'This Week' Transcript 11-10-24: Former GOP Presidential Candidate Vivek Ramaswamy and Charlamagne tha God

A rush transcript of "This Week with George Stephanopoulos" airing on Sunday, November 10, 2024 on ABC News is below. This copy may not be in its final form, may be updated and may contain minor transcription errors. For previous show transcripts, visit the "This Week" transcript archive.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANNOUNCER: THIS WEEK WITH GEORGE STEPHANOPOULOS starts right now.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JONATHAN KARL, ABC "THIS WEEK" CO-ANCHOR: Historic comeback.

DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND 2024 PRESIDENT-ELECT: Thank you very much. Wow.

CROWD (Chanting): USA! USA!

KARL: Donald Trump resoundingly defeats Kamala Harris. His biggest victory. On track to win the popular vote too.

TRUMP: This was, I believe, the greatest political movement of all-time.

KARL: The president-elect's transition now underway.

TRUMP: Nothing will stop me from keeping my word to you.

KARL: President Biden pledges a smooth transition.

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: On January 20th, we'll have a peaceful transfer of power here in America.

KARL: As Democrats re-group after a crushing loss.

KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE U.S. (D) AND FORMER U.S. PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: This is not a time to throw up our hands. This is a time to roll up our sleeves.

KARL: This morning, influential radio host and Harris supporter, Charlamagne tha God on why he's optimistic.

KARL: Should Harris have done more to make it clear she wanted to go in a different direction from Joe Biden?

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD, 'THE BREAKFAST CLUB' CO-HOST: I think that if she wanted to go in a different direction, she should have expressed that.

KARL: What will a second Trump term look like? Trump ally Vivek Ramaswamy joins us live.

Plus, post-election thoughts from voters across the spectrum. And analysis from the roundtable.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: From ABC News, it’s THIS WEEK. Here now, Jonathan Karl.

KARL: Good morning. Welcome to THIS WEEK.

In just 71 days, Donald Trump will be sworn in again as president of the United States. His comeback victory unlike anything we have ever seen in American history.

Just take a look at the final results. With Arizona now projected for Trump, he locks in a sweeping victory in every single battleground state. And Trump did more than that. He made big gains with young voters and with Latinos, doing better among Hispanic voters than any Republican presidential candidate since the first exit polls were conducted in 1976. He even did better among women than when he ran against Joe Biden. He also made significant gains in some of the most Democratic places in the country, doing better in places like Brooklyn, New Jersey, and Chicago. And in deep blue California, Donald Trump is on track to do better than any Republican in two decades. And he was running against a Californian. California voters also rejected liberal policies on taxes, rent control, and crime. They voted overwhelmingly to approve Proposition 36, which imposes tougher penalties for shoplifting and drug possession. Both the mayor of San Francisco and the liberal district attorney in Los Angeles were voted out. A rejection of liberal policies, particularly on crime, in some of the most liberal jurisdictions in the United States.

Regardless of what you think about the outcome, whether you are happy about it or fearful, this week was a victory for democracy. Turnout was near record highs. And when the votes were counted, the losing candidate didn't cry foul or make false allegations of election fraud or try to overturn the will of the voters. She gave a gracious concession speech. And the outgoing president promised to ensure a smooth and peaceful transfer of power. With Biden and Trump scheduled to meet at the White House on Wednesday.

Democracy worked, even if it brought us a president-elect who many argued is a threat to democracy. Now the question turns to what the man who tried to overturn a democratic election four years ago will do with his mandate. In a moment, I'll speak with Vivek Ramaswamy, who was with Donald Trump on election night and in the immediate aftermath.

But first we turn to Rachel Scott, who covered the Trump campaign for us and is now in West Palm Beach, Florida, reporting on the Trump transition.

Rachel, we know we have a new chief of staff, Susie Wiles. What's your sense? You’ve been talking to folks. What is her role going to be going forward?

RACHEL SCOTT, ABC NEWS SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, well, Jon, it's hard to find an adviser that was more critical to the success of President-elect Donald Trump's third bid for the White House than Susie Wiles. She is a long-time Republican adviser. She likes to remain out of the spotlight, work behind the scenes. She was largely credited with helping Governor Ron DeSantis win his victory back in 2018. DeSantis fired her and ultimately it is Wiles who settled the score. She joined the Trump campaign. She helped President-elect Trump defeat Governor DeSantis in the Republican primary, ultimately helping President-elect Trump win the White House.

But she's also been able to pull off something that very few advisers around the president-elect have been able to do. Number one, she's been able to last. She lasted the entirety of the campaign. Also commanding the respect of not only the family, allies, but also thepresident-elect himself, while running a pretty tight ship.

And sources tell me that when they do go to the White House, she wants to make sure that she can maintain some type of control over who has access to the president-elect in the Oval Office especially, trying to avoid some of the chaos that we saw during the first administration, which I know you covered all too well, Jon.

JONATHAN KARL, ABC "THIS WEEK" CO-ANCHOR: Yes, that controlling the access is a challenge. I saw roughly four chiefs of staff try to do that.

But let me also ask you about Elon Musk, who was arguably Donald Trump's biggest supporter, maybe his most important supporter in the campaign. He's been around a lot. I know you've reported he's been on at least two calls with foreign leaders. What – what do you – what's your sense on his role right now?

SCOTT: Yes. And President-elect Trump has said that Elon Musk, the world's richest man, would oversee some type of government efficiency for the federal government. But it's very clear, Jon, that what we are learning from our sources is that his significance, his influence is going to stretch far beyond that. He was there during multiple conversations that the president-elect had with foreign leaders. Sources tell us that he was in the room when the president-elect spoke with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy by the phone. At one point, I am told, that the president-elect handed Musk the phone to talk to Zelenskyy himself. The two remarking over the StarLink internet communicant service that Musk founded.

But also, he was there as well when the president-elect spoke with the Turkish president, Erdogan. Again, this all underscores just how much influence and significance someone like Elon Musk could play in this next administration, Jon.

KARL: All right, the tireless Rachel Scott, live in West Palm Beach. Thank you, Rachel.

I'm joined now in the studio by former Trump primary opponent, turned Trump supporter, Vivek Ramaswamy.

Thank you for being here with us.

VIVEK RAMASWAMY, (R) FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: It's great to be here.

KARL: So, you were there. I saw you there on election night. I know you were there in the aftermath. You spent time with the now President-elect Donald Trump. What's your sense? How is he approaching this transition?

RAMASWAMY: I think he cares about uniting the country. I think that is Donald Trump's number one focus. And I do think we have to get back to a place, after this election, after that decisive victory, which I do think was a gift to the country, get back to a place where ordinary Americans who might have voted differently amongst their family members or their colleagues or their neighbors, to be able to get together at the dinner table and say, we're still Americans at the end of this. That's very much Donald Trump's head space.

He's also learned a lot from that first term. And I think he's going into this second term, even to take to new heights some of the things he wasn't able to accomplish in the first term, which I think is going to be a good thing.

KARL: I want to come back to that unity theme, but first I've heard you say that this is a new Republican Party. So, in brief, how is this different from the old Republican Party? What's the key differential?

RAMASWAMY: Well, it's a party that's now a multiethnic, working class coalition. You saw black voters, Hispanic voters, young voters. That was a big one. A much younger composition of the Republican primary base coming together on basic principles that really weren't as beholden to older Republican orthodoxies, but principles like free speech, anti-censorship, meritocracies, staying out of World War III. These are some of the common threats that brings together what is a pretty diverse and broad tent coalition to restore those basic constitutional principles.

KARL: Yes.

RAMASWAMY: Here's a big one, and Donald Trump's talked for a long time about the deep state, but this idea of restoring self-governance is big in this new coalition. The idea that the people we elect to run the government, they haven't been the ones actually running the government for a very long time. Donald Trump is going to be the president of the United States in the real sense of that word. Capital "p" president. Where he is actually making the decisions with the democratic will of the people behind him, not the un-elected bureaucratic class underneath him.

And I think that's something that unites a common threat of even former Democrats to independents, to libertarians, to, of course, traditional Republicans as well. I think that that's a common thread that unites us.

KARL: Well, let me – let me ask you about the unity, and I think you've referred to this as a resurgence of national unity.

RAMASWAMY: Yes.

KARL: I'm hearing that from some people around the former president, but I'm hearing a very different message from others around the former president. For example, Mike Davis, who had been mentioned by Donald Trump Jr. as a possible candidate for attorney general in a new Trump administration, has been calling for all-out revenge against Trump's opponents. I want to give you just a couple of examples, and believe me there are many, but a couple of examples of what he has said on X. He says, “Trump's opponents attempted to bankrupt him for non-fraud, imprison him for non-crimes, and take him off the ballot and take off his head. Now they want unity? F them. Let's unify them in prison.” And one more, a short one, “Here's my current mood. I want to drag their dead political bodies through the streets, burn them, and throw them off the wall, legally, politically, and financially, of course.”

Now, Davis has said he's not going into the new administration, but this is a – he was a clerk for Justice Gorsuch. And again, Donald Trump Jr. said this is the kind of guy that could be attorney general.

RAMASWAMY: Well, look, the fact of the matter is you haven't heard that from Donald Trump. And you could airlift any quote from a number of people on the left who weren’t very happy with the election result either but who aren't going into the Harris-Biden administration in their trailing days either.

What you're hearing from Donald Trump is he is going to be a president for all Americans. He is a guy who in that first term, he -- you know, he had crowds chanting “lock her up” for Hillary Clinton. He didn't prosecute her. I think Donald Trump is focused on what makes people's lives better.

And actually, my message to Democrats out there, even those who didn't vote for Donald Trump, is to give him a chance to actually make your life better and I think a lot of people across the country even who have bought into I think some false narratives about Donald Trump are going to be pleasantly surprised as to finding more money in their paycheck, prices coming down in the country, a secure border -- those are things most Americans actually care about.

And I think it's time to turn the page on a lot of these histrionics or Hitler comparisons or airlifting some quote of some person who Donald Trump --

(CROSSTALK)

KARL: I mean, this is somebody who's been -- been pretty a staunch defender of Trump, pretty close to the team and --

RAMASWAMY: And by your acknowledgement, someone who’s not coming into the administration.

KARL: Okay. So all the talk of retribution, is that gone now?

And by the way, I’ve heard you say that he didn't prosecute Hillary Clinton. I mean, I’ve talked to Bill Barr about this, he wanted the Justice Department to prosecute, you know, Barack Obama, Joe Biden and they kind of pulled him back.

But your sense is that that retribution talk is done?

RAMASWAMY: I’m going to tell you what Donald Trump has said on this time and again, success will be our retribution. Success will be our vengeance. That's a direct line from Donald Trump. It's a beautiful sentiment.

And I do think that success is unifying. Nothing's going to unite this country more than economic growth. Nothing is going to unite this country more than people feeling like their wages are rising at a faster pace than prices which hasn't been the case for the last few years.

And here's a big one that I know a lot of Democrats should support and do support as well is restoring stability and peace on the global stage.

I mean, the reality is the United States of America is at our best when the chief diplomat of the United States is the democratically elected U.S. president. That's not the case right now. It hasn't been for years.

That changes on January 20th, bringing us off the brink of major conflicts in other parts of the world.

So I think that those are going to unite the country regardless of partisan affiliation, that's what I’m looking forward to.

KARL: Is he going to continue to support Ukraine? I mean, I’ve heard from the Ukraine side that the call actually went well that he had.

RAMASWAMY: Yeah.

KARL: Elon Musk and President Trump with President Zelenskyy.

RAMASWAMY: I think his interactions with Zelenskyy in recent weeks and months have been actually quite constructive.

Donald Trump's first term is a great guide for stability. We were on the brink of major conflict when Donald Trump sat down with Barack Obama at that last transition. He's sitting down with Joe Biden on Wednesday.

Donald Trump is a pragmatist in looking after American interests and he believes in honesty when it comes to international diplomacy. He is the top diplomat but I think also a tough love message to other allies even saying that you need to bear your fair share of your defense spending.

Yes, that's good for the United States, but yes, that's also good for Europe as well.

And so, I think that type of honesty and diplomacy is actually going to bring true strength and true peace in a way that we haven't seen in the last four years.

KARL: Now, obviously, Trump's promised --and you've talked a lot about this, the -- you know, mass deportation of undocumented immigrants.

First of all, do you really think that we're going to see him round up and deport upwards of 11 -- sometimes he's put the numbers high as 20 million people out of the United States? Is that really going to happen?

RAMASWAMY: Donald Trump's campaign promise was the largest mass deportation in American history.

KARL: OK.

RAMASWAMY: And he's going to keep that promise.

And I’ll tell you let's just start very pragmatically here, I think most Americans agree with this. You take the number of people who have entered the country just in the last 18 to 24 months. That's millions of undocumented immigrants, illegal migrants who have really no place in this country, anybody who's committed a crime -- automatically, that already is the largest mass deportation in American history.

Now take that to the next level, not an iota, not a cent of government spending should go to subsidize this. Not to sanctuary cities, not to federal aid to people who are in this country illegally, and we're going to see a large number, by the millions of self deportations as well.

And so, these are pragmatic places to start that would give us yes, the largest mass deportation in American history --

KARL: But fall far short of 11 million or more.

RAMASWAMY: We're going to -- we’re going to go step by step aggressively. Donald Trump's going to stay true to his campaign pledge but in a way that respects the dignity of the Americans who are already here.

KARL: OK. So --

RAMASWAMY: And I do think it's offensive to use when we have $35 trillion of national debt, government funds to subsidize this type of illegal migration. That's half the problem.

And if any illegal migrant is no longer a customer of the welfare state, you're going to see self deportations --

KARL: Let me --

RAMASWAMY: -- combined with deportations of those who enter --

(CROSSTALK)

KARL: Let me ask you though I mean there's been a lot of attention over the years to people known as the DREAMers. These are -- these are people who came into the United States with their parents as young children, grew up here, went to school here, some of them great success stories. But they're -- but they are still undocumented immigrants.

And there's a lot of concern, some of them are deeply frightened by what they heard from Donald Trump during the campaign.

I want to play just -- just two, you know, the words from two of these DREAMers of what they’ve said of their concerns now after the election, and get you to respond.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JESSICA CORTEZ, DACA RECIPIENT: I could wake up tomorrow and there could be animmigration agent, you know, an ICE agent outside of my house, or outside of my mom’s house. We don't know.

REYNA MONTOYA, DACA RECIPIENT AND ALIENTO FOUNDER: We are not what you're seeing on TV. We are people who have been living here for over ten years, who call Arizona home.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KARL: I mean, they're worried about getting that knock on the door.

RAMASWAMY: Look, I say this as the kid of legal immigrants to this country, as the proud child of legal immigrants to the United States of America. If your first act of entering this country broke the law, that doesn't allow you to remain in this country. You have no right to enter the United States legal – illegally.

KARL: I mean they came in as two or three, five years old.

RAMASWAMY: Well, let me – let me just say a few words about this. I think we’re going to be pragmatic. A few basic principles that all Americans agree with are this, OK? One is no migration without consent. Think about your nation like a body. Number two is, that consent should only be granted, and should be granted, to migrants who benefit the United States of America. But those who enter without consent must be removed.

And I think that those are very pragmatic principles that most Americans agree with.

KARL: But I'm asking you about – so they must be removed, these – these people that have spent their entire lives growing up –

RAMASWAMY: I'm going to separate – I'm going to separate two discussions here. First is, let's talk about what the legal immigration system ought to look like.

KARL: Yes.

RAMASWAMY: Do we have a broken legal immigration system? Yes, we do. But I think the first step is going to be to restore the rule of law, to do it in a very pragmatic way, Jonathan, a pragmatic way, that says, let’s just start. I don't think you disagree with me. I would – I would hope not. I don’t think most Americans do, to say, those who have entered in the last couple of years, they haven’t established roots in the county, those who have committed a crime, they should be out of this country. That is by the millions. That alone would be the largest mass deportation. Combine that with ending government aid for all illegals and see self-deportations.

KARL: All right.

RAMASWAMY: And I want to say one more thing, because this is important to the second term, don't forget the second mass deportation that we require as well. And I use this figuratively. The mass deportation of millions of unelected federal bureaucrats out of the D.C. bureaucracy. I actually (INAUDIBLE).

KARL: We’re going to – I – we’re out of time, but I do want to talk to you about that in the future. And just very quickly, we are out of time, what are you going to do? Are you coming into the administration? Do – are we going to see you replace J.D. Vance in the Senate? What are you going to do?

RAMASWAMY: There's a couple great options on the table. I want to have the biggest possible impact on this country. We're not going to sort that out in the press, but we’re having some –

KARL: Secretary of Homeland Security?

RAMASWAMY: We’re having some major – we’re having some high-impact discussions and you’ll be the first to know when we have announcements to make.

KARL: All right, I'll hold you to that. Thank you very much, Vivek Ramaswamy.

RAMASWAMY: All right, thank you.

KARL: Coming up, one of the most influential voices on the airwaves and one of Vice President Harris' most vocal supporters, Charlamagne tha God, on what he's looking to – looking at in Trump's victory.

We'll be back in just two minutes.

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(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE U.S. (D) AND FORMER U.S. PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We must accept the results of this election. Earlier today, I spoke with President-elect Trump and congratulated him on his victory. I also told him that we will help him and his team with their transition and that we will engage in a peaceful transfer of power.

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KARL: That was Vice President Harris speaking at her alma mater Howard University as she conceded the election Wednesday.

One of the most listened to voices on the airwaves, Charlamagne Tha God, was an outspoken Harris supporter after she replaced Joe Biden as the Democratic nominee. I've spoken with him several times as this race unfolded. And after Election Day, I returned to his New York studio for his reaction to Trump's victory and what it means for the country.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KARL: So, look, this was obviously not the result you wanted, but I've heard you say you're optimistic today. Why?

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD, THE BREAKFAST CLUB CO-HOST: Because I have no choice but to be, you know? I'm an American. I live in America. I'm not one of these people that's out here saying, oh, my god, If Donald Trump becomes president again, I'm going to move. Where am I going? I'm here and, you know, I do believe in the future of this country because I have no choice but to.

You know, I think what the vice president said in her concession speech was right on point when she said, you know, the light of America's promise still shines bright. I have no reason to feel otherwise. I'm going to wake up, you know, and just be all doom and gloom and tell everybody the world is ending. It's, like, no. You know, Americans went out there and it was a free and fair election, and they made a choice.

And now we all have to deal with, you know, the consequences of that choice, and whether we like it or not, you know, Donald Trump is the president of the United States of America. I know it feels like the divided states of America over the last, you know, several years. But it is still the United States of America, so that's what I'm looking for us to do. We got to unify in some way, shape, or form.

KARL: You were out there. I saw you at the convention in Chicago. You interviewed Kamala Harris a couple of times. Were you surprised?

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: That she lost?

KARL: Yes.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: I'm not going to say surprised. You know, surprise isn't the word that I would use because it's a tossup. Like, you know, going into the election, you know, they were neck and neck. I think that she needs to get a lot more credit than she probably is going to get because the campaign was dead, you know? Literally.

KARL: With Biden?

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: Oh, yes. The campaign was dead with Biden. I know people make a lot of jokes about the whole weekend at Bernie's thing, and they say things like I would vote for Biden if he was a corpse. Well, he damn near was, and, you know, there was no life whatsoever, and I think that the vice president made a lot of people sit up on the couch and pay attention, and at least be curious. With Biden, everybody was just, knocked out, asleep, gone.

KARL: Have you talked to her since the loss?

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: No. I haven't, but I can't wait to.

KARL: What are you going to tell her?

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: I'm going to tell her I love her. I value her. I appreciate her, and, you know, whatever she plans to do moving forward, I'm going to always support her and I'm going to say what I, you know, have been saying on the radio and on my podcast that she has nothing to be ashamed about. You know, she ran a great campaign and only had 100 days to do it.

Nobody thought she could even do, you know, what it is that she did, like, you know, the first day getting all the delegates in line. You know, raising the money that she raised, you know, digging the campaign out of a hole to where they were neck and neck on election day, and she inspired a lot of people, like, I got a, you know, I got four daughters and my 9-year-old and my 6-year-old when I'm watching, you know, THIS WEEK ABC on Sunday morning or I'm watching CNN or FOX or MSNBC, they're coming in and they're asking me questions about Vice President Kamala Harris.

And they were -- are you going to vote for the vice president, Daddy? Yes, I'm voting for the vice president, and when she lost, they were upset that she was lost, so, you know, she did inspire a lot of people, and it was a historic campaign.

KARL: What do you make of the demographics here? I mean, Trump got one out of every three voters of color.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: No.

KARL: Yes.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: One out of -- no.

KARL: 33 percent.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: Really?

KARL: Yes.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: When you say color, you mean, like black, brown, everything? Oh. Well, I think that, you know, people have different issues that they care about, and I think that there's nobody out there that's a single-issue voter. I think some of this is a backlash to race and gender and identity politics, but, man, most people they just care about keeping food on their table and keeping a roof over their head and I think sometimes people forget about that.

I think they forget about, you know, the working class, and for whatever reason, Donald Trump speaks to the grievances of the working class in a real way, and I keep telling folks. people will forget what you did. They'll forget what you said, but they'll never forget how you made them feel, and when you go back to 2020, even though it was a pandemic and it was COVID.

KARL: Yes.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: People don't care. All they know is they got stimulus checks with his name on it and that's what they remember. And so people think about that. When you have conversations with folks, they be, you know, like I remember how 2020 felt, and they think that they're going to feel that, you know, in this next -- this next, just next term.

KARL: Yes, I mean, how do you explain -- I mean, he obviously swept the battleground states. He drove up, you know, turnout around the country, in Republican areas, but he did much better than Republican -- than he had done before in places like Chicago, Brooklyn, Queens.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: Because --

KARL: The deep --

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: Because dinner table issues. It's -- you know, it's literally that simple.

Every day, people wake up and all they want to do is have more money in their pocket and they want to feel safe.

I don't care if you're Black, White, gay, straight, whatever religion you are, those are the two things that you're thinking about every day. How can I keep some money in my pocket? And how can I stay safe?

And when you look at, you know, issues like the economy, when you look at the border, and that's what I was telling people we had this conversation back in February --

KARL: Yeah.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: I was having conversations with folks and they was telling me, oh, my God, these gangs are coming into our neighborhood and I know it's because of the border, we got to close the border -- like they were having these conversations.

And I told you, Jon, this was the first time in my life that I heard people in my community, Black people, Brown people, having those -- those conversations. So that was going to be an issue.

They felt like things were safer. They felt like the border was safer, you know, under Trump. And by the way, it's not like the Democrats didn't want border security. They just didn't know how to message it right.

Build the wall may sound elementary, but you know what that signals to people? Border security. That's it. Nothing more, nothing less.

Don't complicate it by saying, oh, we got to have the most comprehensive border plan and, you know, we have -- there's a bipartisan, you know, border bill that Democrats and Republicans couldn't agree on and Donald Trump shot it down.

No, Trump is saying build the wall, and when they were telling you that it was a problem, y'all was saying, no, it's not a problem. Let's create sanctuary cities and let's bring, you know, the people into our cities.

And so, when they started putting those you know illegal immigrants on the buses and on the planes and sending them to those sanctuary cities, what did they say then? No, don’t come.

KARL: Right.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: So it looked like the Republicans were right and Democrats were wrong.

And nobody knew that that was going to be one of the big central issues that people thought about when they went into that voter booth.

KARL: Should Harris have done more to make it clear she wanted to go in a different direction from Joe Biden, or did she want to go in a different direction?

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: I think that if she wanted to go in a different direction, she should have expressed that. And once again, that goes back to messaging, that goes back to communication.

I’ve been telling folks the language of politics is dead. You cannot finesse people anymore. You can't believe one thing but then get in front of people and tell them something else.

And if you are, you got to be really good at it, right?

KARL: Yeah, yeah.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: What do I always say? Republicans are more sincere about their lies than Democrats are about their truth.

So when she's on “The View” and she's shaking her head like, no, I don't -- I wouldn't do anything different, but then you on Fox News with Bret Baier, and you’re like, my administration is going to be totally different than a Biden presidency, if that was the case, I just think that that should have been repeated several, several times.

Like, you know, one thing that she said when I had a conversation with her was repetition is good, like that's part of being disciplined.

KARL: Yeah.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: Right? You have to repeat yourself over and over and over.

That might have been one of the issues that she should have repeated herself over and over and over on.

KARL: So you had Lara Trump on the show the weeks before the election.

CHARLAMAGNE THA GOD: You know, after Trump won, I just -- I sent her a message and told her, hey, congratulations. And I said to her, I hope that -- I hope that this administration is going to be an administration for all Americans. And she said, thank you. I promise, in capital letters, that it will be.

Listen, man, I think that we've seen enough of Donald Trump to know that may not be the case, but like I said, I just have to have a sense of optimism because he still is the president of the United States of America. And I just want us like I said as a people moving forward, we got to start building more community amongst each other.

And you know, we just got to hope for the best, like I’m not wishing for America to fail. Why would I want that?

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KARL: Our thanks to Charlamagne.

Up next, strategist and pollster Frank Luntz breaks down his focus group results showing why some voters just couldn't get behind Vice President Harris.

We're back in just a minute.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)KARL: Joining me now in studio is pollster and communication analyst, Frank Luntz. He's been tracking voters in focus groups with "The New York Times" throughout 2024 and is here with some insights on what unfolded in this historic election.

So, Frank, before we get to your focus groups, you admitted quite candidly that you were wrong about something major after the election. You thought this election, if I have you right, was over after the debate between Kamala Harris and Donald Trump. What happened?

FRANK LUNTZ, POLLSTER & COMMUNICATION ANALYST: It simply wasn't. And in the end, the debate did not matter. The public is used to what Trump says. They did not hold it against him. The dogs and cats which people made fun of, memes were created, it did not impact people because -- and one of the things we have to acknowledge is the importance of the truth. We have to tell it.

KARL: Well, that was not the truth when he said that.

LUNTZ: No. And I thought that would kill him, but it didn't. And one of the things that really matters in elections going forward is we have the responsibility to tell them the truth and they have the right to get the truth. And quite frankly, we are a different country today than we were even eight years ago, where we judge people by, sometimes it's ignoring the information becomes more important than what you say, and that was the challenge with Harris. She didn't say enough.

KARL: All right. So let's get to your focus groups. You did a series of focus groups with the young voters, who were persuadable undecided late in the summer. And then you went back right before the election, after they had voted early. Let's play a little bit of the conversation you had with them. This was on Zoom. I want to play just a short clip.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LUNTZ: How many of you, by show of hands, disliked both candidates? You have a negative opinion of both. It is literally every single person here. What does that say to you about American democracy? That you didn't like the Republican or the Democrat? Pierce, you go first.

PIERCE, NORTH CAROLINA VOTER: I mean, I think it just shows how polarized we've become and that, I mean, people vote based on their party over country. And I mean, it's just -- it's unfortunate to see, I don't think we'll ever see another election in our lifetime where there's one candidate that truly wins in a Reagan landslide.

LAURA, MARYLAND VOTER: Harris ran on the platform of "I'm not Trump," and that's not enough to be a president. You need to have more than, "Well, I'm better than this person." You got to explain how you're going to fix our democracy, how you're going to make the United States a better place. And I didn't get that from her. And if she's saying I'm just going to do everything the same as Biden, well, then I have concerns too, because I'm not really happy with the direction that our country is going in terms of inflation and other issues in our economy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KARL: And that was actually the day after the election. So bottom line, what was the factor with these people that were undecided and then broke against Kamala Harris?

LUNTZ: They did not like either candidate, that was clear. They thought that Trump was offensive and abusive in his language and polarizing. But in the end, she didn't answer the question that they wanted to know. What are you going to do in the first hour, in the first day, in the first week, the first month, and so on. They felt they had the right to hear this. And if she won't tell them that, then they couldn't give her their votes.

And other voters, not just the young voters, felt that she wasn't -- she never came clean with what she wanted to do. And the fact that she changed her positions in some issues, she never really explained it.

KARL: And she talked too much about Trump?

LUNTZ: It was too much defining what Trump was. And, Jon –

KARL: And not defining herself.

LUNTZ: And, Jon, we all know what Trump is. We experienced him for four years. Whoever told her to focus on him committed political malpractice because, in the end, you cannot change someone's point of view on him. It was all about her.

KARL: OK, there’s been – there was a lot of talk about the gender gap throughout this campaign. Usually focusing on how she was doing on women and Trump’s problems with women.

But you spent some focus groups talking with men who had voted for Hillary Clinton, they had voted for Joe Biden, and then they voted for Donald Trump.

LUNTZ: He was their voice. They, in him, they saw someone who represented them. And with her, they saw – and it was great, young women getting excited for the first time, surrounded by women, talking about issues like abortion. That was great for the female vote. But men felt ignored. They felt forgotten. And they felt like they didn't even matter. And in the end, the Democratic Party has to keep both of them. It is not enough to get – capture the women's vote. These middle class, middle-income, moderate men – I call it m-cubed, they're the key to any election, and they felt betrayed by her.

KARL: OK, so, before you go, what – what do Democrats have to do to get competitive again?

LUNTZ: How do you win when you lose the union vote? They had the union leadership, but not the union membership. How do you win if you lose Latinos? In fact, a majority of Latino men voted for Trump.

KARL: Fifty-two percent.

LUNTZ: It's incredible how many traditional Democrats. And the reason why is that became ideological. And what they want is simple common sense. What they want is a meaningful, measurable change from the past. And she's talking about having no difference in her policies versus Joe Biden. The Democrats have to do this examination. And it's not about getting angry with Donald Trump, it’s figuring out exactly the words, the phrases, and the messages that will appeal to these voters that felt alienated from the Democratic Party.

KARL: All right, Frank Luntz, thank you a lot. Thank you for joining us. Really appreciate it.

LUNTZ: Thank you, Jon.

KARL: Up next, the roundtable unpacks the fallout from Election Day and what to expect next.

We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KARL: President-elect Trump said on election night that he's going to help heal our country.

The roundtable is here to react to that and talk about the path forward for Democrats.

We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KARL: All right. Let's bringing the roundtable: former DNC chair, Donna Brazile; former Trump chief of staff and RNC chair, Reince Priebus; “Associated Press” executive editor Julie Pace; and former New Jersey governor and presidential candidate, Chris Christie.

So I want to get to the talk of unity that we're hearing from Trump and Vivek Ramaswamy, and all that.

But first, let's turn to the Democrats if you don't mind, Donna. I want -- that there have been a lot of -- there's been a lot of soul-searching, questioning what comes next.

I want to read you one of the things. Ritchie Torres, congressman from New York, Democrat, said this after the election: Donald Trump has no greater friend than the far-left which has managed to alienate historic numbers of Latinos, Blacks, Asians and Jews from the Democratic Party, with absurdities like defund the police, or from the river to the sea, or Latinx. The working class is not buying the ivory towered nonsense that the far left is selling.

Is that a factor here, Donna?

DONNA BRAZILE, ABC NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: You know, Jonathan, if you asked 10 Democrats what happened, I’m sure you go -- you will receive 12 opinions. And the truth is we should put it all on the table and have a great introspection as to what happened.

What happened in New Jersey when Chris and I were sitting there on election night and I’m looking at Chris, like, hey, what's going on? Or what was going on in Minnesota? What was going on, of course, in Massachusetts and Rhode Island?

KARL: Which was Trump was doing better in all these (INAUDIBLE) new places.

(CROSSTALK)

BRAZILE: Trump improved not just his numbers in the battleground which we were talking about on election night, three to four points. He also improved in inner cities. He improved in outer suburbs.

So it looks like Trump ran the 50-state strategy that the Democrats used to talk about. So we can talk about messaging. We can talk about the map. We can also talk about just, was 107 days enough? All of this should be on the table. We are going to have a lot of introspection. I want to say this, and I've lost my voice because clearly --

KARL: You've been -- you've been talking a lot. I mean --

(LAUGH)

BRAZILE: I've been talking a lot. But more importantly, look, the Democratic Party, I was there years ago when Donald Trump defeated Hillary Clinton, and we looked at ourselves and said, what the hell? We tried to stitch together the blue wall with Elmer's glue. We needed duct tape and a lot more. We got to do a better job of reaching the voters where they are and not try to make pretend that this was won simply because Donald Trump is a better liar.

KARL: Now, you were not a Trump supporter, let's to say the least. Chris, I saw you nodding when I was reading Ritchie Torres' --

(LAUGH)

CHRIS CHRISTIE, (R) FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE & FORMER NEW JERSEY GOVERNOR & ABC NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Oh, he's absolutely right. Because the Democratic Party from 2017 through 2024 went off the deep end. I mean, the stuff they've been saying is just offensive to a large percentage of the American people. The DEI stuff is offensive to large swath of the American people.

The most effective ad that the Trump campaign ran in this campaign was, Kamala Harris' for they, them, and Donald Trump is for us. That's because most people don't see themselves as they, them. Yet the Democrats have spent more time talking about the trans issue which quite frankly, is infinitesimal (ph), Jon.

KARL: I mean, I mean to --

CHRISTIE: It's infinitesimal.

KARL: I mean, to be fair, it was the Republicans that spent more time talking about it, but --

CHRISTIE: You know, Jon, they're responding to --

KARL: Yeah.

CHRISTIE: -- the push Democrats put. It wasn't Republicans who brought up the trans issue initially. It was Democrats accusing Republicans of being insensitive, intolerant, and all the (ph) rest.

REINCE PRIEBUS, FORMER RNC CHAIR & FORMER TRUMP WHITE HOUSE CHIEF OF STAFF & ABC NEWS POLITICAL ANALYST: It is Kamala Harris's own words.

CHRISTIE: Right.

PRIEBUS: From five years ago.

CHRISTIE: So --

KARL: OK.

CHRISTIE: So my point to you though, is that what the election proved is that is out of step with the majority of the American people, and Torres is right. And what happened was to -- relatively sane people like Cory Booker, who I know incredibly well. You look at Cory Booker as the Mayor of Newark and initially as the United States Senator, before he ran for president in 2020, and this was a moderate, pro-law & order, pro-school choice Democrat. He ran in that primary and went so far left that he came back to New Jersey and people didn't recognize him. That's what the party became.

KARL: So --

CHRISTIE: And this is a reaction to that.

KARL: So, we heard a different take from Bernie Sanders.

CHRISTIE: Of course.

KARL: Maybe the reverse of what we heard from Ritchie. I want to read this too and get to you guys. This is Bernie Sanders, after the election. It should come as no great surprise that a Democratic party, which has abandoned working-class people, should find that the working class has abandoned them. First it was the working class, now it is Latino and black workers as well, versus the white working class. While the Democratic leadership defends the status quo, the American people are angry and want change, and they are right.

Julie, I mean, what else? I mean, where is the -- where's the balance here? What are we hearing most of from Democrats?

JULIE PACE, ASSOCIATED PRESS EXECUTIVE EDITOR: Well, I think -- look, Donna is right. I think right now, if you ask Democrats, there's a whole range of reasons that they're giving for why Harris lost this race. But I actually do think that there's some overlap in what Torres said there and what Sanders is saying, which is the Democrats lost the message on the economy, right?

They lost the message on the ways that the economy was impacting people. They focused on these macroeconomic trends. When Biden was talking about some of the overall economic pictures, he wasn't wrong. But what --

KARL: Economy is improving.

PACE: Economy was improving --

KARL: Yeah.

PACE: -- at a macro level. But was that impacting people in their lives? And the reality was it wasn't. And they really focused and understandably so, if you're in the office, you've got to be able to try to sell the economy that you've got. But they were so focused in so many ways that -- at trying to convince people that the economy was strong, that they didn't realize that people weren't feeling that. And so, I think that's inherent in what both Torres and in what Sanders are saying actually.

KARL: And Reince, you were at the reins of the Republican Party, Republican National Committee when you had to deal with the loss in 2012 when Mitt Romney lost to Obama. What would your advice be right now to a DNC chair, how to come back?

PRIEBUS: Well, I think that the Democrats have chosen the progressive left instead of the populous left. And progressive leftism is thoroughly rejected in every corner of this country. This was a multicultural, blue-collar, decisive, amazing victory for Donald Trump. And if you look at the numbers, what this shows is the Democrats only improved in three areas. Number one, they improved in -- with non-religious people, people who really don't care about these cultural issues, college grads, and people who make over $100,000 a year.

I mean, think about how far the Democrat Party has come since 1990 when they used to talk about government reform and economic reforms and welfare reforms. And they don't speak to normal working-class parents that are trying to get their kids to school. They're knitting together disparate groups of people in different pockets and trying to call it aDemocrat party.

Look at Puerto Rico. Puerto Rico -- not only did Trump win Puerto Rican voters around Orlando, look at the island of Puerto Rico. All this Puerto Rico talk. The former chairwoman of the Republican Party of Puerto Rico is the governor of Puerto Rico. The Republicans won the statehouse, the state Senate. If I were the Republicans, I would say, let's make Puerto Rico a state so that we can get two more senators from Puerto Rico.

The Republican Party is on the cusp. They put billions of dollars in Hispanic outreach right now. They're on the cusp of reshaping with the help of Donald Trump, who led this effort by the way, though let's not forget it, of potentially crippling the Democrat Party for generations to come.

KARL: You know, I got to say there's something else that is notable here that hasn't, I don't think, been talked about enough, which is Trump ran ahead of Republicans down ballot.

BRAZILE: That's right.

KARL: So he ran ahead in every single one of those competitive Senate races. Trump ran ahead of the Republican candidate. The race for the House is very close right now. Republicans didn't do any great shakes in the House. Their majority might still be retained, but it might be smaller. So I mean, why is that -- so for Democrats across the board, it wasn't necessarily a bad night, but for Kamala Harris, it was a terrible night.

BRAZILE: Look, Donald Trump had a playbook that is unique to Donald Trump, and I think unique in American politics. I don't think anyone else can run on a MAGA playbook the way that Donald Trump can run on the MAGA playbook. We saw that in the Republican primaries where he came out on top.

I'm not going to sit back and let Republicans try to, you know, lecture me about what went wrong. I saw it for myself. So I saw it. I heard it. I just hope that those who --

KARL: You've been pretty damn candid about it.

BRAZILE: I mean, what are we supposed to do at this point? We're supposed to re-group, re-design our message, and to allow this party to get back on the field with new players, a new message, but we also have to transform how we message to people.

Donald Trump had a relationship with the American people that we could not break. We could not break when he was convicted. We could not break when he was caught lying. We could not break that hold he had on the American people. We have to go back, talk to the American people where they live, where they work, where they play, and where they pray.

KARL: Donna, I want to get to, before we run out of time, want to talk about Trump, but one very quick thing on another take. This was from Senator Fetterman talking about the message coming from the Harris campaign. He said, we have a challenge. We have our own kind of childless cat lady situation. Bros, people refer to these young guys as bros and clearly that's not a positive term. hey described them as dopes or gullible, or brutes.

That violates a basic, basic rule of politics. Don't subtract. Do addition. I think that was part of the new coalition that really delivered pretty crushing victory for Trump.

BRAZILE: Again, a lot of good lessons, a lot of great interpretations, introspection, but I'm going to say this as a woman and as a black American.

KARL: Yes.

BRAZILE: I still want as America as good as its promise and I would like to make sure that women have bodily choice and autonomy. With that said --

KARL: And by the way, what about the percentage of black women for Harris?

BRAZILE: 92.

KARL: 92.

BRAZILE: And if it was up to me, it would have been 94.

KARL: OK.

PRIEBUS: The Democrats were bamboozled by never Trumpers. They were comforted -- it was a comfort food. They thought that there was going to be this big swath of Republicans that would vote against Donald Trump by these grifters who were paying their mortgage because of Donald Trump so they could get out there.

BRAZILE: So I have great respect for those Americans because they were patriots, because they put their country over their party, and because they were willing to stand with someone they disagreed with.

PRIEBUS: They made money on it, Donna.

KARL: I mean, I don't know if --

PRIEBUS: A lot of them did.

KARL: I mean, Liz Cheney was I think from --

PRIEBUS: They're on (INAUDIBLE) --

(CROSSTALK)

KARL: Go ahead.

PACE: But I think this is one of the questions for Democrats as they try to stitch back together a coalition, right? I mean I think that there clearly are never Trump Republicans, but they have been in that place for a long time.

BRAZILE: Right.

PACE: So was there enough of a group that could be persuaded after four years of the Trump administration and four years of the Biden administration? Maybe not.

KARL: So, retribution. Is it gone? I mean, Trump is talking unity. How long is that going to last?

CHRISTIE: Just to respond to what Reince said, I think it's true that Democrats and, you know, Vice President Harris made this fundamental mistake early. She tried to correct it late, where she spent most of her time talking about Donald Trump. Donald Trump loves when you're talking about him.

BRAZILE: Absolutely.

CHRISTIE: He doesn't care whether you're saying good things, bad things, indifferent things.

KARL: Yes.

CHRISTIE: Because he knows that keeps him out front, and if you keep him out front, it's a winning formula for him. Different than a lot of other politicians that we've seen over our lifetime. On the retribution thing, look. I've known the president-elect for 22 years. He will always have those instincts.

The question is which instinct will govern how he acts? He also wants to be loved. He has an intense need to be loved, and so the question is will govern how he acts. He also wants to be loved. He has an intense need to be loved.

And so the question is, which one of those instincts is going to take hold? I don't know. We're going to have to watch and see. If it's the Donald Trump who wants to be loved, then he won't go through this retribution stuff because it will not lead to him being loved, respected, and admired. If he does, then I think he could wind up bringing the country together in a way that would be really positive. It's like what I said before the debate, Jon, with Vice President Harris.

Will he take and seize the moment to become something different? And by different, I don't mean changing essentially who he is, become bigger. If he becomes bigger, he has a chance to make this country really, really special. If he doesn't, he not only will make the country smaller and more divided, but he will make himself an insignificant two-term president, and that's something that I think he couldn't stand to live with.

PRIEBUS: I think he -- I think -- I think this president deserves a little peace. He won the popular vote. He won a decisive victory. I think we need to give him a little bit of peace. Let him put his government together and see how things go. I mean, this is -- but everything he promised, I think is going to come to fruition. He is not going to be a person who made a bunch of promises on (inaudible) --

KARL: I mean, he talked about like --

PRIEBUS: Deportation? Absolutely.

KARL: Court marshals for -- for --

PRIEBUS: And it was clear.

KARL: -- Colonel Milley and that kind stuff.

PRIEBUS: Well, look --

PACE: He's also -- he's also made big promises to the American people on the economy, right? That was the fundamental message --

KARL: Yeah, that was dangerous (ph).

PACE: -- which is I am going to change this economy around.

BRAZILE: And I'll fix it.

PACE: I'm going to make your lives better and I'm going to fix it.

BRAZILE: Right.

PACE: And now, he has four years to see if he can back that up.

CHRISTIE: And two things. One, he may benefit like Bill Clinton did in 1992 from the fact that an economy was improving. Bush couldn't get the credit for that.

PACE: Yep.

CHRISTIE: Because it's so -- there's a lag. So even when things are getting better, it takes six, eight, nine months for people to actually feel it.

(CROSSTALK)

PRIEBUS: And you have Republican House -- the Senate and House.

(CROSSTALK)

KARL: He's going to benefit from an improving economy under Joe Biden.

CHRISTIE: Well, yeah. But --

PRIEBUS: He's got the Republican House and Senate.

(CROSSTALK)

KARL: Unfortunately --

(CROSSTALK)

CHRISTIE: If he wants peace though, he's got no peace.

KARL: Our thanks to the Roundtable.

(LAUGH)

KARL: Lot more to discuss. We will be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KARL: That's all for us today. Thank you for sharing part of your Sunday with us. Check out "World News Tonight" and have a great day.

END