Writer Eliza Griswold talks about progressive evangelical church's struggle in ‘Circle of Hope’

Journalist Eliza Griswold turned a chance encounter on the streets of Philadelphia into an exploration of a progressive evangelical church in her new book, “Circle of Hope: A Reckoning with Love, Power, and Justice in an American Church.”

The book offers a portrait of the church’s community, its mission and the crisis created by divisions among its members.

A contributing writer to The New Yorker and a Distinguished Writer in Residence at New York University, Griswold also won a Pulitzer Prize for her nonfiction book “Amity and Prosperity: One Family and the Fracturing of America” in 2019. She has also published several books of poetry.

Griswold sat down with ABC News' Phil Lipof to talk about getting to know Circle of Hope's young faithful and the generational divide that developed among its members.

ABC NEWS: As our country is often divided by political and societal issues, Pulitzer Prize winner and The New Yorker contributor Eliza Griswold went to see firsthand if these divisions are happening in churches, as well.

In her new book, “Circle of Hope: A Reckoning with Love, Power, and Justice in an American Church,” Griswold formed a portrait of an American progressive evangelical church in Philadelphia and sought to see if faith and justice had the power to bring people together. Eliza, thanks so much for joining us. How did you come upon the Circle of Hope church?

GRISWOLD: I came upon this church because I was in downtown Philadelphia, and I was with one of the members who was melting AK-47s into garden implements, because in the Bible, you beat swords into plowshares, right? So he's like, I'm going to do this literally.

So he was on a street corner, literally like pushing the barrel of an AK into this forge. And I saw a young group of people who I knew, like heavily inked, you know, pierced, wearing well-thrifted chic store clothes. And I was like these, “This is a church.” And I know these young people are worth time, getting to know.

ABC NEWS: And as a reporter, I could just picture seeing that scene -- you know something more is happening. And so you embed yourself basically from what, 2019 to 2023, getting to personally know these folks, the younger generation. And eventually the younger generation pushes out the older generation. I'm wondering what it was like to watch that kind of generational change inside this organization?

GRISWOLD: Well, you know, I think that's actually an excellent question. And I think one of the things that I saw was what was happening in so many organizations and institutions around America was happening inside this church as well – a real reckoning. In this case, it was really a moral reckoning over what Jesus meant and how to lead the church forward.

And what happened exactly over time was that the younger people were like, “Hey, we've spent enough time in the streets of Philadelphia trying to help people without really looking at ourselves.” And with George Floyd and pandemic, the time has come to look within, and the book is really about the crisis born of that reckoning.

ABC NEWS: And in 2020, the pandemic and the death of George Floyd, as you say. What happened, in the aftermath of that?

GRISWOLD: A lot of saying, you know “My way is correct, your way is wrong.” And what happened when that was sort of pumped up with theology and people's devotion. It became really, really problematic and really heartbreaking because lots of these guys had left conservative megachurches in rural places in their childhood. They'd been conservative evangelicals and kind of followed the ways of Trump before Trump, right?

And then what had happened, they've come to Philadelphia and left that behind. And they were now with this chosen family, and they thought they were doing the right thing. And so to begin to fight with this chosen family was really painful.

ABC NEWS: I do want to get this question in – you write: “Over the past 25 years, some 40 million Americans have stopped attending church. Scandal over power, money, sex, and abuse have called into question the basic goodness of church leaders and institutions.” How was the collapse of the church that you followed different from, say, what other people are viewing in organized religion worldwide?

GRISWOLD: That is an excellent question. And what I saw with these young people was an enormous amount of devotion and love and energy. And sometimes that energy didn't know where to go.

But it wasn't a falling away, it was an ardent “What does Jesus call us to be and what does that look like?” And they gave their whole lives to live that, and ultimately that began to come into conflict.

ABC NEWS: I spoke to so many of my friends, in the aftermath of the clergy sex abuse scandal, who wanted to profess and find a way to have a relationship with Jesus …

GRISWOLD: Yes.

ABC NEWS: …without the hierarchy of the church. They found that a problem. So was that a struggle, too, in how to find a relationship with God but without the hierarchy?

GRISWOLD: Phil, that is exactly what the church was founded to be. They believed they were anti-hierarchical. They believed that they had solved all of those problems. “Oh, we left behind racism. We've left behind sexism because we are an intentional community that's nonhierarchical.”

ABC NEWS: Noble.

GRISWOLD: Right? Right. And the crisis was that it's not possible to leave the world behind. You have to reckon with what the world brings with you.

ABC NEWS: Thank you so much for coming, Eliza. We really do appreciate it. And we want to let everybody know that you can purchase “Circle of Hope: A Reckoning with Love, Power, and Justice in an American Church” wherever books are sold.

GRISWOLD: Thank you so much for having me.