'This Week' Transcript: Sens Kerry and Lugar


KERRY: The backbone of our success. They have -- no one a year ago would have thought the Pakistanis would have 147,000 troops in the western part in the territories. Nobody would have thought they would have gone into Swat and gone after the insurgents or South Waziristan. Their soldiers have a two-year tour. Their army has been somewhat stretched. And I've spent hours with their chief of command, General Kiyani. I believe they know exactly what they want -- we want them to do, what they have to do, and I believe at some point it's going to happen. AMANPOUR: Well, one of the key American diplomats who was loud and clearly telling him America's strategic vision and what they had to do was Richard Holbrooke, America's point man on Afghanistan and Pakistan. His loss, his death this week, how is that going to affect this process? KERRY: Well, it's -- Christiane, you knew him, we all knew him. It's an enormous, enormous loss. I mean, Richard -- you know, some people could always find him, you know, too strong in his point of view or, you know, too focused on what he wanted to get done, but I'll tell you something: He was a diplomat of extraordinary ability who knew how to get things done, who had a vision.

He was moving things. The team he put together to work on this is one of the most exceptional teams of people I've seen assembled in Washington, D.C. They -- they really understood where they were trying to go. And it's a loss, and it's going to be -- difficult shoes to fill, no question. AMANPOUR: Senator Lugar?

LUGAR: He was a dear friend. And -- and more importantly, he was trying to get the money into Pakistan that John and I had fostered in a so-called Kerry-Lugar bill. Now, the Pakistanis liked the idea of a five-year program. They liked the idea of money for schools and legal enforcement and the rest of it. But getting it there, who -- who runs it? How can you monitor it? This took all the diplomatic skills of Richard, and he still wasn't quite there with it.

But in answer to the question about Pakistan, all we can do, we are trying very hard diplomatically, a five-year program, because it is critical. If the Al Qaida are over there and the Taliban go back and forth, things are not going to continue to work well in parts of Afghanistan without change. AMANPOUR: Senators, thank you very much, indeed, for joining us on these very important topics. And we'll be watching the debate in the Senate this weekend.

AMANPOUR: And we're going to pick up the discussion of the administration's review of the Afghanistan war on our roundtable and, as they take their seats, listen to President Obama's words about the war from three of his major speeches in the past two years.


OBAMA: Many people in the United States and many in partner countries that have sacrificed so much have a simple question: What is our purpose in Afghanistan? We have a clear and focused goal: to disrupt, dismantle and defeat Al Qaida in Pakistan and Afghanistan.

Huge challenges remain. Afghanistan is not lost, but for several years it has moved backwards. Our forces lack the full support they need to effectively train and partner with Afghan security forces and better secure the population.

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