I don't want to go back to this world of Donald Trump; I want to move forward and get someone that's going to work on things that matter to me and not just matter to himself."

KARL: So...

KLOBUCHAR: They want to hear proposals for childcare and housing and bringing down costs, and they know very well that there's been one team, and that's the Biden-Harris team, that has actually done something on pharmaceuticals, put in a $35 insulin per month, done something when it comes to...

KARL: So...

KLOBUCHAR: ... bringing down drug costs by passing my bill that allows Medicare to negotiate.

KARL: So let -- let me ask you about Governor Walz. He's faced some pretty harsh criticism from Republicans about what he has said about his record in the National Guard. And just Friday we heard -- late Friday, the Harris campaign acknowledged that he misspoke when he said that he had carried weapons of war in war. He didn't serve in war.

Why -- why did it -- what do you make of that, and why didn't they just come out right away and say that, look, he misspoke? I mean, that -- that story lingered for several days.

KLOBUCHAR: Let's talk about Tim Walz. Like many rural kids from small towns, he signed up for the National Guard when he was 17 years old, and stayed with it for 24 years, being activated and sent to Europe, but also serving at home with tornadoes and hurricanes and, you know, forest fires. That's what the National Guard does.

KARL: It's -- it's -- it's honorable service.

KLOBUCHAR: And that's why they're loved in states.

KARL: Yes, it's -- it's honorable service, but...

KLOBUCHAR: Let me get to what...

KARL: Yeah.

KLOBUCHAR: Could I -- I'll get to your question. I was just going to get there. And he did carry weapons. He did train just hundreds and hundreds of soldiers on how to use those weapons in war. And he made very clear that he himself was not sent into combat. That was a decision of what was going on with his unit. But, in fact, he carried, he trained -- and I would also add he won these sharp-shooting contests in Congress when he was in Congress.

KARL: But can...

KLOBUCHAR: He is an avid hunter, fisherman. I don't think anyone should question the fact that Tim Walz owns a gun...

KARL: He knows...

KLOBUCHAR: ... and used a gun and knows how to use it.

KARL: We're almost out of time, but can you clarify, when he made the decision to retire, did he know that his unit was very likely to be sent to Iraq?

KLOBUCHAR: I think he made the decision that he was going to run for Congress, and that was his decision. He served four years longer than he would have had to serve to retire in the Guard.

KARL: But did he know?

KLOBUCHAR: I just refuse -- I respect J.D. Vance's four years of service as a Marine very much, but I also respect Tim Walz's service. And whether he -- I -- I don't know all the facts on this, but what I do know is that he made a decision to run for Congress and became head of the Veterans Affairs Committee in the House, one of the top 10 House members for being bipartisan, worked on veterans...

KARL: All right.

KLOBUCHAR: ... worked on mental health issues for veterans, and served our country honorably.

KARL: Senator Klobuchar...

KLOBUCHAR: He stepped down simply because he made a decision to run. That's why he stepped down, and it is completely acceptable. So thank you.

KARL: Senator Klobuchar, thank you very much for your time this morning.The roundtable is up next. We are back in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, (R) FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES AND PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I've spoken to the biggest crowds. Nobody has spoken to crowds bigger than me. If you look at Martin Luther King when he did his speech, his great speech, and you look at ours, same real estate, same everything, same number of people, if not, we had more. And they said he had a million people, but I had 25,000 people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KARL: Donald Trump clearly has crowd size on his mind. This week, bizarrely claiming that more people witnessed his speech on January 6th than Martin Luther King's 'I have a dream' speech. We've got the Roundtable here to get into that and much more when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KARL: The powerhouse roundtable is here, former DNC chair Donna Brazile, former Trump Justice Department spokesperson and senior editor of 'The Dispatch" Sarah Isgur and Washington Post congressional reporter Marianna Sotomayor.

So, Donna, I want to ask you about something that just came in last night. We saw a big speech in Nevada by Kamala Harris, and she came out for no tax on tips. Where have I heard that before?

DONNA BRAZILE, FORMER DNC CHAIR & ABC NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Well, look, I'm...

KARL: It's, like, one of the few policy specifics that Donald Trump has offered.

BRAZILE: And she also gave more details, I think, on how to make that a reality. Look, Vice President Harris has been the Democratic nominee for less than a week. She's had a three-week campaign where she's introduced herself to the American people as -- as the presidential nominee of the Democratic Party. She introduced her vice presidential running mate, who's a great, pragmatic guy. And, you know, next week she's going to start laying out her policies, as we enter the convention in Chicago.

This is a dynamic campaign. She's closed the gap. She's still the underdog. But the momentum right now is clearly on the Democratic Party side.

KARL: So, Sarah, I want to ask you about something that The Wall Street Journal had to say. The Wall Street Journal editorial page, generally a conservative editorial page, had this to say about the state of the Trump campaign.

"Mr. Trump seems to still think he's leading the polls against a feeble incumbent. That overconfidence -- that overconfidence led him to choose Mr. Vance, who hasn't reassured voters on the fence about Mr. Trump. The former president doesn't seem to realize he's now in a close race that requires discipline and a consistent message to prevail."

So are we going to see some discipline and a consistent message out of Donald Trump?

(LAUGHTER)

SARAH ISGUR, THE DISPATCH SENIOR EDITOR & FORMER TRUMP JUSTICE DEPARTMENT & ABC NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Any day now.

(LAUGHTER)

Any day now, it will come.

You know, I thought Charlamagne Tha God actually, kind of, summarized this well. Donald Trump was actually a very good pick for Republicans when they were running against Joe Biden, that "main character energy." Unfortunately, the race has changed dramatically. You need a candidate with message discipline.

The fact that both campaigns, at this point, picked vice presidents that had -- really were base picks, that nobody's been going after that independent, moderate vote that's actually going to decide states like Pennsylvania is, sort of, stunning, I think. And yet you also have both sides, as their policies merge, Republicans have flipped on abortion. Democrats have flipped on crime and immigration, and yet both sides telling their base that, if their opponents win, the country will end; this is an existential threat. It's a really odd dynamic that we're seeing emerge.

KARL: One thing that struck me, Marianna, is a new ad from the Harris campaign on the border, portraying her as the one who has the strength to deal with the border.

MARIANNA SOTOMAYOR, WASHINGTON POST CONGRESSIONAL REPORTER: Yeah, and yesterday, when she was in Nevada, also talked about the fact that, when she was attorney general, she was really tough on the border.

KARL: Attorney general of a border state, it says, yes.

SOTOMAYOR: Exactly, of California.

And she even mentioned, you know, "I spent so much time at the border. I was in those tunnels trying to figure out, with Border Patrol, the same Border Patrol that, just a couple years ago, when she was running in that 2020 primary, she was saying, we should defund ICE.

KARL: Yeah.

SOTOMAYOR: So...

KARL: So it going to -- I mean, does that work? I mean, this is -- the border's not the shining example of success of the last four years.

SOTOMAYOR: Right, and I mean, here's the thing. I think that she is definitely going to have to answer things that she said publicly, right, when she was running in a crowded primary, where she was leaning more left. And we did see she was, kind of, uncomfortable trying to figure out, or at least state her positions.

We do see a more confident Kamala Harris really going and saying, "This is the position that I am holding now," but, again, there's still this flashback to a couple years ago that she is going to have to answer to.

ISGUR: And not taking questions yet on any of those. I'm sure she will at some point.

BRAZILE: Well, she's taken questions in gaggles.

But, look, it takes time...

(CROSSTALK)

ISGUR: ... on the debate, not when did you change your mind on all of your policy positions?

BRAZILE: She's introduced herself on one radio show, one TV show, one talk show, when there are millions of Americans who are tuning in now....

KARL: We've got an extra seat right here, Donna.

(LAUGHTER)

BRAZILE: They're watching -- they're watching C-SPAN. They are listening to her. Look, this is a moment, and she has to define herself. There's no question. She has a record, a record as a United States senator, a record as an attorney general...

ISGUR: It's a very left record, and she's...

(CROSSTALK)

ISGUR: ... changed.

BRAZILE: No, it's not. It's not always left. And, by the way, we're not going to get boxed in with these old metaphors or these old labels of right versus left. She has to tell the American people this is who she is and what she envisions for the country. She's not going to get boxed in.

Look, what I've loved about the last three weeks -- it's been tough, but what I've enjoyed about it, I've enjoyed seeing young people say, "I'm ready to vote," young people, "I'm tuning in," young people -- they're going to help determine this race over the next 86 days.

KARL: It is interesting she has changed her positions on some very key -- I mean, just take immigration. She was for basically decriminalizing coming into the country undocumented. She was -- you know, suggested she would favor defunding ICE. Now, she's talking like a tough prosecutor. Was she positioning herself too far to the left in 2020? Is that was what was going to?

BRAZILE: Well, I think she was representing the views and values of the constituents.

ISGUR: Wait a second.

BRAZILE: I also think that as vice president of the United States, she has taken positions to the center on many of these issues, whether it's immigration. When you take a look at where she is today on lowering costs for prescription medicine, she hasn't changed. Look, there's a consistency in Kamala Harris' record that everyone should take a look at before they start finger pointing and saying she is the left or she is this. She's clearly in the center with the American people on lowering inflation and getting the job done.

ISGUR: Then she should answer some questions about that.

BRAZILE: -- on healthcare. She will. She will.

KARL: So Marianna, you've talked quite a bit about this choice of Tim Walz, and what's interesting is he's known as the progressive governor of Minnesota. But he was actually a moderate from a conservative district in Congress. He's had a similar voyage. Maybe in a different direction.

SOTOMAYOR: Yeah. Similar transition one could say, which is -- makes it interesting to try and figure out who these Democratic candidates are, and what policies they want to be. But listen, I mean, it is very hard to get Democrats on the same page on anything, especially when you're debating policy, and you've had so many Congressional Democrats from the far left to the most moderate saying, he's the guy. And also, we really like what he has done in Minnesota as governor.

KARL: You know, when I saw that -- the first event in Philadelphia, where Josh Shapiro spoke before Walz and Harris came out, Josh Shapiro looked like a guy that was running for president. Tim Walz looked like a guy that was very much the running mate. Was that dynamic a key reason why Walz was chosen over Shapiro?

SOTOMAYOR: Yeah. I mean, we reported, and I know all of us have talked about how Harris really wanted a loyal partner, someone that she could get along with. But beyond that, everyone is always talking about, you know, who's going to be the next Democratic candidate to come in the next couple of years. I think there was a little bit of Shapiro --

KARL: It was about Shapiro?

SOTOMAYOR: Yeah. It could have been the Shapiro show. He's very good at getting attention. He has a very loyal base. And Walz did pledge his allegiance to Harris.

ISGUR: Shapiro is Batman; she needed a Robin.

KARL: Almost out of time. What's the key thing we are going to see at the convention?

BRAZILE: It's going to be a lively convention with all types of talented people, leaders. I can't wait to go. Jon, I even bought a new dress. So I hope to see you on the dance floor. We can have a dance.

KARL: All right, Donna. Thank you. Thank you all. We will be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KARL: That's all for us today. Thank you for sharing part of your Sunday with us. Check out "World News Tonight." Have a great day.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)